Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Has Condi Scourge become useless?


Ashantara.8731

Recommended Posts

I see there are still popular Condition Scourge builds out there - but I have noticed that the damage output has grown extremely meager compared to power builds with recent patches. It takes me forever to kill an enemy compared to, let's say, a Power Reaper.

So what's the point in still playing a Condi Scourge in PvE?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is no point in playing DPS Scourge. Necro looks like this now:

  • Core - Bunker (useless in PvE)
  • Reaper - DPS (only 31k DPS but very forgiving)
  • Scourge - Support (one of the best supporters available: tons of healing, barrier, condi cleanse and might generation for the team)

Healing Scourge:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PSwEYCNssBGEDkpxMxU/S7VB-zxIYwo+vMSsqqOV15kEK/B-e

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been playing full condi in fractals and it's ok but im definitely not as strong as other classes. My problem is that I don't believe I can play full heal build and be able to solo heal T4. I'm tempted to go back to Teapot's Plaguedoctor build because my dps won't drop that much more than what it is now and I'll get more utility by using blood magic line.

In WvW, no question, support scourge. I play full apothecary and adjust my utilities based on the group I'm in. I don't typically roam solo or even duo.

Openworld pve (solo or small group) I reaper because things won't die fast enough with condi

sPVP it's core all the way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"KrHome.1920" said:There is no point in playing DPS Scourge. Necro looks like this now:

  • Core - Bunker (useless in PvE)
  • Reaper - DPS (only 31k DPS but very forgiving)
  • Scourge - Support (one of the best supporters available: tons of healing, barrier, condi cleanse and might generation for the team)

Healing Scourge:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PSwEYCNssBGEDkpxMxU/S7VB-zxIYwo+vMSsqqOV15kEK/B-e

hey, try Rune of the Monk. I think you'll like it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Scourge support feels way better than Condi ngl.Scourge has ALOT of natural Corruption, Boon conversion, party Barrier ontop of Scourge party sustain with Blood Magic.

I think Core Death Shroud feels just superior to Scourge's kit for Condi application.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"maidiance.6920" said:Kodan farm with condi-dmg epi scourge is just faceroll easy-mode and tends to be one of the common squads that show up in lfg that I've seen here on EU.

I was referring to common PvE (open world, story), not Strike Missions, Raids, or Fractals in particular. Kodan farm only works because of Epidemic and the multitude of Condi Scourges. I finished it super fast with a normal squad, though, so the whole "all Condi Scourge squad" thing is just the latest rage rather than a true necessity. It works just fine without.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The history of Scourge is a sad one. When it came out it was one the best dps in game, enemies in PvE just melted around it. Then it got a bug fix which is what was causing it to do so much damage. It still remained good even though the bug fix gutted it's damage by 8k. Then WvW was proving a big problem and most of the nerfs Scourge got were because of WvW. Now that they have split the modes, MAYBE, they'll start giving some power back to Scourge in PvE.

In any case, Scourge can get through open world PvE, like anything else can, but it takes much longer to kill things due to it's slow ramp up time. As things stand, Power Reaper will always have the advantage because it has good burst and amazing cleave which takes things down very quickly in PvE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Ashantara.8731 said:

@"maidiance.6920" said:Kodan farm with condi-dmg epi scourge is just faceroll easy-mode and tends to be one of the common squads that show up in lfg that I've seen here on EU.

I was referring to common PvE (open world, story), not Strike Missions, Raids, or Fractals in particular. Kodan farm only works because of Epidemic and the multitude of Condi Scourges. I finished it super fast with a normal squad, though, so the whole "all Condi Scourge squad" thing is just the latest rage rather than a true necessity. It works just fine without.

I never intended to imply it was necessary, just that it was a popular demand here on the EU server. As for open world, I'd say nearly anything that relies condition damage suffers at least in terms of the simple fact power damage spikes way faster and reliably. That ramp up time is only a factor in something as big as a bounty.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Methuselah.4376 said:Now that they have split the modes, MAYBE, they'll start giving some power back to Scourge in PvE.

I have learnt to not put my hopes up for this game, although there have been a few pleasant surprises of late. :)

@maidiance.6920 said:That ramp up time is only a factor in something as big as a bounty.

True. I used to love Scourge, but now I've decided to only play it in WvW and go back to Reaper in PvE. It's sad, but I just don't have the patience for slow kills while exploring maps and doing story missions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I did another round of wvw (zerg v zerg) as condi last night and it just wasn't good. Sure I could get kills here and there and there would be lots of pretty looking damage numbers, but the truth is that you can't survive long enough in those types of fights unless you have an absurd amount of support. I swapped over to my normal healing build and got the same amount of kills but now we won fights instead of losing them. It's crazy how strong blood magic is right now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Xenic.1387" said:I did another round of wvw (zerg v zerg) as condi last night and it just wasn't good. Sure I could get kills here and there and there would be lots of pretty looking damage numbers, but the truth is that you can't survive long enough in those types of fights unless you have an absurd amount of support. I swapped over to my normal healing build and got the same amount of kills but now we won fights instead of losing them. It's crazy how strong blood magic is right now.

Heal scaling was changed within the last year. It starts lower and ends higher, iirc. The result was a nerf to damage to get better barriers. You can still tag, though.

Blood Magic is not "crazy" strong and costs dps, as does the healing equipment. A Druid, Ele, or others can provide better heals. Your zerg may not have had enough support if a single heal-Scourge made that much of a difference.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Anchoku.8142 said:

@"Xenic.1387" said:I did another round of wvw (zerg v zerg) as condi last night and it just wasn't good. Sure I could get kills here and there and there would be lots of pretty looking damage numbers, but the truth is that you can't survive long enough in those types of fights unless you have an absurd amount of support. I swapped over to my normal healing build and got the same amount of kills but now we won fights instead of losing them. It's crazy how strong blood magic is right now.

Heal scaling was changed within the last year. It starts lower and ends higher, iirc. The result was a nerf to damage to get better barriers. You can still tag, though.

Blood Magic is not "crazy" strong and costs dps, as does the healing equipment. A Druid, Ele, or others can provide better heals. Your zerg may not have had enough support if a single heal-Scourge made that much of a difference.

I'm not saying I made the difference and was some kind of super hero or something lol. No one person wins a zerg fight.

I'm just saying that as a dps I would get melted super quick and not live long enough to do much. Support I was able to stay alive longer, boon strip, pressure the other side, cleanse, res downed quickly, and drop in barrier when I could. In essence I was able to do my job and contribute to our team winning fights. When I was straight damage, I wasn't able to stay alive long enough to use my superior damage.

Now in a smaller scale fight, say 20v20 and not 50v50v50, I would likely stay dps.

Oh and I disagree, Blood Magic is really strong. The ability to res your team in fights can change the swing of a fight

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My scourge has a deep RP story behind him, so I'm reluctant to sideline him. I support my guild's strike missions with a full Magi healbot build, and enjoy playing him in that role. Unfortunately, as y'all have pointed out, condi scourge isn't what it used to be; even in full Viper, playing him as condi DPS is tedious. I am seriously considering dumping his condi build entirely for some kind of power build; I just haven't made myself do it yet because it doesn't fit his RP theme.

EDIT: Condi build dumped for a core MM build just to have a DPS build for him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

It's useful for some specialized roles in raids. Epi for SH, wurm for Dhuum CM, Sab flak kiting, QTP pylons (though deadeye is better here). Generally a useless class, though. Reaper is actually better for most fights and reaper is and has been in a pretty bad state for a while.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

power dps will always trump condi dps in open world by the very nature of power being bursty - does a lot of damage quickly then it falls flat, and condi requiring build up - does a lot of damage but only given time.

i think c scourge is pretty good in open world, it won't kill as fast as a reaper but this is true of EVERY class that has a power + condi build on it, the only class which this isn't as true for is FB and even then power still kills quicker, condi just isn't slow this time. after you put even a little bit of torment on something, use your fear shade skill (sand savant if you're not good at placing shades, or shadeless to begin with) and enemies will quickly melt themselves on the bonus damage torment does. as far as condi builds go, it's actually pretty efficient because of that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Majy.6792 said:It's useful for some specialized roles in raids. Epi for SH, wurm for Dhuum CM, Sab flak kiting, QTP pylons (though deadeye is better here). Generally a useless class, though. Reaper is actually better for most fights and reaper is and has been in a pretty bad state for a while.

While dps is not that high, I wouldn't say Reaper's in a bad state.

Yesterday I played some condi scourge as I haven't done so in a while. And ye, I was super saddened by how far it has fallen. I prefer playing no shade heal scourge any day. Sure condi scourge gets the job done, but my Reaper can get it done in quarter of the time. A far fall from a time when Scourge melted everything in PvE (PvP wise, the nerfs were VERY much warranted).

In essence: if you enjoy condi scourge, go ahead and play it. You can still clear most content with it and it even has some niche places in raids, plus a lot of people don't mind if you bring a scourge to condi fights like Matthias...well as long as you're doing good damage. Most folks tend to be blinded by benchmarks but, lets face it, most people will never reach those numbers in a real raid scenario. A general good rule of thumb is if all the dps are doing at least 15k dmg, you will clear the boss. Obviously the higher you go the quicker you kill the boss and the more mechanics you may skip depending on the boss, so 20k dps per dps is much much better. Notice how that's still an achievable number even for scourge. In Fractals, scourge is ok; power damage is obviously a better choice, and scourge builds condis slower than any other condi spec but it has good ground coverage and Epidemic is always a thing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Lahmia.2193 said:Eh. I still use it for soloing HoT Hero points, so I can't complain.This is very separate thing, how class is usable, friendly, and powered and top mainstream meta (it can be not usable for commons, not friendly, and absolutely NOT good to do hot points )So discussion here about mainstream pve top meta, but not how fine open map or etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...