Class Swapping During AT Rounds After The Match Has Started - It Really Needs To Be Locked — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Class Swapping During AT Rounds After The Match Has Started - It Really Needs To Be Locked

Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

I'm not going to go into a long winded explanation of why class swapping needs to be locked in ATs after the match starts.

But it does need to be locked. Swap all you want before the match begins. After the match begins, everyone's character should be locked.

During final rounds of ATs, try-hard teams will swap, and then your team needs to counter swap, and then they swap to something to counter you, and then you have to swap. It's really just beginning to turn into a painful chore in the play dynamic. I think I speak for most people when I say that, we want to spend our time in the final round actually in combat doing things in the match, not in our character select screens.

After an AT match begins, please just lock characters, exactly the way that it works in ranked.

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~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

Comments

  • Avatar.3568Avatar.3568 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Idk, but I think it is locked, at least I wanted to swap after a few minutes but I wasn't able to do

  • Dantheman.3589Dantheman.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭

    But than no one would run 5 ranger comps in ats :(

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Avatar.3568 said:
    Idk, but I think it is locked, at least I wanted to swap after a few minutes but I wasn't able to do

    It's not locked dude. You can swap to w/e character/class you want after the match starts.

    My Twitch.tv channel
    My YouTube channel

    ~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    what a joke.

    Te lazla otstara.

  • mistsim.2748mistsim.2748 Member ✭✭✭

    I can't believe this is still in the game, years later. Lmao. Spvp literally hasn't moved a kitten inch since I left 3 yrs ago.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 9, 2020

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    what a joke.

    Indeed, it's just an unnecessary bad feel in meta play dynamic to have to incorporate multiple mid game class swaps if you want to win.

    You flatten out your strategy before the match starts, there is plenty of time to do it, and then your comp is locked. That's how it should be.

    My Twitch.tv channel
    My YouTube channel

    ~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

  • HeadCrowned.6834HeadCrowned.6834 Member ✭✭✭

    @skillze.7689 said:
    It should be locked before you enter, i.e (clicking accept). None of this oh well they have this spec I will relog. You picked the class you wanted to play before you entered the match not after you have seen the enemies comp.

    Just another way to match manipulate thats been going on for far to long.

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.

    Furthermore I almost always see the team that rerolls midgame lose. Either the reroll didnt solve their problem or the time that they had to 4v5 was too devastating. But if its locked im fine with it too, it doesnt have that much of an impact as people believe it has.

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:
    It should be locked before you enter, i.e (clicking accept). None of this oh well they have this spec I will relog. You picked the class you wanted to play before you entered the match not after you have seen the enemies comp.

    Just another way to match manipulate thats been going on for far to long.

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.

    Furthermore I almost always see the team that rerolls midgame lose. Either the reroll didnt solve their problem or the time that they had to 4v5 was too devastating. But if its locked im fine with it too, it doesnt have that much of an impact as people believe it has.

    Assume your choice of class on whatever map you end playing ?

  • HeadCrowned.6834HeadCrowned.6834 Member ✭✭✭

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Assume your choice of class on whatever map you end playing ?

    Why would you want to dumb things down like that? Different maps require different strategies and so different classes. That makes the game more interesting.

  • GewRoo.4172GewRoo.4172 Member ✭✭✭

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Assume your choice of class on whatever map you end playing ?

    Why would you want to dumb things down like that? Different maps require different strategies and so different classes. That makes the game more interesting.

    This. If ATs would actually be competitive in high tiers you would expect map specific rerollings way more often then they are happening right now.

  • skillze.7689skillze.7689 Member ✭✭✭

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.

    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

  • HeadCrowned.6834HeadCrowned.6834 Member ✭✭✭

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.


    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

    Nice logic man. Some maps benefit teamfights more, some benefit roaming comps more. A team might benefit from you rerolling to a roamer, sidenoder or teamfighter. You can adjust your team comp accordingly, without the whole team rerolling but just 1 or 2 players. A good comp for a specific map exists of different classes, not 1 class for all 5 teammates. But that might be too difficult for you to comprehend. Now hop back to silver.

  • skillze.7689skillze.7689 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 11, 2020

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.


    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

    Nice logic man. Some maps benefit teamfights more, some benefit roaming comps more. A team might benefit from you rerolling to a roamer, sidenoder or teamfighter. You can adjust your team comp accordingly, without the whole team rerolling but just 1 or 2 players. A good comp for a specific map exists of different classes, not 1 class for all 5 teammates. But that might be too difficult for you to comprehend. Now hop back to silver.

    since you posted that comment many people have told you the same thing as i have just said, all you are doing is making bad excuse for a mechanic thats been exploited since the conception of the game, just give up mate. Honestly im sick to death of people like you making bad excuses for trying to keep exploitable mechanics in the game. example A, loads thief into game low winrate! switches to necro with high winrate and then continues to exploit the match maker. Its a joke and should be removed

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.


    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

    Nice logic man. Some maps benefit teamfights more, some benefit roaming comps more. A team might benefit from you rerolling to a roamer, sidenoder or teamfighter. You can adjust your team comp accordingly, without the whole team rerolling but just 1 or 2 players. A good comp for a specific map exists of different classes, not 1 class for all 5 teammates. But that might be too difficult for you to comprehend. Now hop back to silver.

    The only thing you should be allowed to adjust based on the map is your build, not your class.

  • Deihnyx.6318Deihnyx.6318 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Just had a team of 5 revs, with one of them swapping to warriors at the end.
    I'm more used to ranked than tournament but I gotta say, I don't understand why this is even allowed. Why can't you lock the classes before the tournament start?

  • Lilyanna.9361Lilyanna.9361 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Honestly the biggest issue is class stacking. That kitten is gross and needs to go. If people want to switch? Fine, but take out class stacking so people won’t just roll three of whatever class is doing that and more. Seriously, most games don’t even allow you to do this, so why would Anet allow this here????

  • I can confirm this is still happening. We were winning halfway through the first game of AT when the deadeye switched to holosmith which somehow made them win the game at the end. I don't understand why you can't switch characters mid-game in ranked but AT they allow it. It used to be a problem in ranked till they changed yet I'm seeing posts from 2018 of people bringing up the issue in AT but nothing has been done to fix this match manipulation.

  • Eddbopkins.2630Eddbopkins.2630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I think you should be able to change your traitlines around in a match only. Only in the death screen. No weapon, no ammulet change just trait lines. That should be enough to just make ur build relevant and competitive in the next fight if you end up underhanded. Since everyone can do it, it can make each fight that much more exciting and unexpected.

  • SexyMofo.8923SexyMofo.8923 Member ✭✭✭

    Fake depth to a dead game mode.

  • Avatar.3568Avatar.3568 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.


    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

    Nice logic man. Some maps benefit teamfights more, some benefit roaming comps more. A team might benefit from you rerolling to a roamer, sidenoder or teamfighter. You can adjust your team comp accordingly, without the whole team rerolling but just 1 or 2 players. A good comp for a specific map exists of different classes, not 1 class for all 5 teammates. But that might be too difficult for you to comprehend. Now hop back to silver.

    since you posted that comment many people have told you the same thing as i have just said, all you are doing is making bad excuse for a mechanic thats been exploited since the conception of the game, just give up mate. Honestly im sick to death of people like you making bad excuses for trying to keep exploitable mechanics in the game. example A, loads thief into game low winrate! switches to necro with high winrate and then continues to exploit the match maker. Its a joke and should be removed

    One of the best players on EU is explaining something and than some goldmasters come arround the corner and say "no no"

    That's beyond dumb

  • ollbirtan.2915ollbirtan.2915 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Yes. It's disgusting. You should not be allowed to swap mid game. Keep the build and class swap as it is in ranked - BEFORE the game begins and your are all in the spawn area.

  • @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Guys, this thread isn't turning off swapping BEFORE a match starts.

    It is about turning off character/class swapping AFTER the match starts.

    There is plenty of time for a player to choose what they are going to play before the match starts. They shouldn't be able to swap characters after it begins.

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    Te lazla otstara.

  • Dantheman.3589Dantheman.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Guys, this thread isn't turning off swapping BEFORE a match starts.

    It is about turning off character/class swapping AFTER the match starts.

    There is plenty of time for a player to choose what they are going to play before the match starts. They shouldn't be able to swap characters after it begins.

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    Yeah. 1 reason that swapping is good in ats.
    I personally like having the option- it was also super fun to be able to swap during 2v2 and 3v3 death match ats

  • @Dantheman.3589 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    Yeah. 1 reason that swapping is good in ats.
    I personally like having the option- it was also super fun to be able to swap during 2v2 and 3v3 death match ats

    only thing i can think of is to allow class swapping on entering the match but when there is a minute left until actual match start lock classes while still allowing build swaps.

    Te lazla otstara.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Avatar.3568 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    @skillze.7689 said:

    @HeadCrowned.6834 said:

    This is a very bad suggestion because the class you pick depends on the map that you play on.


    It has nothing to do what class you pick and if it actually did then everyone would be re-rolling to the same class for every map,

    Did you even think about what you said before you typed it ?

    Nice logic man. Some maps benefit teamfights more, some benefit roaming comps more. A team might benefit from you rerolling to a roamer, sidenoder or teamfighter. You can adjust your team comp accordingly, without the whole team rerolling but just 1 or 2 players. A good comp for a specific map exists of different classes, not 1 class for all 5 teammates. But that might be too difficult for you to comprehend. Now hop back to silver.

    since you posted that comment many people have told you the same thing as i have just said, all you are doing is making bad excuse for a mechanic thats been exploited since the conception of the game, just give up mate. Honestly im sick to death of people like you making bad excuses for trying to keep exploitable mechanics in the game. example A, loads thief into game low winrate! switches to necro with high winrate and then continues to exploit the match maker. Its a joke and should be removed

    One of the best players on EU is explaining something and than some goldmasters come arround the corner and say "no no"

    That's beyond dumb

    Best players doesn't mean infallible and no one can dare to disagree with them ever. So defending someone that's not you because someone dared to disagree with someone who is not you is beyond dumb

    WvW band wagoners ruin the game mode just like Karen's ruin these forums.

  • Bazsi.2734Bazsi.2734 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Guys, this thread isn't turning off swapping BEFORE a match starts.

    It is about turning off character/class swapping AFTER the match starts.

    There is plenty of time for a player to choose what they are going to play before the match starts. They shouldn't be able to swap characters after it begins.

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    One of the reasons I can't take GW2 tournaments seriously is because you can swap classes at all. You should be able to decide on what teambuild and what tactics you want to play before clicking the join button. It's not ranked where matchmaking can give you terrible comps, you are in control. Upon loading in and seeing what the enemy is running, your classes/skills/traits should already be locked.
    If your teambuild is totally hardcountered by what the enemy is running, though. Maybe don't use that comp next time?

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Profession swapping is what kills the game diversity the most, lack of commitment to professions is second to it.

    Why allow full blown change profession mid game when you don't want people to change traits? It's extremely obvious that people have every meta builds ready to play rock paper scissor in between loading times. Allowing is the same as changing it on the fly if it was desired.

    Teams upon loading in AT should be hard locked and limited to the profession offering, that would force players to be creative for many roles to fill within the same profession instead of calling it ezswitchholoiwin cuz I can play this only meta build that I'll drop as soon as it's nerfed.

    Knowing the profession in and out would actually mean something and in most cases because everyone wants to be the same but can't will have to resort through other means.

    There's not enough risk or engagement to make it interesting, too much freedom.

    Willing to help with anything Revenant related.

  • Ghos.1326Ghos.1326 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    I'm not going to go into a long winded explanation of why class swapping needs to be locked in ATs after the match starts.

    But it does need to be locked. Swap all you want before the match begins. After the match begins, everyone's character should be locked.

    During final rounds of ATs, try-hard teams will swap, and then your team needs to counter swap, and then they swap to something to counter you, and then you have to swap. It's really just beginning to turn into a painful chore in the play dynamic. I think I speak for most people when I say that, we want to spend our time in the final round actually in combat doing things in the match, not in our character select screens.

    After an AT match begins, please just lock characters, exactly the way that it works in ranked.

    Agreed. It's basically gw2 version of pokemon :)

    The greatest enemy to improvement, is ignorance. But the desire to learn will cast ignorance into the fire.

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 5, 2020

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Guys, this thread isn't turning off swapping BEFORE a match starts.

    It is about turning off character/class swapping AFTER the match starts.

    There is plenty of time for a player to choose what they are going to play before the match starts. They shouldn't be able to swap characters after it begins.

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    That's fine. The other team should be doing the same thing to keep up. RED team swaps last minute to create a counter,; but BLUE also does the same thing. That's fine. RED team loads in with 2 Necros to bait swaps from BLUE team so they bring in Rangers, only to see RED swap the 2 Necros to Power Heralds at the last second. That's fine. It's BLUE team's fault for falling for that. BLUE team could have used some similar tactic. These things are all fine.

    But it needs to be limited to before the match starts, so that players aren't being forced to swap mid match multiple times as if it were some utility skill to be used. It's just kind of ridiculous after awhile for reasons I shouldn't have to explain. Character selection needs to be locked after the match begins.

    @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Trevor Boyer.6524 said:
    Guys, this thread isn't turning off swapping BEFORE a match starts.

    It is about turning off character/class swapping AFTER the match starts.

    There is plenty of time for a player to choose what they are going to play before the match starts. They shouldn't be able to swap characters after it begins.

    what about switching class right before the match starts, locking the other team into an unfavorable match up?

    One of the reasons I can't take GW2 tournaments seriously is because you can swap classes at all. You should be able to decide on what teambuild and what tactics you want to play before clicking the join button. It's not ranked where matchmaking can give you terrible comps, you are in control. Upon loading in and seeing what the enemy is running, your classes/skills/traits should already be locked.
    If your teambuild is totally hardcountered by what the enemy is running, though. Maybe don't use that comp next time?

    You have to have class swapping during the ready up phase. There are many times when an opposing team naturally loads in with a comp that is oddly situated that just counters what you have. In higher tiered matches, when that happens, it pretty much means you auto lose, and that isn't fun. If you were to remove class swaps and reorganize phase during ready up, it would make ATs have that feel of "gambling" like ranked mode has, and you already know that EVERYONE hates that. The difference between 5v5 organized and yolo queue, is that during 5v5 organized, you get to use your full level of experience to situate your comp before engaging the other player's comp. <- This is like the quintessential component that makes 5v5 competitive. Players who can play many classes and help reorganize class comps during ready up phase, should be able to do that. It's part of the game. And those players should be winning more often than players who only main 1 class who only play 1 build who never touched anything else. Suggesting pigeonholing very experienced players into being forced to gamble comp queue into an AT and not be able to utilize their experience & knowledge for comp reorganization, takes A LOT out of the game man. That's the kind of thing that makes people view a game as a casual rando experience that is catered towards preventing strong players from being able to strong. People hate that man.

    It would all functional optimally if you can reorganize and swap during ready up, and then your character gets locked after match begins. That's just the way it should have been since ATs were released.

    My Twitch.tv channel
    My YouTube channel

    ~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

  • While changing characters mid game in ATs is absolutely wrong, from what I've seen it (and I could be wrong), it appears to only be an issue in daily ATs. I haven't seen a competitive game in monthly ATs where a team character swapped mid game. So thankfully its fairly low impact, even if it is very frustrating and dumb.

    I would also like character swapping to be locked at like 30s before the game starts. Playing the "who can swap last and random guess what the other team is going to swap to" game is stupid. 30s before game start it should be locked.

  • This is not the first time, somebody posted about this.

  • Lol what the kitten is this? A sportsball game where we can bench classes and have coach send us in it's our time to shine now in the last quarter?!

  • Highlie.7641Highlie.7641 Member ✭✭✭

    swapping professions should be locked on ready up, build templates should function during the whole match.

  • Ghos.1326Ghos.1326 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Highlie.7641 said:
    swapping professions should be locked on ready up, build templates should function during the whole match.

    This I don't agree with. People should be ready, able, and prepared to swap strategy during the match instead of just have the ability to swap builds to counter something mid-match. I don't think that's really fair and it surely doesn't promote skilled play.

    The greatest enemy to improvement, is ignorance. But the desire to learn will cast ignorance into the fire.

  • Highlie.7641Highlie.7641 Member ✭✭✭

    That's not the case though. the majority of people just use it as a method to put the opposite team at a disadvantage. (I.e queing up as two weak professions which forced the MM into a mirror match)

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Highlie.7641 said:
    That's not the case though. the majority of people just use it as a method to put the opposite team at a disadvantage. (I.e queing up as two weak professions which forced the MM into a mirror match)

    We're talking about automated tournaments with preselected teams, not ranked match making.

    My Twitch.tv channel
    My YouTube channel

    ~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

  • Highlie.7641Highlie.7641 Member ✭✭✭

    Yeah i know, but i don't think arena net wouldn't change the format on one while leaving the other alone. just a guess though