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Increase ascended damage

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  • waaghals.6124waaghals.6124 Member ✭✭

    Keep the stats the same, but increase it for legendaries!

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭
    edited May 15, 2020

    @waaghals.6124 said:
    Keep the stats the same, but increase it for legendaries!

    No no. That will make all people rage quit except 0.01% or less of the 10m population. Full set of legendary is like suicide, your life will be gone.

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭
    edited May 15, 2020

    Based from the opinions gathered, I think the best solution would be to adjust it to 10% per level up to ascended. The difference imbalance would only be the effort put into.

    White to Blue - 10% increase (110%)
    Blue to Green - 10% increase (120%)
    Green to Rare - 10% increase (130%)
    Rare to Exotic - 10% increase (140%)
    Exotic to Ascended/Legendary - 10% increase (150% MAX)

    Easier to understand and the bump is NOTICEABLE lol. I hardly feel the 5%, it's more like a 2% increase.

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭

    It's not the stats that are that superb benefit of ascended but the ability to add infusions for fractals, to move the gear between characters (ascended is account-bound) and to swap stats with Mystic Toilet. And while full ascended is about 5% more stats than exotic, if you add in stat infusions (costs quite a bit, though), the difference get closer to 7-8%. Still not much and not really noticeable unless you're a hardcore raider with arcdps. So, if you want ascended for damage boost alone, it won't make much of a difference unless you master your class and optimize the build and you won't see the difference in open-world regardless. But if you want ascended for QoL and ability to do higher-tier fractals, it's well worth it and when you enter T4, it'll pay itself back in a couple weeks.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who streams and records videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks.

  • Diak Atoli.2085Diak Atoli.2085 Member ✭✭✭

    @killermanjaro.5670 said:

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Based from the opinions gathered, I think the best solution would be to adjust it to 10% per level up to ascended. The difference imbalance would only be the effort put into.

    White to Blue - 10% increase (110%)
    Blue to Green - 10% increase (120%)
    Green to Rare - 10% increase (130%)
    Rare to Exotic - 10% increase (140%)
    Exotic to Ascended/Legendary - 10% increase (150% MAX)

    Easier to understand and the bump is NOTICEABLE lol. I hardly feel the 5%, it's more like a 2% increase.

    How have you concluded that "solution" supposedly "based form the opinions gathered", when pretty much everyone's opinion in this thread has been along the lines of its fine and no changes/adjustments are needed? And for what it's worth, I'm in agreement with everyone else, systems fine as it is.

    Agreed. How can there be a 'solution' when there's no 'problem' to apply it to?

  • Game of Bones.8975Game of Bones.8975 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Currently the hard work to get a full set of ascended does not equate to the tiny value it gives. Its like a piece of kitten for tons of hours and days

    If you want to make the justification for increased damage/reduction due to the time, effort, and mats it takes to craft, talk about the difference between Ascended and Legendary items.

    "That's what" -- She

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Roche.7491 said:

    @lare.5129 said:

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Currently the hard work to get a full set of ascended does not equate to the tiny value it gives. Its like a piece of kitten for tons of hours and days

    if you play GiuldWars2 you get ascended set without any pain. It is easy. More better think where find free salvage kit for that ascend

    Already halfway farming bears. It’s just boring.

    Farming bears? That's a thing?

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    ...what bears?
    Did i miss something?

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • @Elmo Benchwarmer.3025 said:
    No.

    Ascended gear was a terrible idea in the first place. A simple and entirely optional PvE only inscription slot for the grind happy players would have been more than enough.

    Before ascended gear was put as a rewards in ranked PvP and WvW nobody played it, the declining population made anet incentivize people with ascended rewards and this worked.

  • Shining One.1635Shining One.1635 Member ✭✭✭

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:
    Farming bears? That's a thing?
    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    ...what bears?
    Did i miss something?

    I'm guessing he means farming the Voice of the Fallen and Claw of the Fallen Strike Mission.

  • Cerioth.7062Cerioth.7062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    ...what bears?
    Did i miss something?

    People farm the kodan strike mission because it's fast and you get scraps for the cape.

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭
    edited May 15, 2020

    Imo in other mmos that 5% is 50% increase. 10% is generous. It’s like 1/10 more power rather than 1/20 times more power.

    Why not make it 1% and it still worth it right? Lol 1/100

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Imo in other mmos that 5% is 50% increase. 10% is generous. It’s like 1/10 more power rather than 1/20 times more power.

    Why not make it 1% and it still worth it right? Lol 1/100

    Lawlz Look at this stupid game! It doesn't have my preferred method of pointless time-gating! I'm gonna go play hello kitty island adventure instead!

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭
    edited May 15, 2020

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Imo in other mmos that 5% is 50% increase. 10% is generous. It’s like 1/10 more power rather than 1/20 times more power.

    Why not make it 1% and it still worth it right? Lol 1/100

    Lawlz Look at this stupid game! It doesn't have my preferred method of pointless time-gating! I'm gonna go play hello kitty island adventure instead!

    Time gating is not original. They are trying to make it like other daily ios/android app. It’s stupid copying someone else's game plan.

    They should stick to their original flavor gw1 and make it even better. Not switch to a territory not their own. Or follow a trend just because it’s a trend. They make their game CHEAP. Next time there will be SALE and ADS all over. It will be like the rest and the beauty will fade.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Roche.7491 said:

    @Bassdeff.1895 said:
    Ascended wasn't meant to have a whole lot of extra power. They were meant for the agony resistance infusions to progress through fractals. That is what they were originally designed for.

    Ironically by the time you have the set, you are already done with fractals.

    Which is yet another demonstration that Anet understands players sensitivity to locking content behind gear progression and grinding gear.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Why not make it 1% and it still worth it right?

    No, because there is no good reason to do this.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Roche.7491 said:

    @Bassdeff.1895 said:
    Ascended wasn't meant to have a whole lot of extra power. They were meant for the agony resistance infusions to progress through fractals. That is what they were originally designed for.

    Ironically by the time you have the set, you are already done with fractals.

    Which is yet another demonstration that Anet understands players sensitivity to locking content behind gear progression and grinding gear.

    tbh i doubt that, if they cared about that they wouldnt have locked armor behind raids. But thats beside the point.

    The majority of people in this game dont currently HAVE to obtain ascended armor. Its required for one thing and only higher tiers of that one thing. Its also insanely easy to get, without grind.

    Amana Silentchild; My Main
    Ember Wandertooth; The Kingslayer, Kianda Redpaw; The Blazing Light
    Why GW is Called Guildwars

  • Ryo.5824Ryo.5824 Member ✭✭

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

  • Yuffi.2430Yuffi.2430 Member ✭✭

    You need to look back at the history of it.
    Originally Legendary equipment was weapons the same stats as Exotic equipment but with an animated skin. Ascended equipment was introduced before the expansions and their elite professions. At this time Ascended gave experienced players something new to work for - new skins and a 5% or so stat boost. Legendary equipment was updated to the new higher stats. The system works just fine as it is:

    • Normal play and levelling is White to Blue to Green to Yellow (rare) and then Exotic gear as you reach the top. This covers "everyday" casual play.
    • Ascended gear gave new skins, infusion slots, a small boost to stats, and was made Account Bound so you could move it between toons. This all adds up to quite a big change - and don't forget the infusions can add to the stats too!
    • Legendary gear is Ascended but with fancy skins and the ability to change stats without having to carry different armour. Skins and stat swapping both make enough of a difference to separate Legendary from Ascended. If Legendary equipment becomes shareable via templates then this will put it clearly above Ascended in terms of utility, and will finish the progression. Legendary equipment won't be BETTER than Ascended, but it will be more USEFUL and that's important enough.

    Ascended equipment already has enough benefits to justify it's place in GW2 and it doesn't need a power boost..

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭
    edited May 16, 2020

    @Yuffi.2430 said:
    You need to look back at the history of it.
    Originally Legendary equipment was weapons the same stats as Exotic equipment but with an animated skin. Ascended equipment was introduced before the expansions and their elite professions. At this time Ascended gave experienced players something new to work for - new skins and a 5% or so stat boost. Legendary equipment was updated to the new higher stats. The system works just fine as it is:

    • Normal play and levelling is White to Blue to Green to Yellow (rare) and then Exotic gear as you reach the top. This covers "everyday" casual play.
    • Ascended gear gave new skins, infusion slots, a small boost to stats, and was made Account Bound so you could move it between toons. This all adds up to quite a big change - and don't forget the infusions can add to the stats too!
    • Legendary gear is Ascended but with fancy skins and the ability to change stats without having to carry different armour. Skins and stat swapping both make enough of a difference to separate Legendary from Ascended. If Legendary equipment becomes shareable via templates then this will put it clearly above Ascended in terms of utility, and will finish the progression. Legendary equipment won't be BETTER than Ascended, but it will be more USEFUL and that's important enough.

    Ascended equipment already has enough benefits to justify it's place in GW2 and it doesn't need a power boost..

    Thanks for the history. So it seems ascended (hard) is the bridge between exotic (easy) and legendary (impossible) difficulties.

    It seems the primary reason one will get a legendary set is if he has multiple characters and builds.

    Ascended on the other hand is mainly for fractals only.

    For Pvp exotic is perfectly fine

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 18, 2020

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Based from the opinions gathered, I think the best solution would be to adjust it to 10% per level up to ascended. The difference imbalance would only be the effort put into.

    White to Blue - 10% increase (110%)
    Blue to Green - 10% increase (120%)
    Green to Rare - 10% increase (130%)
    Rare to Exotic - 10% increase (140%)
    Exotic to Ascended/Legendary - 10% increase (150% MAX)

    Easier to understand and the bump is NOTICEABLE lol. I hardly feel the 5%, it's more like a 2% increase.

    The best solution to this so-called problem (it really is not) is actually the opposite: to remove the stat bonus from ascended/legendary over exotics to emphasize it's a QoL change rather than stats outside of fractals (agony resistance). Blues/greens/yellow rares shouldn't even factor into the discussion , everyone that played for a short time should be able to afford exotic armor + weapons as well as ascended trinkets/back from Living Story. A full set of named exotic Berserker's stat armor (Zhed/Nika/Devona) is roughly 24 gold which is 12 days of dailies. Doing the War Eternal episode easily provides Diviner's stat armor from achievements.

    Ascended has the advantage of being accountbound and stat swappable via mystic forge, legendary has on-demand stat swap and infusion/rune/sigil swap. The +5 stat infusions from WvW / fractals are already a minor step back from their original vision before GW2 launch where it was meant to be no-grind as far as stats , so skill>time played. At least in PvP everyone remains normalized to exotic PvP level.

    A full set of exotics (including trinkets) has 91% effectiveness of ascended / legendary , with ~95% of the stat bonuses. As stated before , ascended has a 5% damage bonus on the weapon strength while armor itself is only 2% stat bonus. For example, the midpoint on an ascended sword is 1000 while the exotic is 952.5 and ascended Greatsword is 1,100 while on exotic it is 1,047.5.

    See post by Yuffi.2430 on legendary items' evolution with time.

    If you really love powercreep go look at the Chinese version of GW2 where they sell +18 power infusions. There's plenty of games where people need to grind to be remotely competitive (in PvE/PvP) so there's even people paying for internet cafe grind players to do it for them. As such, I am adamant against any gear powercreep, especially when it will make WvW balance worse.

  • Khisanth.2948Khisanth.2948 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

    Just to play Devil's Advocate ... the answer to that is because GW2 supposed to be relatively casual(? maybe, can't cite a source from ANet). While the existing approach is actually a much more hardcore/elitist approach. With what we have now the only way you "improve" is by actually improving your personal abilities. For example is you are bad enough that you just stand in an AoE ticking 5k damage per second you will die in a few seconds. The only way to avoid that is to learn to stop doing that. However in a more grind based improvement system you can eventually get enough stat inflation where the 5k per tick damage offers very little danger. Attack that can one shot you? Eventually that will be barely a scratch. No need to learn anything. Just take it for granted that if things are currently too difficult for you then just play more and the game will become easier. IMO that would be an approach more appropriate for a casual game. It would also be good for a subscription based game as a means to encourage resubscribing.

    To be clear I don't want that game but it is how I would approach it if I was designing a game for a casual audience assuming I realized it at the time and not several years after the game's release. :p

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭

    @Khisanth.2948 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

    Just to play Devil's Advocate ... the answer to that is because GW2 supposed to be relatively casual(? maybe, can't cite a source from ANet). While the existing approach is actually a much more hardcore/elitist approach. With what we have now the only way you "improve" is by actually improving your personal abilities. For example is you are bad enough that you just stand in an AoE ticking 5k damage per second you will die in a few seconds. The only way to avoid that is to learn to stop doing that. However in a more grind based improvement system you can eventually get enough stat inflation where the 5k per tick damage offers very little danger. Attack that can one shot you? Eventually that will be barely a scratch. No need to learn anything. Just take it for granted that if things are currently too difficult for you then just play more and the game will become easier. IMO that would be an approach more appropriate for a casual game. It would also be good for a subscription based game as a means to encourage resubscribing.

    To be clear I don't want that game but it is how I would approach it if I was designing a game for a casual audience assuming I realized it at the time and not several years after the game's release. :p

    Casual doesn't mean you're a bad player or you hate challenge. It means you don't spend 30h/week on the game
    But, if you don't want to challenge players, you could make damage from NPC negligible instead of redesigning the game.

  • Khisanth.2948Khisanth.2948 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Khisanth.2948 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

    Just to play Devil's Advocate ... the answer to that is because GW2 supposed to be relatively casual(? maybe, can't cite a source from ANet). While the existing approach is actually a much more hardcore/elitist approach. With what we have now the only way you "improve" is by actually improving your personal abilities. For example is you are bad enough that you just stand in an AoE ticking 5k damage per second you will die in a few seconds. The only way to avoid that is to learn to stop doing that. However in a more grind based improvement system you can eventually get enough stat inflation where the 5k per tick damage offers very little danger. Attack that can one shot you? Eventually that will be barely a scratch. No need to learn anything. Just take it for granted that if things are currently too difficult for you then just play more and the game will become easier. IMO that would be an approach more appropriate for a casual game. It would also be good for a subscription based game as a means to encourage resubscribing.

    To be clear I don't want that game but it is how I would approach it if I was designing a game for a casual audience assuming I realized it at the time and not several years after the game's release. :p

    Casual doesn't mean you're a bad player or you hate challenge. It means you don't spend 30h/week on the game

    and here we get to a different discussion ;)
    labels being useless without an agreed upon defintion

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭

    @Khisanth.2948 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Khisanth.2948 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

    Just to play Devil's Advocate ... the answer to that is because GW2 supposed to be relatively casual(? maybe, can't cite a source from ANet). While the existing approach is actually a much more hardcore/elitist approach. With what we have now the only way you "improve" is by actually improving your personal abilities. For example is you are bad enough that you just stand in an AoE ticking 5k damage per second you will die in a few seconds. The only way to avoid that is to learn to stop doing that. However in a more grind based improvement system you can eventually get enough stat inflation where the 5k per tick damage offers very little danger. Attack that can one shot you? Eventually that will be barely a scratch. No need to learn anything. Just take it for granted that if things are currently too difficult for you then just play more and the game will become easier. IMO that would be an approach more appropriate for a casual game. It would also be good for a subscription based game as a means to encourage resubscribing.

    To be clear I don't want that game but it is how I would approach it if I was designing a game for a casual audience assuming I realized it at the time and not several years after the game's release. :p

    Casual doesn't mean you're a bad player or you hate challenge. It means you don't spend 30h/week on the game

    and here we get to a different discussion ;)
    labels being useless without an agreed upon defintion

    That's why I used a "but" in my reply. I understood what you meant.
    But... I disagree about GW2 being made for players fitting that definition of casual.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Khisanth.2948 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:

    @Ryo.5824 said:

    @Kulvar.1239 said:
    Exotic being easily available is made on purpose so new players are not tremendously behind veteran players. Not knowing how to play is enough of a handicap.
    If you think ascended is not worth the hassle, then don't bother with ascended gear ! If you're fine with staying in exotic, stay in exotic.

    Not saying that new players need to be more behind than they already are.
    My point is, there are old players not having enough content to grind for (that makes them immediately stronger).

    Why should grind be rewarded with godlike strength ? You can already grind for build freedom (legendary), collections, achievements points, money, ...
    If really you have nothing to grind, it means you've completed the game.

    Just to play Devil's Advocate ... the answer to that is because GW2 supposed to be relatively casual(? maybe, can't cite a source from ANet). While the existing approach is actually a much more hardcore/elitist approach. With what we have now the only way you "improve" is by actually improving your personal abilities. For example is you are bad enough that you just stand in an AoE ticking 5k damage per second you will die in a few seconds. The only way to avoid that is to learn to stop doing that. However in a more grind based improvement system you can eventually get enough stat inflation where the 5k per tick damage offers very little danger. Attack that can one shot you? Eventually that will be barely a scratch. No need to learn anything. Just take it for granted that if things are currently too difficult for you then just play more and the game will become easier. IMO that would be an approach more appropriate for a casual game. It would also be good for a subscription based game as a means to encourage resubscribing.

    To be clear I don't want that game but it is how I would approach it if I was designing a game for a casual audience assuming I realized it at the time and not several years after the game's release. :p

    Casual doesn't mean you're a bad player or you hate challenge. It means you don't spend 30h/week on the game
    But, if you don't want to challenge players, you could make damage from NPC negligible instead of redesigning the game.

    Casual is just the mindset. Like I'm a pretty solid duelist and I like to roam. I will put in time on it. No doubt about it! What you won't find me doing, however, is getting yelled at over voice chat by coms who think we're in an actual army and that winning this fight is super serious business! Likewise, I will shell out cash to server transfer and play with my friend. But I won't shell out cash to get on the server with the best chance of winning or to follow a guild that considers this a cost of doing "business".

    To me, it isn't about how much time you spend or how skilled you are. It just comes down to how serious you are about this.

  • Kylden Ar.3724Kylden Ar.3724 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 18, 2020

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    No, IMO they should nerf it so that ascended/legendary only has an infusion slot over exotic. There's been so much power creep and you want to powercreep it more?

    At its inception people were saying it is gear progression, at this point it is just a baseline standard where ascended weapon + trinkets without the armor has 98% effectiveness.

    100% agreed. PvP was originally balanced around Rares. Exotic should have been the damage/stat caps, period.

    @Trise.2865 said:
    You don't win with stats in this game. A character geared in the free Exotics from level-up is just as capable as someone in full Ascended/Legendary. Try experimenting with your skill order, timing, and combinations, your positioning and tactics, enemy movements and weaknesses, other players, etc., etc.. Military types call these "force multipliers". In other words: "play".

    You'd be amazed at the kinds of things you can do that the game doesn't force you to learn (or re-learn).

    While the 5% bump from Exotic to Ascended isn't enough to matter except in cases of equal skill, saying the " free Exotics from level-up is just as capable as someone in full Ascended/Legendary." is full of it. Those are all mixed, non-useful stats. Might as well tell them to play WvW in rare level magi gear.

    The build stats totally matter. Having the right mix matters.

    Having 5% more than the other guy matters a lot less though.

    How many times we gotta tell you GRIND IS NOT CONTENT there ANet?

    Leader of Tyrian Adventure Corp [TACO], [RaW][TACO] Alliance, Kaineng.

  • crepuscular.9047crepuscular.9047 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Ascended gears are designed to not provide too much difference from exotics because Anet kitten up implementing exotics in the first place

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  • kamikharzeeh.8016kamikharzeeh.8016 Member ✭✭✭

    if anything, increase legendary damage/stats. hard enough to obtain that stuff. i disagree with buffing anything below.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @kamikharzeeh.8016 said:
    if anything, increase legendary damage/stats. hard enough to obtain that stuff. i disagree with buffing anything below.

    There's enough QoL advantage for legendaries and the legendary armory is in the works.

    The more powercreep is added the more of a turnoff it is for new or infrequent players. They do not want to spend ages to have close to top tier stats , luckily unless you do Tier 4 fractals you don't need ascended or legendary armor. Recently Arenanet added a tutorial section to help new players understand the game better so it's clear they are trying to acquire additional players; the "Welcome back" event is more for returning players. +5 stat infusions are small enough of an increase that hasn't been a huge issue yet, but if it's a larger bonus then you can expect some groups looking for full legendary gear for instanced content. How do you expect Arenanet to acquire more customers if more powercreep is added? What would be the net effect on instanced content if the bonus is large? They added strikes to be a learning platform but if legendary gear is powercrept it just adds additional hurdles for newer players. Strike rewards include ascended armor and weapon boxes for a reason, it's because the majority of the openworld playerbase isn't equipped with fully ascended stats yet and neither are alt characters or alt accounts.

    I regularly help new people with <2K AP do instanced content so I've seen the gamut of gear being run. Imagine telling someone that started the game they need to gamble in the mystic forge , do PvP/WvW and loop the reward track many times, or do fractals and buy clovers for a month or two just to have enough clovers to make one legendary to play one character to close to full efficacy. Right now at least people can just rank their crafting to 500 (about 100 gold) and make an ascended weapon or do strikes , do Bjora Marches content for ice to get ascended trinkets/amulet/rings through conversion to other LS4 currency, plus ~24 gold for full exotic berserker's gear. You cannot look at this through only the lens of "legendaries are expensive". Legendaries are expensive because they are a material sink to avoid inflation.

    Just this past week or two I saw people looking for help with ad Infinitum (legendary backpiece) , so the most common legendary backpiece is still being worked on by people.

    Also, since legendaries aren't available to all WvW players (for example you would need to buy weapons off the Trading Post if you don't PvE ; trinkets aren't available unless you do Living world) it would add more balance issues to the mode.

    If you think additional damage is necessary it's probably a build / trait/ gear prefix issue (i.e. only camping a longbow on ranger at max range , pistol mainhand on thief, or greatsword on mesmer ; using spellbreaker spec with Winds of Disenchantment on a boss with no boons --- seen this before ; using CC skills with no damage when there is no CC required) rather than an ascended issue.

  • coso.9173coso.9173 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Let's not. The idea of ascended is for infusions. That's the advantage.

  • Adry.7512Adry.7512 Member ✭✭✭

    No. Just be glad you can have other characters in your account use it.

  • Kulvar.1239Kulvar.1239 Member ✭✭✭

    @killermanjaro.5670 said:

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Based from the opinions gathered, I think the best solution would be to adjust it to 10% per level up to ascended. The difference imbalance would only be the effort put into.

    White to Blue - 10% increase (110%)
    Blue to Green - 10% increase (120%)
    Green to Rare - 10% increase (130%)
    Rare to Exotic - 10% increase (140%)
    Exotic to Ascended/Legendary - 10% increase (150% MAX)

    Easier to understand and the bump is NOTICEABLE lol. I hardly feel the 5%, it's more like a 2% increase.

    How have you concluded that "solution" supposedly "based form the opinions gathered", when pretty much everyone's opinion in this thread has been along the lines of its fine and no changes/adjustments are needed? And for what it's worth, I'm in agreement with everyone else, systems fine as it is.

    It's because his way of making a compromise is to get what he wants but presenting it as a middle ground :)
    He said "based on". Anyone can "base" his decision on what people say and just go with his own want too !

    @kamikharzeeh.8016 said:
    if anything, increase legendary damage/stats. hard enough to obtain that stuff. i disagree with buffing anything below.

    The more increase there is, the more ANet will balance content for it so endgame is not faceroll easy, the more people will ask anyone to have it because not having it would be more difficult, the more ANet will be pressured into making it easier to obtain by nerfing the costs to the ground.
    And then people will complain that there's nothing to do, with the only solution being starting a gear treadmill where gear is easy to get but become useless after a few weeks.

    The way it is currently is perfect.

  • Super Hayes.6890Super Hayes.6890 Member ✭✭✭✭

    No no no! Increase the stats of exotic armor instead

    The next time you get angry at someone try walking a mile in their shoes. After that, who cares! You're a mile away and you have their shoes! -Someone with more awesome quotes than me

  • Brycar.2651Brycar.2651 Member ✭✭✭

    Ascended is really just for the prestigious skin. There are some I just had to have.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Brycar.2651 said:
    Ascended is really just for the prestigious skin. There are some I just had to have.

    Ascended.... prestigious skin....
    lol... ok

  • Roche.7491Roche.7491 Member ✭✭

    @Brycar.2651 said:
    Ascended is really just for the prestigious skin. There are some I just had to have.

    I think you are referring to legendary.

    Ascended are just stat buff and extra agony slots. IMO the skin doesn’t look good.

  • Euclid.2517Euclid.2517 Member ✭✭
    edited May 23, 2020

    This is what I like about this game. No big difference in gears. Only personal skill/group cooperation matters.

    That's why you can deal insanely more damage as a newbie if you know what you are doing, than those with full ascended but don't have right rotation. This is healthy for the game.

  • torakun.9638torakun.9638 Member ✭✭

    Didn't read everything but.. I think Anet had changed from their way in GW1. IN GW1, they went off the mainstream and stay loyal to their vision and fans. This create a hardcore loyalist we still see today.

    When gw2 was released many gw1 loyalist took a peek and some didn't stay long. This mainly is due to the direction Anet doing with gw2 is now joining the mainstream. Clearly gw1 way hurt profit because other mmo can "jump/swim/housing" etc so they made gw2 opposite of it to gain more player base.

    Fast forward to today, still following their business strategy to gain as much casual as possible, Anet had clearly made everything easier and easier to obtain, and I personally don't have a problem with that.

    If not due to corona virus, I'll be working and have a busy life as normal people with family would. This means little time for gaming. If I see the ceiling of the top tier stuff is harder and harder, basically slipper away from my hand every time passed, then I'd just move on to another game. No point in chasing it because when I walk 10 steps the game ceiling also move 10 more steps.

    I personally glad after returning from long absent that I was still able to "catch up" relatively easily even managed to craft 2 legendary in the process. This I value as a customer that normally have a busy life. I don't mind spending money in the game to support them because gw2 made me feel still belong even when I left.

    Anyway OT, I disagree. Asc is already made the game something that non-hardcore players (95% of us? Maybe?) hate:

    ELITISM

    I personally believe that those who want more extra dmg extra benefits especially vs others, just because they had put more time/money are on their way to become an elitist.

    It's enough that raid can only be enjoyed by few % player base. Legendary insight already made its way for the "elite" to establish a boundary against filthy casuls. Ascended given more power will definitely be one of them too. We don't need more that creates too large of a gap between us other than cosmetic.

    Gw1 handle it much much better. All weapon have a max stats. Once you're lvl 20, these maxed stats weapon are easy to come by. Just the skin that are rare. Even then you can't just buy it. You must grind or get lucky.

    The differentiator between players are simple just skill. The only thing that gw1 carried to gw2 thankfully.

    Anyway appear that I've written an essay. Apology. Thanks for anyone that read my ramble.. Lmao

    Cherrs

  • keenedge.9675keenedge.9675 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 23, 2020

    @Roche.7491 said:
    Already halfway farming bears. It’s just boring.

    Bears? Why?

    Grind what's easy and fun for YOU ... Then trade for the rest.
    You can mindlessly grind it out, but that's only for the people who like that activity or challenge.

    I think most of the power creep is that a larger percentage of the player base has improved their game-play skill compared to 5 years ago when so many were fresh.
    I have 2 accounts with rangers. One is full exotic, one has full ascended. In the open-world and WvW, they play almost the same using the same build. Ascended doesn't offer a clear advantage even though the numbers are 5% higher.

    As a new player I first focused on only an ascended weapon because who doesn't love a better weapon. I waited years to make a ascended armor. For T1 and T2 fractals I stacked AR on trinkets to play the higher levels.

    Moral Statute Machine: John Spartan, you are fined five credits for repeated violations of the verbal morality statute.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 23, 2020

    @ torakun.9638 , actually the reason why I signed up for GW1 beta and have been keeping up with this franchise is because I am not really an MMO player. I don't enjoy grinding mobs that die in one hit in search of elusive one in a billion chance drops. Sure I obtained Obsidian armor and multiple 15k armors, but the point is they are all optional and that's a great thing. Someone that joined recently is on an even footing both in PvE and PvP. The slogan was skill>time played.

    GW1 promised people that you don't need to grind at all to be competitive in PvP / GvG which is why it was suitable for esports (although the skill system made it such that you had to know what you were doing ; weapon swap to hide energy and such). GW2 dumbed down the options by a great amount (i.e. no secondary professions or energy except on rev) and doesn't show skill activation bars on the target so you end up relying on twitch reflexes and animation recognition. There is no GVG either and conquest objectives are more complicated for people that want a capture the flag (i.e. stronghold without the archer/doorbreaker NPCs) or deathmatch experience (i.e. GvG done by WvW players). We still have access to PvP instantly but in WvW it's dependent on gear.

    Your sentiment mirrors most people that play this game for fun rather than a job (i.e. people that "play" 1000+ games in a PvP season or grind PvE 12+ hours a day for 1 in 10 billion drop rates) : they play for the story and it's a "pick it up where you left off" situation. Ascended is attainable by most people that just play the game, which is why the topic is ludicrous. Legendary weapons became more attainable due to the collections but the uptake is still not by the majority: see the amount of people with the trinkets and backpiece, per gw2efficiency it's around 10% for the most common backpieces and far lower for trinkets (~10% for Aurora and ~5% for Vision). gw2efficiency represents a subset of the playerbase that is inclined to have more "stuff" so it's actually probably lower than that.

    If ascended armor was prevalent among people that don't do fractals or raids, then I'm sure you would not have the strike mission currency exchange for ascended armor boxes. (Hint: gw2efficiency has the highest unlocked ascended armor piece at 46%.) I made ascended light armor when silk scraps were around 3 silvers a piece or something like that (it's less than 20 copper now), so everyone complaining now that ascended is too hard and they should be given more stats because "it's hard" really haven't been playing long enough to give a proper assessment of ascended.

    As such , I have to echo your sentiment that increasing stats on legendary (making a change that isn't QoL for <10% playerbase is a shortsighted decision) or ascended is asinine. Even at the inception of ascended I warned of powercreep implications. Some people actually were banned from the forum due to voicing concerns about its introduction if you were around then.

    If you look at the state of the gaming market, the highest uptake is games without a grind component to reach an endgame/competitive level. For example mobile games that are just playable once you open them, RTS (i.e. experience rather than time played), autochess (also experience vs time played), shooters (skill > time played), racing games (also experience vs time played), non-MMO RPGs (gear grind doesn't affect others nor PvP), adventure/sandbox games, fighters (skill>time played), etc. It's a detriment to a franchise when people ask "what does it take to reach max gear" and you tell them it takes months and months to reach gear "appropriate" for endgame content (98% effectiveness with exotic armor and ascended trinkets/weapons is sort of close enough at the moment and is enough for T3 fractals or casual raid/strikes).

    My question to everyone proposing stat inflation is if every item on your account vanished and you had to start over with a fresh account with the knowledge/experience you have now would you be able to be competitive in a reasonable amount of time? Or are you so invested in one account that you have lost sight of the forest for the trees?