Burning guardian needs deletion(any spec, core, fb, dh). — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Burning guardian needs deletion(any spec, core, fb, dh).

Burning damage needs big nerf since it scales so much with condition damage stat. For short duration, big damage is done. Burning in PvP is fine if it is the only condition(easy to cleanse), but problems happen when classes that cause burning like guardian apply multiple conditions. So not just even if you cleanse its stacks but new 10 comes right after that. Even as renegade(class that reduces condition damage but also rev that doesn't have good condition cleanses) i couldn't tank burning.

So i propose some big nerfs to guardian might(boon) sources, condition damage stats, their burning stacks from weapons and other effects like spining sword on the ground etc.
This is unhealthy for game, to have a guard that does 5k+ burning damage per second. Literally playing pve dps in pvp.
Hope arenanet devs will reconsider guardian for next balance patch. They did good job for nerfing mesmer, thieves, revs, now it is time to nerf guardians too.

prntscr.com/sig42i

Comments

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 17, 2020

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    Burning damage needs big nerf since it scales so much with condition damage stat.

    EDIT: 5k per tick is like 16-18 stacks of burning. If you get hit by that much, you are omegalul anyway. Maybe stop playing jalis kalla.

    Yeah 0.155 coefficient, scales so much.

    Do you want every condi to be 0.06 like poison and bleed?

    I think they need to nerf POWER parts of those skills. Torch 4 has 1.75 coefficient for power, lol.

  • aelska.4609aelska.4609 Member ✭✭✭

    Burn guard is a build that relies mainly on sword of justice, which has two extremes:

    • Insignificant damage against aware people, people will not even step in your sword of justice.
    • Insanely rewardful when used to cleave downstate/used sneakily in a teamfight (we are speaking here about 10k/s against a downstate, making it effectively impossible to rez).

    It is part on the inconsistent design of the class, with burning mechanics no one asked for, which can only be made potent with other stupid mechanic no one asked for (AoE burn with traited F1/burn on sword of justice). It effectively hard counters your build (which hard counters itself all the others guard builds).

    Besides being clunkily stupid, it is not overpowered by itself considering how easily counterable it is (don't walk in sword of justice, or use a cleanse right after and gg). Although I would love to see some changes made in guard in general to make it feel more "consistent".

  • Kuma.1503Kuma.1503 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 17, 2020

    I was having trouble with core burn guard for a while until I realized that I was panic cleansing too soon. I played it for a bit and realized that, in most cases, my burns were taking a while to down someone. Usually, they had a second or two after my burst to cleanse before they dropped, and if they succeeded in cleansing my burns, my pressure was significantly reduced.

    If I had any advice to give when dealing with burn guard, it would be don't panic. You won't drop to burn damage right away. Make sure you time your clenases well then go in for some counter pressure. Burn Guard has good burst sustain, but it's cooldown reliant, so once you've baited their CD's they're an easy kill. I'd also reccommend playing it for a bit so you can get a feel for how long it takes for someone to die to your burns.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    there are 2 problems with burn guard: symbolic power in zeal which causes justice passive to proc twice as fast and scepter 2 which hits 8 times.

    Te lazla otstara.

  • I'm seeing 2 revs in every game and dh once every 5 games, seems rev is op and needs deletion

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mistsim.2748 said:
    If you're allowing a burn guard to bully you, then you're not pressuring him enough.

    OP nearly always plays jalis/kalla, that build is almost hard countered by burn guard. That's why he is asking for deletion lol.

  • mistsim.2748mistsim.2748 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 17, 2020

    @Tayga.3192 said:

    @mistsim.2748 said:
    If you're allowing a burn guard to bully you, then you're not pressuring him enough.

    OP nearly always plays jalis/kalla, that build is almost hard countered by burn guard. That's why he is asking for deletion lol.

    All is clear now.

    Jallis/Kalla is a fun little build, but it's got lots of weaknesses yeah.

    I think a lot of the crying in general comes from gold players running off-meta when they face plat players running meta builds or some cheese that is difficult to comprehend, like the burn guard.

  • nativity.3057nativity.3057 Member ✭✭✭

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    Burning in PvP is fine if it is the only condition(easy to cleanse), but problems happen when classes that cause burning like guardian apply multiple conditions.

    Wasn't the reason that guardian can only apply burn why it's not any good??

  • Bazsi.2734Bazsi.2734 Member ✭✭✭

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    Burning damage needs big nerf since it scales so much with condition damage stat. For short duration, big damage is done. Burning in PvP is fine if it is the only condition(easy to cleanse), but problems happen when classes that cause burning like guardian apply multiple conditions. So not just even if you cleanse its stacks but new 10 comes right after that. Even as renegade(class that reduces condition damage but also rev that doesn't have good condition cleanses) i couldn't tank burning.

    Oh you cannot tank something that was designed to be a bunker killer? Well I guess it's time to nerf it to the ground! (After all moving offpoint in an 1v1 - how stupid - thats for all the other classes not me!)

    So i propose some big nerfs to guardian might(boon) sources, condition damage stats, their burning stacks from weapons and other effects like spining sword on the ground etc.
    This is unhealthy for game, to have a guard that does 5k+ burning damage per second. Literally playing pve dps in pvp.

    Speaking about what's unhealthy for the game, delete Jalis/Kalla please. Why is renegade even viable in PvP, the visual clutter is already too much at teamfights. Same reason I hate minon master necromancers, at least they border on meme viability and noone plays them seriously. And guess what, AoE burning is also the way to deal with those. We need burning builds(or anything analogous to them) around to cull the insanity that is a fight where 60%+ of entitites present are AI controlled things.

    Hope arenanet devs will reconsider guardian for next balance patch. They did good job for nerfing mesmer, thieves, revs, now it is time to nerf guardians too.

    Yeah, overnerfing classes to force them into 1 role is clearly a good job. Lets add renegade to that list, it's one role can be support DPS in PvE raids.

    So just to reiterate: you're playing a build that's much more problematic compared to the build you're trying to get nerfed, so your complaints cannot be taken seriously.
    Yes burn guard counters bunker renegade, thank kitten at least that one build does that.

  • Well if guard did anything but just spamming 1111 scepter/other weapon(to proc passive burning) and spining sword on the ground, i wouldn't complain, but playing like it is hitting boss in pve....man :P
    It is good counter to renegade but both that guard and renegade(tank) play styles are poorly designed. Spamming spells all over again and 1,1,1,1...
    It happened many times that in ~1650 rating games, enemy had exact burning guard or even 2 and just melting all of us in few seconds.
    I think retaliation is a good enough counter to renegade, those burning stacks with 5-6k tiks is out of mind : D

  • you play Kalla/Jallis? with menders and possibly dollyak?
    your build is a plague that just stands on point and spams. oh you get countered by a one trick pony?
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    yeah well...dont you think YOU deserve that deletion?

    Burn and suffer in silence

  • Eugchriss.2046Eugchriss.2046 Member ✭✭✭

    @lovemghool.7613 said:
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    There are several fake news in there.

  • Bazsi.2734Bazsi.2734 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @lovemghool.7613 said:
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    There are several fake news in there.

    Care to list them? The only one I was able to spot was 20 might. As far as I know, you can do all the rest.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I think Guardians in general are FAR from being the unhealthiest things in PvP.
    Firebrands maybe, but Core and DH are performing well, but not too strong.
    In my opinion, Thief's runaway disengage potential is worse for the gamemode than anything a Core Guardian or DH could throw at you.

  • Eugchriss.2046Eugchriss.2046 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 17, 2020

    @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @lovemghool.7613 said:
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    There are several fake news in there.

    Care to list them? The only one I was able to spot was 20 might. As far as I know, you can do all the rest.

    They all are technically possible. Understand, the game allows it. But good luck trying those in real life.

    • pulsing alacrity: you waste 20 energy on 75 for a total of 1.25s (~2.25s if traited) ahead? LOL
    • pulsing stab: ok
    • 20 might: you can even have perma 25 might
    • aoe protection: ok
    • aoe heal with condi dmg reduction: okay-ish. It would rather want it to condi cleanse or give resistance, but it s a personal opinion.
    • aoe 50% damage reduction: it is almost mutually exclusive with pulsing stab due to energy cost (+ it s the only stunbreak).
    • aoe life steal: ok
    • spamm cc: it is daze actually but okay-ish. 1 aoe cc negate the whole legend. WOW
  • Buran.3796Buran.3796 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Is not very good. I did play power Herald, condi Herald, condi Renegade, carrior Firebrand, sage Firebrand and mender Firebrand in this season (~260 mtaches). In Firebrand I moved from carrion, then sage and finally mender because the amount of damage gained with carrion didn't pay off how weak the healings were with the spec. Core burn guardian does more damage and has better heals in 1 vs 1 than the symbolic Firebrand, but lacks the axe, which is much better weapon in teamfights. You sacrifice too much team presence running a yolo burning Guard, that's why you don't see them in the AT. Maybe it can feel strong against some builds, but is a one trick pony with small weight in the current meta; don't see the reason to nerf it.

  • Khalisto.5780Khalisto.5780 Member ✭✭✭✭

    they can nerf. burn without destroying the other builds, they done it with weaver

  • @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @lovemghool.7613 said:
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    There are several fake news in there.

    Care to list them? The only one I was able to spot was 20 might. As far as I know, you can do all the rest.

    equip Vindication and start 111ing something on shortbow. press F2 for more when not attacking. still possible without Vindication with just f2 and sigil of courage but why would you not use it anyway.

  • @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @lovemghool.7613 said:
    So i propose you propose some big nerfs to your build that covers the capture point and give out pulsing alacrity/pulsing stability/20 might /aoe protection/aoe heal with condi dmg reduction/ aoe 50% dmg reduction/aoe life steal and spam cc

    There are several fake news in there.

    Care to list them? The only one I was able to spot was 20 might. As far as I know, you can do all the rest.

    They all are technically possible. Understand, the game allows it. But good luck trying those in real life.

    • pulsing alacrity: you waste 20 energy on 75 for a total of 1.25s (~2.25s if traited) ahead? LOL
    • pulsing stab: ok
    • 20 might: you can even have perma 25 might
    • aoe protection: ok
    • aoe heal with condi dmg reduction: okay-ish. It would rather want it to condi cleanse or give resistance, but it s a personal opinion.
    • aoe 50% damage reduction: it is almost mutually exclusive with pulsing stab due to energy cost (+ it s the only stunbreak).
    • aoe life steal: ok
    • spamm cc: it is daze actually but okay-ish. 1 aoe cc negate the whole legend. WOW

    Charged Mists exists and is used for this energy hungry build so you are encouraged to spend almost all energy before swapping regardless. you dont need the rite always and you can opt to toggle on vengeful hammers for 20 or any other utility if you are not pressured.

    As for the cc the build has AOE CC with most of it being from range
    Darkrazor's daring: daze spam for 6 seconds on 12 seconds cooldown is not the only cc available to you and is on a low cooldown
    Shortbow 5: 2 seconds aoe ranged knockdown on 12seconds cooldown
    Staff 5: aoe knockback and evade 20 seconds. yes yes it is garbage but still exists
    Forced engagement: cheap cost aoe taunt and slow on 15 seconds cooldown

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 18, 2020

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    Burning damage needs big nerf since it scales so much with condition damage stat. For short duration, big damage is done. Burning in PvP is fine if it is the only condition(easy to cleanse), but problems happen when classes that cause burning like guardian apply multiple conditions. So not just even if you cleanse its stacks but new 10 comes right after that. Even as renegade(class that reduces condition damage but also rev that doesn't have good condition cleanses) i couldn't tank burning.

    So i propose some big nerfs to guardian might(boon) sources, condition damage stats, their burning stacks from weapons and other effects like spining sword on the ground etc.
    This is unhealthy for game, to have a guard that does 5k+ burning damage per second. Literally playing pve dps in pvp.
    Hope arenanet devs will reconsider guardian for next balance patch. They did good job for nerfing mesmer, thieves, revs, now it is time to nerf guardians too.

    prntscr.com/sig42i

    +1

    Soldiers Role-Guardian
    'Guardian Profession are the masters of protection.'
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Profession

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Guardian

    NOT MASTERS OF CONDITION SKILL CASTER!!!!!

    Why Are Soldier Professions Such As Warrior, Guardian and Renegade Are Allowed To Play Scholar Profession Roles? Also, Why Are They Even Allowed To Surpass Their Conditions And Being Praised For It And Being Excused From Nerfings?

    In other word, Soldier Professions Are Freely Given Full Control To Overtake Other Profession Roles At Ease Without Having Any Restrictions or Consequences Whatsoever?

    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    A Non-Condition Role Treated As A Golden Child vs A Condition Role Treated As A Scapegoat?

    'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'

  • ollbirtan.2915ollbirtan.2915 Member ✭✭✭

    @Burnfall.9573 Sorry, could you repeat the last part again? The bolded caps seriously made it difficult for me to understand what exactly you are asking about and, most importantly, from whom .

  • TinkTinkPOOF.9201TinkTinkPOOF.9201 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    Burning damage needs big nerf since it scales so much with condition damage stat. For short duration, big damage is done. Burning in PvP is fine if it is the only condition(easy to cleanse), but problems happen when classes that cause burning like guardian apply multiple conditions. So not just even if you cleanse its stacks but new 10 comes right after that. Even as renegade(class that reduces condition damage but also rev that doesn't have good condition cleanses) i couldn't tank burning.

    So i propose some big nerfs to guardian might(boon) sources, condition damage stats, their burning stacks from weapons and other effects like spining sword on the ground etc.
    This is unhealthy for game, to have a guard that does 5k+ burning damage per second. Literally playing pve dps in pvp.
    Hope arenanet devs will reconsider guardian for next balance patch. They did good job for nerfing mesmer, thieves, revs, now it is time to nerf guardians too.

    prntscr.com/sig42i

    So....Burning is over performing so you want to nerf guards everywhere including power builds? Why not tame burning rather than nerfing guard might, condi stats and burn application?

    Also, in PvP and the lower over all dmg I have never had a problem with burn specs and I don't see them often at all, mostly because the dps is pigeon holed and can just be walked out of, in most cases not even needing a cleanse because most of the big skills are static ground targeted and lack any serious cover condis. Now if we were talking WvW in larger group fights trolling it can be effective because there are so many cover condis tossed around for you and the visual skill mess can make it hard to see what is hitting you. However vs a guild group, it will be cleansed long before it has time to tick twice. So even here it's a noob/pug killer and not much more, if I find one solo, its a free kill.

    "When you power creep the game and make it so that spam gameplay is nearly as effective as deep knowledge and nuance, the quality of players will decrease." -Exedore

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @""Djuna.4387"

    Maybe you should make your own thread instead of risking to get reported for offtopic and derailing in addition to Naming & Shaming.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @""Djuna.4387"

    Maybe you should make your own thread instead of risking to get reported for offtopic and derailing in addition to Naming & Shaming.

    he will get banned for this, he simply wants as many people as possible to see before he does

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 18, 2020

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @""Djuna.4387"

    Maybe you should make your own thread instead of risking to get reported for offtopic and derailing in addition to Naming & Shaming.

    he will get banned for this, he simply wants as many people as possible to see before he does

    It's not like it's of any use anyway.
    If Arenanet doesn't react to multiple reports ingame, I doubt they'll react to anything people write on the forums.

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Burn guard doesn't need deletion, conditions just need a purpose that isn't "other damage."

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    Burn guard doesn't need deletion, conditions just need a purpose that isn't "other damage."

    Well conditions ignore armor.

    I think burning and bleeding should have a difference and poison should have lower coefficient/damage than bleeding. Rest are ok.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Imagine everyone requesting every build that counters theirs to be deleted.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Stop spamming this stuff.
    You do little more than just annoy people.
    Stop ruining the forum with a matter that won't be addressed the way you want it to.

  • ollbirtan.2915ollbirtan.2915 Member ✭✭✭

    geez....can someone please ban that troll already? Has kittened all over the forum with his spa, posts.

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Khalisto.5780 said:
    they can nerf. burn without destroying the other builds, they done it with weaver

    It is far more complex in guardian’s case. The damage comes from virtue of courage (or tome). In core, torch also factors in. The values can be changed, but since it is not tied to a specific weapon, it is harder to balance.

    I understand people complaints about FB (even though it seemed to be getting pushed out of the meta). Core and DH condi builds are C Tier at best. It literally applies one condi, and in core’s case lacks both CC and mobility. It lacks any pressure potential against semi component opponents. However, it is absolutely a noob killer. I guess we have to dumb sPvP further down, that even people who cannot cleanse can compete. At the rate thing a are going I think blind people will be able to compete too...

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ollbirtan.2915 said:
    @Burnfall.9573 Sorry, could you repeat the last part again? The bolded caps seriously made it difficult for me to understand what exactly you are asking about and, most importantly, from whom .

    @ollbirtan.2915 said:
    @Burnfall.9573 Sorry, could you repeat the last part again? The bolded caps seriously made it difficult for me to understand what exactly you are asking about and, most importantly, from whom .

    I apologize and rewrote it; all bolded caps removed

    'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    Wrong game, this is guildwars2 forum.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    Wrong game, this is guildwars2 forum.

    'NCSoft's Guild Wars 2 has revealed another addition to the professions for their up and coming subscription-less MMO. The Necromancer class saw play in the original Guild Wars as a main profession seen throughout and playable in all of the expansions, so it is not all too surprising to see it in the sequel as well.

    However, as it can be seen in all of the revealed classes, there has been some major upgrading done to the Necromancer in both its looks and skill set. Of course the Necromancer appears to be the same minion master class, where you summon masses of ungodly corpses to do your bidding and swarm the enemy mercilessly, but now deadlier than ever.

    https://gamerant.com/guild-wars-2-necromancer-profession-revealed/

    'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    Wrong game, this is guildwars2 forum.

    'NCSoft's Guild Wars 2 has revealed another addition to the professions for their up and coming subscription-less MMO. The Necromancer class saw play in the original Guild Wars as a main profession seen throughout and playable in all of the expansions, so it is not all too surprising to see it in the sequel as well.

    However, as it can be seen in all of the revealed classes, there has been some major upgrading done to the Necromancer in both its looks and skill set. Of course the Necromancer appears to be the same minion master class, where you summon masses of ungodly corpses to do your bidding and swarm the enemy mercilessly, but now deadlier than ever.

    https://gamerant.com/guild-wars-2-necromancer-profession-revealed/

    Not only that's an unofficial source that just comments on the early class reveal, but also "deadlier than ever" isn't anywhere near your self-proclaimed "condition master" (actually, if you don't take it out of context, it's about being a "minion master class, but deadlier than ever"). How is this quote even relevant to my question?

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    Wrong game, this is guildwars2 forum.

    'NCSoft's Guild Wars 2 has revealed another addition to the professions for their up and coming subscription-less MMO. The Necromancer class saw play in the original Guild Wars as a main profession seen throughout and playable in all of the expansions, so it is not all too surprising to see it in the sequel as well.

    However, as it can be seen in all of the revealed classes, there has been some major upgrading done to the Necromancer in both its looks and skill set. Of course the Necromancer appears to be the same minion master class, where you summon masses of ungodly corpses to do your bidding and swarm the enemy mercilessly, but now deadlier than ever.

    https://gamerant.com/guild-wars-2-necromancer-profession-revealed/

    Not only that's an unofficial source that just comments on the early class reveal, but also "deadlier than ever" isn't anywhere near your self-proclaimed "condition master" (actually, if you don't take it out of context, it's about being a "minion master class, but deadlier than ever"). How is this quote even relevant to my question?

    Master of Conditions

    'The Master of Conditions is a Zaishen master who, along with his students, demonstrate the effects of conditions. He gives information about how to tell when you are suffering from a condition.'

    'Dialogue'

    "You come here seeking knowledge, so I shall being with a quick lesson for you: even the mightiest warrior and the wisest mage can still become sick and injured. Here, we study the body and its vulnerabilities. What more would you like to know"
    ⇒ Tell me about Conditions.
    "Conditions are often side effects of other skills, although some professions specialize in causing Conditions. Conditions may slow you, deal damage to you, or affect your ability to cast spells or receive healing. All Conditions wear off eventually, but they can also be removed or transferred with special skills."
    "A small brown downward arrow on a character's Health bar indicates that the character is suffering from a Condition. If you are suffering from a Condition, a gold-colored icon with a golden border will appear on the upper left-hand corner of your default screen."
    "I think it best that you approach my students and experience each Condition firsthand."
    ⇒ Let's talk about something else.

    No I'll be on my way.'

    'He uses the same model as Post-Searing Verata the Necromancer'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Master_of_Conditions

    'Verata is the first Necromancer Profession quest giver in pre-Searing Ascalon. After the Searing, he continued his research on undead minions, but his eager desire for knowledge caused him to use forbidden practices to increase the speed of his research. Because of this, he became an outcast of "the Order" and formed his own guild.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Verata_the_Necromancer

    'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 19, 2020

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:
    Yet Necromancer; A Scholar Profession Is Punished, Ridiculed And Treated As A Scapegoat....For Being Who They Are Called To Be, Who Their Ancestor Called Them To Be- Condition Master?

    Who exactly are they "punished, ridiculed and treated as a scapegoat" by?

    And who called them a "condition master"? Maybe you -and nobody else. You quote a part of vague guardian description from wiki as a part of your "argument", so lets do the same with necro:
    "Necromancers are masters of the dark arts. They summon the dead to fight for them, channel blood energy and rend their enemies' souls. Necromancers draw on life force and use it to strengthen or heal themselves "

    Whoopsie, not a condition master.

    'Commanding the dizzying array of curses and blood spells at their disposal, and piles of the dead in their wake, necromancers excel at area clearing and quickly defeating large groups of enemies. Necromancers are the only profession that willfully inflicts itself with severe negative effects—using their own life force to fuel powerful abilities—in order to defeat the opponent and gain the upper hand in combat; being at death’s door does not concern them if no adversaries remain to deal the killing blow. Once the first enemy falls, a barrage of exploding corpses, condition-spreads and blood spikes follow suit, until the battlefield is littered with the bloody remains of their foes: more resources ready for exploition.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_necromancer

    Wrong game, this is guildwars2 forum.

    'NCSoft's Guild Wars 2 has revealed another addition to the professions for their up and coming subscription-less MMO. The Necromancer class saw play in the original Guild Wars as a main profession seen throughout and playable in all of the expansions, so it is not all too surprising to see it in the sequel as well.

    However, as it can be seen in all of the revealed classes, there has been some major upgrading done to the Necromancer in both its looks and skill set. Of course the Necromancer appears to be the same minion master class, where you summon masses of ungodly corpses to do your bidding and swarm the enemy mercilessly, but now deadlier than ever.

    https://gamerant.com/guild-wars-2-necromancer-profession-revealed/

    Not only that's an unofficial source that just comments on the early class reveal, but also "deadlier than ever" isn't anywhere near your self-proclaimed "condition master" (actually, if you don't take it out of context, it's about being a "minion master class, but deadlier than ever"). How is this quote even relevant to my question?

    Master of Conditions

    'The Master of Conditions is a Zaishen master who, along with his students, demonstrate the effects of conditions. He gives information about how to tell when you are suffering from a condition.'

    'Dialogue'

    "You come here seeking knowledge, so I shall being with a quick lesson for you: even the mightiest warrior and the wisest mage can still become sick and injured. Here, we study the body and its vulnerabilities. What more would you like to know"
    ⇒ Tell me about Conditions.
    "Conditions are often side effects of other skills, although some professions specialize in causing Conditions. Conditions may slow you, deal damage to you, or affect your ability to cast spells or receive healing. All Conditions wear off eventually, but they can also be removed or transferred with special skills."
    "A small brown downward arrow on a character's Health bar indicates that the character is suffering from a Condition. If you are suffering from a Condition, a gold-colored icon with a golden border will appear on the upper left-hand corner of your default screen."
    "I think it best that you approach my students and experience each Condition firsthand."
    ⇒ Let's talk about something else.

    No I'll be on my way.'

    'He uses the same model as Post-Searing Verata the Necromancer'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Master_of_Conditions

    'Verata is the first Necromancer Profession quest giver in pre-Searing Ascalon. After the Searing, he continued his research on undead minions, but his eager desire for knowledge caused him to use forbidden practices to increase the speed of his research. Because of this, he became an outcast of "the Order" and formed his own guild.'

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Verata_the_Necromancer

    1. Master of conditions =/= necro. Even considering it was indeed necro, it doesn't mean anything -just because a master of conditions happens to be "x" class/race/gender/age/whatever doesn't mean every "x" class/race/gender/age/whatever is automatically a "master of conditions". You understand that, right?
    2. Even from what you've quoted: "Conditions are often side effects of other skills, although some professions specialize in causing Conditions."
      Some proffessions. Not necro specifically.
    3. Lore =/= balance.
    4. Wrong game, again. We're playing gw2.

    As you can see, you keep repeating that "NECRO MASTERS OF CONDITIONS HAVE TO BE THE BEST" mantra, but you've just made up that claim yourself.

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tayga.3192 said:

    @Swagg.9236 said:
    Burn guard doesn't need deletion, conditions just need a purpose that isn't "other damage."

    Well conditions ignore armor.

    I think burning and bleeding should have a difference and poison should have lower coefficient/damage than bleeding. Rest are ok.

    Condition's armor-ignoring damage isn't really an aspect that needs to define it. Guild Wars 1 had conditions that inflicted armor-ignoring damage too, but it was never enough to kill anybody rapidly, and they were mostly applied with the intent to use them in order to trigger conditional effects of other skills. The only class in GW1 that really applied conditions just to apply them was Ranger, and even that class generally had a specific role as an "interrupter" outside of just being some dude who inflicts targeted degeneration. GW2 conditions are just damage; that's why they're insufferable and have no real identity.

  • I think you guys are very toxic with your messages about banning someone and calling him troll.
    I gave my opinion about burning damage and class(guardian) that uses it as main tool to overcome not just revenants but many other classes. I think that is toxic for PvP and should be nerfed or changed. Weaver used to have a lot of burning damage in its kit before too but it got balanced.

    Instead of requesting bans for someone just because it gave different opinion, you should give your opinion how to fix current problem or other wise do not even comment.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Svez Poizon XD.5268 said:
    I think you guys are very toxic with your messages about banning someone and calling him troll.
    I gave my opinion about burning damage and class(guardian) that uses it as main tool to overcome not just revenants but many other classes. I think that is toxic for PvP and should be nerfed or changed. Weaver used to have a lot of burning damage in its kit before too but it got balanced.

    Instead of requesting bans for someone just because it gave different opinion, you should give your opinion how to fix current problem or other wise do not even comment.

    They’re complaining about someone spamming a copy and pasted post that has nothing to do with the thread. I think it was about win trading.