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Warrior is NOT fine


Tom.5914

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Damage is not great, thats ok for me,but if damage is so bad I want sustain and be able to heal myself instead of running out of combat to regenerate to full about 10 times per PVP match.

Warrior self-healing is underperforming:

To the limit, healing ~8k, cast time ONE second, cooldown 30 seconds (useless adrenaline + endurance)healing amount is low, cooldown is way too long, cast time impossible under pressureusecase: NONE

Mending, healing ~7k, cast time ONE second, cooldown 20 seconds (useless remove conditions)healing amount is much too low, cooldown is long for bad output, cast time impossible under pressureusecase: NONE

Healing signet, healing 2.5k, ~250 per second, cast time 1.25 seconds, cooldown 20 seconds, resistence 6 secondsboth healing amounts are a joke, regeneration STOPS while it is recharging, cast time impossible under pressure, but activating is worthless anyway, maybe ok when running to stop condition damageusecase: PVE, WvW (only 1vs1)

Defiance stance, healing ~2k, cast time 0.25 seconds, cooldown 30 secondsinitial healing amount is JUST WORTHLESS, cast time is great, the only warrior heal that can pump a decent amount into your wet noodle, but ONLY if enemies are stupidusecase: solo fractals, low SPVP, WvW zerg

Blood reckoning, healing ~3k, cast time 0.25 seconds, cooldown 25 seconds (25% of damage to health for 5 seconds, reset burst)inital healing amount is a joke again, maybe being able to do about 10k damage so another 2.5k joke healing, cast time is great, cooldown too long for resultusecase: solo fractals, WvW, PVP - the healing only really works in pve, but it boosts your damage

Natural healing, healing ~9k, cast time 1.25 seconds, cooldown 25 seconds (lose nearly all boons and conditions)healing amount is still low, at least best cooldown / amount ratio, cast time impossible under pressureusecase: NONE

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Ele heal glyph - comparing with mending, 5 sec worse cooldown, but no cleanses. Provides boons which you already have. Generally worse than warr's heal.

Ele heal signet - comparing with warr signet, no bonus effects on activation, but slightly higher heal and cooldown. About same heal without activating, much worse than warr's heal on activation.

Herald heal - same like warrior's stance heal, lasts 1 second shorter -> worse than warr.

Guard meditation heal - comparing with blood reckoning - 1 sec duration more, but less base heal and no side effects (adrenaline, zerker mode etc). Worse than warr's heal.

In every situation, warr comes with more heal amount or just more effects compared to other heals. Cast times are for the most part the same.

Do you expect every heal to give you 10k health, 1/4 cast time and 10 sec cooldown while you're in full berserker gear? If you want sustain, take traits and gear stats that give you those. Warrs have been by far the worst offender before last patch where they could heal for free with no stat investments, while also having high active defense through blocks and stances as well as high health.

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@steki.1478 said:Ele heal glyph - comparing with mending, 5 sec worse cooldown, but no cleanses. Provides boons which you already have. Generally worse than warr's heal.

Ele heal signet - comparing with warr signet, no bonus effects on activation, but slightly higher heal and cooldown. About same heal without activating, much worse than warr's heal on activation.

Herald heal - same like warrior's stance heal, lasts 1 second shorter -> worse than warr.

Guard meditation heal - comparing with blood reckoning - 1 sec duration more, but less base heal and no side effects (adrenaline, zerker mode etc). Worse than warr's heal.

In every situation, warr comes with more heal amount or just more effects compared to other heals. Cast times are for the most part the same.

Do you expect every heal to give you 10k health, 1/4 cast time and 10 sec cooldown while you're in full berserker gear? If you want sustain, take traits and gear stats that give you those. Warrs have been by far the worst offender before last patch where they could heal for free with no stat investments, while also having high active defense through blocks and stances as well as high health.

Ele also has teleports, built in healing with water. Ele also has way more skills to make use of their signet. Ele also can blast and leap it's own water fields.

Herald also has two heals, teleports, and many kiting tools while also being a heavy armor class.

Guardian has built in healing with their virtues, teleports, defensive boons out the wazoo, and that meditation heal when traited heals for roughly 6k before dealing any damage.

Conversely warrior has no teleports, very little access to defensive boons, and viable builds are always melee in PvP. Their trade off is higher armor, higher health, and higher healing which isn't cutting it at the moment.

Your comparisons are weak and not well thought out.

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it's fine because warrior will never get all these mechanics, so warrior is fine at being hot garbage and banner slave.now that i remembered i've being posting about warrior lack of mechanics since 2013 but nothing ever changes, because that's their philosophy/hard rule for warrior, not even with new elite specs that supposed to change its play style.

i start to think they didn't even want to add evade to bull charge and might makes right, but they are forced to or else warrior will be completely trashed.they can easily give some sustain trait like might makes right to arms and make it viable too, but no. or even give better damage mitigation options so strength doesn't need to give so much sustain while being a offensive line. meh

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They overnerfed MMR. They should have reduced it to 99 hp from 133 hp instead of to 64 hp.

That and when the Dev team reworks Defense they need to give warrior more active defense. Like more ways to actively get retaliation in core for the 10% damage reduction and an active source of protection, like gaining protection for 4s on a heal, or protection on dodge.

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@Tycura.1982 said:

@steki.1478 said:Ele heal glyph - comparing with mending, 5 sec worse cooldown, but no cleanses. Provides boons which you already have. Generally worse than warr's heal.

Ele heal signet - comparing with warr signet, no bonus effects on activation, but slightly higher heal and cooldown. About same heal without activating, much worse than warr's heal on activation.

Herald heal - same like warrior's stance heal, lasts 1 second shorter -> worse than warr.

Guard meditation heal - comparing with blood reckoning - 1 sec duration more, but less base heal and no side effects (adrenaline, zerker mode etc). Worse than warr's heal.

In every situation, warr comes with more heal amount or just more effects compared to other heals. Cast times are for the most part the same.

Do you expect every heal to give you 10k health, 1/4 cast time and 10 sec cooldown while you're in full berserker gear? If you want sustain, take traits and gear stats that give you those. Warrs have been by far the worst offender before last patch where they could heal for free with no stat investments, while also having high active defense through blocks and stances as well as high health.

Ele also has teleports, built in healing with water. Ele also has way more skills to make use of their signet. Ele also can blast and leap it's own water fields.

Herald also has two heals, teleports, and many kiting tools while also being a heavy armor class.

Guardian has built in healing with their virtues, teleports, defensive boons out the wazoo, and that meditation heal when traited heals for roughly 6k before dealing any damage.

Conversely warrior has no teleports, very little access to defensive boons, and viable builds are always melee in PvP. Their trade off is higher armor, higher health, and higher healing which isn't cutting it at the moment.

Your comparisons are weak and not well thought out.

And you have mobility skills with low cooldown, lots of blocks/evades on weapon skills, stances that completely negate damage as well as hard cc to lock down targets (which can also be used defensively). Every class have their ways of avoiding damage and warr always had it for free. Take more healing power and you'll see your sustain.

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@steki.1478 said:

@steki.1478 said:Ele heal glyph - comparing with mending, 5 sec worse cooldown, but no cleanses. Provides boons which you already have. Generally worse than warr's heal.

Ele heal signet - comparing with warr signet, no bonus effects on activation, but slightly higher heal and cooldown. About same heal without activating, much worse than warr's heal on activation.

Herald heal - same like warrior's stance heal, lasts 1 second shorter -> worse than warr.

Guard meditation heal - comparing with blood reckoning - 1 sec duration more, but less base heal and no side effects (adrenaline, zerker mode etc). Worse than warr's heal.

In every situation, warr comes with more heal amount or just more effects compared to other heals. Cast times are for the most part the same.

Do you expect every heal to give you 10k health, 1/4 cast time and 10 sec cooldown while you're in full berserker gear? If you want sustain, take traits and gear stats that give you those. Warrs have been by far the worst offender before last patch where they could heal for free with no stat investments, while also having high active defense through blocks and stances as well as high health.

Ele also has teleports, built in healing with water. Ele also has way more skills to make use of their signet. Ele also can blast and leap it's own water fields.

Herald also has two heals, teleports, and many kiting tools while also being a heavy armor class.

Guardian has built in healing with their virtues, teleports, defensive boons out the wazoo, and that meditation heal when traited heals for roughly 6k before dealing any damage.

Conversely warrior has no teleports, very little access to defensive boons, and viable builds are always melee in PvP. Their trade off is higher armor, higher health, and higher healing which isn't cutting it at the moment.

Your comparisons are weak and not well thought out.

And you have mobility skills with low cooldown, lots of blocks/evades on weapon skills, stances that completely negate damage as well as hard cc to lock down targets (which can also be used defensively). Every class have their ways of avoiding damage and warr always had it for free. Take more healing power and you'll see your sustain.

Lots of blocks huh? What warrior are you playing? It has 4 and 3 are garbage that don't see use.

Shield 3 second block with a CD of 30 secondsMace has a single instance of block on a 10 second CDOffhand sword has a single instance block on a 15 second CDShattering Blow, 1/2 block, 15 CD on zerker spec lol

Lots of evades on weapons huh? Because there's just one.

GS 3, 3/4th second evasion 10 second CD

But I'll point out those other "weapon skill evades".

Burst Skill: Full Counter, 1/2 second evade, 12 CD, 1 Bar of Adrenaline

Utility: Bull's Charge, 1 and 1/4 second evasion, 30 second CD.

Stances that completely negate damage?First of all who runs stances anymore? The traits got wrecked in defense. Nobody runs the stance heal because it's objectively bad in skillful play. For the sake of the post I'll throw it down here away.

Defiant Stance (the only stance that can be said to "completely negate damage") all incoming damage heals you for 4 seconds. 30 CD

Berserker Stance, 4 seconds of pulsing 1 second stacks of resistance and adrenaline, 30 CD

Endure Pain, 3 seconds of no power damage, 40 second CD

As for hard CC every single one is telegraphed except for "fear me" and the vast majority are melee range.

If you would like to show me a stance build with healing power using all the evades and blocks I will be glad to point out how it isn't competitive.

Furthermore what you claim to be free sustain in the very same post talk about running sustain utilities and a completely sustain focused off hand weapon. Every competitive warrior build has to run some form of sustain in it's traits. Your excuse to just run healing power is terrible as well because the class has been balanced around not using it. Healing power gives pitiful returns to most sources of healing. For whatever reason if you actually did run healing you would see that your damage is garbage without zerk/demo because the damage warrior does has been balanced with those stats in mind. Just like ele has been balanced around running healing power just the opposite side of the coin.

Warrior's meta build needs a buff to compete with the current meta simple as that. People with an axe to grind will say otherwise.

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@Tycura.1982 said:

because the class has been balanced around not using it

Apparently it's not anymore, so learn how to adapt. It's pitiful on every class, but at least they have sustain when they take it.

Ele's never been balanced around healing power because it always had no damage output so you had to use condi builds if you want it or full glass which has 0 sustain and defense. Same could be said about many non engi/warr classes which had busted sustain with no investment as well as high damage skills and built in defense. Now that they cant kill you with their stunlocks, people demand buffs. Buffs arent needed if you adapt your build.

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I never got killed because I used a healing skill with an activation time, actually, I hate the healing signet. It doesn't really give you that much. Mending is way better, defiant stance can also be good for more invulnerability (at the cost of an healing skill though...) To the limit is actually pretty decent and awesome if you run Tactic with the trait. Adrenaline and Endurance are never useless.

For the healing power, I've seen better results with Mending and To the limit. Those 2 skills scales pretty well with it. Appart of those 2, the other skills don't offer a lot.

The only use for Natural Mending may be only if you are solo and you don't have someone buffing you.

Warrior is really weak, but mostly because of the other classes that are really overperforming. It's no secret that a lot of traits and skills needs to be reworked as well.

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I straight up read none of this except the title.... This may be wrong but let me explain....

Warrior used to be a beast Solo, or in a party. easily doing more damage then any other class in early stages. This was due to being able to kite bosses with rifles with Bleeding doing mass amounts of damage, and before they nerfed the entire "Seed Healing Turret", where you could bring multiple items with you, where you could solo champions, and even event bosses.

This is what made me delete my lvl 80 warrior, and Guardian, because these two classes got nerfed so far into the ground a few months/years after launch, it became almost unbearable to play these two classes. Thus, creating new classes.

I'm not too sure how it is now, but from what I've seen, Melee Rangers. and even Revenants/Renegades (DoT) can do WAY more damage than warriors. I almost see absolutely no Warriors now, unless it's a new player who's trying to learn how to play for the first time, because no one in their right mind would choose a warrior over any other class. I've even seen how engineers work, and despite their lack of damage, at least their support roles outwiegh the roles of a warrior in any matter, whether it comes to damage, or support. Warriors are absolute trash, and at this point, should just entirely be removed from the game, or reworked until they are viable again.

This is just me speaking from someone who's went from Launch Warrior, to the Warriors now. It's sad that no one wants a warrior in their party, and they're considered a "Lowbie Class".

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@"Humor.5763" said:I straight up read none of this except the title.... This may be wrong but let me explain....

Warrior used to be a beast Solo, or in a party. easily doing more damage then any other class in early stages. This was due to being able to kite bosses with rifles with Bleeding doing mass amounts of damage, and before they nerfed the entire "Seed Healing Turret", where you could bring multiple items with you, where you could solo champions, and even event bosses.

This is what made me delete my lvl 80 warrior, and Guardian, because these two classes got nerfed so far into the ground a few months/years after launch, it became almost unbearable to play these two classes. Thus, creating new classes.

I'm not too sure how it is now, but from what I've seen, Melee Rangers. and even Revenants/Renegades (DoT) can do WAY more damage than warriors. I almost see absolutely no Warriors now, unless it's a new player who's trying to learn how to play for the first time, because no one in their right mind would choose a warrior over any other class. I've even seen how engineers work, and despite their lack of damage, at least their support roles outwiegh the roles of a warrior in any matter, whether it comes to damage, or support. Warriors are absolute trash, and at this point, should just entirely be removed from the game, or reworked until they are viable again.

This is just me speaking from someone who's went from Launch Warrior, to the Warriors now. It's sad that no one wants a warrior in their party, and they're considered a "Lowbie Class".

The only solution seems to rework the entire class. Because right now, it's either "too op" or "trash". It's always truly balanced.

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@"Lighter.5631" said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

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@Atticus.7194 said:

@"Lighter.5631" said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

It's his attempt to cope with the situation.

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@Atticus.7194 said:

@"Lighter.5631" said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

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@Lighter.5631 said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

How about detailing a list of issues as you see them and potential solutions, or a comparative analysis of warrior vs other classes to illustrate flaws or at least if absolutely nothing else make your posts funny and original, cause just complaining is just resentment and no matter how well deserved it's not fun to be around.

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@Atticus.7194 said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

How about detailing a list of issues as you see them and potential solutions, or a comparative analysis of warrior vs other classes to illustrate flaws

You realize there are hundreds of posts about that, posting more will just be repeating the same thing for the 10th times.if you actually read thoseinstead of complaining about complaining, but if that's your cup of tea.

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@Lighter.5631 said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

How about detailing a list of issues as you see them and potential solutions, or a comparative analysis of warrior vs other classes to illustrate flaws

You realize there are hundreds of posts about that, posting more will just be repeating the same thing for the 10th times.if you actually read thoseinstead of complaining about complaining, but if that's your cup of tea.

So instead of taking those as a marker for the right thing to do you settled on mindless tantrum on the forums? Yea sure that's really going to help developers understand the problem and make yourself part of the solution.

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@Atticus.7194 said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

How about detailing a list of issues as you see them and potential solutions, or a comparative analysis of warrior vs other classes to illustrate flaws or at least if absolutely nothing else make your posts funny and original, cause just complaining is just resentment and no matter how well deserved it's not fun to be around.

There was plenty of feedback over last months/years and if devs are not aware of what is wrong with the class they balance (underperforming skills/traits, skills that don't always work as they should, etc) then what can I say... incompetence?Stomp still didn't get its cooldown reduction. Battle Standard is still 240 seconds underwater. Rush still doesn't work reliably. Earthshaker doesn't hit reliably when there is small elevation in terrain. Rupturing Smash is very impractical to use in close melee range due to its aoe targeting.Also there are some obsolete skills (including their cast times and animations) and traits that are not used in proper builds at all, nothing is done with that or it just takes like several years... is that really competent balance?

When the balance patch comes, I can't wait for things like hammer autoattack damage increased by 15% in PvE and Imminent Threat Taunt duration increase from 1.5 sec to 2 sec. Just what warrior needs. /s

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@Atticus.7194 said:

It's fine guys, warrior is fine.CMC specifically said in stream that next patch is gonna be super small and only touch on birds and thief.move on guys.

Why do you appear in every thread and go "Warrior is fine go away" and add nothing to the conversation??

because there's nothing to add? tell me what else can anyone add? i'm sure the community has added enough already.i can literally rant about warrior's poor treatment since 2013 for days as a pvper , but yea.anyone can ever do right now really, is to tell the written truth and that's exactly what anet will think and do.

How about detailing a list of issues as you see them and potential solutions, or a comparative analysis of warrior vs other classes to illustrate flaws

You realize there are hundreds of posts about that, posting more will just be repeating the same thing for the 10th times.if you actually read thoseinstead of complaining about complaining, but if that's your cup of tea.

So instead of taking those as a marker for the right thing to do you settled on mindless tantrum on the forums? Yea sure that's really going to help developers understand the problem and make yourself part of the solution.

Yes, because devs aren't independent thinking individuals that need forum posts to tell them what's going on in the game LOL. bro.how you still think like these amazes me, if dev really took forum posts seriously, they would have done something years ago. 90% of my constructive feed back being a pvp warrior player since 2013 and played at top 100 level dont bring any changes, but 10% of my posts about "warrior is fine" is going to affect dev judgement? damn bro. devs maybe missing directions, but they are not preschoolers.

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