Dagger Suggestions

(English is not my native language, so I apologize if I have grammatical errors)

I'm sure everyone agrees with the fact that there are a lot of underperforming weapons, I want to focus on daggers, of course if you are going to use dagger in necro you will only do it to generate life force, so it goes without saying that daggers need a damage bonus, the interactions with bleeding of dagger main hand are interesting, so to begin:

1. We need a base damage buff of all dagger skills.
2. Following the theme of skill 2 "Life siphon", an increase in damage when the enemy is bleeding should be applied to all dagger abilities, to support this interaction, autoattack chain should apply bleeding.

Dagger main hand skill 3 "Dark pact" is really underwhelming, single target long cast time for a very low reward, the boons corrupted are good, inmobilize is fine I guess, plus self bleeding, I know this is supposed to be used before using "Life siphon", to use the interaction "Healing effectiveness increases in 20% if you are bleeding", but for me it's not enough, so to fix this my suggestion is:

3. Skill 2 "Life Siphon" I like it, but when a teammate condi cleanse the bleeding you lost your extra healing, and come on someone else can heal you to full no problem, but still, to fix this the interaction "Healing effectiveness increases in 20% if you are bleeding", should be gone and just buff the healing a little bit.

4. Skill 3 "Dark Pact" this should be AoE 5 targets keep the 600 range, boon corruption and inmobilize, add bleeding, if the enemy is bleeding double the boon corruption and increase a little bit the inmobilize duration.

Dagger off-hand, oh boy... I like to use two incinerators on my characters, but with necro it's hard, if you compare it with the other options (warhorn,focus,torch) you start wondering why should I even bother, dagger can't compete, ,

5. Off-hand skill 4 "Deathly swarm", a weird skill, a 900 range projectile that bounces 3 times, blind, transfer 3 conditions, I like this skill, a little bit tricky to use but ok imo, maybe more damage would justify the 18 second cooldown.

Off-hand skill 5 "Enfeebling Blood", this skill... long cd, low damage, this one could use some big buffs, something that Off-hand lacks vs the other off-hand weapons is life force generation, so my suggestion is:

6. skill 5 "Enfeebling Blood", big buff to damage, gain life force for every enemy struck, if the enemy is bleeding, convert another boon to condition and stun, maybe it will be too load of a skill but 25 seg cd?, it should be strong.

Possibly you guys have better ideas than me, maybe some of these suggestions have already been made, and these suggestions may not even be very useful in pvp but I speak from a pve perspective, so looking at the rest of the necro weapons I think it would be fun to make daggers a hybrid weapon, interacting with damage and condition damange, i would love to use D/D necro, and I would love for anet to give a little love to daggers, that's it, take care guys!.

Some dagger design facts (you have to understand these to get an overview about anets intention of the weapon):

• Dagger (mainhand and offhand) is meant to fit thematically (leeching) and meant to synergize with blood magic. It synergizes with the leeching traits due to its fast and frequent attacks and its channel on skill 2 which triggers the leech traits multiple times. BM does also include the dagger buff trait and the mark on dodge trait applies bleeding to the target.
• The selfbleed of dagger 3 is meant to keep on yourself to improve your heal of dagger 2 or alternatively meant to be transfered via dagger 4 to your target. Dagger 5 does apply bleeding on your target as well.

So changes will most likely happen in this design context.

The problem with the weapon is that all this complexity is useless as the weapon is simply to weak in its damage. It is pretty much impossible to kill an encounter in the competitve modes with a dagger build right now after the damage nerf patch.

They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

Dagger really is awkward. Literally, the only reason to run any Daggers at all on Necro are to get more self healing in OW content with Dagger MH, or while you're leveling up as Condi before you can get Torch from Scourge...

Dagger OH is closest to being functional. It'd only take a few tweaks to become a decent Condi off-hand:

Deathly Swarm - Simply add a few stacks of Torment on it in addition to its other effects. Like 2-4ish would seem okay.Enfeebling Blood - It needs to be faster so it will actually land sometime this century. It would also benefit from additional Bleed stacks so it can do a somewhat reasonable amount of damage. Say, 5-10 stacks of Bleed (Given its 25s CD)

Dagger MH needs some more work though. It can't really decide if it wants to be a Power weapon (Due to the power scaling on skills 1 and 2) or a Condi weapon (Due to the boon to condi on skill 3 and bleeding affinity on skill 2) and unlike some other classes weapons, ends up being non-viable as either, let alone actually decent as a hybrid weapon (See: Basically all Ele weapons that can be Power or Condi and SB's dagger MH can be Power or Condi)

It'd need to really try and pick a direction to go in and be reworked around that, or have much better facilitation of being a hybrid weapon.

If it was going to become a proper hybrid (As opposed to opting for one build type) then something like:

Necrotic Slash - Also applies 2x 3s Bleed stacksNecrotic Stab - Also applies 4s TormentNecrotic Bite - Also applies 4s Bleed and 4s Torment

Life Siphon - Now applies 2s Bleed per tickDamage bonus now based on if a target has Torment

Dark Pact - Power coefficient increased by 100%Now also applies 4x 10s Torment stacks to target

@KrHome.1920 said:They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

Dagger will not outperform GS just from some auto attack buffs.

Given that GS (Also Axe) in Reaper is powerful because of dropping its high damage CD's (Death Spiral and Nightfall for GS and Ghastly Claws for Axe) while waiting on Shroud's CD the burst Life Force generated by DS and GC also works well for quickly getting back into Shroud. As opposed to using its auto's for long periods of time (In fact, GS's sustained damage leans on sub-50% life Gravedigger spam which doesn't auto attack at all)

Suggestion 1 :

• Life Siphon moved to Auto, remains largely the same and additionally restores 0.5% Life force per damage tick
• New skill 2 which tethers the player to nearest 5 targets in 600 range, pulsing damage and Bleed for 3 ticks, then applying Immob on the last tick.
• Dark Pact remains mostly the same

Gives the Dagger more kiting potential, and give it a fair Immob condition.

Suggestion 2 :

• Necrotic chain increased to 5 targets
• Life Siphon coefficients lowered slightly but increased to 5 target tether
• Dark Pact changed to Bleed self in order to deal damage in a cone AoE which also converts up to 2 Boons into Bleed.

Gives Core Necro finally some good cleave, and good AoE sustain.

I love mainhand dagger as it is and don't want it ruined as often happens with skill revamps.

I quite like Dagger how it is atm but the only main change i'd like to see is the restoration of 3 target hit on the Auto chain for PvE only.I'd be more than content with that alone.However for the other skills, i'll give my take.

Life Siphon is fine, huge heal on a short CD for tank builds and if you run a life steal Minion Master this skill can actually become your dedicated heal.

Dark Pact, I would rather have the 3sec immob replaced with a heavy cripple to better help lock down a target and add a Dark Pact buff that allows you to deal more damage to crippled foes or a % of damage per condition on foes or something like that.Either that or replace the immob with a stun so it can at least have a bit of CC.

Deathly Swarm is fine, though as a projectile it's easily blocked and dodged.I'd prefer it if it worked a bit more like Gw1's version of the skill rather than a projectile and caused a swarm to appear on a target and then bounce to 2 others if they are in range.

Enfeebling Blood is fine as it is.

I use dagger for my Reaper with axe in 2sd bar.I hate how sluggish GS feel, I just can't play with this weapon..Necro really need another or a buff to his second main hand power weapon to made it a viable choice.

@Lahmia.2193 said:I love mainhand dagger as it is and don't want it ruined as often happens will skill revamps.

Dagger could use some changes, but I dread having to think about them redesigning it and making it utterly useless.

I agree daggers have fared badly in the game's power-creep.

When the game released in 2012, there was not as much condition removal or mobility. Necro's daggers do not have as powerful a means to confine opponents into short range combat. Dps could be improved but dagger's main issue is the weakened tool set.

Axe was buffed many times and has a longer range with more power but range and power were never dagger's weaknesses. Dagger struggles with locking opponents into short range combat. Players know it is ineffective at that. This is a prime reason why Reaper is so preferred: Reaper has a modern tool set.

@KrHome.1920 said:Some dagger design facts (you have to understand these to get an overview about anets intention of the weapon):

• Dagger (mainhand and offhand) is meant to fit thematically (leeching) and meant to synergize with blood magic. It synergizes with the leeching traits due to its fast and frequent attacks and its channel on skill 2 which triggers the leech traits multiple times. BM does also include the dagger buff trait and the mark on dodge trait applies bleeding to the target.
• The selfbleed of dagger 3 is meant to keep on yourself to improve your heal of dagger 2 or alternatively meant to be transfered via dagger 4 to your target. Dagger 5 does apply bleeding on your target as well.

So changes will most likely happen in this design context.

The problem with the weapon is that all this complexity is useless as the weapon is simply to weak in its damage. It is pretty much impossible to kill an encounter in the competitve modes with a dagger build right now after the damage nerf patch.

They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

I think the root cause of dagger's weak play is that health leech is a ineffective strategy in PVE; it doesn't do much to keep you alive (not like it's hard to stay alive in the first place) and the tradeoff is average damage output. Nothing will fix this weapon for PVe short of a complete rework of the health leeching concept (i.e. removal) ... or for it to be broken entirely with straight up DPS increases of 10-20%.

@"Obtena.7952" said:I think the root cause of dagger's weak play is that health leech is a ineffective strategy in PVE; it doesn't do much to keep you alive (not like it's hard to stay alive in the first place) and the tradeoff is average damage output. Nothing will fix this weapon for PVe short of a complete rework of the health leeching concept (i.e. removal) ... or for it to be broken entirely with straight up DPS increases of 10-20%.

Personally I think the main hand dagger's design fit the original design of the shroud that was supposed to be the downstate. In the game as it is, I could see it become "viable" just with the introduction of a trait that would grant the necromancer an amount of barrier equal to the amount of LF gained from weapon skills (Obviously it would need to be in a shroudless e-spec akin to the scourge).

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@"Obtena.7952" said:I think the root cause of dagger's weak play is that health leech is a ineffective strategy in PVE; it doesn't do much to keep you alive (not like it's hard to stay alive in the first place) and the tradeoff is average damage output. Nothing will fix this weapon for PVe short of a complete rework of the health leeching concept (i.e. removal) ... or for it to be broken entirely with straight up DPS increases of 10-20%.

I think it could work better with the Soul Eater style. The trait gives a noticeable increase in sustain for a reaper. Heal for 5% of damage dealt.

@LucianDK.8615 said:

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@"Obtena.7952" said:I think the root cause of dagger's weak play is that health leech is a ineffective strategy in PVE; it doesn't do much to keep you alive (not like it's hard to stay alive in the first place) and the tradeoff is average damage output. Nothing will fix this weapon for PVe short of a complete rework of the health leeching concept (i.e. removal) ... or for it to be broken entirely with straight up DPS increases of 10-20%.

Unfortunately not, the dagger don't shine by it's damage but it's sustain, the 5% from Soul eater can't help the dagger to be competitive against the GS in this aspect.

You know dagger could be more of a melee range support weapon. It's already used on heal scourge, there's no reason they cant slap some party/squad healing on it at least for PVE. The boon corrupt is also rather poor given the cooldown (2 boons on 15 cooldown) and single target.Staff : this is a condi weapon mainly due to the marks , even if the auto is mainly life force generation. It is poor in PvE because unblockable marks and high target count don't mean as much in PvE (since it's condi)GS: power weapon by far / melee range boon corrupt (4 on 25 cooldown)Axe: power ranged weapon / PBAOE boon rip (2 on 12 cooldown)Scepter: condi ranged weapon / boon rip (3 on 10 cooldown , only AoE when traited)

Dagger would fulfill the support weapon role much like mace on guardian, staff on revenant , druid, elementalist, or guardian or warhorn on warrior

I really wish dagger was a viable option when you’re running reaper powered. Right now I just lose a great sword because it’s such a damage increases

@Obtena.7952 said:

@KrHome.1920 said:Some dagger design facts (you have to understand these to get an overview about anets intention of the weapon):

• Dagger (mainhand and offhand) is meant to fit thematically (leeching) and meant to synergize with blood magic. It synergizes with the leeching traits due to its fast and frequent attacks and its channel on skill 2 which triggers the leech traits multiple times. BM does also include the dagger buff trait and the mark on dodge trait applies bleeding to the target.
• The selfbleed of dagger 3 is meant to keep on yourself to improve your heal of dagger 2 or alternatively meant to be transfered via dagger 4 to your target. Dagger 5 does apply bleeding on your target as well.

So changes will most likely happen in this design context.

The problem with the weapon is that all this complexity is useless as the weapon is simply to weak in its damage. It is pretty much impossible to kill an encounter in the competitve modes with a dagger build right now after the damage nerf patch.

They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

Have to disagree there, I have a couple of Necros built around lifestealing that all use Dagger 2 as a healing skill.They're borderline unkillable in most PvE content, only a handful of really powerful creatures can outdamage their incoming healing in one on one fights.My main T4 Fractal character uses Dagger 2 as a dedicated heal as well to great effect, without it my build would no longer work there as i'd loose too much lifesteal to sustain myself.

Yes you can bring leeching and healing to absurd levels in PvE. But in PvP and WvW it's still too weak because the drawbacks are too big against targets that are not AI based.

Example:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PSwEgEWoMCmGDj5xKxxWytZD-zRIYR09XGRUVVkq2eSCj/A-eThat build is full zerk but nevertheless trivializes PvE content due to all its heals. But even in this build the dagger is a pure utility weapon.

@Teratus.2859 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@KrHome.1920 said:Some dagger design facts (you have to understand these to get an overview about anets intention of the weapon):

• Dagger (mainhand and offhand) is meant to fit thematically (leeching) and meant to synergize with blood magic. It synergizes with the leeching traits due to its fast and frequent attacks and its channel on skill 2 which triggers the leech traits multiple times. BM does also include the dagger buff trait and the mark on dodge trait applies bleeding to the target.
• The selfbleed of dagger 3 is meant to keep on yourself to improve your heal of dagger 2 or alternatively meant to be transfered via dagger 4 to your target. Dagger 5 does apply bleeding on your target as well.

So changes will most likely happen in this design context.

The problem with the weapon is that all this complexity is useless as the weapon is simply to weak in its damage. It is pretty much impossible to kill an encounter in the competitve modes with a dagger build right now after the damage nerf patch.

They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

Of course they are ... because PVE content is so easy that you're overhealing in most encounters. That's actually the point I made ... life stealing as a strategy is ineffective, not because it doesn't work, but because it's only useful in a very small number of encounters.

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@KrHome.1920 said:Some dagger design facts (you have to understand these to get an overview about anets intention of the weapon):

• Dagger (mainhand and offhand) is meant to fit thematically (leeching) and meant to synergize with blood magic. It synergizes with the leeching traits due to its fast and frequent attacks and its channel on skill 2 which triggers the leech traits multiple times. BM does also include the dagger buff trait and the mark on dodge trait applies bleeding to the target.
• The selfbleed of dagger 3 is meant to keep on yourself to improve your heal of dagger 2 or alternatively meant to be transfered via dagger 4 to your target. Dagger 5 does apply bleeding on your target as well.

So changes will most likely happen in this design context.

The problem with the weapon is that all this complexity is useless as the weapon is simply to weak in its damage. It is pretty much impossible to kill an encounter in the competitve modes with a dagger build right now after the damage nerf patch.

They can not simply buff the auto attack damage because then the weapon will outperform greatsword which has super slow but individually strong autoattacks for a reason. So there have to be some extreme damage buffs to skill 2, 3, 4, 5. I am talking about at least 50%.

I'm confused by your statements.. they seem to counter one another.Overhealing in most encounters, yet the mechanic is only useful in a very small number of encounters?That doesnt make sense to me sorry.

From my experience the only encounters where lifestealing isn't that useful is against the very small number of enemies in the game with instant kill mechanics, like Raid bosses, and a handful of really powerful enemies that can do massive damage even to tanks, or can outheal my solo damage.. like the Skeletal Lich in the Halloween Labyrinth whom pretty much puts me in a immovable object meets unstopable force situation and we could just fight on till the end of time with no victor lolEverything else it works on perfectly fine imo.

@Teratus.2859 said:I'm confused by your statements.. they seem to counter one another.Overhealing in most encounters, yet the mechanic is only useful in a very small number of encounters?That doesnt make sense to me sorry.

What he/she mean is that life siphons might be good at healing but that doesn't mean that the mechanism itself is attractive in term of effectiveness. To put it simply it's not a valuable tool in group setting unless you face foes that cannot be critically hit.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:I'm confused by your statements.. they seem to counter one another.Overhealing in most encounters, yet the mechanic is only useful in a very small number of encounters?That doesnt make sense to me sorry.

You mean lifesteal not siphon right? Siphon is specifically one skill, LifeSteal is the mechanic.

In a group setting it depends how you look at it, if you have a dedicated healer like a Druid then wouldn't having your tank not require any additional healing be good for that Druid?They can focus almost exclusively on the other party members and ignore the Tank making their job easier and likewise more effective.

Maybe the disagreement here comes from how some people view Lifesteal as an offensive mechanic more than a healing one..It's the other way around for me, I consider it primarily a healing mechanic with some bonus offensive damage that just adds up the more sources you can get it from.. in a Minion Masters case that can be quite a bit.Getting 10+ minions in most encounters is hadly difficult.. and combined they can deal somewhat decent damage and lifesteal sustain.

Just for funzies I tested my tanky lifesteal MM on that DPS golem in LA earlier just to see how high I could get my DPS on what is mostly a tank build.Even without food and the 100% crit chance I know I can get on the build in most groups, I was hitting the golem for between 11-13K under ideal conditions (all boons and buffs with perma vun and chill on golem)Was almost hitting 10K with just the boons and perma chill+vun on golem as well with even less crit chance and no food which isnt bad at all for a Tank build.Normally in groups I have the 100% crit chance and food, 25 might and a lot of quickness uptime and sometimes class buffs to my power and ferocity.. so I expect between 10-13K dps is quite realistic for the build to hit a lot of the time in group content like Fractals or open world content like bounties, world bosses etcSpecially when there are adds in the fight that I can exploit for extra minions (one thing the DPS golem also cant account for since I can't spawn several of them to max my minion production and therefore see the total damage and lifesteal potential they can output combined.)

The highest benchmark I found for power Necro was 31K under ideal conditions so i'm quite satisfied with my test results on what is pretty much a near unkillable tank.. specially when my main objective isnt even DPS anway, it's keeping my party alive.. I'm more a support role in this build if anything.It does make me wonder what the max potential DPS for the build is though if I were running with a optimized group that could provide all the buffs and boons I need to get it there..Then again there are far better players in this game that would be better suited to work that out.. and I don't want to install things like ArcDPS on my computer just to satisfy my curiosity.. so most of what I wrote after the original response is kinda irrelevant I guess since i'll likely never know >.<

Long story short:

In the competitive modes you need burst heals and not healing over time because your encounters deal burst damage and you can't simply kite them when you need time to recover like you could kite a stupid A.I in PvE.

Two exceptions are

• healing in shroud because your health bar is protected against damage of your encounter. Healing over time works exceptionally well in that case and that's why core and reaper have only access to very limited healing sources in shroud. They would be unkillable otherwise.
• scourge barrier does also protect your health bar for a short amount of time to get some usage of the blood magic heals over time.

10-13K dps is quite realistic for the buildThat's actually pretty bad and I would be pretty pissed having such a low damage in my group as this wastes a lot of time for no reason. Pretty much every class can build for great survivability while still maintaining at least 20k DPS.

E.g. the power reaper metabuild deals ~25k DPS just with GS and shroud autoattacking. So you can fill your whole utility bar with defensive skills to increase your survivability. And even if you then additionally switch to marauder gear, you are still above 20k.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:I'm confused by your statements.. they seem to counter one another.Overhealing in most encounters, yet the mechanic is only useful in a very small number of encounters?That doesnt make sense to me sorry.

Yes, that's the general idea. heal over time skills with cooldowns aren't that useful based on how this game is designed because most the damage you take that actually kills you in this game isn't applied over time ... it's direct, single attacks. Even if there was more DoT's in this game, Dagger 2 would simply cancel the damage over the time of the attack ... then what? The length of a battle is certainly going to be much longer than any HoT from a offensive weapon skill can provide.

I think the thing that is offensive to me is that there are MUCH better ways to do what a dagger necro does and not use daggers. Even if life siphoning was an effective PVE strategy to be sustainable ... Reaper does it much better, so the question is why is there so much overlap between two build strategies where one is obviously crap ... I know the answer to that will be 'theme' because not everyone wants to play a reaper, but no one should be promoting a necro dagger build because of it's capability to be 'effective' in PVE. If you can hit 1 ... you're effective in 90% of the PVE in this game ...

If someone wants to promote a build as 'effective' in PVE ... show me how it can solo most of the Mastery points in HoT ... then we can talk. I know dagger necro doesn't do that. If people want to understand what effective means in PVE, check out OWD Mirage or play a minion Scepter necro.

@Infusion.7149 said:You know dagger could be more of a melee range support weapon. It's already used on heal scourge, there's no reason they cant slap some party/squad healing on it at least for PVE.

I agree MH dagger could be a choice instanced PvE support weapon but Arenanet clearly disagrees. Necromancer should not have group support options because it is selfish according to the developers. Sharing the siphon heal and damage buffs at some fraction of the Necromancer's sustain makes sense but Vampyric Presence sets a very low bar.

@"KrHome.1920" said:

10-13K dps is quite realistic for the buildThat's actually pretty bad and I would be pretty pissed having such a low damage in my group as this wastes a lot of time for no reason. Pretty much every class can build for great survivability while still maintaining at least 20k DPS.

It was an estimate based on limited information and the lack of means to accurately test it in real scenarios, could be more or even less I couldn't honestly tell you.I'm not a DPS head though and I don't build for that often and even when I do it's never to min max.. I hate min max gameplay, that honestly feels like working more than playing to me and it just isn't fun.

The point of the build when I created it several years ago was to be able to basically facetank anything in PvE and still be able to kill it without needing hours to do so as back then I often heard people claim that tanking was useless in Gw2 and had trash damage and also there was this attitude that Soldier Stats were a noob stat set for idiots who didnt know how to play the game. (this was back around the time when everyone pretty much had the mindset that DPS zeker was the only right way to play Gw2)

Build was in part created to prove those people wrong, and also to really annoy those kinds of people in PvP too by kicking their b***'s with something they considered a "noob stat build"Admittedly though I was a PvP noob back then but that original pre HoT MM build allowed me to win pretty much every 1v1 fight to my memory, also a number of 2v1 fights and even on a few cases 3v1's.In fact I can't recall many times I was killed back then using the build, specially in 1v1's.. but my memory isn't reliable specially that far back.Anyhow I had a lot of cheater accusations and angry messages from people who simply could not kill me, as well as a few Necro players asking me what the hell I was using.

Unfortunately there is no way I can get the information on how many players I specifically fought and killed during this time.. if there is a way to access that information i'd love to see it.The best I can give you is my win loss ratio for the time as almost my entire Unranked stats in Gw2 are from pre HoT launch in 2015 and using the original tank MM build, my last unranked game pre HoT being on the 16/9/2015.As it stands:Unranked Arena Games Played: 71Unranked Arena Games Won: 42Unranked Arena Games played by tanky Necromancer MM build: 56Unranked Arena Games won by tanky Necromancer MM Build: 35We can knock off a unranked game too as I had one game on the 10/11/2015 post HoT and lost that one largely due to the powercreep of Elite Specs which is one reason I just stopped pvping all together. (tbh I was never much of a fan in the first place anyway and i'd had my fun already with the build)

So ultimately this build managed to get a 35/55 win streak in unranked PvP with randoms (I never played with a pre existing team) and at the time I was a complete PvP noob who had never played much PvP before and never with Necromancer.I can provide screenshot proof of those stats if needed since I still have them thanks to not touching unranked pvp since 2015.

Getting back on track though, I know the DPS is ultimately low.. it's a tank/support build so it's supposed to be.I know I could get a lot more damage out of it without giving up too much tankyness, I do have other Necro MM builds that do just that, as well as Necros using other methods of lifesteal and sustain like a Wellmancer build and I do have more DPS focused Necro builds to.But I still use the Tanky MM as well because I simply enjoy playing it and it allows me to to do things like win solo 1v2's against the Lab Horror and Grand Viscount on halloween or solo legendary bounties and other such stuff.It's good for small group play too since I can easily keep a number of players alive which in scenarios where there's like 2-3 low skill players getting wrecked by a bandit champ, I can run on in and guarantee they'll get the kill and carry them through the legendary bandit too if that spawns since I can solo it if need be and prevent it from winning the fight.That kind of thing I love doing in this game, and I don't mind giving up a moderate chunk of DPS to do it.