Please stop asking LI for strike missions — Guild Wars 2 Forums
Home Fractals/Dungeons/Strike Missions/Raids

Please stop asking LI for strike missions

Asking li for strike missions, no matter which strike missions you're planning on doing just doesn't make sense. Strike missions are supposed to be an introduction to raid and not the other way around.

It's damaging for both party.

It's either gonna continue to split the community in two between those who can do "harder" strike missions and those who can do "easier" strike missions, and as we saw with both fractals and raids, that content is just gonna be non-existent in the long run.

So no matter how much longer you take to clear Boneskinner or Whisper of Jormag with a random group, just don't ask for LI. If you also know what you're doing as a commander there is no scenario in which you can't adapt to the situation, a good team comp should make up for whatever group you have. And low damage just means you won't get gold at the end of the strike.

I can understand the frustration of how much time it might take if you don't ask for LI but, if you value your time then just go with a group full of guildies.

The latest that just got released on Tuesday with the new episode is another "easy mode" strike, and if this continue strike are gonna go back to shiver peak level.

<1345

Comments

  • DutchRiders.2871DutchRiders.2871 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    I wanna play with people that raid hence I ask for LI.

    If strikes go non existent I dont care, they are not that interesting. If they get more easy, that means more easy loot.

    "I only want to play with the cool kids" is why raids were abandoned by the developers.

    I never said I wanna play with cool kids, I said I wanna play with raiders when I lfg.

    And I dont care about raids being abandoned. Gw2 is supposed to be easy.

  • tim.4596tim.4596 Member ✭✭✭

    It's quite different, he's arguing how he has the right to create whatever lfg he wants and I am saying that it is damaging to the community.

    Don't get me wrong, I am not whining about strike being too difficult, I am saying strikes are way too easy as they now stand (that includes Boneskinner and Woj). And that asking for li requirements is pointless when you could just explain the strat to your group, or rather reconfirm it if you see that it's a fiesta. Boneskinner explanation is literally stick together and dodge left.

    I have around 2k li and do weekly clear almost every week. I am not affected by li requirements , however strikes were getting harder up to the point of WoJ and Boneskinner buy are now getting easier. Forging steel is just long and annoying but is hardly difficult.

    Also no matter how much li I ask strikes I've never seen a single pug group being able to skip the ball phase from Whisper of Jormag. So if people with li didn't feel so entitled it would solve a lot of issues.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 28, 2020

    @tim.4596 said:
    Asking li for strike missions, no matter which strike missions you're planning on doing just doesn't make sense. Strike missions are supposed to be an introduction to raid and not the other way around.

    I agree. With li we also have some role-play players. I try ask only KP from 100CM fractal. Have 50+ ? welcome

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • TPMN.1483TPMN.1483 Member ✭✭✭

    Naked Asuran Strike Missions are coming ! There will be a group that manages it !

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 28, 2020

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    I wanna play with people that raid hence I ask for LI.

    If strikes go non existent I dont care, they are not that interesting. If they get more easy, that means more easy loot.

    "I only want to play with the cool kids" is why raids were abandoned by the developers.

    That is however one of the premises for raids' existence in the first place, so you can;t really hope for raiders to just abandon this way of thinking. And especially not if it's extremely advantageous in the content, because it helps you to not wipe.

    You won't change the people. The only thing that can be changed is content.

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @tim.4596 said:
    It's quite different, he's arguing how he has the right to create whatever lfg he wants and I am saying that it is damaging to the community.

    It is actually good for the community because by clearly stating requirements, groups set their own expectations. That way players of vastly different skill levels don't mix in the same team, reducing overall friction.

    That works only if all groups have the same chances of success (even if for some it will take longer). Once it's no longer the case, the friction gets even higher.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    That works only if all groups have the same chances of success (even if for some it will take longer). Once it's no longer the case, the friction gets even higher.

    In-game friction is mostly removed if groups set their own requirements, aside from those rare snowflakes that enter groups they don't belong to by faking the requirements. Or the other special snowflakes that join groups without requirements and hijack them. But special snowflakes aside, having requirements leads to less friction than without having any requirements, as someone said once: "if you don't post requirements, you don't have expectations", which could cause way more friction in the end.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 28, 2020

    @Alyster.9470 said:
    I create full strike run everyday on lfg without asking LI even tho I have almost 2k now. I never had problems with clearing it, yes there are some people who have no idea or do 2-3k dps die here and there, but thats just fine, tolerate them or help them by giving advice or sharing your builds. If we dont tolerate newbies and kick them rightaway it will ruin their motivation and after that we will cry that no strikes are being released because no one is doing them. Funny thing is whenever I join a party asking for LI, ironically they fail more or someone leaves the party after a specific boss. Strikes are easy, just create your own squad know what roles are needed and do it. Dont know the boss mechanics? Just watch a video, it takes 2 minutes.

    What the game needs is community building. That way newbies won't need to be tolerated by other random players, they'd have a group already, their guild for example to play and enjoy Strike Missions (and all other content). It's why I always wonder when I join a squad or a party for any type of content, all these players from different guilds, what's stopping them from playing with their guilds/communities instead of joining random teams? Strike Missions should be seen by Guilds as a type of Guild Missions, an excellent opportunity for Guild Members to get together and tackle content as a team.

    Teach a guild newbie how to do Strike Missions and next time they won't be a newbie, teach a random newbie how to do Strike Missions and next time you'll need to train the next random newbie. Once pug life is lessened all the friction and the requirements talk will disappear.

  • tim.4596tim.4596 Member ✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    I wanna play with people that raid hence I ask for LI.

    If strikes go non existent I dont care, they are not that interesting. If they get more easy, that means more easy loot.

    "I only want to play with the cool kids" is why raids were abandoned by the developers.

    That is however one of the premises for raids' existence in the first place, so you can;t really hope for raiders to just abandon this way of thinking. And especially not if it's extremely advantageous in the content, because it helps you to not wipe.

    You won't change the people. The only thing that can be changed is content.

    I'm not sure this statement is true, GW2 is a horizontal progression game, so you're doing the same content over and over, eventually you'll learn how to do the content and it won't be an issue.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    That works only if all groups have the same chances of success (even if for some it will take longer). Once it's no longer the case, the friction gets even higher.

    In-game friction is mostly removed if groups set their own requirements, aside from those rare snowflakes that enter groups they don't belong to by faking the requirements. Or the other special snowflakes that join groups without requirements and hijack them. But special snowflakes aside, having requirements leads to less friction than without having any requirements, as someone said once: "if you don't post requirements, you don't have expectations", which could cause way more friction in the end.

    Like i said (and which you keep ignoring), for that to work well, the requirements should be just a matter of choice of gameplay style you prefer. Unfortunately, they aren't. They impact far more - specifically, they influence the success chances. As such, the choice is often not a choice. Or rather it's a choice that only one group can make - and is making. The other group... well, they either try to mix with the first group somehow, creating friction, or give up on the content, which also creates bad feelings.

    You're trying to present the choice as if it's between choosing a playstyle you prefer, when in reality it's often a choice between succeeding or failing. And a choice like that is not a choice at all.

    @tim.4596 said:
    I'm not sure this statement is true, GW2 is a horizontal progression game, so you're doing the same content over and over, eventually you'll learn how to do the content and it won't be an issue.

    Or, far more likey is that you'll fail over and over, and then eventually you give up on the content completely. The point where you'll get experienced enough is for many way too far to be willing to carry on through the very unfun phase of constant failures.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • tim.4596tim.4596 Member ✭✭✭

    @Thornwolf.9721 said:

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    I wanna play with people that raid hence I ask for LI.

    If strikes go non existent I dont care, they are not that interesting. If they get more easy, that means more easy loot.

    If raids go non-existent I wouldn't care, they are not interested and are just a way for the "Elite" to kitten the E-kitten. The loot is garbo, the encounters are garbo and frankly Id rather them use the resources elsewhere for better content. Like a WvW overhaul or maybe like I don't know class balance? Stop wasting resources on an extremely niche game mode, and as seen strikes seem way more readily accessed by the community than raids do. But then.... that just might be because of the people within that section of the community? Who knows. If you want quality raiding WoW exists and that is ALL that game has been about and has been built from the ground up over the years to be master at raid encounters, Guild wars 2? Was never designed for such and shoe-horning it in was a mistake, one that continues to be wanked about even today as its population dwindles and continues to sink.

    Sorry, but its a waste of precious developer time.

    Raids in GW2 are very good, especially compared to WoW, they don't have a proper release pattern. They are not as difficult as WoW Mythic mode, but they are much more dynamic than in WoW, and the way you fight encounters as a group feels very refreshing compared to WoW, who has been the MMORPG model for so many other games. But it's such an old game, and is starting to show.

    The thing is back in HoT GW2 became extremely promising Raid wise, as it had content release every three months, however very few people partake in raids, and they saw a massive decline in PoF. It pretty much went from Raid wing release being quarterly to yearly. But Path of Fire still had a bit of raid release, to be fair most of us Raid players are delirious to think that they are gonna release new raids, Strikes seems to get all the attention.

    Regarding developers wasting their time, I hardly see how so, Open World team, Fractal, Strike and Raid team, should be very different teams, they would just need to actually have a Raid team. So it wouldn't really be a waste of anyone's time, it would just be more content to be released for the game. Sadly Anet hasn't displayed any interest towards Raids. When Bjora came out, they did announce that Raids were not out of the question but they couldn't confirm it at the time either. So I guess we'll just have to wait and see. The issue is that the community is extremely demanding when it comes to Raids, and have really high expectation, since content release is so scarce. We'd generally get 3 or 4 boss per wing, whilst we'd truly want 10 or 12 even if it means that some of them have less good mechanics, it wouldn't matter much. But Anet just doesn't have the team for it, or don't have any particular interest towards making GW2 a raiding game.

    I think they are strongly miscalculating the rate at which a lot of players are able to consume the entirety of the content, and be left with nothing much to do but repeatable content for a vast majority of us players. Or players interest when it comes to difficult content. As it now stand once you've reached maximum Mastery Points, unlocked all the mounts that comes with it, made a few legendaries, gone through making legendary armour, rings etc... you're not left with much to do, content becomes very reapeatble. Let's do fractal, raids, conquest, WvW.... E V E R Y single day until the next patch release. It's not that much fun and even worst, a lot of your friends start quitting the game because they get bored.

    I understand that Anet goes towards making the game for their biggest audience, which might be Open World, however they are strongly under evaluating how are those players willing to play different game modes, in order to keep themselves busy.

  • tim.4596tim.4596 Member ✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    That works only if all groups have the same chances of success (even if for some it will take longer). Once it's no longer the case, the friction gets even higher.

    In-game friction is mostly removed if groups set their own requirements, aside from those rare snowflakes that enter groups they don't belong to by faking the requirements. Or the other special snowflakes that join groups without requirements and hijack them. But special snowflakes aside, having requirements leads to less friction than without having any requirements, as someone said once: "if you don't post requirements, you don't have expectations", which could cause way more friction in the end.

    Like i said (and which you keep ignoring), for that to work well, the requirements should be just a matter of choice of gameplay style you prefer. Unfortunately, they aren't. They impact far more - specifically, they influence the success chances. As such, the choice is often not a choice. Or rather it's a choice that only one group can make - and is making. The other group... well, they either try to mix with the first group somehow, creating friction, or give up on the content, which also creates bad feelings.

    You're trying to present the choice as if it's between choosing a playstyle you prefer, when in reality it's often a choice between succeeding or failing. And a choice like that is not a choice at all.

    @tim.4596 said:
    I'm not sure this statement is true, GW2 is a horizontal progression game, so you're doing the same content over and over, eventually you'll learn how to do the content and it won't be an issue.

    Or, far more likey is that you'll fail over and over, and then eventually you give up on the content completely. The point where you'll get experienced enough is for many way too far to be willing to carry on through the very unfun phase of constant failures.

    Boneskinner achievement sells goes as follow 3 healer and 1 dps, and they kill the boss, and manage to get the whoever people who joined the group the achievements of not dying a single time until the boss is dead. Most of the time you'd get it first or 2nd try, it's literally not that difficult, plenty of open worlders actually dodge way more mechanics than try hard people, they just have a wrong rotation and often don't use a dps meter so they fail to fit enough skills to do damage and rather focus too much on dodging. The point is you're seriously underestimating most people play skills. As well as how "difficult" strike missions are actually. You'd pretty much need 70% of your squad to be bad in order for you not to be able to defeat the boss. a single really good dps is enough to deafest the boss before enrage mode..

    There is almost no scenario in which you would fail over and over, unless the commander is really bad, but you really shouldn't be making a squad if you can't fix things. The only scenario in which you'd often run to, is having miscalculated, what classes you might need on bosses like bone skinner, and have people on specific key classes who cannot swap. Like if you're trying to do Overheal bone skinner with only 2 heal that would most likely not work, or if your team keeps dying etc... or if no single dps class can stay alive, but just 1 or 2 dps is enough.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @tim.4596 said:
    It's either gonna continue to split the community in two between those who can do "harder" strike missions and those who can do "easier" strike missions, and as we saw with both fractals and raids, that content is just gonna be non-existent in the long run.

    KP/LI isn't splitting the community, as you describe...skill + gear + game knowledge does that. There remains a percentage of the GW2 player base that attempt "harder" strike missions, but have no business doing so, as it remains outside their current reach. Same holds true of T4 LFGs - there are far too many folks in the parties I join who should be down in T2 or T3, but instead get carried by others through T4.

    For some players, they are done with carrying the driftwood, so they form their own LFGs with set requirements, and while asking for KP/LI isn't a guarantee of anything, if the tactic didn't work, players wouldn't do it.

    Now of course everyone has to learn, and there is equally nothing wrong with creating an LFG for just that purpose - and I promise you that no speed-clear, git gud tryhard is going to join that LFG and demand everyone perform to their level.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    Like i said (and which you keep ignoring), for that to work well, the requirements should be just a matter of choice of gameplay style you prefer.

    Players either respect the requirements (and there is no friction) or they don't (and there is). It's a simple matter of honesty and respect. You are concerned that some players will find their skill level and playstyle inadequate to beat the content and therefore will try to join groups with requirements they don't fill and cause friction. That's unfortunate but given the many groups without requirements that succeed in clearing all Strike Missions I see no reason of concern. Given that, the only reason for a player to a join a group without filling the requirements is for pure greed and entitlement. They will get "rooted out" eventually, or more strict (or easier to enforce) requirements will appear, as the existence of such players is the reason for having requirements in the first place.

    The point where you'll get experienced enough is for many way too far to be willing to carry on through the very unfun phase of constant failures.

    And they simply want to skip directly to the point of success by abusing the efforts of others. Great idea and the primary reason for any kind of friction between players.

  • HotDelirium.7984HotDelirium.7984 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    I wanna play with people that raid hence I ask for LI.

    If strikes go non existent I dont care, they are not that interesting. If they get more easy, that means more easy loot.

    "I only want to play with the cool kids" is why raids were abandoned by the developers.

    Raid's, like dungeons, will have its moment as experimental development and then we will move on just like we are doing with fractals. We might only get a few more of those and then the new development idea will spawn. Those are visions of the past instances and strike missions. Why build content that only a few % of the population plays when you have the rest of your population left in waiting? Each raid itself could have EASILY been a story step in the Living World (with modified mechanics of course). That is what hurts me because I would have loved to experience it in the LW.

  • Tails.9372Tails.9372 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    the existence of such players is the reason for having requirements in the first place.

    No, the fact that the performance (or better lack thereof) of a part of the group can have profound impact on the progression speed / success of the content in question is why people put up requirements. No one cares about carrying others in OW metas as long as it goes "smooth enough". The same would also be true for FS if it weren't for the BB on the last part and instanced content in general.

  • Ooops.8694Ooops.8694 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:

    "I only want to play with the cool kids" is why raids were abandoned by the developers.

    "I only care for rewards but refuse to do any work for it, so carry my lazy kitten or i will pretend raids don't exist" is why raids were abandond by so many players.

    @tim.4596 said:
    you'd pretty much need 70% of your squad to be bad in order for you not to be able to defeat the boss.

    Which is exactly what you get if you don't post rediculous requirements. Start Boneskinner without requirements and you're the only one alive after the first wave of aoe circles... every single time... Believe me i tried it dozens of times. The average player in this game nowadays can't run in straight line without hurting himself.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Love how raider gate keepers always assume people want to be "carried" if they dislike their gate keeping.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2020

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    Love how raider gate keepers always assume people want to be "carried" if they dislike their gate keeping.

    Why do inexperienced people want to join experienced groups?

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2020

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    The "experienced" player pool shrinks every single day. If you do not allow more players to reach the "experienced" level you eventually run out of people to play with and your game is dead.

    But there is nothing that doesn't allow them to reach that level. There is a difference between earning and being carried which I don't think is being appreciated in your posts.

    Nobody is inherently entitled to someone else's time. If someone wants to teach and carry they will start the appropriate group. If they don't then they will start another group with requirements. You don't get to demand anything of them.

    I never understood the mentality of "better start teaching people or your game mode will die". Strikes are easy enough that a majority can be done by anyone so it has a lower barrier to entry but none of that prevent people from playing the game in a way they think is fun with a group of like minded people.

  • Ayrilana.1396Ayrilana.1396 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    The "experienced" player pool shrinks every single day. If you do not allow more players to reach the "experienced" level you eventually run out of people to play with and your game is dead.

    You assume that new people don't join raids and get experienced.

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    There is, it's called being gate keeped out of being able to even play the content. Which the """veterans""" are content on doing, even if it means the destruction of their own game to the point where they need to quit and move onto another game(Where btw, they'll be gate keeped out of!)

    And how are they gate keeping something that's open to everyone?

  • TPMN.1483TPMN.1483 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    There is, it's called being gate keeped out of being able to even play the content. Which the """veterans""" are content on doing, even if it means the destruction of their own game to the point where they need to quit and move onto another game(Where btw, they'll be gate keeped out of!)

    Many Veterans offer specific training and have setup Guilds,Discord Servers,Guides and training videos to help players get experienced. I believe the Veteran players are entitled to have their high requirement groups when they want an experienced fast run with people who understand every mechanic, will clear easily (most of the time) and understand what’s going on without explanation.

    There are many veterans who have put time aside to train new players so they can become more experienced and learn at a faster rate than they did. Veteran players may have spent 10-15hrs on every boss learning it - there is nothing stopping you forming a group with friends and trying to work out how to kill a particular price of content.

  • Ooops.8694Ooops.8694 Member ✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2020

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    Love how raider gate keepers always assume people want to be "carried" if they dislike their gate keeping.

    I don't "assume" anything but talk about my experience. And about facts you could actually test yourself would you stop whining about those bad elitist raiders gatekeeping content just for fun and start playing those game modes. But I assume it's easier living in this fictional world were others are at fault for your inabilities, were people get istantly kicked for low li (something that actually never ever happens; people get kicked for trying to fake li/kp, for underperfoming so hard they get outdps'ed by healers or being obviously completely clueless about a boss -which probably meant they succeded at faking their li at first-, or for being rude and insulting. The latter actually can happen when someone with low li is asked politely to leave the group, but even that's very rare.) and were raiders are just stupid and keep others out for their own amusement and not because they constantly try to include new players but sadly know from this experience what to expect in a "no requirements" group.
    Ohh... and to return to the real world again... many of those bad elitist do their weekly clear on monday (in a group with really rediculous high requirements^^), then spend the remaining 6 days joining other groups just for fun and mostly not caring about the group's experience. (Of course in your "reality" they probably just do it for all the gold they get... What do you get for completing a full raid wing after your first clear again? ~30silver in salvagable kitten ? Minus food/utility costs. Oh yes, time to get insanely rich while laughing about all those noobs i keep from raiding by not allowing them to post their own lfgs if they don't like mine... Oh wait... Sorry... slipped into the mass delusion repeatedly posted here again.)

    Speaking of repeatedly posting the same kitten. When i started raiding (somewhat after release of wing 3) the exact same posts were filling this forum; only the raw number of li were lower and instead of guild hall trophy tokens people required things like the finished spirit quest potion as proof you have experience. Guess what, i just joined training groups and every other party with low/no requirements to get to used to the boss fights or asked higher li groups politely if they would give me a chance (which ofc is easier if you're willing to fill a needed role or volunteer for mechanics instead of being 1 of the 20 "i just stick to the boss and do my golem trained rotation"-dps competing for a single free slot...^^). Now i stopped counting li long ago (after i had enough to build all legendary armor... wish it wouldn't be that ugly) while doing 100% of all my raiding in pugs formed through lfg tab... Guess those gatekeepers were jsut bad at their job and missed me (...or maybe the ingame reality isn't what the forum makes you believe.)

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    The "experienced" player pool shrinks every single day. If you do not allow more players to reach the "experienced" level you eventually run out of people to play with and your game is dead.

    Sadly it's not the "experienced" raiders pool that shrinks every single day, but the pool of players with skill or any kind of ambiton to do more than just autoattack for lootz.

    A few weeks ago i did raid wings 1-4 with a chronotank that never killed anything but vale guardian before, but had done the work of getting useful equipment, reading some guides and watching a few videos from tank pov. I really wished something like this could happen more often, and -as i said before- i have absolutely no problem trying out new guys once in a while (and usually after my moday full clear). But experience tells me that for every single capable guy who's just new to the game or gamemode, there are 100 who just fail hard, whine, leave the group and come the forums to cry about raids and how it's completle not their fault they can't carry their weight.

    Which brings us back to the topic... It's okay to bring new people to raids AND strikes, but when doing just a fast run of daily strikes i still prefer requirements that objectively are crazy high. Just because i don't want to start every single day with trying out players to find those minority that bothered to bind dodge to a key and stopped watching nexflix while doing a boss that can actually kill you when you screw up.

    And i understand that this is a worse problem with strikes (and fractals...) which many try to do as fast as possible once a day. But sadly it's a problem that won't go away as long as 99% of the game is tuned for people casually klicking a single skill every few seconds while eating/doing homework/watching tv/whatever...

    So basically stop blaming the players. Anet created a game for extremely casual play took every chance to listen to the whiners and make everything easier the moment someone cried about it's difficulty (see the whole HoT expansion for example...). If the majority in this game really wants to get rewarded for accomplishing nothing then that's the way the game will change and yes, raids will probably die out or get reduced to just another faceroll content. But that's hardly the fault of players who actually like a challenge and want to play that really small part of difficult-ish content with like-minded players instead of teaching others the very basics of the game for day after day.

  • Shiyo.3578Shiyo.3578 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2020

    There's a reason your game mode was abandoned by the developers, your dwindling player base wasn't worth their time and resources. You're just going to get strike missions abandoned next.

  • Krzysztof.5973Krzysztof.5973 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    There's a reason your game mode was abandoned by the developers, your dwindling player base wasn't worth their time and resources. You're just going to get strike missions abandoned next.

    You're repeating yourself. Gotta come up with a better idea if you want to keep trolling you know :)

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I just can't believe there is another thread on this.

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mindcircus.1506 said:
    I just can't believe there is another thread on this.

    As long there are people that try to cut themselves off from the vast majority via requirements, these threads will never stop.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:
    I just can't believe there is another thread on this.

    As long there are people that try to cut themselves off from the vast majority via requirements, these threads will never stop.

    ewww,.... just.... ewww

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:
    I just can't believe there is another thread on this.

    As long there are people that try to cut themselves off from the vast majority via requirements, these threads will never stop.

    ewww,.... just.... ewww

    I know it's not beautiful, but that's just what those raid requirements do.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tails.9372 said:

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    the existence of such players is the reason for having requirements in the first place.

    No, the fact that the performance (or better lack thereof) of a part of the group can have profound impact on the progression speed / success of the content in question is why people put up requirements. No one cares about carrying others in OW metas as long as it goes "smooth enough". The same would also be true for FS if it weren't for the BB on the last part and instanced content in general.

    Not always true. If the only players that joined experienced runs were actually experienced then you wouldn't need to put up "250 Li requirements". If I made a LFG listing of "quick Strike Mission full clear" and got only players that are experienced enough with all Strike Missions to make the run quick, then there would be no need to gate keep players with ridiculous LI and KP requirements. But a lot of players either overestimate their abilities (thinking that they are masters when they are not) or know their abilities are lacking but still want to enter experienced runs for the quick and easy rewards. Further complicating things is the ability to get "fake" LI, either by managing to fake inside a run and not get noticed, or by buying a kill, which leads to further inflated LI requirements.

    Would we need "250 LI req" if it was impossible to get LI in less than standard ways? I think not. Furthermore, to address the topic, there is no "LI equivalent" for Strike Missions, if there was there would be no (or maybe less) "LI requirements" and instead ask for Strike Mission KP.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 29, 2020

    @Shiyo.3578 said:
    The "experienced" player pool shrinks every single day. If you do not allow more players to reach the "experienced" level you eventually run out of people to play with and your game is dead.

    You are absolutely right about allowing more players to reach the "experienced" level. I've taught many players on how to run the harder content in the game. I'm willing and always run raids with newbies, to show them what raiding is all about and give them access to the legendary armor. However, they are always part of one of my guilds. And I'm willing to believe that most of these "evil experienced players" are doing the same. Especially for content like Strike Missions, which most of them are really easy, I wonder why not more guilds are making guild runs with them. Why does this game have the expectation of doing everything in random groups instead of grouping up with your guild members?

    Edit: at this point I believe the problem isn't with requirements or experienced players gate keeping others, but rather guilds being glorified chat rooms.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    As long as people want to leech off others instead of doing content with their own guild members these threads will never stop.

    Leeching off of others isn't good either.
    But I always list my own groups with my own requirements (which most of the time don't exist), so there is no leeching that could be complained about.
    My squads usually ended as merry come-togethers from average players that knew the mechanics to some extent and were fairly successful at doing them, with maybe the occasional one or two higher skilled players. But I can't remember anyone complaining about leeches.

    If you cannot find enough players in your guild to do a Strike Mission, then you need a better guild.

    While I haven't had a guild for months and completed the Steel Warband weapon collections without major issues, I agree that being in guilds can be useful for completing group content.
    However, my last guild ended up being not too focused on multiplayer activities, so there is no guarantee that everyone suddenly has more success in Strike Missions, just because they join a guild. But that usually depends on the guild, as well as the players' behaviours.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @tim.4596 said:
    Raids in GW2 are very good, especially compared to WoW, they don't have a proper release pattern.

    no, this is absolutist different concept. In wow I with 2-5 members can close ANY big raid, if it obsolete. So we do raids as dominate vs npc. And ofc we not go in last raid till next patch.
    In gw2 all raid mostly a same. The not obsolete by difficulty. So the Li here still have value.
    But I know people who do only escort every week last 3 years. Some people do only escort and only river. So the Li value also not can grant some magic skill.
    All that we can get - some small hope that this person not stand in red rings.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:
    While I haven't had a guild for months and completed the Steel Warband weapon collections without major issues, I agree that being in guilds can be useful for completing group content.
    However, my last guild ended up being not too focused on multiplayer activities, so there is no guarantee that everyone suddenly has more success in Strike Missions, just because they join a guild. But that usually depends on the guild, as well as the players' behaviours.

    Yes, that should be one of the purposes of being in a guild but as I said in this game guilds are just chat rooms most of the time. Most Strike Missions are easily done by Guild groups, as easy as doing regular Guild Missions, and the last two Strike Missions also scale well with the amount of players.
    It's also worth noting that Raids were also supposed to be guild content, done by organized static teams and not pugs. Meaning if they went as expected, threads about requirements, friction and exclusions wouldn't exist about Raids either. But anyway this idea of running everything with randoms is what both kills Guilds (as anything more than chat rooms) and creates all this tension.

  • Vornollo.5182Vornollo.5182 Member ✭✭✭

    I don't generally do PvE, but this reminds me a bit of what happens in WvW squads sometimes where you "have to do this/that, runs such/so build" etc.
    My opinion?
    Make your own LFG for like-minded people. The small amount of time spent on the forum seems to indicate there's so many of the kind of players who think just like you.
    If I ever feel like doing Fractals but can't find a T4 group that's looking for what I play: I make my own LFG.
    Squad in WvW doesn't want me as a Thief main..? Well, kitten them I'll do my own thing.
    You are as much entitled to these demands not to do it, as they are to do demand them, lol.

    Also, there's clearly a difference... If I run around in WvW with my guild (private tag, because no we don't want you around us) and we're about to jump into a 15v30 fight, but some pug comes around in our smokefields and gives our advantage away, yeah that's a good way for that 1 pug to spoil the fun of 15 others.
    Same thing for PvE I'd figure. You want people who know what they do, understandable, carrying dead weight is heavy work.
    You're fine with casuals who just want to have fun in their own way, understandable too.

    You do you, nothing's stopping you in any part of this game to do what you want to do, the tools are there.

    [PUSH] Constant Pressure