Please disable minion and pet tagging for loot. — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Please disable minion and pet tagging for loot.

Everyday the same players are standing around the log farm in Malchor's Leap AFK with their minions and pets farming mobs, just like the same bums you see standing around the convenience store. Now they are strategically placed on the escort trails in Drizzlewood where the mobs spawn, just like the same bums you see everyday at the traffic lights. Are they bots? Probably not, but they are AFK and the only reason they do it is because they get loot from the minions and pets without having to do anything. They don't affect me other than I gotta look at their corpses when Lyssa spawns, just like I gotta look at garbage the real life bums leave laying on the ground at their loitering spots. It's pitiful really, newer players keep trying to resurrect them out of the kindness of their hearts thinking they are helping their fellow player when they are really just helping someone who is probably playing some other game or on a different account. Call me a jerk if you want, but it's an exploit. If I ran a company that relied on gem sales as part of our income, i'd make dang sure players that trade gold for gems weren't stealing real money from us by standing around doing nothing in game. When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch so we don't have to look at these deadbeats.

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Comments

  • lokh.2695lokh.2695 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Sad but true, nothing will be done about this. The issue is well known for years at this point and ANet seems to be ok with the way things are. If it helps you feel better report the players for botting though the better aproach would be to just ignore them and move on with your life.

    Why bother, just delete the official Forum.

  • Faenar.8036Faenar.8036 Member ✭✭✭

    This thing exists in the game for years, and most probably nothing will be changed about this. Personally, I do not see anything wrong in this behaviour, because they are actually using pets in the exact way for which they were implemented in the game - as autonomous NPC allies, which will defend your character against any enemies. Btw, actually, I heard some players were glad for these semi-AFK ppl exists, this was especially appreciated by some players in the Bitterfrost Frontier map, near all WinterBerry Bushes gathering nodes. Winterberry gatherers were not distracted by monsters spawning around these nodes, so they actually liked the fact that these semi-AFK ppl with pets were there. Of course, I have to admit some other players hated this semi-AFK gameplay.Some liked it, some other hated it.

    I also disagree with disabling pet tagging for loot, because that would almost destroy the gameplay style, where you are (actively) playing as pet minion-master necromancer.

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It doesn't affect the game as there's a Diminishing Returns (DR) system in place that prevents it. Essentially, you have to be active and move around the map alot and change maps to get loot, sometimes DR even affects regular players by accident.

    Why do you think they've never "fixed" it?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Diminishing_returns

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    Mains Mariyuuna/Tempest & Alisha Kei/Druid(PvE), Terakura/Spellbreaker & Kitty Koume/Reaper(WvW)
    The fun part of being a link server is tagging up and hearing "who are you?".

  • Yggranya.5201Yggranya.5201 Member ✭✭✭

    @Hannelore.8153 said:
    It doesn't affect the game as there's a Diminishing Returns (DR) system in place that prevents it. Essentially, you have to be active and move around the map alot and change maps to get loot, sometimes DR even affects regular players by accident.

    Why do you think they've never "fixed" it?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Diminishing_returns

    Yeah, people standing there every single day, every single night is normal. Hah! You just play some other game on your second screen or watch netflix. I could go to iron marches everyday and they would be there. They would automate it all but then they actually might get banned (they wouldn't, of course). DR doesn't matter, they just log out of one character and change to another character and later they do the same and go in a nice little routine as they don't play the game just obsess about the sweet trading post profits.

    They never fixed it because "think of the savings!"

  • AgentMoore.9453AgentMoore.9453 Member ✭✭✭

    As annoying as it is to see the same five names farming mats or leeching metas for all eternity, I don't know that disabling pet/minion credit is the answer.

    Instantly, you'd be punishing players who arrive late to events because they don't have mounts (a separate issue, but a real one) who unload everything they have upon arrival in hopes to get credit. In some cases, you have to meet a certain damage threshold to qualify for loot, and for certain builds, pets/minions are the way to meet it. They're just as much a natural part of the game as passive runes, sigils, and class traits that have been around since launch. Pets/minions/devices/etc. aren't the problem when used for legitimate gameplay; players messing with the system are.

    At the moment, reporting these people really is the best solution. That way you're specifically targeting bad actors and letting ArenaNet make the final decision.

  • Lumikki.1725Lumikki.1725 Member ✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    Been AFK very long time in middle of mobs spawn area is not normal gameplay. Why they don't just put minion in 2 (or 5) min timer like elementalist summoners? That way player needs to be active to keep the "Minions" live. Same can be done for engineers turrent and so on. Only issue would be rangers pet, but that's only one pet. Only classes I have seen doing AFK farming are mostly necromancers and a few engineers.

  • Sleepwalker.1398Sleepwalker.1398 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm seeing quite a few Necros farming Elaborate Totem in Domain of Kourna near the choya area in north.
    I tried to pull a few veteran choyas onto them but they survived cos of their minions...lol.

  • Tyncale.1629Tyncale.1629 Member ✭✭✭

    Everquest implemented that rule pretty early for pet classes. You have to get at least 1 point of damage in yourself. You can still automate that to an extent but it will be a lot harder to tag all mobs that way.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:
    Inb4 Khamin get you. Yeah I always felt if all the damage comes from your pet or minion or turret you shouldn't get loot. I'm also against bots but if you just sit your character there and the pets auto react it's not really botting. It's a loophole that should be closed

    Nicely done.

    Yeah, another bot thread. Sure, it's annoying, but nothing these players are doing prevents anyone from playing the game. The only recourse is to report and move on. Let Anet handle it and if these players remain, then assume that Anet is sanctioning them.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭

    LSS; any kind of playing, however passive, is allowed. Given you are not AFK.
    Devs will occasionally ping a character for an action, and if they're deemed AFK, they'll be disconnected.
    But i assume most of these players are half-AFK. Like, dual monitoring and just watching one pieces, catching pokemons, or watching animoo.

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • @Tyncale.1629 said:
    Everquest implemented that rule pretty early for pet classes. You have to get at least 1 point of damage in yourself. You can still automate that to an extent but it will be a lot harder to tag all mobs that way.

    This person gets it, Everquest gets it. Not that it's up to me, but I think this is the perfect solution. As I said in the original post, "When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them." I never mentioned changing anything about the way minions or pets work other than tagging for loot. Those AFK'ers aren't loitering around the winterberry nodes to help players, or any other location. They pick those spots because veterans are there in hopes of better loot. The vet that spawns at the log farm in Malchor's drops a minimum fine grade item 100% the time. I know because I have 23 characters parked there and I have been MANUALLY killing that vet for years. Try thanking one of those players for making things easier for you and you will see what a great addition to the community they are when they are silent, or their status is set to offline. My complaint is purely from a business standpoint. I love the game and if one of those slackers trades in gold for only 100 gems I consider this stealing. Especially when Anet had to recently lay off employees.

  • Lumikki.1725Lumikki.1725 Member ✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    If passive "AFK" boting would be okey by "everyone" and it would not hurt anyone, then these treats would not even exist. These bots as huging resource spots to them self. Redusing real active players ability get loot in that area. As for other affect, it will also affect games economy. Affect can good or bad related are you selling or buying, because boting lowers items and materials values in TP, when they sell them in TP. Everyting players do in this game will affect others one way or other.

    What I'm wondering, does GW2 developers EVER do anyting what is suggested in this forum? I mean if they don't, then hole discussions about allmost anyting as change for issues is for nothing. I'm just commenting this because I see sometimes comment like "it has been this for years and notting has be done".

  • lokh.2695lokh.2695 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lumikki.1725 said:
    If passive "AFK" boting would be okey by "everyone" and it would not hurt anyone, then these treats would not even exist. These bots as huging resource spots to them self. Redusing real active players ability get loot in that area. As for other affect, it will also affect games economy. Affect can good or bad related are you selling or buying, because boting lowers items and materials values in TP, when they sell them in TP. Everyting players do in this game will affect other one way or other.

    What I'm wondering, does GW2 developers EVER do anyting what is suggested in this forum? I mean if they don't, then hole discussions about allmost anyting as change for issues is for nothing.

    They don't care about the forums as long as as everything is sanitized for your protection.

    Why bother, just delete the official Forum.

  • Game of Bones.8975Game of Bones.8975 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:
    Everyday the same players are standing around the log farm in Malchor's Leap AFK with their minions and pets farming mobs, just like the same bums you see standing around the convenience store.

    So you're saying they're NOT social distancing. :o

    I think a better solution would be to have minions "die" and pets "go hide" after the character hasn't moved for ~10-15 minutes. I have two dogs and two cats that demand attention, so I go AFK for a few minutes to play with them or feed them. I will usually hover with the Skyscale or go to the "Change Character" screen (if I have consumables counting down).

    Right now only 6 professions (base necro, Reaper, Scourge, base ranger, Druid, and Soulbeast) have this "built-in" exploit. That's ~22% of the playable professions, but what percentage of the active player base use one of those professions? And how many of those regularly "abuse" the exploit enough to make a dent in the economy of the game?

    I play necros quite a bit and enjoy the ability to solo areas where I can't with my Renegade, Deadeye, or warrior. I will almost guarantee you that MM Reapers and mesmers with their clones are very popular professions for just that reason.

    Either I haven't been around the areas you are describing or just don't see it as a big enough issue to upset the entire GW2 Universe.

    Regardless, I'm down-voting the idea because: It would negatively impact too many people (including me) for the amount of gain a few people would see. There are plenty of areas for you to "farm" whatever it is you are looking for.

    Ask a child a question and you'll get a childish answer.

  • Game of Bones.8975Game of Bones.8975 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lumikki.1725 said:
    Been AFK very long time in middle of mobs spawn area is not normal gameplay. Why they don't just put minion in 2 (or 5) min timer like elementalist summoners? That way player needs to be active to keep the "Minions" live. Same can be done for engineers turrent and so on. Only issue would be rangers pet, but that's only one pet. Only classes I have seen doing AFK farming are mostly necromancers and a few engineers.

    Changing the MM necro the way you describe would essentially mod it back to GW1 status where minions continually lost health and you had to exploit a "fresh" corpse to create a new one.

    Ask a child a question and you'll get a childish answer.

  • Yggranya.5201Yggranya.5201 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:
    LSS; any kind of playing, however passive, is allowed. Given you are not AFK.
    Devs will occasionally ping a character for an action, and if they're deemed AFK, they'll be disconnected.
    But i assume most of these players are half-AFK. Like, dual monitoring and just watching one pieces, catching pokemons, or watching animoo.

    And since that's what they are, one wonders why they are still there? Disconnected, not banned = pointless. At this point everyone Knows this, it's true we can't do anything so simply accept it or take your money and leave, nothing will be done. And if you are watching something while "playing", obviously you are not playing. If that is allowed, then it's no wonder ALL metas are filled with these people who pile more work on other people and get the same rewards. Sad, sad truth but what can you do, report them? Ahahahahahahahahaha EHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE.

  • Friday.7864Friday.7864 Member ✭✭✭

    @AgentMoore.9453 said:
    As annoying as it is to see the same five names farming mats or leeching metas for all eternity, I don't know that disabling pet/minion credit is the answer.

    Instantly, you'd be punishing players who arrive late to events because they don't have mounts (a separate issue, but a real one) who unload everything they have upon arrival in hopes to get credit. In some cases, you have to meet a certain damage threshold to qualify for loot, and for certain builds, pets/minions are the way to meet it. They're just as much a natural part of the game as passive runes, sigils, and class traits that have been around since launch. Pets/minions/devices/etc. aren't the problem when used for legitimate gameplay; players messing with the system are.

    At the moment, reporting these people really is the best solution. That way you're specifically targeting bad actors and letting ArenaNet make the final decision.

    I can't even report them all because there's too many of them stacked on top of each other at times. Besides, they're everywhere, am I supposed to stop for a few minutes every time I see them, click through all the afk chars and the report menu? I'm here to play the game, not do Anet's job!
    Besides, if reporting them was effective they would have stopped doing it already instead of me finding them all over the place.
    Having people you pay manually review player reports is no solution at all in this case. If the player doesn't hit a mob with an autoattack or skill minion damage shouldn't be taken into account at all.

  • Friday.7864Friday.7864 Member ✭✭✭

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 You should add the word Exploit in the title for them to take this seriously.
    As people can just gain participation in Drizzlewood by afking and automatically receive map rewards without doing anything.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    If you implemented this, you'd need to somehow increase "tagging power" for the pet classes, though, to compensate for what they would lose. The net result should not be classes like mesmer needing to do a lot more dps than other classes in order to pass tag thresholds, because the part of their dps that comes from pets/clones/minions/turrets doesn't count.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • Faenar.8036Faenar.8036 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    inbefore another k i t t e n storm will happen in this topic, I have to react according to these new posts in this topic speaking about ANet never care, ANet never change, Anet bad bad toxic company not watching their own game etc. - You get the point which things I am speaking about ...

    In this very specific case, I have to actually DEFEND ARENANET (and anyone knowing me for more than 1 hour know this is not exactly my usual attitude towards ArenaNet), and I have to say the fact that they actually, in some extreme circumstances, actually did some changes if they saw by some of their (secret) metric methods that some ingame actions may extremely affect game economy.

    Example to proof my words: Lake Doric Leather engi Turret semi-AFK farming. You can search this situation some years back on this forum, there was a real k i t t e n storm about this. In this case, ArenaNet did some metric research how this was affecting a game economy, and after some time, ANet decide to stop this gameplay, because they actually start thinking this can affect game economy extremely bad. Im not gonna judge (in this topic at least) if that change was good or not, legions of players agreed with tht, legions of players disagreed with that.

    In this case, I am mentioning this fact as a proof, that ArenaNet actually taken a real action in the game to prevent a collapse in the ingame economy.

    According to this fact, even the continuos year-long existence of these semi-AFKers probably does not affect game economy as much to the extent that some extreme actions have to be taken against it. So hte fact that ANet does not change this does not automatically mean ANet does not WATCHING this. Thats all. Im definitelly not a fanatical Anet fanboy (you can check that yourself, in general forum section, Im trying to be friendly and helpful and whatever, but look at my own toxic posts in WvW forum section if you dare - warning - toxicity in WvW section is the stronk one (ANet deserve that in WvW), read WvW forum section at your own risk), but at this point in this case, I had to really defend ArenaNet.

    //edit: another example: IIRC some time ago recipe 3 thick leather sections -> 1 cured thick leather square was (IIRC secretly and not even mentioned in game patch notes) changed from 3 to 4 needed to craft that cured square. (also most probably to prevent economy collapse)

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    Wont matter since the Necro is autocasting GS4.

    Better to remove the ability to change your auto cast but some people like that feature and again it wont change anything since people will just use Macros instead or more people will use path farming/node farming bot mods..

    Outside of killing minions/pets/turrets as a mechanic this ability to afk farm isnt going away and I am absolutely 100% against Minions etc being ruined because of cheating, lazy players abusing them.
    I would much rather have these players removed from the game and perma banned.

    Best we can do is continue to report these players when we see them, nothing else we can do.

  • Tukaram.8256Tukaram.8256 Member ✭✭✭

    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Hope they do that with Elementalist's summons.
    Actually, the elementals only attack if you attack.

  • No, ranger pets are an essential part of the class, this is not gw 1 where you could play a petless build and have full functionality. I use my pet from time to time to target another target as my own, would not be fair if it didnt drop loot. The mayority of players should not be be punished for the behaviour of a minority. I see this threads for years. Players with class A demand that players with class B be nerfed to the ground because a certain 'exploit'. Whats next, cancel turrets, clones etc. A pet/minion timeout would be a good idea for rangers and necros after 10 minutes of inactivity. And be honest a ranger with one pet is not a problem, certainly not with diminishing returns.

  • magnusthorek.8027magnusthorek.8027 Member ✭✭✭

    Measures against bots and AFK players doesn't seem to be "stonks enough". These players are the disgrace of the Reaper class I love so much

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    I disagree. I would still be playing the game, so I should get the rewards. Just because I'm not playing it to your definition doesn't mean that I'm not playing the game.

    NOTE: I am NOT advocating botting. I have NEVER advocated botting. I do NOT bot. Seems like every time I argue this topic, people seem to think that I'm all for it. I'm not. I just fail to see how those players who appear to be botting, even after being reported, are in any way affecting another player's ability to play the game. So far, no one has been able to answer this.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    I disagree. I would still be playing the game, so I should get the rewards. Just because I'm not playing it to your definition doesn't mean that I'm not playing the game.

    NOTE: I am NOT advocating botting. I have NEVER advocated botting. I do NOT bot. Seems like every time I argue this topic, people seem to think that I'm all for it. I'm not. I just fail to see how those players who appear to be botting, even after being reported, are in any way affecting another player's ability to play the game. So far, no one has been able to answer this.

    How are you playing tho in the instances I mentioned. You are logged in yes but if the pets minions do everything then you really aren't earning the loot. And no it doesn't affect me except they get income doing nothing that I don't get I guess. I don't think you support bots or calling you a bot and like I said up above I can't even say they are botting if the pets minions attack on their own. They just taking advantage of the system which If my suggestion happened they would have to cross that line into botting and actually risk their account banned. In a small way it does affect everyone and some would argue positive because before new map certain dusts were 9-11 silver and they might of been higher if there weren't so many afk farmers getting those just sitting necroes in certain areas

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    I disagree. I would still be playing the game, so I should get the rewards. Just because I'm not playing it to your definition doesn't mean that I'm not playing the game.

    NOTE: I am NOT advocating botting. I have NEVER advocated botting. I do NOT bot. Seems like every time I argue this topic, people seem to think that I'm all for it. I'm not. I just fail to see how those players who appear to be botting, even after being reported, are in any way affecting another player's ability to play the game. So far, no one has been able to answer this.

    How are you playing tho in the instances I mentioned. You are logged in yes but if the pets minions do everything then you really aren't earning the loot. And no it doesn't affect me except they get income doing nothing that I don't get I guess. I don't think you support bots or calling you a bot and like I said up above I can't even say they are botting if the pets minions attack on their own. They just taking advantage of the system which If my suggestion happened they would have to cross that line into botting and actually risk their account banned. In a small way it does affect everyone and some would argue positive because before new map certain dusts were 9-11 silver and they might of been higher if there weren't so many afk farmers getting those just sitting necroes in certain areas

    Any income gained does not affect any other player's ability to gain income. Nothing these players are doing will help them "win" Guild Wars 2 or cause another player to "lose". If there were a significant effect on the in-game economy then Anet would step in and make adjustments (and has in the previous example of the leather farm). If players are taking advantage of the system in a way that is against the CoC, then Anet will handle it. No one here on the forums can which is why it is so frustrating for me to see these threads continue to pop up.

    There already exists a way to deal with suspected botters: report them and move on.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Khisanth.2948Khisanth.2948 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hannelore.8153 said:
    It doesn't affect the game as there's a Diminishing Returns (DR) system in place that prevents it. Essentially, you have to be active and move around the map alot and change maps to get loot, sometimes DR even affects regular players by accident.

    Why do you think they've never "fixed" it?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Diminishing_returns

    Does DR have much effect in the case of Drizzlewood? It would have to prevent gaining participation otherwise there would still be plenty of loot from the chests based on objectives controlled.

  • Blocki.4931Blocki.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    These people hurt nobody. No use complaining about them.

    I rather choose death.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    I disagree. I would still be playing the game, so I should get the rewards. Just because I'm not playing it to your definition doesn't mean that I'm not playing the game.

    NOTE: I am NOT advocating botting. I have NEVER advocated botting. I do NOT bot. Seems like every time I argue this topic, people seem to think that I'm all for it. I'm not. I just fail to see how those players who appear to be botting, even after being reported, are in any way affecting another player's ability to play the game. So far, no one has been able to answer this.

    How are you playing tho in the instances I mentioned. You are logged in yes but if the pets minions do everything then you really aren't earning the loot. And no it doesn't affect me except they get income doing nothing that I don't get I guess. I don't think you support bots or calling you a bot and like I said up above I can't even say they are botting if the pets minions attack on their own. They just taking advantage of the system which If my suggestion happened they would have to cross that line into botting and actually risk their account banned. In a small way it does affect everyone and some would argue positive because before new map certain dusts were 9-11 silver and they might of been higher if there weren't so many afk farmers getting those just sitting necroes in certain areas

    Any income gained does not affect any other player's ability to gain income. Nothing these players are doing will help them "win" Guild Wars 2 or cause another player to "lose". If there were a significant effect on the in-game economy then Anet would step in and make adjustments (and has in the previous example of the leather farm). If players are taking advantage of the system in a way that is against the CoC, then Anet will handle it. No one here on the forums can which is why it is so frustrating for me to see these threads continue to pop up.

    There already exists a way to deal with suspected botters: report them and move on.

    Lol I know you get frustrated. I was surprised I got a comment in before you but the title wasn't as obvious. I mean if you want to argue It doesn't affect us then I really can't win that argument. I mean it's not like other games like Aion when I would go in the enemys zone and kill the gather bots for pvp points. That was fun hunting bots as you felt you could do something. Here I get players frustration but yeah nothing really hurts us individually

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • Yggranya.5201Yggranya.5201 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    So, as a ranger main, if I target an enemy and F1 my pet to attack it then I get no credit for the kill

    Wouldn't you also be attacking the mob as well? Or other mobs? Doing damage with your skills other then the pet? If you are casting skills then you get loot. If you sit your ranger and the pets kills 500 mobs in a row by itself like you see them do then no. Like there was a ranger once on a hut and the jacaranda pet was confused and killing all these bandits while running around the hut trying to get back to him but couldn't. In that case no loot. If you are actively also casting skills and stuff then you get loot

    I disagree. I would still be playing the game, so I should get the rewards. Just because I'm not playing it to your definition doesn't mean that I'm not playing the game.

    NOTE: I am NOT advocating botting. I have NEVER advocated botting. I do NOT bot. Seems like every time I argue this topic, people seem to think that I'm all for it. I'm not. I just fail to see how those players who appear to be botting, even after being reported, are in any way affecting another player's ability to play the game. So far, no one has been able to answer this.

    And there we have it, from the mouth of kharmin themself, they want rewards for nothing. Oh, it isn't botting but it might as well be, because you are not playing the game.
    "I'm not playing but i'm not botting, see the obvious difference!" You can't be serious... You people don't need to go to these lenghts to try to make us believe your shaky explanations, you are not fooling anyone, anet is simply indifferent so go nuts. When there is nothing but AFKers and bots, maybe anet will feel bad (yeah, right...).
    It's a "playstyle" AHAHAHAHAHAHA!

  • TwoGhosts.6790TwoGhosts.6790 Member ✭✭✭

    The more the merrier. Makes TP prices lower for when I need to buy kitten.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yggranya.5201 said:
    And there we have it, from the mouth of kharmin themself, they want rewards for nothing. Oh, it isn't botting but it might as well be, because you are not playing the game.
    "I'm not playing but i'm not botting, see the obvious difference!" You can't be serious... You people don't need to go to these lenghts to try to make us believe your shaky explanations, you are not fooling anyone, anet is simply indifferent so go nuts. When there is nothing but AFKers and bots, maybe anet will feel bad (yeah, right...).
    It's a "playstyle" AHAHAHAHAHAHA!

    Again, you think that y9u know me so well. Please, then, show me how these suspected botters directly affect your ability to play the game. How do they prevent you from completing content? How do their rewards affect your rewards? Why does it bother you?

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yggranya.5201 said:

    You people don't need to go to these lenghts to try to make us believe your shaky explanations, you are not fooling anyone, anet is simply indifferent so go nuts. When there is nothing but AFKers and bots, maybe anet will feel bad (yeah, right...).

    Better yet, add me in game and then when I'm on you can come and watch me play the game and see that I do not bot for rewards.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • danielrjones.8759danielrjones.8759 Member ✭✭
    edited July 1, 2020

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:

    @Tyncale.1629 said:
    Everquest implemented that rule pretty early for pet classes. You have to get at least 1 point of damage in yourself. You can still automate that to an extent but it will be a lot harder to tag all mobs that way.

    This person gets it, Everquest gets it. Not that it's up to me, but I think this is the perfect solution. As I said in the original post, "When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them." I never mentioned changing anything about the way minions or pets work other than tagging for loot. Those AFK'ers aren't loitering around the winterberry nodes to help players, or any other location. They pick those spots because veterans are there in hopes of better loot. The vet that spawns at the log farm in Malchor's drops a minimum fine grade item 100% the time. I know because I have 23 characters parked there and I have been MANUALLY killing that vet for years. Try thanking one of those players for making things easier for you and you will see what a great addition to the community they are when they are silent, or their status is set to offline. My complaint is purely from a business standpoint. I love the game and if one of those slackers trades in gold for only 100 gems I consider this stealing. Especially when Anet had to recently lay off employees.

    When I'm in a farming mood i usually put myself offline so no one will pm me. Just because they are offline doesn't mean they aren't there. Some people just don't want to be bother sometimes. I'm not saying that's true for every one but please don't assume every person set to offline and farming is a bot Most of the time when I farm. I have 70 alts that I will run through w/e area. I just want to get it over with. Idle chit chat just slows me down. I know a few others who farm a lot who feel the same.

  • Hot Boy.7138Hot Boy.7138 Member ✭✭✭

    i think this is okay. It's just a perk of playing a pet class. It's not like pet classes are not available to everyone. Anyone can make one and do the same. Some classes have way more mobility, some have way more self healing, etc. This is just a unique perk of a pet class, that's all.

  • Tukaram.8256Tukaram.8256 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:
    ...When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch so we don't have to look at these deadbeats.

    Actually that is exactly what the OP said - "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You may not be saying it but the OP did, and that was who my reply was aimed at . My minions are my main weapon. It would be the same as saying a warriors weapon damage cannot tag for loot.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 2, 2020

    @Tukaram.8256 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:
    ...When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch so we don't have to look at these deadbeats.

    Actually that is exactly what the OP said - "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You may not be saying it but the OP did, and that was who my reply was aimed at . My minions are my main weapon. It would be the same as saying a warriors weapon damage cannot tag for loot.

    No, that's what the title says and if you don't read anything then yeah off that you can infer he meant what you responded too. But if you read it and the thread which you didn't and only read the title then 2 times you say the wrong thing and correct someone by saying the wrong thing again. He says in his post they sit there afk and the minions do it all while the player does nothing and no that wouldn't be the same because you know the war has to use his weapon skills to do damage where your minions can kill with you in the other room

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • sorudo.9054sorudo.9054 Member ✭✭✭✭

    i actually want them to fix the minions, do you have any idea how annoying it is to walk around, get into battle mode for absolutely no reason and then find out that about 20 meters back your minion is fighting some useless mob.....

    the truth is harsh, my opinions are too.

  • Tukaram.8256Tukaram.8256 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:
    ...When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch so we don't have to look at these deadbeats.

    Actually that is exactly what the OP said - "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You may not be saying it but the OP did, and that was who my reply was aimed at . My minions are my main weapon. It would be the same as saying a warriors weapon damage cannot tag for loot.

    No, that's what the title says and if you don't read anything then yeah off that you can infer he meant what you responded too. But if you read it and the thread which you didn't and only read the title then 2 times you say the wrong thing and correct someone by saying the wrong thing again. He says in his post they sit there afk and the minions do it all while the player does nothing and no that wouldn't be the same because you know the war has to use his weapon skills to do damage where your minions can kill with you in the other room

    I did read the whole thread - but was only replying to the original (stupid) idea. He said "Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch". That means necro & ranger only get credit for their AOE or I suppose other personally applied damage - though he does not mention that. He wants ALL damage by minions &pets to not count. He did not say to put in an AFK check, he said "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You can dance around it all you want. I was replying to him and am done with you.

  • Friday.7864Friday.7864 Member ✭✭✭

    Some of you seem to be arguing how earning drops and meta participation without doing anything isn't botting because you're just standing there.
    Can you then at least prove how it is an okay thing to do, or get anet to verify it?
    I would definitely afk with a few accounts in drizzlewood or somewhere with enough mobs before going to work each day then.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Friday.7864 said:
    Some of you seem to be arguing how earning drops and meta participation without doing anything isn't botting because you're just standing there.
    Can you then at least prove how it is an okay thing to do, or get anet to verify it?
    I would definitely afk with a few accounts in drizzlewood or somewhere with enough mobs before going to work each day then.

    If you haven't, please read the policy on unattended gameplay: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Jilora.9524Jilora.9524 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tukaram.8256 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:

    @Jilora.9524 said:

    @Tukaram.8256 said:
    To say minions cannot help with earning loot would be like saying a warrior's sword damage does not count. The minions are our weapons. As a necro/minion master I would say maybe add a player movement requirement every so often, or the critters despawn. But to say they do not count... asinine.

    No one is saying that. They are saying if it is only your minions doing all the damage while your character casts no skills you get no loot

    @Howdy its me Brad.6132 said:
    ...When a player is actually controlling a Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch so we don't have to look at these deadbeats.

    Actually that is exactly what the OP said - "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You may not be saying it but the OP did, and that was who my reply was aimed at . My minions are my main weapon. It would be the same as saying a warriors weapon damage cannot tag for loot.

    No, that's what the title says and if you don't read anything then yeah off that you can infer he meant what you responded too. But if you read it and the thread which you didn't and only read the title then 2 times you say the wrong thing and correct someone by saying the wrong thing again. He says in his post they sit there afk and the minions do it all while the player does nothing and no that wouldn't be the same because you know the war has to use his weapon skills to do damage where your minions can kill with you in the other room

    I did read the whole thread - but was only replying to the original (stupid) idea. He said "Necromancer or Ranger, they have plenty of AOE for loot without the minions and pets helping them... So please disable minion/pet tagging for loot in the next patch". That means necro & ranger only get credit for their AOE or I suppose other personally applied damage - though he does not mention that. He wants ALL damage by minions &pets to not count. He did not say to put in an AFK check, he said "disable minion/pet tagging for loot". You can dance around it all you want. I was replying to him and am done with you.

    Fine Be done with me after saying dance around while you ignore the whole paragraph which was mostly an annoying rant but it's more for AFK not how you pull out a couple sentences and base your whole argument on it. You can see it's afk sitting at drizzle now not someone actively player but yeah now we can be done

    WvW bandwagoners have small D's and never left their house even before Covid19

  • Friday.7864Friday.7864 Member ✭✭✭

    @kharmin.7683 said:

    @Friday.7864 said:
    Some of you seem to be arguing how earning drops and meta participation without doing anything isn't botting because you're just standing there.
    Can you then at least prove how it is an okay thing to do, or get anet to verify it?
    I would definitely afk with a few accounts in drizzlewood or somewhere with enough mobs before going to work each day then.

    If you haven't, please read the policy on unattended gameplay: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    In that case it's not okay to use pets and turrets and they should change their behavior. Period.
    I don't understand why it's even being discussed anymore, at this point people can literally gain meta participation while being afk instead of losing it.