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Warrior Balance Requests Omnibus

Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭
edited October 22, 2020 in Warrior

For Reference:

@KryTiKaL.3125 said:
Just as a note that I find is important, if you have suggestions and ideas on adjustments or changes that are specifically tied to PvP, or might help better the PvP/WvW experience of Warriors; i.e things like Banner changes that will actually make them not so outdated, fast hands being baseline, offhand weapon skills being made better, etc then these things should try to be directed onto the PvP/WvW sections of the forums.

CMC just said in a State of the Game stream he did with Teapot and Angeels that it will be the best place for him to see these things so that he can parse through the suggestions and see what can be done on his end and what he might be able to forward to the skills team.

Oh and also CMC himself said, when asked what class he feels is sort of the ideal place that he would like other classes to be in regards of their power in PvP/WvW, and this is paraphrased a little "Warrior is pretty close to the ideal power level".

So, lets put together all the changes that we feel are needed for warrior in PvP/WvW into one thread here. As people make good suggestions I'll edit this main post to include them. Later on, once it is sufficiently fleshed out and in a good place the main post will be copied over to the PvP and WvW subforums. If you make a suggestion, please keep in mind how it affects warrior as a whole. Weapons, traits, skills, and mechanics are all on the table here, but also bear in mind that warrior is "close to the ideal power level" so crazy stupid buffs are not going to happen. I'll start off with Sword to get things started, if someone thinks of something better for sword that the community thinks is better then I'll replace what I have below.

Weapons
Sword:

  • Flurry: Remove self-root. reduce channel time to 2s. Edit: some reasoning, the self root keeps this skills from seeing active play in competitive modes and such long duration self roots are counter productive in a game that advocates active defenses over passive defenses. Channel time reduction is more of a QOL change. Move Flurry to Slot 3, making the tier 2 burst the new slot 3 sword skill with the immobilize distributed evenly across each strike rather than one large duration.
  • Final Thrust: Make this the new burst. Foes struck above 50% take 2 stacks of bleed and the current level of damage above 50%. At Tier 1 they take 4 stacks of bleed and 150% of the listed damage, at Tier 2 they take 6 stacks of bleed and 200% of the listed damage (the current skill), at Tier 3 they take 8 stacks of bleed and 250% of the listed damage. The Tier 1 and Tier 3 values can still be debated, but I think the current skill damage numbers work at a Tier 2 burst. Bleeds above 50% were added to give a reason for a Core Condi build to use it above 50% HP if needed and still get some benefit.
  • Impale: Change cast time to 1/4s cast.
  • Rip: Adjust the hit box on this skill to make it easier to land. Impale and Rip are clunky, improving the cast time on Impale and making Rip easier to hit with would alleviate this.
  • Riposte: Change the name to Parry. Parry initiates the blocking portion of the skill as it is now, including adrenaline gain if it completes its channel, except that melee attacks will not end the block. Change the flip over skill to Riposte instead of Adrenaline Rush. Riposte does what the current attack does, but also interrupts the target via a 1/4s daze(no CC, just interrupts their action). So, Riposte becomes a 2.25s block with the option to end it early for a soft interrupt with damage. Add a 1/2 evade to the attack frames of Riposte.

Mace:

  • AA chain: Reduce the cast time of the AA chain to 2.4s
  • Skull Crack: Add a 300 range leap.
  • Tremor: Change from a projectile to a cone based AoE, 600 range.

Rifle:
* Kill Shot: Remove the self root for the same reasoning as Flurry

  • Change rifle weapon skills 1-4 to 600 range cone AoEs.
  • Brutal Shot: Move the evade to before the shot is fired. Evade Forward rather than backwards.
  • Remove Kill Shot and replace with a new burst: Salt Shot: Daze (1/4s) and Blind (5s) foes in front of you and deal damage (Current Kill Shot damage levels but reduced by 2/3) based on Adrenaline spent.

Hammer:

  • Staggering Blow: Add an evade around the target prior to the knockback, foes struck are slowed for 3s.

Longbow:

  • AA: Apply 1s of burn per arrow.
  • Fan of Fire: Add 1 more arrow along with burn on it. Tighten the cone so that at least 2 arrows will hit the same target at max range if the target is in the middle of the cone. This reduces the reliance on being in melee range to maximize the skill DPS.
  • Pin Down: Remove Arcing Arrow and put Pin Down into slot 3.12s cd, 6 stacks of bleed for 6s, 1s immob.
  • Smoldering Arrow: Increase radius to 240.
    Add in a new LB5 based on the version that did not make release.

  • Rain of Fire: 20s CD, channel while being mobile, 12 hits with a damage interval of 0.5s burn Duration 4s/2s per hit, duration split for PvE/Comp. Essentially Barrage, but mobile during the channel and only applies burning instead of cripple.

  • Combustive Shot: Reduce the intervals to the more normal game duration of 1s. So after the initial hit the field persist for 1s per Adrenaline spent. This would not change the total damage dealt by the skill, but would a major QoL update to the skill.

Greatsword:

  • Hundred Blades: Reduce channel time to 2s.

Torch:

  • Flames of War: This skill removes Chill in addition addition to the other conditions it cleanses. Reduce the number of conditions cleansed by 1 for WvW and PvP.

Axe:

  • Whirling Axe: Remove the tooltip about increasing movement speed. Grant instead 3s of superspeed.
  • Dual Strike: Apply quickness for 0.5s per foe struck.

Dagger:

  • Bladestorm: Change this skill to an activation time of 1/2s. For 2s blades swirl around target area creating a lightening field, granting swiftness to allies and damaging foes, Foes damaged are inflicted with vulnerability. Reflects missiles. 900 range. Strike interval of 1/4s. 2 stacks of vulnerability for 10s per strike.

Traits
Strength

  • Berserker's Power: This trait now activates upon number of adrenaline bars spent regardless of if a foe is struck.
  • Body Blow: Change this trait to: CCs apply weakness (3s) and deal damage, 400/800 scaling of 1.0/0.8 (PvE/Comp). Can critical hit. Damage and weakness are applied after the CC.

Discipline

  • Double Standards: Update this trait to reflect the changes to banners below. Banners provide swiftness when summoned, increase duration to reflect that they are no longer picked up.

Arms

  • Burst Precision: Make the 100% critical chance upon using a burst persist for 2s. Alternatively make it persist based on the number of adrenaline bars spent (1s/2s/3s).
  • Sundering Bursts: Add to this trait that applying vulnerability heals you for 50/25 health (PvE/Comp).
  • Dual Wielding: Critical strikes from main hand weapons wielded in the offhand have increased effects:
    OH Sword: Immobilize (1s).
    OH Mace: Weakness (3s).
    OH Axe: Vulnerability (3s).
    OH Dagger: Remove 1 boon.

Tactics

  • Marching Orders: Reduce the CD from 15s to 5s.

Defense:

  • Defy Pain: Defy Pain now provides Retaliation (5s) and Protection (5s) when struck below 50% HP and breaks stuns with a CD of 30s.
  • Last Stand: Last Stand now increases stance duration by 25%, reduces their CDs by 20%, and provides 6s of vigor upon activation.
  • Cleansing Ire: This trait now activates upon number of adrenaline bars spent regardless of if a foe is struck.

Berserker:

  • Smash Brawler: Increase the number of adrenaline strikes one can hold in Berserk Mode by 5 strikes.
  • Last Blaze: When you use a Berserker skill set nearby foes on fire and gain 5/2 stacks of might for 5s (PvE/Comp).
  • Fatal Frenzy: Reduce the Toughness penalty to -150.
  • Burst of Aggression: Allow quickness and superspeed to reapply upon hitting with a Primal Burst.

Spellbreaker:

  • Loss Aversion: Add in a 20% CD reduction of Meditation skills. Increase coefficient to 0.5.
  • Break Enchantments: Increase base damage to 399, keep scaling as is.
  • Sight Beyond Sight: Update it so that your next three attacks are critical hits, each strike removes blindness prior to the hit.
  • Full Counter: Normalize the 2s daze across all game modes.
  • Revenge Counter: Full Counter now deals a 0.25s daze, grants resistance for 2s, copies up to 5 conditions to foes struck. and deals increased damage: 532 (2.4/1.0 Pve/Comp).

Skills

  • Banners: Update these to mount onto the warrior's back, update the skins if appropriate for visual cleanliness/fashion sense. Battle Standard also mounts on the warrior's back, but provides a flip over skill to rez/finish causing the banner effect to end. To summarize, banners are summoned onto the warrior's back, provide their usual benefits, and in the case of Battle Standard, it is summoned, provides buffs as normal, but the rez/finish effect is on a flipover skill that subsequently banishes the banner.
  • "Fear Me!": Make an ammo skill like the other utility shouts, CD between uses should be 35s and ammo recharge should be 60s. grant 4/2 stacks of might for 5s per foe feared (PvE/Comp), remove the weakness.
  • Blood Reckoning: Grants 10 adrenaline, with an additional 2/1 adrenaline on hit (PvE/Comp). 33% damage dealt is converted to healing. 5 second duration. Keep the same base healing and healing coefficient.

Mechanics

  • Berserk Mode: Add a F2 to exit Berserk Mode. This action consumes all remaining adrenaline. This new skill counts as a T1 burst for traits. Reduce CD of Berserk to 10s. While in Berserk Mode you have 30 Strikes of Adrenaline, Adrenaline decays at the rate of 1 strike per second, Primal Bursts no longer have cooldowns, but consume 10 strikes of adrenaline per use. Once all Adrenaline is consumed you exit Berserk Mode, exiting Berserk Mode due to loss of adrenaline will also count as a T1 Burst for traits. This is a similar functionality to every other mechanics in the game that functions as a mode.
  • Rage Skills: Wherever a rage skill increases the duration of Berserk Mode, grant that many strikes of adrenaline instead.
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Comments

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 27, 2020

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    • Riposte: Change the name to Parry. Parry initiates the blocking portion of the skill as it is now, including adrenaline gain if it completes its channel, except that melee attacks will not end the block. Change the flip over skill to Riposte instead of Adrenaline Rush. Riposte does what the current attack does, but also interrupts the target (no CC, just interrupts their action). So, Riposte becomes a 2.25s block with the option to end it early for a soft interrupt with damage.

    Wait, so riposte would be pretty much 2sec shield stance (because you need that 1/4 sec to use flip skill) + current riposte + current riposte flip skill made 'passive' + interrupt on 2 x shorter cd than shield stance?

    e: spelling

  • I like that riposte/parry skill change, I think it'd make it possible to "replace" shield for condi builds. Not sure though how they'd make it an interrupt without a CC, and would that make it so you can change it to another target for the interrupt? That part might be a little broken.

    #nornmodeisbestmode

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    • Riposte: Change the name to Parry. Parry initiates the blocking portion of the skill as it is now, including adrenaline gain if it completes its channel, except that melee attacks will not end the block. Change the flip over skill to Riposte instead of Adrenaline Rush. Riposte does what the current attack does, but also interrupts the target (no CC, just interrupts their action). So, Riposte becomes a 2.25s block with the option to end it early for a soft interrupt with damage.

    Wait, so repost would be pretty much 2sec shield stance (because you need that 1/4 sec to use flip skill) + current reposte + current reposte flip skill made 'passive' + interrupt on 2 x shorter cd than shield stance?

    A shorter but more versatile block yes. Making Riposte itself the flip skill to use actively rather than hoping someone hits you in melee makes it more versatile. You could double tap the skill to go straight to the interrupt if the foe had the unblockable buff up or switched to using a heal skill. Keep in mind the current skill is already pretty much shield stance lite but for a shorter duration. This change is ultimately to make it more versatile, and to make the damage portion something that we have active control over while keeping the flavor of actually riposting an attack.

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:
    I like that riposte/parry skill change, I think it'd make it possible to "replace" shield for condi builds. Not sure though how they'd make it an interrupt without a CC, and would that make it so you can change it to another target for the interrupt? That part might be a little broken.

    Fair points, I'd point out though that things like Gunflame and Disrupting Stab have a 1/4s daze but still do their damage. The interrupt is more for keeping the riposte an actual riposte, but a 1/4s daze that keeps the damage would work as well as I think you are right that anything that interrupts in this game uses daze or one of the harder Cs to do so.

  • Ferus.3165Ferus.3165 Member ✭✭✭

    the first thing warrior weapons need is, especially sword (main/off), is better animations. Like many old warrior weapons they are cluncky and have an huge aftercast on many abilites and that needs to be fixed before any numbers are thrown around.

  • @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:
    I like that riposte/parry skill change, I think it'd make it possible to "replace" shield for condi builds. Not sure though how they'd make it an interrupt without a CC, and would that make it so you can change it to another target for the interrupt? That part might be a little broken.

    Fair points, I'd point out though that things like Gunflame and Disrupting Stab have a 1/4s daze but still do their damage. The interrupt is more for keeping the riposte an actual riposte, but a 1/4s daze that keeps the damage would work as well as I think you are right that anything that interrupts in this game uses daze or one of the harder Cs to do so.

    One thought I have to get the desired effect might be shocking aura? I know it doesn't quite fit a warrior getting a shocking aura but it might do what you're wanting?
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shocking_Aura_(effect)

    #nornmodeisbestmode

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Red Haired Savage.5430 said:
    I like that riposte/parry skill change, I think it'd make it possible to "replace" shield for condi builds. Not sure though how they'd make it an interrupt without a CC, and would that make it so you can change it to another target for the interrupt? That part might be a little broken.

    Fair points, I'd point out though that things like Gunflame and Disrupting Stab have a 1/4s daze but still do their damage. The interrupt is more for keeping the riposte an actual riposte, but a 1/4s daze that keeps the damage would work as well as I think you are right that anything that interrupts in this game uses daze or one of the harder Cs to do so.

    One thought I have to get the desired effect might be shocking aura? I know it doesn't quite fit a warrior getting a shocking aura but it might do what you're wanting?
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shocking_Aura_(effect)

    I saw your recommendation before. The better comparison would be gladiators defense from GW1. To port that over would be to have a 2s channeled evasion that pulses AOE damage, but that would essentially be dagger storm but melee range.

    Not that I'd be against that, but that is an elite equivalent ability.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ferus.3165 said:
    the first thing warrior weapons need is, especially sword (main/off), is better animations. Like many old warrior weapons they are cluncky and have an huge aftercast on many abilites and that needs to be fixed before any numbers are thrown around.

    Aye, what I recommended for impale/rip was essentially that. Do you have recommendations on other weapons? I'm holding back so that other players can have their say and not have this end up being my personal wish list.

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Personally I think the devs need to work on CC. The game just wasn't designed for how stability work currently. Working on CC is bound to indirectly benefit all profession, but it's especially true for professions that tend to fight at melee range in PvP/WvW like the warrior.

    Balance need less emphasis on CC with large and long effect and more on the concept of "interrupting". To achieve this, the introduction of "CC duration/impact" mod is necessary and the reconversion of stability into a "-100% CC duration" mod no longer blocking the interrupt effect (and thus no longer a set number of block) would be, in my opinion a good option.

    All in all, interupting is good, CC chain isn't.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dadnir.5038 said:
    Personally I think the devs need to work on CC. The game just wasn't designed for how stability work currently. Working on CC is bound to indirectly benefit all profession, but it's especially true for professions that tend to fight at melee range in PvP/WvW like the warrior.

    Balance need less emphasis on CC with large and long effect and more on the concept of "interrupting". To achieve this, the introduction of "CC duration/impact" mod is necessary and the reconversion of stability into a "-100% CC duration" mod no longer blocking the interrupt effect (and thus no longer a set number of block) would be, in my opinion a good option.

    All in all, interupting is good, CC chain isn't.

    Like perhaps converting some knockbacks into dazes and returning some of the damage?

  • KryTiKaL.3125KryTiKaL.3125 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910
    Would we want to put the suggested changes to Banners in this as well? Considering they are mostly mechanic changes rather than any sort of flat increase or direct buff to their effects. I'll put them here regardless.

    I'll take the direct quote from the post I summarized it all in because it also includes reasoning behind the changes.

    @KryTiKaL.3125 said:
    So just to compile the ideas;

    Banners: Rework to function similar to Scrappers gyros, "attaching" the banner to the Warrior while retaining all current effects that banners provide. No more picking them up, no more having them replace currently slotted weapon skills.

    Battle Standard: Would be reworked just like all other banners, the only difference is that it will alter its function to one similar to the Herald's Facet of Elements (which turns to Elemental Blast). While active it would replace the elite skill slot with its active use effect, a ground targeted finisher/rally.

    I'm going to exclude suggesting adding a Banner heal skill as that would give Warriors 5 heal skills as a part of the Core class, and that would throw off the balance between the rest of the Core classes as all others have 4 heal skills.

    Gyros got this treatment because they weren't terribly great due to how weird they worked and their previous function was outdated and just didn't fit well. Banners are in this same boat, and its part of why Warriors are pretty much only ever taken for Winds of Disenchantment in WvW zerging, and why Banners being as stationary as they are is an outdated concept for this game. While they are still widely used in PvE, mostly Raids and Fractals as they are still potent enough buffs when placed, changing how they work while retaining all current effects (they do not need to be increased or decreased) will still allow them to retain their position in PvE content, if not just be a nice QoL change for Warriors. It might even open them up for more use in WvW as well.

    Please do note that this is the only thing that I would advise changing in regards to Banners, nothing else needs to be done. The only outside alteration that would need to be made, specifically traits, is that Doubled Standards would need a little revising in its tooltip and how it works.

    "Doubled Standards" current: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon or pick up a banner.
    "Doubled Standards" after: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon a banner.

    That should be noted as well, try to pair a reasoning with any specific change anyone here comes up with or suggests; that was something I should have mentioned previously, as CMC also stated that it would be preferred and much more helpful if players actually stated the reasoning behind it. I'm sure everyone here has seen the constant threads of "CHANGE THIS JUST BECAUSE".

    Explaining your thoughts as to why will be very helpful.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @KryTiKaL.3125 said:
    @Lan Deathrider.5910
    Would we want to put the suggested changes to Banners in this as well? Considering they are mostly mechanic changes rather than any sort of flat increase or direct buff to their effects. I'll put them here regardless.

    I'll take the direct quote from the post I summarized it all in because it also includes reasoning behind the changes.

    @KryTiKaL.3125 said:
    So just to compile the ideas;

    Banners: Rework to function similar to Scrappers gyros, "attaching" the banner to the Warrior while retaining all current effects that banners provide. No more picking them up, no more having them replace currently slotted weapon skills.

    Battle Standard: Would be reworked just like all other banners, the only difference is that it will alter its function to one similar to the Herald's Facet of Elements (which turns to Elemental Blast). While active it would replace the elite skill slot with its active use effect, a ground targeted finisher/rally.

    I'm going to exclude suggesting adding a Banner heal skill as that would give Warriors 5 heal skills as a part of the Core class, and that would throw off the balance between the rest of the Core classes as all others have 4 heal skills.

    Gyros got this treatment because they weren't terribly great due to how weird they worked and their previous function was outdated and just didn't fit well. Banners are in this same boat, and its part of why Warriors are pretty much only ever taken for Winds of Disenchantment in WvW zerging, and why Banners being as stationary as they are is an outdated concept for this game. While they are still widely used in PvE, mostly Raids and Fractals as they are still potent enough buffs when placed, changing how they work while retaining all current effects (they do not need to be increased or decreased) will still allow them to retain their position in PvE content, if not just be a nice QoL change for Warriors. It might even open them up for more use in WvW as well.

    Please do note that this is the only thing that I would advise changing in regards to Banners, nothing else needs to be done. The only outside alteration that would need to be made, specifically traits, is that Doubled Standards would need a little revising in its tooltip and how it works.

    "Doubled Standards" current: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon or pick up a banner.
    "Doubled Standards" after: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon a banner.

    That should be noted as well, try to pair a reasoning with any specific change anyone here comes up with or suggests; that was something I should have mentioned previously, as CMC also stated that it would be preferred and much more helpful if players actually stated the reasoning behind it. I'm sure everyone here has seen the constant threads of "CHANGE THIS JUST BECAUSE".

    Explaining your thoughts as to why will be very helpful.

    TYVM mate. As I said I'm trying to let other people bring things up before I comment further so it doesn't just look like a personal wish list, but a community driven set of feedback. Banners definitely need this update. I think keeping the reasoning within this thread rather than the main post may be fine. Otherwise the main post would get massive quickly.

  • KryTiKaL.3125KryTiKaL.3125 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @KryTiKaL.3125 said:
    @Lan Deathrider.5910
    Would we want to put the suggested changes to Banners in this as well? Considering they are mostly mechanic changes rather than any sort of flat increase or direct buff to their effects. I'll put them here regardless.

    I'll take the direct quote from the post I summarized it all in because it also includes reasoning behind the changes.

    @KryTiKaL.3125 said:
    So just to compile the ideas;

    Banners: Rework to function similar to Scrappers gyros, "attaching" the banner to the Warrior while retaining all current effects that banners provide. No more picking them up, no more having them replace currently slotted weapon skills.

    Battle Standard: Would be reworked just like all other banners, the only difference is that it will alter its function to one similar to the Herald's Facet of Elements (which turns to Elemental Blast). While active it would replace the elite skill slot with its active use effect, a ground targeted finisher/rally.

    I'm going to exclude suggesting adding a Banner heal skill as that would give Warriors 5 heal skills as a part of the Core class, and that would throw off the balance between the rest of the Core classes as all others have 4 heal skills.

    Gyros got this treatment because they weren't terribly great due to how weird they worked and their previous function was outdated and just didn't fit well. Banners are in this same boat, and its part of why Warriors are pretty much only ever taken for Winds of Disenchantment in WvW zerging, and why Banners being as stationary as they are is an outdated concept for this game. While they are still widely used in PvE, mostly Raids and Fractals as they are still potent enough buffs when placed, changing how they work while retaining all current effects (they do not need to be increased or decreased) will still allow them to retain their position in PvE content, if not just be a nice QoL change for Warriors. It might even open them up for more use in WvW as well.

    Please do note that this is the only thing that I would advise changing in regards to Banners, nothing else needs to be done. The only outside alteration that would need to be made, specifically traits, is that Doubled Standards would need a little revising in its tooltip and how it works.

    "Doubled Standards" current: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon or pick up a banner.
    "Doubled Standards" after: Unique Banner effects applied to you are stronger. Gain swiftness when you summon a banner.

    That should be noted as well, try to pair a reasoning with any specific change anyone here comes up with or suggests; that was something I should have mentioned previously, as CMC also stated that it would be preferred and much more helpful if players actually stated the reasoning behind it. I'm sure everyone here has seen the constant threads of "CHANGE THIS JUST BECAUSE".

    Explaining your thoughts as to why will be very helpful.

    TYVM mate. As I said I'm trying to let other people bring things up before I comment further so it doesn't just look like a personal wish list, but a community driven set of feedback. Banners definitely need this update. I think keeping the reasoning within this thread rather than the main post may be fine. Otherwise the main post would get massive quickly.

    Very true, it would get rather bloated with text. So long as links are provided back to this particular thread so the reasons can be viewed it should be fine. Either that or if the reasoning is concise enough it can be included in the main post. Explaining things concisely is not a skill I'm particularly good at, but others might be.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Updated main post for daze on Riposte to reflect the soft CC via daze.
    Updated main post to include banner and double standard changes.

    Again as you all provide feedback, please add your reasoning. If you've seen/shared posts before feel free to share them here again so that they can be collected into one place. I know several people wanted distinct Rifle and Longbow changes, and that others wanted distinct changes to some OH weapons, so feel free to chime in.

  • Torqiseknite.1380Torqiseknite.1380 Member ✭✭✭
    • Rifle 4 still has the bug where it cancels itself and goes on cooldown if the target enters your hitbox during its 1/2 second cast, even if you're standing still. They should either fix that bug or change it to evade before shooting.
    • I don't think longbow really needs buffs, it's already a good power weapon that can be used to 1v1 any other warrior build with the right setup (people on NA can whisper me for duels if you want to test it). If the goal is to make it useful for condi/hybrid, I'd argue that the issue lies with arms being too weak to compete with literally any other trait line warrior has in pvp.
    • Defy pain and last stand are still dead traits. I suggest having defy pain proc 5 seconds of retaliation (for synergy with spiked armor) and protection when dropping below 50% health on a 60 second cooldown. Other ideas could involve granting barrier instead of protection or keeping the stunbreak functionality. As for last stand, I think that lesser balanced stance should be replaced with reducing stance cooldowns by 20% while keeping the increased durations and vigor.
    • I disagree with your suggestion of speeding up impale, as I've not really had any difficulty landing it compared to rip, and if arms becomes viable it'll already get a faster cast from dual wielding. Instead, I think they should increase the duration of the impaled debuff to 6 seconds to allow a longer window to use rip, and/or decrease rip's cast time to 1/2 second.
    • For offhand mace, tremor shouldn't be counted as a projectile. It's already a slow-moving skill that can't traverse elevation or gaps in terrain, and the fact that it can be reflected just makes it even clunkier to use.
  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Torqiseknite.1380 said:

    • Rifle 4 still has the bug where it cancels itself and goes on cooldown if the target enters your hitbox during its 1/2 second cast, even if you're standing still. They should either fix that bug or change it to evade before shooting.

    It would be better to evade first.

    • I don't think longbow really needs buffs, it's already a good power weapon that can be used to 1v1 any other warrior build with the right setup (people on NA can whisper me for duels if you want to test it). If the goal is to make it useful for condi/hybrid, I'd argue that the issue lies with arms being too weak to compete with literally any other trait line warrior has in pvp.

    I have had surprising success with it myself in the past, but arcing arrow is clunky and fan of fire needs a tighter cone so that you aren't forced into melee range to get the most benefit of it.

    • Defy pain and last stand are still dead traits. I suggest having defy pain proc 5 seconds of retaliation (for synergy with spiked armor) and protection when dropping below 50% health on a 60 second cooldown. Other ideas could involve granting barrier instead of protection or keeping the stunbreak functionality. As for last stand, I think that lesser balanced stance should be replaced with reducing stance cooldowns by 20% while keeping the increased durations and vigor.

    Those are all good suggestions.

    • I disagree with your suggestion of speeding up impale, as I've not really had any difficulty landing it compared to rip, and if arms becomes viable it'll already get a faster cast from dual wielding. Instead, I think they should increase the duration of the impaled debuff to 6 seconds to allow a longer window to use rip, and/or decrease rip's cast time to 1/2 second.

    It's more for normalization with throw axe which is a 1/4s cast. I don't think we'd get a duration increase, but I can see reducing Rip's cast time as well.

    • For offhand mace, tremor shouldn't be counted as a projectile. It's already a slow-moving skill that can't traverse elevation or gaps in terrain, and the fact that it can be reflected just makes it even clunkier to use.

    It would be better if it hit 4 150x300 rectangles in a row. Each with a 5 target cap. Mace 4 also feels like it should be quicker, but you are right on that a better worked version of dual wielding may help that instead. Any thoughts on dual wielding or Arms specifically?

  • Torqiseknite.1380Torqiseknite.1380 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Torqiseknite.1380 said:

    • Rifle 4 still has the bug where it cancels itself and goes on cooldown if the target enters your hitbox during its 1/2 second cast, even if you're standing still. They should either fix that bug or change it to evade before shooting.

    It would be better to evade first.

    • I don't think longbow really needs buffs, it's already a good power weapon that can be used to 1v1 any other warrior build with the right setup (people on NA can whisper me for duels if you want to test it). If the goal is to make it useful for condi/hybrid, I'd argue that the issue lies with arms being too weak to compete with literally any other trait line warrior has in pvp.

    I have had surprising success with it myself in the past, but arcing arrow is clunky and fan of fire needs a tighter cone so that you aren't forced into melee range to get the most benefit of it.

    • Defy pain and last stand are still dead traits. I suggest having defy pain proc 5 seconds of retaliation (for synergy with spiked armor) and protection when dropping below 50% health on a 60 second cooldown. Other ideas could involve granting barrier instead of protection or keeping the stunbreak functionality. As for last stand, I think that lesser balanced stance should be replaced with reducing stance cooldowns by 20% while keeping the increased durations and vigor.

    Those are all good suggestions.

    • I disagree with your suggestion of speeding up impale, as I've not really had any difficulty landing it compared to rip, and if arms becomes viable it'll already get a faster cast from dual wielding. Instead, I think they should increase the duration of the impaled debuff to 6 seconds to allow a longer window to use rip, and/or decrease rip's cast time to 1/2 second.

    It's more for normalization with throw axe which is a 1/4s cast. I don't think we'd get a duration increase, but I can see reducing Rip's cast time as well.

    • For offhand mace, tremor shouldn't be counted as a projectile. It's already a slow-moving skill that can't traverse elevation or gaps in terrain, and the fact that it can be reflected just makes it even clunkier to use.

    It would be better if it hit 4 150x300 rectangles in a row. Each with a 5 target cap. Mace 4 also feels like it should be quicker, but you are right on that a better worked version of dual wielding may help that instead. Any thoughts on dual wielding or Arms specifically?

    Balancing dual wielding is probably a bit tricky since the main question is whether or not it should stack with quickness for +70% attack speed. At the very least, I think it should stack with the +15% attack speed from berserk mode since berserker is essentially warrior's condi elite spec. If stacking with quickness is a problem, it could also grant a 5-10% bonus to power/condition damage when you have quickness to cover that loss of functionality.

    Burst precision should give a brief 100% crit chance buff after using a burst skill, similar to hidden killer in critical strikes. This would allow for greater synergy with the bloodlust minor and potentially help hybrid builds with their burst (e.g. guaranteed crit on final thrust after flurry).

    The bonus bleed duration on bloodlust should be increased to +25% in competitive modes to reflect its status as a minor grandmaster (compare with barbed precision, the minor adept in curses that grants the same amount of bleed on crit and +20% bleed duration).

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Dadnir.5038 said:
    Personally I think the devs need to work on CC. The game just wasn't designed for how stability work currently. Working on CC is bound to indirectly benefit all profession, but it's especially true for professions that tend to fight at melee range in PvP/WvW like the warrior.

    Balance need less emphasis on CC with large and long effect and more on the concept of "interrupting". To achieve this, the introduction of "CC duration/impact" mod is necessary and the reconversion of stability into a "-100% CC duration" mod no longer blocking the interrupt effect (and thus no longer a set number of block) would be, in my opinion a good option.

    All in all, interupting is good, CC chain isn't.

    Like perhaps converting some knockbacks into dazes and returning some of the damage?

    Well, yes and no. Let's say that it's an option on the short term but on the long term it's not going to do any good to the game to just turn knock back into daze. Daze in itself is still a "long duration CC" even if it's effect is less debilitating than a knock back. As for the damage, yes, I'm all for a return of some of them, the true issue was being locked in a chain of CC with stupidly long duration, not the damage received. (I always feel like ANet's devs miss the mark when they balance, the CC change is a good example of that)

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Torqiseknite.1380 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Torqiseknite.1380 said:

    • Rifle 4 still has the bug where it cancels itself and goes on cooldown if the target enters your hitbox during its 1/2 second cast, even if you're standing still. They should either fix that bug or change it to evade before shooting.

    It would be better to evade first.

    • I don't think longbow really needs buffs, it's already a good power weapon that can be used to 1v1 any other warrior build with the right setup (people on NA can whisper me for duels if you want to test it). If the goal is to make it useful for condi/hybrid, I'd argue that the issue lies with arms being too weak to compete with literally any other trait line warrior has in pvp.

    I have had surprising success with it myself in the past, but arcing arrow is clunky and fan of fire needs a tighter cone so that you aren't forced into melee range to get the most benefit of it.

    • Defy pain and last stand are still dead traits. I suggest having defy pain proc 5 seconds of retaliation (for synergy with spiked armor) and protection when dropping below 50% health on a 60 second cooldown. Other ideas could involve granting barrier instead of protection or keeping the stunbreak functionality. As for last stand, I think that lesser balanced stance should be replaced with reducing stance cooldowns by 20% while keeping the increased durations and vigor.

    Those are all good suggestions.

    • I disagree with your suggestion of speeding up impale, as I've not really had any difficulty landing it compared to rip, and if arms becomes viable it'll already get a faster cast from dual wielding. Instead, I think they should increase the duration of the impaled debuff to 6 seconds to allow a longer window to use rip, and/or decrease rip's cast time to 1/2 second.

    It's more for normalization with throw axe which is a 1/4s cast. I don't think we'd get a duration increase, but I can see reducing Rip's cast time as well.

    • For offhand mace, tremor shouldn't be counted as a projectile. It's already a slow-moving skill that can't traverse elevation or gaps in terrain, and the fact that it can be reflected just makes it even clunkier to use.

    It would be better if it hit 4 150x300 rectangles in a row. Each with a 5 target cap. Mace 4 also feels like it should be quicker, but you are right on that a better worked version of dual wielding may help that instead. Any thoughts on dual wielding or Arms specifically?

    Balancing dual wielding is probably a bit tricky since the main question is whether or not it should stack with quickness for +70% attack speed. At the very least, I think it should stack with the +15% attack speed from berserk mode since berserker is essentially warrior's condi elite spec. If stacking with quickness is a problem, it could also grant a 5-10% bonus to power/condition damage when you have quickness to cover that loss of functionality.

    Yeah, that is the tricky part. It needs something else to make it worth taking, although for it being in Arms it would have to be condi or critical hit related. How about critical hits while dual wielding provide quickness(3s 10s CD) and swiftness (3s 10s CD) in addition to the base attack speed increase?

    Burst precision should give a brief 100% crit chance buff after using a burst skill, similar to hidden killer in critical strikes. This would allow for greater synergy with the bloodlust minor and potentially help hybrid builds with their burst (e.g. guaranteed crit on final thrust after flurry).

    Glad to see someone else thinks the same way. I'll add this in and is solid reasoning for the trait to be reworked to better fit the traitline.

    The bonus bleed duration on bloodlust should be increased to +25% in competitive modes to reflect its status as a minor grandmaster (compare with barbed precision, the minor adept in curses that grants the same amount of bleed on crit and +20% bleed duration).

    It used to be 33% but it got nerfed prior in the Feb. patch, this is a great example of how unevenly their balance patch was done. I think what is more likely is that Barbed Precision gets nerfed to 15% rather than Bloodlust getting buffed.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dadnir.5038 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Dadnir.5038 said:
    Personally I think the devs need to work on CC. The game just wasn't designed for how stability work currently. Working on CC is bound to indirectly benefit all profession, but it's especially true for professions that tend to fight at melee range in PvP/WvW like the warrior.

    Balance need less emphasis on CC with large and long effect and more on the concept of "interrupting". To achieve this, the introduction of "CC duration/impact" mod is necessary and the reconversion of stability into a "-100% CC duration" mod no longer blocking the interrupt effect (and thus no longer a set number of block) would be, in my opinion a good option.

    All in all, interupting is good, CC chain isn't.

    Like perhaps converting some knockbacks into dazes and returning some of the damage?

    Well, yes and no. Let's say that it's an option on the short term but on the long term it's not going to do any good to the game to just turn knock back into daze. Daze in itself is still a "long duration CC" even if it's effect is less debilitating than a knock back. As for the damage, yes, I'm all for a return of some of them, the true issue was being locked in a chain of CC with stupidly long duration, not the damage received. (I always feel like ANet's devs miss the mark when they balance, the CC change is a good example of that)

    Well when I mentioned knockback -> daze I was meaning a 1/4s daze.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Added:

    • Kill Shot self root removal. Reasoning is the same as Flurry. I went ahead and added that in since I was adding to rifle. Self roots in general are suicide in a game where active defense is the main means of defense.
    • Added on Rifle 4 to have the evade moved to before the shot is fired.
    • Added Burst Precision change. I added a tiered effect based on Adrenaline bars spent. This will help differentiate core from the elite specs and keep said elite specs from over abusing the suggested change.
    • Added Tremor change. I did not propose how many or what size the AoE field(s) should be, that can be debated still, or be left up to the Devs.
    • Added Last Stand change.
    • Added Defy Pain change.

    Still debating:

    • Some knockbacks being changed to 1/4s daze and having some damage returned.
    • Dual Wielding changes. I may remove my suggestion on cast time decreases depending on how this plays out.

    Feedback is still welcome, be constructive and provide sound reasoning please.

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Added:

    • Kill Shot self root removal. Reasoning is the same as Flurry. I went ahead and added that in since I was adding to rifle. Self roots in general are suicide in a game where active defense is the main means of defense.

    Does it mean you advocate for removing self root on every skill in the game? Because otherwise this reasoning seems inconsistent and biased, just saying :p

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Added:

    • Kill Shot self root removal. Reasoning is the same as Flurry. I went ahead and added that in since I was adding to rifle. Self roots in general are suicide in a game where active defense is the main means of defense.

    Does it mean you advocate for removing self root on every skill in the game? Because otherwise this reasoning seems inconsistent and biased, just saying :p

    I do in fact. That kitten needs to go. In particular for anything channeled. A 1/4s self root is one thing a +1.5s self root is another. But sure get rid of them all.

  • Torqiseknite.1380Torqiseknite.1380 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Yeah, that is the tricky part. It needs something else to make it worth taking, although for it being in Arms it would have to be condi or critical hit related. How about critical hits while dual wielding provide quickness(3s 10s CD) and swiftness (3s 10s CD) in addition to the base attack speed increase?

    While thematic, I think this would overlap a bit too much with heightened focus in discipline for passive quickness uptime. Maybe it could grant 3 seconds of superspeed on a 15 second cd instead?

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Added:

    • Kill Shot self root removal. Reasoning is the same as Flurry. I went ahead and added that in since I was adding to rifle. Self roots in general are suicide in a game where active defense is the main means of defense.

    Does it mean you advocate for removing self root on every skill in the game? Because otherwise this reasoning seems inconsistent and biased, just saying :p

    I do in fact. That kitten needs to go. In particular for anything channeled. A 1/4s self root is one thing a +1.5s self root is another. But sure get rid of them all.

    If kill shot gets unrooted, it needs a more visible animation since the current one can be difficult to see. I'd also argue that self root on a skill like hundred blades is fine, because it's meant to require setup for a high risk/high reward burst, similar to eviscerate (which locks you into the leap animation). On the other hand, flurry is evidently intended to set itself up with immobilize, but that doesn't always work if you can't get opponents to stand still long enough to start casting it on them.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Torqiseknite.1380 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Yeah, that is the tricky part. It needs something else to make it worth taking, although for it being in Arms it would have to be condi or critical hit related. How about critical hits while dual wielding provide quickness(3s 10s CD) and swiftness (3s 10s CD) in addition to the base attack speed increase?

    While thematic, I think this would overlap a bit too much with heightened focus in discipline for passive quickness uptime. Maybe it could grant 3 seconds of superspeed on a 15 second cd instead?

    You are right on the conflict with Heightened Focus. Perhaps Dual Wielding should be +20% attack speed, gain 100 Power and Condition damage while dual wielding. Gain additional (+50) Power and Condition Damage while you have quickness or swiftness. So +100 Power +100 Condition damage, with a possible +200 total if you have quickness and swiftness, but only while dual wielding. This would help Sword/Sword condi builds over sword/torch, and help maximize Axe/Axe and dagger/dagger builds over x/Shield variants.

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Sobx.1758 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    Added:

    • Kill Shot self root removal. Reasoning is the same as Flurry. I went ahead and added that in since I was adding to rifle. Self roots in general are suicide in a game where active defense is the main means of defense.

    Does it mean you advocate for removing self root on every skill in the game? Because otherwise this reasoning seems inconsistent and biased, just saying :p

    I do in fact. That kitten needs to go. In particular for anything channeled. A 1/4s self root is one thing a +1.5s self root is another. But sure get rid of them all.

    If kill shot gets unrooted, it needs a more visible animation since the current one can be difficult to see. I'd also argue that self root on a skill like hundred blades is fine, because it's meant to require setup for a high risk/high reward burst, similar to eviscerate (which locks you into the leap animation). On the other hand, flurry is evidently intended to set itself up with immobilize, but that doesn't always work if you can't get opponents to stand still long enough to start casting it on them.

    I'd be fine with an animation change. Flurry and Kill Shot are two skills that really do not work well because of the self root. Hundred Blades itself does not function well either, you never get all the hits in, and as a result you'd be better off just auto attacking. But if I had to pick piece meal which skills to unroot first they would be Flurry, Kill Shot, and then maybe Hundred Blades. Hundred Blades may be fine if it remained as is but with a shorter channel time.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 28, 2020

    Offhand sword needs help as you noted. Defy Pain / Last Stand need their promised changes.

    Berserker (in general): a way to end Berserk manually, at a cost (for example lose all adrenaline) if it is to be remotely viable in PvP. Right now you can basically ignore berserkers and then full burst them when they're red tinged (berserk mode).

    Flames of War (Torch 5): add always removes chill

    "Fear Me!" : it's hard to recommend using this skill when the cooldown is double bull's charge , stomp, or kick. A reduction to 40-45 seconds would allow Vigorous Shouts to make it more competitive.

    (spellbreaker) Sight Beyond Sight: does anyone use this? An ammo reduction to 10-12s might be a step towards use but it is basically a niche skill vs blindness and stealth gyro / veil.

    Nothing for hammer? :(

    I guess you're focused more on PvP than WvW but unless you want warriors to be a support class blowing warhorns and using hammer for CC only , hammer needs some damage back on its weapon skills (maybe not the burst). I suspect Flurry roots you since it immobs unlike Flaming Flurry.

    Unless there's a way to remove banners from an opposing team it can be a potentially dangerous change to the game (i.e. breakbar).

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    Offhand sword needs help as you noted. Defy Pain / Last Stand need their promised changes.

    DP and LS seem to be in placeholder/temporarily deleted purgatory. The changes listed above may help them though.

    Berserker (in general): a way to end Berserk manually, at a cost (for example lose all adrenaline) if it is to be remotely viable in PvP. Right now you can basically ignore berserkers and then full burst them when they're red tinged (berserk mode).

    Lots of people have suggested this and I've yet to see a good reason to not include it.

    Flames of War (Torch 5): add always removes chill

    Certainly seems thematic right? Covering yourself in fire should remove chill. Should this reduce the number of total condi removed though?

    "Fear Me!" : it's hard to recommend using this skill when the cooldown is double bull's charge , stomp, or kick. A reduction to 40-45 seconds would allow Vigorous Shouts to make it more competitive.

    I see no problem with such a change. It is a little used skill as it is. do you have any other reasoning other than it stinks as is?

    (spellbreaker) Sight Beyond Sight: does anyone use this? An ammo reduction to 10-12s might be a step towards use but it is basically a niche skill vs blindness and stealth gyro / veil.

    That is its niche though. A range increase on the reveal may be the way to go to make it less of a niche skill.

    Nothing for hammer? :(

    I'm withholding my thoughts so that others can contribute, feel free to make suggestions.

    I guess you're focused more on PvP than WvW but unless you want warriors to be a support class blowing warhorns and using hammer for CC only , hammer needs some damage back on its weapon skills (maybe not the burst). I suspect Flurry roots you since it immobs unlike Flaming Flurry.

    My focus is on WvW, as I said I'm withholding a lot of my own ideas so that the whole community can come together on this rather than it coming off as my own personal wishlist. Feel free to suggest some hammer changes.

    If each strike of Flurry applied immob then the self root may be fine, but that is not how it works, and given how obnoxious Immob Druids are I don't think we want to go down that path. That and being able to move out of red circles that form at your feet during the channel would help it greatly.

    Unless there's a way to remove banners from an opposing team it can be a potentially dangerous change to the game (i.e. breakbar).

    No more dangerous that the give +100 XYZ stat to nearby allies traits that several classes have. A way to balance it would be to make it so that they cannot be perma maintained. 60s duration on a 70-90s CD (PvE/Comp) with Battle Standard keeping its current values?

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 28, 2020

    I think always removing chill would be fair for Flames of War. There's quite a lot of chill from grenades/mortar kit , power revenants and condi revs alike, necros, plus aura tempests. Given the state of berserker spec, it could be applied to all modes.

    Fear Me change would allow for more viable shouts on a tactics warrior. It would actually be a consideration rather than just overlooked for another hard CC (despite it being ranged). If people manage to get the multi target to add value , more power to them. It probably won't get changed for PvP , but in WvW if people have stability all you did was shave off one stack even if it is unblockable.

    The thing with Sight Beyond Sight is it can't even deal with blindness from engineer flashbang let alone the bomb /grenade/mortar , guardian GS #3 (leap of faith) or sword 2 (symbol of blades), Illusionary counter's Counterspell flip skill on mesmers, or blinding ashes / staff's lightning surge from elementalist. So ultimately it is going to be a reveal skill first and foremost.

    Hammer could probably add auto-attack level damage (0.8?) to Staggering Blow in WvW vs weakened targets since you can't follow up if they don't have stability , unlike with backbreaker/earthshaker. This probably won't happen because it's a PBAOE hard CC.

    Could also increase hammer shock damage to a more reasonable level (instead of 0.7, maybe 1.0 or 1.1) as it only cripples, but since it's a ranged cone attack maybe it isn't the ideal place to put damage.

    Add back base damage on fierce blow in WvW , 0.9 scaling instead of 0.77 base and keep 1.82 vs controlled (which is different than soft CC). It only functions to damage and apply weakness , which is highly likely to be cleansed or just ended due to 2s duration.

    I fully expect damage won't be added to hammer for PvP since weakness makes glancing blows (plural) so if two people are hitting each other the one with weakness application will sustain better (see daredevils).

    I'm not sure on how to balance banners for WvW, if you make them as strong as in PvE people will just run one or two banner per ten people. A CC bar check similar to dragon banner/centaur banner might help for this.

  • Smoosh.2718Smoosh.2718 Member ✭✭✭

    Hammer needs some utility to it, its currently a weapon which gives the user no sustain. Yes it has it's CC, however you can not use it to avoid inbound attacks.

    Hammer 4, rather than being a PBAOE, this should become an evasive side step and then a knockback (like the rangers sword). The knockback should effect all targets within 150 range of the attack in the forwards direction after the side step dodge. If this skill interupts the target, the target is then slowed for 3 seconds.

    An animation used should show the top of the hammer being slammed into the target, as if aiming to wind the target.

    This would allow the hammer to do its CC and allow a level of sustain through evasion/counterplay.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Smoosh.2718 said:
    Hammer needs some utility to it, its currently a weapon which gives the user no sustain. Yes it has it's CC, however you can not use it to avoid inbound attacks.

    Hammer 4, rather than being a PBAOE, this should become an evasive side step and then a knockback (like the rangers sword). The knockback should effect all targets within 150 range of the attack in the forwards direction after the side step dodge. If this skill interupts the target, the target is then slowed for 3 seconds.

    An animation used should show the top of the hammer being slammed into the target, as if aiming to wind the target.

    This would allow the hammer to do its CC and allow a level of sustain through evasion/counterplay.

    Is Staggering Blow the place for that though? Why not on Earthshaker? Come to think of it none of the core bursts have inherent sustain built into them. What are your thoughts on that?

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭

    also to that CMC statment "Warrior is pretty close to the ideal power level".

    TRUE that warrior is very close to be PLAYABLE in normal ranked.
    FALSE that warrior is still too far away from being one of the meta pick to be competing in tournaments.
    They already nerfed so many classes and builds for 5 months straight yet warrior is still trash, all the buffs to offhand sword/mace remain pointless
    at least two more meta without warrior to go before they finally reach warrior level in about 2021

    warrior has been unplayable in pvp
    for 6 months till now

    good job balance team

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @felix.2386 said:
    also to that CMC statment "Warrior is pretty close to the ideal power level".

    On paper he may be right, but in reality there are long running issues in the class, badly executed traits, outdated weapons, and clunky animations that keep this from being true, which is the entire purpose of this thread. To collect a repository of these issues, discuss and debate them amongst ourselves, and then share it in the threads CMC actually reads.

    TRUE that warrior is very close to be PLAYABLE in normal ranked.
    FALSE that warrior is still too far away from being one of the meta pick to be competing in tournaments.
    They already nerfed so many classes and builds for 5 months straight yet warrior is still trash, all the buffs to offhand sword/mace remain pointless
    at least two more meta without warrior to go before they finally reach warrior level in about 2021

    Their recent 'buffs' did miss the mark, which again the purpose of this thread is to collect appropriate ideas of what can and should be buffed so that Warrior is close to the ideal power level in practice. True there are things about other classes that NEED to be nerfed and some things that need tweaking/buffing, but I'd rather put Warrior directly into the place it needs to be, not just on paper but in execution, than to bring other classes down.

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 29, 2020

    Like sword was supposed to be the alternative of shield with half the cooldown.
    but in the end, it is too unreliable. the counter attack and sword 4's damage doesnt make up for the unreliable blocks.
    and the amount of endurance you gain from block canceling is insignificant

    and tbh all of the offhand are too similar..not even a single movement skills yet has the most off hand in the entire class roster
    i've swapped with OH axe/mace/sword..they all play pretty much the same...all of them are stationary melee range damage dealers..with very minor tweet..i'm sure same goes for OH dagger which is just a inferior version of axe.

    tho i think warrior is pretty much playable with minor MMR buff...but we would like to see more play style...we would like to see skill changes...
    and spellbreaker is still the only warrior spec that has a chance in the high end and berserker is still completely trash because starting from traits berserker is already bad..too passive, too limited..

    warrior has been unplayable in pvp
    for 6 months till now

    good job balance team

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @felix.2386 said:
    Like sword was supposed to be the alternative of shield with half the cooldown.
    but in the end, it is too unreliable. the counter attack and sword 4's damage doesnt make up for the unreliable blocks.
    and the amount of endurance you gain from block canceling is insignificant

    True story.

    and tbh all of the offhand are too similar..not even a single movement skills yet has the most off hand in the entire class roster
    i've swapped with OH axe/mace/sword..they all play pretty much the same...all of them are stationary melee range damage dealers..with very minor tweet..i'm sure same goes for OH dagger which is just a inferior version of axe.

    Feel free to make suggestions.

    tho i think warrior is pretty much playable with minor MMR buff...but we would like to see more play style...we would like to see skill changes...

    I think MMR should be at 90 hp per might personally. They over nerfed it when they nerfed sustain across the board.

    and spellbreaker is still the only warrior spec that has a chance in the high end and berserker is still completely trash because starting from traits berserker is already bad..too passive, too limited..

    Again, feel free to contribute what you think would make Berserker better.

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 29, 2020

    I would make suggestion for berserker, but berserker from the ground up it's just bad..
    from the mechanics to traits to utility...there's nothing worth using in the entire sets...
    none of those utilities are worth using by themselves...even in pve it's used to increase berserker duration only...so people can do more damage with all the passive damage buff from berserker traits..
    and the entire trait lines are all too passive, there's 0 thought for pvp..it's just a lazy pve spec..

    and for off hands..it's easy just add like a ranger dagger evade movement to sword or something
    like give rip the evade movement with 200 range or something..your sword 4 has to land in order to trigger the evade skill..
    mace 5 needs to be AoE thats not projectile.

    and offhand dagger is just sad, axe 4 does more damage then dagger 4 without condition, and dagger 4 without triggering condition does less then a mobility skill..
    and axe 5 does double the damage of dagger 5 PER HIT with less cooldown..only without projectil reflect which is kinda meh tbh...
    just delete dagger 5 and give something like mobility, like a backward evade like on rifle 4 but without cast time...
    dagger 4 needs to be like revenant sword 2.

    really anything goes there are plenty of things they can do with offhand, the only thing stopping anet is their limitation for warrior..

    ALSO Heightened Focus, 2 seconds of quickness with 15 second that only proc when you hit 50% hp below enemy...really?..cooldown needs to be 10 second and quickness needs to be 3 second+

    look at sun and moon style, 2 seconds of quickness when you interrupt enemy with 5 second cooldown...like come on..

    warrior has been unplayable in pvp
    for 6 months till now

    good job balance team

  • Mack.3045Mack.3045 Member ✭✭✭

    Thanks for putting this together @Lan Deathrider.5910

    I'll get back to you with some suggestions.

  • DKRathalos.9625DKRathalos.9625 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 30, 2020

    I just don't want any self root on warrior skill/burst I mean I don't think any other class has self root (so far I know, feel free to correct me) skill why warrior gotta have it? Banner changes are nice too.

    Edit, I forgot to mention.
    Greatsword
    Hundred Blades : remove self root, reduce cast time or rework it.

    Mace
    Increase speed for autoattack
    Tremor: I'd rather tremor have a cone AoE like hammer 3 but that's up to dev again.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DKRathalos.9625 said:
    I just don't want any self root on warrior skill/burst I mean I don't think any other class has self root (so far I know, feel free to correct me) skill why warrior gotta have it? Banner changes are nice too.

    Edit, I forgot to mention.
    Greatsword
    Hundred Blades : remove self root, reduce cast time or rework it.

    I was waiting for someone else to bring this up ty. Here I think that They'd probably have to rework the entire animation to unroot it, which may or may not be too heavy of a lift. If they simply cannot remove the self root due to programming issues/lack of engineering resources then I think reducing the channel time to 2.5s would be sufficient. If you cant get that last hit in, you where better off auto attacking, so as is right not the skill is too high risk for too little reward. At least reducing the channel time gives more of a chance to get that last hit in to make the skill worth using. What do you think?

    Mace
    Increase speed for autoattack

    Hmmm... Its more of the last hit that is still slow right? Or do you mean all of it?

    Tremor: I'd rather tremor have a cone AoE like hammer 3 but that's up to dev again.

    What about the cascading field mentioned above? That would keep the current animation in place, just change the implementation of it.

  • Acyk.9671Acyk.9671 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 30, 2020

    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

  • Smoosh.2718Smoosh.2718 Member ✭✭✭

    @DKRathalos.9625 said:
    I just don't want any self root on warrior skill/burst I mean I don't think any other class has self root (so far I know, feel free to correct me) skill why warrior gotta have it?

    Other classes do self root as well, however they have defences attached to them, like distortion, evade or reflect.
    I would like to include the ele's fire 5 skill... however they can use a teleport to take them out of harms way while in mid cast.

    Warrior is too static in a highly mobile meta.

    Each weapon needs a utility.

    Sword 5, change this to a flip skill, block an attack gain access to a leap attack.
    Mace 5, change this to cone AOE ( as has been mentioned before) multiple target knockdown. no longer a projectile.
    Dagger 5, change this to provide a boon rip.
    Mace f1, provide leap like the berzerker skill. The current Mace F1 will not work with the current meta.
    Rifle, change to shotgun. a mid range AOE weapon designed to do higher damage the closer the target is. ( it makes no sense that we have two ranged weapons currently that almost do the same thing. Yes you can argue that the bow is condi and the rifle is power. However the rifle is too clunky and very boring to actually use.
    Hammer 4, change this to become an evasion CC (as i have stated above).
    Warhorn 4, change this skill to provide superspeed.
    Warhorn 5, change this skill to also provide protection.

    Numbers alone will not balance the boards. Actual redesigns of some of the weapons / skills will need to be done to both make the play more fluidly and provide something useful to the scene.

    Aftercasts... Why are they still a thing? If you run Sword and Dagger, try to press 4 then 3, then watch the huge delay you get most of the time before skill activation. I have had these skills fail me in WvW which would have got a kill but instead it let the other player simply walk out of range due a skill delay. Axe on the other hand is a very smooth weapon, the skills roll into the next without this painful pre/aftercast which both dagger offhand and Sword mainhand suffer from. I would love to comment on Mace offhand... However number tweaks alone will not make this a viable weapon.

  • DKRathalos.9625DKRathalos.9625 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    I was waiting for someone else to bring this up ty. Here I think that They'd probably have to rework the entire animation to unroot it, which may or may not be too heavy of a lift. If they simply cannot remove the self root due to programming issues/lack of engineering resources then I think reducing the channel time to 2.5s would be sufficient. If you cant get that last hit in, you where better off auto attacking, so as is right not the skill is too high risk for too little reward. At least reducing the channel time gives more of a chance to get that last hit in to make the skill worth using. What do you think?

    If the self root too complicated to be removed then yeah make it reduce channel time, it's crazy slow and people also complained they can revive people through hundred blades, it's supposed to be the super hard hitting move from GS.

    Hmmm... Its more of the last hit that is still slow right? Or do you mean all of it?

    I mean the autoattack chain.

    What about the cascading field mentioned above? That would keep the current animation in place, just change the implementation of it.

    Cascading field as in like CoR? hmmm I prefer kind of instant like hammer 3, so when we go to melee just aim the cone and we will be good. I mean with the current setting of wvw it's not like CC deals damage anyway so at least give it easy way to apply.

    @Smoosh.2718 said:
    Other classes do self root as well, however they have defences attached to them, like distortion, evade or reflect.
    I would like to include the ele's fire 5 skill... however they can use a teleport to take them out of harms way while in mid cast.

    OH yeah Smoosh you are correct, Mesmer Sword 2 is also self root but evade for the entire duration, good mention!

    Rifle, change to shotgun. a mid range AOE weapon designed to do higher damage the closer the target is. ( it makes no sense that we have two ranged weapons currently that almost do the same thing. Yes you can argue that the bow is condi and the rifle is power. However the rifle is too clunky and very boring to actually use.

    Hmmmm not really using rifle too much so I kind of neutral here but I agree with rifle kind of boring.

    Warhorn 4, change this skill to provide superspeed.
    Warhorn 5, change this skill to also provide protection.

    Warhorn 4 superspeed? it's nice but remove swiftness from it? since those 2 overlap maybe not good.
    Warhorn 5, I'd rather it provide stability like 2-3 stacks than protection. Warrior could use something to give stability aoe, what do you think?

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Acyk.9671 said:
    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Do you think via a trait, like Pulminary Impact or possibly by reworking Body Blow?

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

    Fatal Frenzy's toughness hit is stiff considering we lost core F1s as well. EITHER would have been enough of a tradeoff.
    I vote to just begone with the toughness penalty.

    I also suggest changing Burst of Aggression so that the quickness and super speed are refreshed when you hit with a Primal Burst.

    These two changes would go a long way in helping Berserker, but am not sure what else it may need.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DKRathalos.9625 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    I was waiting for someone else to bring this up ty. Here I think that They'd probably have to rework the entire animation to unroot it, which may or may not be too heavy of a lift. If they simply cannot remove the self root due to programming issues/lack of engineering resources then I think reducing the channel time to 2.5s would be sufficient. If you cant get that last hit in, you where better off auto attacking, so as is right not the skill is too high risk for too little reward. At least reducing the channel time gives more of a chance to get that last hit in to make the skill worth using. What do you think?

    If the self root too complicated to be removed then yeah make it reduce channel time, it's crazy slow and people also complained they can revive people through hundred blades, it's supposed to be the super hard hitting move from GS.

    Yeah, my preference would be for the self root to be gone, but I highly suspect that the animation is holding that back. A 2.5s channel time or a flipover skill that executes the final strike early along with some other benefit would work as well.

    Hmmm... Its more of the last hit that is still slow right? Or do you mean all of it?

    I mean the autoattack chain.

    Hmm.. The whole things takes 2.9s considering aftercasts. That really is too slow for a one handed weapon, the Hammer AA chain is faster! What about 0.5s/-/0.5s? With aftercasts it should be similar to the sword AA chain in speed.

    What about the cascading field mentioned above? That would keep the current animation in place, just change the implementation of it.

    Cascading field as in like CoR? hmmm I prefer kind of instant like hammer 3, so when we go to melee just aim the cone and we will be good. I mean with the current setting of wvw it's not like CC deals damage anyway so at least give it easy way to apply.

    Alright, several people have mentioned a cone instead, something like 600 range like Hammer Shock? That is a reduction in half the range. Why not 900?

    @Smoosh.2718 said:
    Other classes do self root as well, however they have defences attached to them, like distortion, evade or reflect.
    I would like to include the ele's fire 5 skill... however they can use a teleport to take them out of harms way while in mid cast.

    OH yeah Smoosh you are correct, Mesmer Sword 2 is also self root but evade for the entire duration, good mention!

    We could blow Endure Pain during the channel, but thinks like Mesmer Sword 2 have the built in sustain. Just more justification to rework 100B.

    Rifle, change to shotgun. a mid range AOE weapon designed to do higher damage the closer the target is. ( it makes no sense that we have two ranged weapons currently that almost do the same thing. Yes you can argue that the bow is condi and the rifle is power. However the rifle is too clunky and very boring to actually use.

    Hmmmm not really using rifle too much so I kind of neutral here but I agree with rifle kind of boring.

    I'm not really for a shotgun approach myself, personally I think AA, Rifle 2, and Rifle 4 need a ~20-25% dps boost and for rifle 4 to evade prior to the shot. That and since they JUST reworked rifle I don't think they would turn it into a shotgun at this point.

    Warhorn 4, change this skill to provide superspeed.
    Warhorn 5, change this skill to also provide protection.

    Warhorn 4 superspeed? it's nice but remove swiftness from it? since those 2 overlap maybe not good.
    Warhorn 5, I'd rather it provide stability like 2-3 stacks than protection. Warrior could use something to give stability aoe, what do you think?

    I don't think Warhorn needs more buffing at this point. I'd rather Roaring Reveille have given different boons than what they gave.

  • Acyk.9671Acyk.9671 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 30, 2020

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:
    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Do you think via a trait, like Pulminary Impact or possibly by reworking Body Blow?

    If you add that to traits you are even more enforcing a playstyle on you character, E specs and trade offs already do that to an extreme. And this affects every classes, not just warrior.
    But if you were to reintroduce blank damage through traits, Body Blow or weapon's traits like Merciless hammer and Sundering Mace would be the solution. Especially since those traits are never played. Merciless hammer is even more useless now... Maces need a rework though.

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

    Fatal Frenzy's toughness hit is stiff considering we lost core F1s as well. EITHER would have been enough of a tradeoff.
    I vote to just begone with the toughness penalty.

    I also suggest changing Burst of Aggression so that the quickness and super speed are refreshed when you hit with a Primal Burst.

    These two changes would go a long way in helping Berserker, but am not sure what else it may need.

    Honestly, i don't think berserker needs much more. Anet made it too much of a glass canon imo to make it competitive. It already does a fair amount of damage, it is just crippled by a lack of self sustain.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Acyk.9671 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:
    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Do you think via a trait, like Pulminary Impact or possibly by reworking Body Blow?

    If you add that to traits you are even more enforcing a playstyle on you character, E specs and trade offs already do that to an extreme. And this affects every classes, not just warrior.
    But if you were to reintroduce blank damage through traits, Body Blow or weapon's traits like Merciless hammer and Sundering Mace would be the solution. Especially since those traits are never played. Merciless hammer is even more useless now... Maces need a rework though.

    Well this is up to Anet owning up to no damage CCs being a mistake. I think we'd have more success getting additional effects via traits than getting straight damage back.

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

    Fatal Frenzy's toughness hit is stiff considering we lost core F1s as well. EITHER would have been enough of a tradeoff.
    I vote to just begone with the toughness penalty.

    I also suggest changing Burst of Aggression so that the quickness and super speed are refreshed when you hit with a Primal Burst.

    These two changes would go a long way in helping Berserker, but am not sure what else it may need.

    Honestly, i don't think berserker needs much more. Anet made it too much of a glass canon imo to make it competitive. It already does a fair amount of damage, it is just crippled by a lack of self sustain.

    Well removing the toughness penalty would help its sustain and might actually make it more viable don't you think?

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 30, 2020

    Berserker's primary problem is that it lacks might generation, which makes it so it can't be played with MMR which is crucial for damage/sustain being dps warrior in pvp.
    picking defense heavily limits berserker's damage potential as berserker doesnt do enough power damage to begin with..

    and that spellbreaker with strength actually out sustain berserker with defense is also quiet funny..

    there's really nothing going on for berserker that's suited for competitive pvp..core war is only slightly better.
    as long as berserker can't self cancel berserk, it will not be competitively played unless extremely overbuffed

    i suggest remove primal burst cooldown all together like axe and make berserk mode consume adrenaline overtime with 8 second cooldown going out of berserk mode.
    and then can make traits based on adrenaline level or pulse might during berserk mode or w/e

    warrior has been unplayable in pvp
    for 6 months till now

    good job balance team

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭

    also spellbreaker's primary problem is that, any weapon that has damage scaling with adrenaline tiers doesnt work with spellbreaker, only greatsword and dagger
    because these two doesnt have scaling problem and that tier 1 does decent damage.

    killshot on spellbreaker does the 1.5k non crit on heavy golem...that's the same as shrapnel grenade does 1.5k non crit on heavy golem..
    that's how bad it is.
    literally all f1 tier 1 burst skill except dagger and greatsword are not worth using, thus not worth using with spellbreaker

    warrior has been unplayable in pvp
    for 6 months till now

    good job balance team

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @felix.2386 said:
    Berserker's primary problem is that it lacks might generation, which makes it so it can't be played with MMR which is crucial for damage/sustain being dps warrior in pvp.
    picking defense heavily limits berserker's damage potential as berserker doesnt do enough power damage to begin with..

    Well it does have might generation via Eternal Champion, but you cant take that and get more damage.

    and that spellbreaker with strength actually out sustain berserker with defense is also quiet funny..

    That's more to Defense being bad now though, Strength still fuels a large amount of might generation.

    there's really nothing going on for berserker that's suited for competitive pvp..core war is only slightly better.
    as long as berserker can't self cancel berserk, it will not be competitively played unless extremely overbuffed

    Again, self cancel is one of the main change requests for the spec.

    i suggest remove primal burst cooldown all together like axe and make berserk mode consume adrenaline overtime with 8 second cooldown going out of berserk mode.
    and then can make traits based on adrenaline level or pulse might during berserk mode or w/e

    You'd then have MemeFlane and MemeDivider being spammed continuously, which would not be a good thing. Perhaps make Primal Bursts not consume adrenaline bars at all, but instead just have their CD. Adrenaline decays by 1 strike per second , you begin with 30 Strikes, Smash Brawler adds 5 points to the total and all the rage skills that add in duration instead add that many strikes of adrenaline, in or out of BMode. Have a F2 to exit early, but consume all Adrenaline to do so.

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @felix.2386 said:
    also spellbreaker's primary problem is that, any weapon that has damage scaling with adrenaline tiers doesnt work with spellbreaker, only greatsword and dagger
    because these two doesnt have scaling problem and that tier 1 does decent damage.

    killshot on spellbreaker does the 1.5k non crit on heavy golem...that's the same as shrapnel grenade does 1.5k non crit on heavy golem..
    that's how bad it is.
    literally all f1 tier 1 burst skill except dagger and greatsword are not worth using, thus not worth using with spellbreaker

    Well, that is the drawback of the e-spec. Anet won't change that one. As opposed to Berserker which has several very stiff drawbacks to it.

  • Acyk.9671Acyk.9671 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:
    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Do you think via a trait, like Pulminary Impact or possibly by reworking Body Blow?

    If you add that to traits you are even more enforcing a playstyle on you character, E specs and trade offs already do that to an extreme. And this affects every classes, not just warrior.
    But if you were to reintroduce blank damage through traits, Body Blow or weapon's traits like Merciless hammer and Sundering Mace would be the solution. Especially since those traits are never played. Merciless hammer is even more useless now... Maces need a rework though.

    Well this is up to Anet owning up to no damage CCs being a mistake. I think we'd have more success getting additional effects via traits than getting straight damage back.

    True.

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

    Fatal Frenzy's toughness hit is stiff considering we lost core F1s as well. EITHER would have been enough of a tradeoff.
    I vote to just begone with the toughness penalty.

    I also suggest changing Burst of Aggression so that the quickness and super speed are refreshed when you hit with a Primal Burst.

    These two changes would go a long way in helping Berserker, but am not sure what else it may need.

    Honestly, i don't think berserker needs much more. Anet made it too much of a glass canon imo to make it competitive. It already does a fair amount of damage, it is just crippled by a lack of self sustain.

    Well removing the toughness penalty would help its sustain and might actually make it more viable don't you think?

    yes, at least reducing it. Another thing is for melee gameplay to be more viable in WvW but that means nerfing other classes and probably WoD.
    Head Butt also need an improvement or rework but coming from WvW i like banner. Any other improvement/balance should come from core trait lines imo

  • Lan Deathrider.5910Lan Deathrider.5910 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Acyk.9671 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

    @Acyk.9671 said:
    I would like for Anet to bring back non crit damage on CC skills. There is too much of a split between damage weapons and cc weapons now which affects builds and gears in a binary way in WvW: minstrel or marauder.

    Do you think via a trait, like Pulminary Impact or possibly by reworking Body Blow?

    If you add that to traits you are even more enforcing a playstyle on you character, E specs and trade offs already do that to an extreme. And this affects every classes, not just warrior.
    But if you were to reintroduce blank damage through traits, Body Blow or weapon's traits like Merciless hammer and Sundering Mace would be the solution. Especially since those traits are never played. Merciless hammer is even more useless now... Maces need a rework though.

    Well this is up to Anet owning up to no damage CCs being a mistake. I think we'd have more success getting additional effects via traits than getting straight damage back.

    True.

    Also reduce the trade off (fatal frenzy) on berserker in competitive game modes, -300 toughness alone makes berserker nonviable and +300 power/condi is not really needed. +/-150 should be enough.

    Adding few stats in PvE/WvW from PvP amulets would also improve warrior's build diversity.

    Fatal Frenzy's toughness hit is stiff considering we lost core F1s as well. EITHER would have been enough of a tradeoff.
    I vote to just begone with the toughness penalty.

    I also suggest changing Burst of Aggression so that the quickness and super speed are refreshed when you hit with a Primal Burst.

    These two changes would go a long way in helping Berserker, but am not sure what else it may need.

    Honestly, i don't think berserker needs much more. Anet made it too much of a glass canon imo to make it competitive. It already does a fair amount of damage, it is just crippled by a lack of self sustain.

    Well removing the toughness penalty would help its sustain and might actually make it more viable don't you think?

    yes, at least reducing it. Another thing is for melee gameplay to be more viable in WvW but that means nerfing other classes and probably WoD.
    Head Butt also need an improvement or rework but coming from WvW i like banner. Any other improvement/balance should come from core trait lines imo

    Warrior in general just needs the tools to dive bomb in WvW. Head Butt could be faster I suppose. Despite have some range it is easiest to hit at point blank range. With the no dmg on CC thing though they need to rework what it does, again.

    You are right that most of the improvements that need to happen are within the core traits and weapons, but Berserker specifically needs some attention, see the above comments with @felix.2386.