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  • Psientist.6437Psientist.6437 Member ✭✭✭

    If the slug had a big honking nose maybe...
    Why does Jormag have a big nose?!?

    weathering's everything

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Here's what I see, when I see Jormag's big wrinkly nose:
    77526030e97a104e53cac27a7e39a5ed--halloween-movies-disney-halloween.jpg

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  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I think it looked weird and especially so in profile. It hasn't translated well from the excellent trailer pic to the actual model

    Hopefully it'll get some updates to make it look better by the time it reappears.

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Eekasqueak.7850Eekasqueak.7850 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The "nose" gives me goblin shark vibes.

  • Scraggy.3814Scraggy.3814 Member ✭✭

    Personally I think Jormag look really cool, regarding the “nose” I feel like the developers were trying to give them a more stereotypical dragon like appearance, at least in the face, typical dragons have long mouths/snouts moving forward away from their face, with the other dragons, their faces were a lot shorter, with Zhaitan and Mordy being kinda undragony and more monstery, Kralkatorrik’s face screamed dragon, but it was sharp/blocky and fairly short. I like the new direction they’re heading in with Jormag, their face is less defined and kinda featureless, pertaining to Jormag being genderless. TLDR: I like the look, and the new direction the developers are headed in.

  • Fenom.9457Fenom.9457 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Lol I hadn’t noticed anything was up with the nose, now it’ll be hard to unsee. I like the dual sets of horns.. tusks? Fangs?

    A little sad we couldn’t see a gap where the tooth is missing but it’s not like we stopped to inspect his mouth, we’re not its dentist. Do hope they didn’t forget that and either show it or mention that its look has changed in the last few years

    I'd rather keep going.. wherever the wind takes us

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The nose definitely is based on Witches of the Harz (location in Germany), especially around the Brocken/Blocksberg (the mountain most infamous for witches).
    Cartoon witches usually are based on that same witch design as well.
    Goblin sharks could also be an inspiration.

    I don't think it should have horns and tusks though.
    They seem to make it harder for her to swim through ice.

  • Psientist.6437Psientist.6437 Member ✭✭✭

    If I were mean I would go with a cross between cliche male pauldrons and the Honkers from Sesame Street. Since I am not mean....
    I don't think the designers were trying to emulate anything but instead, became enamored by the side horns and that pushed them in a direction. Without the muzzle horn, it obviously isn't a nose, don't imagine water dripping from the nose because it clearly is a muzzle horn and not a nose, the overall shape of the head with side horns flattens and doesn't resemble a dragon. Without the side horns, Jormag has a long enough muzzle to look like a dragon but with the side horns they do need a muzzle horn.

    weathering's everything

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

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  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

    Which could attribute to Aesgeir smashing the tusk and causing other pieces of it to shatter. It seems pretty kitten safe to say that’s where the tooth is from. I mean yeah it’s a tusk, which technically an elongated tooth anyways.

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Scraggy.3814 said:
    Personally I think Jormag look really cool, regarding the “nose” I feel like the developers were trying to give them a more stereotypical dragon like appearance, at least in the face, typical dragons have long mouths/snouts moving forward away from their face, with the other dragons, their faces were a lot shorter, with Zhaitan and Mordy being kinda undragony and more monstery, Kralkatorrik’s face screamed dragon, but it was sharp/blocky and fairly short. I like the new direction they’re heading in with Jormag, their face is less defined and kinda featureless, pertaining to Jormag being genderless. TLDR: I like the look, and the new direction the developers are headed in.

    Zhaitan was very draconic. Probably the most "typical" dragon of the lot so far. The thing is his lower jaw is completely gone with a slew of dragon heads and necks emerging from where it should be.

    Mordremoth is more of an Eastern Dragon style.

    Though I will say I do like that each Elder dragon is distinct and unique from each other.

  • Daniel Handler.4816Daniel Handler.4816 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

    Which could attribute to Aesgeir smashing the tusk and causing other pieces of it to shatter. It seems pretty kitten safe to say that’s where the tooth is from. I mean yeah it’s a tusk, which technically an elongated tooth anyways.

    Doesn't the fang in hoelbrak have its gum line? That implies a whole tooth was knocked out. Not the tip of another.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 31, 2020

    @Daniel Handler.4816 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

    Which could attribute to Aesgeir smashing the tusk and causing other pieces of it to shatter. It seems pretty kitten safe to say that’s where the tooth is from. I mean yeah it’s a tusk, which technically an elongated tooth anyways.

    Doesn't the fang in hoelbrak have its gum line? That implies a whole tooth was knocked out. Not the tip of another.

    Yeah the colour of the “gum” is similar to the rest of the colour of the tusk. Perhaps being struck by Aesgeir weapon peeled back some of the ice and exposed the lighter coloured tooth.

    Will probably be explained in the guild chat today.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Daniel Handler.4816 said:

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

    Which could attribute to Aesgeir smashing the tusk and causing other pieces of it to shatter. It seems pretty kitten safe to say that’s where the tooth is from. I mean yeah it’s a tusk, which technically an elongated tooth anyways.

    Doesn't the fang in hoelbrak have its gum line? That implies a whole tooth was knocked out. Not the tip of another.

    Yeah the colour of the “gum” is similar to the rest of the colour of the tusk. Perhaps being struck by Aesgeir weapon peeled back some of the ice and exposed the lighter coloured tooth.

    Will probably be explained in the guild chat today.

    My interpretation is that they're redesigning the "gum" to be a scab that formed when the tooth was broken.

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  • Micky.3648Micky.3648 Member ✭✭
    edited August 1, 2020

    The Fang of the Serpent is clearly a TOOTH not a tusk, they just simply changed the design, this is not the first time and won't be the last, there is nothing wrong about that. its funny to see all of you trying to reinterpret the obvious.

    If we really want to get an answer in lore. better to say the magic he absorbed changes his appearance, just like Primordus. rather than lying to yourself to say the tooth does fit.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 1, 2020

    @Micky.3648 said:
    The Fang of the Serpent is clearly a TOOTH not a tusk, they just simply changed the design, this is not the first time and won't be the last, there is nothing wrong about that. its funny to see all of you trying to reinterpret the obvious.

    If we really want to get an answer in lore. better to say the magic he absorbed changes his appearance, just like Primordus. rather than lying to yourself to say the tooth does fit.

    I don't think anyone has denied that the design has been changed, but it is true that they made the still-whole tusk match the size and general shape of the Fang of the Serpent, so it does fit. Just not perfectly.

    Also, Primordus' appearance change has never been canonically attributed to the magic it absorbed, or even be canonically recognized, as nearly everything had changed appearances between GW1 and GW2. Either minorly, like charr losing their shoulder spikes, or majorly, like hydras going from three-headed T-Rexes to becomingthree-headed cobra quadrupeds.

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  • Sykper.6583Sykper.6583 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 2, 2020

    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

  • Sajuuk Khar.1509Sajuuk Khar.1509 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2, 2020

    @Micky.3648 said:
    The Fang of the Serpent is clearly a TOOTH not a tusk,

    A TUSK IS A TOOTH.

    Why do people not know this!

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

    @Micky.3648 said:
    The Fang of the Serpent is clearly a TOOTH not a tusk,

    A TUSK IS A TOOTH.

    Why do people not know this!

    I mean even when you look at Jormag’s in game model, his left tusk is clearly damage and is very reminiscent of the fang of the serpent. This seems like a no brainer to me. I was hoping the devs on the guild chat would just confirm as this appears to be the simplest explanation.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Seeing Jormag's model outside of the game, the nose looks much better - I guess perspective really warped its appearance:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738075333265326140/SPOILER_utBi35lu.jpg
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738092134368018522/SPOILER_jormag_tooth.png
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309191637144436739/738093253668110366/SPOILER_slim.png

    Also the Fang of the Serpent is very clearly the upcurved tusk. Doesn't fit perfectly (slightly wider base, different texture design), but it fits very, very well.

    Any indications of size comparison between Jormag and other ED's from the model?

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Randulf.7614 said:
    Any indications of size comparison between Jormag and other ED's from the model?

    Unfortunately for some reason, gw2browser isn't cooperating with me anymore (it crashes whenever I try to open up any model), and I've seen no comparisons made by Vyko or That_shaman. Yet.

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  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    No worries, I’ll keep an eye out for one

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Sykper.6583 said:
    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

    I mean, let's look at Aurene as an example of this.

    First she appeared pretty flat-faced, sharing many traits with Mordremoth facially wise, alongside a squat body. When she absorbed Balthazar she grew a fair bit, her facial structure changing. As she got more power she grew more crystals/glowed.

    When she ascended to Elder Dragon status, her entire skull shape changed drastically again.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:

    @Sykper.6583 said:
    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

    I mean, let's look at Aurene as an example of this.

    First she appeared pretty flat-faced, sharing many traits with Mordremoth facially wise, alongside a squat body. When she absorbed Balthazar she grew a fair bit, her facial structure changing. As she got more power she grew more crystals/glowed.

    When she ascended to Elder Dragon status, her entire skull shape changed drastically again.

    Counter argument: Aurene was growing from baby to adult, the Elder Dragons are all fully-grown.

    While it certainly is plausible that the Elder Dragons could evolve over 200 years (or 250 years for Primordus), Aurene's not a good example because her appearances are part of her puberty, whereas the Elder Dragons are all full grown adults.

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  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:

    @Sykper.6583 said:
    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

    I mean, let's look at Aurene as an example of this.

    First she appeared pretty flat-faced, sharing many traits with Mordremoth facially wise, alongside a squat body. When she absorbed Balthazar she grew a fair bit, her facial structure changing. As she got more power she grew more crystals/glowed.

    When she ascended to Elder Dragon status, her entire skull shape changed drastically again.

    We also see Kralkatorrik absorb a bunch of energy from Balthazar and change very little in his appearance too though.

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tyson.5160 said:

    @Kalavier.1097 said:

    @Sykper.6583 said:
    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

    I mean, let's look at Aurene as an example of this.

    First she appeared pretty flat-faced, sharing many traits with Mordremoth facially wise, alongside a squat body. When she absorbed Balthazar she grew a fair bit, her facial structure changing. As she got more power she grew more crystals/glowed.

    When she ascended to Elder Dragon status, her entire skull shape changed drastically again.

    We also see Kralkatorrik absorb a bunch of energy from Balthazar and change very little in his appearance too though.

    Depending how you view the model swaps (storm form Kralk vs physical form kralk). Of course, Kralk got less of Balthazar then Aurene did, or it was split evenly. Kralk already had huge amounts of magic.

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @Kalavier.1097 said:

    @Sykper.6583 said:
    It might be weird for me to say, but is it really odd that Elder Dragons might appear differently over time? Perhaps Jormag did originally have teeth and not tusks but opted to grow the tusks, one of which was his broken tooth as a show of strength to recover from whatever efforts Aesgeir did back then, to show they were fruitless.

    Elder Dragons are powerful, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they could alter their appearance, especially out of spite.

    I mean, let's look at Aurene as an example of this.

    First she appeared pretty flat-faced, sharing many traits with Mordremoth facially wise, alongside a squat body. When she absorbed Balthazar she grew a fair bit, her facial structure changing. As she got more power she grew more crystals/glowed.

    When she ascended to Elder Dragon status, her entire skull shape changed drastically again.

    Counter argument: Aurene was growing from baby to adult, the Elder Dragons are all fully-grown.

    While it certainly is plausible that the Elder Dragons could evolve over 200 years (or 250 years for Primordus), Aurene's not a good example because her appearances are part of her puberty, whereas the Elder Dragons are all full grown adults.

    While true I suppose, Vlast as a child shared many traits with Glint, even though his adult form was different. Though we know that Glint was transformed into what she was at some point and was once flesh and blood.

  • Sykper.6583Sykper.6583 Member ✭✭✭

    I'm more thinking of EDs changing their forms out of practicality or personal motive.

    Primmy I think is a good example, from GW1 to GW2 his appearance changed to something far more bloated and massive, at least his face indicates he went through an eating phase. But he's been dormant mostly, so I assume his appearance changed for practicality, growing massive for storing more Magic.

    I don't think Aurene is a good example right now of appearance changes, her appearance might be the more natural growth of an ED. Who knows, maybe down the line she changes forms to fit the occasion.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Depending how you view the model swaps (storm form Kralk vs physical form kralk). Of course, Kralk got less of Balthazar then Aurene did, or it was split evenly. Kralk already had huge amounts of magic.

    He had the same model from PoF in A Star to Guide Us, well after he not only absorbed Balthazar's magic, but got accustomed to it.

    Also? Kralkatorrik got more of Balthazar than Aurene. Aurene only absorbed magic in the epicenter of the storm which raged across Vabbi, and Kralkatorrik absorbed everything else.

    While true I suppose, Vlast as a child shared many traits with Glint, even though his adult form was different. Though we know that Glint was transformed into what she was at some point and was once flesh and blood.

    That's a poor comparison. Eye of the North cut a lot of corners when it came to new models. Vlast being a literal shrunken Glint is one of them. Vlast didn't just "share many traits with Glint", it was the exact same model, just smaller.

    Besides (and this goes to @Sykper.6583 too with the Primordus model comparison), there's often drastic model design changes between the two games. Most prime example being hydras - from this:
    Hydra_%28Crystal_Desert%29.jpg

    To this:
    Veteran_Fire_Hydra.jpg

    And it's nothing more than a design change, a retcon if you will, and not an actual mutation or evolution.

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  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    Well, we have elements of both aspects happening within GW2. For example, Drakkar is explicitly referenced as changing from the frozen GW1 form to the form he appears as in GW2.

  • Tyson.5160Tyson.5160 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Well, we have elements of both aspects happening within GW2. For example, Drakkar is explicitly referenced as changing from the frozen GW1 form to the form he appears as in GW2.

    I would say that it’s a slight different situation as it’s a dragon champion. As well as Jormag placing the new dragon energies into Drakkar.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Well, we have elements of both aspects happening within GW2. For example, Drakkar is explicitly referenced as changing from the frozen GW1 form to the form he appears as in GW2.

    Drakkar is a mixed bag, because on top of lore pointing out that he's decayed due to exposure to elements, and absorbing the magic of the Lost Spirits and dead Elder Dragons, Drakkar was redesigned outside of lore too - the only aspect of his body that they focused on maintaining was the silhouette of the head. They ignored the old appearance of the legs and tail.

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