Why the player quality on pvp is so low on gw2?

Low population? Hard to learn? Hard to find sources of learning? Wrong rewards luring wrong peoples? A lot of newcomers?

Why around 90% of the pvp population cant evolve?

@anjo.6143 said:Low population?yesHard to learn?yes and no

Hard to find sources of learning?100% no

A lot of newcomers?definitely not

Low population and an unwillingness to improve among many, since the game's philosophy is to make most ingame rewards outside of PvP super easily achievable, while the good stuff is in the gemstore. Unfortunately this game has a bit of a hippie philosophy, "you can get everything you want at every you want at any skill level", which obviously doesn't go well with a competitive mindset, which is also why the more hardcore playerbase in basically all 3 gamemodes is constantly at odds with the game design decisions made by Anet.

cuz of dumb meta, and unpunishing pvp

PoF specks, most of them were designed for PVE dps and are too spammy in nature, low cds large AoEs no reliance on any combos. Just spam and let the build carry you .This was probably made like that so new players can have easier time, which backfired since older players abused the shit out if it.And we thought that HoT was bad, how wrong were we.

Balancing is a joke, anet balancing team needs replacing.

They trashing random skills and killing off functions that are not used by meta, we have --Easy spammable engi-Dumb core nerco with lich (why hasn't lich been touched?)-Fire guard that fart out stacks of burns faster then you can clear just by dancing doing silly amount of damage.

Last update example --Killed rev that I believe just needed damage lowering but got trashed instead.-Nerco wells and sig got completely trashed along with a new trashy trait for no reason which are not used by dumb core nerco.

Fingers cross for Ashes of Creation as this is just a sinking ship. I've played since gw1.... anet we knew has died along with the passion to grow this game.

The mistake on the nerco balance update is shocking and they fixed it by killing it further, part that didn't need to be touched at the first place.

A lot of reasons.Bad balance - builds carry the players, no punishment for mistakes, rng procs, high reward low risk, skill spammability, false 'depth' of classes via elite speces that in reality is just powercreep, etc.No in-game guide - game doesn't provide information what is PvP and how it works on it's own, players need to look for it on yt or some specific websites for it.Visual clutter - connected to skill spammability as well, a lot of skills just burn your eyes - meaning you really can't improve if you don't know what's going on the screen(even if you wanted).Lack of 'reason' to get better - why would you get better if build does everything for you?They just left - good players just quit PvP or whole GW2 cause of boredom and bad balance.Game became far too 'casual friendly' with HoT release, now it's just getting worse and worse...

PvP's community is a mixture of both toxic and lazy. We have players who rather just lay around and just play with builds but we also have people who are super intense and go for the easiest tactics to win. Those two mindsets begin to bash heads and make the environment unhealthy for any potential newcomers, not to mention many of the intense tend to be pretty griefy as well, the classic BMs of 'u bad.' or 'lol l2p.' and many more.

The balance is also questionably slow, which causes poor balancing choices to really sting due to the delay from trying to patch up issues they did that caused a profession to really spike up for a single trait or a single skill, etc.

Another issue with PvP has to do with the delay between matches, queues currently range from 3-10 minutes depending on the time of day. Even in prime-time, it goes between 2-5 minutes which really shows the size of the community now.

TL;DR: Differing mindsets, poor balancing, long match queues cause people to get cranky.

@anjo.6143 said:Low population? Hard to learn? Hard to find sources of learning? Wrong rewards luring wrong peoples? A lot of newcomers?

Why around 90% of the pvp population cant evolve?

First and foremost any and all games lose players over time. What one hopes then is that new players take their place to keep a some what even or stable player base.

The primary reason GW2 has such a low PvP player base is simply the toxicity of this community.

This game mode has a reputation for being the least favorable in terms of community in this game. Also, the general toxicity tends to limit the amount of new players interested in this game mode.

Add into the fact very poor balance overall as well as about the worst match making system I have ever seen in a game and you have what we have.

This is a prime example of what happens when a player base cannibalizes itself then wonders where all the players went.

@Azreell.1568 said:

@anjo.6143 said:Low population? Hard to learn? Hard to find sources of learning? Wrong rewards luring wrong peoples? A lot of newcomers?

Why around 90% of the pvp population cant evolve?

this games community is not toxic at all, what do you even mean.Matchmaking sucks, I just fought floody, guess what, soulbeast on his team didnt know his character can dodge. How can you put those 2 players in the same game is astounding. Im not having fun killing him, he doesnt have fun getting killed, whats the point of it all. You think he is gonna come back after getting killed 12 times in 5 minutes? I have my doubts, and it has nothing with me being toxic towards the slb. We just should not be put together in the same lobby, most other games have hidden mmr even in unranked for that specific reason.

@Azreell.1568 said:

@anjo.6143 said:Low population? Hard to learn? Hard to find sources of learning? Wrong rewards luring wrong peoples? A lot of newcomers?

Why around 90% of the pvp population cant evolve?

Side 2- man I have trouble fighting this class, it must be broken OP then and no Its not me I'm awesome and surely cant be a learn to play issue and I'm not gonna spam post for reasonable shaves to the classes I dislike but rather spam post about how it should be deleted and not exists while I offer unreasonable suggestions to delete said class cuz I could care less about the players who do enjoy playing it = a lot of the time anet listens and does in fact delete said builds or multiple builds for said class causing players to drop class and in some cases leave the game.Seems there's a pattern to both sides...= player loss.Gw2 pvp community in a nutshell and actually wonder why population is low.

Obviously anet design team and lazy balance efforts are the most to blame in the end.

I think thats the case in 90%+ of mmos, ppl come for pve content, some end up enjoying the pvp, as money comes mostly from pve the resources are mostly put there, so if pvp gets any love pve always comes first and so is their balance which constantly get in the way of what needs to be done in pvp.

And then you have games like dota, lol, cs, pvp only, with a lot of more resources and well stablished community. Where do you think new ppl will go? Even talented old players may have a better chance starting fresh in this games if they're trying to make money from their passion.

It is like chosing between

This game is goodBut balance patches take kinda long to landCommunity is slowly decreasingAnd there abuses that need to be fix for long time now

And

This game is greatWe have small patches every 2 weeks, 1 big patch every 3 month that shakes up the meta and 1 huge patch every 6 month that brings new stuff and significant changes .It's been 3 years nothing is really brokenAnd bugs and abuses dont get past 2 weeks

Which one would you choose?

Population is low coz the matching system is pure kitten, and on top of that you get punished (by rank points deduction) often severely; because of the results of what that kitten match system produce.Player should not lose rank because this matching system decided to put them in a team 2 leagues below their level just to insure that 50:50 win rate...

Outside of other stuff- the biggest problem I see in anyone who’s say new or not experienced is 1.) big mechanical problems from terrible settings 2.) no knowledge of roles, which makes their play seem random 3.) no inter class knowledge- they don’t know what to expect from other classes or simply when to dodge 4.) no knowledge of what maps are like- they cannot know where to rotate for wins or simply cannot figure out if or not they will win with say 2 nodes and hence get decapped or make a random rotation

There are many people who don't even bother trying to win or even play decently.I certainly can't understand why anyone would try hard on a game mode that even the developers (seem to) have given up on.

some of you need to remember not everyone has 40 hours a week to practice guild wars.

The beauty of guild wars pvp is its balance. anyone can log in and its a fair fight. I think its combat/pvp is one of the greatest in any mmo's out there. being none gear dependent is its corner stone.

If you come across someone who's not as skilled, remember they could possibly have 50-60 hour week job, family to raise and other commitments. So when they get to log in for an hour on a Sunday afternoon they aren't going to be highly skilled are they?

@bhaldor.9837 said:some of you need to remember not everyone has 40 hours a week to practice guild wars.The beauty of guild wars pvp is its balance. anyone can log in and its a fair fight. I think its combat/pvp is one of the greatest in any mmo's out there. being none gear dependent is its corner stone.Guild Wars is a nice game with (what feels like) balanced PvP.But it shouldn't be compared with Guild Wars 2, which is a fundamentally different game with a fundamentally different amount of effort put into PvP balance.Also, Guild Wars is no MMO, it's a CORPG.

Because you dont actually have to win to obtain most things. You get ticks for losing anyway. You get pvp lvl XP and you can do the reward tracks simply by losing. Winning is just for showing your nice tag, titles and achievements. Of course there are a few things like the legendary amulet that require you to win tournaments, but generally speaking you can honestly just play lowkey and no efford, eventually you'll get whereever you want to go.

@bhaldor.9837 said:some of you need to remember not everyone has 40 hours a week to practice guild wars.

The beauty of guild wars pvp is its balance. anyone can log in and its a fair fight. I think its combat/pvp is one of the greatest in any mmo's out there. being none gear dependent is its corner stone.

If you come across someone who's not as skilled, remember they could possibly have 50-60 hour week job, family to raise and other commitments. So when they get to log in for an hour on a Sunday afternoon they aren't going to be highly skilled are they?

Which is perfectly fine, be a supercasual, have fun PvP-ing against other supercasuals. Unranked also needs to separate based on skill level, it's better for everyone. Being tired after working 50+ hours and barely managing the kids, you wouldn't want the little time you have spent getting stomped on by top players right? This just ends up driving people away, making matchmaking even worse.

At least 5 years of braindead meta melted every brain and skill

I think one of the main problema is, that the game is advertised for casual players, it could have way more competitive players if they would know that it exists. They tried it with or after Hots release, and the free 2 play marketing in pvp but not many registered that. It's just a casual game and thats why it's handled as one

We have atm a half guy for pvp balance, which shows what the direction of the game is

Because matchmaking will bring you to 50% win rate anyway. Regardless of how good a player is.

And the rewards are almost the same on every level.

There is simply no reason to improve other then wanting it yourself.

@Avatar.3568 said:the game is advertised for casual players,

This game is being advertised?I haven't seen any official Arenanet advertisement in years.I've only seen it a few times in videos about current MMOs, but that hardly counts.

@Vancho.8750 said:PoF specks, most of them were designed for PVE dps and are too spammy in nature, low cds large AoEs no reliance on any combos. Just spam and let the build carry you .This was probably made like that so new players can have easier time, which backfired since older players abused the kitten out if it.And we thought that HoT was bad, how wrong were we.

I have to say that as a player from launch, I really enjoyed the change of pace when heart of thorns dropped but that's where they started the cater to casuals PvP. Introducing a lot more DPS your opponent while being invulnerable, spam, and mindless play. I really loved the game pre-HoT but it's also what nearly killed this game since it people generally found it boring. My buddy and I used to take on entire zergs 2v15-25 people back then simply because we used proper timing on blocks, dodges, reflects, and knowing when to heal and peel for each other. The reason that stopped with HoT was that when you're fighting groups of even 5-8 you have people that can damage you while spamming distortion, evades, blocks, etc while still keep DPS up on you.

After PoF, I've had moments where we can wipe guild groups of 5-8, but it's a lot more rare. It's more even now, but not because the opponents are more skilled imo, it's just the games evolved exactly the way you stated it to be in your comment. Spam.

Think of the worst meta you ever experienced in any game, multiply it by 9 and apply to every class in GW2.

Just imagine in todays fast paced clown fiesta of aoe invuln/block/random evades/condi/reflect/cc how a new player would feel. 90% attacks miss, downed instantly if they were even lucky enough to play their character. It sure sounds fun to me KEK. Even if a poor padawan stuck it out and rose up the ranks then they deal with the horrendous matchmaking which works directly against you. There's also the loving embrace of our oh so great veteran pvp community to look forward to.