Is Roaming In A Good Or Bad State?

Title. Also, for discussion, why?

Good for scouting and call outs. If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good. Bad on the flip side of you are not running a take on 3-5 vs 1 beast build. Cause you will die and find yourself looking up at the sky as siege is thrown upon you wondering where you went wrong in life.

So it has its ups and downs.

ba dum tish

@Sinfullysweet.4517 said:If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good.Yes, roaming on roaming builds and being able to fight roamers usually helps when it comes to roaming.

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Sinfullysweet.4517 said:If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good.Yes, roaming on roaming builds and being able to fight roamers usually helps when it comes to roaming.

Surely roaming is more than fighting roamers? Do you feel you can engage and pose a threat to a larger group presently? Does that not count as roaming?

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Sinfullysweet.4517 said:If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good.Yes, roaming on roaming builds and being able to fight roamers usually helps when it comes to roaming.

Massive respect to the roamers who do fight though. I have watched some impressive fights.

@duillyn.2697 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Sinfullysweet.4517" said:If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good.Yes, roaming on roaming builds and being able to fight roamers usually helps when it comes to roaming.

And even Sin above lumping "scouting" with "roaming". I only said that yes it helps to have a build thats able to fight roamers, the reaction is that roaming automatically mean fights... the wording in what I quoted was kind of silly, since it basicly said bring a roaming build to roam good. Duh.

Roaming is a state of mind. Not an activity.

If thats in a bad state... well...

The main reason I never got into roaming is because of all the dumb overpowered builds. At least in pvp they are toned down a bit, but even then its still pretty bad.

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:The main reason I never got into roaming is because of all the dumb overpowered builds. At least in pvp they are toned down a bit, but even then its still pretty bad.

And this is the main reason why I clicked on "bad". The outcome of too many battles is pre-determined by the class selection. The consequence is that you see certain classes dominating in roaming.

It's very hard to roam solo or duo; much respect to those that still will try to fight 1v2 or 3 or something. This is what you'll encounter:

1.) Random singles trying to do dailies or lost players in a squad. You can always kill those and some players love adding them to montages, but that's no real content

2.) People that run away on mounts

3.) A small group running a full mini-comp, filled with supports and typically 1-2 dps. These are impossible to take on if they outnumber you simply because they will just bore you to death or get hard carried with down state. (woo next week!). You can usually identify these when the "star" (typically dps) goes down and all the supports hug them, and then they usually run away, leaving their supports for dead.

4.) That oh so "true" solo roamer that I describe in the first sentence. Sadly, he or she will most likely get blobbed down when they get chased down by 7-8 salty people that siege bury them.

5.) People that pretend to be 4, but have about 4-6 buddies around the corner to protect their guildies undefeated 1v1 record.

6.) Your own clueless teammates who rallybot. Honestly, I consider them as enemies too.

7.) Someone running some variant of a build that is only there to annoy you and lead on a 30 minute stalemate with stealth, bunker, or some combination in the above. Usually you can just walk away or jump in the water for a meme water battle.

Btw, I'm sure a lot of people have their reasons for doing the above, so I don't blame them. People can only get run down so many times before they have to resort to more mobilty/disengage/sustain. And of course people aren't here to entertain you and they have business elsewhere.

It's generally better to roam with 2-4 people, though I am not really sure if you consider that roaming anymore, and throw down catapults at tiered structures. You try your best to hold out as long as you can against the inevitable stream of defenders that comes, and you win if you take the structure or if they do something like pull EWP, sending a map queue to blob you off the map. That's probably the most fun you'll get. In addition, you'll be able to fight organized groups your own size or bigger.

If you actually want a good fight from GM people, you're probably best off adding cool people from other servers and form your own circle for content. Yes, occasionally,. you'll get a friendly whisper, among the dozens that tell you to go kill yourself or something. ;)

Don't take this too seriously. This game is pve balanced and the server's hamsters are getting old , so if you die or your enemy dies, it probably doesn't mean much either way. This is a casual pve game; approach it as such.

Hard to say.

Do you mean are there good fights? Do you mean balance wise? Personally I think its better than pre Feb patch ohk meta days. I still enjoy it, but there are always builds that are a cut above the rest and should be toned down, most of those builds being condi.

But the real killer of roaming is support builds. Crazy that the full minstrel specs dominate in every part of the game that includes them. 3 dps roamers that can hold their own in solo fights don't stand a chance against a group of 3 running a minstrel support. The best they can hope for is a stalemate assuming the minstrel support knows what its skills do.

So roaming is pretty decent, until someone brings a pocket healer, because after that skill is irrelevant, you aren't going to kill anything. You either re roll your own pocket healer to counter and enjoy a fight that lasts for all eternity or just admit defeat and avoid fighting with the pocket healer nearby.

@gloflop.3510 said:

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:The main reason I never got into roaming is because of all the dumb overpowered builds. At least in pvp they are toned down a bit, but even then its still pretty bad.

Well yeah, it's only fair. Same said classes dont dominate zerg fights.

I'm not sure anything dominates roaming atm, everything is just kinda weak and easily escape-able on any proper roaming build. That aside, as I'm aware that isn't your actual point, valid insight in terms of different eco-systems, absolutely.

Also, @ArchonWing.9480 I certainly don't take it seriously anymore and I agree that no-one should currently, but it's just a real shame it's in the state it is. Good insights, accurate, nonetheless.

I can't remember the last time I was solo or with a handful of people and posed a legitimate problem to a zerg. That just feels kinda bad. Like, what's the propose of a single player in WvW if they pose no threat at all? To extend that perhaps, what's the purpose of WvW for a single player?

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@gloflop.3510 said:

@"Paradoxoglanis.1904" said:The main reason I never got into roaming is because of all the dumb overpowered builds. At least in pvp they are toned down a bit, but even then its still pretty bad.

I was maybe not clear enough: I speak of roaming classes/builds. As an example, let us say that I constantly lose against mesmer but I beat all thiefs.

We were once duelling in armistice bastion, just casually ofc. We were both on guards. I won with some difficulties but I won each round. Then the other players went to revenant. He could beat me each time. Ok so far, so normal. I am a bad player. The other player just was the first time ever on his rev. He created the rev with a lvl 80 boost, got gear and build from anet and had literally no clue what the skills were doing. This incidence showed me how bad the balance for 1 vs. 1 fights is.

Honestly I feel like the question depends on how tolerant you are to dying repeatedly and what class you play. I've died over 11k times on my thief over 7 and a bit years (averages out as once every 35-40 mins or so), so I'm not exactly afraid of running at a group haha. I will try to pick off the weakest of any size group I find and personally I find it hilarious to aggravate people at camps until they send a map blob after me or siege spam me. I don't care if I die after that as long as I get more kills than deaths overall. If dying like that would trigger you, I can see why you would think that roaming is bad right now.

well, bus are bigger and roaming or small groups are fewer.it is harder to pull off 1v2 or outnumbered than before.bus wil often chase you with mounts so you can't escape unless you play thief.you have less of an impact against large group or bus than before.scouting, if considered as a part of roaming, is kinda dead.very hard to find other roamers to play as a group with. overall individual skills is getting weaker.golden age of duels (random roamers 1v1 spontaneous events) is long dead. no one in obsidian sanctuary. barely any solo roamers to meet up and deuls with.which is a shame as it pushed players to improve their dueling skills without having to use cheesy builds that tries to one shot you or fly very far away to reset the fight is failed.

i woulod say that the overall quantity and quality of roamers have decreased alot with time (just like escorters and scouts.)you almost see only bus nowerdays. with some little guild raid on prime time and some group of players with cheesy hit and run builds.

@duillyn.2697 said:

@Dawdler.8521 said:

@Sinfullysweet.4517 said:If you got a survivable build and can take camps solo as well as defend off another roamer then life is good.Yes, roaming on roaming builds and being able to fight roamers usually helps when it comes to roaming.

While roaming: take on other roamers, scout, take camps, towers, go for keeps (haven't been able to try post patch), and poke at havocs and zergs. Prior to nerf patch had 20+ toons could do this on. After nerf patch, that's down to 2-4 and everyone else needs to re-adjust yet. As far as attacking a group or zerg, it's going to equate to more slowing them since even if you drop a target, if you don't get all the rest then you really didn't do anything since once the rest are out of combat they will just get their defeated ally back up like nothing happened. So as far as state...I like fish. It's much harder to solo objectives now. Is that good or bad...depends on if it's your objective that was lost.

@duillyn.2697 said:

Also, @ArchonWing.9480 I certainly don't take it seriously anymore and I agree that no-one should currently, but it's just a real shame it's in the state it is. Good insights, accurate, nonetheless.

Oh, I just feel like it's a necessary mindset to function in this game mode at all. Otherwise you just end up like those people that whine endlessly about getting killed. Obviously I will also complain about fighting annoying people, but I'm just too tired for that and life is too short, and they probably aren't listening anyways. But you know, hey, we might get another RvR game someday, and hope to see you all there. xD

You know you've probably made an impact if multiple players are actually turning around to get you, unless your enemy is very disciplined. May have to go deeper. It may take you a few deaths or 30 to find out where this point is, but it'll totally be worth it! They did remove armor repair lately.

Sometimes Roaming good and sometimes its is badGood when grabbing camps and contesting waypointsBad when you get caught by a group of ten

I suppose it depends what your goal is, or what you define roaming as, since it seems to be a very subjective topic.

To me, roaming is anything involving "trouble making", and typically involving a solo player or a few friends. You want to be annoying; killing pugs, tapping waypoints, capturing camps, capturing towers, killing structure siege (cannons, oil, AC's, etc.), even trying to open keeps if the time is right. Some consider this to be more in line with havoc, and while I agree, I think it is also very much roaming so long as you aren't with a comp'd squad.I see havoc as being roughly the same as roaming, but more organized, PPT focused, and communicating with commanders and/or guilds. Where as roaming is neutral chaos- you're just out to be as much of a pain in the enemies back side as you can with little to no regard for how it helps your server (though you are knowingly helping, it isn't your goal to do so).

I feel that roaming by how I define it is in a bad state. It is extremely difficult to open or capture towers with a small group or solo, and even supply camps can be quite challenging depending on the circumstances (eg. upgraded, nearby towers having Watch Tower, etc.). Passive upgrades, tactics, mounts and to a lesser extent objective auras, are all things that have impeded the impact a solo player or a handful of players can have. For the most part, the best you can hope to do is successfully distracting pugs from regrouping with their zergs or being hard enough to kill that scouts start putting more time in to complaining about you than relaying actual info to the map.

It is still possible to do more than killing pugs, but the effort needed to do so, and often the immensity of the frustration that comes with it, just makes it not worth it for most.

I very rarely see players I would consider actual roamers. Most are more like what I call a "floater", which is something I often do myself. They hang around areas that are easier to gain support when they're outnumbered, play as a fringe fighter near zergs, or chase red dots any time one appears on their mini map. That's all fine and good, but it is a very simplified and low risk version of what roaming used to be.

I still very much enjoy doing what I consider roaming. I try to open towers or keeps, contest waypoints, relay info to map when it's applicable, seizing opportune moments to snipe things, looking for fights when I think I can handle them, etc. But I'm a whole lot less brave than what I was pre-HoT. I used to go deep in enemy territory, almost always solo, and would successfully capture towers or open keeps on a pretty regular basis. As well as forcing small groups of pugs to dedicate scouts to keeping an eye on me and singling people out who chased too far. But thanks primarily to Watch Tower, Mounts and everyone being so damn tanky, the most I can usually do now is hope for some good 1 v 1/2's and preventing camps from reaching T3 or resetting the ones that do.

Roaming is kinda dead. Havoc parties are still viable, as long as there is a commander willing to coordinate.

Objective based roaming, don't see much of it, don't see small groups or solo players actively trying to help the server. Mostly, and I don't like to see them referred as roamers and they seem to get everything their way in WvW like mounts being gutted, but mostly its gankers masquerading as roamers in unbeatable or easy to escape keyboard face roll builds, or 3 mans with support and 2 gankers, sitting outside keeps or spawns killing the odd solo player and making no effect on the match up at all. So in effect, roaming is dead because roamers made it so (apart from the good roamers who duel and actually take and defend stuff). Stop catering to them.

@Biermeister.4678 said:Sometimes Roaming good and sometimes its is badGood when grabbing camps and contesting waypointsBad when you get caught by a group of ten

But good if you can get them to chase you. And better when you can squirrel an entire zerg off course even if they spent the time to catch you.

Let me sum up roaming fights: Low risk, High reward with bunker condi spam or range pew pew. Melee has essentially been deleted from the game. It is crazy that a melee thief, warrior, etc do a fraction of the damage of some idiot standing on a wall. It is a stupid design that a player can essentially rotate bunker skills while casually spamming condi and win.

The thief has been nerfed into oblivion. Mesmer variants got mostly squashed. Warriors particularly melee are laughable now.

I think its pushing more towards the bad side. The current meta is a bit of a self-sustaining circle. Players who roam are now more likely to run into larger groups of 3+. Because they are running into larger groups, and the meta we're in heavily favors sustain and tanky builds, roamers are more inclined to include more sustain and survivability so they can last longer. This leads to more bunker builds or passive condi builds because they can soak up alot of damage. This in turns leads power players to need to group up to defeat single bunker player, which in turns encourges more players to either team up or go more tanky. This means that solo roamers are being pushed to team up in order to play. In addition to this, fights are lasting longer than ever now, and any roamer can tell you that the longer a fight goes on the more at a disadvantage they become as more players may +1 to the fight. Furthermore, securing downs in outnumbered fights is harder than ever. Cleaving does less damage since the power nerf while the Down state HP remained the same, and with the mass reduction in stability across the board, safe stomps are now much less frequent.

While I think this is bad, its pretty clear this is ANet's decision. They want WvW to be a larger scale game mode for team fights. You canstill solo roam just be prepared to run if anymore than 2 players show up.

Something between bad and kitten bad tier.Roaming is dead.In past week I've met:"Roamers" that run circus builds (Soulbeasts that have very high sustain and boons uptime and damage, unkillable condi stealth trap Druids that have a fetish to be chased by 10+ players, condi Mirages that are still unbalanced and annoying to fight, teefs that have too many 'i'm outta of here scrub' cards, condi Revenants that are core necro 2.0, but better and many others)."Roamers" that run away if they're spotted even if they use roaming builds."Roamers" that can only fight if they outnumber enemy atleast 3:1.Roaming is just annoyance at this point. Only good thing from it is giving info about enemy as a scout and decapping stuff from time to time.