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Would you like Elite Specializations to have a second weapon?


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I can see each class getting to use 6 new weapons if they had 6 new elites, but they might not create 6 expansion. Not knowing how many Elite Specs will be coming, would it be a good idea to give each elite two new weapons instead of one. They have the new Expansion coming next year and they could drastically change the direction of how the next expansions, if any, will go.

If they did give each profession two weapons per expansion I think these would be a good idea:

HOTDragon Hunter: Long Bow & off hand SwordBerserker: Torch & main hand ShieldHerald: Shield & offhand FocusDruid: Staff & offhand FocusScrapper: Hammer & main hand MaceDaredevil: Staff & Dual MaceChronomancer: Shield & Dual DaggersTempest: Warhorn & offhand ScepterReaper: Great Sword & offhand ShieldPOFFirebrand: Main hand Axe & main hand FocusSpellbreaker: Dual Daggers & offhand FocusRenegade: Short Bow & Great SwordSoulbeast: Main hand Dagger & RifleHolosmith: Main hand Sword & StaffDeadeye: Rifle & offhand FocusMirage: Main hand Axe & Main hand PistolWeaver: Main hand Sword & main hand FocusScourge: Torch & Offhand AxeEODGuardian: War Horn & offhand ScepterWarrior: Staff & Dual PistolsRevenant: Dual Pistols & main hand ScepterRanger: Hammer & offhand ShieldEngineer: Great Sword & offhand FocusThief: Torch & Great SwordMesmer: Short Bow & WarhornElementalist: Long Bow & Great SwordNecromancer: Rifle & Hammer

Thoughts?

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or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

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@Reirli.3817 said:or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

You are not forced to use the weapon that comes with the spec.

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i would like a major revamp of all elites to make them more pure on purpouse and rebalance them, for example one ofthe ones that would benefit rhis revamp os the DE: DE being a thief elite spec or its broken(because so many free of jail skills) or its unplayable to make them balanced DE have to lose the major disengage/stealth skill acces that provides thief, a sniper is someone that can burst you from distance and need a setup to do it but if get discovered/caught is fucked not one that have infinite disengage and reset acces to try and try until succes

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@Reirli.3817 said:or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

So you want to use current weapons differently due to being and elite spec? That's a lot more work for Devs. How would you even balance that?

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@Dark Red Killian.3946 said:I think it would be nice that the elite specs that had an offhand weapon got a main hand weapon too. So you had one elite spec which may have gotten 5 new skills from a 2 handed weapon, and another elite spec which got 2 new skills from and offhand weapon. I thought it was odd there was an imbalance there.

Yeah, I wasn't thinking about skill count. I was more so thinking of theme.

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I'd rather have some core updates, be it new weapons, swappable skills for old weapons for some extra customisation or finishing/added Utility skill categories, and just in general more aggressive reworks of old and under- used/powered Traits and Trait lines as well as Utilities.

I think I'd also rather have Elite Spec Weapons become unexclusive than adding more exclusive weapons to certain specs, although I won't say no to just more skill diversity in general.

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@yoni.7015 said:

@Reirli.3817 said:or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

You are not forced to use the weapon that comes with the spec.

i know how you're picking up on my comment but that's absolutely not what i meant, my statement is not that i dislike the weapon or that we were forced to use it - as in matter of fact it's encouraged for players to try out new things or customize and tinker their build to their liking. it's the fact that instead of forcing themselves (the devs) to design skills around a completely new weapon for classes like ranger, rev, war etc they can instead simply change up the weapon skills of an already available weapon to the class.

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@VocalThought.9835 said:

@Reirli.3817 said:or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

So you want to use current weapons differently due to being and elite spec? That's a lot more work for Devs. How would you even balance that?

it would be interesting, but you're making a suggestive statement that devs being worked harder than normal is not a good idea. if you want to create something special, it always requires effort. regarding your second question, they'd balance the new set of skills of the same weapon just like how they do it with any other weapon skill/ utility skill/ build specs if you ask me. appreciate all the thoughts though :)

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@Reirli.3817 said:

@Reirli.3817 said:or they can change up the skills of the same weapon based on elite specialization build. i don't like to be forced to use a different weapon because of a different xpac. why can't the ranger longbow or shortbow skills be changed because of an elite spec.

point is, they don't need to force new weapons out to the point where things can get bizzare like rifle necromancer, just change up the staff skills... and i know for a fact a lot of necro players would love to be able to use staff cause of its RP-ishness

So you want to use current weapons differently due to being and elite spec? That's a lot more work for Devs. How would you even balance that?

it would be interesting, but you're making a suggestive statement that devs being worked harder than normal is not a good idea. if you want to create something special, it always requires effort. regarding your second question, they'd balance the new set of skills of the same weapon just like how they do it with any other weapon skill/ utility skill/ build specs if you ask me. appreciate all the thoughts though :)

To make sure I hear you right, you would like to not add a new weapon to each elite, but you would rather they change how the elites use each weapon they currently have available differently. So if my Warrior uses a great sword than my Berserker would use a Great Sword differently, a Spell Breaker would use the Great Sword different from the both of them, and will so on with every new elite? So it's like how each profession uses each weapon differently. The issues I would have is if I choose to be a warrior, witj your idea, I could never be an elite spec, because it would change my weapon skills. I can see having different elites use weapons unavailable to the core professions differently, but existing weapons change... I would not like that and those are a whole lot of skills being made to be balanced for no good reason in my book. I think this is an example of how more is not always better. I think having more skills would offer a slight change in the ability instead or dynamic change in skill.

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classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is shit so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters shoud use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is greatswords, axes and other shit

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@krz.1327 said:classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is kitten so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters should use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is great swords, axes and other kitten

It's not like, if you play a thief you can't use DD, but other players clearly don't play Thief to just do max dmg. Some like to cc, buff allies, or simply enjoy being creative. Plus your scope of what classes can do is more limited than the current game. I recall playing D&D 3rd edition and they even made it possible for classes to non-traditional class based weapons, if you could justify it with the expansions. So I guess you don't like mesmers or reapers using Great Swords? I really do like how each profession uses each weapons differently, and to how each specialization and elite specialization pushes towards different themes of the profession is really nice.

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@krz.1327 said:classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is kitten so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters shoud use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is greatswords, axes and other kitten

Guess you havent seen the DD deadeyes.

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@VocalThought.9835 said:

@"krz.1327" said:classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is kitten so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters should use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is great swords, axes and other kitten

It's not like, if you play a thief you can't use DD, but other players clearly don't play Thief to just do max dmg. Some like to cc, buff allies, or simply enjoy being creative. Plus your scope of what classes can do is more limited than the current game. I recall playing D&D 3rd edition and they even made it possible for classes to non-traditional class based weapons, if you could justify it with the expansions. So I guess you don't like mesmers or reapers using Great Swords? I really do like how each profession uses each weapons differently, and to how each specialization and elite specialization pushes towards different themes of the profession is really nice.

krz made a pretty relevant example even if they didn't intend to. ok so with the weapons that thief profession could have.. hammer, shield, mace ... tell me what exactly could professions for example like *suppose they added an elite spec called assassin or ninja (hypotheticals for the sake of argument) use? would it not make sense for assassins or ninjas to use daggers, pistols, or swords? see the problem with that is the fact that the weapons are already present, why not change the way they are played? obviously you're still releasing a whole new branch of spec traits and utility skill. all you're really changing is the selection of weapons, this makes it easier for anet to pump out new types of elite specs with a lot more ease and create more build diversity. a plethora of other games do it already. you speak of balance, but balance is not foreign as a concept, when a developer works with elite specs, its expected that they at least test and balance this, when you mention about "balance" that literally applies for everything anet has ever released and tested, and run through with patches/updates.additionally, a changeup on ranger shortbow and longbow would be a good idea as well based on elite spec, some people like shortbow but don't like that it's condi focused, so why not release an elite spec that changes up how shortbow works? as i mentioned already, many other mmos or games employ this strat, it's not new at all.

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@Reirli.3817 said:

@"krz.1327" said:classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is kitten so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters should use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is great swords, axes and other kitten

It's not like, if you play a thief you can't use DD, but other players clearly don't play Thief to just do max dmg. Some like to cc, buff allies, or simply enjoy being creative. Plus your scope of what classes can do is more limited than the current game. I recall playing D&D 3rd edition and they even made it possible for classes to non-traditional class based weapons, if you could justify it with the expansions. So I guess you don't like mesmers or reapers using Great Swords? I really do like how each profession uses each weapons differently, and to how each specialization and elite specialization pushes towards different themes of the profession is really nice.

krz made a pretty relevant example even if they didn't intend to. ok so with the weapons that thief profession could have.. hammer, shield, mace ... tell me what exactly could professions for example like *suppose they added an elite spec called assassin or ninja (hypotheticals for the sake of argument) use? would it not make sense for assassins or ninjas to use daggers, pistols, or swords? see the problem with that is the fact that the weapons are already present, why not change the way they are played? obviously you're still releasing a whole new branch of spec traits and utility skill. all you're really changing is the selection of weapons, this makes it easier for anet to pump out new types of elite specs with a lot more ease and create more build diversity. a plethora of other games do it already. you speak of balance, but balance is not foreign as a concept, when a developer works with elite specs, its expected that they at least test and balance this, when you mention about "balance" that literally applies for everything anet has ever released and tested, and run through with patches/updates.additionally, a changeup on ranger shortbow and longbow would be a good idea as well based on elite spec, some people like shortbow but don't like that it's condi focused, so why not release an elite spec that changes up how shortbow works? as i mentioned already, many other mmos or games employ this strat, it's not new at all.

You forgot that thief dont have single or dubble axe, longbow, off hand sword, torch, scepter, foci, warhorn and 2h sword right?EditAs for your ninja example, off hand sword would probabely fit best.

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@Reirli.3817 said:

@"krz.1327" said:classes have too many weapons available anyway and it makes playing with a weapon that should be default for your class not worth it, elite specializations made it even worsethief should use double daggers because it's just renamed assassin from GW1 but DD is kitten so you need to use a staff or anything other than DD to not feel like you're doing not enough damagecasters should use staves, scepters and focuses but no, meta is great swords, axes and other kitten

It's not like, if you play a thief you can't use DD, but other players clearly don't play Thief to just do max dmg. Some like to cc, buff allies, or simply enjoy being creative. Plus your scope of what classes can do is more limited than the current game. I recall playing D&D 3rd edition and they even made it possible for classes to non-traditional class based weapons, if you could justify it with the expansions. So I guess you don't like mesmers or reapers using Great Swords? I really do like how each profession uses each weapons differently, and to how each specialization and elite specialization pushes towards different themes of the profession is really nice.

krz made a pretty relevant example even if they didn't intend to. ok so with the weapons that thief profession could have.. hammer, shield, mace ... tell me what exactly could professions for example like *suppose they added an elite spec called assassin or ninja (hypotheticals for the sake of argument) use? would it not make sense for assassins or ninjas to use daggers, pistols, or swords? see the problem with that is the fact that the weapons are already present, why not change the way they are played? obviously you're still releasing a whole new branch of spec traits and utility skill. all you're really changing is the selection of weapons, this makes it easier for anet to pump out new types of elite specs with a lot more ease and create more build diversity. a plethora of other games do it already. you speak of balance, but balance is not foreign as a concept, when a developer works with elite specs, its expected that they at least test and balance this, when you mention about "balance" that literally applies for everything anet has ever released and tested, and run through with patches/updates.additionally, a changeup on ranger shortbow and longbow would be a good idea as well based on elite spec, some people like shortbow but don't like that it's condi focused, so why not release an elite spec that changes up how shortbow works? as i mentioned already, many other mmos or games employ this strat, it's not new at all.

So instead of simply adding new weapons with weapon skills with each elite, you want new weapon skills for existing weapons because you too feel there are, not too many skills, just too many weapons, and you don't mind losing old weapon abilities simply because you added an elite specializations. In your game a Deadeye would not get a Rifle, they'll just use Pistols, Daggers, and Sword differently than core Thief.

I'd say give each elite two new weapons and if they come out with more elites they can use the non-core weapons differently. In my game Deadeye would not only get a Rifle, but they'd also get a focus, and if a newer Elite was made to use either a Rifle or Focus, they'd use those weapons differently than Deadeye, but would use the core weapons the same.

I also think new traits could give a newer feel to core weapons without changing the actual weapon's skills.

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no, basically -

new thief elite spec - introducing assassinweapon of choice - main hand daggerassassin set of main hand dagger skills =/= core thief set of main hand dagger skills (this along with the dual wield skill)old weapon, new skills

and i'm not asking for every class to use a pre-existing weapon as a new template for a new set of skillsmaybe along with assassin using daggers we'll get

new warrior elite spec - spearmanweapon of choice - staff (as a spear)new weapon, new skills.

that's all i am implying.

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@Reirli.3817 said:no, basically -

new thief elite spec - introducing assassinweapon of choice - main hand daggerassassin set of main hand dagger skills =/= core thief set of main hand dagger skills (this along with the dual wield skill)old weapon, new skills

and i'm not asking for every class to use a pre-existing weapon as a new template for a new set of skillsmaybe along with assassin using daggers we'll get

new warrior elite spec - spearmanweapon of choice - staff (as a spear)new weapon, new skills.

that's all i am implying.

Got it. So a new elite, like your Assassin, would have to loose his previous main hand dagger skills and gain new ones. You would rather that instead of getting a main hand axe with the dagger skills you have in mind?

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