Teach me to scrapper, please...

I'm still new to the game, I just got my first character (charr engineer) to 80, and have the first 3 or so skills in scrapper unlocked. While leveling, I was using firearms + explosives and mostly using a flamethrower for the juggernaut stability and much greater damage than I had with the pistols/rifle. I didnt really have any issues during leveling and even managed to kill a couple champions solo.

Now that I've added scrapper in, and bought some semi-decent level 80 gear (also an entropy hammer given to me by a guild member), things just seem to have gotten worse. Without the juggernaut stability, I get knocked around all the time while trying to use the hammer, and honestly it doesn't seem to be any more effective than the flamethrower was, often times feels like i'm doing less damage and taking more when using the hammer vs using the flamethrower.

I've come across videos of scrappers that look really impressive, solo WvW roaming and soloing pve stuff easily, but that's not the experience I'm having at the moment. I know I need to work on filling out the rest of the specialization to get more passive traits unlocked, but I also feel like I'm doing something wrong when it comes to actual gameplay.

While I was leveling, I ran flamethrower, flame turret, thumper turret, and supply drop for my utilities, and spent 99% of the time with the flamethrower. Turrets were there for veteran/champion enemies where I needed extra tankiness, with the thumper turret doing knockdown and holding threat, and the flame turret providing smokescreen.

I swapped out my explosives tree for alchemy, following some scrapper builds I've seen posted online, and now I'm running two elixirs (the stat buff elixirs, cant remember which letters they are), and flamethrower in my third utility slot, I still like the flamethrower and switch to it often, especially against enemies that knock down/back repeatedly or large groups where the flamethrower can AoE better than the hammer.

Still, I feel like I'm taking a lot of damage, and not doing much in return. I'm not seeing any of the tankiness that people say scrapper is known for. Could just use some tips to improve my gameplay at this point.

Stick to core engi till you fully unlock scrapper. Why handicap yourself with a barely unlocked elite spec?You need a full tree of traits minimum to make any sort of comparison.

Flamethrower is a meme weapon / maximum PVE tagging weapon.Most scrappers are running hammer and some form of damage kit (to augment the damage) for PVE unless they are support scrapper. The two kits commonly used are grenade kit (both the toolbelt skill and just about every grenade except Flash Grenade) and bomb kit (if you're not a condi build ultimately it's for the toolbelt skill Big Ol Bomb + bomb kit #2 aka Fire Bomb).

The barrier is based off damage dealt so you want as much damage output as possible. If you don't have gear with high power and ferocity that could be the reason.

I'm mostly doing solo pve so the flamethrower should be fine, I would think. I enjoy using it, but just figured I'd replace it with the hammer eventually, and finding out that really isn't the case. Tbh I hate bomb/ grenade kit and cant really stand using them, so I'm trying to avoid that if possible.

I'm using almost all berserker gear, so power/precision/ferocity I think.

Check the guides below.... both are pvp orientated but may help you to learn scrapper tips and tricks.

Hope it helps.

Floody’s Guide

Vallun’s Flanethrower Guide

PvP is completely different to PvE for scrapper though. The strength of Scrapper in the open world PvE for me is that you can use combo fields to melt groups of mobs. You can use the Lightning combo of Thunderclap (Hammer 5) followed by the whirl finisher of Electro-Whirl (Hammer 2) to do really good damage to them. Spare Capacitor followed by Shredder Gyro and Electro-Whirl is also good at doing damage to groups of mobs. If you use combos, you will not have the issues other players have with Raptors in the HoT maps.

Flamethrower is the best kit for scrapper in open world. Flame scrapper is not good at anything high level, as far I can understand. I think that has to do with the slow attacks of hammer and flamethrower, but someone can correct me on that.

Once you unlock full Scrapper, you'll never look back at flamethrower.

This is the build I use. It is a variant on a recent video by Nike:

Hi mate, returning player here so may be able to put a set of fresh eyes on it.I started as a engineer when the game started but switched to Ranger and stuck with that until the Druid elite spec came out which i loved.I left to play ESO full time half way through HOT (hated it) and although i find POF equally frustrating my Druid ate the content with ease.Now to the real stuff - having played Cyrodiil in ESO i wanted to try WvW here and also build a tanky Scrapper.OMG its so much fun - you can look up on Metawhatever but the thing is that Engies have so much different stuff it really is down to what your comfortable with.For WVW im running Alchy and Explosives mainly using Hammer and Mortar Kit (swap out for sneak gyro when needed).I mainly roam taking easy 'Cows with saddlebags' and soloable points using Bulwark, Elixir U and Rocket turret.This works for 'me' and its 50/50 when i go 1v1 - i die a lot but its seriously fun.

Someone above said not to bother with the spec until you have unlocked it all - great advice because scrapper doesn't shine until you have the whole bag of tricks.I thought HOT and POF were easy on my druid - with a scrapper its stupidly easy - barrier, lots of healing, burst damage with hammer, want to skip mobs? Sneak Gyro seems like it never ends in pve!

Stick with it, its not the best class in WVW (well not for a newbie like me) but this is the most fun class ive played in over 30 years of gaming.

Be Safe

Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

@Lynx.9058 said:I'm still new to the game, I just got my first character (charr engineer) to 80, and have the first 3 or so skills in scrapper unlocked. While leveling, I was using firearms + explosives and mostly using a flamethrower for the juggernaut stability and much greater damage than I had with the pistols/rifle. I didnt really have any issues during leveling and even managed to kill a couple champions solo.

Now that I've added scrapper in, and bought some semi-decent level 80 gear (also an entropy hammer given to me by a guild member), things just seem to have gotten worse. Without the juggernaut stability, I get knocked around all the time while trying to use the hammer, and honestly it doesn't seem to be any more effective than the flamethrower was, often times feels like i'm doing less damage and taking more when using the hammer vs using the flamethrower.

I've come across videos of scrappers that look really impressive, solo WvW roaming and soloing pve stuff easily, but that's not the experience I'm having at the moment. I know I need to work on filling out the rest of the specialization to get more passive traits unlocked, but I also feel like I'm doing something wrong when it comes to actual gameplay.

While I was leveling, I ran flamethrower, flame turret, thumper turret, and supply drop for my utilities, and spent 99% of the time with the flamethrower. Turrets were there for veteran/champion enemies where I needed extra tankiness, with the thumper turret doing knockdown and holding threat, and the flame turret providing smokescreen.

I swapped out my explosives tree for alchemy, following some scrapper builds I've seen posted online, and now I'm running two elixirs (the stat buff elixirs, cant remember which letters they are), and flamethrower in my third utility slot, I still like the flamethrower and switch to it often, especially against enemies that knock down/back repeatedly or large groups where the flamethrower can AoE better than the hammer.

Still, I feel like I'm taking a lot of damage, and not doing much in return. I'm not seeing any of the tankiness that people say scrapper is known for. Could just use some tips to improve my gameplay at this point.

Alchemy is chosen primarily for Might stacking in PvE. You have 3 passive traits that grant you access to Elixir skills in Alchemy and with HGH you get quite some Might just out of this core specialization alone. And you stack Might with your hammer auto attacks too. (By the way, the weapon is actually quite survivable with an evade skiil (#3), a blocking skill (#4) and a CC skill (#5) built-in to help you mitigate incoming damage.) And the most important benefit of all the might stacks only kicks in until you unlock Impact Savant, which grants you Barrier based on the amount of damage you deal against your foes. Together with Thunderclap and Shredder Gyro you will stack up quite some defense, particularly when fighting against multiple opponents. But to effectively achieve all these, first you still need to be properly equipped to deal at least decent damage.

As for Stability, run Bulwark Gyro and Elixir U. If you still feel like not having enough, throw in Elixir B for its toolbelt skill, which also grants you Stability, or alternatively Blast Gyro for also tis toolbelt skill, which breaks you out of stun. And if CC still troubles you, run Tools as your third specialization for Reactive Lenses. And if that still does not help, maybe you need to either prioritize on bursting down enemies that can CC you, or if no avail, to block/evade inbound CC attack.

The builds you see posted online are not designed for people still struggling to unlock the entire elite specialization with half decent gear. My recommendation would be to switch back to what you used to run and feel comfortable running until you unlock everything and acquire at least a full set of exotic level 80 equipment. (Also, ascended trinkets are easily available if you have not.) There is really no point for you to run Alchemy at the moment since it probably provides little to no synergy to your current build.

@Obtena.7952 said:Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

I get what your saying and its great we all come up with different ways to do the same thing, i couldnt get on with the FT, guess its just me, i just found in open world PVE trying to catch up (LW3/HOT/POF) that scrapper with hammer on multipul targets - Thunderclap/Electro whirl + Spare capacitor/Shredder Gyro just wrecks everything around me.

Be Safe

@"Obtena.7952" said:Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

You can also come with a full zerk build, send an auto of nades to tag, and afk in some safe spot, scaling event with 0 damage build just to "avoid dying" will actually hinder & kill other player who would have enjoy the content more without your presence

@haattila.5974 said:

@"Obtena.7952" said:Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

Sure, there are lots of things you can do ... I don't see what that has to do with what I'm talking about here. I never suggested AFKing in a safe spot with zero damage. It's not even possible to do that with FT Engi because of the medium range of the weapon. I mean ... if you got a point here, just say it. Don't dance around like people know what you are implying.

@Obtena.7952 said:

@haattila.5974 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

the point is here, what you advocate is the same as afking, period

Heres the Flamethrower-Scrapper-Build for you:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PeQAQlRwcYQsOWJOuLftfA-zRIYRUwXGtVA1lA2OLRssB-e

And heres the good build:http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?PeQAIlRw0YcMIWJO2LvtfA-zRIYRUwXG1mAVUA2ONUYGA-e

@haattila.5974 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@haattila.5974 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Sometimes I wonder if people proclaiming how garbage FT Scrapper is in PVE just don't want you to get bags AND survive hard encounters while doing it. Regardless, such proclamations are ignorant. Hitting MULTIPLE mobs is going to be way more useful than any fractional damage increases you get from non-AOE weapons and FT has such a good relation with Scrapper because of Juggernaut that it's almost worthless to consider anything else. Be assured, there is PLENTY to like about this build and if you aren't fighting multiple mobs and want better single target DPS, nothing prevents you from swapping to your hammer either.

Well, that is absurd. You might not like FT ... but it's the same as playing AFK and having zero damage? Wow ... what's your agenda here? Are you going to tell people how to OW PVE so it benefits you at their expense ... based on sensational statements that don't make sense? You realize that's not inline with the philosophy of the game right? You know you got even LESS of a position to push optimized builds in OW than you do in instanced content right? You realize that it's actually NORMAL for people to play builds you appear to consider trash right? But here you are. I'm sure this will be fun.

Be assured that it will be made clear to the OP that he is free to play this game how he wants ... ESPECIALLY when it comes to OW content, despite whatever nonsense you want to post about the usefulness of builds you don't approve to push an agenda.

@"Lynx.9058" said:

I'm using almost all berserker gear, so power/precision/ferocity I think.

First, don't play Scraper or any other elite spec before you unlock ALL skills!Second, berserker gear is for max Power dps, which is required for fractals and raids but for open world i would recommend you Marauder gear (power/precision/ferocity/vitality), if you struggle a lot: slightly less dmg, huge buff to your health pool. Anyway, while both Berserker and Marauder stats are optimal for Scraper playstyle, they are not that good for Flamethrower, which is more condition oriented "weapon".If you really wanna stick with Flamethrower get yourself a gear with condi stats such as Sinister or Viper's gear for max dmg or Carrion, Trailblazer for more defensive playstyle, but as condi Engineer you can forget about Scraper and Hammer :) Only core Engi can be played as condi. Double pistols, Flamethrower and you are fine.

Never got the feel or understanding of Scrapper. Took some of the ideas in this thread along with linked builds (no ascended gear, though) and fumbled around in newbie zones to try to get a feel for the mechanics (no pun intended). Still not getting the grenade/bomb kit and how/why it works. Had some fun with hammer though. Didn't know about the crazy barrier generation. Seemed neat.

Any advice would be helpful if anyone cares to help explain more to this filthy casual player. ;)

@"kharmin.7683" said:Never got the feel or understanding of Scrapper. Took some of the ideas in this thread along with linked builds (no ascended gear, though) and fumbled around in newbie zones to try to get a feel for the mechanics (no pun intended). Still not getting the grenade/bomb kit and how/why it works. Had some fun with hammer though. Didn't know about the crazy barrier generation. Seemed neat.

Any advice would be helpful if anyone cares to help explain more to this filthy casual player. ;)

I prefer hammer + all gyros for Scrapper. This build. You use hammer 99% of the time. Rifle is really only for tagging and cases where I need to be ranged, but even in that case I usually prefer to use mortar.

You're using hammer skills 1,2,5 primarily (usually lead with 5), and shredder/bulwark gyro pretty much on CD. Being aggressive in your attacks helps to keep up barrier - it's sometimes feels counter-intuitive, but sometimes attacking more is the best defense.Hammer 3 is a gap closer and 4 is actually pretty good damage, besides being a block. Use them mostly tactically.F1 I save for the superspeed unless I really need the Protection.F2 (nice daze) and F3 can be on CD or tactically.F4 provides stability & projectile defense so use tactically.F5 I usually save for its very efficient rez of allies.

I do swap in Blast gyro situationally, like doing the Dragon Stand NASCAR run, since it provides group superspeed via Bypass Coating (as does your Medic gyro).

Its so far and gone from meta but it works amazing in pvehttp://gw2skills.net/editor/?Pe0AoqJlRw6YQMHWJW8S9tfA-zRZYiRHnvZQBFRQMKNTgEhR8ApeFoeA-e

@Sifu.9745 said:

@"Lynx.9058" said:

I'm using almost all berserker gear, so power/precision/ferocity I think.

Wrong. Flamethrower is mostly a power weapon.

The auto attack

deals most of the damage from flamethrower and its

all power dmg

. Combine it with juggernaut trait from firearms and all the bottom traits from scrapper. There you go, easy to play build with perma stability and good dmg. The only condition dmg that is notable from flamethrower is the nr 4. But it's small and stationary.

Read the tooltip again: Flamethrower auto attack is power AND condi dmg, like ALL other FT abilities (including ammo), with #5 being an exception. Burning dmg on FT is very powerful. Power dmg is limited to auto attack only, while #2, #3 and #4 barely do any power dmg.

@"Sifu.9745" said:

Wrong. Flamethrower is mostly a power weapon.

The auto attack

deals most of the damage from flamethrower and its

all power dmg

. Combine it with juggernaut trait from firearms and all the bottom traits from scrapper. There you go, easy to play build with perma stability and good dmg. The only condition dmg that is notable from flamethrower is the nr 4. But it's small and stationary.

The condi dmg from the auto and all other abilities apart from nr 4 and the toolbelt skill are pitiful, compared to the power dmg of the auto attack. The main dmg comes from the auto attack. All the broken ass scrapper flamethrower builds in PvP are all power based. The auto attack does an immense amount of dmg with easy 25 might stacks + quickness + while accumulating endless barrier. It still applies condi dmg but the dmg you do when speccing into power is miles higher.

This shouldn't be working like this. Imo flamethrower SHOULD be mainly a condi weapon, since engi has no real viable condi weapon. Sadly power is just way too effectice with the the FT.

So your comment that FT doesn't work well with power builds couldn't be further from the truth. A power specced juggernaut FT scrapper is faceroll easy open world pve gameplay, while in PvP it is among the most hated and toxic builds in the game. Don't believe me? Check out this video:

And he's even playing a rather safe version of the build. It can do a LOT more dmg if you build for it.