@Cyninja.2954 I tag you because you have the strongest stance to argue and I'm curious what you have to say.
Lately I haven't been able to be on at reset. I'm on NA servers. Lately I have to try and complete my fractal runs in between the hours of 2:00 am and 2:00 pm eastern time zone. This is not preferable, but it's just what I have to do right now. Of course you know, participating CM level player base is low at these times in the LFG. Some days are better than others and you get a group within 5 minutes, but other days a group won't form at all and you just have to go do something else for awhile and try again later.
So I feel like a lot of where some people's stance on the matter is coming from, is the standpoint of players who have the luxury of being able to log in around reset each night when the participating CM player base is high. It is important to note that this time frame is small, and not all of us have that luxury.
Here is the type of garbage that happens during off peak hours due to the imminence front of KPs. This just happened to me last night, and the entire time it was unfolding, I couldn't help but to have this thread on my mind https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/114669/no-kp-for-cm-fractals-is-that-gonna-increase-toxicity
- It's like 2:00 am eastern and I get some time to log in and try to run fractals.
- I search the LFG. Unfortunately I see no groups who want to run 100 Sunqua CM, they are all posted as 99/98 CM T4s. I see 3 different CM groups, 3 of them. There is a group with a BS War sitting in it by himself asking for a HB/Alac of 100 ESS. There is another group posting for 50 ESS that has a guardian and a thief sitting in it, and they are asking for alac/bs or dps. Then there is the third group that is a no ESS required CM listing that has a Rev sitting in it who is asking for HB. And then you have me looking to run CM T4s, which I main Soulbeast DPS but can adequately fill HB or Alac or BS if the group needs it.
- I analyze the situation and it hilariously occurs to me that we have a full group of players online at that very moment who want to run 99/98 CM T4s, who encompass a meta fractal party, yet they are divided into different parties due to KP ESS gating. I figured I would wait a few minutes and see which party was getting the most joins, and then I'd jump into the party that was filling the quickest because well, waiting around at 2:00 am in the morning is really boring. I don't care if my group is 90000 KPs or 0, I just want to start and get to playing. I don't really care if my run is +10 minutes or -10 minutes off the usual time frame.
- Must have been something like 5 minutes later, no one was joining any of those groups. I figured I'd take initiative and try to get the night moving because well, waiting sucks. So I joined the 100 ESS group and said to the guy: "Hey we've got two other groups in the LFG who would make for HB/Alac and another DPS. You want to just merge with these guys so we don't have to wait?" He proceeded to move around the fractal lobby so I know he wasn't AFK, but he didn't respond. I sat in there with him for another 5 minutes or so as I watched the LFG. I was ready to bail on him if the other groups were filling, but no one was joining any of these groups. I said to him again: "Yo, you want to merge with at least the 50 KP group?" Then he left party and vanished.
- So I merged with the 50 ESS group and joined their instance, which was a HB and a Daredevil. I immediately said to these guys: "You guys want to merge in that no KP Rev sitting down there in the LFG? Might as well at off peak hours" HB says to me: "Let's wait a few more minutes. People will join." So we wait another 5 minutes or something and another Soulbeast joins. I logged off and back on as Ren for those guys and told them we should just start while waiting for 5th. They seemed to agree but when the ready box popped up, lo and behold the Daredevil had apparently gone AFK during the wait and wasn't hitting ready. The Soulbeast quickly grew frustrated and within a couple minutes of waiting he left the party and vanished. The Daredevil quickly had returned after the Soulbeast left and said he was sorry, that he had his internet browser up in the background while we were waiting. We waited what must have been another 5 minutes or so, and at that point I had actually turned on Netflix in the background while we were waiting. Then the HB just up and left without saying anything.
- I left that group from the Daredevil and joined the no ESS required Rev who was now sitting with a Reaper in his group. I logged into HB for them and asked if it was ok if I changed the LFG to something that would just get players in there so we could start, because the wait times were kind of ridiculous that night. They said sure and I changed the LFG to "99/98 CM All Welcome +2 DPS" and then the group filled with +2 DPS within 60s and we began the CMs. It was a 20m to 30m run, no problems, went smoothly. And I couldn't help to think that if I had just joined this group to begin with, I could have saved myself 30 minutes of dinking around that night. And if I hadn't joined that group, I wouldn't have been able to form an ESS req group at all, unless I wanted to tank an inordinate amount of waiting.
So a few things to note:
- In a high population game that maintains high participation even during off peak hours, KPs are a wonderful system to utilize.
- In a lower population game, for those who can log in right at reset during peak hours, KPs are still a wonderful system to utilize.
- In a low population game, for those who are unable to log in at peak hours, KPs become a toxic system that in some cases completely prevents a group of players from joining together to play content at all. This is because of a placebo effect where the KPs change how players think. The KPs make them believe they are entitled to a standard of play efficiency and it makes them refuse to settle for less. This often results in players wanting to wait out inordinate amounts of time to achieve some desired party standard of efficiency before even beginning play. Even if they waited 20 minutes and failed to form the desired party standard, they'd rather log offline and try again tomorrow, than just get started playing with lowered standards. This is a large portion of the reason why raids died. KP Placebo. It's not that high KP participants believe the low KP participants will fail to complete the content, it's that high KP participants believe the low KPs can't run it properly. And if the high KPs cant' run it properly, they'd rather not run it all.
- ^ That is the very essence of "gamer elitism" where players become so knit picky about how they play, that they don't want to play at all unless everything is perfect. I'm not saying that this is right or wrong, but I am saying that it creates segregation within the community and when population gets low a decade into the game's lifespan, that segregation begins to kill game modes entirely, because players don't want to play together or can't play with certain players or won't allow certain players to play with them, all because of KP segregation. This very real effect can be exampled through the life & death of raids and the story I have written here in this thread.
If players want to live the KP life, they need to understand what they're encouraging within the community's sociology & communication and what they're injecting in the bloodstream of the game's lifeline. And they should understand that maybe this debacle over KPs is less about how a player feel subjectively during their nightly fractal run in the immediate heat of the debate, and a lot more about what can be done to ensure we have an active game mode to keep playing at all, in the coming years of Guild Wars 2.
Sometimes people vouch for things they don't fully understand the full consequences of, myself included.
What is written in this thread is simply what I have noticed to be the eventual cause & effect of KPs in Guild Wars 2 game modes. And that's even including rating & badge icons in competitive modes. It's the same thing, essentially it's KPs, and it has every bit the same exact social consequences as it does with KPs in pve modes.