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Jack of all trades profession

Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

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  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Hybrid stats (e.g. viper) are a good choice for condition-based builds as they only have 2 damage stats rather than 3 like it is with power, but attempting to go any further toward a balanced hybrid usually results in losing more damage than you gain.

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Most classes can do that. Guardian probably has the most flexibility in PvE, performing in all roles. Rev as well. Ranger. Most other classes can fill dps or tanky roles, but healing/support is not always viable.

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The answer to all these questions is: "all professions". They are even in regard of these considerations.

  • The better question to ask is which class offers the most variety of styles while filling said trades.

    Not every class can do every role as well as others, and some are steeply limited in playstyles.

  • Taril.8619Taril.8619 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Guardian would be the most flexible class. They can perform every role to a decent standard.

    They can do Power DPS (Dragonhunter), Condi DPS (CondiBrand), Healing (HealBrand), Boon Support (QuickBrand) and can even Tank.

    As far as hybrid stats go, Condition builds will generally use hybrid stats because Viper has Condition Damage and Expertise on. Some classes can also use Grieving alongside Vipers when they cap out their condition duration (I.e. CondiBrand gets 50% Burn duration from runes and 20% Burn duration from a trait so only needs 30% extra condition duration to cap out)

    Hybrid stats outside of this is generally only used in PvP, where you can see things like Carrion, Sage, Avatar or sometimes even Celestial (Usually only on Elementalists)

    Other than this, there are some other classes that can play multiple roles;

    Revenant can play Power DPS (Power Renegade), Condi DPS (Condi Renegade), Boon Support (Alacrigade), Healing (Healigade) and Tank (Healigade)

    Elementalist can play Power DPS (Power Tempest and Power Weaver), Condi DPS (Condi Tempest and Condi Weaver), Boon Support (Aurashare Tempest) and Healing (Heal Tempest)

    Ranger can play Power DPS (Power Soulbeast), Condi DPS (Condi Soulbeast), Healing (Heal Druid) and Tank (Heal Druid)

    Mesmer can play Power DPS (Power Chrono), Condi DPS (Condi Mirage), Boon Support (Boon Chrono) and Tank (Boon Chrono)

    Cat: Meow.

  • @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    The better question to ask is which class offers the most variety of styles while filling said trades.

    Not every class can do every role as well as others, and some are steeply limited in playstyles.

    yes yes this is the better question hahahha so any profession comes to mind?

  • @ralphches.1746 said:

    @Lan Deathrider.5910 said:
    The better question to ask is which class offers the most variety of styles while filling said trades.

    Not every class can do every role as well as others, and some are steeply limited in playstyles.

    yes yes this is the better question hahahha so any profession comes to mind?

    Well, Warrior has tons of weapons for different play styles, but some aren't very good. Ranger is fairly versatile though and can cover most roles with ease. Ranger Greatsword+Longbow is probably the most balanced weapon combination in the game as far as utility, personal sustain, and damage goes.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 14, 2020

    If by "jack of all trades" you mean power, condi, support (mainly heals) : Guardian , ele , ranger, and maybe chrono (more for boons/tanking) if you're talking about PVE.

    You can even say rev, necro and warrior too if you're talking about lesser used builds. There's a support warrior if you really wanted to play it (mainly people that run support spellbreaker in WVW/PVP that play it in PVE for memes), support scourge is an offmeta heal , same goes for support heal renegade (awfully clunky tablet).

    While condi holo certainly exists along with heal scrapper, they aren't common at all and require a lot of work to play.

    The worst spot goes to thief, where condi and healing both aren't as viable as on other classes. The only support thief right now in common use is the consume plasma boon thief.

  • Elementalists first design philosophy was to be a jack of all trades master of none. It has a bit of everything in its kit but doesnt specialize in a particular area. One of the few that can be hybrid damage while also making use of healing power.

  • @FrownyClown.8402 said:
    Elementalists first design philosophy was to be a jack of all trades master of none. It has a bit of everything in its kit but doesnt specialize in a particular area. One of the few that can be hybrid damage while also making use of healing power.

    Engi,rev and ele are all more in the idea of jack of all trades

  • Strider.7849Strider.7849 Member ✭✭✭

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    By far the most flexible and "jack of all trades class" would be guardian. Necessary in every meta environment with functional builds in power, condi, support, and all kinds of hybrid builds you can imagine.

  • here's what I gather
    the most flexible class that is meta is the guardian mainly because it has many builds that is meta in the endgame

    revenant is also viable jack of all trade class that can be considered 2nd to guardian in meta endgame build variations I guess?

    elementalist is also considered jack of all trades although it's more jack of all trades master of non class. it is also a very flexible class that can be a viable hybrid damage with healing power

    ranger also have builds that can be viable power,support,condi. although I think they are more on the pve aspect? because I rarely hear rangers in pvp and wvw

    engineers can be too???

    mesmers are also flexible since they can be power,condi, support(boons) although I hear they are more for pve? cause I hear pvp mesmer took a big hit. (I like this class if only the pvp is more on the misdirection and manipulating your opponents rather than being one hit mesmer and burst skill.)

    warriors have different weapons so it offers different playstyle although they aren't very good

    so my question is are there any classes that can also offer different playstyles other than the warrior in pve/wvw/pvp

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 15, 2020

    What you summarized is more or less correct.
    Guardian is by far the most flexible currently as it can run power/condi/support in all 3 modes.
    Condi rev is rarely run in PVE (everywhere outside 100cm and a few raids) or WVW in comparison but a support rev is common in PVE and power herald is typically in WVW comps/PVP.
    Elementalist is typically run as support in PVP/WVW and DPS in PVE. Masochists that enjoy complicated skill rotations can play condi weaver but there is also condi tempest.
    Despite the complaints ranger is viable in PVP even if it isn't the top class, and in WVW they are run as immob soulbeast for group play. They're meta in all PVE because of high power burst and the support of druid affects 10 for raiding.

    Engineers are rarely run as heals in PVE (usually holo DPS), but are meta in PVP/WVW.
    Mesmers are flexible in PVE but not really in PVP / WVW. In PVP/WVW the confusion condition is reliant on the enemy not cleansing and spamming skills ; the power variant isn't able to burst as hard anymore. In WVW usually chrono is run for boon rip (via Vicious Expression), not damage.
    Warriors aren't bad. Meta in PVE and WVW. In PVP usually run as shout spellbreaker support these days.

  • Elementalist ofc
    You don't even need a Elite spec to do that, AND that's why it is the weakest class.
    Weakest in terms of high damage with low effort, Elementalist doesn't apply in this category like other professions.

  • Dave.6819Dave.6819 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 16, 2020

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    Physical Supremacy: This trait now causes Steal to become Swipe, which reduces the range from 1,200 to 600

    So who's the Thief now?
    2019.04.23 -Anet

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dave.6819 said:
    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    I would say that as it is played the thief is more a mobility and burst specialist than a damage dealing specialist.
    There is also quite a few build options for the thief that are left behind mainly due to a lack of will to play differently. For example, the thief literally overflow with support options that are largely left untouched in favor of a more selfish gameplay mindset (for example, it's not difficult for a DE to permanently keep 25 mights stacks, fury and the stolen skill's boon to up to 10 allies, yet the only thing people think that DE are good for is "damage"). I'm not even talking about the almost disgusting self sustain a thief can achieve if he trule want to play on this field instead of pigeonholing himself into the "hide and burst" gameplay.

    Anyway, it's all a matter of whether you look at the profession in a narrow way or in a broad way.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

  • Dave.6819Dave.6819 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 16, 2020

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

    No1 plays DE in reality tho. Benchmarks are one thing but real raid/fract gameplay is different. Try to be #2 with DE while sitting stationary. Or even fractals for that matter. Gl in CMs with that DE gameplay. U'd be better off with those large hitbox benchmarks like Power DH or even Condi FB. Usually thieves just play Daredevil Power build.. which is way below in your SC benchmark list. I mean.. even SLB is 38k (and it also has Druid heal build) meanwhile Power Daredevil is 35k.

    Physical Supremacy: This trait now causes Steal to become Swipe, which reduces the range from 1,200 to 600

    So who's the Thief now?
    2019.04.23 -Anet

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

    No1 plays DE in reality tho. Benchmarks are one thing but real raid/fract gameplay is different. Try to be #2 with DE while sitting stationary. Or even fractals for that matter. Gl in CMs with that DE gameplay. U'd be better off with those large hitbox benchmarks like Power DH or even Condi FB. Usually thieves just play Daredevil Power build.. which is way below in your SC benchmark list. I mean.. even SLB is 38k (and it also has Druid heal build) meanwhile Power Daredevil is 35k.

    It's a benchmark. In real raids there is room for all kinds of builds. When you get into that you could also argue that thief has a big advantage over say elementalist, which deals similar damage with like a 70 step rotation while thief can do their rotation with their eyes closed. Which is just to say that it's not as bad as all that.

  • Dave.6819Dave.6819 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 16, 2020

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

    No1 plays DE in reality tho. Benchmarks are one thing but real raid/fract gameplay is different. Try to be #2 with DE while sitting stationary. Or even fractals for that matter. Gl in CMs with that DE gameplay. U'd be better off with those large hitbox benchmarks like Power DH or even Condi FB. Usually thieves just play Daredevil Power build.. which is way below in your SC benchmark list. I mean.. even SLB is 38k (and it also has Druid heal build) meanwhile Power Daredevil is 35k.

    It's a benchmark. In real raids there is room for all kinds of builds. When you get into that you could also argue that thief has a big advantage over say elementalist, which deals similar damage with like a 70 step rotation while thief can do their rotation with their eyes closed. Which is just to say that it's not as bad as all that.

    So you're saying.. because Thief has an easy rotation so it's supposed to have 1 build only and not really excel at anything else like healing/support? Not a generalist class. Not a specialist either.

    I mean.. i'd take Holo or FB instead of Thief anyday. Holos dmg is way higher. And FB brings atleast some other stuff on the table. Why take Thief when u can take other classes that dish out more dmg?

    Physical Supremacy: This trait now causes Steal to become Swipe, which reduces the range from 1,200 to 600

    So who's the Thief now?
    2019.04.23 -Anet

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

    No1 plays DE in reality tho. Benchmarks are one thing but real raid/fract gameplay is different. Try to be #2 with DE while sitting stationary. Or even fractals for that matter. Gl in CMs with that DE gameplay. U'd be better off with those large hitbox benchmarks like Power DH or even Condi FB. Usually thieves just play Daredevil Power build.. which is way below in your SC benchmark list. I mean.. even SLB is 38k (and it also has Druid heal build) meanwhile Power Daredevil is 35k.

    It's a benchmark. In real raids there is room for all kinds of builds. When you get into that you could also argue that thief has a big advantage over say elementalist, which deals similar damage with like a 70 step rotation while thief can do their rotation with their eyes closed. Which is just to say that it's not as bad as all that.

    So you're saying.. because Thief has an easy rotation so it's supposed to have 1 build only and not really excel at anything else like healing/support? Not a generalist class. Not a specialist either.

    I mean.. i'd take Holo or FB instead of Thief anyday. Holos dmg is way higher. And FB brings atleast some other stuff on the table. Why take Thief when u can take other classes that dish out more dmg?

    I'm actually not trying to get into it because this is not a discussion about thief. FWIW, in a perfect world I would like all classes to have options. Alternatively, if what you want to hear is that thief is trash and needs more builds in PvE we can go with that, too.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 16, 2020

    He's right though, thief is more for so-called ease of play as a DPS than a strong class overall. Other than shadow portal and a few skips via stealth it doesn't have as much going for it.
    If thief had party quickness as an option rather than on a few select raid bosses with detonate plasma x2 traited with Improvisation then it'd be more viable than just as a DPS.

    The condi variants haven't been that strong due to nerfs stemming from PVP to deadly ambition and the like.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The idea of a single stat set doing both strong support and acceptable DPS in a group setting is largely a dream.
    Guardian, Necro, Ranger or Elementalist are the best examples of what you are looking for in terms of classes. Engineer, Mesmer and Rev can also hang.
    Theif's support option is extremely limited, Warrior's isn't really viable outside WvW.
    But don't fall into the trap of thinking a single gear set will do it. If you want to swap between a strong DPS spec and a strong Support Spec, farm up a second set of gear and leverage the existing equipment loadouts. One for each role.
    The ubiquity of stat selectable exotic armor and the ease of collecting a set of ascended trinkets and weapons means you don't have to compromise the strength of either role.
    The fact you can swap your gear loadout and build any time you are out of combat means you don't have to kitten yourself while still getting the value you are looking for.

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Dave.6819Dave.6819 Member ✭✭✭

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Dave.6819 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @ralphches.1746 said:
    Well the main question is what is the jack of all trades class for you? I know it's very broad for many types of playstyle and modes but which profession do you think that is very flexible that can do so many roles and builds? or which profession that can have different type of support or dps builds in a game mode? Is there any class that can hybrid stats?

    The game tends to favor specialists over generalists, but most classes are capable of performing some sort of support and/or healer role aside from just dealing damage.

    Looking at my Thief (hmm..wondering..) It's a specialist in damage dealing only.. yet it's being outdpsed by most of the other classes that are generalists and have some real build options. Hmm...

    The #2 DPS benchmark currently listed on SC is a thief (DE) build.

    No1 plays DE in reality tho. Benchmarks are one thing but real raid/fract gameplay is different. Try to be #2 with DE while sitting stationary. Or even fractals for that matter. Gl in CMs with that DE gameplay. U'd be better off with those large hitbox benchmarks like Power DH or even Condi FB. Usually thieves just play Daredevil Power build.. which is way below in your SC benchmark list. I mean.. even SLB is 38k (and it also has Druid heal build) meanwhile Power Daredevil is 35k.

    It's a benchmark. In real raids there is room for all kinds of builds. When you get into that you could also argue that thief has a big advantage over say elementalist, which deals similar damage with like a 70 step rotation while thief can do their rotation with their eyes closed. Which is just to say that it's not as bad as all that.

    So you're saying.. because Thief has an easy rotation so it's supposed to have 1 build only and not really excel at anything else like healing/support? Not a generalist class. Not a specialist either.

    I mean.. i'd take Holo or FB instead of Thief anyday. Holos dmg is way higher. And FB brings atleast some other stuff on the table. Why take Thief when u can take other classes that dish out more dmg?

    I'm actually not trying to get into it because this is not a discussion about thief. FWIW, in a perfect world I would like all classes to have options. Alternatively, if what you want to hear is that thief is trash and needs more builds in PvE we can go with that, too.

    Well sorry if it came out wrong. Didn't really wanna focus on Thief either but just gave an example that some classes don't really fit into a generalist role nor does it really fit into specialist role either cuz it doesn't really excel at anything except mobility. When it comes to Thief i guess a very good solution for it would be giving it more options. Like you said - a perfect world scenario where all classes have choices to be damage dealers or healers or tanks or boon supporters. Hopefully next expansion can give those options to every class in the game.

    Physical Supremacy: This trait now causes Steal to become Swipe, which reduces the range from 1,200 to 600

    So who's the Thief now?
    2019.04.23 -Anet