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The CC excuse

How about changing the system so that CC's don't overlap and you actually have to time a "chain" to leave as minimal gap as possible or else have your spam wasted.

If it worked like this, maybe aoe ground / air pollution team combat wouldn't be as bad either.

Also if damage was so high, all you had to do was make cc's non critable, nerf the actual 2 main offenders of ridiculous damage at the time, and or give pvp realm a flat 3k hp increase to everyone.

Comments

  • Thornwolf.9721Thornwolf.9721 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Removing damage on all cc's was a very bad and to no surprise lazy balance decision, sure when looking at them Individually a few should have been adjusted for sure, but to remove damage on all cc was so bad. Huge hammer smashing the top of ur head stunning u makes sense to do zero damage.
    The timing of chain cc's will never happen because the devs prefer to dumb down the game not add complexity.

    That and the classes who hold a pure CC built kit (Primarily warriors) are not well liked, it seems. By devs or community overall. So of course the nerfs would strike at the core Ideal of their kit... shield bash not doing damage? Bulls-rush? Head-butt? All of these skills look and feel like they should hit hard if they land. But they dont now. Jade winds? Well that we know should be hitting hard.... again nope.

    I think some CC's like pulls and such shouldn't I think that perhaps stuff like Stomp shouldn't and maybe the mallyx leap shouldn't. But every CC is not created equal, and some just feel like a waste when they dont do damage... they could of just shaved damage off and toned it down but nah... easy to implement changes of blanket nerfs makes it take less time to balance content that they dont care about.

  • Bazsi.2734Bazsi.2734 Member ✭✭✭

    @TeqkOneStylez.8047 said:
    How about changing the system so that CC's don't overlap and you actually have to time a "chain" to leave as minimal gap as possible or else have your spam wasted.

    If it worked like this, maybe aoe ground / air pollution team combat wouldn't be as bad either.

    Also if damage was so high, all you had to do was make cc's non critable, nerf the actual 2 main offenders of ridiculous damage at the time, and or give pvp realm a flat 3k hp increase to everyone.

    How would you go about implementing such a system? For one I have no idea how to do this without ruining the game. Immunity stacks, personal breakbars etc; whatever model you chose it just looks terrible.

  • KrHome.1920KrHome.1920 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    The timing of chain cc's will never happen because the devs prefer to dumb down the game not add complexity.

    ???

    Timing chain cc's is how I achieve 90% of my wins.

  • Eugchriss.2046Eugchriss.2046 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 15, 2020

    @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @TeqkOneStylez.8047 said:
    How about changing the system so that CC's don't overlap and you actually have to time a "chain" to leave as minimal gap as possible or else have your spam wasted.

    If it worked like this, maybe aoe ground / air pollution team combat wouldn't be as bad either.

    Also if damage was so high, all you had to do was make cc's non critable, nerf the actual 2 main offenders of ridiculous damage at the time, and or give pvp realm a flat 3k hp increase to everyone.

    How would you go about implementing such a system? For one I have no idea how to do this without ruining the game. Immunity stacks, personal breakbars etc; whatever model you chose it just looks terrible.

    It's super trivial. It's basically another cooldown. As you can't use a skill which is on cooldown you can't CC a guy who is on "CC-able" cooldown. The cd value is setted by the skill which CC you and that cd is resetted if you breakstun. In term of coding, it is really easy to do.

  • To clarify for those confused an example would be: If you get hit with a stun that lasts 3 seconds, and then someone comes in and uses a knockdown on you before the stun is over, you don't get knocked down. You finish however much time was left of the 3 seconds. So basically when you are cc'd you go into inactionable state that lasts the duration of whatever the CC duration is which disallows you to have another CC overlap. This gives you a window to get out of incoming random CC spam and would mean if you want to chain CC someone, then you have to start your next CC as the 3 second stun is ending to re CC them.

    If timed well enough you basically stunlock anyway, but if not then the target might have enough of a window to act between and interupt or just escape.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @KrHome.1920 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    The timing of chain cc's will never happen because the devs prefer to dumb down the game not add complexity.

    ???

    Timing chain cc's is how I achieve 90% of my wins.

    Yeah and what skilled timing it takes with necro and its specs lol. Nothing about necro nor its spec requires much skill. Cool theme tho.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Thornwolf.9721 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Removing damage on all cc's was a very bad and to no surprise lazy balance decision, sure when looking at them Individually a few should have been adjusted for sure, but to remove damage on all cc was so bad. Huge hammer smashing the top of ur head stunning u makes sense to do zero damage.
    The timing of chain cc's will never happen because the devs prefer to dumb down the game not add complexity.

    That and the classes who hold a pure CC built kit (Primarily warriors) are not well liked, it seems. By devs or community overall. So of course the nerfs would strike at the core Ideal of their kit... shield bash not doing damage? Bulls-rush? Head-butt? All of these skills look and feel like they should hit hard if they land. But they dont now. Jade winds? Well that we know should be hitting hard.... again nope.

    I think some CC's like pulls and such shouldn't I think that perhaps stuff like Stomp shouldn't and maybe the mallyx leap shouldn't. But every CC is not created equal, and some just feel like a waste when they dont do damage... they could of just shaved damage off and toned it down but nah... easy to implement changes of blanket nerfs makes it take less time to balance content that they dont care about.

    I agree, cc needed to be looked at individually for each class for consideration on what adjustments should be done for each not this lazy kitten of here's one adjustment to cc, lets just tack that one adjustment to a all cc and call it balancing.
    Kinda sad, games gonna be cool in another ur following this path lol.

  • That feature of not allowing to overlap cc is flawed not only because 3 sec cc could fail but also because most ccs arent instant cast. Meaning you need to hit that specific timing half a second in advance, but its also not quite half a second (cause it donesnt necessarily cc at the end of the animation).

    In other words chain cc would be extremly hard to pull of if even cpmpared to the counterplay. As spamming the roll button, which you can also do right now gets you out of any stunlock attempts that are not overlaping or perfect anyways.

    We play a game where all classes have access to abilities that cam get then out of stunlocks ("break stun" effect) some even paired with cc imunity (stability). If somone reads/ reacts to your stunbreaks and gets you again then its only fair for you to be stunned. (aside from the fact that you can have more stunbreaks and other tools like thief steal, blinds, corona burst EE for 5k dmg etc).

    There is counterplay to CC both hard CC and soft CC (although they have to share with condi)

  • Tharan.9085Tharan.9085 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ragnar.4257 said:
    "Oh, I just used my 60s cooldown 3s-knockdown, and it landed, but it didn't count because my team-mate already hit 0.25s daze with Headshot"

    This is why this will never happen.

    You'll never get a mechanic in game where 1 player can screw over another player on the same team.

    Spellbreaker on release with 8k fc

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Eugchriss.2046 said:

    @Bazsi.2734 said:

    @TeqkOneStylez.8047 said:
    How about changing the system so that CC's don't overlap and you actually have to time a "chain" to leave as minimal gap as possible or else have your spam wasted.

    If it worked like this, maybe aoe ground / air pollution team combat wouldn't be as bad either.

    Also if damage was so high, all you had to do was make cc's non critable, nerf the actual 2 main offenders of ridiculous damage at the time, and or give pvp realm a flat 3k hp increase to everyone.

    How would you go about implementing such a system? For one I have no idea how to do this without ruining the game. Immunity stacks, personal breakbars etc; whatever model you chose it just looks terrible.

    It's super trivial. It's basically another cooldown. As you can't use a skill which is on cooldown you can't CC a guy who is on "CC-able" cooldown. The cd value is setted by the skill which CC you and that cd is resetted if you breakstun. In term of coding, it is really easy to do.

    you misunderstand him. programing such system is trivial.
    having it actually be improved to how it currently is, is another matter.
    I played games with many many different was of CC reduction, resets, removes, immunities and other but they ALWAYS sucked.
    CC should always work, and you should have a panic anti CC button, thats it.
    if CC is such a problem give EVERYONE extra button that gives stab ( can be cast while controlled ) lets say 2 stacks for 2s. 100s cd. Then you actually have to think how and when to use it and not have skills randomly not work.
    For example off the top of my head this " system " would make
    revs staff charge not work properly
    grav well would get kitten
    spin daze rev thing wouldnt work
    mesmer F3 would get screwed up, in fact lots of power mesmer combos would suffer big time.