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Fix confusion for pve

Confusion damage over time should be affected by condition damage. It does no damage now. Every spec that use confusion is garbage in pve. Give it a 0.6 modifier like the other conditions. This is for pve only

Comments

  • Black Storm.6974Black Storm.6974 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2020

    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    If a profession, for this reason, don’t get consistently rewarded for its high condition damage, maybe ArenaNet could consider to add more damage from a different condition to this profession. There are many ways to achieve that and that could even be somehow tied to the usage of Confusion.

    An example is the Reaper trait “Deathly Chill” that apply Bleeding every time Chill is applied. Chills can maintain is uniqueness and main purpose, but we have a way to use it to make more Condition damage.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Black Storm.6974 said:
    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    If a profession, for this reason, don’t get consistently rewarded for its high condition damage, maybe ArenaNet could add more damage from a different condition to this profession. There are many ways to achieve that and that could even be somehow tied to the usage of Confusion.

    An example is the Reaper trait “Deathly Chill” that apply Bleeding every time Chill is applied. Chills can maintain is uniqueness and main purpose, but we have a way to use it to make more Condition damage.

    The thing is they seem to be able to split how much damage skills deal, but not split things like that bleed on chill. So changing confusion so that it ticks for more damage in PvE only seems to be something they can do, while adding bleed on confusion (or something similar) doesn't split and would impact PvP/WvW as well.

    That's sort of the problem with confusion. It's a PvP condition meant to either punish players spamming skills or apply control by forcing them not to use skills. PvE enemies don't change their behavior when confusion is applied, so half of the condition's purpose is irrelevant there. PvE enemies also tend to attack more slowly than players do, so confusion is only good against enemies which have particularly high attack speed.

  • They already addressed this when they changed some skills from doing confusion to doing torment. Right now confusion damage is either balanced on 99% of pve scenarios or on the 1% of fast attackers it is op. I don't see the issue. If you add extra baseline scaling to it suddenly all the condi classes with some level of confusion get a buff and none of them actually need it.

    This is actually really cool in a way as for instance when doing largos you can actually switch up your rotation on some condi builds to prioritise skills that do confusion so it gives some variety to the way you play.

  • @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    @Black Storm.6974 said:
    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    If a profession, for this reason, don’t get consistently rewarded for its high condition damage, maybe ArenaNet could add more damage from a different condition to this profession. There are many ways to achieve that and that could even be somehow tied to the usage of Confusion.

    An example is the Reaper trait “Deathly Chill” that apply Bleeding every time Chill is applied. Chills can maintain is uniqueness and main purpose, but we have a way to use it to make more Condition damage.

    The thing is they seem to be able to split how much damage skills deal, but not split things like that bleed on chill. So changing confusion so that it ticks for more damage in PvE only seems to be something they can do, while adding bleed on confusion (or something similar) doesn't split and would impact PvP/WvW as well.

    That's sort of the problem with confusion. It's a PvP condition meant to either punish players spamming skills or apply control by forcing them not to use skills. PvE enemies don't change their behavior when confusion is applied, so half of the condition's purpose is irrelevant there. PvE enemies also tend to attack more slowly than players do, so confusion is only good against enemies which have particularly high attack speed.

    Thank you for being polite explaining your concerns

  • Nephalem.8921Nephalem.8921 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2020

    @Stavros.8249 said:
    Confusion damage over time should be affected by condition damage. It does no damage now. Every spec that use confusion is garbage in pve. Give it a 0.6 modifier like the other conditions. This is for pve only

    Except for 2 raidbosses where it is incredible op. So op that everything without confusion is underperforming. It is also doing high dmg to bounties.

  • @Black Storm.6974 said:
    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    On the topic of uniqueness, it would be like saying to make torment ticks affected by condition dmg only when you're moving, so I don't really see how it makes it less unique, confusion dmg when not activating skills being very low compared to other conditions just makes it more niche than unique.

  • @necromaniac.7629 said:

    @Black Storm.6974 said:
    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    On the topic of uniqueness, it would be like saying to make torment ticks affected by condition dmg only when you're moving, so I don't really see how it makes it less unique, confusion dmg when not activating skills being very low compared to other conditions just makes it more niche than unique.

    It was designed to be niche. Other conditions was designed to be more consistent in applying their damage. I don’t find these differences to be bad.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Black Storm.6974 said:

    @necromaniac.7629 said:

    @Black Storm.6974 said:
    There is no need to make different conditions less unique by making them work more similarly toward each other. The main damage from Confusion is supposed to be applied when the enemy try to attack, something situational (and situationally very strong).

    On the topic of uniqueness, it would be like saying to make torment ticks affected by condition dmg only when you're moving, so I don't really see how it makes it less unique, confusion dmg when not activating skills being very low compared to other conditions just makes it more niche than unique.

    It was designed to be niche. Other conditions was designed to be more consistent in applying their damage. I don’t find these differences to be bad.

    I disagree. It is a problem because it makes confusion too strong on a small number of opponents while being completely ineffectual against everything else. It is difficult to fix the latter issue without overbuffing it the other way.

    Restoring the damage ticks per second in PvE is one way this could be addressed.

  • I don't think confusion should be changed to tick for more passive damage.
    For most enemies, different conditions are already really redundant, many mobs in PvE don't heal themselves so applying Bleed or Poison or Burning is all the same. We don't need more of the same, it doesn't add to the gameplay value at all. The torment amplification is already weak enough to be ignorable for most purposes and the amount of builds that mainly rely on confusion can be counted on one or two fingers.

    Confusion is a rather rare condition and if you include it in your build you should play around it. If you confuse a melee mob and then run away from it, it will be useless. If you stand in melee range and blind, block or dodge its attacks you might find that confusion hits for quite substantial amounts of damage in a short time.
    True, it stands in a line of skills and effects that suffer from low enemy attack rates like retaliation in core Tyria but in expansion content it ticks quite frequently on many mobs and isn't weak by any means.

    If you don't like the playstyle that comes with utilising it, simply play a build that focuses on other conditions, there are plenty alternatives.