Delete Stormsoul

I know we all love the 2 stacks water arrow Stormsoul deep freeze memes, but stormsoul is absolute garbage.And not garbage as in Blinding Ashes level, where maybe top 20% of pvp and wvw use it and no one else, garbage as in unused by all players and overshadowed in all game modes.

I went to metabattle and snowcrows and searched through every single elementalist build I could find. Result :

• 32 builds not using it.
• 1 outdated build using it (from when aeromancer's training was still a tier 2 major trait, more than a year agoThis trait is so bad that even the Healing tempests that use Air trait Raging Storm instead of Stormsoul.I'd say this is probably the case because of 2 things :

1. Ele has a wide variety of cc (knockdown, knockback, launch ,daze, pull, float, sink, immobilize, cripple, chill, freeze and finally stun) out of witch only the last two mentioned are improved by the stun duration part of the trait, so the utility of the trait rarely comes into play, and
2. Raging Storm, that's on the same tier, is an absolute monster of a trait, granting you 50%-66% furry uptime alone and providing free ferocity whenever you have furry, making the very rare 10% dmg increase of stormsoul a joke. I think this setting makes it so that even if Stormsoul was a decent trait that increased all your cc's durations and provided the same damage increase, it would still be just as unused.

It's a cool idea of a trait, but sadly extremely bad. I wouldn't usually suggest nerfs for my main class, but maybe replacing the very boring Ferocious Winds with Stormoul and then adding something else could also be an option if this trait needs to be kept somewhere(for synergy with future specs).

Stormsould is nothing but a hollow husk of Tempest Defense that was thrown into our faces when the former was removed so that we don't complain that we're the only class with only 2 major master traits in a spec.

In 3 days it will be 2 full years since this trait was added, 2 full years since this trait was adjusted, 2 full years since this trait was last used, and also 2 years longer than this trait needed to exist.

In any case & TLDR , the 3rd major master trait in the air specialization needs to go, and be replaced with something worthy to be there.

I agree. Plus, once more we have a trait that benefit mostly to tempest rather than core ... It's becoming a habit.But hey, we already have 3 300sec icd traits (I think it's a record) since February + as I said a lot of traits that benefit more to tempest than core or weaver ... the developpers can't work on all priorities at once.

Actually they're not working on Elem, but I mean in general.... 

Well, in general they're not working on elem, but I mean after the extension pack.

I haven't run fractals in ages but don't high level fractals where you get consistent break bars have it as a meta skill? At least I know I used to run it (provided I had an alternate source for fury and reliable team CC)

@Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:the developpers can't work on all priorities at once.

It sure looks like their only priority is new black lion items every other month, but hey what do I know. At least the artists are doing their jobs.

1. Ele has a wide variety of cc (knockdown, knockback, launch ,daze, pull, float, sink, immobilize, cripple, chill, freeze and finally stun) out of witch only the last two mentioned are improved by the stun duration part of the trait, so the utility of the trait rarely comes into play, and

I'm afraid I don't quite follow? The Trait mentions that knockdown, knockback, launch, daze, pull, float, sink and stun all work.

2. Raging Storm, that's on the same tier, is an absolute monster of a trait, granting you 50%-66% furry uptime alone and providing free ferocity whenever you have furry, making the very rare 10% dmg increase of stormsoul a joke. I think this setting makes it so that even if Stormsoul was a decent trait that increased all your cc's durations and provided the same damage increase, it would still be just as unused.

Indeed. I do believe that the 3rd Major Master Trait in Air should therefore not be based around DMG. However, that leaves Air with not a lot of options inside its identity. A CC Trait would be the perfect here.

It's a cool idea of a trait, but sadly extremely bad.I agree. It's working based on one established Identity of Air: (single target) CC.It also tries to compete with the other Major Master Trait of Air, which will always make one of the two Traits undesirable.

@Bleikopf.2491 said:

1. Ele has a wide variety of cc (knockdown, knockback, launch ,daze, pull, float, sink, immobilize, cripple, chill, freeze and finally stun) out of witch only the last two mentioned are improved by
   the stun duration part of the trait
   , so the utility of the trait rarely comes into play, and

Stormsoul : Deal increased damage to disabled foes. Outgoing stun duration increased.Keywords, keywords...

@vardeleanu.8972 said:

@Bleikopf.2491 said:

1. Ele has a wide variety of cc (knockdown, knockback, launch ,daze, pull, float, sink, immobilize, cripple, chill, freeze and finally stun) out of witch only the last two mentioned are improved by
   the stun duration part of the trait
   , so the utility of the trait rarely comes into play, and

Oh, that makes so much more sense now to me. I always assumed it was outgoing disabled duration increased...Yeah, then this Trait doesn't do anything at all.

The lost of the aura on it realty killed it for sure. Air master traits are do dmg (stormsoul), do a lot more dmg (Raging Storm) or be worthless (Inscription). Realy you could delete inscription too at this point its soo bad.

There just soo many worthless and counter productive traits on the core ele lines i am shocked they not reworked the class at this point. If they had a real balancing team.

It maybe time for the ele community to start going though traits and skills that are simply not used and call for them to be deleted form the game.

@Bleikopf.2491 said:

@vardeleanu.8972 said:

@Bleikopf.2491 said:

1. Ele has a wide variety of cc (knockdown, knockback, launch ,daze, pull, float, sink, immobilize, cripple, chill, freeze and finally stun) out of witch only the last two mentioned are improved by
   the stun duration part of the trait
   , so the utility of the trait rarely comes into play, and

Yes and you only have stun with dagger air#3 (schoking aura) and Staff air#5, or with the schoking from Tempest Air overload. It doesn't work with the elite elementalAnd If I remember the damage modificator doesn't work either with Lightning Rod (The damage is not affected at first (unless you chain cc against a disabled foe))

The utility of the +33% is really situational, I don't think it's useless (It works okai for a fresh-air tempest in pvp for example) but usually you'd benefit more of fury uptime, and the +10% damage ... kinda poor ...

Air Traitline has only one form of damage in it's identity: Crit.Raging Storm is the damage Trait in Major Master for Air. Having any kind of other dmg Trait compete with it won't work.Therefore, we want utility options.

@Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:The utility of the +33% is really situational, I don't think it's useless (It works okai for a fresh-air tempest in pvp for example) but usually you'd benefit more of fury uptime, and the +10% damage ... kinda poor ...

And I'm afraid this won't be enough.By all means, I want Anet to work more towards the CC identity of Air on this Trait. But the current iteration does not achieve anything worthy of a Major Trait.Might as well kick Zephyr's Speed and put Stormsoul in there. At least then we don't have to be disappointed in either Trait anymore.

@Zeesh.7286 said:I haven't run fractals in ages but don't high level fractals where you get consistent break bars have it as a meta skill? At least I know I used to run it (provided I had an alternate source for fury and reliable team CC)

Elementalist has too many damage modifiers and this one is really only useful in fractals. They could just delete 1/3rd of the modifiers and buff the base weapon skills, while replacing the traits with actually useful stuff. Would be good for the class, instead of having this disadvantage of having to get a modifier on every single trait choice.

Stormsoul is what make the ele good in Fractals, without it, you can say goodbye to ele in CMs, so no.... ele already got deleted from wvw, don't delete it from another gamemode, if you want to delete an usless trait, inscription and lighting rod are here for you.

@WindBlade.8749 said:Stormsoul is what make the ele good in Fractals, without it, you can say goodbye to ele in CMs, so no.... ele already got deleted from wvw, don't delete it from another gamemode, if you want to delete an usless trait, inscription and lighting rod are here for you.

10% dmg not that massive to remove you from pve how often do you cc a mob vs having +12% crit dmg when you have fury up?

@WindBlade.8749 said:Stormsoul is what make the ele good in Fractals, without it, you can say goodbye to ele in CMs, so no.... ele already got deleted from wvw, don't delete it from another gamemode, if you want to delete an usless trait, inscription and lighting rod are here for you.

Lightning rod is good for some builds, and is my favorite choice most of the times. Don't touch it ?

@Jski.6180 said:

@"WindBlade.8749" said:Stormsoul is what make the ele good in Fractals, without it, you can say goodbye to ele in CMs, so no.... ele already got deleted from wvw, don't delete it from another gamemode, if you want to delete an usless trait, inscription and lighting rod are here for you.

Busted breakbars are near-permanent in high-level instanced content like Fractals, to the point where one of the most common sigils taken for all classes does the same thing that Stormsoul does, more or less.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_Impact

Damage in this game is exponential, so after the bar breaks you're doing 1x1.50x1.10=165% damage. The other trait is a more reliable, consistent option, but its overall damage is lower unless you're crit-capped, at least in such environments.

(Parties and squads usually provide permanent Fury, so having a source of Fury is also unnecessary.)

In open-world or solo play, of course the Fury stacking and extra Ferocity is far superior.

The problem with threads like these is they show a lack of experience with builds. For example some players are saying Inscription is bad, when its the backbone of Elemental Summoning builds and they'd be much weaker without it.

@"Hannelore.8153" said:Busted breakbars are near-permanent in high-level instanced content like Fractals, to the point where one of the most common sigils taken for all classes does the same thing that Stormsoul does, more or less.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_Impact

Ah yes, the 3% permanent damage increase that occasionally turns to 7%.There's this funny thing, called Superior Sigil of Force, and to my understanding they're usually used together, but if they're not someone would rather take force than impact. Wonder why that is ? Why is 5% permanent damage better than a 3 that turns to 7% when your enemy is cc'd?

I was going to let this be a rhetorical question, but I realised that some people might actually not know, so I'll explain. The time it takes for the enemy defiance bar to recover will always at least double the time the enemy is stunned. That's just how game mechanics work. A simple look at the wiki will tell you that the smallest defiance bar recovers in 15 seconds, and I don't know about high tier fractals, but I'm sure the enemy doesn't just sit there stunned for 8 seconds. Add in the time it takes you to break the defiance bar and it becomes pretty obvious that Force is a lot better.

Why is this important ? Because Sigil of impact is only taken because when you're crit capped and already have sigil of Force, then a 3% dmg sigil is the only other existent sigil that will further increase your damage.Sigil of impact is simply the only one that can, occasionally, activate the 7% side effect, so that's why it's taken over Ghost Slaying and the such (obvious exception being sigil of the night, but that's beyond the point)

I'd say that comparing stormsoul with Sigil of Impact is ridiculous to begin with, but it's accurate to some degree : both are 2nd tier damage choices, one inferior to a fellow sigil and another to a fellow trait. The difference is that you get 2 sigil slots, but only 1 major trait

The other trait is a more reliable, consistent option, but its overall damage is lower unless you're crit-capped, at least in such environments.It's a direct dmg buff, not an all dmg buff. Power weaver crit-caps with full berserker, furry and an accuracy sigil, and Condi builds don't even run air, so thank you for agreeing with my point that even in such dedicated environments raging storm is "a more reliable, consistent option", which provides overall better damage (since you are crit capped on power ele)

The problem with threads like these is they show a lack of experience with builds. For example some players are saying Inscription is bad, when its the backbone of Elemental Summoning builds and they'd be much weaker without it.

Inscription is bad, and elemental summoning builds are bad too if you want to play any end tier content, competitive or PvE. But at least Inscription is important from a design perspective, since it gives the player the option to directly improve how certain skills work, and use those preferred skills more often, witch is really important for player happiness, creating a choice or at least illusion of choice. I'm sure a lot of new players that just get into the game and start leveling their eles have a fun time with it. So on this trait I'd say both opinion sides are valid

I'd say a much bigger problem for threads like this is "experienced" end game content players running a build that they took from somewhere for ages, doing the same thing that everyone around them does without bothering to try to understand why they use certain skills/traits in their build, or what those skills/traits really do, and then coming here to comment about balance with a false sense of superiority.Wouldn't you agree ?

@vardeleanu.8972 said:

@"Hannelore.8153" said:Busted breakbars are near-permanent in high-level instanced content like Fractals, to the point where one of the most common sigils taken for all classes does the same thing that Stormsoul does, more or less.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_Impact

I think they should just shuffle it around.

If left in Master tier, it is never gonna compete with Raging Storm which is so much better.They could swap it with Adept's One With Air and I can still see many builds not picking it, but LR builds now aren't forced to pick between "More damage" and "Alot more damage" for Master tier traits.

@"Yasai.3549" said:I think they should just shuffle it around.

If left in Master tier, it is never gonna compete with Raging Storm which is so much better.They could swap it with Adept's One With Air and I can still see many builds not picking it, but LR builds now aren't forced to pick between "More damage" and "Alot more damage" for Master tier traits.

What anet likes to do when they "shuffle" things on the trait line they tend to nerf the effect. Its not important if they move it up or down in some way they nerf it.

There needs to be a hard line drawn that non used effects needs to be removed from the game or anet will only "limp" alone with updates never fixing the problem.

@"Jski.6180" said:What anet likes to do when they "shuffle" things on the trait line they tend to nerf the effect. Its not important if they move it up or down in some way they nerf it.

There needs to be a hard line drawn that non used effects needs to be removed from the game or anet will only "limp" alone with updates never fixing the problem.

I rather Inscription got reworked or removed then.That thing is way weaker than the Raging Storm or Storm Soul.

@Yasai.3549 said:

@"Jski.6180" said:What anet likes to do when they "shuffle" things on the trait line they tend to nerf the effect. Its not important if they move it up or down in some way they nerf it.

There needs to be a hard line drawn that non used effects needs to be removed from the game or anet will only "limp" alone with updates never fixing the problem.

Inscription should be something like superspeed (+ fury/quickness?) on glyph usage, while stormsoul is swapped for some supportive trait, like removing movement impairing conditions on air swap or giving nearby allies a stack of discharged lightning (or something else, all of these are random ideas). The same needs to happen with GM traits because all 3 focus only on damage, there's no mobility or supportive options in there (however, with suggested change from above, FA could be used for both dps and support builds).

20% dmg on <50% hp targets should IMO be removed from all classes because those traits are just boring and on most of dps builds (on all classes), you'd pretty much always choose them and they don't affect your build at all. In ele's case, BttH could be swapped for aoe quickness on superspeed application for example, or giving all allies with shocking aura and/or allies who enter your lightning fields some extra bonuses like ferocity, static discharge stacks etc for some period. Basically, anything that would enable auramancer or any supportive build to provide some offensive bonuses other than might.

3% doesn't "turn into" 7%, that isn't how those sigils work. They add up to 10% together.