Question for you guys

I heard mirage is used for SPVP not sure how good it is how would you guys describe how good right now mes is in variety builds for SPVP and WVW?

If ANET sees what would you tell them?

@Axl.8924 said:

If ANET sees what would you tell them?

Fix what the real issue is and give us the dodge back.

All of Mesmer, not just Mirage, has been nerfed to the ground. They must bring the other classes down to our level or undo at least some of the nerfs and rework some traits and weapons. We have compiled long lists of changes we want in the past. You could fill a small book with them. They get consistently ignored. At least from the perspective of WvW roaming and I guess PvP.

By variety builds i meant really all the elites included and core builds.

So what weapons would you want changed first? How? lets see if we can fill htis up and get anets attention.

@Yoci.2481 said:All of Mesmer, not just Mirage, has been nerfed to the ground. They must bring the other classes down to our level or undo at least some of the nerfs and rework some traits and weapons. We have compiled long lists of changes we want in the past. You could fill a small book with them. They get consistently ignored. At least from the perspective of WvW roaming and I guess PvP.

Thats why i said mes builds to describe both elites and cores chrono mirage core etc.

Which weapons should they first fix and how_ lets see if anet listens.

Listen im drunk rn so ima make you a promise ill forget to keep. ill make a list of whats wrong with everygin mesmer related, including core, chrono and mirage.howout tnat a christmass promise?

@Leonidrex.5649 said:Listen im drunk rn so ima make you a promise ill forget to keep. ill make a list of whats wrong with everygin mesmer related, including core, chrono and mirage.howout tnat a christmass promise?

Good luck writing that Thesis!

Haha! I'll buy that book, after you find a publisher!Will you sign it for me? I can already imagine the book title: "The Mesmer, For Bad or For Worse"

Probably don't play a mesmer right now in PvP.Or do, just to see how horrible it feels having 1 dodge compared to everyone else.

Mesmers are not in a good place right now to put it mildly.

@Veprovina.4876 said:Probably don't play a mesmer right now in PvP.Or do, just to see how horrible it feels having 1 dodge compared to everyone else.

Mesmers are not in a good place right now to put it mildly.

I like how we were forced to play mirage for so long its not even registering in our brains that its mirage with 1 dodge but mesmer with 1 doge.chrono and core doesnt even exist kekW

P.SI slightly sobered up and ill write what I said ill do just cuz I think its funny.I spend 40 hours painting in terraria for 3s joke so Im not the best at using my time anyways.

Generally don't run mesmer in PVP but for WVW people use it for boon rips (chronos in particular).

In PVP it could be used for the condi burst of ambushes if mirage wasn't 1 dodge (axe is typical for mirages these days that use Jaunt + Blink on top of energy sigils to offset the one dodge) ; power shatter is still a thing if you manage to get it off but it has a huge setup (clone generation outside of scepter needs time even if you trait for clone on dodge) and the potential failure is high.

@Infusion.7149 said:Generally don't run mesmer in PVP but for WVW people use it for boon rips (chronos in particular).

In PVP it could be used for the condi burst of ambushes if mirage wasn't 1 dodge (axe is typical for mirages these days that use Jaunt + Blink on top of energy sigils to offset the one dodge) ; power shatter is still a thing if you manage to get it off but it has a huge setup (clone generation outside of scepter needs time even if you trait for clone on dodge) and the potential failure is high.

Chrono is ok for boonstrip, but honestly, pretty much every other class that can rip boons is better than chrono and has a lot more to offer other than that, be it damage, barrier, boons or healing, often times more than just that simultaniously. Chronos in WvW are there for pulls and boonstrip/clense, and doing that mildly effectively requires 10x more effort than anyone else doing the same thing and also excelling at 3 other things at the same time.

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@"Infusion.7149" said:Generally don't run mesmer in PVP but for WVW people use it for boon rips (chronos in particular).

In PVP it

could

be used for the condi burst of ambushes if mirage wasn't 1 dodge (axe is typical for mirages these days that use Jaunt + Blink on top of energy sigils to offset the one dodge) ; power shatter is still a thing if you manage to get it off but it has a huge setup (clone generation outside of scepter needs time even if you trait for clone on dodge) and the potential failure is high.

This isn't conjecture , people are running sword chronos for a reason. https://gw2mists.com/builds/mesmer/support-chronomancerNull field is also on a cooldown comparable (actually it's better in WVW) to Well of Corruption and unlike well of corruption it doesn't have to contend with enemy scrappers' Purity of Purpose.Couple this with an unlimited target cap on Veil and Tides of Time.

Your other main options are spellbreaker (namely from Winds of Disenchantment, Break Enchantments , and Full Counter and hammer CCs if you run hammer), scourge / reaper (as typically running Spiteful Spirit, not as many boon rips unless running Path of Corruption), and condi renegade/herald or a power herald using mallyx instead of shiro / jalis.

@Infusion.7149 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:

@Infusion.7149 said:Generally don't run mesmer in PVP but for WVW people use it for boon rips (chronos in particular).

In PVP it

could

be used for the condi burst of ambushes if mirage wasn't 1 dodge (axe is typical for mirages these days that use Jaunt + Blink on top of energy sigils to offset the one dodge) ; power shatter is still a thing if you manage to get it off but it has a huge setup (clone generation outside of scepter needs time even if you trait for clone on dodge) and the potential failure is high.

I know, i said it's ok. But it's definitely not as strong as other boonstrip classes.I run the inspiration version of that build, it's fun but honestly it has problems. And that's not a conjecture either.

Illusion of life is meh.Mimicking Null field is awesome and so is gravity well.

Shatter storm is useless because clones will never survive, and +1 shatter for that 1 more boonstrip is not worth taking illusion trait for.Compounding power with minstrel's, come on...Phantasmal haste - most phantasms are bugged and don't spawn, especially the shield ones.Master of misdirection - good but in PvE where you have clonesMaster of fragmentation - again, on a minstrel? It has no impact on boon stripping, only on damage which you're NOT getting with full minstrel's.

The problem with chrono boonstrip and what makes it from being good is that a lot of the skills are unreliable in a fight, especially the core mechanic - clones. Other professions don't have a problem with that. THat's why everyone else is better at the same thing even if they maybe have less options.

So then you run boonstrip chrono where exactly? WVW?

xD seems like there will always and ever be the same discussions about Mesmer. The Chrono Zerg version for WvW is, even with the new changes to chrono, a gimmick build. It can do nothing better then other classes beside high cd cc skills and it will always be the build you want to have 1 or 2 times in your Zerg but please not more. And you don’t take them because they can rip boons and cc very good, you take them because they can do all Mesmer utility skills PLUS a little bit boon rip and cc. The fact that you take shatter storm, Phantasma haste, or rending shatters shows how bad some synergy’s of this build are. Minstrel stats’s? 80% of the weapon skills are not even usefull... No one can tell me that this should be considered a real build.

@Axl.8924 said:So then you run boonstrip chrono where exactly? WVW?

Yes, boonstrip is mainly for WvW. It's not required in PvE, not many mobs or bosses have boons, and in PvP it's kinda bad to build around that and chronos need to build around boonstripping. In PvP you're better off doing damage, with some CC. I don't play PvP though, only WvW so idk what builds exist in PvP.

@Senqu.8054 said:xD seems like there will always and ever be the same discussions about Mesmer. The Chrono Zerg version for WvW is, even with the new changes to chrono, a gimmick build. It can do nothing better then other classes beside high cd cc skills and it will always be the build you want to have 1 or 2 times in your Zerg but please not more. And you don’t take them because they can rip boons and cc very good, you take them because they can do all Mesmer utility skills PLUS a little bit boon rip and cc. The fact that you take shatter storm, Phantasma haste, or rending shatters shows how bad some synergy’s of this build are. Minstrel stats’s? 80% of the weapon skills are not even usefull... No one can tell me that this should be considered a real build.

Yeah, that metabattle and gw2mists builds are horrible. I don't know why people keep taking illusions with that build and then going minstrel on gear? Illusions are for buffing clones and shatters and damage. Good luck with all that in WvW on a Minstrel!

Taking inspiration has way more synergy than illusions.

That's just an example of one of the builds people run in WVW. Illusions is taken for the ammo on shatters and phasntasmal haste means the Phantasmal Berserker (which rips boons) attacks faster.

If you play WVW over an extended period of time you would know that since July 2020 patch mesmers started to see play again.

For PVE , the most common use of boon rip is in fractals with No Pain No Gain or Vengeance where it is usually covered by a Renegade.

hmm thinking of mirage 1 dodge sounds pretty ridiculous since everyone else gets at least 2-3 dodges per stamina bar.

@"Infusion.7149" said:That's just an example of one of the builds people run in WVW. Illusions is taken for the ammo on shatters and phasntasmal haste means the Phantasmal Berserker (which rips boons) attacks faster.

If you play WVW over an extended period of time you would know that since July 2020 patch mesmers started to see play again.

I know the idea behind taking illusions, i just don't know why they keep taking it in the current state. That would be great for the build IF summoned clones and phantasms would survive at all. This is especially evident in group fights, you can't rely even on phantasmal berserker to spawn let alone clones, so that shatter skill is "meh" if you use it only on yourself, and quickness won't do the berserker any use if he dies instantly.

I'm just saying, mesmer has problems that go way too deep, and very unreliable skills. And that build focuses on all the broken unusable things mesmer has, that's why it's bad, not because the idea is bad.

Still... Illusions is great for roaming and small scale.But it's useless in group and zerg fights, you'll never get the benefit of shatter skills or phantasms.

@Infusion.7149 said:That's just an example of one of the builds people run in WVW. Illusions is taken for the ammo on shatters and phasntasmal haste means the Phantasmal Berserker (which rips boons) attacks faster.

If you play WVW over an extended period of time you would know that since July 2020 patch mesmers started to see play again.

---

For PVE , the most common use of boon rip is in fractals with No Pain No Gain or Vengeance where it is usually covered by a Renegade.

quickness doesnt seem to work on phantasmal berserker :)

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Infusion.7149 said:That's just an example of

one

of the builds people run in WVW. Illusions is taken for the ammo on shatters and phasntasmal haste means the Phantasmal Berserker (which rips boons) attacks faster.

If you play WVW over an extended period of time you would know that since July 2020 patch mesmers started to see play again.

---

For PVE , the most common use of boon rip is in fractals with

No Pain No Gain

or

Vengeance

where it is usually covered by a Renegade.

Question was it always like that?

@Axl.8924 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Infusion.7149 said:That's just an example of

one

of the builds people run in WVW. Illusions is taken for the ammo on shatters and phasntasmal haste means the Phantasmal Berserker (which rips boons) attacks faster.

If you play WVW over an extended period of time you would know that since July 2020 patch mesmers started to see play again.

---

For PVE , the most common use of boon rip is in fractals with

No Pain No Gain

or

Vengeance

where it is usually covered by a Renegade.

Since I started playing ( little over a year ago ) it was already ineffective. Someone else might chim in what were happening before that.

@Leonidrex.5649 said:quickness doesnt seem to work on phantasmal berserker :)

I just tested it 10 seconds ago and quickness does apply to the phantasmal berserker

@Infusion.7149 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:quickness doesnt seem to work on phantasmal berserker :)

applies? yes, does it impact the speed of its attack? no.