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  • Blocki.4931Blocki.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's better than expected in many parts, a bit weaker than I had liked in others. I really enjoy the DRMs, but I also took my sweet time with them.

    Pls just permaban me by now so I can stop going back here

  • The idea wasn't bad, it's nice to revisit the far shiverpeaks again.
    Recent releases are not as appealing as the beginning of Saga, the content feels too diluted for me. I've done the first DRMs couple of times, the 2nd batch I've done only to complete the story. I might revisit them to complete the achivements, but not in the near future.

    It's nice to see the old maps in new light, but it doesn't have the appeal of visiting parts of Tyria we haven't seen since GW 1.

  • Pifil.5193Pifil.5193 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 23, 2021

    @Randulf.7614 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Danikat.8537 said:
    As other people have said I think it's a shame they're so obviously rushing it because of the complaints about not having another expansion after season 4.

    Are they?
    I mean when IBS was originally presented to us wasn't it that the last several parts would be with the developers trying to incorporate the aspects they most liked about s1 into the story? or maybe it was a puff peice for an MMO site where this was mentioned. How they wanted to change the story telling near the end to do this.
    Isn't that exactly what they are doing now? Giving us these instances where places we know are under attack/change?
    And if indeed that was the plan all along, then how is it rushed?
    These DRMs have clearly been the plan from the beginning. To transition the game towards a place where they can tell the stories they want without worrying about the headaches that the development approach to s1 created. In a way that makes them repeatable and relevant as group content.
    The problem isnt that they have rushed the end of Icebrood, the problem is that they are spreading it out too thin. What should have been 4 months of content updates now becomes 6-8 while they continue work on the expansion.
    I don't think this was rushed. I think it was the plan all along, but that the DRMs would release weekly or biweekly.

    I like what we are getting, but I will forever wonder what we could have had and how much more interesting it could have been if only people had been willing to give them a chance instead of endlessly going on about the game dying because they didn't have to pay for it.

    To blame the portion of the playerbase is a little puzzling.
    This was the play by Anet,
    Don't be surprised if a lot of your End of Dragons story is told in a similar way.

    Quite so. They hinted at the Champions releases being this way as far back as Feb 2020. We simply do not know if there was a change of direction and if there was, when that happened. It's possible Champions wasn't meant to be the end of the Saga and much more was planned of course. With the Game Director leaving and seemingly never replaced, I suspect some change may have happened around the time of the presentation, but it's clear a lot of this was always going to happen expac or no expac

    Yeah, they said that in February, shortly before Mike Z left and the expansion announcement. However, only 6 months before, around the icebrood saga announcement, Mike Z said that they had no plans of making any more expansions. He also said they had four fully staffed teams to work on the Saga.

    I think it's highly likely that the decision to make an expansion after all resulted in the icebrood saga being redesigned and scaled back. How else would they be able to get the people to make the expansion for this year? The people to design the maps, events and other content? If those four fully staffed teams haven't been redirected to the expansion then what are they doing?

    I didn't like everything in the saga but I have to acknowledge and appreciate the ambition shown in the earlier episodes, new world bosses, the visions of the past, the scale of Drizzlewood, the strikes that came alongside those episodes, the finale seems very incongruous with that scale and ambition shown earlier. A single episode's content starting 4 months after the previous release and stretched out over 7-8 months.

    Is it possible that they always intended to end the saga in this manner? Possible but I think it's very unlikely, this saga is looking increasingly likely to limp to an unsatisfactory conclusion. I can't imagine a world where this was their original plan back when the whole team was focused on it.

  • Dreamy Lu.3865Dreamy Lu.3865 Member ✭✭✭✭

    A 1 from my side.
    I liked somewhat of the prologue in Grothmar. After it, I disliked about 80% of the content. With the last episodes, it's up to 100%.
    I had not finished the "Truce" episode when the new one "Power" came out. I did only first step of this new one and stopped. I didn't complete several of the mastery tracks and it doesn't bother me. Since I play GW2 (since beta), it's the first time that I let story business unfinished and don't care about. It's no good sign.
    However, I don't want to criticize because it's a matter of tastes and preferences. In my case, simply, this content doesn't interest me. That's all.

    WvW server: Henge of Denravi

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Yggranya.5201 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Yggranya.5201 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Danikat.8537 said:
    As other people have said I think it's a shame they're so obviously rushing it because of the complaints about not having another expansion after season 4.

    Are they?
    I mean when IBS was originally presented to us wasn't it that the last several parts would be with the developers trying to incorporate the aspects they most liked about s1 into the story? or maybe it was a puff peice for an MMO site where this was mentioned. How they wanted to change the story telling near the end to do this.
    Isn't that exactly what they are doing now? Giving us these instances where places we know are under attack/change?
    And if indeed that was the plan all along, then how is it rushed?
    These DRMs have clearly been the plan from the beginning. To transition the game towards a place where they can tell the stories they want without worrying about the headaches that the development approach to s1 created. In a way that makes them repeatable and relevant as group content.
    The problem isnt that they have rushed the end of Icebrood, the problem is that they are spreading it out too thin. What should have been 4 months of content updates now becomes 6-8 while they continue work on the expansion.
    I don't think this was rushed. I think it was the plan all along, but that the DRMs would release weekly or biweekly.

    I like what we are getting, but I will forever wonder what we could have had and how much more interesting it could have been if only people had been willing to give them a chance instead of endlessly going on about the game dying because they didn't have to pay for it.

    To blame the portion of the playerbase is a little puzzling.
    This was the play by Anet,
    Don't be surprised if a lot of your End of Dragons story is told in a similar way.

    So, are DRM possible to complete solo? Because if the answer is "no" they might as well not exist. If that is what the future holds, then that's bad.

    Of course they are.
    But to say that content must be soloable to exist in an MMO is among the more misguided comments someone could make.

    From how things are designed in GW2, anet agrees with me. Want to twist my arm in an attemt to make me join your grouping thing? I'll just bail insted.

    So, how is the design of raids, fractals, strike missions, sPvP, and those dungeons that absolutely require a team an indication that Anet agrees with you?

  • Sarrs.4831Sarrs.4831 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021

    Bjora Marches is alright.
    I love Drizzlewood, apart from siege clogging up my bags. It's very Silverwastes v2 which I like and I love long meta-events.
    I was really lukewarm on DRMs at first but honestly they're just a straight up better version of story instances.

    What's there is good, it's just very clearly been scaled back because of the expansion.

    As far as the story goes I'm not really sure. It does feel undercooked, probably because most of the development resources are going into EOD.

  • felix.2386felix.2386 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021

    its just incredibly low budgeted fillers to keep u repeating the same thing till EoD release.

  • crepuscular.9047crepuscular.9047 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021
    • Prologue = 8, Map metas are very player friendly, can easily duck in-out the map during metas, would be nice if the strike is more punishing

    • Bjora P1 = 9, strikes are fun

    • Bjora P2 = 7, still feel like Drakkar meta needs some tuning, strike is fun

    • Vision of Past = 2, good to show us what happened in between, but FS (Fake Strike) is a massive time sink, let us skip to the end Anet, there are 3 bloody choppers just sitting there doing nothing

    • Drizzlewood P1 = 9, meta is good, strike is good too

    • Drizzlewood P2 = 3, plenty of complains on the forum already about the meta, 8 months already still nothing is done about the length of it

    • Champion = 1 (1 for NPC dialogues to push the story forward, so the rest are 0), DRMs are a massive fail, they are just copies of FS, which players already complained how overly boring it is, and it's stupidly difficult to find any cm groups (at least in my play hour, everytime i look on lfg it's empty); btw, why the does new infusion turns players into a kitten man/woman? the Deldrimor dwarves looks like mithril after the Rite of the Great Dwarf in GW1 https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/File:Transformed_Jalis.jpg

    [RIP Fashion Wars 2005-2018]     [TTS] [KA] [SI]     [RIP Fashion Wars 2005-2018]
    Praise the Inevitable Eternal Transcendent King Palawa Ignacious Joko, the Beloved and Feared Undying Eternal Monarch of All !!!
    ... til Aurene ate him for dessert 😭
  • trixantea.1230trixantea.1230 Member ✭✭✭

    The first part of Icebrood was enjoyable but the Champions episodes feel like a scam because all that Anet did is to reuse old maps fill them with different NPCs.

  • acdspydar.8920acdspydar.8920 Member ✭✭✭

    @Fimbulvetr Wraith.2379 said:
    First time in fifteen years they have convinced me to quit guild wars. So a solid rating of one as I can't even try to care. it started well enough but then just became a blubbery, flabby ,and bile-streaked mass of repetitive content. Same ideas just new (ish) places. Honestly I would rank it lower if it were possible.

    I actually agree with this. I feel like the PvE devs found a formula that generated positive responses around the time HoT launched and just kept using the same formula ever since, but have gradually become lazier with the details, while trying to increase the overall difficulty.

    There's been some potentially great ideas, but the execution is lackluster at best. I'm not excited to continue with the story anymore. Maybe, if/when they release EoD, hopefully sooner than soon™, it'll bring fresh and exciting content with unique mechanics and dynamics.

  • Mea.5491Mea.5491 Member ✭✭✭✭

    2/10.
    First 2 episodes/maps are OK but that's about it.
    Story is meh, Charr is my least favorite race so I don't really care about them, sorry.
    I absolutely hate Braham, can we have an option to sacrifice him or something?
    Meta events are lackluster, the metal concert was fun though.
    Masteries are useless, I won't max them because I don't even spend time on the maps where they are relevant.
    DRMs are the worst and most boring content in this game. I'll do them once to finish the story and I'll never touch them again.

  • 8/10

    Yeah, I know I'm the minority, but I kind of enjoy the Icebrood Saga. I don't get why so many people don't like it.
    I don't really have any complaints about anything up to Champions. And when it comes to Champions, my only complaint is that they split it into chapters and now each chapter is a bit short.
    Dragon Response Missions are ok in my eyes, I do 2-3 of them each day ever since they came out. They are like mini story-dungeons to me and the fact that they aren't too difficult is a plus, I don't like difficult content, it would create more toxicity in the game if they were as hard as strikes or raids.
    I also like where the story is going, I expected Jormag to be an enemy from the begging and not an ally.

    What I've always liked in this game the most are the story, world bosses, metas and just doing random stuff through the world.
    I'm not into farming for achievements or high rewards, getting legendaries, doing strikes and raids. Maybe that's why I like it while others don't, dunno.

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This season left me wanting a metal legion encore.

    Storywise, Anet handles horror and slice of life well, but drops the ball when it comes to dragons and dragons watch in general. Maybe it's time to drop the dragon plots, stop the war campaigns, and do some fun slice of life for a season or two?

    Fire and steel was fun. It's like I'm playing alongside other players, so my enjoyment of the content isn't tied to how well they perform. The tank and sniper parts were cool, and the rocket launchers were super metal.

    Strikes and Drms are just horrible. They prove Anet is out of touch with their community, which can be split in two camps - the "100 kp or kick" party, or the "I think melee is scary, I'm a casual" party. Anet needs to seriously consider buffing mesmer gs, ranger longbow or whatever weapon bad players use before pushing this sort of content.

    Drizzlewood is the new meta map of the week, and probably should have been the sole focus of lws5. The first half of the map is fun, but the second half feels like half an hour of follow the commander tag.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021

    Bjora Marches with its dark, spooky forest, puzzles, dungeons and bits of ancient Norn mythology (especially the old library) was fantastic. I also love the weather effect during the first meta, and the variety of events. The story there was enjoyable as well.

    Unfortunately, they missed the opportunity to dive deeper into Norn lore after that and add more hidden places and puzzles and an adventurous mythological feel for the season. :/

    The introduction of Strike Missions is also a big plus in my book. :+1: The newer DRMs are also quite enjoyable, as are the factions event weeks.

    Then there was the lousy implementation of build "templates" - thanks for that. :angry:

    The Charr part I didn't enjoy for most part. Yes, the intro map was a lot of fun and well designed (the jumping puzzle, the concert, the map per se) - but I can no longer take the Charr seriously. A teen warband of unintelligent brats, an imperator who fell from grace (i.e., Smodur), another imperator who's megalomaniacal (i.e., Bangar), more of Rytlock's immature emotions and grumpy babbling, badly written casual modern talk dialogue all over the place (not just Braham but almost everyone). Ugh. Away with it!

    So, overall, rather a disappointment for at least 50% of its content.

  • Daishi.6027Daishi.6027 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021

    This may be arguably unfair, but my conception of content is always taken as a whole. If I cannot enjoy PvP, WvW, I cannot in turn enjoy PvE content. If I cannot enjoy Fractals and Raids with the class or archetype I want to play; I cannot enjoy PvP, WvW.

    Open world content is such a mundane thing, that I can appreciate, and enjoy it as the bridge; but will never be able to hold my attention alone. Even less so when it doesn’t organically facilitate community interactions.

    As it stands now I’m so utterly displeased with PvP, and my main class, and the archetype, that I cannot find enjoyment in Ice brood. Ultimately why would I want to play in a world where I can’t have fun playing what I want to play? Especially when double standards are considered valid to the devs in the competitive and balance scenes.

    I stopped playing around the time we lost voice acting, I only log in for about 5 min to get updates knowing that if I ever did come back I’d have to pay. And I have the expectation the pendulum will eventually swing back; or fall off its chain entirely. (Hence why I even post or try to stay in the loop.) But by the time voice acting was added back it’s been far to late, and the disconnect is to large.

    On top of the fact good will has not been restored; customer service and their fairness has also significantly declined, I and my friend who still play this game have had quit e a few bad run ins in the past few years; which has soured the experience even more.

    Again maybe some of these are unfair standards and conflations. But they had over 8 years to make common problems, not be problems.

  • Kurrilino.2706Kurrilino.2706 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2021

    I somehow have a hard time to even call the last episode an episode.
    It was exactly like the one before without any story. Just portal to 3 locations and hold the town.

    Thank goodness it doesn't matter you archive something or not. At the end of the timer you get the mission complete.
    I just went down the kitchen and let the other players deal with that stuff.

    Why is this garbage even produced????

    Just take the resources and put it into the new expansion

  • Tekoneiric.6817Tekoneiric.6817 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I think the best part of it the trailer. For me it mostly hasn't lived up to the hype of the trailer. The few maps we got were decent but navigating them can be tedious even on mounts. Either the portal scroll should have offered where to end up at or there should have been mesmer portals to send you to the second rally locations on the two maps main maps. The Drizzlewod Coast meta needs a lot of work. It's to long when you do the combined meta. Many including myself have offered suggestions to fix it.

    I'm not a fan of strike missions. I just don't like closed instance format that depends rallying players to form a team to tackle them. I like bounties over strike missions. Yes bounties could be improved but I prefer the open world scramble of players to the target. Closed instance limited player content like strike missions, raids, etc is an environment that isn't friendly to casual players, new ones or players who don't like attitudes the content tends to foster. I'm not against the content because some people like the format. I've offered suggestions to improve them and increase their release speed while making open world players not feeling left out.

    I do think that Dragon Response missions are a good compromise but I feel like the length of the episode have suffered due to their inclusion. Champions chapter 2 was better than chapter one. It felt a like a complete episode, a little short but complete.

    I know that updating old content is never on their priority list but I think the Dragon Response Missions format would be a good way to go back and revamp old content to be more flexible. I could see the format improving Dragon's Stand Meta by splitting the meta into different lane public instances that work like DR missions while leaving the non-meta map open for general exploration. They could triple the number of players doing it. The entry portal could tell players which lane needs support.

  • Poormany.4507Poormany.4507 Member ✭✭✭

    5/10 - The prologue was excellent, but then the Saga just seemed to go downhill for me in many ways. Bjora was an average LW map, and I haven't been back since doing a few of the achievements. Drizzlewood was much better in terms of replayability, but suffered due to the meta event being too long due to the split map. Champions just feels like filler content that solely exists to fill the content drought until EoD is released.

    Story and map-wise, I was expecting a full Jormag vs Primordus expac with epic maps for each dragon, including new underground content, so the Saga putting all of that into a very rushed story was a huge letdown to me ever since they made clear that was the direction they were going. If they kill off Primordus in a single episode of DRM missions without a new map, I will be very disappointed. However, if they do tie the Jormag/Primordus conflict into EoD, I do think it would be a good way to go.

    Gameplay wise, some of the masteries are useful outside of the Saga maps, while others (primarily the Raven and essence ones), just don't feel worth getting due to their limited use. Achievements in the Saga have been very bad imo, as the amount of grind they require makes me not want to start them. Before the Saga, I aimed to get every meta achievement and played regularly to do so, but since then, I only got the prologue one and did not even try to get the others due to boring, repetitive grind (do x event 25-50 times) or expensive skin collection achievements being required for the meta. I really hope they go back to the pre-saga achievement variety (exploration, non-material/gold gated collections, lore collection etc.) in EoD.

  • After seeing Heart of Thorns there's no way I'm spending money on it.

  • My biggest gripe is, the humans got a human centric expansion, the sylvari got one with a lot of lore and info for them, but the charr and norn have to share their 'expansion'? the charr already get shafted on a lot so this has left a very bad taste in my mouth. The writing has been fairly solid but the previously stated has left my view on the full thing tainted.

  • up until Drizzlewood it was quite good, like a 7/8 (still inferior to S4 imo) but this second half... I don't hate it though, I'm enjoying the diff. mechanics with this 2nd round of DRMs but for a LW season it's extremely underwhelming to say the least. and I don't accept the reasoning that it's because the team is working on the expansion - S3 was running fast and even had that extra final episode whilst PoF got finished seamlessly; granted, different times and studio and yet, to portray an epic clash between Jormag and Primordus through these DRMs and "factions" alone is going to be hard to swallow.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    Anet needs to seriously consider buffing mesmer gs, ranger longbow or whatever weapon bad players use before pushing this sort of content.

    Power Longbow Soulbeast can already benchmark over 35k dps. Buffing the weapon is not going to make low-effort players magically contribute at an acceptable level. There is nothing wrong with the weapon.
    Don't get me wrong....whenever I see some someone shockingly underperforming it's 9 times out of 10 a longbow ranger.
    1.5k dps on Bears? Soulbeast
    Won't stack after being repeatedly told to do so? ALWAYS Soulbeast
    I get it.
    But the answer is not buff a spec/weapon that is already overperfoming in the right hands.

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Super Hayes.6890Super Hayes.6890 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Critique all you want. My votes on these matters are always based on how much fun I had.

    The next time you get angry at someone try walking a mile in their shoes. After that, who cares! You're a mile away and you have their shoes! -Someone with more awesome quotes than me

  • Super Hayes.6890Super Hayes.6890 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Didn't realize this was private. I voted 10!

    The next time you get angry at someone try walking a mile in their shoes. After that, who cares! You're a mile away and you have their shoes! -Someone with more awesome quotes than me

  • Excursion.9752Excursion.9752 Member ✭✭✭✭

    You ever watch a movie get half way through it and then come to the realization that its bad? You want to turn it off but you can't because you have already invested to much time into it and its almost over any way so you push through watching the rest of it. This to me is the Saga in a nutshell. I was not in a hurry to get to the new expansion but I have now become antsy. I just want to move on from this.

                                                              There is a 50% chance you will not agree with me and a 50% chance I will not agree with you
    
  • kamikharzeeh.8016kamikharzeeh.8016 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @vier.1327 might add to the poll what u see as good and what as bad. i guess 10 = best / 1 = worst? (in german schools at least, 1 is the best and 5 worst for example)

    i think it's not horrible, suits as the living world saga that it is. but i don't like the strike missions and the dragon response missions alike really, because it's semi-tryharding, like a bit half-baked. not crazy hard, not crazy easy. big variation in the players, sometimes u have weirdos that quit after two minutes, then get a group where you finish the same CM with 5 minutes left or sth alike. i have nearly a 50:50 (maybe 60/40) chance of easy run VS total fail and waste of time atm there.

    i'd have want that stuff to be more openworld-meta-train like... all this waiting for groups is just annoying.

    maybe they could have made this more kitten by just allowing far more player into one instance, like 20, 30, 40 even? then it would be nearly meta-like. (since yes... for the scenarios you need kinda the own instances, i guess)

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2021

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    Anet needs to seriously consider buffing mesmer gs, ranger longbow or whatever weapon bad players use before pushing this sort of content.

    Power Longbow Soulbeast can already benchmark over 35k dps. Buffing the weapon is not going to make low-effort players magically contribute at an acceptable level. There is nothing wrong with the weapon.
    Don't get me wrong....whenever I see some someone shockingly underperforming it's 9 times out of 10 a longbow ranger.
    1.5k dps on Bears? Soulbeast
    Won't stack after being repeatedly told to do so? ALWAYS Soulbeast
    I get it.
    But the answer is not buff a spec/weapon that is already overperfoming in the right hands.

    Ask yourself how and why this weapon is both underperforming and overperforming, and you'll see clear areas that need improvement.

    Power Longbow DPS is strong because 2 and 5 are used in a rotation during one wolf pack + sic' em, before getting swapped out to your primary dagger/axe for that juicy offhand axe damage and dagger autos. It's used as a offhand weapon used for sneaky (melee) dps gains, not a primary (ranged) weapon of choice.

    New players think Power Longbow dps comes from comboing their scaling range autos and point blank shot. They think they're helping by by scattering mobs, because other games and common sense tell you it's easier to pick off opponents rather than fight 20 at once. They think having 1500 range and a knockback means they should never get close to the enemy. New players think ranger means archer, so longbow will be the weapon most newbs will flock to since it fits an archers theme.

    It's my opinion that Ranger Longbow needs some sort of redesign for this exact purpose, because it's painful to play with these sorts of players.

    If Anet expects me to play with other people, I don't want them to hold me back. It seriously affects my enjoyment if the content when everyone stands in fire and dies, leaving me to save the day from a way overscaled 20 minute bossfight.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    New players think Power Longbow dps comes from comboing their scaling range autos and point blank shot. They think they're helping by by scattering mobs, because other games and common sense tell you it's easier to pick off opponents rather than fight 20 at once. They think having 1500 range and a knockback means they should never get close to the enemy. New players think ranger means archer, so longbow will be the weapon most newbs will flock to since it fits an archers theme.

    No.
    Low-effort players who gravitate to longbow ranger aren't thinking about comboing a thing. They are firing all their abilities off cooldown with zero regard for rotation. They are drawn to Ranger for the class fantasy, or because they hop on this very forum and say "what should I play??" and are told by veteran low-effort players that Ranger is easy because they just let their pet tank and pewpew from distance.
    The game itself never punishes the playstyle and no feedback is ever given to the player that they are underperforming. They see numbers they barely understand and are given full rewards during group events without contributing meaningfully. They live in a bubble.
    Lets also be clear that this isn't a "new" player issue. There are plenty of members of the current forum cartel who proudly "main ranger since beta", telling new players that all they have to do is get a brown bear to tank and this will get them over in all content in the game.

    If Anet expects me to play with other people, I don't want them to hold me back. It seriously affects my enjoyment if the content when everyone stands in fire and dies, leaving me to save the day from a way overscaled 20 minute encounter.

    I would counter that Anet expects you to use the tools at your disposal to customize your experience. You can very easily say "no longbow rangers" in your LFG or just ask them to switch and kick them from your group if they don't. Not a thing wrong with that.
    Your group, your rules.
    Additionally you can just play with people you enjoy playing with and who aren't there to take a carry.
    A little personal responsibility goes a long way to making sure your play time is how you like it.

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    New players think Power Longbow dps comes from comboing their scaling range autos and point blank shot. They think they're helping by by scattering mobs, because other games and common sense tell you it's easier to pick off opponents rather than fight 20 at once. They think having 1500 range and a knockback means they should never get close to the enemy. New players think ranger means archer, so longbow will be the weapon most newbs will flock to since it fits an archers theme.

    No.
    Low-effort players who gravitate to longbow ranger aren't thinking about comboing a thing. They are firing all their abilities off cooldown with zero regard for rotation. They are drawn to Ranger for the class fantasy, or because they hop on this very forum and say "what should I play??" and are told by veteran low-effort players that Ranger is easy because they just let their pet tank and pewpew from distance.
    The game itself never punishes the playstyle and no feedback is ever given to the player that they are underperforming. They see numbers they barely understand and are given full rewards during group events without contributing meaningfully. They live in a bubble.
    Lets also be clear that this isn't a "new" player issue. There are plenty of members of the current forum cartel who proudly "main ranger since beta", telling new players that all they have to do is get a brown bear to tank and this will get them over in all content in the game.

    If Anet expects me to play with other people, I don't want them to hold me back. It seriously affects my enjoyment if the content when everyone stands in fire and dies, leaving me to save the day from a way overscaled 20 minute encounter.

    I would counter that Anet expects you to use the tools at your disposal to customize your experience. You can very easily say "no longbow rangers" in your LFG or just ask them to switch and kick them from your group if they don't. Not a thing wrong with that.
    Your group, your rules.
    Additionally you can just play with people you enjoy playing with and who aren't there to take a carry.
    A little personal responsibility goes a long way to making sure your play time is how you like it.

    And then we have public mode were you cant chose who to play with nor can you kick.

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    New players think Power Longbow dps comes from comboing their scaling range autos and point blank shot. They think they're helping by by scattering mobs, because other games and common sense tell you it's easier to pick off opponents rather than fight 20 at once. They think having 1500 range and a knockback means they should never get close to the enemy. New players think ranger means archer, so longbow will be the weapon most newbs will flock to since it fits an archers theme.

    No.
    Low-effort players who gravitate to longbow ranger aren't thinking about comboing a thing. They are firing all their abilities off cooldown with zero regard for rotation. They are drawn to Ranger for the class fantasy, or because they hop on this very forum and say "what should I play??" and are told by veteran low-effort players that Ranger is easy because they just let their pet tank and pewpew from distance.
    The game itself never punishes the playstyle and no feedback is ever given to the player that they are underperforming. They see numbers they barely understand and are given full rewards during group events without contributing meaningfully. They live in a bubble.
    Lets also be clear that this isn't a "new" player issue. There are plenty of members of the current forum cartel who proudly "main ranger since beta", telling new players that all they have to do is get a brown bear to tank and this will get them over in all content in the game.

    If Anet expects me to play with other people, I don't want them to hold me back. It seriously affects my enjoyment if the content when everyone stands in fire and dies, leaving me to save the day from a way overscaled 20 minute encounter.

    I would counter that Anet expects you to use the tools at your disposal to customize your experience. You can very easily say "no longbow rangers" in your LFG or just ask them to switch and kick them from your group if they don't. Not a thing wrong with that.
    Your group, your rules.
    Additionally you can just play with people you enjoy playing with and who aren't there to take a carry.
    A little personal responsibility goes a long way to making sure your play time is how you like it.

    And then we have public mode were you cant chose who to play with nor can you kick.

    A player who gets frustrated by others underperforming or getting smoked by standing in red circles should know better than to play the public mode.

    "We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content." Gaile Gray 01.10.19

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2021

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @mindcircus.1506 said:

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    New players think Power Longbow dps comes from comboing their scaling range autos and point blank shot. They think they're helping by by scattering mobs, because other games and common sense tell you it's easier to pick off opponents rather than fight 20 at once. They think having 1500 range and a knockback means they should never get close to the enemy. New players think ranger means archer, so longbow will be the weapon most newbs will flock to since it fits an archers theme.

    No.
    Low-effort players who gravitate to longbow ranger aren't thinking about comboing a thing. They are firing all their abilities off cooldown with zero regard for rotation. They are drawn to Ranger for the class fantasy, or because they hop on this very forum and say "what should I play??" and are told by veteran low-effort players that Ranger is easy because they just let their pet tank and pewpew from distance.
    The game itself never punishes the playstyle and no feedback is ever given to the player that they are underperforming. They see numbers they barely understand and are given full rewards during group events without contributing meaningfully. They live in a bubble.
    Lets also be clear that this isn't a "new" player issue. There are plenty of members of the current forum cartel who proudly "main ranger since beta", telling new players that all they have to do is get a brown bear to tank and this will get them over in all content in the game.

    If Anet expects me to play with other people, I don't want them to hold me back. It seriously affects my enjoyment if the content when everyone stands in fire and dies, leaving me to save the day from a way overscaled 20 minute encounter.

    I would counter that Anet expects you to use the tools at your disposal to customize your experience. You can very easily say "no longbow rangers" in your LFG or just ask them to switch and kick them from your group if they don't. Not a thing wrong with that.
    Your group, your rules.
    Additionally you can just play with people you enjoy playing with and who aren't there to take a carry.
    A little personal responsibility goes a long way to making sure your play time is how you like it.

    Unfortunately, that's not the way I roll. If things don't turn out the way I want, venting my frustrations on other players is no way to solve anything in a game I know is largely knowledge based. Learning the game is the responsibility of the players, that is true, but it's also no secret that the general player base sucks at the game. I don't think this is through a lack of players trying, in fact, I find players try too hard. Ask a bearbow why they refuse to stack, their answer will generally be "because of my damage bonus on auto", or "because melee is scary" - not because they want to troll or indiscriminately mash buttons, but rather because they see numbers they don't understand and don't know any better. You're right, there is a bubble, but why should they have to burst it when so many players are forced to reinvent the wheel the same way?

    I want to play in an instance where everyone has fun, not an instance where I select what fun is. That is the responsibility of Anet, and why I prefer asking for a balance change over becoming a salty sea pirate demanding everyone play meta or kick.

    But this is becoming a derailing discussion of class balance, not why I dislike playing alongside 30k AP bearbow "new players" in new content.

  • Trinnitty.8256Trinnitty.8256 Member ✭✭✭

    the repetitive DRMs are killing this story something bad imo... Then the achievents to keep doing them 5 times ahh man sad sad.

  • TheThief.8475TheThief.8475 Member ✭✭
    edited January 27, 2021

    I will give em a 7/10. I enjojed prologue and bjora marches experience, strikes are a good intro to raids, even tho they are MUCH easier. Not a fan of meta events, i didn't like drizzlewood coast experience.

    Completed all DRM today, and I a have to say I enjoyed em a lot (except the metrica and caledon).

    I mean that they are a GREAT way to play the instanced story chapter that you used to play alone. I don't say they are a good repeatable content, they are just great if you play each of them one time. I would like to see instanced story chapter in this format in EoD.
    I've played gw2 for a very long time, and this is the first time i have really enjoyed the instanced story, wich were much more boring even in HoT and PoF with no exception for living world season 3 and 4.

    But yes, there is no content added in the game in the "champions" releases, no one can deny it (no maps, no strikes, no meta events ecc).

    But no, DRM are not as bad as everyone says, they are just a fun way to push instanced story (imo). Not a repeatable content, but not bad content.

  • Konrad Curze.5130Konrad Curze.5130 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2021

    it was meh up until Champions. not terrible, but FAR behind the expectations that they themselves set when they said it'd be a LS with expac-like length and features

    then Champions came and all hell broke loose. it's beyond awful, boring and cheap, and Im genuinely concerned for the game's wellbeing in the short term, if this is all they can give us until EoD.

  • Kaliwenda.3428Kaliwenda.3428 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2021

    I loved it at the start, especially Grothmar. The Metal Legion concert was the high point for me for sure! :) BJora was OK I guess but felt a lot more tedious to work thru.

    Drizzlewood part 2 took just way way way too long to complete the full meta but I wanted the Otter so I stuck it out. I was able to cut the time sink down a bit by crafting the weapon set to break down for otter parts. I haven't been back there since.

    Champions chapters I only do once to advance the story(*) and get the mastery points. I hop on a different character who is further behind in the Saga to earn the mastery XP so I don't have to do the DRM's more than once.

    • I find it really hard to get the story particulars in the Chapters since so much of it happens in the middle of the DRMs and if you're not at the right location, or in the middle of clearing objectives, the dialog is easy to miss. I really have no idea what the story is at this point so I'll have to look for some walk-through videos to catch up.
  • Mik.3401Mik.3401 Member ✭✭

    The maps and music are nice, but the chapter itself is a waste of time - feels like a grinding area with nothing special to win

  • Without taking into account Strike missions and DRMs 8, with them 5.

  • Susy.7529Susy.7529 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 31, 2021

    1, Garbage.
    To elaborate, ep 1-4 were sufficient, but Champions releases are so bad (in everything) they lower the vote for the whole season.

  • Yggranya.5201Yggranya.5201 Member ✭✭✭

    @AzureShiron.7658 said:
    My biggest gripe is, the humans got a human centric expansion, the sylvari got one with a lot of lore and info for them, but the charr and norn have to share their 'expansion'? the charr already get shafted on a lot so this has left a very bad taste in my mouth. The writing has been fairly solid but the previously stated has left my view on the full thing tainted.

    Thanks to nostalgia, it will probably be human centric in cantha too.

  • It was going down hill after the first two releases. Then we had to deal with Taimi screaming like Nevil Chamberlain appeasing the third reich and it hit rock bottom. DRMs are meaningless to the world. No love to wvw (as usual). Its actually worse than the contrived season 2 story. Typical of Anet. Start something great and then serve rotten fruit for desert.

  • Raknar.4735Raknar.4735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Too much instanced content.

    *...the biggest challenge in creating more is the small audience they attract.* - Andrew Gray, February 3, 2020

  • Drizzlewood one of the best maps yet!

    But after that its disappointing..
    Its fun to get a lot of maps in a destroyed kinda version but thats it.. i need a map not a instance i have to choose between solo or group fighting
    apart from that its always the same thing u have to do .. all day.. not even this new infusion could got me hyped in the slightest

  • I like Drizzlewood Coast and Bjora Marches events. Not much interested in Dragon Response and Strike Missions. I assume Anet is trying something new, and working for another development. I think the concept of reusing Central Tyria was awesome. Core map is vast, i still feel like to walk around there sometimes.

  • Svarty.8019Svarty.8019 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2, 2021

    Everything after the introduction of Ryland was mediocre and the plot, predictable.

    As a WvW player, I don't do a lot of PvE.
    I did, however, play a lot of both Bjora maps. As I understand it, there were different teams working on each.
    I thought the first map was good, but the second map didn't evoke the same feeling.

    When they brought out a WvW-a-like map I wondered, why don't they make WvW better instead? Why make this parody of WvW?
    I've seen quite a few new players appear in WvW since, so maybe that's what they were trying to do, but in that case... Why not improve WvW so that those new players have a better experience? It's quite a frustrating dilemma.
    I suppose the developers have similar feelings about this - or maybe they think, "new maps are always the way to go and old content costs too much manpower to change".

    Why am I "feeling" instead of "thinking"?

    This post contains my opinion.

  • Genesis.8572Genesis.8572 Member ✭✭✭

    A lot of the content this season feels like grindy, busy work (or at least more than the usual fair of past content).

  • Yes, the story can be further improved, provided that we all pay subscription fees I guess.
    But the vital part here is not that.
    It is the basic human value of being grateful for having this new content without us paying anything on it after so many years, and I wish they continue to do this.
    Rather, you could have provided ideas to enhance the storyline.

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I give it no better than a 4.
    It has a good concept, good potential, and had an initially great map and meta.

    It just went downhill from there in terms of content quality and story writing.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.