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How could the story continue

Foxy.5319Foxy.5319 Member
edited January 24, 2021 in Lore

Now the second chapter is out. I wanted to start a discussion about where the story could go, how the story might look in the last two chapters and how the story leads us further to cantha.

Comments

  • To be honest, im not expecting much in this last 2/4 of a chapter.
    Hopefully they wont kill off an elder dragon in an DRM or even off screen.

    So here is my guess:
    With the help of the spirits led by Braham, Aurene sacrifices herself as a big prism and gets into stasis to maintain eternal balance between Jormag und Primordus, effectively taking 3 elder dragons off the board. The last remaining elder dragon will come up for Cantha / End of Dragons expansion. Aurene will only be able to help us through telepathy. :#

  • Svennis.3852Svennis.3852 Member ✭✭✭

    What feels most likely is that a dragon (or two) will perish, we’ll realize the balance is indeed real, and the world starts to degrade as magic goes out of control. We get some reason to believe the solution is in Cantha and travel there.

    Or, the season simply ends with Primordus fully awakened and erupting to the surface. With Jormag and Primordus simultaneously active, and Bubbles possibly exasperated by these events, we have three awake and active at the same time. We get reason to believe something in Cantha could be the solution and head there.

    The finale will be “earth shattering,” and that indicates something big with Primordus. That finale is likely to cause a huge problem or threat that we’ll need to solve in EoDs, and that will be part of the reason we go to Cantha. Maybe we’re all refugees, even.

    My predictions at least. Since the tag line of the expansion is “the cycle is reborn” it’s likely about safely de-powering the remaining hostile elder dragons, possibly causing new beings to ascend in their place (high dragons or otherwise).

  • Keidnard.9170Keidnard.9170 Member ✭✭
    edited January 21, 2021

    Yes, we can at least expect Primordus to show up accompanied by some earthshattering at the end of the episode.
    Then let's see wether dragons will die, will be contained for a while or will freely spread terror whilest we head for Cantha.

    As far as we know there will be just 3 more DRMs (Caledon Forest, Bloodtide Coast, Fireheart Rise), so each dragon got 5.
    I'd expect those 3 DRMs to come in part 3/4 of "Champions", so part 4/4 could be a more story heavier chapter.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm slightly concerned that the "Dragons must no die" seems to have been forgotten by every character in the game. We seem to be leaning towards killing one or both, but no real discussions on the consequences

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • I won't be surprise if we'll get some like that: 2 dragons dead, Aurene is almost some kind of the All, Braham is good norn, Ryland is bad and dead.

  • Hypnowulf.7403Hypnowulf.7403 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 21, 2021

    I'm more invested in how Jormag is playfully goofing around with Aurene, frankly. It's adorable and I can't deal with it, especially since Aurene reciprocates.

    I've been wondering for the longest time what this weird vulnarable energy is that I've felt streaming off of Jormag since we first met them. Yes, they're obviously terrified of Primordus but it's more than that—something that would explain their unusual behaviour. Then it sort of clicked.

    I think it was when Jormag referred to interlocution. That's a very interesting word. Jormag is an old, lonely Elder Dragon who's never had anyone to talk to beyond mortal norns. If I'd been in that situation, I'd be crying out for an intellect to converse with as well. It's funny though because if we think of Jormag in the sense of one dragon making an effort to befriend another without knowing how? A lot of things fall into place.

    • Why was Jormag initially acting skittish?
    • Why did they take a champion?
    • Why do they have a negative opinion of mortals?
    • Why have they been quietly building Aurene's self-esteem?
    • Why have they been so careful about what they've said?
    • Why have they been trying so hard to look cool?
    • Why do they seem concerned with what Aurene thinks of them?

    If you've ever known the joy of pieces falling into place? This was that. Oh, and that Aurene reciprocates too? That's delightful. The age difference means that this isn't that kind of relationship, however I do see Jormag chasing a companionship—a lasting friendship. Being as old as they are, they'd make an interesting mentor for Aurene, and a legitimate foil to Aurene's innate naïveté.

    I don't think things will go as most think since I see Jorms having a friendcrush on our dragon of prisms. They seem so eager to try to please or impress Aurene that... I don't see this going the edgelord-y way that most would think. I mean, besides, with our world going to hell it'd be nice if something could work out for a fictional one we care about. So that's where I am right now.

    Considering that they'll be expanding the Eye of the North in an upcoming update... I wonder why they're doing that?

    I admit, this blindsided me. I was too busy feeling defensive of Jormag considering how they're a.) oddly vulnerable, and b.) very autistic. I've all too often seen neurotypicals jump down the throat of people and assume they're psychopaths just for having neurodiverse or even anxious traits. So whenever neurotypicals freak out about something being "evil," I feel inclined to dig a little deeper. And I like what I found. I just wish I'd spotted it sooner. I'm very happy about this if I am correct.

    Addendum

    I figure I should asnwer some of these in case my point isn't clear.

    • Why was Jormag initially acting skittish?

    They were being careful not to offend Aurene as they knew this was a delicate situation and they didn't want to screw it up.

    • Why did they take a champion?

    "I took a champion too! Am I cool yet?"

    • Why do they have a negative opinion of mortals?

    Envy. Aurene is paying attention to mortals more than Jormag and Jorms finds it frustrating—they want to be worthy of Aurene's attention. They want to prove that they're far more interesting to talk to than the little scampering creatures.

    • Why have they been quietly building Aurene's self-esteem?

    They actually value Aurene and they might be hoping that she'll eventually notice. What Jormag has been doing is building the foundations for Aurene to have more faith in herself, to feel less neurotic. This is very different from, say, insincerely boosting a person's ego with valueless platitudes.

    • Why have they been so careful about what they've said?

    Oh, I kind of repeated this one. They're being careful about saying something that might offend Aurene and hve her close herself off from Jormag—Jorms is dealing with the fear they hold for Primordus, but they're also having to manage a very valuable thing to them. Their first friendship.

    • Why have they been trying so hard to look cool?

    I mean... Yeah, this one speaks for itself. A lot of nerds do this, they try to seem impressive, to have mystique. It's just something we do socially, and so apparently do Elder Dragons. That or Jormag is simply copying mortals as they don't know how else to go about it.

    • Why do they seem concerned with what Aurene thinks of them?

    They value her opinion of them—this is probably the way that Aurene could wound Jormag the worst, by continuing to see them as evil or a problem.

    Frankly, it's charming my socks off. It's really endearing and I love it. It's made me like Jormag even more, the giant frosty nerd.

  • The Greyhawk.9107The Greyhawk.9107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hypnowulf.7403 said:
    I'm more invested in how Jormag is playfully goofing around with Aurene, frankly. It's adorable and I can't deal with it, especially since Aurene reciprocates.

    Playfully goofing around with Aurene my kitten, Jormag has been Gaslighting Aurene, emotionally manipulating her and borderline a mentally abusing her. Repeatedly cutting down self-esteem, making her doubt herself and her beliefs and her friends, and occasionally throwing out complements to try to keep Aurene dependent on Jormag. Reminds me of the villain from that Rapunzel movie Disney made some ten years ago, the one that pretended to be Rapunzel's mother. Its telling that for all the times you call out people on this forum on in game for being "Toxic", your own biases towards Jormag have prevented you from seeing what clearly and blatantly toxic behavior from the Ice Dragon.

    @Svennis.3852 said:

    @Randulf.7614 said:
    I'm slightly concerned that the "Dragons must no die" seems to have been forgotten by every character in the game. We seem to be leaning towards killing one or both, but no real discussions on the consequences

    Yes, this has been the biggest issue with Champions for me. I care less about the other issues, and more about this jarring shift in the lore/plot. Even if they wanted to retcon the drive behind the last several years of story, the fact no one’s dwelling on “the balance is fake” is shocking. I’m hoping it comes down to Jormag’s persuasion magic having indoctrinated us somewhat to be more accepting, but at this point... I don’t know. Can’t tell if it’s intentional or not.

    Next episode is called Balance though, so perhaps we’ll get more. Can’t help but think that title is more indicative of the “balance” between Jormag and Primordus though, as was mentioned in such a heavy handed way during this Power release.

    I've been hoping quite desperately that this comment about the balance being an illusion was just more of Jormag's kitten, cause that is one retcon that Anet can not be allowed to get away with. It quite literally renders the entire quest to make Aurene an elder dragon pointless, as well as the battle against Balthazar (well, accept that whole killing innocent people to turn them into Forged bit, kinda needed to stop that).

    Frankly I have no expectations of how this LS season will end other than that it'll probably be really disappointing.

    Hate Is Fuel.

  • Svennis.3852Svennis.3852 Member ✭✭✭

    @The Greyhawk.9107 said:
    I've been hoping quite desperately that this comment about the balance being an illusion was just more of Jormag's kitten, cause that is one retcon that Anet can not be allowed to get away with. It quite literally renders the entire quest to make Aurene an elder dragon pointless, as well as the battle against Balthazar (well, accept that whole killing innocent people to turn them into Forged bit, kinda needed to stop that).

    Frankly I have no expectations of how this LS season will end other than that it'll probably be really disappointing.

    I’m starting to feel like neither Primordus or Jormag will die this season. I think the finale will be Primordus erupting up the surface, and the season ends on “the real war has only just begun.” EoDs focuses on us trying to replace or depower the twins as they’re wreaking havoc in Tyria as their forces battle it out, and our only lead to fix it are saltspray dragons potentially being able to ascend. Most likely we get this info in a vision from Aurene/the scrying pool. We head to Cantha to search for them and get caught up in regional issues during the process.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2021

    @Svennis.3852 said:

    @The Greyhawk.9107 said:
    I've been hoping quite desperately that this comment about the balance being an illusion was just more of Jormag's kitten, cause that is one retcon that Anet can not be allowed to get away with. It quite literally renders the entire quest to make Aurene an elder dragon pointless, as well as the battle against Balthazar (well, accept that whole killing innocent people to turn them into Forged bit, kinda needed to stop that).

    Frankly I have no expectations of how this LS season will end other than that it'll probably be really disappointing.

    I’m starting to feel like neither Primordus or Jormag will die this season. I think the finale will be Primordus erupting up the surface, and the season ends on “the real war has only just begun.” EoDs focuses on us trying to replace or depower the twins as they’re wreaking havoc in Tyria as their forces battle it out, and our only lead to fix it are saltspray dragons potentially being able to ascend. Most likely we get this info in a vision from Aurene/the scrying pool. We head to Cantha to search for them and get caught up in regional issues during the process.

    It's a definite possiblilty that the two dragons in the EoD logo could well be Primordus and Jormag and have absolutely nothing to do with the DSD at all

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • @Hypnowulf.7403 said:
    I'm more invested in how Jormag is playfully goofing around with Aurene, frankly. It's adorable and I can't deal with it, especially since Aurene reciprocates.

    I've been wondering for the longest time what this weird vulnarable energy is that I've felt streaming off of Jormag since we first met them. Yes, they're obviously terrified of Primordus but it's more than that—something that would explain their unusual behaviour. Then it sort of clicked.

    I think it was when Jormag referred to interlocution. That's a very interesting word. Jormag is an old, lonely Elder Dragon who's never had anyone to talk to beyond mortal norns. If I'd been in that situation, I'd be crying out for an intellect to converse with as well. It's funny though because if we think of Jormag in the sense of one dragon making an effort to befriend another without knowing how? A lot of things fall into place.

    • Why was Jormag initially acting skittish?
    • Why did they take a champion?
    • Why do they have a negative opinion of mortals?
    • Why have they been quietly building Aurene's self-esteem?
    • Why have they been so careful about what they've said?
    • Why have they been trying so hard to look cool?
    • Why do they seem concerned with what Aurene thinks of them?

    If you've ever known the joy of pieces falling into place? This was that. Oh, and that Aurene reciprocates too? That's delightful. The age difference means that this isn't that kind of relationship, however I do see Jormag chasing a companionship—a lasting friendship. Being as old as they are, they'd make an interesting mentor for Aurene, and a legitimate foil to Aurene's innate naïveté.

    I don't think things will go as most think since I see Jorms having a friendcrush on our dragon of prisms. They seem so eager to try to please or impress Aurene that... I don't see this going the edgelord-y way that most would think. I mean, besides, with our world going to hell it'd be nice if something could work out for a fictional one we care about. So that's where I am right now.

    Considering that they'll be expanding the Eye of the North in an upcoming update... I wonder why they're doing that?

    I admit, this blindsided me. I was too busy feeling defensive of Jormag considering how they're a.) oddly vulnerable, and b.) very autistic. I've all too often seen neurotypicals jump down the throat of people and assume they're psychopaths just for having neurodiverse or even anxious traits. So whenever neurotypicals freak out about something being "evil," I feel inclined to dig a little deeper. And I like what I found. I just wish I'd spotted it sooner. I'm very happy about this if I am correct.

    Addendum

    I figure I should asnwer some of these in case my point isn't clear.

    • Why was Jormag initially acting skittish?

    They were being careful not to offend Aurene as they knew this was a delicate situation and they didn't want to screw it up.

    • Why did they take a champion?

    "I took a champion too! Am I cool yet?"

    • Why do they have a negative opinion of mortals?

    Envy. Aurene is paying attention to mortals more than Jormag and Jorms finds it frustrating—they want to be worthy of Aurene's attention. They want to prove that they're far more interesting to talk to than the little scampering creatures.

    • Why have they been quietly building Aurene's self-esteem?

    They actually value Aurene and they might be hoping that she'll eventually notice. What Jormag has been doing is building the foundations for Aurene to have more faith in herself, to feel less neurotic. This is very different from, say, insincerely boosting a person's ego with valueless platitudes.

    • Why have they been so careful about what they've said?

    Oh, I kind of repeated this one. They're being careful about saying something that might offend Aurene and hve her close herself off from Jormag—Jorms is dealing with the fear they hold for Primordus, but they're also having to manage a very valuable thing to them. Their first friendship.

    • Why have they been trying so hard to look cool?

    I mean... Yeah, this one speaks for itself. A lot of nerds do this, they try to seem impressive, to have mystique. It's just something we do socially, and so apparently do Elder Dragons. That or Jormag is simply copying mortals as they don't know how else to go about it.

    • Why do they seem concerned with what Aurene thinks of them?

    They value her opinion of them—this is probably the way that Aurene could wound Jormag the worst, by continuing to see them as evil or a problem.

    Frankly, it's charming my socks off. It's really endearing and I love it. It's made me like Jormag even more, the giant frosty nerd.

    It doesn't look like building Aurene's self esteem. For me, it looks like a simple manipulation, when the manipulator talk to you that you are good in something that is beneficial for the manipulator. And also like creating a link, some kind of dependency of talking to, being near and listening to the manipulator. Just to benefit from it.

  • @Svennis.3852 said:

    @The Greyhawk.9107 said:
    I've been hoping quite desperately that this comment about the balance being an illusion was just more of Jormag's kitten, cause that is one retcon that Anet can not be allowed to get away with. It quite literally renders the entire quest to make Aurene an elder dragon pointless, as well as the battle against Balthazar (well, accept that whole killing innocent people to turn them into Forged bit, kinda needed to stop that).

    Frankly I have no expectations of how this LS season will end other than that it'll probably be really disappointing.

    I’m starting to feel like neither Primordus or Jormag will die this season. I think the finale will be Primordus erupting up the surface, and the season ends on “the real war has only just begun.” EoDs focuses on us trying to replace or depower the twins as they’re wreaking havoc in Tyria as their forces battle it out, and our only lead to fix it are saltspray dragons potentially being able to ascend. Most likely we get this info in a vision from Aurene/the scrying pool. We head to Cantha to search for them and get caught up in regional issues during the process.

    Well, it would be interesting. Also, the "they need me, Kuanalung (?)" from the teaser would sound more intriguing in this context.

  • Very interested in finding out what happens! Love reading these responses!

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 22, 2021

    As I said in another thread the clues dropped in this latest episode suggest to me that Jormag is going to die either during this saga or very early into End of Dragons and the unified Spirits of the wild will through Braham absorb the magic unleashed by Jormag's death.

    How Jormag will die.. I am not 100% certain yet but my gut tells me that the finale of the saga will see Jormag and Primordus clash in a large battle.
    Ultimately the outcome of this event will be decided by Braham.
    This is my speculation on how this event may play out.

    I have a feeling that Jormag and Primordus will be evenly matched by this point however Ryland is going to play a big part in Jormag's army for this battle and will act as a sort of trump card for Jormag.
    I think our part in this fight will start off being forced into helping Ryland against Primordus but towards the end as he's about to enact his attack and either kill Primordus or cripple him so Jormag can finish him off, we decide we cannot allow Ryland to go through with it as killing either of the dragons will be very bad for the world thus we try to stop Ryland leading to a fight between us and Ryland as the 2 dragons continue their battle.
    After defeating Ryland (but not killing him) we are now desperately trying to find away to end this situation without killing either of the dragons when Ryland catches a second wind and attempts to murder either the commander or one of our allies in the fight.. (Either Crecia or Rytlock is my guess)
    Braham acting on pure instinct in the heat of the moment defends his allies and kills Ryland before he can complete his attack.
    Jormag who sense's the death of her champion is momentarily distracted and weakened, angered by Rylands death focus's it's attention onto us giving Primordus the opening it needed to deal a lethal blow to Jormag.
    Knowing that it has won and it's sibling is fatally wounded with no hope or survival, Primordus retreat's back into the ground leaving Jormag to die of it's wounds.
    At this point we and Aurine share one final conversation with the Ice dragon before it dies.
    As Jormag's energy is released Braham backed by all the spirits of the wild throws himself into the blast absorbing Jormag's magic and transferring it to the spirits averting the end of the world.

    With another Dragon dead our attention turns sorely to Primordus who is now free of his sibling and more powerful than ever before.. we decide we have no choice but to find away to kill Primordus as well which eventually leads us into End of Dragons where both Primordus and the Sea Dragon will die and likely be replaced by Kuunavang and Albax.

    A possible end scenario is that once the old Elder's are gone the New Elder Dragon's along with the Spirits of the Wild fear that the power they now possess will one day attract challenges by other powerful beings who may seek to usurp them and throw the world into chaos again, thus they decide that it is in the best interests of Tyria if they do what the human Gods did and leave Tyria to go where no one will ever find them.
    As they leave Aurine says her farewells telling us that she loves us more than she can express and thanks us for everything before she too leaves the world and probably does something really corny like leaves a shining star in the sky like in one of those old cheesy movies lol

  • Brycar.2651Brycar.2651 Member ✭✭✭

    Aurene will refract Primordus and Jormag so the are finally separated from each other. Or what is the opposite of refraction? maybe they will combine into one new dragon. Jormag and Primordus will “die” as we know them.

  • Raknar.4735Raknar.4735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 23, 2021

    @Randulf.7614 said:

    @Svennis.3852 said:

    @The Greyhawk.9107 said:
    I've been hoping quite desperately that this comment about the balance being an illusion was just more of Jormag's kitten, cause that is one retcon that Anet can not be allowed to get away with. It quite literally renders the entire quest to make Aurene an elder dragon pointless, as well as the battle against Balthazar (well, accept that whole killing innocent people to turn them into Forged bit, kinda needed to stop that).

    Frankly I have no expectations of how this LS season will end other than that it'll probably be really disappointing.

    I’m starting to feel like neither Primordus or Jormag will die this season. I think the finale will be Primordus erupting up the surface, and the season ends on “the real war has only just begun.” EoDs focuses on us trying to replace or depower the twins as they’re wreaking havoc in Tyria as their forces battle it out, and our only lead to fix it are saltspray dragons potentially being able to ascend. Most likely we get this info in a vision from Aurene/the scrying pool. We head to Cantha to search for them and get caught up in regional issues during the process.

    It's a definite possiblilty that the two dragons in the EoD logo could well be Primordus and Jormag and have absolutely nothing to do with the DSD at all

    I don't really think this is a possibility. HoT and PoF have logos that represent the corresponding dragons by adding small features to the basic GW2 logo.
    HoT represents the Mouth of Mordremoth in a spiral, paying homage to it's long body, while the PoF logo has the "branded markings" Kralk has along his neck and back.

    Ignoring the whole water/wave design of EoD, Anet still deliberately put "dragon ear fins" on both dragons in the EoD logo, a feature we haven't seen before on any of the other dragons. I don't think those 2 represent Jormag or Primordus in any way. I'd expect some features resemblind tusks for Jormag and a underbite for Primordus, like their current appearance in the game.

    This, of course, doesn't mean the EoD logo has to have anything to do with the DSD. It could also be related to any other dragon, like Kuunavang, who features dragon ear fins.

    You have a heart of gold. Don't let them take it from you.