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The reward design in the game is getting worse and worse


KingJoko.1625

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These new weapon sets... one is either a below 1% drop (volcanic), and the rest require a ton of DRM currency. You either spend 20k gold on ingots to get them all, or do every single DRM for the next 2 years...According to gw2efficiency, only 1177 players (0.4%) unlocked the weapon set from chapter 1, and even less (55-81) the azure and crimson sets.Chapter 1 is out for a few months now and only 1000 players bothered. So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy? Waste of resources... this is worse than f2p chinese mobile game reward system. All it takes is to change the values anet, its not too late.

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@"KingJoko.1625" said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

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@Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

@"KingJoko.1625" said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

infusions are for that

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@KingJoko.1625 said:

@KingJoko.1625 said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

infusions are for that

And so are these weapons. Don't really see the issue.

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@KingJoko.1625 said:These new weapon sets... one is either a below 1% drop (volcanic), and the rest require a ton of DRM currency. You either spend 20k gold on ingots to get them all, or do every single DRM for the next 2 years...According to gw2efficiency, only 1177 players (0.4%) unlocked the weapon set from chapter 1, and even less (55-81) the azure and crimson sets.Chapter 1 is out for a few months now and only 1000 players bothered. So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy? Waste of resources... this is worse than f2p chinese mobile game reward system. All it takes is to change the values anet, its not too late.

The DRM currency isn't even the worst part about it. I made a thread that puts forth the total of all the crafted weapon sets. Fiery and Icy weapons alone add 6650 Gold to the total.

Whoever is in charge of regulating rewards in Icebrood Saga better have nothing to do with any future content.

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Over the years there's been complaints that there aren't enough ways to show prestige and that there wasn't enough sense of vertical progression.Perhaps they thought this was a way to kill two birds with one stone.As it's been pointed out, only a few people will go for these which might even add to their appeal.

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The counter is that people will look at these new weapons, see what it takes, and say, "I'm not even going to try and start to do them". where as previous weapon sets that seemed doable in a reasonable amount of time/cost would be something I'd try to do, I'm definitely in the case of not bothering with that latest set.So that means I play the game less, which means I'm less likely to spend any money on the game.How that works out in balance, I don't know - maybe they are getting more money from that very small set of players going for those weapons than they would for all those not even bothering. But that seems like a dangerous game to play, because if those few decide it isn't worth it, then that is basically dead content.

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@Shaogin.2679 said:

@KingJoko.1625 said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

infusions are for that

And so are these weapons. Don't really see the issue.

there are several issues with it, but if you dont see any then i wont even bother explaining...

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@KingJoko.1625 said:

@KingJoko.1625 said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

infusions are for that

And so are these weapons. Don't really see the issue.

there are several issues with it, but if you dont see any then i wont even bother explaining...

Do you expect people to just agree with you? If you want to convince people making weapons prestige items is a mistake you should probably explain why.

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To be fair, even if people dont really care for the new weapon sets (and i admit the last set is just outright overkill in terms of cost), it makes DRM somewhat profitable considering that you get around 9 prismaticite a day with home instance, which is almost 16g if you combine them with the other stuff.I mean its not the biggest selling point if you wanna make gold, but eh its something. I did the dragon slayer collection for achievement purposes, but ill ignore crimson/azure for now and just hoard on prismaticite and maybe Anet does something towards it.

I cant help it but I am a meta achievement grinder, so I have to get the 39/39 aswell on the current champions chapter, which means sooner or later i need that 2nd set of ridiculous pricy weapons :skull:

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why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

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@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

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@Shaogin.2679 said:

@KingJoko.1625 said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

infusions are for that

And so are these weapons. Don't really see the issue.

If you had ever been a part of something like the guild [TP] you'd understand.

Players who are sitting on a lot of gold are sitting on a lot of gold because they buy/sell/make things that make them gold, not things that lose them gold. Players who are sitting on a lot of gold, I guarantee you, are not dumping that gold into these recent weapon sets.

Players who are not sitting around on mountains of gold do not have realistic access to building these new weapon sets, and they are too expensive to care to waste the time honestly. Players would rather spend 2000 gold on a legendary item, than triple that cost on vaguely normalized weapon sets.

In other words, the requirements for obtaining these new sets are not designed well. What is required to obtain these sets is entirely impractical for any demographic of player.

Speaking for myself here as a person who bought the game on day 1 and has been playing for 9 years who has 30k APs and who had participated in [TP] trade post mechanics, when I've looked at what it takes to get these new weapons and complete said given achievements, I say to myself: "Um no. This is a laughable waste of time. Moving on now." <- I don't want to feel like that about any game content, but as much is true with these recent weapon sets.

The "overpriced overqualified" nature of these new sets is like if IRL I had gone into a convenience store to buy a candy bar, but the guy who owned store told me that if I wanted the candy bar, I had to become an employee and work full time for him for a week, and at the end of the week he would allow me to buy the candy bar for $300.00 USD.

Too expensive, too much of a waste of time to care to buy the candy bar

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@KingJoko.1625 said:

@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

I don't know how many APs you have but even me who has more than 90/95% of the players in the game, I don't do all of them.From the start there are always a few that are far too unattainable like '' Ultimate Dominator '' in wvwyou have to consider it that way, it's reserved for 0.2% of players and that's it

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@radda.8920 said:

@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

I don't know how many APs you have but even me who has more than 90/95% of the players in the game, I don't do all of them.From the start there are always a few that are far too unattainable like '' Ultimate Dominator '' in wvwyou have to consider it that way, it's reserved for 0.2% of players and that's it

Yea but you're talking about two very different types of achievements.

Something like Ultimate Dominator was designed for those who went into the game fully intending to spend a very large amount of time playing wvw. Achieving Ultimate Dominator feels like a personal milestone when it happens, and anyone who wears that title shows clout dedicated towards the wvw game mode.

These tiny achievos for 6000 g weapon sets just feels bad when you obtain them man. People don't even use these skins and they barely get any AP for what it's worth. These are lame unreasonable laughably overpriced achievements for what they are worth, even for the 2%. End of story.

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@KingJoko.1625 said:

@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

So basically .. you just want easy or cheap AP's that you are willing to do. That's not how MMO's are designed.

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@Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

@"KingJoko.1625" said:So why waste time creating these weapons if getting them is so expensive or grindy?Because in every MMO there is always a small group of people who end up sitting on a ton of cash, with nothing to spend it on, so devs will make what amounts to "prestige" items they know the vast majority of the playerbase will never go for, due to the cost. These items serve a purpose of giving those people with tons of cash something to work for, and drains a lot of excess gold from the game in the process.

So, in essence, the whole point IS that they are so expensive and grindy.

I'd believe that they are prestige items if they weren't the exact same weapon set five times with different colors and extra effects, which aren't even that pretty and in actual fact use quite low effort textures, especially compared to the BL Ticket exclusive skins.

It's just a lazy way to add content, not to mention that finishing the Stretching Goals meta achievement (the 39 chieves for max, not the 31 for the emote) is impossible without finishing the first 3 collections. This is a completionist's worst nightmare and just pure bad design. Either spend 5,000 gold right off the bat that you could spend on actually useful legendaries, or grind the worst pve content this game has ever put forward for 2 years. No thanks.

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@Obtena.7952 said:

@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

So basically .. you just want easy or cheap AP's that you are willing to do. That's not how MMO's are designed.

I think the point that everyone is stressing isn't that they want cheap & easy APs, but rather they want the time invested & reward to worth it.

For example, if you could have salvaged let's say every completed Dragon Slayer weapon to get some kind of essence that you could use at a craft station to build a legendary Dragon Slayer infusion that had great graphics, that could also be sold on the trade post to redeem gold invested, or even if it were account bound and couldn't be sold, we would be seeing far far less complaint or maybe none at all, about the expenses of these new weapon sets.

As it is now, these new weapon sets feel like nothing but a sarcastic gold/time sink.

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@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@radda.8920 said:why are you so worried about these new weapons?I mean the first versions are hideous and the last is barely ''ok''There are regularly much more beautiful skins in the cash shop for 10 times less money

I am an achievement farmer (37k ap) and yet I gave up the idea of ​​doing them. I mean who can do so much DRM(the worst content in this game) without going crazy...

And it makes me laugh those who speak of prestige for these new weaponsThe only prestige of these DRMs is to keep your sanity by farming them so much, this content is mediocre and anyone can finish it. legendary armor, some pvp titles and legendary trinkets have a kind of little prestige (and again this word is not suitable). But these weapons absolutely not.

As an ap hunter I want to do them, but not for this cost, that's why i'm 'worried' about them.

I don't know how many APs you have but even me who has more than 90/95% of the players in the game, I don't do all of them.From the start there are always a few that are far too unattainable like '' Ultimate Dominator '' in wvwyou have to consider it that way, it's reserved for 0.2% of players and that's it

Yea but you're talking about two very different types of achievements.

Something like Ultimate Dominator was designed for those who went into the game fully intending to spend a very large amount of time playing wvw. Achieving Ultimate Dominator feels like a personal milestone when it happens, and anyone who wears that title shows clout dedicated towards the wvw game mode.

These tiny achievos for 6000 g weapon sets just feels bad when you obtain them man. People don't even use these skins and they barely get any AP for what it's worth. These are lame unreasonable laughably overpriced achievements for what they are worth, even for the 2%. End of story.

yes, you are absolutely right, these are 2 totally different categories of achievementsBut I just wanted to say that when you're an AP farmer, it tends to become a drug. We do things completely without interest which ultimately do not even give the slightest prestige in the game but it becomes a habit.Except that there have been and always will be impossible achievements to finish without making your life: a nightmare .And we have to put this one in this category and move on for our sanity.There will surely be other cases in the future.... even if it is a bad habit that arena is taking and I think they are doing this to `` occupy '' the players since there is almost no more content added to the game.

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