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what killed the pugmander?

Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

the endangered species study session

te lazla otstara.
fingers crossed meta ~

what killed the pugmander? 103 votes

useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up
37%
Aury.1367SidewayS.3789Nitrosiili.5628Stand The Wall.6987Chaba.5410Mazreal Blackknight.1564Bellatrixa.3546TwoGhosts.6790choovanski.5462VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618volpenvieh.3201mistsim.2748Magnuzone.8395Hesione.9412Cynz.9437Strider.7849Eternal Frozen.6485mindcircus.1506TinkTinkPOOF.9201Calisanna.8732 39 votes
lack of incentive, no rewards, no prestige, no love
14%
Tatsumi.2047jul.7602cobbah.3102ArchonWing.9480Raiden The Beast.3016moutzaheadin.4029Veprovina.4876Bish.8627idolin.2831PancakedlordThird.5041Zawn.9647thancock.6307SaintBishop.1846Rukasu.3097Joperocl.1307 15 votes
getting farmed by guild groups, forcing the pvdoor and slow morale death
12%
ugrakarma.9416Arheundel.6451Darman.1468Shining One.1635Clownmug.8357aspirine.6852babak.3654suheir.1843Apokriphos.7042Sansar.1302Raizel.1839Lyssia.4637piffpaff.5789 13 votes
objectives being too hard to take without a zerg, too easy to take with one
3%
XxsdgxX.8109charrboiledeggs.8164Fueki.4753Opticpopol.5963 4 votes
theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore
14%
Blockhead Magee.3092Kylden Ar.3724K THEN.5162RedBaron.6058Arya.3841Sinfullysweet.4517displayname.8315spectrito.8513God.2708MisterA.2759jonesy.1470Rogue.4756SexyMofo.8923Master Pallongo.6827Mungo Zen.9364 15 votes
other
16%
TheOneWhoSighs.7513kash.9213Threather.9354Super Hayes.6890Dinas Dragonbane.2978Ben K.6238grave of hearts.7830Aeolus.3615TheQuickFox.3826Baldrick.8967Rune.5890Gudradain.3892SwankyMutt.9521avey.4201acdspydar.8920Solanum.6983manu.7539 17 votes

Comments

  • God.2708God.2708 Member ✭✭✭
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    Most pugmanders from longer ago simply were grouped up bodies from guilds that weren't running that particular night for those players that did play every night. It was a way to diversify approaches and ideas, and kept commanders from being burnt out.

    Now, you have a bunch of long time players that think they are to good for squads; new players that have no idea what a squad is, how to join one, or why it's important; and then a smattering of the above players that usually aren't enough to form a core for a pugmander to have a meaningful effect vs another actual guilded group.

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021

    OTHER - Server Linking - which caused & continues to cause

    LOSS of Server Identity & systematically perpetuates Long Term SUPPRESSION of Communities

    2016-06-11 - Prediction & Full Details
    https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Poll-6-June-World-Linking-Schedule-CLOSED/page/5#post6197744


    NEXT - Server Linking = Alliance Linking = Toxic Game Mode

    2018.07.17 - Prediction & Full Details
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/593461#Comment_593461


    ALTERNATIVE - Clear Roadmap & New Match-Up Model

    2019.10.05
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes-road-map-to-reboot-wvw/p1

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

  • displayname.8315displayname.8315 Member ✭✭✭
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    Heart of Thorns did when it made wvw much more guild centric. All the new mechanics only went to high level guilds and nothing for pugs(manders).

  • kash.9213kash.9213 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021
    other

    They're still commanding, they just don't roll up full zergs anymore. A good pugmander won't throw everyone into a bad drive to get wiped, if the pugs aren't pushing with that commander, there's likely a good reason. You can cry about them not getting on your discord or whatever but most people aren't dumb and already know what they need to do, but they might see clearly that you as a commander don't and they're going to be careful because they don't want to waypoint too many times.

    Northern Shiverpeaks [EL] & [SD]

  • other

    The player base. Just in general. It's not just pugs being bad. A lot of people play this mode in what is possibly the most unfun way possible (siege humping, running from fights). And even more, there's an armada of people whose only goal at the end of the day is to be the loudest person yelling in team chat.

    Gets old after a while.

    Can the forum devs please make the dev tracker actually usable. No one wants to see posts in which a dev has commented on 2 months ago pop up just because some random person commented on it today.

    Why are we put here, just to suffer?

  • Magnuzone.8395Magnuzone.8395 Member ✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    People don't join anyway when someone tags up (With a few exceptions when someone a bit well-known tags open once in a blue moon). Full map with a big que and most coms struggle to get even 15 people in squad. Even if they are on TS/Disc. If pugs don't want to join, why bother to tag up at all? So of course they rather run hidden tag with a tight squad they can rely on.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021
    other

    It's a bit of every option in the pool beside awfull class implementation based on aoe and sheer numbers, the not so good balance over this years.
    Game got old kinda quickly since there was lack of vision towards the game to much stallness to much aoe.

    Slayers [XD] NSP Guild
    Yao Chen Herald/Ventari
    Ying Wuxian Renegade/Demon

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021

    Megaservers and linking primarily.

    Before megaservers you could get fresh blood in PVE cities if you needed reinforcements which recruits more people for your server effort. Before linking every 2 months you could at least build up your general WvW playerbase, which you simply can't if you are forced to play musical chairs against people stacking servers.

    One of the 16 to 72 hour (reset weekend) commanders that quit when links started wrote that the servers should all be unlinked, there should be no lockout of servers, and transfers should be more expensive. The rationale that commander gave is "even if people stack on one server they would be bored out of their mind and all actual competitive guilds and players would try to balance it out" , "people would eventually disagree or try to get people to get off maps and generate intraserver conflict and move off" or something to that effect. We saw this happen to Blackgate , where eventually anyone that wasn't a PVE player considered moving to avoid queues and to actually have fights. Cookie quit by the way.

    For someone that hit 10K WVW rank in 2017 or 2018 and has all the skins and legendary things you can get from WVW what is the incentive right now? To have PUGs running their own builds that will never listen or adjust anything that the commander requests (any class is usable in WVW by the way, it's just players refuse to play as a team player)? How do you motivate people afk pipping, the ones there "just for gift of battle for their legendary", or those that would rather k-train than defend because it's more WXP if they are not great at fighting?

    Squads aren't an issue. It's a wrong way of thinking to believe they are. Before squads existed we still had people playing WvW on a competitive scale. Squads only provided additional organization of boon priority and cleanses.

    It's also wrong to think that PVE guilds don't show up to WvW. I've seen them and they continue even after being wiped in one push because they still get pips (outnumbered ones if the opposing force is larger) and most of them don't care about success on the battlefield because KDR is meaningless for rewards. Primarily PVE guilds are most likely to PPT undefended structures. This means the poll option "getting farmed by guild groups, forcing the pvdoor and slow morale death" isn't correct , as they can either avoid (port out or work other maps) the guild group giving them trouble , play off of a group that actually plays WvW for fights, or adjust their playing time-frames. The groups that exist only to PPK actually are more likely to die out due to boredom or because of diminishing returns on PPK (you don't gain any WXP or loot if you repeatedly kill a particular target).

  • Kylden Ar.3724Kylden Ar.3724 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    Megaservers and linking primarily.

    Before megaservers you could get fresh blood in PVE cities if you needed reinforcements which recruits more people for your server effort. Before linking every 2 months you could at least build up your general WvW playerbase, which you simply can't if you are forced to play musical chairs against people stacking servers.

    Bingo. This right here. Same thing that's been slowly bleeding population as people figure out there are far better balanced games for PvP out there...

    Alliances ever!? Communication when!?

    How many times we gotta tell you GRIND IS NOT CONTENT there ANet?

    Leader of Tyrian Adventure Corp [TACO], member of [RaW][TACO][Owls][HELL] Alliance, Kaineng.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    Megaservers and linking primarily.

    did you play prior to this?

    te lazla otstara.
    fingers crossed meta ~

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    Megaservers and linking primarily.

    did you play prior to this?

    I've been playing since GW1 beta and participated in GW2 prelaunch

    I pretested the desert map as well on the test server.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021
    getting farmed by guild groups, forcing the pvdoor and slow morale death

    Current meta "punish" a lot more pug-blobs. 15 x 50 its enough to 15man guild tier wipe 50 man blob......

    -- Atlantean Sword --
    The secret of steel has always carried with it a mystery. You must learn its riddle, Conan. You must learn its discipline. For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men, not women, not beasts..." [Points to sword] "This you can trust."

  • ArchonWing.9480ArchonWing.9480 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2021
    lack of incentive, no rewards, no prestige, no love

    Have seen countless pugmanders get chased off by toxic backseat commanders and cliques that only follow popular ones. Of course these toxic players never contribute anything of value and just run circles around keep if no tag.

    On a lesser scale it is especially bad when some tryhard guild flames the pugmander for wiping. Note: your guild group SHOULD outlast the pugs. Also getting away from a losing fight doesn't make you better. Especially bad during queues when people get told to leave.

    Thankfully most of them are gone. But the damage is done.

    And yes I prefer pugs that are bad over pugs that are both toxic and bad.

  • Vilin.8056Vilin.8056 Member ✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    Nothing more depressing then seeing your blob of Zerg pushes back ward.

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Where's the All of the above choice?

    ^ Another derailing post - Anet
    Perma stealth is needed to outrun zergs. - Thieves
    /Stomps Mirage-Scourge-Warclaw, boon ball balance! - Anet
    All Guilds Carried By Boon Ball [BQQN]

  • cyberzombie.7348cyberzombie.7348 Member ✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    From Personal experience, unless you're a guild commander or a well-known tag not many people are willing to follow or even communicate.

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2021
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    Pugmanders have to suffer bad pugs.
    Like not newbie pugs which don't know anything.

    Like pugs which are like, literally there just to be a rallybot.

    They don't resup when people call for resup.

    They aggro the enemy group before the zerg can prepare their stack and boons.

    They rotate sieges for no reason.

    They keep begging the Pugmander to go for daily objectives despite other more pressing matters like defending T3 keep.

    Any Pugmander will give up and just leave.

    When I pugmand, I don't even demand much.
    I demand resups, I demand sticking to the group and I demand they follow me when I call to push or not.

    I don't even care if they run meme builds.

    But somehow some pug can be on other side of the map flipping camps while we defend Keeps.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2021

    Canary in the coal mine & Goose that lays the Golden eggs

    The number of Pugmanders is a simple way to gauge the overall health of our WvW game mode.

    The number of Pugmanders are dying out should help provide a warning that a toxic environment is present in the game mode.

    ANet does not understand the dangers of a toxic environment, or chooses to deny the toxicity...they know much less on how to fix the Match-Up Model that creates the systematic killing off of Pugmanders.


    The number of Pugmanders can also be considered the Goose that lays the Golden eggs.

    Pugmanders help provide content to ALL Players & help to directly stimulate the traffic flow of players to visit the ANet online store to purchase goods.

    Pugmanders & the pugs that follow them flourished before Server Linking, but now the decisions of ANet are coming home to Roost as the number of Pugmanders continue to die off while the level of pug players continue to rise...who don't care to be a Pugmander themselves.

    2019.07.30
    Slowly & methodically killing their "Goose that lays their Golden eggs"
    Told you so

    We need an alternative - We need a Clear Roadmap & New Match-Up Model.

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

  • Cynz.9437Cynz.9437 Member ✭✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    My vote is not a guess but what i heard from commanders that tagged down after trying for couple hours to get something done on the map.

    Meh~

  • Grand Marshal.4098Grand Marshal.4098 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2021
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    On top of what people have mentioned with their vote on the first option, pugs cannot understand situations.

    Assaulting SM and pulling 2 or 3 people off the wall to finish them off and a gathering of 25 pugs cannot damage them and thye escape. Pugs don't know what CCs do. Pugs die to stealth pushes because they don't know when to activate stunbreaks. Pugs don't put marks on portals to alert the group of stealthed enemies etc.

    Pugs gather for dailies, that's it. Many more factors play into this of course, but it's the main reason.

    Even regular players don't care. My server going T1 today. Comms instructed not to go T1. My guild and all other guilds wanted to avoid the kitten of T1 with Piken and Desowsr.

    And then you got pugs asking for tags saying: "we don't care, we will take a week off", same people complaining "boohoohoo the link is dead no comms, boohoohoo, what are the guilds doing"... And yet the guilds will be stuck raiding in T1 while the EBG pugs have their vacation.

    Make Banner Warrior for Zergs great again!!!

  • Strider.7849Strider.7849 Member ✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    I used to pugmand, not the typical pugmander who lacks direction, knowledge, ability, or fear of fighting. The biggest problem I find is pugs simply don't follow a commander who doesn't already have a zerg or guild group with them. If I tagged with my guild, I could easily have a large zerg supplemented by pugs.. on my own, sometimes I'd be lucky if 3+ people followed, even with no other tags on maps.

    Adding to this in general pugs simply don't care about anything other than pressing one to collect loot while you and your guild do all the heavy lifting/pushing.. it makes you understand why we don't have more new commanders wanting to tag up and furthermore guilds are more frequently turning to hosting private squads.

  • displayname.8315displayname.8315 Member ✭✭✭
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    On the flippy flop could say guilds don't know how to fake push and weed out the no comms rallybots. Guilds fight tactics consist of a bum rush stealth push and running away after half of them die. Guilds don't know how to slow push. Guilds only know how to drop a cata up against a wall and have it get disabled and destroyed. Guilds hop maps when their pug farm fails. Guilds dodge actual fights lest their good name be sullied.

  • kamikharzeeh.8016kamikharzeeh.8016 Member ✭✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    i'D 2nd vote this "lack of incentive, no rewards, no prestige, no love" .. bc its kinda adds in. people often stay full newbies for years, and a pugmander can push the uncoordinated cloudgroups over some metres, but if your pugs then make a moshpit and suicide into a guildgroup... it's just game. people don't even understand what a tag is about (that to be said, half of the pugmanders are simply very bad as well, so they might not notice)

    pug quality dropped so hard since the format gets no work done since years, i guess.

  • Clownmug.8357Clownmug.8357 Member ✭✭✭✭
    getting farmed by guild groups, forcing the pvdoor and slow morale death

    lol, seems like a lot of people think their "zergbusting" is healthy for the game.

  • theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    First teamspeak and then discord.

    Unfortunately this. I am legit unable to get into discord or TS cause of my crappy connection. So instead of harming a group by not being able to listen in, I just scout and do call outs in chat. It works for me. And if I do get caught up following a commander I go full heals and just throw everything to the wall and see what sticks.

    Sin The Alluring/Tormentor/Terrorizer/Terrible/Insane/Fragrant/Subtle/Vigilante/Explosive/Saint/Demonic/Scout/Crazy
    WVW: The Quarriors - [JADE] ~ Hide Yo Zerg Hide Yo Tag Cuz - [ICU] (if ICU UR Spotted) ~ Really Into Partying - [RIP]
    PVE: Vassals Of The Aether - [VOA] ~ Friends Vs Dungeons [FvD]

  • manu.7539manu.7539 Member ✭✭✭
    other

    There is not enough support for pugmanders. Many are very bad but even the good ones rarely get supports. Its hard to get good at pugmanding when peoples are not following 90% of the time.

  • Threather.9354Threather.9354 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2021
    other

    Its just claim buff, there is no doubt about it.

    Pugmanders can't be equally strong anymore. You defend your keep with 800 extra stats? Great! Now try take enemy keep when they have 800 extra stats. You will just get one pushed. No siege or strategy included, just location.

    That is literally 30%+ damage and 40%+ survivability difference. Even between friendly and enemy camps it is over 15% of both. Same thing killed dueling/roaming.

    One side is forced to be constantly on defence and one on offense. Needless to say, the offending side needs to be 30% better than the defending side, thus bandvagoning occurs killing pugmanders even further.

    Playerbase has absolutely no way to make equally strong pugging servers with the current passive stat buffs in place.

    It isn't about objectives being hard to take, its just every part of map being obnoxiously easy or hard to play at.

    Of course siege balance needs to be looked at as well as defending siege is pretty useless. Rework claim buff to non combat bonuses + buff defending siege (Nerf shield gens. Buff wall hp and siege vs siege dmg)

  • TheQuickFox.3826TheQuickFox.3826 Member ✭✭✭✭
    other

    Nothing. I see pugmanders every single day. (Ruins of Surmia)

    Ascalon Will Prevail!

    GW Wiki user page | GW2 Wiki user page

  • DesertSong.5603DesertSong.5603 Member
    edited April 3, 2021
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    Wouldn't say they are useless. Just not on voice chat so I can kinda understand why they would be hesitant to push. I have been pugmanding (or at least trying to) a few days since returning to gw2 after a year and I can relate to most of the views here. Lol I miss the good old days..

  • cobbah.3102cobbah.3102 Member ✭✭✭
    lack of incentive, no rewards, no prestige, no love

    Try herding squirrels then you will know I guess

  • aspirine.6852aspirine.6852 Member ✭✭✭✭
    getting farmed by guild groups, forcing the pvdoor and slow morale death

    How ironic that part of the name of the game ruined the mode for me :)

  • mistsim.2748mistsim.2748 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 4, 2021
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    It's the first one, easily. My buddy use to Pugmand quite effectively a few years back, and a few of us would be on comms to support him. We tried a few times when we returned to the game a month ago, and it's basically unworkable. Whether it's new players, or bad players, their characters look like the person behind the monitor is playing with one arm, or worse two broken arms trying to move the mouse with their head. Zero effort to switch to a meta-ish build, zero paying attention to the tag, zero awareness of oncoming pain trains. Sad times overall. So we just roam these days, or help organized guilds.

    The other thing we've noticed is after one or two wipes they just scatter about and start doing other things. So there's a lot of pressure on the Pugmander to not lose fights, which makes the train boring.

  • useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    maybe it is a NA thing, but the server I am on and our links have and had pugmanders. Mixed blobs from all sides of the link.

    The problems a pugmander faces:

    pugs not listening
    fb not doing their job
    bad necros

    This kills the blob, pugmander gets frustrated, pugmander goes and plays with guild mates.

    It helps when the pugmander has a core group of guild mates around him. Add 10,15 players from known guilds and things improve a lot. But a pure random blob just suffers.

  • Chaba.5410Chaba.5410 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 5, 2021
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    I'll go with this answer because the other answers all are a result of "useless pugs".

    Getting farmed by a guild group? Well, that's often because you've joined the squad of an open tag who is being kind and not removing your or your compatriots' useless builds that aren't meta or can't counter meta. Or your compatriots are wasting their bursts on one or two squirrels rather than focusing on where the group is targeting because they're too busy standing out in Africa rather than following the tag. Useless pugs is why you're getting farmed. Stop making excuses for why you and your compatriots won't change builds to counter guild groups.

    Lack of incentive? There are incentives. They're just not enough to overcome having to deal with useless pugs, many of whom will be judgemental about why you don't want to give them a spot in your squad or why you can't win fights 100% of the time. (Also see last paragraph.)

    Objectives too hard to take without a zerg? That's because commanders try to make up for mistakes and uselessness by adding numbers since this game favors numbers.

    Not enough people playing? What this actually means is not enough non-useless pugs playing. Successful pugmanders generally have a core group of "pugs" who are friends from guild groups that will rally when the pugmander says he's going to tag up and they behave as a guild group even if they're from different guilds. The pugmander isn't left with too many useless pugs in his squad and instead will have a core group of players on meta builds who aren't squirreling off and know how to coordinate, especially by being on discord together. These players aren't likely to join tags that don't institute similar requirements because it's frustrating watching the same people go down for the 17th time and you don't want to feel like you're carrying that person.

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Idk I pretty sure able sentry still running around.

    For my guild leader I presumed it was all the firebrand nerfs making it hard for him to carry the questionable ability players while rolling into matchup after matchup of omega karma train zergs that we were getting put up against the prior few months before he threw in the towel and quit the game.

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Mokk.2397Mokk.2397 Member ✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    Many times people shout out for a tag . When one does only a couple people join let alone getting in comms . So why bother when theirs less stress roaming..
    Another problem , that wasn't mentioned in the poll , is tag watching . This happens more than you think . That's why many tags go private .

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 6, 2021

    I know it'll be hard to believe, but coordinated groups are just stronger than a bunch of randoms joining a squad for the sake of just running together.
    So... that.

  • displayname.8315displayname.8315 Member ✭✭✭
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    So the answer we all knew was all the good players quit. Yeah HoT really wrecked WvW. OG dragonbanners... high lv guilds only for all the new tactivator junk.. none of the failures of the expansion getting fixed for months or years.

  • Naxos.2503Naxos.2503 Member ✭✭✭✭
    useless pugs that refuse to push and comp up

    Gonna have to go with that one. If you join up a commander, the least you should do is follow. If you have ideas, voice them out, but understand that the commander has the last say and always should. If they make a mistake, they bear the responsability at all times and they often say so.

    If you judge the commander give nonsensical commands, leave the squad and find another one, but dont actively disregard commands while you're in the squad. Some commanders are also learning the ropes and experiment, just as some commanders are generally patient with unruly players, be patient with new commanders, or you'll find none left to command.

  • Mungo Zen.9364Mungo Zen.9364 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 6, 2021
    theres simply not enough ppl playing anymore

    I feel for the WvW players, having PvE players forced into joining your content and play poorly enough to drag the rest of the dedicated players down must suck. I am one of those players, and I wouldn't go to WvW if it wasn't required for Gifts.... I rarely even bother going to WvW because it is such a terrible way to spend my time that I can't be bothered to grind out Gifts with any regularity.

    I am the type of player hurting WvW and I don't want to be there, yet..... this game.

    I wonder, if PvE players were not required to go to WvW for certain items, would it cause WvW to collapse or would it strengthen the player base.

    My vote was based upon the idea that there are not enough of the right player in WvW

  • other

    The main problem is how the game is currently balanced. Guild groups always had an advantage over pug groups but it was never that big.

    I always liked to pugmand and I have done so since 2012. Things have drastically changed since the earlier days and made it easier for guild groups to completely dominate pug groups. In particular:

    1. It's way easier to heal now since you have dedicated build to heal. Healing required to stack in a place, drop a water field and then blast it to heal all the group. That regroup gave pug group a little break to recover and you could even bomb that heal attempt sometimes. The less good the guild group, the more time they would take to regroup, drop water field and blast them to heal. Now they just heal as they move and continuously destroy pugs.
    2. Guild groups move much faster now. It used to be a bit comical to run around guild groups unaffected by them while they slowly move in a nearly straight line toward the pug group that was rapidly dispersing in all directions. It was harder for them to catch pug. Now, they have superspeed!
    3. Easy stealth engage. Stealth engage is nothing new but it never used to be so ridiculously easy to do it. Nothing better to wipe a semi-attentive pug group than to stealth engage them from very far away.

    These would be the main issues combat-wise for me.

  • other

    Harassment, it isn't worth it. Also harassment on my server that I witnessed spiked after links began, and as my server lost its previous identity so too did all but one of its pugmanders disappear(the last one I know of from that era plays very sparingly now, like once a month that I see).

  • Some Call Me Tim.2319Some Call Me Tim.2319 Member ✭✭✭✭

    lol. I like to pop the “anything goes” tag. Complete with a caveat squad message that says prepare to die! I do this for the pugs that really just want some wxp and are NOT compt up. Some don’t even have warclaw so it’s hard for them to get into squads etc.

    When I do this I run it just as if I’m roaming, except with more people. We ppt our butts off and get all the wxp we can for them. 🙂

    Just another WvW lifer who'll never say die... while dying again and again!

  • other

    @Gudradain.3892 said:
    The main problem is how the game is currently balanced. Guild groups always had an advantage over pug groups but it was never that big.

    I always liked to pugmand and I have done so since 2012. Things have drastically changed since the earlier days and made it easier for guild groups to completely dominate pug groups. In particular:

    1. It's way easier to heal now since you have dedicated build to heal. Healing required to stack in a place, drop a water field and then blast it to heal all the group. That regroup gave pug group a little break to recover and you could even bomb that heal attempt sometimes. The less good the guild group, the more time they would take to regroup, drop water field and blast them to heal. Now they just heal as they move and continuously destroy pugs.
    2. Guild groups move much faster now. It used to be a bit comical to run around guild groups unaffected by them while they slowly move in a nearly straight line toward the pug group that was rapidly dispersing in all directions. It was harder for them to catch pug. Now, they have superspeed!
    3. Easy stealth engage. Stealth engage is nothing new but it never used to be so ridiculously easy to do it. Nothing better to wipe a semi-attentive pug group than to stealth engage them from very far away.

    These would be the main issues combat-wise for me.

    +1 from me on that ,and i am adding the fact that condition to boon was made easier and more systainable while the options to flip boons to conditions got nerfed.
    Unless somehow a pugmander gets everyone to run that sigil that steals a boon,the odds of pugs dealing with an organised boonspam group in limited space are dramatically low.

  • objectives being too hard to take without a zerg, too easy to take with one

    funny how everybody blames the pugs. its always everybody else's fault isnt it?