A somewhat viable D/D build for WvW ? — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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A somewhat viable D/D build for WvW ?

GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

So I have been playing Rifle, Staff, S/D, D/P, S/P Thief, Deadeye, Daredevil.. Basically I've played a lot of builds, but there is one build I have not found yet, and that is a build that utilizes Dagger/Dagger, I know, it is not the best weapon set, but I made my Incinerator, and I want to use two of them.

Does anyone have a "good" D/D build they could share ? Im not the best build builder, as proved by my question here.

Comments

  • kash.9213kash.9213 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I hope someone has a good build, I'd try it out. There are viable builds but they'll likely feel like good builds adjusted to awkwardly fit in condi clear, control, and reach after a few encounters. You could try a low crit banger like DA and DrD for Dash reach and maybe fit a debuff or condi clear on your utility instead of another port. Or you can free up some trait and utility slots by being super prescient with cooldowns like Shadowstep and Steal/Swipe to use for reach also and maybe toggle Action cam a lot for stuff like Roll for Initiative to close in when nothing else is up, but also to manage your direction and orientation when you hit something targeted with skills that move towards or away from target and might make something like Deaths Blossom easier to shift around with.

    Shortbow auto and skill 3 evade are great for walking in and out of stuff, especially in a group vs group, and I probably use it more than the D/D's when I take that kit. It can be a resource hog though when all of your other utility is under pressure or you need clutch mobility.

    Northern Shiverpeaks [EL] & [SD]

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 3, 2021

    Firstly : PvP/WvW or PvE?

    Here's me offering my opinion for WvW :
    I feel like D/D is less about "a good build" rather how good yu are at awareness and knowledge of yur own limitations vs the enemies yu will meet.
    D/D doesn't have nearly enough leeway that D/P or Rifle DE enjoys, and they burn way more utilities for their rounds of attack because without Signet Shadowstep, yur engage options are really too limited.

    As such when I do play D/D I run this :
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlFw2YXsMGJO6LqnfA-zVIYT0xXKtVA1lA9GBdHCKNA-w

    It's a Valkyrie build with Hidden killer which I use to just cheese people using CnD and Backstabs.
    The idea is literally just to CnD and Backstab, and if I can't kill anyone I just run.
    It's so bloody cheese and it's so inflexible, so I really recommend against running what I run. I just run what I do because I like it that way.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @Yasai.3549 said:
    Firstly : PvP/WvW or PvE?

    As I put in the title. "For WvW" :P

    Here's me offering my opinion for WvW :
    I feel like D/D is less about "a good build" rather how good yu are at awareness and knowledge of yur own limitations vs the enemies yu will meet.
    D/D doesn't have nearly enough leeway that D/P or Rifle DE enjoys, and they burn way more utilities for their rounds of attack because without Signet Shadowstep, yur engage options are really too limited.

    As such when I do play D/D I run this :
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlFw2YXsMGJO6LqnfA-zVIYT0xXKtVA1lA9GBdHCKNA-w

    It's a Valkyrie build with Hidden killer which I use to just cheese people using CnD and Backstabs.
    The idea is literally just to CnD and Backstab, and if I can't kill anyone I just run.
    It's so bloody cheese and it's so inflexible, so I really recommend against running what I run. I just run what I do because I like it that way.

    Maybe I should try this build.

  • zalt.8937zalt.8937 Member ✭✭

    As mentioned, doesnt fare as well as d/p or rifle, or even perhaps s/d.

    Here's one that relies a lot in rng steals to recharge util skills. Shortbow should be used defensively while your burst window is down. Steal is the key ability so ut shouldn't be spammed off cd. Mind that imrov trait has a 20sec icd whilst swipe's cd is a bit lower.
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw2YXsMGJOMXrtUA-zVRYBRHdRME6jR7CoeCIdA-w

    This one uses SA for a bit safer gameplay. Flickering shadows can be used if you struggle vs power builds (forgot to swap runes in thai one, doesnt need vigor from runes since it runs bountyful thief.)
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlFw2YXsM2Je2WntUA-zVRYBRHdRME6jR7CoeCIdA-w

    Feel free to tinker around with runes, stats and food!

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @zalt.8937 said:
    As mentioned, doesnt fare as well as d/p or rifle, or even perhaps s/d.

    Here's one that relies a lot in rng steals to recharge util skills. Shortbow should be used defensively while your burst window is down. Steal is the key ability so ut shouldn't be spammed off cd. Mind that imrov trait has a 20sec icd whilst swipe's cd is a bit lower.
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw2YXsMGJOMXrtUA-zVRYBRHdRME6jR7CoeCIdA-w

    This one uses SA for a bit safer gameplay. Flickering shadows can be used if you struggle vs power builds (forgot to swap runes in thai one, doesnt need vigor from runes since it runs bountyful thief.)
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlFw2YXsM2Je2WntUA-zVRYBRHdRME6jR7CoeCIdA-w

    Feel free to tinker around with runes, stats and food!

    How would one go about to bursting with these builds ? That's probably a question I do need to ask, Stealth Backstabs ?

  • Jugglemonkey.8741Jugglemonkey.8741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Before the Feb patch last year I ran D/D instead of D/P in a malicious backstab deadeye build for a while, but it's arguably a support set in that context since you spend most of your time on rifle. Cloak and dagger is actually nice to have there tho, since you already have a smoke field in sniper's cover for heartseeker spam, and without trickery you will only get 3 leaps in black powder. You really have to manage your malice and stolen skill use to make the most of the stealth to cover D/D's weaknesses however.

    The build Yasai linked would also work, most core D/D thieves I've seen have used smoke screen over agility signet but it's much the same idea. I've fought a couple thieves like him, and it's all about timing that steal>cloak and dagger spike and disengaging if it doesn't work exactly right. It's a fun build to mess with tho.

    Critical Kit, Deadeye.
    “If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.” - John Steinbeck

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @Yasai.3549 said:
    As such when I do play D/D I run this :
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlFw2YXsMGJO6LqnfA-zVIYT0xXKtVA1lA9GBdHCKNA-w

    It's a Valkyrie build with Hidden killer which I use to just cheese people using CnD and Backstabs.
    The idea is literally just to CnD and Backstab, and if I can't kill anyone I just run.
    It's so bloody cheese and it's so inflexible, so I really recommend against running what I run. I just run what I do because I like it that way.

    Oh yeah on that note, how come you run Valkyrie, and not Marauder or Berserker ?

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    Oh yeah on that note, how come you run Valkyrie, and not Marauder or Berserker ?

    Hidden Killer gives 100% Crit while in Stealth and for 2s upon coming out of Stealth, which makes Precision unneeded if yu are playing a hit and run build which wants to hit, then disappear again equally quickly.

    Valkyrie is the perfect set to not only provide Power and Ferocity which makes up the other two parts of the trinity of stats for Power Damage, it provides Vitality which will make Thief much more durable than they naturally are.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @Yasai.3549 said:

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    Oh yeah on that note, how come you run Valkyrie, and not Marauder or Berserker ?

    Hidden Killer gives 100% Crit while in Stealth and for 2s upon coming out of Stealth, which makes Precision unneeded if yu are playing a hit and run build which wants to hit, then disappear again equally quickly.

    Valkyrie is the perfect set to not only provide Power and Ferocity which makes up the other two parts of the trinity of stats for Power Damage, it provides Vitality which will make Thief much more durable than they naturally are.

    Ooh I see, yeah that does make sense..

    Now where in the world will I get a hold of ascended trinkets and rings with Valkyrie.. Maybe the mist vendor, how much is it for a ascended ring/trinket now again ?

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    Now where in the world will I get a hold of ascended trinkets and rings with Valkyrie.. Maybe the mist vendor, how much is it for a ascended ring/trinket now again ?

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_Supervisor#vendor
    Under Ascended Trinkets

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • zalt.8937zalt.8937 Member ✭✭

    Granted this isnt d/d, but this is what i play for fun right now in pvp, numbers should be way higher i wvw. Survivability is actually ok due to the nature of the weapon set. Get regular hs 12-13k on <25%hp. Bs hits like a truck, and thats in pvp games. Bonus, people seem to have forgotten the bursty thieves and panics on opener.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YasO2JOsLbrVA-zZIPleFC5LBCYEUwCwEDA

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @zalt.8937 said:
    Granted this isnt d/d, but this is what i play for fun right now in pvp, numbers should be way higher i wvw. Survivability is actually ok due to the nature of the weapon set. Get regular hs 12-13k on <25%hp. Bs hits like a truck, and thats in pvp games. Bonus, people seem to have forgotten the bursty thieves and panics on opener.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YasO2JOsLbrVA-zZIPleFC5LBCYEUwCwEDA

    What gear and consumables n such would you use for WvW though ?

  • zalt.8937zalt.8937 Member ✭✭

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    @zalt.8937 said:
    Granted this isnt d/d, but this is what i play for fun right now in pvp, numbers should be way higher i wvw. Survivability is actually ok due to the nature of the weapon set. Get regular hs 12-13k on <25%hp. Bs hits like a truck, and thats in pvp games. Bonus, people seem to have forgotten the bursty thieves and panics on opener.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YasO2JOsLbrVA-zZIPleFC5LBCYEUwCwEDA

    What gear and consumables n such would you use for WvW though ?

    Well that depends on what you aim to achieve. The build im running is straight glass canon, and is rather fragile. Its 11k hp and burst runes. Surv/utility comes from tricks and the blinds/stealth baked into d/p. Should you want more Survivability you can mix in valk or/and marauder gear. Same goes for consumables. Although, if you'd rather be a bit more durable, just roll standard daredevil sa d/p!

  • Vecuu.2018Vecuu.2018 Member ✭✭
    edited April 6, 2021

    I run a condi D/D build. A lot of solo-roaming, camp flipping, yakslapping, but also join up in zergs fairly regularly.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw+YbMOGJeWX5NVA-zVRYcRHQG+SpgEInCIzQo3IwnZBm1I-w

    In duels/skirmishes as a roamer, it's mostly about layering through conditions while evasion tanking and jumping in and out of stealth. You shred glass cannon builds that you catch out, since they don't run nearly enough condi cleanse and can't hit you for long enough. Bunker builds are harder, but they don't have much kill-threat on you. Scorpion wire is used in duels for interrupting heals or dragging back into Caltrops. Most of the damage comes from Bleed made by Death Blossom/Caltrops/Dodgetrops, so it's important to keep multiple other forms of condi on your target so the Bleed is harder to cleanse (the build's capable of Tormet/Cripple/Poison/Vuln/Confusion/plus certain Steal items). Cloak and Dagger applies Vuln and gives you Spider Venom from masteries, and tossing out a Dancing Dagger every 10seconds or so goes a long way and keeping the condi pressure up. I rarely use attacks from stealth, with the most common attack being either a dodge while standing on them for dodgetrops or a Scorpion Wire to make reaction dodging a little harder. Being revealed is just a bit too much of a liability, since I'm constantly CnD/Withdrawing/Stealing to reposition/stealth/Shadow Rejuv. Reminder that Tricks are a form of condi cleanse, but you want to use Withdraw or Unhindered Combatant first to cleanse mobility condis first so that Tricks remove Bleed/Poison/Torment/etc.

    In zergs, I'll start Caltrop's cast animation and Shadowstep into a clump for the insta-AoE, then go right into Daggerstorm. I'm tanky enough to fish for CnD stomps, but, if it's a really large zergbattle, I'm mostly fishing for Scorpion Wires while Dancing Dagger spamming runners or dropping poison fields with my shortbow while I wait for Shadowstep+Daggerstorm to come back up.

    It's fun :)

    Edit: You can Caltrops while stealthed, dodging for Dodgetrops will keep you stealthed too. I'll frequently flank a sieging zerg and shred through catas/trebs that aren't properly protected, since I can just CnD the user or the siege itself right as my stealth expires for semi-permanent stealth while keeping 20+ stacks of bleed ticking.

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 6, 2021

    @Vecuu.2018 said:
    I run a condi D/D build. A lot of solo-roaming, camp flipping, yakslapping, but also join up in zergs fairly regularly.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw+YbMOGJeWX5NVA-zVRYcRHQG+SpgEInCIzQo3IwnZBm1I-w

    In duels/skirmishes as a roamer, it's mostly about layering through conditions while evasion tanking and jumping in and out of stealth. You shred glass cannon builds that you catch out, since they don't run nearly enough condi cleanse and can't hit you for long enough. Bunker builds are harder, but they don't have much kill-threat on you. Scorpion wire is used in duels for interrupting heals or dragging back into Caltrops. Most of the damage comes from Bleed made by Death Blossom/Caltrops/Dodgetrops, so it's important to keep multiple other forms of condi on your target so the Bleed is harder to cleanse (the build's capable of Tormet/Cripple/Poison/Vuln/Confusion/plus certain Steal items). Cloak and Dagger applies Vuln and gives you Spider Venom from masteries, and tossing out a Dancing Dagger every 10seconds or so goes a long way and keeping the condi pressure up. I rarely use attacks from stealth, with the most common attack being either a dodge while standing on them for dodgetrops or a Scorpion Wire to make reaction dodging a little harder. Being revealed is just a bit too much of a liability, since I'm constantly CnD/Withdrawing/Stealing to reposition/stealth/Shadow Rejuv. Reminder that Tricks are a form of condi cleanse, but you want to use Withdraw or Unhindered Combatant first to cleanse mobility condis first so that Tricks remove Bleed/Poison/Torment/etc.

    In zergs, I'll start Caltrop's cast animation and Shadowstep into a clump for the insta-AoE, then go right into Daggerstorm. I'm tanky enough to fish for CnD stomps, but, if it's a really large zergbattle, I'm mostly fishing for Scorpion Wires while Dancing Dagger spamming runners or dropping poison fields with my shortbow while I wait for Shadowstep+Daggerstorm to come back up.

    It's fun :)

    Edit: You can Caltrops while stealthed, dodging for Dodgetrops will keep you stealthed too. I'll frequently flank a sieging zerg and shred through catas/trebs that aren't properly protected, since I can just CnD the user or the siege itself right as my stealth expires for semi-permanent stealth while keeping 20+ stacks of bleed ticking.

    This looks like a fun build, I think I will need to try this. But wouldn't the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnanimous_Tuning_Crystal be better as a consumable ?

  • Vecuu.2018Vecuu.2018 Member ✭✭

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    @Vecuu.2018 said:
    I run a condi D/D build. A lot of solo-roaming, camp flipping, yakslapping, but also join up in zergs fairly regularly.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw+YbMOGJeWX5NVA-zVRYcRHQG+SpgEInCIzQo3IwnZBm1I-w

    In duels/skirmishes as a roamer, it's mostly about layering through conditions while evasion tanking and jumping in and out of stealth. You shred glass cannon builds that you catch out, since they don't run nearly enough condi cleanse and can't hit you for long enough. Bunker builds are harder, but they don't have much kill-threat on you. Scorpion wire is used in duels for interrupting heals or dragging back into Caltrops. Most of the damage comes from Bleed made by Death Blossom/Caltrops/Dodgetrops, so it's important to keep multiple other forms of condi on your target so the Bleed is harder to cleanse (the build's capable of Tormet/Cripple/Poison/Vuln/Confusion/plus certain Steal items). Cloak and Dagger applies Vuln and gives you Spider Venom from masteries, and tossing out a Dancing Dagger every 10seconds or so goes a long way and keeping the condi pressure up. I rarely use attacks from stealth, with the most common attack being either a dodge while standing on them for dodgetrops or a Scorpion Wire to make reaction dodging a little harder. Being revealed is just a bit too much of a liability, since I'm constantly CnD/Withdrawing/Stealing to reposition/stealth/Shadow Rejuv. Reminder that Tricks are a form of condi cleanse, but you want to use Withdraw or Unhindered Combatant first to cleanse mobility condis first so that Tricks remove Bleed/Poison/Torment/etc.

    In zergs, I'll start Caltrop's cast animation and Shadowstep into a clump for the insta-AoE, then go right into Daggerstorm. I'm tanky enough to fish for CnD stomps, but, if it's a really large zergbattle, I'm mostly fishing for Scorpion Wires while Dancing Dagger spamming runners or dropping poison fields with my shortbow while I wait for Shadowstep+Daggerstorm to come back up.

    It's fun :)

    Edit: You can Caltrops while stealthed, dodging for Dodgetrops will keep you stealthed too. I'll frequently flank a sieging zerg and shred through catas/trebs that aren't properly protected, since I can just CnD the user or the siege itself right as my stealth expires for semi-permanent stealth while keeping 20+ stacks of bleed ticking.

    This looks like a fun build, I think I will need to try this. But wouldn't the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnanimous_Tuning_Crystal be better as a consumable ?

    Yes, I'm just cheap. Costs half as much on the AH and lasts for twice as long.
    It's really the extra 100 Expertise from food I care about.

    Rough math says I'd gain ~40-50condition damage by going with with Magnanimous. Considering I'm over 1400 condi-damage unbuffed, I don't think that's too much to worry about for casual WvW play.

  • GoldenPants.1870GoldenPants.1870 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vecuu.2018 said:

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    @Vecuu.2018 said:
    I run a condi D/D build. A lot of solo-roaming, camp flipping, yakslapping, but also join up in zergs fairly regularly.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw+YbMOGJeWX5NVA-zVRYcRHQG+SpgEInCIzQo3IwnZBm1I-w

    In duels/skirmishes as a roamer, it's mostly about layering through conditions while evasion tanking and jumping in and out of stealth. You shred glass cannon builds that you catch out, since they don't run nearly enough condi cleanse and can't hit you for long enough. Bunker builds are harder, but they don't have much kill-threat on you. Scorpion wire is used in duels for interrupting heals or dragging back into Caltrops. Most of the damage comes from Bleed made by Death Blossom/Caltrops/Dodgetrops, so it's important to keep multiple other forms of condi on your target so the Bleed is harder to cleanse (the build's capable of Tormet/Cripple/Poison/Vuln/Confusion/plus certain Steal items). Cloak and Dagger applies Vuln and gives you Spider Venom from masteries, and tossing out a Dancing Dagger every 10seconds or so goes a long way and keeping the condi pressure up. I rarely use attacks from stealth, with the most common attack being either a dodge while standing on them for dodgetrops or a Scorpion Wire to make reaction dodging a little harder. Being revealed is just a bit too much of a liability, since I'm constantly CnD/Withdrawing/Stealing to reposition/stealth/Shadow Rejuv. Reminder that Tricks are a form of condi cleanse, but you want to use Withdraw or Unhindered Combatant first to cleanse mobility condis first so that Tricks remove Bleed/Poison/Torment/etc.

    In zergs, I'll start Caltrop's cast animation and Shadowstep into a clump for the insta-AoE, then go right into Daggerstorm. I'm tanky enough to fish for CnD stomps, but, if it's a really large zergbattle, I'm mostly fishing for Scorpion Wires while Dancing Dagger spamming runners or dropping poison fields with my shortbow while I wait for Shadowstep+Daggerstorm to come back up.

    It's fun :)

    Edit: You can Caltrops while stealthed, dodging for Dodgetrops will keep you stealthed too. I'll frequently flank a sieging zerg and shred through catas/trebs that aren't properly protected, since I can just CnD the user or the siege itself right as my stealth expires for semi-permanent stealth while keeping 20+ stacks of bleed ticking.

    This looks like a fun build, I think I will need to try this. But wouldn't the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnanimous_Tuning_Crystal be better as a consumable ?

    Yes, I'm just cheap. Costs half as much on the AH and lasts for twice as long.
    It's really the extra 100 Expertise from food I care about.

    Rough math says I'd gain ~40-50condition damage by going with with Magnanimous. Considering I'm over 1400 condi-damage unbuffed, I don't think that's too much to worry about for casual WvW play.

    Only reason why I am asking is because I got a ton of those Tuning crystals.

  • Vecuu.2018Vecuu.2018 Member ✭✭
    edited April 6, 2021

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    @Vecuu.2018 said:

    @GoldenPants.1870 said:

    @Vecuu.2018 said:
    I run a condi D/D build. A lot of solo-roaming, camp flipping, yakslapping, but also join up in zergs fairly regularly.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgiVlNw+YbMOGJeWX5NVA-zVRYcRHQG+SpgEInCIzQo3IwnZBm1I-w

    In duels/skirmishes as a roamer, it's mostly about layering through conditions while evasion tanking and jumping in and out of stealth. You shred glass cannon builds that you catch out, since they don't run nearly enough condi cleanse and can't hit you for long enough. Bunker builds are harder, but they don't have much kill-threat on you. Scorpion wire is used in duels for interrupting heals or dragging back into Caltrops. Most of the damage comes from Bleed made by Death Blossom/Caltrops/Dodgetrops, so it's important to keep multiple other forms of condi on your target so the Bleed is harder to cleanse (the build's capable of Tormet/Cripple/Poison/Vuln/Confusion/plus certain Steal items). Cloak and Dagger applies Vuln and gives you Spider Venom from masteries, and tossing out a Dancing Dagger every 10seconds or so goes a long way and keeping the condi pressure up. I rarely use attacks from stealth, with the most common attack being either a dodge while standing on them for dodgetrops or a Scorpion Wire to make reaction dodging a little harder. Being revealed is just a bit too much of a liability, since I'm constantly CnD/Withdrawing/Stealing to reposition/stealth/Shadow Rejuv. Reminder that Tricks are a form of condi cleanse, but you want to use Withdraw or Unhindered Combatant first to cleanse mobility condis first so that Tricks remove Bleed/Poison/Torment/etc.

    In zergs, I'll start Caltrop's cast animation and Shadowstep into a clump for the insta-AoE, then go right into Daggerstorm. I'm tanky enough to fish for CnD stomps, but, if it's a really large zergbattle, I'm mostly fishing for Scorpion Wires while Dancing Dagger spamming runners or dropping poison fields with my shortbow while I wait for Shadowstep+Daggerstorm to come back up.

    It's fun :)

    Edit: You can Caltrops while stealthed, dodging for Dodgetrops will keep you stealthed too. I'll frequently flank a sieging zerg and shred through catas/trebs that aren't properly protected, since I can just CnD the user or the siege itself right as my stealth expires for semi-permanent stealth while keeping 20+ stacks of bleed ticking.

    This looks like a fun build, I think I will need to try this. But wouldn't the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnanimous_Tuning_Crystal be better as a consumable ?

    Yes, I'm just cheap. Costs half as much on the AH and lasts for twice as long.
    It's really the extra 100 Expertise from food I care about.

    Rough math says I'd gain ~40-50condition damage by going with with Magnanimous. Considering I'm over 1400 condi-damage unbuffed, I don't think that's too much to worry about for casual WvW play.

    Only reason why I am asking is because I got a ton of those Tuning crystals.

    Nice. Should work fine.

    The builds kinda quirky to skirmish with, but I've been using a variant of it since way back before Dire or Trailblazer's were an option and love it for WvW.
    It's a pretty potent roamer that's hard to kill and can solo flip T3 camps pretty quickly and safely. Some of my favorite moments are fighting off 1-3 players solo while evasion tanking and bleeding down entire camps (admittedly I'll usually only opt into t1 camps for those plays!).

  • Sifu.9745Sifu.9745 Member ✭✭✭

    An old condi D/D is still more viable than power D/D which is kitten. It's far from being a perfect build, but it's not that bad either. Just take condi stats (Trailblaizer or you can add some Carrion pieces if you need more Power, crit is not needed at all). Oh and don't forget your Shortbow. Condi P/D is still in a better place than condi D/D, but you can have both weapon sets, if you don't take WvW too serious: P/D and D/D, if you think you can live without SB.

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Condi D/D is significantly stronger than power D/D with the coefs and scaling nerfs from the infamous Feb. patch. Since it can't disengage and can't fight toe to toe, it has to blow someone up or it generally fights at a huge disadvantage, but there's just not enough damage on the kit currently to deal with most of the more powerful roaming kits, and even some of the glassier specs depending on a few tertiary conditions.

    Power D/D doesn't actually have any real use since a SA S/D build just objectively superior with more innate utility. Though it's wiser to build Trickery instead of DA in all cases of D/D because they nerfed the damage on DA unless the opponent is loaded with conditions due to the reworked EW. ToTC and the fury on steal to get CnD to crit and Lead Attacks' more sustained damage on chained CnD are simply better choices in most cases, and because D/D is extremely initiative-inefficient, Preparedness is generally a must-have since you'll be recasting CnD as a primary source of damage while using Infil Signet and Shadowstep as your primary means to chase down foes. HS isn't good unless you're absolutely sure, since the animation lock is long and aside from already hitting CnD and the opponent burning its defensive resources, cannot be safely casted with reliable damage. The initiative is better-saved for more chained CnD casts.

    There's also little reason to run Valk/HK since the backstab damage is generally so low now; rotating CnD endlessly is often a better use of your skills against opponents that aren't running backline zerg builds or just don't play well since you will rarely get lethal in one or even two rotations of CnD->Stab and are overly-punished for Reveal with D/D since you have no disengage nor means of dealing with rangers and D/P thieves if you do. S/D building Marauder for CnD crits can actually chip since CnD accounts for so much of the damage now, and can also deal unblockable damage into stuff like guard/ranger as a follow-up as well as disengage, and has in-built cleanses and decent CC.

    Condi can just equip Dire/TB gear and just facetank most lethal counterbursts, or evade with DB which is already part of the primary means of damage, though its efficacy is pretty lackluster into most roaming builds which have so much support for condi removal, so you'll still struggler into better or higher-end builds played by competent players anyways.

    D/D is in really bad shape as a whole and is generally the forgotten stepchild of Thief. Virtually all of the kit's power is in CnD alone, which when recasted endlessly, is a boring style of play which good players can also capitalize well on because they know you'll be in melee every 3-4s and can either dodge/block or bomb their feet and pressure you out or slap back and just sustain through most of the punishment.

    So if you're playing SA Tr DrD or CS Tr SA in Marauder and are making this thread which is pretty likely, you're already playing the most viable D/D power build, but not playing it optimally, and very boringly, by using any other weapon skills than CnD and maybe an occasional HS or extremely niche DB.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.