Minstrel Support Rev for WvW?

mistsim.2748

I'm looking for some opinions on viable Minstrel +/- Giver Rev for zerging specifically (any spec). I like active and rewarding play styles so the support FB is kinda out of the question for me, given its faceroll nature. Can Ventari do anything useful any more? I imagine some combination with Herald is the way to go?

So any beefy, supportey Rev build out there that is at least semi viable? What about a core build with Malyx/Ventari for heals, CC and condi protection? Maybe a terrible idea?

I actually don't care for any DPS Rev builds because core guard is a freaking god and I'm using him to farm bags atm.

Thanks.

Nydo.3406

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Herald_-Ventari_Healer-_(WvW) The build isn't set up with minstrel gear, but it is a viable support build. Also, playing the meta hammer Herald build is partially a support build due to facet buffs and using road for stability; it just isn't really a group healing build.

ArchonWing.9480

Tablet Herald is good for trolling small scale as all projectile users will hate you. It's also a good way to stop siege disablers.

In large scale, the static nature of the tablet is a problem and is simply outclassed by mobile support like scrappers and tempest. In addition you are forced to choose between excluding either Dwarf (no stability) or no Dragon (less sustain and no stunbreak).

mistsim.2748

@ArchonWing.9480 said:
Tablet Herald is good for trolling small scale as all projectile users will hate you. It's also a good way to stop siege disablers.

In large scale, the static nature of the tablet is a problem and is simply outclassed by mobile support like scrappers and tempest. In addition you are forced to choose between excluding either Dwarf (no stability) or no Dragon (less sustain and no stunbreak).

I was thinking of Malyx/Ventari with Dire/Apothecary to sustain my roaming group and put out condi pressure. Thoughts?

Ventari not having a stun break really hurts though.

Dawdler.8521

@mistsim.2748 said:

@ArchonWing.9480 said:
Tablet Herald is good for trolling small scale as all projectile users will hate you. It's also a good way to stop siege disablers.

In large scale, the static nature of the tablet is a problem and is simply outclassed by mobile support like scrappers and tempest. In addition you are forced to choose between excluding either Dwarf (no stability) or no Dragon (less sustain and no stunbreak).

I was thinking of Malyx/Ventari with Dire/Apothecary to sustain my roaming group and put out condi pressure. Thoughts?

Ventari not having a stun break really hurts though.

Sure that'll work, assuming your goal is to give the enemy more boons and healing than what you can give your allies.

Za Shaloc.3908

Honest thoughts. I main Rev and have played a lot of Ventari over the years but don't really run in squads so my perspective is a bit limited.

• Ventari feels pretty bad ever since the big balance patch, and it didn't have a good rep before that. Its healing got hit really hard and that was its main schtick, so on top of having to deal with the tablet mechanic it has very little appeal. Superspeed uptime has made micromanagement even harder. Bubble spam is nice in smaller scale and its cleanse is actually pretty good if you can land it. I used to be very passionate about it but now it just feels like it's generally not worth the effort. If I want big heals I play Druid. When you compare it to meta supports like FB you provide better healing potential but at such a huge cost, and Scrapper basically just does everything better with 10x more ease. ANet gave our bubble a 240 radius, but the only other bone they have thrown the legend is healing orbs, which turned out not to be a bone, but a meme that nobody asked for.
• Heal Herald is still a decent healer but it doesn't do much else. It no longer has 10-man boons, Facet of Nature-Ventari was bootied, and that's about all you do. No stab, one stunbreak, and common boons. Feels okay I suppose. You can run without Glint if you want, but the only reason IMO would be for the Jalis F2; otherwise you are better off going core or Renegade. It gets a 4/5 on Metabattle which is WAY overestimating its worth. I would give it like a 2.5 or 3.
• Minstrel Renegade feels more impactful because you can provide 10-man alacrity to your allies, which I'd argue is of greater benefit than Herald now. You miss out on shield heal and being able to freely cast weapon skills in Glint without much regard to the energy costs, but axe is still really good. You can run Jalis or Mallyx; both have their advantages. Actual heal support feels on the weaker side but it works okay I suppose. Alacrity makes the legend feel a lot more fluid as you can move the tablet and cleanse more often, not to mention quicker access to skills in other legends. Personally I think is the best choice for mid to large scale now. If Purity of Purpose ever gets addressed, it would probably see more value (though I wouldn't be surprised if ANet took away 10-man Alac)
• Core Ventari is fun but a bit memey. You have access to a ton of energy which makes it more realistic to get off a lot of heals, and the core lines are all really good depending on which niche you want to fulfill. You don't have access to many boons as core though. If running Jalis I would still run Minstrel but if running Mallyx I'd go Apothecary/Plaguedoctor's depending on how deep into damage you wanna go. I kinda like running this best for small scale because you can never trust pugs to actually do damage, and the boonripping and CC chains are really nice.

Not trying to dissuade you from picking it up whatsoever, as you should ultimately just play what you enjoy, just giving you my honest biased opinion. You can still make it work and have fun with it. I will link you some builds if you are interested. For all builds but Herald, take Rapid Flow if your group has poor swiftness uptime.

• Heal Herald is basically what is on Metabattle that @Nydo.3406 linked you (here's the working link), but I would still recommend going with Minstrel's since Draconic Echo is nerfed. IMO take Elevated Compassion, and you can swap for Hardening Persistence if you want the extra cleanse (though Shared Empowerment is a reliable way of proccing Elevated Compassion in Ventari so will net more healing).
• Ventari/Mallyx Renegade Renegade or Ventari/Jalis Renegade. Alternative rune: Altruism (if running Mallyx). You can swap the 2 first Salvation traits for mid & mid if you want more sustain (I swap to those in small-scale)
• Core Ventari/Jalis Rev. Leaving the runes blank because IMO there are a lot that can work: Flock, Rebirth, Monk, Herald, or Durability would be my recommendations. First two traits in Salvation are flex too, as they generally are since the healing modifiers got gutted.
• Core Ventari/Mallyx Rev. IMO the only reason you would go core with Mallyx is if you want to do some damage too. The GM in Corruption is more of a personal choice depending on what you want to go for; they are all good I am just really partial to the transfers. You can make the build a lot more aggressive if you want, but at a certain point you have to ask yourself if it is even worth running Ventari.

mistsim.2748

@Za Shaloc.3908 said:
Honest thoughts.

Thanks, amazing breakdown. I was gonna take a Dire/Apoth core Mallyx/Ventari for a spin in some skirmishes. If it doesn't work out, I'll just switch to Dire/Trailblazer Glint/Mallyx.

I really really enjoy everything about Mallyx and staff. So I wanna build around that legend and weapon. I was thinking Ventari to support my small squad with some heals and cleanses, which Glint can't do, while still doing good damage.

I can't believe they kept nerfing Ventari like that. It's really unfortunate.

What Rev are you playing now in zergs?

Also, I tried Minstrel Druid a year ago, and it felt fairly useless. No useful boons, dead pets, poor CC options. I switched to immob Soulbeast and I'm really enjoying the high impact plays...but I'm interested in a more supportey spec. Ideally without the faceroll.