Shiro needs a rework.

Yasai.3549

I don't usually make claims like this but I truly feel that Shiro is ACTUALLY unplayable anymore.

They used to be a hyper aggressive set with high energy costs balanced by the fact that their heal is inconsistent in order to embody Shiro's bloodlust and aggression.
Now its :

• Inconsistent Heal
• Cooldown based Gapcloser which costs 35 Energy
• Stunbreak that costs 40 Energy
• AoE CC with no damage that costs 50 Energy
• Upkeep which can't be used for longer than 3 seconds or yu will be unable to cast literally any other Utility

Please listen Anet, Shiro needs some work and number tweaks.
In general : utility skills need some bloat reduction.

We need a standard costing Stunbreak :
Riposting Shadows should be reduced to 30 Energy but have its Endurance refill removed. That's all we need to stop it from being abused to Evade spam. We desperately need this in order for Shiro to still be able to keep up with the level of CC some builds pour out.

We need PT cost reduction.
While I agree that Phase Traversal's 5s Cooldown was abit too sticky for Rev, 12s is too much, especially when the skill costs 35 Energy.
My opinion is that Phase Traversal should have never been changed to carry Quickness as it gave too much burst potential.
Should lower the Cooldown for PvP to 8s, and remove Quickness from Phase Traversal and to reduce its cost to 25 Energy.

We should put Quickness back into IO.
Impossible Odds has been neutered so hard over the years.
Impossible Odds used to be that really powerful but expensive Upkeep which allowed Rev to go into a flurry of attacks.
It first had its Quickness removed, then it had its Superspeed removed.
Now it's just Impossible, with all the Odds stacked against it.

Put Quickness back into Impossible Odds. That's all it needs to explain its high energy cost.

Jade Winds needs to be have some damage back.
50 Energy for a CC in AoE is really not a great deal, especially when enemies can just negate it with Stability or Stunbreaks.
But since making it cheaper or to remove any limit on it in anyway could cause potential problems, it needs to have some Damage back.

It just makes no sense that a high cost, powerful Elite does 0 damage.

Leonidrex.5649

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:
imagine asking for buffs for S tier class, I bet every mesmer/ranger is dying on the inside or from laughter from reading this. I sure died tiny bit.

Revenant may be "S" tier but Shiro isn't, not in the state it's in.

And the fact yu are quick to call it a buff means yu didn't even read the post.

My suggestions directly call for removal of effects to core parts of Shiro that were troublesome in order to make gameplay smoother. Shiro has had enjoyed an unhealthy amount of skill bloat on a short cooldown for too long, but slapping up Energy cost and cooldown is a deconstructive change which entirely shatters Revenant's gameplay design.

I made suggestions to have Shiro's skills be reduced in bloat in exchange for reducing cost and lowering the cooldown of PT to a more flexible level (12s- 8s) and that's considered a buff?

Gosh I guess yur gonna tell Mirage players asking for their 1 Dodge back asking for buffs too?

I did read it.
you want S tier spec to gain
extra damage
extra quickness
lower energy costs

in return you are willing to give up 25 kitten endurance on the riposting shadows

its not a kitten rework, its a straight buff across the board.

Yasai.3549

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

I did read it.
you want S tier spec to gain
extra damage
extra quickness
lower energy costs

in return you are willing to give up 25 kitten endurance on the riposting shadows

its not a kitten rework, its a straight buff across the board.

I'll say it's more of a much needed rebalancing.

Revenants have been stuck with really few Legend choices due to how they are designed, and they need more balancing focus which Anet just isn't giving them.
If these changes that I've suggested were rolled out much earlier, we wouldn't have people complaining about how much Rev does in a single button press.

In fact, I don't believe Rev should have a 12s cooldown skill use 35 energy in the first place. And besides, why is Shiro getting nerfs after nerfs when Renegade's node control with Summons is way more of a problem in the first place?

UNOwen.7132

Isnt Shiro used both by Renegade and Power Herald, 2 really, really good classes right now?

Yasai.3549

@UNOwen.7132 said:
Isnt Shiro used both by Renegade and Power Herald, 2 really, really good classes right now?

I wouldn't say Power Herald is really good, and I'm not calling for a total revert of PT's cooldown. 8s is still a pretty punishable cooldown.
I just don't feel that if the cooldown cost is in place that the skill should still cost 35 energy, and removing Quickness does affect how consistent PT is used for engages.

I mean just hop on Power Herald right now, it went from somewhat strong to idk how to even describe it anymore, it's just bad.

Leonidrex.5649

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

yes, they are both really good, one of the best builds right now
shiro needs more attention and buffs then anything, kitten core ele, kitten core mes, kitten core engi.
we need to roll in with them shiro buffs

Being sarcastic like this doesn't help those professions either.
People should make threads on those, because we have an equal amount of posts calling for their nerfs in the past.
Strange that yur first reaction to seeing others demanding for balances and reverts is to take a dump instead of figuring out what these lacking builds or professions need.

For the record, I HAVE made suggestions to buff Core Ele, Core Mes and DEFINITELY Core Engi in their respective Profession subforums, but I've made this one in PvP because it's a PvP specific nerf and it really feels uncalled for.

And I strongly disagree with Power Herald being one of the best builds right now.
One of the more workable builds yes, but best? Not even close.

people made those posts, devs dont listen.
heck CMC promised to read through mesmer suggestions and there is silence, how long has it been now? lol.
Last thing we need is kitten revenant buffed, I think I would actually flip my kitten if that happened
You want shiro to have NO kitten weaknesses, which is a BIG problem, you want everything at once and honestly, its 1 kitten legend.
you have another one to run with it too. When I make ranger I always give up something, be it damage, sustain, ways to remove CC, mobility or evasion but revs just want it all.

Yasai.3549

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

people made those posts, devs dont listen.
heck CMC promised to read through mesmer suggestions and there is silence, how long has it been now? lol.
Last thing we need is kitten revenant buffed, I think I would actually flip my kitten if that happened
You want shiro to have NO kitten weaknesses, which is a BIG problem, you want everything at once and honestly, its 1 kitten legend.
you have another one to run with it too. When I make ranger I always give up something, be it damage, sustain, ways to remove CC, mobility or evasion but revs just want it all.

Shiro does have weakness, and has had weakness even before the huge patch that nerfed power damage.
It's called Condi.
If anything PvP Rev is still pretty susceptable to Condi, and with the recent Infused Light nerf, they should be even weaker to Condi now.

Shiro also being a power set is weak to perma prot and weakness, something many builds wield with wild abandon.
Shiro is also weak to CC due to their Stunbreak costing so much. Shiro is also weakest after using their Stunbreak and after PT due to those costs.

I can sit here and explain Shiro's weakness all day long but people probably won't understand how weak Shiro is to fight anyway.
Herald is the real problem with Power Herald and always has been.

Herald is the one introducing no cost cooldowns with strong skills tied to them which threw the balance of Rev out the window, coupled with the strong sustain from traits as well as really good self booning, I'm still curious why Herald still exists as it is right now, especially when Condi Herald is still an existing problem.

I don't think Shiro needs to be taking the hit for the problems and inbalance Herald is introducing to the Profession as a whole.
Infuse Light nerf is the first step, now there needs to be more targetted nerfs to Herald's sustain which made Glint/Shiro strong and make their weakness clearer, and in exchange Shiro needs to be rebalanced and stop being a "press 1 skill and there goes all my energy" Legend.

For the record, I never sat with Druid damage nerf. Perma Immob is a problem but the damage nerf ruined Power Druid.

My stance :
Shiro and by extension Core should stop suffering nerfs which was brought on by the massive strengths of Herald and Renegade

Khalisto.5780

Nah, buff something that actually need it instead like berserker or core ele

Za Shaloc.3908

Quickness on a 1200 range unblockable port was not their best idea, but IMO it was a PvE-oriented change so they could tweak IO to make it more relevant for endgame content, so I doubt they would ever put it back on IO. Also, IO is actually really good right now and absolutely should not have both the additional strikes and quickness. I do miss the versatility of the old IO though.

Kuma.1503

This class definately needs work. It's S tier in PvP and F tier in PvE. I'm all for classes not necessarily being great in every game mode, but in a game mode as volatile as PvP where "balance" can swing wildly patch to patch, I wouldn't say being good in PvP is a sustainable strength to have.

If nothing else, Anet needs to decide if Rev is a cooldown based class or an energy based class. If it's the former then lower the energy costs and increase cooldowns to be on par with other classes. If it's the latter then cooldowns on the spec need to go down not up, since, like thieves, their resources gate their ability usage.

Vancho.8750

@Kuma.1503 said:
This class definately needs work. It's S tier in PvP and F tier in PvE. I'm all for classes not necessarily being great in every game mode, but in a game mode as volatile as PvP where "balance" can swing wildly patch to patch, I wouldn't say being good in PvP is a sustainable strength to have.

If nothing else, Anet needs to decide if Rev is a cooldown based class or an energy based class. If it's the former then lower the energy costs and increase cooldowns to be on par with other classes. If it's the latter then cooldowns on the spec need to go down not up, since, like thieves, their resources gate their ability usage.

Well Rev was supposed to be the one weapon set heavy armored profession with reverse thief system where their utilities cost energy, but they didn't have the balls to give it an identity and let people dictate what it is supposed to be and it ended up in jumbled mess of clashing designs that overlap with other professions and in some cases do a better job at them while able to switch to another class on the go with a button. The issue with not having a strong core design is not only with rev but it is the most noticeable profession to have it.

Trevor Boyer.6524

@Yasai.3549 said:
I don't usually make claims like this but I truly feel that Shiro is ACTUALLY unplayable anymore.

lol no

Power Shiro is still top 3 MVP for any competitive team for too many reasons to list here in this thread.

They used to be a hyper aggressive set with high energy costs balanced by the fact that their heal is inconsistent in order to embody Shiro's bloodlust and aggression.
Now its :

• Inconsistent Heal
• Cooldown based Gapcloser which costs 35 Energy
• Stunbreak that costs 40 Energy
• AoE CC with no damage that costs 50 Energy
• Upkeep which can't be used for longer than 3 seconds or yu will be unable to cast literally any other Utility

Everything else in the game was getting nerfed so of course Shiro had to be nerfed too.

Please listen Anet, Shiro needs some work and number tweaks.
In general : utility skills need some bloat reduction.

No

We need a standard costing Stunbreak :
Riposting Shadows should be reduced to 30 Energy but have its Endurance refill removed. That's all we need to stop it from being abused to Evade spam. We desperately need this in order for Shiro to still be able to keep up with the level of CC some builds pour out.

You mean like Spellbreaker? They are supposed to counter you. It's normal.

We need PT cost reduction.
While I agree that Phase Traversal's 5s Cooldown was abit too sticky for Rev, 12s is too much, especially when the skill costs 35 Energy.
My opinion is that Phase Traversal should have never been changed to carry Quickness as it gave too much burst potential.
Should lower the Cooldown for PvP to 8s, and remove Quickness from Phase Traversal and to reduce its cost to 25 Energy.

Phase Traversal should be at least 12s CD. You seem to be taking the idea "constant teleportation" quite lightly for some reason.

We should put Quickness back into IO.
Impossible Odds has been neutered so hard over the years.
Impossible Odds used to be that really powerful but expensive Upkeep which allowed Rev to go into a flurry of attacks.
It first had its Quickness removed, then it had its Superspeed removed.
Now it's just Impossible, with all the Odds stacked against it.
Put Quickness back into Impossible Odds. That's all it needs to explain its high energy cost.

No

Jade Winds needs to be have some damage back.
50 Energy for a CC in AoE is really not a great deal, especially when enemies can just negate it with Stability or Stunbreaks.
But since making it cheaper or to remove any limit on it in anyway could cause potential problems, it needs to have some Damage back.
It just makes no sense that a high cost, powerful Elite does 0 damage.

It's an elite skill with an inordinately long duration and radius of effect. It should cost 50 energy and it doesn't need damage. No other massive AoE CCs in the game deal damage either so why should Shiro be different?

There are a lot of things you suggested that would feel mechanically right to fix. But every class has been ultra super nerfed at this point. Every class has gripes like what is listed in this thread. The way Shiro sits now, is balanced for this new great nerf patching. Your suggestions here would make Shiro way way way too strong.

I'm not necessarily opposed to your suggestions. But for them to work, they'd first need to revert a lot of the nerfing they've done lately, to every class.

frareanselm.1925

Go to metabatel, click PVP... Power Shiro is the second strongest build in all the PVP but the OP wants more buffing lol

Stand The Wall.6987

at the very least i would like to see all rev stunbreaks cost no more then 30e

Svez Poizon XD.5268

@Yasai.3549 said:

Put Quickness back into Impossible Odds. That's all it needs to explain its high energy cost.

After reading this i know you are joking...

Virdo.1540

Shiro nerf here... Jalis nerf there.... Trait nerfs there....

All i see are unnecessary nerfs for core,while not targeting the real problems, the E-Specs. This probably goes for other professions aswell.

Tbh i think we r coming to the point, where Power Rev builds take demon for damage.

XxsdgxX.8109

"So what do we do to this Elite Spec that was part of the winning team of this Monthly Tournament (because how dare it)? Nerf Change something about the Elite Spec itself? Nah, lets nerf something about the core class instead."

Yasai.3549

@Virdo.1540 said:
Shiro nerf here... Jalis nerf there.... Trait nerfs there....

All i see are unnecessary nerfs for core,while not targeting the real problems, the E-Specs. This probably goes for other professions aswell.

Tbh i think we r coming to the point, where Power Rev builds take demon for damage.

@XxsdgxX.8109 said:
"So what do we do to this Elite Spec that was part of the winning team of this Monthly Tournament (because how dare it)? Nerf Change something about the Elite Spec itself? Nah, lets nerf something about the core class instead."

My exact feelings.
People here are all against Shiro being balanced due to the fact that Power Herald being dominant.

I've already mentioned earlier in this thread that Core is paying for Espec's massive unbalance.
I play Core Rev more than I play Herald, and It's highly obvious that the only reason the build still works is because Power Herald was carrying it so hard. Same with Power Renegade.

If anything it should be the other way around, with Especs being nerfed and Core being rebalanced, not Core being neutered and Especs being kept the same.
Where's that TN Demon nerf at? And instead of nerfing Fury pulse for Herald, they nerfed Invocation's Incense Response instead. And before the Incensed Response nerf, they removed the damage boost from PT instead of nerfing the ridiculous 25 Might only made possible because of Herald.

Crozame.4098

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@Yasai.3549 said:
I don't usually make claims like this but I truly feel that Shiro is ACTUALLY unplayable anymore.

lol no

Power Shiro is still top 3 MVP for any competitive team for too many reasons to list here in this thread.

They used to be a hyper aggressive set with high energy costs balanced by the fact that their heal is inconsistent in order to embody Shiro's bloodlust and aggression.
Now its :

• Inconsistent Heal
• Cooldown based Gapcloser which costs 35 Energy
• Stunbreak that costs 40 Energy
• AoE CC with no damage that costs 50 Energy
• Upkeep which can't be used for longer than 3 seconds or yu will be unable to cast literally any other Utility

Everything else in the game was getting nerfed so of course Shiro had to be nerfed too.

Please listen Anet, Shiro needs some work and number tweaks.
In general : utility skills need some bloat reduction.

No

We need a standard costing Stunbreak :
Riposting Shadows should be reduced to 30 Energy but have its Endurance refill removed. That's all we need to stop it from being abused to Evade spam. We desperately need this in order for Shiro to still be able to keep up with the level of CC some builds pour out.

You mean like Spellbreaker? They are supposed to counter you. It's normal.

We need PT cost reduction.
While I agree that Phase Traversal's 5s Cooldown was abit too sticky for Rev, 12s is too much, especially when the skill costs 35 Energy.
My opinion is that Phase Traversal should have never been changed to carry Quickness as it gave too much burst potential.
Should lower the Cooldown for PvP to 8s, and remove Quickness from Phase Traversal and to reduce its cost to 25 Energy.

Phase Traversal should be at least 12s CD. You seem to be taking the idea "constant teleportation" quite lightly for some reason.

We should put Quickness back into IO.
Impossible Odds has been neutered so hard over the years.
Impossible Odds used to be that really powerful but expensive Upkeep which allowed Rev to go into a flurry of attacks.
It first had its Quickness removed, then it had its Superspeed removed.
Now it's just Impossible, with all the Odds stacked against it.
Put Quickness back into Impossible Odds. That's all it needs to explain its high energy cost.

No

Jade Winds needs to be have some damage back.
50 Energy for a CC in AoE is really not a great deal, especially when enemies can just negate it with Stability or Stunbreaks.
But since making it cheaper or to remove any limit on it in anyway could cause potential problems, it needs to have some Damage back.
It just makes no sense that a high cost, powerful Elite does 0 damage.

It's an elite skill with an inordinately long duration and radius of effect. It should cost 50 energy and it doesn't need damage. No other massive AoE CCs in the game deal damage either so why should Shiro be different?

There are a lot of things you suggested that would feel mechanically right to fix. But every class has been ultra super nerfed at this point. Every class has gripes like what is listed in this thread. The way Shiro sits now, is balanced for this new great nerf patching. Your suggestions here would make Shiro way way way too strong.

I'm not necessarily opposed to your suggestions. But for them to work, they'd first need to revert a lot of the nerfing they've done lately, to every class.

MOTA -- 0 power rev, HS top3 teams has no pshiro rev....

About massive CC and dmg, LR weaver and tornado, thats like 60 sec CD?

Arheundel.6451

@Crozame.4098 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@Yasai.3549 said:
I don't usually make claims like this but I truly feel that Shiro is ACTUALLY unplayable anymore.

lol no

Power Shiro is still top 3 MVP for any competitive team for too many reasons to list here in this thread.

They used to be a hyper aggressive set with high energy costs balanced by the fact that their heal is inconsistent in order to embody Shiro's bloodlust and aggression.
Now its :

• Inconsistent Heal
• Cooldown based Gapcloser which costs 35 Energy
• Stunbreak that costs 40 Energy
• AoE CC with no damage that costs 50 Energy
• Upkeep which can't be used for longer than 3 seconds or yu will be unable to cast literally any other Utility

Everything else in the game was getting nerfed so of course Shiro had to be nerfed too.

Please listen Anet, Shiro needs some work and number tweaks.
In general : utility skills need some bloat reduction.

No

We need a standard costing Stunbreak :
Riposting Shadows should be reduced to 30 Energy but have its Endurance refill removed. That's all we need to stop it from being abused to Evade spam. We desperately need this in order for Shiro to still be able to keep up with the level of CC some builds pour out.

You mean like Spellbreaker? They are supposed to counter you. It's normal.

We need PT cost reduction.
While I agree that Phase Traversal's 5s Cooldown was abit too sticky for Rev, 12s is too much, especially when the skill costs 35 Energy.
My opinion is that Phase Traversal should have never been changed to carry Quickness as it gave too much burst potential.
Should lower the Cooldown for PvP to 8s, and remove Quickness from Phase Traversal and to reduce its cost to 25 Energy.

Phase Traversal should be at least 12s CD. You seem to be taking the idea "constant teleportation" quite lightly for some reason.

We should put Quickness back into IO.
Impossible Odds has been neutered so hard over the years.
Impossible Odds used to be that really powerful but expensive Upkeep which allowed Rev to go into a flurry of attacks.
It first had its Quickness removed, then it had its Superspeed removed.
Now it's just Impossible, with all the Odds stacked against it.
Put Quickness back into Impossible Odds. That's all it needs to explain its high energy cost.

No

Jade Winds needs to be have some damage back.
50 Energy for a CC in AoE is really not a great deal, especially when enemies can just negate it with Stability or Stunbreaks.
But since making it cheaper or to remove any limit on it in anyway could cause potential problems, it needs to have some Damage back.
It just makes no sense that a high cost, powerful Elite does 0 damage.

It's an elite skill with an inordinately long duration and radius of effect. It should cost 50 energy and it doesn't need damage. No other massive AoE CCs in the game deal damage either so why should Shiro be different?

There are a lot of things you suggested that would feel mechanically right to fix. But every class has been ultra super nerfed at this point. Every class has gripes like what is listed in this thread. The way Shiro sits now, is balanced for this new great nerf patching. Your suggestions here would make Shiro way way way too strong.

I'm not necessarily opposed to your suggestions. But for them to work, they'd first need to revert a lot of the nerfing they've done lately, to every class.

MOTA -- 0 power rev, HS top3 teams has no pshiro rev....

About massive CC and dmg, LR weaver and tornado, thats like 60 sec CD?

I see you're well informed...... https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Tornado , people whine about some useless low tier trait https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Rod_(trait_skill)#WvW.2CPvP which has been nerfed twice already and now you deal like 1-2k dmg on glassy target while you use a glassy set up yourself , in addition many of you truly believe the big hit are due to CC when : https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Plasma_Burst and https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Convergence are not CC at all...but again nothing surprises me on this forum anymore

I could try to explain how glass d/f weaver works but..the video above easily explains why the build is only working in soloq, pfff "massive CC and dmg", it's why you run ele and not rev...oh wait you don't know how to play ele, easier and safer to run revenant.

Kuma.1503

We can't even convince half the forums that underpowered specs need work. Good luck convincing them that an S tier specialization needs it.
Unless it's a nerf, most don't want to hear it.

Arheundel.6451

@Kuma.1503 said:
We can't even convince half the forums that underpowered specs need work. Good luck convincing them that an S tier specialization needs it.
Unless it's a nerf, most don't want to hear it.

The direction of the game should not be in the hands of any forum

Shao.7236

Shiro outside of Impossible Odds upkeep doesn't need any change.

Yasai.3549

@Kuma.1503 said:
We can't even convince half the forums that underpowered specs need work. Good luck convincing them that an S tier specialization needs it.
Unless it's a nerf, most don't want to hear it.

Cos most likely they don't know what they are fighting.

Wasn't there that guy a month ago which thought HERALD was the one with Phase Traversal?

Shows people don't even research why something is strong or where the problem's coming from and complain in forums, and the funniest thing is Anet listens.

Big joke making Guardian's short duration burns even shorter btw.

Tharan.9085

@Yasai.3549 said:

Revenants have been stuck with really few Legend choices due to how they are designed, and they need more balancing focus which Anet just isn't giving them.

What? Herald great, shiro great, mallyx great, Kalla great, Jallis great, Ventari decent. Where tf has it been stuck with really few legend choices?

Yasai.3549

@Tharan.9085 said:
What? Herald great, shiro great, mallyx great, Kalla great, Jallis great, Ventari decent. Where tf has it been stuck with really few legend choices?

It's more like :
Herald/Renegade +

Power : Shiro or Jalis aside from Espec
Condi : Mallyx only aside from Espec
Heals : Ventari only (😂)

With the repeated nerfs to Core, it's slowly becoming Herald/Renegade + whatever left that isn't nerfed.
But of course people don't care, because all they see is Herald and Renegade as Revenant itself, and whatever related to it getting nerfed is a plus.

Yasai.3549

@Virdo.1540 said:
Tbh i think we r coming to the point, where Power Rev builds take demon for damage.

Demon is actually better for Power, has been for awhile tbh.

• Good Chunk Heal
• Good resistance to Condi, being Rev's greatest weakness
• Good on demand AoE CC
• Fills the Boonrip lost by not running Shiro

The only drawback is that if yu wanna pull out the strength of this, yu have to run Corruption, and Corruption is not exactly stellar for Power damage.

Scoobaniec.9561

He dont need rework. He need to go back to his origin before the bloat, joke cd's and ridiculous energy costs.

snoow.1694

100% disagree with this one, Shiro is one of the most broken mechanics in the game and one of the reasons why Rev is still the most overperforming class in PvP. If anything I think Shiro should be further nerfed in terms of energy costs.

Lighter.5631

teleport is the most broken mechanics in the game follow by stealth
shiro still easily top spec, thief/mes even out of meta for tournaments and organized plays, still top specs for ranked unorganized matches and will always be.

specs like ranger/war = specs is bad = unplayable everywhere,
spec with teleport/stealth = even bad, still allowed to go dps and pick on low health for snowball and carry.

as plat 2 power rev, i find the new CD limits skill ceiling which allows me to get kills after kills in quick session, i could jump from low target to low target real quick from far if you had awareness, which is op in itself.

Lighter.5631

i would suggest make thief/rev/mes in to bruisers make classes like warrior/engi in to roamer, the game would be lot of enjoyable

Kuma.1503

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Kuma.1503 said:
We can't even convince half the forums that underpowered specs need work. Good luck convincing them that an S tier specialization needs it.
Unless it's a nerf, most don't want to hear it.

Cos most likely they don't know what they are fighting.

Wasn't there that guy a month ago which thought HERALD was the one with Phase Traversal?

Shows people don't even research why something is strong or where the problem's coming from and complain in forums, and the funniest thing is Anet listens.

Big joke making Guardian's short duration burns even shorter btw.

I'm convinced a lot of people don't even know what revenant does. Some of my favorites include

"Nerf infuse light on Shiro."
"Renegade has too much AoE damage with spirits"
"Renegade can give perma alacrity and stability to it's team while still dishing out insane damage"
"Mallyx pull has no tell"
"Rev refilling energy is broken. Thief cant do it so rev shouldn't either"

It's like... at least put in the bare minimum amount of effort to learn what the class does before you complain about it.

XxsdgxX.8109

@Lighter.5631 said:
i would suggest make thief/rev/mes in to bruisers make classes like warrior/engi in to roamer, the game would be lot of enjoyable

Yes! That is exactly what we need! More class homogenization!
/s