PoF areas: Impossible to rest for one second...

Dears

I must admit that this morning (my time), I am somewhat bored and annoyed at PoF, and this is first time since we have it.

However, my reasons are probably different than most of you. I am someone who loves to explore, try to climb up where possible, test different ways to go, and farm while doing all that. I also enjoy a lot to observe around and take pictures of what I find nice, to share with guildies.

In PoF, to do that is a hardly possible due to the overcrowding of foes with extra long aggro range, fast respawning and - it seems - no limit as for how far they can follow us, so that running away is very rarely a viable option. At the top of it:

• The status "in combat" prevents the use of mounts.
• The status "in combat" prevents map travelling.
• The status "in combat" is soooo long and at times remain active for no valid reasons...

So, of course, I can fight every foes on my way, but fact is that after a while, I am simply tired of it... These last days, more and more, I abandon the idea of going to PoF due to that, or if I go, then this is only for a very specific objective, and once done with it, I let myself die so I can map out (this goes a lot faster than any other alternatives! :) ).

For me, HoT is different because thanks to the canopy, and the possibility to climb nearly everywhere on rocks and cliffs, offering places to take a breath, and therefore enough ways to explore without it being a continuous boring fighting. In PoF too we can climb almost everywhere, but there is not one ledge without a foe... That's really crazy.

Are there others who lose their motivation at PoF areas for same reasons than me?

I lost the interest in PoF almost immediately.

I feel it's the combination of mob density, aggro range, and respawn rate that makes it a chore rather than fun.If I drop off from my mount (or get knocked off) I need to kill something, which is fine. However this mob calls in a lot more so now I'm fighting a group. This could be fine too, if it weren't for the fact that once I'm done with the group they usually start respawning so I need to do it all again. And agan. And again. Eventually I'll have killed them fast enough that I get a brief respit in which I can get back on my mount and get out of there. Until the next time...

Is it too hard? No, I can kill most mobs just fine. It's just that it becomes a chore, and to me chores really aren't fun. So I stay mostly away from PoF.For me it would probably take an adjustment of either one of the 3 factors to make it more enjoyable; either lower mob density, or aggro range, or respawn rate.

But that's just me.

Yeah...The 1st week or so was great in PoF as I was more of checking the area out, trying to get masteries, trying to 100% the maps, and so on and so forth.Noticed the problem with the enemies, but I was on a quick pace so I was fine with it...Then came when I really want to check out the whole area and see little tidbits that might be easy to miss and... now I'm hating it.

Even had a time where there was nothing around and I was aiming to do the race event to start working on one of the ascended weapons, and with 10 seconds before it started, 2 flaming scarabs came out of no where and now I'm forced to fight them. After that I had to wait until I was out of combat like 30 seconds after the fight... and THEN I could've tried to do the race. Luckily I didn't run out of time... I almost did.I've had a time where somehow an enemy saw me and I did find one spot to hide, but because it had aggro and wouldn't go away even though it couldn't see me no more... I couldn't leave. I was in like a little ditch and it couldn't see or reach me. I couldn't mount, I couldn't fast travel, I couldn't anything. The most I could've done was log out fo the character select screen and come back... thankfully one of my friends was on the map and maybe 500 feet away so they just killed the stupid thing so I could've gotten out.

I am starting to guess that i was the only one who liked that part of pof

When PoF was very new there were a lot of gushing comments about how much better than HoT it was because of how much more open the maps were and how much less of a hassle it was to get around. It amused me at the time.

The first couple of maps are indeed comparatively laid-back but as you push further south the comfort level drops off a cliff. Not only are the maps every bit as convoluted and awkward to navigate as HoT but Mounts are considerably less user-friendly than gliders, jumping mushrooms and poison masteries even though they serve the identical functions. As for the mobs, Mordrem may be marginally slower to die but Awakened and Forged have more CC abilities and do just as much damage. There are also a metric tonne of them everywhere. If you thought mob density was excessive in HoT just wait til you get to Desolation and Vabbi.

I'm not particularly saying this is a good or a bad thing. Personally, as an explorer, I found HoT comfortable from Day One so I wasn't especially hoping for something easier. Just as well, because that is certainly not what we got. The difficulty gradient in PoF is perhaps better handled, with the opening map being very soft and the final map very hard by comparison. What it doesn't do anywhere near as well is progression.

With HoT, as you gained Masteries the maps became easier and easier to travel until eventually the whole expansion became a comfort zone. The problem with PoF is really what the OP describes: rather than getting easier as you learn the ropes it becomes tedious and annoying the more time you spend there. The mounts don't do much to help matters - they're clumsy to use, their skills have negligible impact and the mob density and aggro means you can't deploy them when you need them, unlike gliders which are unaffected by combat.

I spent most of the year following the launch of HoT in the jungle. Just a month after PoF appeared I'm already pretty much done with the desert. It's not that it's too tough, just too annoying. And in any case there's no real incentive or reason to be there.

Yeah it's nearly impossible to just wander around the map or even take a second to look at a scenery, 'cause some sharpshooter you can't even see starts shooting you, so you try to move out of range and suddenly there's 10 Forged all attacking you. So you run to get away from them, but it's not safe to check your map, so you just keep running. Then when you think you're safe and away from them you bring up the map to fast travel, but-- oh wait, you're in combat? Bring down the map to see 3 veterans chewing you up.

I only go back in the PoF maps if I have to at this point. Can't stop anywhere except settlements, and even then sometimes they still get you while you're idle at a waypoint next to a bounty board.

Yep, that's the main reason why I stopped logged in. Got too fed up of trying to explore Desolation: repeatedly getting my mount shot by something I couldn't even spot in time, then CC'd to death by a bunch of veterans. ...and then back to the waypoint halfway across the map for yet another try. Porting to a waypoint and getting killed by something before the models even loaded was the last straw. Tedious and not even remotely fun. HoT, at least, had a decent amount of waypoints.

Certainly doesn't help that there are so few routes of travel because of all the impassable cliffs and invisible walls. I miss the open world exploration.

Invisible walls are something meant, imho, to prevent a massive springler exploit during exploration, but i do understand that since they gave it to us could be not that good to find so many of em.

You just kill whatever is in combat with you, and quickly leave combat. It's not like there's champions all over the place, and othing really takes long to kill in PoF. Hydras and giants take a little longer, but they still go down pretty fast even with soldier gear.

I think those getting hit by enemies that they can't see need a better computer :)

Not necessarily the same reasons but close ones. Let's just say it's not only the "rest" factor.

Example 1 : one of the vistas in the branded area north of the ogre camp in crystal oasis. You can reach it using springer or raptor. Issue is : there're devourers across a gap, so if they engage combat before you jump the gap with your raptor, you eventually dismount to see the vista and... You're in combat ! The devourer does nothing : it doesn't move, nor does it attack you. But you remain in combat, so you can't do anything but logging off and on. Lots of places have that issue. Dismounted, in combat, no foe around, stuck on a cliffside.

Example 2 : Yesterday, I was doing an air djinn bounty in the desolation. It took, 5-7 minutes. During this time, a nearby fire hydra spawned, was killed, spawned again, was killed again, spawned again, was killed again, and spawn again. It spawned four times in a less than 7 minutes interval ! Just next to a champion bounty ! What kind of obnoxious design is that ?!

As for the exploration. Immediatly after PoF was announed, I decided to clear all HoT maps with my main characters. I was really afraid of tangled depths, because of all the bad experiences I had in it (no issue at all with all the other maps). Yet, after 2-3 runs, I managed to find a route that allowed me to clear the map smoothly, and I even took some time to do events, meta etc. Roughly, it was a 2-3 hours business. I eventually came to enjoy that map too because of the diversity of landscapes, eventhough I still think they went too far in the "intricate and vertical" design. Whatever.

Now, I'm clearing all maps too. The 7th time I cleared crystal oasis, it took me 45 minutes. The map is supposed to be huge, but it took me 45 minutes. I know I didn't do much events because of how non-rewarding they are, and how mobs provide boring stunfest fights. I'm currently in the desolation, and there's no obvious route : the map is intricate, there're paths everywhere, and PoI in the most awkward and random places. It'll take ages to clear, eventhough the map isn't that intricate. This is a real turndown to me. Because I may not go back to these maps with all my characters.

Actually, there's no real incentive to go back there when one is done with collections and achievements. So I'm guessing maps will soon be plain empty, and I'm expecting bounties to be nerfed at every patch like bandits bounties are currently. Disposable design. What a shame.

Peoples are asking me how is POF. Its beautiful ?? Its better than Core or HOT ?? I tell them I don't know. I am constantly chased by mobs whatever I go. Hell, even in cities or even on wp is possible to get killed. Its impossible to stop for 5 second to enjoy the surroundings or to check the map. Mobs are attacking you by miles away, they will chase you half of the map, respawn times are insane, so you will not be able to kill all mobs in the area, in order to rest a little....they will come back faster than you can kill them. Its insane. Its like Anet want to prove you that can be worst then HOT, aggressive mobs wise. Also they are situations like this : you need a chest behind a large mobs party, you can go in and out from there only with mounts, you manage to get to the chest without killing the mobs, but you cant go from that location because you cant access your mount while tagged by mobs. Killing that mobs party its impossible because of spawning rate, getting out there is impossible because you need the mount....a lot of this annoying situations that are not think thru by Anet.

@MithranArkanere.8957 said:You just kill whatever is in combat with you, and quickly leave combat. It's not like there's champions all over the place, and othing really takes long to kill in PoF. Hydras and giants take a little longer, but they still go down pretty fast even with soldier gear.Good for you? Meanwhile, I'm usually dead before I can even see where the attacks are coming from.

Been roaming around these maps for weeks now and still haven't experienced being in combat for 24/7 and chased down the whole map by mobs. Are you guys using your mounts to your advantage, like jumping over mountains to reach other spots?

@Offair.2563 said:Been roaming around these maps for weeks now and still haven't experienced being in combat for 24/7 and chased down the whole map by mobs. Are you guys using your mounts to your advantage, like jumping over mountains to reach other spots?

Not only that. I mean, some complain they can't go afk for some period of time in PoF maps....But how is it possible to justify the time playing a game if you need to to go afk frequently in the fist place?

Who would have guessed that Elona is dangerous and not a vacation spot?

I must be playing in a different Crystal Desert. Sure, packs are also a thing, or chain aggro leading to an impromptu pack. However, I seem to have no difficulty finding a place to chill for a moment. I also seem to be able to Raptor spring, Springer hop, Skimmer glide or Jackal port through mobs. While they do follow, they don't follow forever. The only time this backfires is if I go into a closed-off area and have no recourse but to fight or try to run back through. Granted, it isn't like core, where a lot of mobs don't even seem to notice if one Raptor spring past them.

As to stuck in combat, well, that happens. For me, it's often because an AoE or cleave did some damage to an object, or a mob aggroed and remains within range but can't reach me for some reason. I either kill the object, kill something else, or relog as a last resort. As to the vista near the Tetrahedron in CO, I use springer and jump up from the ground on the side opposite the nearby plateau. The devourers on the other plateau ignore me if I do that and the mobs on the ground lose aggro when they lose LoS,

I like the spacing of enemies in POF. It seems like a good balance.

I know this was more about getting onto mounts/changing weapons, etc, but as a tip - if you need a few moments of breathing room to go afk or whatever without losing your position on the map, I find the best thing to do is usually to travel to the guild hall, do what you need to do, and then leave the hall. It puts you back in the same spot.

Honestly, I've had some less than enjoyable situations, but not that many. I can only remember getting truly frustrated a few times. I've been able to find spots to sit in a few maps, but there aren't many. I'm slow-playing the content and have 3 maps complete with the Desolation and Vabbi at <20%. I still don't have my Jackel (insert laughter here).

I main a Guardian spec'd to Power DH and have Aegis in place. That Aegis can afford me an extra hit while mounted, and most mobs can't wear down the mount fast enough, relative to how quickly I get out of the danger zone. I feel like I can get away from most situations.

One thing I have noticed in my admittedly limited play time is that I've been abandoned a several times. I'm tearing along on my mount and see 1-2 people either in trouble or engaging something significant. I hop in and join the fray. They get on their feet and flee... I'm guessing that they have what they want or never intended to get stuck there, but it sucks to get left behind like that. I think I've died more often to that scenario than just being chased by mobs. It actually had me considering a no-help approach, but I banished that from my mind. Helping is a big part of what I like to do, and a few bad experiences shouldn't change that. I've been helped by others too, and it's great.

I'm soon going to start my 4th map completion and have yet to found any problems in finding a safe spot to afk when I needed it. Not to mention how easy it is to escape on mounts.

PoF has very beautiful sceneries but you can never enjoy them because every square inch is squatted by something that absolutely, definitely, positively wants to kill you.

I felt the same in Silverwastes, Dry Top, HoT, and now PoF. Then I got used to my builds, the enemy builds and leash ranges, and found some safe spots. Admittedly there are some spots that really 'should' be safe that aren't (e.g. next to the bounty boards and villages not under direct attack) and all sorts of seemingly empty desert that's hiding land sharks. Not to mention a lot of vistas are in high-risk locations. However, I have yet to find a single area of any zone which lacks safe spots.

A couple of things that helps:

• If you're already on bunny-roo, you don't have to stop moving to channel the jump: use the [mount 1] key (default v); saves a lot of time.
• After mastering the sand puppy, [mount 1] works as an evade on all mounts. That makes the manta ray very useful, even outside the obvious wet|sulfurous|branded regions, as you can evade for quite a long time.
• The ground levels are less safe than hills and outcrops. Climb a rock, hover on a lake, jump up a cliff ledge.

My goal isn't to convince anyone that PoF is 'safe' or even 'safer' than the other zones (I agree: it's more dangerous). I hope only to show that if you're willing to invest the time and suspend your current viewpoint, you'll also be able to find safe areas enough to enjoy the expansion for which you've paid.

@flog.3485 said:

@Offair.2563 said:Been roaming around these maps for weeks now and still haven't experienced being in combat for 24/7 and chased down the whole map by mobs. Are you guys using your mounts to your advantage, like jumping over mountains to reach other spots?

Because some people are adults with adult lives that sometimes take precedence over a game for minutes at a time. Or they aren't going afk but trying to get a screenshot of something cool. Or an important phone call came in and they have to take it. Not everyone gets to stay glued to their computer at every moment while in game.

@PookieDaWombat.6209 said:

@flog.3485 said:

@Offair.2563 said:Been roaming around these maps for weeks now and still haven't experienced being in combat for 24/7 and chased down the whole map by mobs. Are you guys using your mounts to your advantage, like jumping over mountains to reach other spots?

If you need to go afk, can't you press 'g' to get to the guild hall? Or just [f12] to return to the character select screen?

@maddoctor.2738 said:I think those getting hit by enemies that they can't see need a better computer :)

I'll own up to this one. I play on a potato, and thought everything had stealth for a bit until I realised the potato was overcooking again.