I really hate fighting against mirage - help

I'm a ranger and the constant stealthing and target breaks every 3 seconds is so frustrating to play against. My pet is useless for 90% of the fight because I have to keep retargetting it every few seconds, which means all of its skills get interrupted and its really just not fun to play against.

Against competent mirages, especially condition ones, there's literally no window for me to apply any pressure at all. Because when they aren't evading or distorting, they are stealthing or breaking target, and when they aren't invulnerable, they are shattering clones and dazing you which forces you to dodge or you'll get hit with 9 stacks of confusion, blind, burning, and a bunch of other condis per shatter.

I don't know what to do vs this, someone help me. I can't find any solution or strategy that can consistently do well vs something you can't even target for half a fight. Not to mention the new axe buffs means they can reapply confusion so often its impossible to cleanse if you can't evade 7 times in a row.

inb4 "l2p"

Hello, are you using Druid? If so I have some tipsIf you use Dolyak rune and constant regen application - you'll get back into ur Celestial Avatar more quickly and cleanse conditions very quickly.As a mesmer main - I usually cannot kill or die to any druid - they're very tanky and sustain-y - You need to invest some more into regen.. Rune of Dolyak is VERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRY STRONG to charge ur Celestial Avatar, also what traitlines are you using - nature magic?, you have sufficient cleanse on your utiltiies? Are you shout build or survival build?also what weapons are you using?

It should be a draw match up - because both are too tanky - even tanky druid does a lot of damage. (the pet does good damage regardless of your stats.)

Goodluck

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Mirage can wreck a lot of builds very quickly at the moment.

However, I don't think druid is one of them.

I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't kill one if they are being played at a very high level.

I'm a plat 3/legend tier player, I hit rank 9 on the NA leaderboards this past season on Soulbeast/Druid/Core. So the problem isn't the fact that I need to learn to play. With years of experience in PvP, I can't find a window to pressure a very well played Mirage and I don't know what to do about it.

I would have won the past 1v1 tournament if it had not been for my 1v1 against Kronos' Sage Mirage. Even as a druid, speccing for full condition clears, I was unable to apply significant pressure without being interrupted or condi bombed. It got to the point where I literally couldn't do anything except for try to predict a stealth shatter or wait to get hit before I cleared it. I don't get how this is fun to play against.

Not to mention the pet AI gets really messed up with the constant stealths and target breaks. I can't even keep track of my pet anymore because all of the pet skills get interrupted/cancelled which throws any rotations I have off (because there's no bar that displays pet skill cooldowns) as well as the fact that pets "retreat" and do nothing every few seconds vs a Mirage, which means they run from their target back to the player, then targetting again means they have to run back to the target. My pet is literally useless during a fight with one.

It’s not fun 1v1 against them but if you can stalemate, you’d at least cap the point.

In the hands of a top tier player Mirage is so strong right now. It kites like crazy, outputs tons of conditions, and you can't CC it. Don't know why Anet thought it was good design to give a slippery class like Mesmer stunbreak on dodge...

I don't think we're likely to see alot of complaints though, because 99% of Mirages can't utilize the class to it's potential unlike pre nerf faceroll spellbreaker.

@shadowpass.4236 said:I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't kill one if they are being played at a very high level.

So then what's the issue? You think you should be able to beat someone that drastically outskills you? Sorry, that's not how it works.

Mesmer is just a terrible class to play against, especially condi and especially Mirage.You can't pressure someone with perma blinks, stealth and evades.

I honestly dont mind any class even the ones considered OP, but when i see Mirages i just go "ehhh"

years of experience in PvP

• okay, I see..

In your 1v1 tournament against mirage...Yeah - I don't think it's possible - the only thing i can think of is a fully offensive power build, it depends on which spec the mirage is using tbh, if they're using inspi or something else defensive - they can chain their defence and counterpressure and you probably won't be able to kill.

Maybe like a fully offensive build with Gs/LB and and stealthing with the smokescale f2 + gs leap? XD - Sic 'em? XDDDidk, but you won't be able to kill unless you're some cheese full power build. - it's possible btw.

Anyway, I don't think it's possible against a very well played mirage unless full power build and lots of waiting/kiting/pressuring/outsustaining until their cds are in a weird position/order - and even then probably no.

let's ask anet to make mesmers more offensive and less defensive I think. (but if i make that post it will get downvote to hell and i'll get suspended again because anet doesn't like being told what to do.)

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Stealth, invulnerable, Shadowsteps, Clones, Mobilty, Condtions, Breaking Target, Dazes, Instant cast skills.

Mesmer has always been the epitome of anti-fun to fight against. Mirage just happens to top that and then some. Terrible design.They are also overtuned, which makes things worse.

Doing ridiculous jumping puzzle to mess up shattering clones' AI was only reasonable way to deal with them for me, which is very situational. Though it may not suitable for competitive team pvp, core trapper seems to work best against them because it has tons of dodge baits, instant blind and taunt, soft/hard CCs, frequent (small) cleanses than non-WS druids, and strong condi DPS & burst.

Better to not cry about it but better to find a counter against it.

@Espada.2158 said:Better to not cry about it but better to find a counter against it.

Isn't that exactly what he's trying to do?

@Espada.2158 said:Better to not cry about it but better to find a counter against it.

@Lain.5179 said:

@Espada.2158 said:Better to not cry about it but better to find a counter against it.

Yes, that is exactly what I'm trying to do.

"git better" at "gitting gud"

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't

kill

one if they are being played at a very high level.

Modesty aside, from a dueling perspective (which is what I'm assuming you're talking about) I don't think anyone "drastically outskills me."

The only person in the game I've ever met that I can't beat consistently is Kronos. I wouldn't say he drastically outskills me either, he's really strong mechanically but he uses really strong builds like Sage Mirage with axe/sword scepter/torch with inspiration and mantra heal. That build outputs so many condis and has so much survivability with a ton of healing/condi clear/stealth/target breaks/distortion/blind/etc. that its essentially impossible for me to do any damage to him at all. More damage oriented builds can't survive long enough through sustained stacks of 9 confusion that can be reapplied every few seconds. Builds that aren't completely glass can't do any meaningful damage to it.

For the record, Mirage dodge guarantees your heal skill. So, a sage mirage channeling mantra could just enter mirage cloak every time and you can't do anything about it. It essentially guarantees them a 9k heal with a ton of condition clear on a 10 second cooldown.

I can't for the life of me, figure out a good way to counter something that can go invulnerable so much while outputting condis second only to a scourge.

Edit: Kronos uses a build similar to this -http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQRAnc8fn0nBlphVoBmqBMMjlZDzf+l/Cgn3gcwvpMAUbyNA-jJRHABCcSA6Z/B6LDAwTAAAOther variations run Inspiration/Illusions or Dueling/Illusions

He's even said he wouldn't like to fight himself on Mirage, and he's the one playing it. Even he knows how insane the build is.

you 1v1 mirage ,you can't kill him but he also can't kill you .and comments :mirage is op

some leap of logic here >@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't

kill

one if they are being played at a very high level.

For the record, Mirage dodge guarantees your heal skill. So, a sage mirage channeling mantra could just enter mirage cloak every time and you can't do anything about itlast time i check even you burn through two dodge that's totally 2s evademantra cast time is >2s and mantra heal is not always 9k. 3 condi clear every 10 is surely ton of condition removal .you linked the build but still saying nonsense about those basic things , how could anyone takes your seriously ?axe ambush can be reflected , the build main dmg source is from shatter >blind > confusion but that aoe is around mes and the radius is small .

tbh you used druid build with good sustain but less burst dmg vs same kind of build , as long as you can stalemate them , what's the problem here? it's not like they hard counter your build or too op and kill you everytime .pvp forum used to be : xxx class /build can kill me without effort , they must be opnow : mirage can't kill me , but i can't kill them , so they must be op .

@Shooka.9712 said:You can't pressure someone with perma blinks, stealth and evades.

That's not how you use the word "permanent". lol

@musu.9205 said:you 1v1 mirage ,you can't kill him but he also can't kill you .and comments :mirage is op

some leap of logic here >@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't

kill

one if they are being played at a very high level.

They can kill me though. I can't kill them.

Sage mirage can burst 20 stacks of confusion and sustain 10 of them if you don't play well. Not to mention that half of their skills have no tell because they cast them from stealth/target break.

What does menders druid have? No damage.What does marauders ranger have? No sustain.What does sage mirage have? High damage, high sustain.

Also your example is kind of silly. I don't see the point of exaggerating here. Of course, they aren't going to waste their entire dodge bar to channel their heal. The good ones use it when they need to guarantee the cast. Seriously, try fighting Kronos' Sage Mirage on any build, on any class, and see if you think its a fun/fair/balanced fight.

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@musu.9205 said:you 1v1 mirage ,you can't kill him but he also can't kill you .and comments :mirage is op

some leap of logic here >@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@shadowpass.4236 said:I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't

kill

one if they are being played at a very high level.

"I can stalemate a Mirage, that's not my problem. I can't kill one if they are being played at a very high level."that was what you said . idk if they can kill your or not , or just one particular person with one particular build .so you got beaten by one person and you think mirage is the problem ?

you said "For the record, Mirage dodge guarantees your heal skill. So, a sage mirage channeling mantra could just enter mirage cloak every time and you can't do anything about it"i said you were plain wrong .i gave you fact mirage can not guarantee the mantra heal charge .if you can't interrupt their mantra channel , it is your fault .and you were wrong about 9k heal also wrong about ton of condi clear . whats more ?

"mention that half of their skills have no tell because they cast them from stealth/target break"mirage has two stealth , one is 20s cd , one is 30s . the build u linked have single one target break skill , that's axe 3 , maybe you should try to use that skill yourself before you say it has no tell .so they are doing burst without tell from stealth like every 20s . and you can't have enough condition removal for that ?for the record , staff ambush adds more cover condi for mirage but it hardly counts as burst since the every long casting time . and thet leaves mirage with bleed / torment / confusion as main condition .actually sage mirage has less sustain than menders druid , less stealth than druid (its funny you cry about mirage stealth attack no tell lol ),, higher burst sure.but it does not have higher burst than marauders ranger . anyway guess no broken ranger pet = no dmg for ranger i guess .

i don't get the issue. you can't kill the mirage and the mirage can't kill you. but unlike the mirage, you should be able to hold the point.

As OP may know well already, it's very difficult for rangers to take both sufficient (frequent. from WS) condi cleanses and significant damage (including pet damage combined with MM and BM) unless you ditch the elite trait line. I believe this limitation can be fundamental weakness especially against mirage match up. If you somehow succeeded to bait mirage's dodge you could have a chance to delete him, otherwise, you would get melted from his frequent condi applications (suppose you take marauder and don't avoid the 1v1. mender? insufficient damage).+Since rangers lack the ports and insta wombocombo skills but only have big hit skills with long animations, they can be countered hard by random blindness flying around, which makes it even harder.TL;DR Hard matchup for rangers by design.

@Kuya.6495 said:i don't get the issue. you can't kill the mirage and the mirage can't kill you. but unlike the mirage, you should be able to hold the point.

The mirage can kill me. And in a 1v1, the point would neutralize due to druid stealth after about 30-45 seconds of fighting on point.