Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged] - Page 22 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]

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  • People run for these skins like there's no tomorrow.

    Look at this graph - it shows the changing-rate gold->gems

    Shortage of gems today - sad but true

  • Tyger.1637Tyger.1637 Member ✭✭✭

    @Wolfheart.7483 said:
    This outrage would be a tad more justified if this adoption contract was going to be the absolute final and only way to acquire new mount skins which I seriously doubt it will be. So far they released a bundle of Halloween mounts where you knew what you were getting but had to buy the bundle, this adoption contract where you're guaranteed a new mount skin but have no control over which one you get and the premium-priced Reforged Warhound which is an entirely new (and gorgeous, in my opinion) skin that costs the same as the non-sale price for the Halloween skin bundle of 5 skins.

    As it is; it's either a 400 gem raffle ticket OR 2000 for a specific skin and they're mutually exclusive (or maybe further seasonal packs at a "discount" of 1600). It's not like we can roll for Warhound with the adoption licences or buy the specific Raptor/Springer/Skimmer/Jackal/Griffon from the pack. Warhound is 2000, everything else is 9600 if you buy-it-all or a 400 for one chance.

    Mounts are new to the game and I think it should be obvious they are attempting different methods of selling the skins to see which succeed in bringing in the most profit and which bring in less. I think patience is key here. The feedback is good to give to Anet if you are unhappy with this method. Make it constructive and non-accusatory feedback.

    The RNG aspect to the tickets doesn't lend itself to finding out which skin works; only that Anet is maximising profit by co-ercing people into buying more for the skin they actually want. You may get it on the 1st roll or the 30th. Completionists won't care as it's inevitable, skinnies will enjoy whatever they get but those who only want one or two or a set of specific mount skins and the rest are going to feel ripped-off or just won't bother because they don't want to waste gems on skins they will begrudgingly use 'because they got them'.

    You get a new mount skin for every contract. This is not a loot box like many other games tend to offer like so many posters are implying. No loot box I have ever encountered guaranteed you got a new unique unlock every single time. If you would be happy with the most basic mount skin being the one you get, then go for it. If not, then don't buy the contracts, wait for new skins to be released that you can purchase directly. Support the purchase method you agree with.

    It's a RAFFLE which is still gambling but you have all the tickets and will get everything EVENTUALLY. Getting what you want is still subject to RNG. Again, you may get what you want in the first OR they may be the last few in the pack to unlock.

    It's also very rare they change the method of obtaining via the gemstore. Minis have ironically shifted to a direct purchase method which is what I'd hope happens here.

    I actually think this outrage is partially fueled by the fact that these are the first general (i.e. not seasonal themed) mount skins to be added to the game. If we had 6 months of periodic direct-purchase mount skins added to the game and then these contracts came out, I would bet there wouldn't be nearly as much outrage. Sure, there would be some, it is the internet and an MMO, after all, there will always be outrage at everything from some part of the community. But I think the outrage and backlash is being fueled, in part, by the fact that players love their new mounts and want to customize them. The first option we get after Halloween themed skins consists of one premium skin and 30 RNG based (but guaranteed to give a new skin, regardless). People who can't or won't purchase the contracts are frustrated and I understand that but lashing out at Anet with insults and accusations is simply childish and not constructive.

    I think it's that there is very little variation between most of the skins compared to the base mount skins. The other would be the slightly incongruous use of the word 'guaranteed' with an RNG-based method of obtaining them. See above: 1st or 30th you may get what you want. That's 12,000 gems potentially because not everyone has 9600 to dump on a 30-pack saving.

    I do agree that there should be alternate methods of direct purchase for these skins or additional non-premium priced skins available for direct purchase. I think the contracts are fine but I think the timing of them was poor. Various standard, direct-purchase options should have been filtered in to the gem store first with the contract bundle coming a little later.

    It's barely 7 weeks ago that Pathfire was released, we had the Halloween Mounts pack only 3 weeks ago. I was hoping that the tiger would be released (some might be wanting the spider) but now I'm not so hopeful; that it will end up in this license pack as the rosta expands like it did with the Guaranteed Wardrobe Unlock.

    As it stands; this doesn't make me want to buy any of them ever. I didn't buy the Halloween bundle because I thought it was too seasonal and too soon after Pathfire for a new set of skins and this method just doesn't inspire me either.

  • @PookieDaWombat.6209 said:
    Anet's business model and their choices in the game come down to the whales. Always has, always will. As long as a few fools with deep pockets are willing to throw money at BS like this, then Anet will gladly do things which lead to player bleed off, lower quarterly numbers and more vet player loss. Then they push hard to a new xpac and hope to create enough buzz to get new players in so they can find new whales to cater to. They have a chance here to change their strategy and listen to a large number of players that have already stated they will not give them money for this and time will tell if they listen or not. If not though, this might be the thing that will sink their chances of seeing another xpac.

    Wait, because I have a job and some disposable income every month that I can blow on stuff like this, that makes me a fool? Now, I haven't bought any of these skins(On a tight budget this month unfortunately) but I will probably blow some money down the line to get some. That money is specifically budgeted to be disposable. And it's not like I have a high paying job, and no, I'm not living at home with my parents either. I don't have deep pockets, but I'm still probably going to throw money away at BS like this still. Is it annoying? Yeah, certainly, but it's disposable money, so it's whatever. So much hate for us with jobs here. Whales indeed. I'm not saying you don't have a right to be pissed about the RNG situation. You do. I'm just saying, you can be angry at the situation without insulting people like me, who have some disposable income every month that are willing to throw away to essentially gambling.

    As to the principles of buying something that I inherently disagree with? Principles are good to have, but it's important to pick your battles, and while I admire many of you picking this one, it's not one I'm really all that willing to fight for, sorry. In saying all that, I hope you manage to have some success, so when I do get the disposable income to get these, I'll have maybe a little less RNG in my way of getting the ones I want.

  • @Skobel.6920 said:
    In Q2 2017 GW2 hit all time low earnings. Anet probably got letter from NC to do something about it. Business is business.
    These are the times we live in: Ub.. popular France-based developer announced they earn more from DLC and microtransactions than from digital distribution of games.
    And this is bacause of you people who buy this crates, keys and all this RNG stuff.
    It's not that Anet sets RNG trap for you. It is you who encourages them to use such marketing method. If this weren't effective, they would never have used it. This is how free market works.

    And I know this game is PG13, but are you naive kids?
    You should all know what can happen if you buy and use it.

    If you buy lottery ticket and didn't win a car do you argue with guy who sold you this ticket? I don't thivk so. So why so much anger towards Anet right now?

    Grow up.

    I would argue that you're taking the wrong tact towards this argument. I don't call this mount system gambling as with actual gambling you have a chance to receive nothing. The BL chests are definitely closer to "gambling" than these mount adoptions but the fact remains that the random aspect to them denies consumer choice from those who would happily purchase otherwise. For me personally, I have stuck with GW2 since I first discovered it because I have genuine admiration for the devs. I have great respect for how much choice they provide in so many aspects to the game.

    If you don't like rng for black lion chests, you can still grind out keys to try your hand. Most of the items in those boxes are available elsewhere either through time limited sales or via black lion weapon tickets. As much as it would annoy me, this system wouldn't seem nearly as predatory if there were a means to earn these things in-game (I'm aware of gold to gem exchange but that is not what I mean). As I've seen others post another solution would be to give players a choice on the type of mount skin they get if it isn't feasible to just let them pick the exact skin they want.

    Anet are unlike most other devs I'm familiar with in that they interact with us on a much deeper level than many other game devs. I would suggest that part of the anger is that this feels like a betrayal from a dear friend and does not bode well towards future additions to the shop. For me personally i'm upset with their decision not the devs themselves as are many others. I will happily support the devs and the continued development of this game via cash shop. I cannot, in good conscience, support this new sales model.

  • Eyedye.7582Eyedye.7582 Member
    edited November 8, 2017

    Confession - I haven't read all 26 pages. Rather, I am going to use this opportunity to insert my "2cents" without linking into someone else's post. Using this as an opportunity for a normally silent player (myself) to speak up!

    Games have moved from playing to unlock items, to paying to unlock items. Now as we move forwards in the gaming industry, you see more and more persons / groups speaking up against games that introduce the lootbox / pay2win (e.g. Battlefront 2). There is a reason why GW2 is still up there over newer MMO's such as Archeage, Black Desert etc. They've fallen to "loot boxes" or "pay to win."

    Granted GW2 is an older MMO, and the company needs to fund the cause somehow. I get that, I do.

    However the introduction of a loot box is with a risk, because now we're falling into the same pit as less than popular MMO's, into what is becoming a negative trend in the gaming industry.

    In this situation, its also poor timing. There are concerns about the expansion itself. So the introduction of this mount skin roulette has it appear the current glaring issues are being overlooked, or pushed aside, in favour of hitting the cash pinata. Where as open communication about these issues would offer a fix, confidence in the company from the playerbase.

    If I were to use a popular MMO as an example - lets take EQ2. Game based off of a very successful brand. I recall when they introduced an ingame cash store out of the blue, the population nosedived. Look at where the game is now, a game that once could have rivaled popular MMO's is now rarely mentioned.

  • The skins are great, the price is great, the RNG is awful. I think there's several ways to easily fix it-- make the skins tradeable on the trading post instead of auto-unlocked (like dyes!), make the skins selectable from the box instead of random (like armor/weapon skins!), or at least make the breed selectable (I don't even have a griffon, I don't want griffon skins I can't use). I'd prefer the first one-- I'm happy to sell out hundreds of gold or whatever it would settle on for a single mount skin, just like I am for weapon skins, but the accountlocked lootbox RNG is a HUGE dealbreaker for me and, frankly, makes me lose some respect for ANet as a whole.

    That may sound overly harsh, but one of the things I admired about the company was the ethical way they run the gemstore, and this undermines that in a big way that makes me EXTREMELY concerned about the future. I've ridden the pay to play gambling downspiral on several MMOs already and it hurts my heart to think GW2 is heading down that path as well, because I love this game.

  • LanfearShadowflame.3189LanfearShadowflame.3189 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    Skipping most of the comments.... Here are my thoughts on the new BLS: I don't hate it. Conversely, I think it could be better.

    First, I'm fine with some skins being available via rng only. However, we need an equal number of non-rng based skins that are just as nice looking. Preferably via both direct purchase as well as through in game as rewards.

    Second, getting a guaranteed skin from the BLS is lovely. However, with a pool of 30 skins, many of which some don't want, I feel Anet would be further ahead to let a user at least limit the pool by having the option to select which mount the user would like a skin for. Users may feel more inclined to participate if its a 1 in 6 chance at the skin they really, really want, as opposed to a 1 in 30 chance. Yes that 1 in 'x' dwindles with each purchase, but not everyone wants every skin nor are the interested in sinking $100 into the store in the attempt to get the 1 or 2 they want if RNG does not favor them.

    Don't believe anything you've heard. None of it is remotely close to my actual insanity.

  • ezd.6359ezd.6359 Member ✭✭✭

    My main pretension is since GW2 is fashion wars and when you put epic shiny skins in your shop there is no point in game ahievements any more. Introduce gear treadmill then at least we will have something to play for.

  • @MrGhosty.4296 said:

    I don't call this mount system gambling as with actual gambling you have a chance to receive nothing.

    I have to disagree. Give me a table with 30 bags containing stickers, keychains or plushies, have me pay 4 coins to open one (or have me pay 34 coins to open 10, or 96 to open all), it's a classic gambling thing. The 'you always win something' stands in fairs are also gambling. Less so for the people that would be happy with anything, or that can/are willing to pay enough to collect all, but that doesn't make it less of a gamble. A lot of people do it for the plushies. I might like some, though I tend to favor keychains more overall. Hardly anyone wants to pay 34 coins just to get mostly stickers they didn't want.

  • @Myrdreth.6829 said:
    What happens if you already got a certain skin and get it again?

    It says in the tooltip that you will not get one you already have.
    Sorry if that has already been answered. I don't usually voice my opinions on the forums.. But I feel so much emotion about this I thought I would do my part.

  • @Hyper Cutter.9376 said:

    @Loosifah.4738 said:
    What do you have against mount skins?

    The fact that they couldn't even be bothered to add any that were obtainable in-game, for starters. Like, just add a set of mount skins, like the ones that are just a recolor of the basic ones, to the actual game, for Christ's sake.

    This would be alright. And I say that having gotten those "Recolored ones". Total F*ing let down. I wanted to cry. I would feel less regret if I went and bought $30 worth of cheeseburgers and ate them all in one go.

  • I, like everyone else, don't really like much this whole RNG lootbox trend that every game has been trying to shove onto players.
    But as someone who works close to the industry I can understand why this is good for the devs and is employed by them.

    What I don't get is HOW it was implemented here. Like, everyone really wants those skins and everyone has been waiting and saving money for when they leased those skins. I mean, we all knew they were coming before the expansion even got released and we really wanted to get them, and to show our support for the dev team because let's face it, Mounts are awesome and the skins they released? While some might not be everyone's cup of tea, mos of them are so amazing!

    But they decided to make this the worst way possible. I understand how lootboxes are there to make it so you can turn 100% of your content into something that 100% of your player base will consume, but when you do it this way it just has no good faith in it. There is just too much RNG involved and it will just leave a very, very bad taste in player's mouth.

    I am one of the guys that whenever I have gems to spare I buy Black Lion Chest keys even though I know it's bad and stupid and mostly not worth it. I don' t like the loot boxes in games buy I buy them from time to time because I want to support the game and I do like what I get from it.

    You know what else good games with Lootboxes system have? A FALL BACK to get what you want. Sure you can get dupes and stuff you don't like it, but you also get "points" to spend on what you want, so eventually none of your money is wasted. On some you can destroy/decraft the ones you got and don't like so you can save for what you really want.

    Here lies the problem with this system: You can buy a few of those and you'll get something that you can use because it's better than nothing right? Well, not really. You might not like to use some mounts, you might get 3 skins for the same mount and you might just get the ugly skins you'd never ever use because you just don't like them.
    And sure, in loot box systems it's okay for players to get something they don't want/like, but on those games you can get some boxes for free AND there is such a wide array of things to get that the chance for this to happen is pretty low. Also you get multiple items from each box so even if half of it is lame, some of it is decent.

    If they really wanted to make it so you'd pay for RNG gamble the skin you'd get, well, they needed to AT LEAST make it so you'd be able to choose for which Mount you'd gamble for.

    I'm pretty sure if they just did that nobody would be really complaining right now.
    You always have at least 1/6 of chance to get the skin you want, and who knows? maybe you get one that is pretty great and be satisfied with it. Maybe you get just the one you want and then you will still buy more to gamble for other mounts.

    Right now the chance of "failing" a roll is too high and if they implement more skins to be acquired this way it will only get worse.

    The problem is that no one wants ONE specific skin, everyone has ONE skin for EACH MOUNT they want and to get that or at least close to that they will most likely get many skins they don't like or won't use EVEN for the mount they already got the skin they wanted for.

    Idk, sorry for the long rang y'all, but I just really think that if you could choose the mount type you'd be rolling for everyone would be happy to pay for it, even if it was 500 gems instead of 400.

  • This is all I have to say.

    I'm not asocial, I'm selectively social. There's a difference.

  • @MithranArkanere.8957 said:

    • There's no discounts for buying more gems. Getting 8000 is the same as getting 800 gems 10 times.
    • There's nothing like a permanent accumulative discount for items you've bought before reducing them up to a certain minimum. Like reducing the cost for inventory bags slots from by 5 for each one you buy, up a minimum like 150. So players who has many character feel less punished for it.
    • There's nothing like two gemstore currencies, one for the gems you get in-game with coin or AP rewards, and another for the ones you get with cash. That would allow reducing the cash-only prices, making them reasonable, without affect the free prices.
    • There's no permanent reduction of prices for oldest stuff. Instead items are removed to cause a sense of 'purchase urgency'. People stopped falling for that kind of nonsense in the 90s. Now it only makes them angry.

    But as thing are, there will be a few whales and trading post exploiters who can afford everything, and less and less of the rest will buy anything.
    The number of apathetic or unhappy customers will only grow. If they are paying customers, they can't afford a thing with gems they used to get with cash, so they will stop. And if they are poorer customers, they can never buy enough gems in-game to afford anything, so they will also stop trading them.

    There's a reason why Steam has been so profitable. They get people to pay a lot when they can afford it, but after a while they also let people with less purchasing power in on the fun. It's a very simple practice. Start high and with bonuses, then decrease prices over time, and have sales that can get to up to 90% for most and less popular stuff. You'll get more from the popular stuff because the last people who couln't afford it will afford it, and more from the less popular stuff because people who wouldn't pay that much for it will now pay the discounter price. But the products are available at all times.

    In here, there may be 'sales' that feel more like the actual price of the item, then the item goes back to be more expensive than it should, or it's removed altogether untild gods know why. And we can't ask them, they are gone.

    Human behavior is known. We know what works, maximizes benefits and makes customers happy. Why doing the freaking opposite? It's as if whoever is in charge of ANet's monetization and pricing was winging it, or hated the company for some reason and was actively working against them. I can't help but seriously question their decisions and loyalty to the company. Nothing else explains these decisions.

    I want to give this a Thumbs up and a Helpful and just say this is the most level headed post I've read in a loooong time. Not just relating to Gw2.

  • I'm still thinking about how much I don't like this latest development. I guess the account-bound skins in the BL chests were testing the waters and I didn't heed the warning signs, so I have no right to be this disappointed, but I am. I thought I was playing an MMO with a soul and staying power, not some flash-in-the-pan Facebook mobile garbage. This is just so... sleazy.

  • Erasculio.2914Erasculio.2914 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    We know about ArenaNet's current RNG scheme for mount skins, and we're watching the community's reaction to it.

    What do you think will happen? What do you think will be the result of the whole outcry we're seeing?

    Do notice I'm not asking what you would like to happen; rather, what do you think will happen.

    How about some anti eyes bleeding options? Here's the direct link to the concept.

  • So after I've read a few of the comments here (not all, because that's just too much) I want to answer some of the statements that were made by people who are defending Anets RNG nonsense.

    • "The Gemshop only contains cosmetic Items, it isn't pay to win."
      Yeah you are right, but that isn't the point. People are freaking out because if they want one specific mount skin, they need to buy licenses for 120$ in the worst case. Guild Wars 2 had one of the best Gemshops, because they had just a few RNG aspects. You knew what you were buying. You have the chance to get one black lion chest for free every week and the exclusive dyes can be bought and sold in the trading post. So even if you didn't get what you want you still have other ways to get it.

    • "ANet needs to make money, you are just to dumb/lazy/greedy/whatever to acknowledge their hard work"
      Yeah they need to make money, they do hard and good work. But it isn't the point. People don't want to pay more money for a guaranteed chance to get like 3 or 4 skins they want, than they paid for the game itself. And with these RNG methods ANet wont earn more money. There are ppl buying the licenses and they maybe buy 10 or even more, but there are enough ppl which would pay even more gems if they could decide which skin they get. ANet could sell RNG and non RNG licenses and make more money, now they lose potential buyers.

    • "It's ANets game and they decide what they do!"
      Again you are right, but a lot of players aren't happy with content like RNG Skins and they speak out to change something, or at least stopping ANet from doing such things again. To give Feedback is something really important for every kind of content creator and negative feedback is a chance to learn and to offer better options. We are giving feedback as it is our right, to make GW2 a better place to be.

    So what could the devs do?
    There are a few things they could do,
    1. They could lower the prices, but everyone who already bought licenses would be angry about this.
    2. They could remove the RNG aspect from the licenses and give everyone who already bought licenses the chance too choose.
    3. They could add a non RNG license to the GemShop, a lot of players stated they would even pay MORE gems to decide which skins they get.
    4. They could make the skins sellable, so you can sell unwanted skins in the TP and others can buy skins they want.

  • Gahzirra.8639Gahzirra.8639 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    I don't think this is a bad method, but I think it would be better to add something like 400 GEM=Random, 800 GEM = Selected, 9600 GEM = Complete Bundle. This way you cover all bases and I would be more inclined to spend $$.

  • Danikat.8537Danikat.8537 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    I doubt they'll change the currently available skins (although I'd be very happy to see them do it) because too many people have already bought them under this system and almost certainly paid more than they would have otherwise because of the RNG.

    But I suspect from the fact that Gaile took the time to consolidate posts (something that usually only happens when Anet wants a summary of all the feedback) and the sheer volume of complaints that they will use other systems in future.

    But I'm actually expecting that to be a mix of systems. I suspect they'll throw out a few skins sold directly to pacify people, then do pretty much what they've done with glider skins - some in the gem store as direct sale items, some bundled, some in Black Lion Chests, very rarely maybe the odd one in-game and probably some more through RNG.

    They're not going to stop selling things by RNG unless and until it stops working - when enough people refuse to buy them, at all, that it's no longer profitable vs. selling them directly. But there's enough people who don't care or are convinced the laws of probability don't apply to them that it's never going to happen. We've been dealing with things like this since the game launched and we're going to keep having to deal with it quite likely until the game gets shut down. Or this whole loot box controversy really kicks off and it becomes illegal in an important market.

    Danielle Aurorel - Desolation EU. Mini Collector.

    "I know that I'm born and I know that I'll die, the in-between is mine."

  • @WingedLass.7456 said:

    @MrGhosty.4296 said:

    I don't call this mount system gambling as with actual gambling you have a chance to receive nothing.

    I have to disagree. Give me a table with 30 bags containing stickers, keychains or plushies, have me pay 4 coins to open one (or have me pay 34 coins to open 10, or 96 to open all), it's a classic gambling thing. The 'you always win something' stands in fairs are also gambling. Less so for the people that would be happy with anything, or that can/are willing to pay enough to collect all, but that doesn't make it less of a gamble. A lot of people do it for the plushies. I might like some, though I tend to favor keychains more overall. Hardly anyone wants to pay 34 coins just to get mostly stickers they didn't want.

    Actually, you're correct. I misspoke. What I should have said is that I consider the traditional slots/table games type of gambling a form of harmful gambling. Which is what I assume many equate the term"gambling" to in their minds. I feel like using the term "gambling" obfuscates the issue and provides many with obvious counter arguments that do little to move the discussion forward.

  • Oglaf.1074Oglaf.1074 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Gahzirra.8639 said:
    I don't think this is a bad method, but I think it would be better to add something like 400 GEM=Random, 800 GEM = Selected, 9600 GEM = Complete Bundle. This way you cover all bases and I would be more inclined to spend $$.

    400 Gems is a fair price for a guaranteed unlock when you conisder that the vast majority of them are merely retextures. Only a select few have a new model or fancy sfx.

    Please Anet give us a hide Chest Armour-option. Tattoo-clad Norns everywhere beg of you.

  • Leolas.6273Leolas.6273 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    @Tachenon.5270 said:
    News of this is hitting the gaming sites, in case it hasn't been mentioned yet.

    It has been mentioned but needs mentioning again. I watched one review that can be basically summed up with its term "debacle." Personal opinion and all that, but I agree. The RNG aspect has a lot of people po'ed but if ANet changes it to "buy the one you want" they will have po'ed people that already gambled.

    Now they gambled anyway so who cares when they get po'ed?

  • hchadw.1097hchadw.1097 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    How come you give us a quest to hunt for Plain Griffon yet no quests for new special mounts/skins... Why is the Forge Skin for sale for 2000 gems (No Quests to earn forged in the big game you made with lots of stuff, then wonder why many people dont do events/quests, then instead feed the issue when you make quick lazy cash shop grabs!... With RNG nature of other mounts...Could you not have added some to living story.(your welcome if you didnt think of that yet!) Anet cant remain consistent on anything anymore these days... Why are skins more expensive than your game and or addons...why did some of these not come with the addon? Why did you wait until after everyone spent gems from bonus/pre purchases then release these! You LOOK BAD!!! the list goes on why this is on all levels of wrong and out of Anet Character... (Predatory Business practices is what it looks like) I also hear you guys hired someone from EA to handle the cash shop.. Bad move.. Fire this guy soon or rain him in before he gives you more bad ideas!!!! Beat your new addon on in 3 days.. (Minus bugs and Constant disconnects)Maybe you should work on content/bugs/Disconnects instead of cash shop items !!!!!

  • Wolfheart.7483Wolfheart.7483 Member ✭✭✭

    .> @hchadw.1097 said:

    ...Could you not add some to living story.

    The living story tied to PoF is not out yet. None of us have any idea if they will add mount skins attainable in-game for LWS4.

  • Right now I feel sick to my stomach. Mostly I am mad at myself for getting excited. I should know better by now. I've never had any luck. I've never once gambled on something and not regretted it. I definitely felt a false sense of security when the tool-tip said " you are guaranteed to get one you don't already have". I regret this decision tremendously.
    What do y'all suppose are the chances of a refund are?

  • Palador.2170Palador.2170 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @MastemaRose.6703 said:
    What do y'all suppose are the chances of a refund are?

    Zero, unless we convince them to back off and change this whole thing.

    Lip synching is just mime karaoke.

  • Ronorra.1530Ronorra.1530 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    Very disappointed about Anet plans about mount skins and continues the theme of barely giving any rewards ingame but rather monetise the hell out of it wich at this point makes me reconsider any further gem purchases or even continuing playing. Why even have raids when the rewards that thematically should be a raid drop/reward (like the bloodstone glider and the sloth backpack) end up being in the gemstore after all? And now this extra layer of RNG? No thanks.

  • Wolfheart.7483Wolfheart.7483 Member ✭✭✭

    @MastemaRose.6703 said:
    Right now I feel sick to my stomach. Mostly I am mad at myself for getting excited. I should know better by now. I've never had any luck. I've never once gambled on something and not regretted it. I definitely felt a false sense of security when the tool-tip said " you are guaranteed to get one you don't already have". I regret this decision tremendously.
    What do y'all suppose are the chances of a refund are?

    They might give you one but they shouldn't. Open a support ticket and wait for a response.

    This is a separate argument, though, from whether the adoption contracts are good or bad. You were not tricked into buying them. It clearly states you will simply unlock one of the mount skins you don't have. You also state that you always regret when you gamble but you chose to do it anyway. Knowing what they were and buying anyway was your choice.

  • @Jaquelidor.2618 said:

    @Aya.6321 said:
    So are we going to get any news or feedback from ANET about the atrocity of this or are we just going to let them watch us mangle each other and wait for it to blow over? THIS IS BS. Why can't they ever just talk to us. Coddle us. Explain to us the situation. Come up with a solution.

    None of that is happening. When there is quite a kitten storm right in front of them and they're going to just pretend it's not happening.

    I really hope they don't take the "Blizzard Route" of just hunkering down and waiting for things to blow over. That's why I quit that game. I got tired of the current dev team taking the players for granted with a "we know you'll keep playing no matter what" attitude.

    Give an explanation. Talk to the players. Even if there's still disagreement and ANet chooses to "stay the course" at least treat your customers like customers.

    Oh man, you're definitely new here. The hunker down and wait method is almost like a martial art form for Anet. They have practiced it well.

    Greck Howlbane - Firebrand
    Sorrow's Furnace For Life

  • Wolfheart.7483Wolfheart.7483 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ronorra.1530 said:
    Very disappointed about Anet plans about mount skins and continues the theme of barely giving any rewards ingame but rather monetise the hell out of it wich at this point makes me reconsider any further gem purchases or even continuing playing. Why even have raids when the rewards that thematically should be a raid drop/reward (like the bloodstone glider and the sloth backpack) end up being in the gemstore after all? And now this extra layer of RNG? No thanks.

    There are many, many rewards in game. When people make that claim, what you actually mean is "the rewards in game are not the ones I like/want."

  • I want to clarify my position from earlier:

    Allow us to pick and choose the mount skins. I've seen some really good ones, but I haven't yet gambled to see what I get. I would love to buy them all to avoid the gambling, but it's $120 for all of them when bought in bulk, which comes to $4 per skin...

    A lot of people have "themes" for their characters, so putting this behind gambling is bad form.

  • I dont want to buy an item for maybe 1-2 skins i might really want and then be stuck with skins i dont want. This type of stuff has made stop playing mmos come on anet. at leat make them a bundle or something. dont lock it behind a gamble item and if you want them all to spend 120!!!

  • @Wolfheart.7483 said:

    @Ronorra.1530 said:
    Very disappointed about Anet plans about mount skins and continues the theme of barely giving any rewards ingame but rather monetise the hell out of it wich at this point makes me reconsider any further gem purchases or even continuing playing. Why even have raids when the rewards that thematically should be a raid drop/reward (like the bloodstone glider and the sloth backpack) end up being in the gemstore after all? And now this extra layer of RNG? No thanks.

    There are many, many rewards in game. When people make that claim, what you actually mean is "the rewards in game are not the ones I like/want."

    I am very curious about those many many rewards that drop in the raid, please enlighten me...

  • aikatara.3462aikatara.3462 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    True story: I was listening to a podcast talking about lootboxes in videogames and gambling while opening GW. There is a new item in the gemshop: The "mount adoption license"

    Me: What the kitten?

    What I liked about GW was that aside from the black lion chest, whose key you could get actually by playing the game (personal story) there was no such kitten in the game. So I am happy to spend a specific amount of real world money in the gemstore to get a specific skin I want (although 2000 gems on a mount skin is a little bit too much for my liking (jackal skin)). But I am not into this gambling thing (and for me this rng/lottery thing is gambling), I will not spend any money on this and I will not support it. So if this trend continues the gemstore will not see much of my money in the future.

    I am not in the mood for GW at the moment anymore. I am going to play something else.

    (edit for spelling)

  • @Wolfheart.7483 said:

    @Ronorra.1530 said:
    Very disappointed about Anet plans about mount skins and continues the theme of barely giving any rewards ingame but rather monetise the hell out of it wich at this point makes me reconsider any further gem purchases or even continuing playing. Why even have raids when the rewards that thematically should be a raid drop/reward (like the bloodstone glider and the sloth backpack) end up being in the gemstore after all? And now this extra layer of RNG? No thanks.

    There are many, many rewards in game. When people make that claim, what you actually mean is "the rewards in game are not the ones I like/want."

    Stay focused please... this is about mount skins, of which there certainly aren't any in the game in the form of rewards.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    @Dropdown.7460 said:

    You still have to spend over $120 to get all the skins (or spend up to that amount for the ONE skin you WANT). This is predatory and while there are "no duplicates" it's like saying a diet cola is better for you because it's diet. This is Diet Lootbox (TM) presented by Anet.

    This is my problem. There are several skins in that package that I dont want, and a handful I do. I dislike buying things I dont want just to get something I do want, nobody likes that.

    If you were concerned some people would gravitate to certain skins, put the skins you think will be more popular up for purchase outright in the store like you did with reforged, and then make the less popular skins available through gameplay. don't force feed your content to people, especially if they're paying you.

    Poor marks for this. This could easily have been content that, if marketed properly and rotated in and out of the gem store for people to explicitly purchase if they so chose, would last well into 2018 as gem store addons. But to give us 30 skins at once and then ask us to pay to slog through all of them in the hopes that we get ones we like before we hit the... 24th? was it? because thats where the bundle sale saves us 6 skins?

    Its not a good move.

    Dont get me wrong. I appreciate the artists. You guys did AMAZING. Every last skin is nice.

    Marketing though... Ive got my eye on you. you're doing things I dislike with this lootbox venture.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Noa.7490Noa.7490 Member ✭✭✭

    Anet, like any company out there, exists to make money and it is actively looking for new ways to make said money. Sure, loot boxes isn't new but right now they're testing the waters. The more people will buy the loot boxes the more Anet will invest efforts to provide even more. Don't encourage this practice and it will die out of its own. Simple as that.

  • Wolfheart.7483Wolfheart.7483 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ronorra.1530 said:

    @Wolfheart.7483 said:

    @Ronorra.1530 said:
    Very disappointed about Anet plans about mount skins and continues the theme of barely giving any rewards ingame but rather monetise the hell out of it wich at this point makes me reconsider any further gem purchases or even continuing playing. Why even have raids when the rewards that thematically should be a raid drop/reward (like the bloodstone glider and the sloth backpack) end up being in the gemstore after all? And now this extra layer of RNG? No thanks.

    There are many, many rewards in game. When people make that claim, what you actually mean is "the rewards in game are not the ones I like/want."

    I am very curious about those many many rewards that drop in the raid, please enlighten me...

    Raids are only one small part of the game and do not represent rewards available throughout the whole game. But since you asked, for example: there are special infusions, back pieces, minis and legendary armor that can be acquired from raids.

  • @Noa.7490 said:
    Anet, like any company out there, exists to make money and it is actively looking for new ways to make said money. Sure, loot boxes isn't new but right now they're testing the waters. The more people will buy the loot boxes the more Anet will invest efforts to provide even more. Don't encourage this practice and it will die out of its own. Simple as that.

    I'm sorry but "testing the waters" is something they did a LOOOOOOOONG time ago with black lion chests. This is already implementing some pretty unfair tactics to grab the most amount of cash from people while disregarding the fact that many of them will have truly poor experiences with the RNG

  • Consumerism is a social and economic order and ideology that encourages the acquisition of goods and services in ever-increasing amounts. The mount skins are a super example of this in comparison to how glider skins have been offered in the past. Just some food for thought today: If you went to a store to buy a sweater or a shirt. Would you be willing to spend your money on that shirt if it was standard that you would not get the choice of color or style and instead you had to accept whatever was issued to you? We can do the same example with food. Would you be willing to spend your money on a meal that is selected for you and does not allow you the opportunity to choose?
    I'm seeing this as a test to learn about our RNG tolerance. Where Black Lion Keys have always provided this experience, will we spend real money and send the message that it is acceptable that the TP to shift to deliver more items by chance and without choice. It's just business.....not saying it's right or wrong today. Just saying this is how businesses learn about your appetite and your tolerance.

  • Dantert.1803Dantert.1803 Member ✭✭✭

    i understand that it makes sense on the money side but this is unfair towards your players also players like me that don't like gambling will stay away from mount skins even though I would have spent lots of gems to get some of them.
    Place the skin at higher prices based on the complexity as single or bundles on the store and people will buy them.
    You hit the jackpot with the mounts now don't screw it up!
    PLEASE Anet, Mike O' Brien , everyone! Rebel against this, your player base doesn't want it!

  • idc for the whole new skins in the shop being RNG but what i am sad about is that there is no skins for non gem players hiding all these skins behind a pay wall is really bad other mmos have mounts in their games which can be obtain via achievements , quests, crafting or even drops why cant we get this as well?

  • The 400 gems is a fair good price, the adoption gimmick is very cute and fun. Though I do have a bit of issue with the RNG for them.
    To be fair I under stand the reason for the tickets to be random but ...I feel there are a few ways it could of been rolled out better.
    First the tickets could of let you select the grouping, say wanted a jackal. You select Jackal from ticket and it gives you a random Jackal.
    Second, mounts a player doesn't have unlocked should not be in the loot pool. Getting a Griffin skin while a player still has only up to the jackal. Kinda leave the player who got the Griffin skin feeling a lil bummed and lost out on a skin they could use right away.

  • Aya.6321Aya.6321 Member ✭✭

    Since when is the trend of gambling in this game okay? Ecto gambling, sure, but gambling for things that we should have access to freely in the first place is just wrong.
    RNG stuff isn't even allowed on the eastern market anymore because of how wrong it is.
    I hate knowing that the Devs are just sitting back watching this unfold. It's so sad.

  • Menadena.7482Menadena.7482 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kheldorn.5123 said:
    Everything is happening exactly as was to be expected. Mounts are going to be heavily monetized. If you think gliders were bad, hehe, good morning, the future is today.

    Everybody knew they would be monetized. The objection is to lootboxes and selling the only single skin at a steep price (it is more than the Halloween pack).

    New to the game? Feel free to give a yell if you need PVE help.

  • Wolfheart.7483Wolfheart.7483 Member ✭✭✭

    .> @Aya.6321 said:

    Since when is the trend of gambling in this game okay? Ecto gambling, sure, but gambling for things that we should have access to freely in the first place is just wrong.
    RNG stuff isn't even allowed on the eastern market anymore because of how wrong it is.
    I hate knowing that the Devs are just sitting back watching this unfold. It's so sad.

    You got access to your mounts with Path of Fire. Putting the RNG issue aside, why do you think you should have the mount skins for free? Or did I misinterpret what you meant?

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