Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged] - Page 27 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]

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Comments

  • The other thing to do, once we comment here...is not buy them...until we get to choose the ones we want.

    I mean do the math ANET peoples...you would get at least $30-50 out of me for $5/skin if I choose them. Mulitply that by lets say 1/3 of the player base. That's a good chunk of cash. You lose that much when we don't buy any, because RNG a skin i won't use and its a wasted 400 Gems...and I hate wasting my $$.

    Its plain to see, if we express our disappointment here...and act on our disappointment in game by not buying any of the "Licenses". I would hope people will pay attention.

    Thanks Gaile, for passing along our feedback and bringing it to peoples attention.

    Always willing to help others if I am able. Catch me in-game. I'm a dirty-casual with 2 kids in college, so I am on at odd times. lol

  • @Witch of Doom.5739 said:

    @Turk.5460 said:
    Who would bother buying the non-shiny mount skins when they can just insta-get the most shiniest and most legendary looking ones? No one. <

    Then how about don't bother MAKING the non-shiny skins, and focus on making the ones people actually WANT.

    The reason the kitten ones are in the lootboxes are so people unlock those instead of the ones they want, forcing them to keep buying the lootboxes to get the one they want. With a one in thirty chance of getting the one you want, you'll need to buy WAY more than just one lootbox to get the one you want. If you end up getting lucky and only buy ten lootboxes, that's still FOUR THOUSAND GEMS you spent on ONE DAM SKIN.

    And that's not even taking into account whether or not the odds of each one dropping is equal. There are no drop tables yet, so the really cool looking ones could have a one in sixty or even EIGHTY chance of dropping rather than a one in thirty, artificially forcing you to buy EVEN MORE THAN 4000 GEMS on lootboxes to get them all.

  • @EUmad.7645 said:
    IF you rate mount skins too expensive you can easily don't buy it. I usually don't buy skin but i can play aswell. THey are not mandatory so i don't see nothing wrong if they gain on that, it is not a p2w so it is really ok for me

    It's more than just a "don't buy it" scenario. It's the principal of the decision to follow through with it and actively knowing that it's a dirty move. You can stand by and halfway defend them all you want, but at the end of the day. It was and is a bad move on their part.

    In terms of what's going on in the media these days as an example, it's like if a movie is put out by a company that has a cameo from a celebrity who is a sexual predator. Are you going to keep watching movies from that company with the knowledge that they allowed the guy to be in it and knowing that he is a sexual predator?

    Come on man. People have to stand up for tom-foolery.

  • I was going to make a list of good and bad, but I couldn't think of anything that's good in the current state - only things that would be good if the situation were a little different.

    Guarantee of a skin you don't have yet WOULD be good, except there's really no other option, is there? The skins aren't tradeable or obtainable in any other way, so of course you can only get each skin once, because what else would you do with them?

    400 gem price WOULD be good if the skins were tradeable on the trading post or if we had more control over which skin to unlock, whether that means straight up buy a skin or buy a random skin for a particular mount.

    Pure random is bad because you can't even guarantee that you'll get a skin for a mount you own. In all likelihood most players will never unlock the griffon at all due to cost or not owning the expansion, so why are they receiving griffon skins they can't use? If the random element is going to stay, there should be mount-specific boxes or a guarantee that you'll only get skins for mounts you have, as well as a cap on how many skins are in a random box. Odds of getting a skin you like are too low.

    In my opinion, in order to be fair, one of these two things needs to happen:

    • Sell individual mount skins at a fixed price
      OR

    • Allow skins to be bought and sold on the trading post.

    With the system as is I will not buy any mount skins and will actively recommend against potential players buying into the game in the worry that this is a sign of future development.

  • Also, at least a few nice looking mount skins should be obtainable by actually playing the game.

  • morrolan.9608morrolan.9608 Member ✭✭✭

    Here is my feedback Gaile these are gambling boxes and anet are cynically pandering to and exploiting addictive tendencies in players with them.

  • I am at an absolute point of fatigue with predatory loot box, DLC, and micro transaction practices taking place in so, so many new games. Unless arena net reverses their stance I will absolutely not log in and play any further. I have probably spent close to 1K over the last 5 years on this game. There is no legitimate need other than greed to begin a true casino style loot box. There are other games with less predatory practices I will move on to.

  • Geikamir.6329Geikamir.6329 Member ✭✭✭

    I, like many others, am very disappointed by the direction you guys have taken with RNG in general, but especially this. RNG boxes is a parasitic plague infecting gaming today.

  • I don't like the idea of buying a bunch of things that I don't actually need (basic mounts with different dye patterns) just to be able to obtain something that I want (unique mounts with new effects). I see this whole system as a pile of stepping stones, each one being sold to you for 400 gems. You pay once, you get the wrong mount. You pay again, you get the wrong thing again. Repeat till you waste 4000 or 6000 gems, still not getting anything you were looking for.

    It saddens me to say this, but I am pretty much displeased with this. There's no place for RNG in this game (we already have quite a lot of it in form of the Black Lion chests).

    Thank you.

  • First of all, thanks for making this thread and I hope it can be of some use. I think the two main issues here are pricing and the amount of 'RNG'. As many people have said, the price is very steep, and the poor 'RNG' came as an unpleasant surprise. It seems most people want these things given out for free or via in-game progress, and I think it could add an interesting aspect to the game. However, people should understand that you guys are a business overseen by an even bigger business, and profits margins are crucial. If the lootbox system is the route you guys want to take, please make them fairer to us, as they currently feel like an exploit of your player base. I think it's possible to make a lootbox system to benefit both parties, even though I'd rather the 'RNG' be removed entirely. My last point of contention, the pricing on the Reforged Warhound is plain unreasonable, even though some still chose to buy it. With that, should we be given the choice to choose from the 30 mount skins, I hope it comes at a more reasonable pricing point. Again, thank you for making this thread and hopefully this comment is of some use.

  • Nightshade.1530Nightshade.1530 Member
    edited November 8, 2017

    I absolutely love the new skins and look forward to future ones; however, I'm sorely disappointed in the acquisition method being used to obtain them. Rather than have it all random, it would be better to just have 5 different tickets, each ticket being for a different mount type. I'd be fine with the RNG aspect if it were that way; at least I would be able to pick the type of mount I wanted to gamble on. But the most beneficial scenario would be being able to outright buy the mount skin you want at around the same price (400 gems). Players wouldn't have to waste time/gold/gems and can be satisfied with their mounts.

    Just a thought, but if you think about it, some of these skins look like they could've been obtained via a heart/collection/quest, much like how a regrown Caladbolg was obtained via a series of collections and instances in Living World. The simplier skins would've been a great reward for players and a good incentive for them to return to the PoF maps or even other maps in Tyria. Meanwhile, the shinier skins would be sold in the gem store, but with a better way to obtain them, as stated previously.

    Also worth noting is the price of the Reforged Hound. I get that it's a completely new model and unique animations, but 2000 gems is a bit overpriced for me. I'd rather spend 2000 gems gambling on the current mount Adoption Licenses than pay that much for a single skin, and I seriously refuse to spend anything on them atm. 800-1000 gems for a single, unique mount skin is the highest I'm willing to spend, be it hesitantly.

  • These (mount) loot boxes have destroyed me financially and made me realize I really have a problem. As a result, I cancelled my credit card and am doing my best not get lulled into the same vortex again.

  • Lonami.2987Lonami.2987 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    Linking the main threads from reddit, in case someone missed them:

    As for my opinion:

    • The gem store has kept getting more and more abusive since release. Worse prices, worse value, and forced packs. Look outside the whale bubble for new models, where you pay less but reach more customers.
    • RNG is awful, and it's only worse when you involve real money. It's literal gambling and it's ruined your reputation as a "clean company". The trust you've lost with this will take months to recover, if it's ever recovered.
    • Glider and mount skins need to have ingame-only options too, which you get by playing. If 99% of mount and glider skins are at the gem store, it feels like a ripoff. We paid for a box, we deserve more respect. If everything is going to be in the gem store, then stop charging for expansions altogether.
    • This game has a problem with being "rewarding". Putting a ton of skins in a vendor, buying from the trading post... that is not rewarding. Rewarding means working for something, feeling good at completing the journey. See ambrite weapons and carapace armor for examples. We need more rewarding stuff (skins, minis, etc) in the game, which leads to prestigious items. Include the previous point in this, and give us ingame prestigious mount skins.
    • Poor quality skins need to stop. Way too many cheap reskins. Charging money for different colored gliders, or mounts with a different horn angle or skin pattern, makes the whole selection looks like poor fan modding instead of actual quality.

    At this rate, you're going to ruin the game, and I'm not kidding or exaggerating. Path of Fire has a lot of problems, and seeing how they are simply ignored while we get 30 new mounts in the gem store has only added insult to injury. If you want to recover your previous reputation, you better start working at ingame mounts which feel rewarding and prestigious, and have decent skins (looking at that awful legendary armor, which was utterly unacceptable). Before Christmas if possible, if you want to make any sales during the holidays.

    Cosmetics are not part of the gameplay, but they are part of the game. If you keep pretending farming gold to turn it into gems will keep the game afloat, you're in for a very bad surprise. You better wake up already, it's been 5 years and you're still making the same mistakes.

    Just a summary, but I hope whoever compiles the feedback from this thread checks the reddit threads above as well.

  • Rococo.8347Rococo.8347 Member ✭✭✭

    @Nero DarkSlayer.9206 said:

    @Witch of Doom.5739 said:

    @Turk.5460 said:
    Who would bother buying the non-shiny mount skins when they can just insta-get the most shiniest and most legendary looking ones? No one. <

    Then how about don't bother MAKING the non-shiny skins, and focus on making the ones people actually WANT.

    The reason the kitten ones are in the lootboxes are so people unlock those instead of the ones they want, forcing them to keep buying the lootboxes to get the one they want. With a one in thirty chance of getting the one you want, you'll need to buy WAY more than just one lootbox to get the one you want. If you end up getting lucky and only buy ten lootboxes, that's still FOUR THOUSAND GEMS you spent on ONE DAM SKIN.

    And that's not even taking into account whether or not the odds of each one dropping is equal. There are no drop tables yet, so the really cool looking ones could have a one in sixty or even EIGHTY chance of dropping rather than a one in thirty, artificially forcing you to buy EVEN MORE THAN 4000 GEMS on lootboxes to get them all.

    This is purely anecdotal but most people who have talked about buying 3-6 contracts have all stated they got Springer mounts mostly in the initial drops, I barely use my springer so you could be on to something there

  • but have found that a single feedback thread offers the best opportunity for you to share your thoughts and for us to review it in the context of a wider set of feedback.

    So here's a thread into which you're invited to post your thoughts on the subject of the Black Lion Stables Mount Skins.

    >

    Translation: We've made this thread so we can ignore you all in a group rather than than ignore you individually in the dozens of new threads flooding our forums.

  • Kencussion.9273Kencussion.9273 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    You asked for my feedback, so here it is...

    I hate how the Mount Adoption system is pretty much a RNG Lootbox. I really like some of the skins and would be willing to pay for them, but I certainly am not willing to pay for just a 'chance' to get them. I don't go to a clothing store and give them $20 for a 'chance' to get something I like! I really don't support the RNG Lootbox system at all (including the Black Lion Chests).

    I think it was a really bad move on ArenaNet's part, ESPECIALLY with the serious fire that other gaming companies are taking because of their own RNG Lootbox systems and how much people hate them. The PoF expansion was amazing and gave GW2 some great reviews and popularity, but these RNG Lootboxes are just going to ruin it. As a loyal veteran, I'm already finding myself not as excited to play GW2 after reading up on all this...

  • mindcircus.1506mindcircus.1506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    So here's a thread into which you're invited to post your thoughts on the subject of the Black Lion Stables Mount Skins.

    My Feed back is that I didn't see anything in the pack that motivated me to spend money or gems on this. I have the money, but the pricing model made it unattractive. Please tell your art department that some of these are really fantastic work though.

  • @Rococo.8347 said:

    @Nero DarkSlayer.9206 said:

    @Witch of Doom.5739 said:

    @Turk.5460 said:
    Who would bother buying the non-shiny mount skins when they can just insta-get the most shiniest and most legendary looking ones? No one. <

    Then how about don't bother MAKING the non-shiny skins, and focus on making the ones people actually WANT.

    The reason the kitten ones are in the lootboxes are so people unlock those instead of the ones they want, forcing them to keep buying the lootboxes to get the one they want. With a one in thirty chance of getting the one you want, you'll need to buy WAY more than just one lootbox to get the one you want. If you end up getting lucky and only buy ten lootboxes, that's still FOUR THOUSAND GEMS you spent on ONE DAM SKIN.

    And that's not even taking into account whether or not the odds of each one dropping is equal. There are no drop tables yet, so the really cool looking ones could have a one in sixty or even EIGHTY chance of dropping rather than a one in thirty, artificially forcing you to buy EVEN MORE THAN 4000 GEMS on lootboxes to get them all.

    This is purely anecdotal but most people who have talked about buying 3-6 contracts have all stated they got Springer mounts mostly in the initial drops, I barely use my springer so you could be on to something there

    I'm not on to anything; that's exactly how these systems work. If you don't give players what they want, but make them FEEL like they're getting closer, they'll keep buying without ever realizing how much they ACTUALLY paid to get the thing they want. It's corporate greed 101.

  • I wont be purchasing any gems with money whilst these exist. 'nuff said.

  • dai.4170dai.4170 Member
    edited November 8, 2017

    I could have understood this if it had gone the same route as event currencies and BL tickets. 400 gems for 2 tickets/800 discounted for 5 (or get them rarely from BL chests, or god forbid make an achievement that gives some away and incentivizes getting more) , then it opens a vendor window where you could spend like, 1x on one of those basic/near unnoticeable reskins, 2x on a random roll, 3x on the fancy ones, maybe 5 on the super fancy unique ones that everyone would obviously want the most. Give them a rarity-based drop table from random rolls and let those ones be tradeable. I also love the idea of making some themed packs so you could nab a bundle of basic reskins vs a bundle of astral skins or elemental skins or something so you can get your fire and ice fix. Do literally _anything _but "hey you've got the option of $120 for everything or somewhere between $5 and $150 to find the few you love. You COULD also translate game money to gems but hey have fun grinding 100g only to get a skimmer with vaguely different dye channels. See you again in a few dozen hours!"

    the variety is great, the skins are great and I didn't expect to see so much so soon, but the lack of any agency in acquiring even one of them is abysmal, and then there's a $25 jackal. I sincerely regret wasting the cash and spare gold for my wife and I on the halloween skins knowing their acceptance probably led to this new decision. Did the outcry of "let us purchase skins individually" coupled with "why is this bundle so pricy for four cheesy recolors" completely fly under the radar?

    There's a video of opening all the skins and all I can do is count up by $5 or 100 gold increments every 3 seconds as they click through, and the longer the video goes the more depressing it gets. No single skin felt worth the value it took to reach it, nor does the collection as a whole feel like it's worth having it all, even as an altaholic

    The moment I polished off masteries and beat out friends on the griffon races I just dropped off the face of the game, the lack of large scale map metas and bosses, mixed with the lack of any decent rewards for doing bounties after the achievements are fulfilled, really strikes me badly and I'm pained to know if future living world junk is just going to add more optional side maps while ignoring the issues the new main zone faces. (I'm still in disbelief that someone legitimately wrote to the reddit and the forum here early on that they were thankful for the amnoon casino coin meta.) I completely understand skins are a byproduct of keeping artists on the team working while they don't have mainline content to produce, but I'd rather pay garbage subscription fees if it meant somebody took the effort to tie some of this junk to prestigious achievements and difficult content, instead of giving us a thousand things to wear and nowhere to be for months on end

  • Let us buy the skins individually, or maybe like. Turn it so the adoption license opens a menu that lets you see the skins, choose one, and get it.

    I've seen suggestions of breaking the RNG up into packs, like the raptor pack. While I think RNG at all is absolute, hot, sweaty, liquid garbage for something that you pay MONEY for- it would have been MARGINALLY better. Still pretty vomit flavored trash though.

    Having RNG on something that we- as the consumer- pay ACTUAL MONEY FOR and should be GUARANTEED that OUR CASH DOLLAR goes towards something we genuinely want... is absolute dog breath. Take it somewhere to the free gameplay. I can accept RNG in a place where we get to play for it free, because heck, that's almost.... wow.... gameplay?? Huh... Who would have thought. But this isn't free stuff, it's stuff we pay money for, and should be again, GUARANTEED. I get that it costs a lot of money to host/make an MMORPG... but this isn't the route to go. I would have spent LOTS of money on mount skins without the RNG factor.

    Oh, side note, maybe add something we can get in game if you INSIST on keeping the RNG. That's how it should be. Look to overwatch, people actually respect lootboxes there because you can- huh- GET THEM IN GAME?

  • ArenaNet,

    I am not of the player population that typically posts on forums or social media. However I felt strongly enough about this topic that I felt I needed to share my perspective. You have a beautiful game and it has been my source of entertainment for the last 5 years. I typically spend $10-15 a month on the gem store, and I always feel like my purchase is meaningful and adds to my enjoyment of the game. When mounts were introduced with Path of Fire I became very enthusiastic about the potential mount skins would provide to the game. Aside from the limit to dye channels, the mounts were a huge hit and it helped me bring several new and old players into the game. Those players have likewise began to spend money on gems for convenience and aesthetic items. Many of us have been anxiously awaiting mount skins and have saved money and gems awaiting their arrival.

    The current mount adoption system is disappointing, to a longtime fan and advocate of Guild Wars 2. And it is not because of the skins, they are truly awe inspiring and exciting. It is because of their acquisition and limited availability outside of a "chance" to receive the skin. I am aware this option provides a large revenue generation for your company and I support that, these are after all a cosmetic option and in no way increase the abilities of anyone who possesses these skins. But in its current form there is a feeling of disdain from players who have limited discretionary income and this section of your player base feels ignored. WE WOULD LOVE TO BUY MOUNT SKINS. But for me to tell a friend that in order to obtain the new mount skins he could end up getting 5 skimmer skins before he gets a skin for another mount is unacceptable. And for myself I would gladly pay over the 400 gem price for any of these skins if I could select which one. So I do not believe in pointing out a problem without also providing a solution.

    1) Keep the Adoption license as is, there was clearly a lot of work put into this so I won't say abandon your decision, and I am sure many players have already purchased many mounts from this system.

    2) Add the adoption license to the black lion chest as a rare drop, the black lion chest has always been a part of the game and accepted by the community, this is where RNG has an acceptable platform. Since there are already random wardrobe unlocks that feel like a bonus anyway, the random mount unlock fits here.

    3) Tier the mounts, Reskins for 600-800 gems, Reskins with physical alteration for 1000-1400 gems, and particle effects added skins for 1600-2000. THIS allows players to select the exact skin, while still giving players value from the 400 gem "discount" on the adoption license. You have now appealed to your player base, created value in the adoption license, and have not had to retroactively compensate the players who have already purchased the adoption license.

    As an additional note, tossing in a skin for each mount, with 2-4 dye channels, as rewards to grind for in Path of Fire would add an end game goal many players are searching for in Path of Fire. Those maps are gorgeous, please give us a reason to spend more time there.

    Whatever you decide to do, thank you very much for your hard work, please continue to be the company we all believe you are and your community will continue to support you.

  • Witch of Doom.5739Witch of Doom.5739 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267 said:
    lmao, To all the people defending this kitten, here's a video of Jim Sterling.

    I hope all the ANet suits and employees who were involved with putting the mount skins behind RNG watch this. Again, make the skins available individually and by choice, and I will buy some.

  • BlakThornArrow.2389BlakThornArrow.2389 Member ✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    I've seen this thread evolve with a lot of negative complaints... And I do agree that this is just ridicules. I bought 3 adopt licenses and I gained 3 springer skins. 1 I will actually use AND two I don't even wanted. Also the forged mount in the gem store for 2000 gems?! are you kidding me? with halloween you gave us 5 skins for 1600.... Then to make matters worse, you make it so we have to gamble in order to actually get what we want, Hell I'd rather spend 600-800 gems on 1 mount skin I will actually use then having to spend my money on skins I don't care about. I would really like the Inu like dog skin for the Jackel but hey I've got 1 in 30 chance of getting that.. and let me guess if you add new mounts those will also be added to that RNG Loot box.

    Arenanet. I would very much like to hear a response in this thread about how and what you are going to do to keep your players happy.
    I love this game and I really liked the mounts. But something like this simply ruins it.

    Also as some simple solutions:

    • Sell individual mount skins at a fixed price in the gem store
    • Make it that when you buy and adopt license you can actually choose which type of mount you want to adopt (giving you more chances to get what you want)
    • Or make it that you simply buy a license and get to choose a skin.
    • Or make it that if you get a skin you don't like you can trade it in for another.
  • Shaaba.5672Shaaba.5672 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    @Rococo.8347 said:
    1. Ive been around the block, I was there for the Great Ascended Backlash, The Great HoT (rewards/meta/Item acquisition/difficulty) Backlash and the Veterans HoT Price Backlash, the latter was handled with swift rethink and positive action on Anets part, the former two not so much a couple of times with issues that layers are unhappy with we have been asked for feedback, then the htread has been shut down and then? ...nothing happens - I recall one thread on the old forum going for OVER A YEAR ( i wish I could remember which) and resulting in little to no change. If you are asking for feedback it needs to be acted on and it needs to be quickly, or at least a clear concise game plan of how long it will take to action.

    I think the one you're thinking of was the thread about traits. Basically that the system of unlocking them through specific events, etc was flawed.

    I'll aslo add another PR disaster to that list - changing the TP interface, specifically the gold to gem exchange rate. At that point the lowest amount of gems you could exchange for was 400. People were furious and vocal about this change. I believe the only thing that made them reverse their decision on that particular change was the PR from gaming magazines reporting on it. I'd like to think it was concern for the customers and listening to their feedback, but sadly it was pretty immediately reversed when it began to be reported on.

    So the Jim Sterling video was great. What I think we need to do is contact other gaming journalism sites to spread the word about how unhappy we are.

  • My issue with this is more about the direction that the whole gaming industry is moving towards with loot boxes and games that are paid for. Its one thing with the freemium models (which I try to avoid), but games that we pay for in advance it leaves a bad taste in my mouth and is frankly worrying.
    Personally I would like to not support a game that encourages people to gamble (especially children, won't someone think of the children!!!!). I know that there has been elements of gambling in GW (even in 1 with the Zaishen chests), but it never felt that intrusive to me. My concern is RNG creep... What would happen if the people who make the money decisions see that they get a better payout by RNGing items? If this model works would they start putting legendary items in loot boxes?
    Unlike BF2 or SoW where I can see the kitten kitten going on in the media (and some surprising reversals) I can just not buy the games. With GW2's unique model I'm already invested. I sank many a hour in GW and GW2 and I've always tried to support the great work of the devs other members of the team by buying gems when I can. The amount of skins I have which I hardly ever use isn't about owning the skin as much it is about saying thank you for making a great game.
    Please please don't go down the path that was forged by mobile games (and other gacha games) using tactics that is only helpful to society in the data it provides drug addiction study groups.
    I really want to play SoW and BF2, but I won't because of how the loot boxes are implemented. I really hope that ANet doesn't bring more gacha elements into the game as I would hate to not play this game too.

  • We all knew mount skins were going to be on the Gem Store, and that's fine.
    At Halloween we couldn't buy just one mount skin, we had to buy the entire box with all five mounts skins, and that is okay too I guess. (It's the festival's skin after all)
    But now with the Black Lion Stables, it's RNG ?

    A lot of people were looking forward to update their mounts skins, but doing this and preventing us from choosing the skins we want to get is SO FRUSTRATING.

    So please, raise the price if you want, but at least let us choose.

  • Honestly, I would buy one of the mounts if I could choose the one I want for 400 gems. But when it's a 1 in 30 chance, or having to pay over $120 I feel insulted as a consumer. The forged skin also costing almost as much as Path of Fire itself is crazy too. Granted, it's not as distasteful as dropping lootboxes onto the beaches of Normandy, but still just as insidious.

    This is a rated Teen game pushing gambling on it's players using real money. Would the developers at Anet want someone pushing their 13 year old kid to gamble with real money? Sure you could use gold, but the amount you would need is out of reach for the vast majority of the playerbase.

    As a player of 5 years, I definitely won't be supporting this game financially if this keeps up. I also feel like a charlatan for telling my friends that GW2 isn't the kind of game to exploit it's players.

  • Nahlaas.8029Nahlaas.8029 Member
    edited November 8, 2017

    I'm 100% against the RNG factor on anything related to skins. There's enough RNG in the black lion chests and the dye packs already. A game like Guild Wars 2 which revolves around making your character look unique can't have skins thrown in the RNG bucket. I cannot, and will not support evil practices like these. It's clearly a decision made my heartless corporate suits who've never touched the game before. To those saying we're blowing this out of proportion, remember things will probably escalate when the corporate suits in Arenanet find out how weak the community is and how easy it is to sell and profit from Lootboxes.

    Until the RNG factor is completely removed from the skins, I will not support Arenanet any further.

    On a darker note: How shameful it is to see Arenanet in the news outlets bundled together with the likes of EA and Activision as just another blind greedy and soulless company. To see Arenanet in the media as some evil corporation who fell to the lootbox fever. What a sad day.

  • Same as a lot of people have said. I like that there's new Mount skins, but I don't want to gamble to get them (especially if that's the ONLY way to get them). There's more than a few that aren't really my taste, and with my terrible RNG luck I'd get one I don't like, thus wasting gems on something I'm not going to use. It just doesn't really make sense when glider skins can be bought individually. There's a few of these I'd like to buy now if they were available separately. Most people can't fork out the $100+ for all of them, or however much it takes to get the ones you want. But I guess that's a good way to get more money out of people.

  • SkyFallsInThunder.8257SkyFallsInThunder.8257 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 8, 2017

    This was a huge dissapointment to me. I thought ANet couldn't let me down more after the borefest PoF is, but they really outdid themselves. One of the stupidest ways to acquire mount skins and I won't be spending a single gem on this rng kitten. Not to mention that a good deal of the skins are generic boring skins, with only a few cool ones. But hey, gotta play that rng.

    Or you can drop 2000 gems and get a single skin for one mount - ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha no.

    Sad to see GW2 heading in this direction.

    EDIT: Also, they are not actually new skins, except a few. They are new PAINT JOBS! If someone actually thinks new paint jobs are as hard to make as actual new skins, please go ahead and slap yourself.

  • This video gives an in-depth analysis of this kind of lootbox system.

  • How is that different from spending 100 gems for a chance at an exclusive dye]? Or 80 gems (in bulks) for BL keys, with a random chance of skins? Like any lotto, play if you think you'll get lucky, otherwise hang tight and buy the specific skin(s) you want when they show up at a discount later.

    You can simply buy the dye you want from the TP, you can't buy the specific mount skins you would like to have, cause you gotta you buy a liscence for 400 gems and have to pray you get the mounts skin you'd like to have, if you're lucky you get it, it not it might take you 30 liscences to get the one you want. 400 gems for a Mount skin is actually ok, but 400 gems on a random mount skins you might not even like, is not ok imo :(

  • Zeem.2564Zeem.2564 Member ✭✭

    I have no issue with the 400 gems for a random skin - thats a good price. But 2000 for an individual skin is waaaaay too high. I'd at least -consider- it at 1000 gems.

    I personally won't be buying any random skins though as the risk of a boring skin or a mount I don't care for is too high. I trust we'll be able to buy each skin individually at a respectable price at a point in the future, with the random option being a risk people have to take if they want it early.

  • I don't really get why people are suddenly outraged at this: This has been ANet's MO since launch (see: Black Lion Chests). I'll buy an outfit and I'll deal with in-game RNG, but I'm not paying for RNG.

    So, yeah, this is a stupid product and it was rolled out in a dumb way (especially given how lazy some of those skins are - imo), but just don't buy it. This isn't new.

  • I don't like that the 2000 gem one is unobtainable in the pool of mounts from the adoption licenses. The adoption licenses should work like the guaranteed wardrobe unlock....that way if I spend a ton of money I at least have the chance to get super lucky and snag the fancy schmancy reforged dog. (yes...I bought tickets to get all the mounts, and the reforged dog is still locked, despite me having a spare license).

  • The thing ppl are missing here is the way it's setup currently means that all new skins will go into the rng table, meaning the more skins they put in the less likely you are to get the one you want. It only took a month before they released 30 skins what's to say next month they add another 30 all being just repatterns meaning if you want 1 skin you have 1/60 of a chance of getting it. Honestly I think it would be better if the stable worked like the black lion claim tickets. you get 400 per ticket and most the skins cost 1 ticket but the real good ones cost 2.

  • Licht Sieger.8496Licht Sieger.8496 Member
    edited November 8, 2017

    I would personally like to say I love the work on the various mount skins and thank the team for their work. I support Anet a lot and would like to support the teams that made these skins by getting some. That said, I don't think I personally will be spending any gems on these the way they are now. I think that it is a combination of the randomness and the $5 price per random pull that I find distasteful.

    I play Magic the gathering and buy booster packs for it, which have randomized cards and cost about the same, maybe a little less. The difference to me is that in something like a booster pack like that you get more than one thing AND you are guaranteed rares and uncommons. In the mount skins that were released there are obviously some that could be likened to a higher 'rarity' purely in the fact that you have some that are different patterns and some that are that plus body shape redesigns, and then some with those things plus various particle effects. As far as we know, in the odds of the Mount Adoption License, you have odds of getting any of these skins equally, there are none actually rarer than others. However in all likelihood the majority of the playerbase will perceive some as more desirable than others. And I can't help but think a lot of the time, someone is going to be outright disappointed if they get one of the less complex ones without particle effects and such. I think all of the designs are good and should be appreciated. The current system just lends itself to the less shiny of these mount skins getting regarded as trash drops or useless and I think that is a shame.

    I think if the skins are going to be randomized in which one you get, I would like the price to go down. I think 200 or 250 is not unreasonable, but I'd be much more likely to buy a few pulls if they were about half the current price they are. On the other hand, I would definitely also like it if you could buy a selectable version of the Adoption Contract that allows you to choose a specific skin. I'd even say the price could go up maybe as high as 600 gems and be fine with me if there was a version where you could outright choose which skins you wanted. I would even say that the game would be fine with both of these methods. I know that if I could, I would definitely buy three or so pulls of a random mount for 200 gems or so, and then spend 600 gems once or twice to get some specific skins that I didn't get that I might like. As the Adoption Contract system currently stands, I bought the spooky mount pack back when it was introduced and will happily stick with those and the default skins until something changes, and have advised my friends and guildmates to do the same.

    Related note- charging 2000 gems for the single reforged Jackal skin when the Spooky pack of 5 was 1600 is a bit exoribitant. If it was a pack of all five mounts with a skin like that for that price, sure I could see it. However there is absolutely no reason for a single mount skin individually to be that much more than a glider skin or outfit in cost. I just want to reiterate that I love the work you all have done in designing these new mount skins, but I and many others simply will not be supporting with our wallets at these prices, and will happily change that stance if you consider at least halving the current prices, especially if the RNG element is kept to the Adoption Contract.

    *Edit for one last thought, I think that if a random version is kept in game, something needs to be done about the fact that people can get griffon skins when they do not have and possibly were not planning on getting the griffon mount. Whether it is those who do not have it simply do not get drops of it, or people can actually select which of the five mounts they want a random roll from, at the very least something needs to be changed here.

  • Spent $60 on mount skins and I'm very satisfied with my purchase. I enjoyed the feeling of gambling and exclusivity that comes with not being able to attain them through individual purchases.

  • I love mounts and want more customization options for them.

    I'm the type of player who is happy to throw you guys some money to get a skin I like, because it's usually a pretty reasonable transaction in lieu of a monthly fee, and it gets me something I can use for my character right then and there. That said, for a single mount skin, it's going to have to be phenomenal and exactly what I want before I'll be willing to spend $20.00 on it.

    Further, this business model turns me off from not only spending any money on mounts, but from spending money on the game altogether. It feels predatory, and I'm not comfortable spending money in a gem store where the stable is seen as an acceptable way to distribute what is now almost the entire roster of mount skins. I've been here since Beta Weekend 2. I'm willing to compromise on this a lot because this is a B2P MMO with no subscription fee, but every time you enforce gambling as a necessary way to get something out of the gem store (which is where the vast majority of cosmetic items are obtained in this game that explicitly called out skins and cosmetics as its end-game), I get closer to checking out of the game completely and feeling like I'm playing a gachapon machine with a nice action RPG as a mere wrapper. You guys need to make money, but I need to respect ANet as a company to be willing to give you my money. And as someone who wants maybe 1 skin out of the entire Stable, telling me I have to spend somewhere between $5 and $100+ dollars to unlock it is completely unacceptable. Just because you guys put a cap on the amount of gambling we have to do to get a certain reward doesn't mean that you aren't making us gamble upwards of $100 for them.

    Let us buy specific skins for $10. Make the skins tradeable on the TP. Let us trade in skins we don't want for tokens to buy a specific skin at a 2-to-1 or 3-to-1 rate, but whatever you do, do something. I was really excited about the direction of PoF and was looking forward to seeing where things go from here and supporting you monetarily along the way. I was looking forward to buying mount skins. But not like this. I can't buy gems in good conscience if this is the new standard for distributing rewards.

  • I've bought glider skins previously because they fit with my my characters and I'd do the same with mount skins if I were to be given the option to choose which skin I wanted, but rng or pay £125 for the entire set beggars belief. I'm a big fan of Guild Wars 2, having played since launch, and I've NEVER seen the community this upset, even when we were promised a full set of new legendary weapons that never appeared/got delayed.

    To my mind we should be able to pick which mount skin we want and pay a reasonable price. For instance, you might want the fire skins for all your mounts, so make it available as a set for the five mounts, like you did with the Halloween skins, you want just one, fine, make that one available but to open up Guild Wars 2 to the loot box mentality isn't the way to encourage the customer base, especially when we've only just bought the expansion.

    It smacks of greed on the part of ArenaNet and I honestly believe the company is better than that.

  • Lyger.5429Lyger.5429 Member ✭✭✭

    To be honest folks, this ship has already sailed and in Anet's financial eyes this release was a success. I mean just look at the gems-to-gold prices after yesterday and how many people already have these skins in game.

    What can they do at this point if they remove the RNG they would have to offer refunds to a lot of people.

    If they want to regain the trust of their customers again, they have to release the next set of skins to be obtainable in game and not the gemstore.

    It's quite sad because of all the positive rep they built with the expansion release is pretty much gone due to this PR nightmare.

  • Interesting. I agree with the general sentiment I'm seeing here.

    The dye packs work because you can buy and sell them on the trading post. Black lion chest keys can be found normally playing the game, and make for a fun surprise, especially as most of the items in them are available on the TP anyway. Black Lion Chests already cover the "fun random chance at expensive skins" mechanic without forcing themselves as the ONLY way to get black lion weapon skins. We don't need more of that, we need more guaranteed customer satisfaction.

    Mounts should be done similarly to how glider skins were, sold individually in the gem store for reasonable prices (although I think a few mount skins that you could get through in-game achievements and the like would be quite welcome)! I think I started out with all of about one glider skin I wanted? Then, as more were released that I liked, sales came and went, and as I designed characters that I realized would look much better with a certain correspondingly themed glider skin, I bought more and more skins. There's just something satisfying about finally deciding to make that investment to buy that glider skin you really love. Something exhilarating about clicking the button and seeing your mailbox light up, knowing that yes! You just finally got that cool item you've been drooling over!

    Loot boxes entirely rob you of that experience. If I see a cool item that I want, then see it's only available from a random loot box drop, I'm going to instantly forget about it. I have neither the time, nor money, to continually spend gems on a random chance at an item, and though some players might, most don't. I'll probably see other players running around with cool mount skins, and I'll wish I had them, but I'm not going to buy the adoption certificates if I don't know what I'm actually getting.

    Other games may pull all sorts of shenanigans like loot boxes and subscription fees to keep draining money out of their players, but Guild Wars 2 players are here because we don't want that kind of game. I want a game where when I pay for something, I get it, whether that be my account itself being mine and not needing constant monthly fees to stay so, or the mount skin I paid for actually being the one I want.

    I love Guild Wars 2 and will continue to play it, but I'm not exactly rich and won't be spending money on it unless I'm sure I'll get what I want.

    However, the gw2 devs are awesome and clearly want to know how their player-base feels about all this, so I expect we'll soon end up being given the option to choose which mount skins we're buying!

    You must love the sound of my voice. Not that I blame you...

  • I'm a disabled man on a limited budget. I've supported this game since it first was available for purchase. It is my primary hobby to engage with online. I tend to buy a gem card every couple of months (even though I really don't have much discretionary money) to further support your company because I believe you provide me with that much entertainment. I buy a lot of stuff in the gem shop. I own more gliders and outfits than I have characters to use them. If you had made mount skins directly purchasable, I would have bought the ones I wanted. But I will not spend what little money I have on a gamble. Gambling is unethical. I've never purchased a single Black Lion Chest for that reason. And I won't be spending any money for mounts skins that are either way overpriced or locked behind a gamble. If you wish for me to stop purchasing items from the gem shop, then keep locking it behind a chance to get what I want.

  • I dont like the rng aspect of it. Id rather be able to buy the skins individually. I think the pricing is fine per skin. Maybe some more or less than others.

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