Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged] - Page 36 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]

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  • How is the new mount adoption thingies worse than the RNG loot that have ALWAYS excisted in GW2?
    Haven't played the game for a while, since launch of PoF. Woke up this morning to see a Jim Sterling video on GW2 in my subs on youtube. Went to reddit and official forums, and saw the outrage. Logged into the game to see how it worked, and don't see the big problem here compared to what is already in the game. I mean don't get me wrong, I have always hated the gambling elements in GW2, but it seemed like people rarely ever cared.
    These new lootboxes is better than so much gambling that already exist in the game. With the 400 per random mount you are at least guaranteed to get a mount skin, and you can't get the same one twice. Compare that to lets say dye kits, where there is a big chance of only getting dyes worth a couple silver.
    I've known many people in the game who have burned away 100's of $ on trying to get precursors in the mystic forge , many of those were full on addicts, who couldn't stop, many of those saw they had a problem and quit the game forever before they went to far.
    I hate lootboxes, but i'm no saint myself. Idiot me spent 4000 PoF gems on dye kits when I was bored, to try and get that permafrost dye, only to regret it big time ofc. I bought Shadow of War even though I hate the fact that we now have lootboxes in single player games. I'm part of the problem.
    I hope this trend will collapse soon, but this have always been part of GW2.
    Guild Wars 2 is probably my favorite game of all time, but this have always been a big negative for me in this game, fail to see how these new loot boxes that are actually better than so much gambling we've already seen in the game is now somehow big news.

  • It would have made more sense to just add most of the skins in chives / rewards and leave Unique ones in gemstore for fair price of 400-800 gems.
    Pof content was lacking in actual (chive/meta) rewards anyway would have made nice bonus to shove some skins there.. or least added as reward into adventures with daily low chance or something related to that instead of the rng loot box.

  • guys and girls , dont forget : WE control the game .. not Anet. So We disagree with prices on the mounts ? simple , we boycot the gemstore until we get fair prices and fair choises in mount skins. Been playing since august 25th 2012. In the past 5 years spend 1000's of gems without a doubt, cause i always got what i wanted to buy. Always supported the gemstore and the game. but its simple anet . strike one... all i can say , strike one..

  • We get so much loot in the game, we don't even realize it.

    The biggest problem ANet has is perception. Since we don't need the traditional lucky drops to play (as would be true in many, many other games), the only things that feel rewarding are those with super tiny drop rates. Those can often be acquired with gold, that accumulates from just about anything we do. That results in understandable frustration and the feeling that there aren't good drops and that everything "worthwhile" is too expensive.

    The fact is that we don't need very much in GW2 to succeed, so we tend to focus on things we don't need as being paramount.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • Honestly, I think it's pretty deplorable. The last thing this game needs is randomized loot boxes. It would be so much better getting at least a random skin for a selected mount.
    I honestly only support the microtransactions in this game because the devs haven't made it p2w in any way and they actually developed a good game but this is taking the Mickey.

  • The whole problem started with the black lion chest giving random rewards, giving specific account bound items like gliders I think it was? Just let us pick or make them tradeable. This demotivates people to buy a skin at all.

  • I don't like the thought of RNG Mount Boxes because I am more a "you get what you see" type. At the moment I am more or less okay with the Box but it's only the beginning because new skins will be released. Either they expand the contents in it and lessen the chance to get what you want in the process or they just make more and more of those boxes and neither of those two possibilities sits very well with me. And on Top of that, they released a single skin with a price tag as high as a complete mount bundle.
    So it's not this box especially which is worrying me but the future of this shop model.

  • Ohoni.6057Ohoni.6057 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    We get so much loot in the game, we don't even realize it.

    The biggest problem ANet has is perception. Since we don't need the traditional lucky drops to play (as would be true in many, many other games), the only things that feel rewarding are those with super tiny drop rates. Those can often be acquired with gold, that accumulates from just about anything we do. That results in understandable frustration and the feeling that there aren't good drops and that everything "worthwhile" is too expensive.

    The fact is that we don't need very much in GW2 to succeed, so we tend to focus on things we don't need as being paramount.

    I mean, the quantity of loot is fine, they give plenty of loot, but if it's not stuff that people actually value then it's not really loot. I mean if at the end of the week your boss hands you a paycheck for minimum wage, and also three full garbage bags to take out to the trash, well that's a large volume of reward for your efforts, but it's not going to get you very far.

    That's the issue here, there's not a whole hell of a lot of point to most of what the game offers you. It cannot even meaningfully help you earn the things that you DO want, in most cases. Maybe the solution would be more of a shift away from blue and green "trash" gear, and more towards collectible tokens that can eventually be converted into fancy and uncommon items that you actually want.

  • I'm just disappointed that someone at Anet thought randomizing skins was a good idea... You mix in really dull skins with amazing ones and expect your playerbase to like it? No. They won't.

    Please fix this. Let me choose my skins.

  • Fallesafe.5932Fallesafe.5932 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    @Jordan.5930 said:
    Do you feel Guild Wars 2 is rewarding?

    NO. I've started threads on this issue, and left countless replies to the effect that 'NO, GW2 is NOT REWARDING!' And it's the number one thing killing the game for me right now. It took me about six months to completely max out two characters. And now, I don't have a kitten thing to do. When people talk about "fashion wars," I want to reach through my monitor and slap the stupid out of them. SKINS AND DYES ARE UTTERLY MEANINGLESS! Why would anybody subject themselves to a year of stomach-acid, learning to raid... just to pop out, on the other side, exactly the same as they started? Or... once you've bought your ad infinitum, and endless mist's omnipotion... why would you bother running fractals with terrible PUGs for relics you have nothing to spend on??

    THIS GAME IS NOT REWARDING!!! And people who would LOVE to keep playing are quitting because of it. I have nothing that I want in this game. And I'm sorry, I'm not going to play it for the "joy" of the animations, or the absurd, horribly-acted story.

  • @jokke.6239 said:
    How is the new mount adoption thingies worse than the RNG loot that have ALWAYS excisted in GW2?
    Haven't played the game for a while, since launch of PoF. Woke up this morning to see a Jim Sterling video on GW2 in my subs on youtube. Went to reddit and official forums, and saw the outrage. Logged into the game to see how it worked, and don't see the big problem here compared to what is already in the game. I mean don't get me wrong, I have always hated the gambling elements in GW2, but it seemed like people rarely ever cared.
    These new lootboxes is better than so much gambling that already exist in the game. With the 400 per random mount you are at least guaranteed to get a mount skin, and you can't get the same one twice. Compare that to lets say dye kits, where there is a big chance of only getting dyes worth a couple silver.
    I've known many people in the game who have burned away 100's of $ on trying to get precursors in the mystic forge , many of those were full on addicts, who couldn't stop, many of those saw they had a problem and quit the game forever before they went to far.
    I hate lootboxes, but i'm no saint myself. Idiot me spent 4000 PoF gems on dye kits when I was bored, to try and get that permafrost dye, only to regret it big time ofc. I bought Shadow of War even though I hate the fact that we now have lootboxes in single player games. I'm part of the problem.
    I hope this trend will collapse soon, but this have always been part of GW2.
    Guild Wars 2 is probably my favorite game of all time, but this have always been a big negative for me in this game, fail to see how these new loot boxes that are actually better than so much gambling we've already seen in the game is now somehow big news.

    The big difference to dye-kits is that you can buy all the dyes via TP. You don't have to gamble for them. Also, if you do gamble for them, you can dump unwanted dyes and get some gold in return. For mount skins there is no non-gambling way to acquire them and any unwanted skin is a complete loss.
    The big difference to precursors is also that you can buy all MyFo-pres on the TP. And if you gamble for pres you're not even encouraged to use gems. I'm gambling for pres on a regular basis with dungeon exotics.

    The only thing in GW2 that is comparable to mount skins are account bound items in BLCs. Those are relatively new and no less despicable.

    No skin should be exclusive to gem-store rng boxes.
    What really happened with mount skins

  • PopeUrban.2578PopeUrban.2578 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    @ToxicScopes.9832 said:
    Honestly, I think it's pretty deplorable. The last thing this game needs is randomized loot boxes. It would be so much better getting at least a random skin for a selected mount.
    I honestly only support the microtransactions in this game because the devs haven't made it p2w in any way and they actually developed a good game but this is taking the Mickey.

    This game has had randomized loot boxes since launch. Nobody cared because they could pay other players in gold to gamble in stead of doing it themselves. Doesn't change the fact that Anet is heavily monetizing a minority of the player base at the expense of the majority's selection of ingame rewards and always has been. When people buy skins or BL items for gold they are still supporting this business practice and actively saying to anet they'd rather be nickel and dimed a skin at a time than buy larger more content rich expansions at a standard game price point.

    All the perks, none of the responsibilities.
    PopeUrban - The Papacy [POPE]
    Dude in Charge, Chief Financier, and Cave-Polisher
    It's really just a club for lazy people! Join today and get big-guild services with no-guild schedules!

  • @Ohoni.6057 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    We get so much loot in the game, we don't even realize it.

    The biggest problem ANet has is perception. Since we don't need the traditional lucky drops to play (as would be true in many, many other games), the only things that feel rewarding are those with super tiny drop rates. Those can often be acquired with gold, that accumulates from just about anything we do. That results in understandable frustration and the feeling that there aren't good drops and that everything "worthwhile" is too expensive.

    The fact is that we don't need very much in GW2 to succeed, so we tend to focus on things we don't need as being paramount.

    I mean, the quantity of loot is fine, they give plenty of loot, but if it's not stuff that people actually value then it's not really loot. I mean if at the end of the week your boss hands you a paycheck for minimum wage, and also three full garbage bags to take out to the trash, well that's a large volume of reward for your efforts, but it's not going to get you very far.

    That's the issue here, there's not a whole hell of a lot of point to most of what the game offers you. It cannot even meaningfully help you earn the things that you DO want, in most cases. Maybe the solution would be more of a shift away from blue and green "trash" gear, and more towards collectible tokens that can eventually be converted into fancy and uncommon items that you actually want.

    You did a nice job of paraphrasing what I said: the game gives a lot of loot; it can't possibly be "good" loot as other games have, because we don't need special gear to succeed; and we dismiss the coin-value of "trash" loot as different from collectible tokens.

    The literal way that RIBA is profitable is by selling that trash loot. We just dismiss it because it doesn't seem special.

    One way to see this:

    • Other games give expensive gifts, which might be the sweater you'll never wear or the mouse you had your eye on for months.
    • ANet gives us a gift certificate, good at the TP, allowing us to get whatever the heck we want.

    As with RL gifts, some people prefer the first; it's more meaningful to them. And some prefer the latter, as they always get what they want.

    Note by the way: when it comes to loot, we perceive random rare stuff as better than giving us a constant stream of little stuff that we can convert at our leisure to the rare stuff. But when it comes to stuff we buy with RL cash (or gems), we're the opposite: we want fixed stuff, not random.

    "Face the facts. Then act on them. It's ...the only doctrine I have to offer you, & it's harder than you'd think, because I swear humans seem hardwired to do anything but. Face the facts. Don't pray, don't wish, ...FACE THE FACTS. THEN act." — Quellcrist Falconer

  • ANET .. please speak up if you are actually reading these . because from where I sit I think you may be hoping the furor over this is going to go away.
    it's not. and I am not spending another dime with you till you fix it.

    Your move has now made it onto major gaming publications. if you are in the camp of any press is good press, by all means .. continue on.. If not
    then you need to back this up and unwind it and find another means. This is unacceptable.

  • i think the choice to make it completely impossible to get the same skin twice is good, but the money put into it is far too much for something based on rng. especially given some skins are just texture changes (not a bad thing design wise, because they're all really nice imo). i don't really have suggestions on how to better it, because i'm a little naive to how the whole videogame industry works.

    i had an extra £10 to spare, on top of my 400 gems from my last purchase, so i got three skins and although i wasn't upset with my skins, but i wasn't really pleased with them either, the only consolation is next time i spend on gems, i would get something different... but i don't want to keep spending money on something i'm uncertain of. with gliders, i can see what i'm getting, it's not down to rng, it's a skin or two, so spending the money on gems is comfortable, but i don't feel comfortable just dropping, say, a tenner a month on gw2 just to get things i don't want. especially if new skins are going to keep being added to the pool. the price will just keep going up! i can't afford that, even if i'd like to.

    it's worse, imo, that they're account bound. that really makes it sting that little bit more. you can't even sell the ones you don't want! you just need to re-roll next payday and live with the potential disappointment of not getting the skin you want again... but at least you won't get the one you already have!

    i don't like gambling, i don't like how easily i could just keep saying "just one more license, just one more license, i can get the one i want, just one more", and i think that's what people mean by predatory. people with addictive personalities and problems with gambling will be up for spending £100+, and i fall into that category of addictive personality... it's not fun knowing the only thing stopping me from wasting my money is the fact i'm worried about making rent this month. some people might not have the same self control as me, and just fire right in... it's not fair on them. it feels sleazy. please don't be that way, anet, i've supported you financially when i could, but i couldn't, in good conscience, support a company that preys on people so vulnerable, intentionally or not.

  • Ayumi Spender.1082Ayumi Spender.1082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fallesafe.5932 said:

    @Jordan.5930 said:
    Do you feel Guild Wars 2 is rewarding?

    NO. I've started threads on this issue, and left countless replies to the effect that 'NO, GW2 is NOT REWARDING!' And it's the number one thing killing the game for me right now. It took me about six months to completely max out two characters. And now, I don't have a kitten thing to do. When people talk about "fashion wars," I want to reach through my monitor and slap the stupid out of them. SKINS AND DYES ARE UTTERLY MEANINGLESS! Why would anybody subject themselves to a year of stomach-acid, learning to raid... just to pop out, on the other side, exactly the same as they started? Or... once you've bought your ad infinitum, and endless mist's omnipotion... why would you bother running fractals with terrible PUGs for relics you have nothing to spend on??

    THIS GAME IS NOT REWARDING!!! And people who would LOVE to keep playing are quitting because of it. I have nothing that I want in this game. And I'm sorry, I'm not going to play it for the "joy" of the animations, or the absurd, horribly-acted story.

    You just flat out said the game is rewarding if you got 2 characters maxed out in 6 months.
    I've played about a year now and ain't got Jackal-Skritt

  • Not sure if this has already been posted but as usual, Jim kitten Sterling son, delivers.

    Sums up the thread nicely, methinks.

  • Shirlias.8104Shirlias.8104 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017
    1. Gw2 is rewarding all the time. Most of the things are shared, content made for exotic equipment, ascendeds account bound, the possibility to drop and reduce the game after a while and be still capped, useless farm which allows you to just log in in order to have fun, and much more.
      .
      .

    I really like the totale absence of progression, and I am sure it could help in order to heal those players now addicted after years of statsfarm+subscription mmos.
    .
    .
    2. GEM STORE is not that rewarding recently, but Since it is fashion i don't really care, though I am disappointed and eventually feel sorry for those who like shinies. I thank those who buy black Lion keys because thanks to them i was able to buy things from TP.

  • Please add more bundles like the Halloween one. I want to buy skins that fit with my characters, and I'm not going to buy a skin for just one mount without knowing if that theme will ever be introduced to the other mounts. I think the pricing on the Halloween bundle was good, and would have bought it if it fit any of my characters. For other players, consider adding the ability to buy just one mount from the bundle for 500-ish gems.

    The reforged hound and adoption license don't give me a bundle with a theme fitting my characters, so I won't buy those. In addition, these are way too expensive! I also don't spend any money on gambling, and I'm sad that such amazing skins can't be acquired any other way. Those flame-skins would make for a nice bundle I would buy for one of my elementalists, for the same price as the Halloween bundle. Please give us the ability to get these skins without gambling. I think 1600-2000 gems for a bundle of 5 is a good price, and 500-ish for one specific mount skin. I'm not going to spend 2000 gems on just one skin, no matter how amazing it might be.

    Also, consider adding mount adoption licenses as in-game rewards. Black lion keys can be acquired as a reward for personal story completion, and we can pick a dye from the dye-gamble-packs with our birthday presents. It would be nice to get a mount license as a rare drop from some events in the desert, or something like that. It would also be nice to add the skins to the wardrobe unlock system (even though that's more gambling :( ).

  • PrinceAzulon.1876PrinceAzulon.1876 Member
    edited November 9, 2017

    I don't mind buying & spending 1000+ gems for each mount skin that I really like if I can pick them individually. Honestly, I'm never going to buy gems or convert my gold for this. This is a scummy business model and I'll never support it. I really think Anet didn't give this enough critical thought. It's even ironic because they did it hoping to drain our wallets but they ended up not earning much and losing a lot of respect from the community.

  • Tenno.3419Tenno.3419 Member
    edited November 9, 2017

    When will you guys understand that no one ever wants to buy skin bundles that include every mount??? I guarantee you that almost every player has a favourite mount and one that they almost never use except for puzzles or something. Then why the heck would I want to buy a skin bundle that includes skin for every mount even though I only use one of them for 99% of the time?? Excuse me but thats just stupid if I'd waste my money for that. I know that selling skins individually wont work for Anet moneywise since they get a lot more by selling bundles, and I understand that - they are a company and like every company they have to make profit. Therefore individual skins are never going to happen. Sorry to burst your bubble guys. However more and more people are starting the get angry with the "bundle-enforcement" and Anet should definitely do something about this. But what can Anet do against this without loosing too much profit?

    Here are a few Ideas:
    1) Drop the price for a single license to 200 Gems (this one doesnt solve the unwanted mount skins and the RNG though)
    2) Introduce licenses that are mount-specific so players at least get a skin for the mount they like (I highly recommend this one eventhough the RNG Factor is still given!)
    3) Give 1 License as a special Monthly/Challenge/Story Reward/PVP-Reward: E.g. Completing an Expansion Pack/Having Done every Daily for 30 Days straight/ Completing special Achievments that are hard to do/Finishing a lot of PVP-Rewardtracks in a short timespan etc. ( This way Players can slowly but surely work their way to licenses and can also decide to buy licenses if this seems too grindy or slow for them - however this method rewards diligent players which is a huge plus. If some people can't afford the skins let them at least grind for it.)

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's rather simple, the game doesn't feel rewarding because you play the game to earn gold and then use that gold to buy what you want from the gem store.
    On the other hand, if content was giving out the rewards, the game would suddenly feel rewarding again.
    However, the problem with the open world is you can't really have exciting, and not behind heavy RNG, rewards because if 200 players kill a world boss and they all get the reward with 50% chance, then we'll need the next reward right away. They can't possibly add a new unique and amazing reward every day.
    The system that allows everyone to roll for their own rewards is what is killing the rewards in the open world. Although amazing in so many other aspects, when it comes to unique world boss rewards it's simply terrible. Because when everyone is rolling, it must have a very low chance of acquisition otherwise players will get their reward in two attempts and then complain that the game is not rewarding and need their next reward.
    So good things in the open world have abysmal chances of getting them, to combat this fact, but I can't see an easy way around it.

    Instances is another story but not gonna open that can of worms, I'll stay with the Open World.

  • Ohoni.6057Ohoni.6057 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    You did a nice job of paraphrasing what I said: the game gives a lot of loot; it can't possibly be "good" loot as other games have, because we don't need special gear to succeed; and we dismiss the coin-value of "trash" loot as different from collectible tokens.

    But there is plenty of "good loot" that is in the game already, it's just poorly distributed. Right now there are hundreds of items that people might consider "good loot" that are either A: omega rarity drops that most people will never see in the wild, or B: only earnable through completing specific content that not everyone cares to do. They could add a lot of value to the game by presenting better paths to save up for those sorts of items via more practical ingame activities. Let people save up for Black Lion Keys. Let people save up for PvP/WvW specific armors via PvE play. Let people save up for Envoy Armors and similar items through general activities.

    And before you suggest that in at least some cases gold could fill this role, remember that gold is subject to the whims of the market, so the more people have, the less it is worth. This needs to be a non-market currency that retains full value regardless of how much of it exists.

  • Buy a bunch of skins for US$100/EU$120/AU$175 when you wont use most cause they look pretty bland & you can only use one at a time... After the kitten that occurred with HOT release you would think you guys would have learnt to not kitten on your customers. You get players returning to play POF & then you pull this stunt.

    There is literally only two benefits from screwing your players like this.
    The first is a lot of them are just copy paste models with minor changes so nice & easy to make (after the time consuming first one). Many people (the most vocal at least) would rather just buy 1 skin for each mount. By doing this way the ones noone wants will still sell & the ncsoft report will have higher number of prem store items sold which may bring some bargaining power depending on how well pof sold. The second is by screwing your players with gambling you create fear they may miss the skins they want & it pushes them towards buying the slightly discounted packs.

    So to the disadvantages. Well it is obvious you have really really pissed off many people from the countless threads & comments in them. You havent really responded cause you are waiting for the sales & player reports to see if it was successful regardless of the rage. You also miss out on people who wont gamble on principle or dont want to risk getting stuck with kitten looking skins. Then the people who dont have the ingame gold & cant afford to drop $100+ on nothing more than some eye candy.
    Then there is the rng issue. If people dont buy the discounted packs & decide to try their luck they might get the couple they want in the first say 4 & wont buy any more which makes the scam less effective. That seems like a big risk & only way I can see you could have avoided that is if you secretly rigged the rng so the best looking ones wouldnt drop unless account licenses ownership was say more than 10 or you did what you do with the blc chests & made the chances of getting the best looking ones super super low compared to the rest. Sure you can deny it & say that it's all equal chance but you reaaly think people will believe you after seeing you pull a stunt like this?

    The alternatives?
    1. Companies like Amazon & walmart rely on selling cheaper but selling more instead. As I said many just want the ones they like best so by itself this wouldnt work. It would have rely on something like 300-400gems for each mount & if you complete the "collection" by buying them all then you unlock a good looking exclusive skin.
    2. You sell them in predefined packs & I dont mean like Halloween pack. I mean like packs of say 5 with the obvious most popular ones spread across groups.
    3. You sell them singular at 600-800 & let people buy the few they want. Selling a singular skin for 2000gems ($20-25) is stupid & only the rich, ocd & addicted will purchase it. However I do suspect that was put there purely to help sell the licenses to stupid people who compare the two & believe the licenses are a great deal despite all prices being artificially created/inflated.

  • Frostfang.5109Frostfang.5109 Member ✭✭✭

    Give us the ability to trade one already aquired mount skin for another. That way we dont have to spend 400 gems in something we dont want.

  • I could go on and on as many people have but i ll keep it simple in one sentence i think we can all agree on:
    Gambling should not be the only way to get something in a game.

  • I do not mind BL chests because there is a way to earn keys through gameplay. I find the lootbox gambling of the new mount skins very disappointing. Despite the fact that I indulge in a bit of fashion wars, buying skins with irl money once a month, I will not be partaking in this instance.

    How would I like to see you guys fix this? Add some mount skin collections. The legendary collections had me spending lots of gems to buy gold to get the materials to make it. Remove the RNG element from the skin purchases, and keep that limited to BL chests, which are achievable through gameplay.

    Thank you for your time and your great game.

  • Make packs of all the same type mounts, and packs with different effects like fire and celestial etc, charge the 1600 gems like the Halloween pack. Sell each skin individually for 400-800 gems and let people pick and pay the price accordingly. Keep the 30 pack up longer for those who cannot get the cash within 7 days to purchase it but would like to, maybe they need more time to work some overtime to get it. If it’s rng then lower the price to 200 gems per license so players are more apt to buy the gems.

  • Make packs of all the same type mounts, and packs with different effects like fire and celestial etc, charge the 1600 gems like the Halloween pack. Sell each skin individually for 400-800 gems and let people pick and pay the price accordingly. Keep the 30 pack up longer for those who cannot get the cash within 7 days to purchase it but would like to, maybe they need more time to work some overtime to get it. If it’s rng then lower the price to 200 gems per license so players are more apt to buy the gems.

  • PopeUrban.2578PopeUrban.2578 Member ✭✭✭

    The logic that the game can not survive on box purchases alone is false. We'd be paying a lower distributed cost in more frequent expansions at the cost of having as many free updates. We'd be paying full box price for these expansions. We'd be getting the full result of an entire development effort in once chunk. Actual cost of hosting servers in 2017 is DRASTICALLY lower than the days of the subscription model. Actual cost of developing games has not changed as drastically as you are led to believe, as the labor market in the industry is much more competitive and it is far easier to acquire better talent for less investment.

    Microtransactions effectively monetize a minority of a game's player base for the majority of their revenue by specifically targeting so-called "whales"

    Effective expansion models effectively monetize every player by distributing the income across the entire player base, and encourage the developers to release high value content loaded with whatever the players find desirable rather than specifically building their games in such a way as to withold content in order to drive cash shop sales under the guise of "free updates"

    The cost of developing and hosting an MMO in 2017 is not drastically dissimilar than the cost of maintaining online services for the plethora of shooters and sports games that offer these services for free, release iterative games once a year, and did not adopt microtransaction models until very recently although their business model was already so sustainable it bootstrapped multiple other projects. Very little of the added value from embracing a microtransaction model is actually reinvested in developing the game you buy them in.

    The idea that "they have to have a cash shop" is a myth. Offering discreet large chunks of complete content for direct pricing and placing all of the rewards within that package is very much a sustainable business model. If I had to choose between buying slightly more expensive expansions with no free updates that have all the rewards in the game, or having more free single map updates with two skins and being saddled with a cash shop and living in an environment where playing the game is not sufficient to access whatever reward mechanisms exist, I would most certainly choose the former. The problem is that without those people who "should know better" or "have the money anyway" spending hundreds and hundreds of collars more than the average on "optional" cash shop items, the profits do not keep pace with the rest of the industry. Making enough to continue making your game and paying your developers well is not the objective of such systems. Making as much as the rest of the industry that is exploiting their players for piles of money to deliver to cranky shareholders is.

    All the perks, none of the responsibilities.
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  • @Nikal.4921 said:
    Mount skins should be sold and priced like glider skins. 400 gems for basic, 500 gems for those with effects. Perhaps room for premium skins for 700 gems. Anything more is a rip-off IMO.

    They prefer 2k gems for the one u get to choose. Lets sell the expansion without any obtainable mount skins, wait a few weeks and start cashing in at 25euro/skin.

  • Luth.6915Luth.6915 Member ✭✭

    I don't like presence of real money gambling in a game. A lot of people in the gaming world have expressed hate for this business model. You chose to implement this exactly while everyone is heated about this issue. Are you guys trying to make people hate you? I came back to play GW2 after taking a break from it a few years ago. I find some comfort in it knowing that it didn't have any loot box bs cancer affecting the games today. Well, that didn't last long.

  • @Dianekas.4359 said:

    @Nikal.4921 said:
    Mount skins should be sold and priced like glider skins. 400 gems for basic, 500 gems for those with effects. Perhaps room for premium skins for 700 gems. Anything more is a rip-off IMO.

    They prefer 2k gems for the one u get to choose. Lets sell the expansion without any obtainable mount skins, wait a few weeks and start cashing in at 25euro/skin.

    Now imagine if you want 1 skin for each mount. At 2k gems per skin that's 10k gems. Even more expensive than the unlock-all-package!

    No skin should be exclusive to gem-store rng boxes.
    What really happened with mount skins

  • I love how everyone panics so much about mounts, when in fact there are more BL skins, Glider skins you'd be getting for a much more expensive way if you want to collect them all. just because they released them all at ones doens't mean they are more expensive then other skin like things from the BLTP.

    i think anet did a fine job making OPTIONAL skins for the fashion wars and yes, the game is 5 years old, wil probably not sell as much as it did at launch, and yet they have the heart to keep developing and creating stories and expansions and every other feature and bug that is currently in game. Have some decency for them since all they want to do is make a living creating something we all love... kitten 9600 gems for 30 mount skins... THIRTY!! get your act together because Nothing in life is free. These are optional and if you want them, you'll have to gamble for it.

    Anet devs. Nice work on the skins, tho the coloration might be a bit too horrible xD. But i bought a few adopt licenses and got a nice jackal one. I like it, keep this up ^^

  • Fallesafe.5932Fallesafe.5932 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    The RNG mount skins that everybody is freaking out about are a perfect example of my earlier point (i.e. that the game is not rewarding, and that skins don't matter). I decided to just go ahead and get all the mount-skins yesterday, because, why not? So the first one I got was the "Reforged Warhound." But I was disappointed to see that it runs like it has arthritic hips, and makes a top of the line gaming-machine freeze and hitch when it teleports... Not so impressive. But, SURELY, the other 30 mounts are pretty cool. right? So I settled on the flaming raptor, the frosty rabbit, the light-up skimmer, and the flaming griffon. And, in the end... it was a gigantic basket of, "WHO THE kitten CARES?"

    -The first problem, is that getting these mounts has no connection to actually playing the game.
    -The second problem is that these mounts add nothing but visual-clutter to what you already had to begin with
    -The third problem is that they literally CAUSE lag.

    So, I ran past the bank, and saw everyone clustered in a group... showing off their new lag-machines to the "have nots." And it was literally embarrassing. This, in a nutshell, is the entire game right now... people working for nothing (e.g. skins), in order to show off their nothing to strangers who don't care.

  • I havent seen a more unrewarding game than guild wars 2. Killed a bear? Green loot, killed a general of an elder dragon? Green stuff,you killed Mordremoth? Green stuff. you killed a raid boss? here have an exotic worth 4g

  • Frostfang.5109Frostfang.5109 Member ✭✭✭

    If they keep up with these really expensive sells in TP they gotta make it possible to farm Gold more effectivley or they make a difference between time-spending ppl (who wont be able to keep up) and wallet cashers. And that is BAD.

  • troops.8276troops.8276 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dukotje.4382 said:
    I love how everyone panics so much about mounts, when in fact there are more BL skins, Glider skins you'd be getting for a much more expensive way if you want to collect them all. just because they released them all at ones doens't mean they are more expensive then other skin like things from the BLTP.

    i think anet did a fine job making OPTIONAL skins for the fashion wars and yes, the game is 5 years old, wil probably not sell as much as it did at launch, and yet they have the heart to keep developing and creating stories and expansions and every other feature and bug that is currently in game. Have some decency for them since all they want to do is make a living creating something we all love... kitten 9600 gems for 30 mount skins... THIRTY!! get your act together because Nothing in life is free. These are optional and if you want them, you'll have to gamble for it.

    Anet devs. Nice work on the skins, tho the coloration might be a bit too horrible xD. But i bought a few adopt licenses and got a nice jackal one. I like it, keep this up ^^

    I literally laughed out loud. Thanks for that 😂

  • Oldirtbeard.9834Oldirtbeard.9834 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Some times we get good quest lines like Reforged Calagbold and the Griffin quest.

    “The only watchmaker is the blind forces of physics.”
    ― Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion

  • Zenaide.3046Zenaide.3046 Member ✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    So much entitlement. It's only been A DAY.

    They could have trickled the skins as "single buy" - starting with the simple ones that are just "more dyes" and every few weeks releasing slighly more complex ones. Many would buy the "simple" skins if that was all there was, and then 4 weeks later a set of more "complex" ones and one and on etc... People would have paid 400 for many skins over time, probably bought a dozen or more.

    They chose to make them all available at once which I think is cool. More diversity.

    But once they did that, they could either make the super fancy skins very expensive (people would complain there too, yes?) or try something else. I think Arenanet tried to think of a mechanism that would feed mount skins in the system slowly, give people something to look forward to over a bit of time, so as to not have the same mount for everyone at the same time. They came up with this one. Giving people things to look forward to and grow over time, as people are always complaining there's not enough new skins etc.

    I'd say give it time. Right now they are all on tickets but I suspect perhaps the plan is to have the option to buy single mount skin, perhaps as time specials.

    "If I can't get exactly the skin I want right now I will quit the game" - seriously? But you would have paid 400 for the 4 dye "simple" skin if that is all they had released. But somehow just knowing there's other skins you might not get makes you fume? How vicious everyone is over skins when mounts are so great? This is "fear of missing out" gone mad.

    Just wait, there will be more ways to get them eventually, I am sure!

    Disclaimer: I am not a gambler and I am not a completist so I can resist many of the sink mechanics in games, like mini collections etc.

    I love this game and I really respect that they try to get their income without selling distinct in-game advantage. So I now and then buy gems and spend them. Roughly twice a year, in a way I do it instead of "subscription" to keep the machine running. It's still cheap comparing to all the steam games I would buy if I didnt remember I am so hooked on GW2 I don't play them. GW2 remains a cheap gaming hobby.

    I maxed out on useful things and I don't fancy wing skins (they make it harder to be precise in flight, usually) or outfits as I like to mix and match for originality, but I have bought some outfits, skins, and I even bought keys once or twice. I bought 2 mounts. Got the simple ones but not upset, i can dyes to match my characters and that is already fun. Though I might wait until I have the griffin to get more than a couple.

  • NeroBoron.7285NeroBoron.7285 Member ✭✭✭

    Playing since headstart, still waiting for a precursor drop 😅

    Loot at all haven't been really rewarding for me.
    I know people with more then 8 precursor drops for example or people who got 3 touch of madness drops during Halloween.
    Would like if they increase the chance of really good drops with play time and then reset that chance when you get one.

  • I seriously do not see an issue with the state they implemented. They have a good way to introduce even more mount skins to the roster and for more mounts in the future. It can clearly be build upon and the price is fine. People need to seriously remind themselves that they can also convert in-game gold into gems. and 400 isn't an outlandish goal.. This even gives people who don't want to pay for these skins with real money a decent farm long term goal. AND on top of all that, they ensured you will not get duplicate skins, This is RNG and lootboxing done right. and Anet should honestly be thanked for how this was done. If anet didnt do the RNG thing they likely would've made the costs on the mounts different. you think the for example, electric raptor, celestial jackal and the starbound griffon would cost 400 gems or less you gotta be kidding yourself.

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