Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged] - Page 40 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Mount Adoption Feedback Thread [merged]

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  • Oglaf.1074Oglaf.1074 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @wingedsoul.9406 said:
    TLDR: New mount Skins with different dye channels for 400 Gems are super ok. If you want all Legendary Mount Skins, you will have to pay much more (as always).

    Of course they're "super ok".

    The problem is that you don't buy them for 400 Gems, now do you? No, you spend 400 Gems to gamble for them.

    That is the issue here. Nobody would have an issue with these skins if you could outright purchase them.

    Please Anet give us a hide Chest Armour-option. Tattoo-clad Norns everywhere beg of you.

  • Umut.5471Umut.5471 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    I only need flame griffon since I don't use any other mounts. I would pay 2000 gems directly, but 400 gems for a random skin for a random mount is expensive imo.
    What should I do with the skins I don't want and I will never use? I'm ok with guaranteed unlocks for high cost. But RNG boxes aren't ok.

  • Azuset.5804Azuset.5804 Member
    edited November 9, 2017

    _Loot boxes are an anti-consumer mechanic. Its a predatory system that preys on peoples psychological weaknesses. The game is already setup to feed our chemical dopamine responses as it is. _

    For those of you unaware of gaming addiction this video does a good job introducing you to how it works. Here is an article with many sources and videos to get you going on understanding gaming addiction.

    And the mass population thinks drugs are bad, yesh. I can't wait until everyone wakes up from this madness when they realize all the psychological/chemical damage publishers and game developers are consciously causing with there video games. This kitten didn't happen by accident.

    At that point it BLOWS my mind how many people buy micro-transactions in the first place. We are truly a sick society. It's not JUST your fault for preying on people Anet but be a responsible force for good in this world as you have millions of people's lives to influence.

    Tell me one gamer aka consumer that has asked for loot boxes to be put into a game. Who asked to be able to maybe buy something they like? Pouring money into digital products is insane in the first place. There is zero equity in 99% of digital products.

    Implementing this randomized skin system into the game really lets gamers know what you think of them. We are just **"whales" and "dolphins" **to you.

    We already pay premium prices for the expansions and people like me who bought into the game at launched payed for the base game and a subscription. I miss subscriptionl fees. Companies make more money on feeding off of peoples chemistry with these "F2P" models. Truth be told GW2 is not worth playing on the F2P model. You still need inventory space and you would miss out on the expansions.

    **Remove this randomized purchasing mechanic from the game for good. **

    I'm really glad Jim made this video about GW2 just check it out.

  • GreyWolf.8670GreyWolf.8670 Member ✭✭✭

    @pah.4931 said:

    @GreyWolf.8670 said:

    @Dinks.2478 said:
    And those of us who actually like to play the game as just sitting here wondering when we'll get good in game rewards.

    Judging by this move? When you pay cash for them. :/

    200 gems to get Teq to drop the purple chest... any takers?

    OR pretend that gems are sold by Argos the Gem Trader and he takes your in-game gotten gold for gems. And then you can trade your Gems with Cashopia the Wicked for a magical orb that unpredictably (magic isn't an exact science) gives your a mount a new look.

    BOOM. You can actually play the game and get good in game rewards...

    Can't you see how it's all an illusion?????

    Yeah, except for that pesky "currency exchange" where you can bypass all the hard work by buying gems from someone else that paid real money for them.

  • Luna.6807Luna.6807 Member ✭✭

    I'm very disappointed with the RNG lootbox system for the mount skins. I spent my last 400 gems on one of the boxes only to get a bland bunny skin - a mount that I rarely use. I mainly play wvw so gold is already low given that WvW is not profitable at all against those who farm day in and day out. Thus, when I go farm for something, it's something that I really want. You might ask why I don't just spend real money to get gems? Because GW2 seems to forget that different countries have different currencies. Yes, GW2, when I have to pay dollars or euros for gems I have to pay 10-15 times my currency value because I do not get paid in the super currency. Yes, that's not your problem, but I'd really like you to take that into consideration. Moreover, even if I was to farm for gold to buy all 30 skins - I would have to get around 2.7k gold - that's almost the price of a legendary on the trade post!!! That's a crazy price. I will not gamble the little gold I have on random skins. I don't find gambling thrilling or rewarding in any way! And I think you should also consider adding a gambling addition warning and helpline to your profit endeavors of this nature.

  • pah.4931pah.4931 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @GreyWolf.8670 said:

    @pah.4931 said:

    @GreyWolf.8670 said:

    @Dinks.2478 said:
    And those of us who actually like to play the game as just sitting here wondering when we'll get good in game rewards.

    Judging by this move? When you pay cash for them. :/

    200 gems to get Teq to drop the purple chest... any takers?

    OR pretend that gems are sold by Argos the Gem Trader and he takes your in-game gotten gold for gems. And then you can trade your Gems with Cashopia the Wicked for a magical orb that unpredictably (magic isn't an exact science) gives your a mount a new look.

    BOOM. You can actually play the game and get good in game rewards...

    Can't you see how it's all an illusion?????

    Yeah, except for that pesky "currency exchange" where you can bypass all the hard work by buying gems from someone else that paid real money for them.

    So? The skins don't make you better or awesomer. Who cares if someone else bypasses the fun? Does that stop you from having fun?

  • @Andryej.4609 said:
    Oh, and by the way - I was under the impression, that when I go to the shelter to adopt an animal I get to choose which one exactly I want to adopt? It's not like: 'Hi, I wanted some cute little kitten for my little sister...', 'Well, sir, you're in luck. Here, have Brutus, the traumatized guard dog.' Yeaaaaaaaah, right...

    If you insist on calling it "adoption", then at least make it look like one.

    EDIT: Plus, you could always make it work like miniature claim tickets, that one "slip" unlocks you one basic skin of your choice, and two or three allows to pick one of the "shiny" ones.

    Literally snorted at "Brutus the traumatized guard dog." Sorry, had to share.

    Greck Howlbane - Firebrand
    Sorrow's Furnace For Life

  • I've been rewarded in all game modes so far. PvE, got several precursors from the mystic toilet, got rare infusions, rare drops. Got a lot of fun in several metas and bosses. And I have a terrible addiction for gathering. I spend probably 70% of my gaming time gathering stuff. In PvP, got some cool fights ( and also very frustrating ones), rare dyes when we were able to craft them, ascended stuff. In WvW, amazing fights, memorable 1vX, 2 precursors drops, and also but rarely ascended drops. And the best experience I had in guilds were with wvw small group guilds.
    I can't complain really.
    The game is farting gold, so even if you don't have rare drops, you can still buy or craft them. It's still a lot better than farm 100000000 times this dungeon/raid and never get your kitten item.

  • Tsakhi.8124Tsakhi.8124 Member ✭✭✭

    @Fallesafe.5932 said:

    @feroxeu.7416 said:
    this is a carebear game. Anyone who says they don't feel rewarded are just numb due to the amount of rewards they recieve. Facts: You get rewarded for losing. You get rewarded for winning. You get rewarded for logging in.

    And it's all garbage. I wish I had a giant snow-shovel to throw it all into the delete-incinerator at the same time. This game absolutely showers you with trash while offering you nothing of any real value. If came up to you every day, and gave you a milk-crate full of ribbons, and colored drinking straws, and chewing gum, and number 2 pencils how long would it take before you started getting annoyed?

    laughs In my case, I'd start making things from those items MacGyver style. Then again, you're looking at someone that is delighted to get leaves as presents. Heh.

    Want some pancakes?

  • Unpopular opinion, but I would pay 800 gems to choose a skin from the mount adoption license and I would pay 2000 gems for the "legendary" mount I if I liked it. IMO starbound is as legend as it would be, it would be more popular than the current 2000 gem warforged skin.

  • I can't go into LA with out seeing the new mount skins and being frustrated. Some are really good skins and I want them but I wont buy RNG loot boxes to get the skin I want. I wont be playing till this is fixed.

  • @katz.8376 said:
    i think Anet saw the huge sales of the spooky pack and their eyes lit up with dollar signs and they heard KACHING!!! and went overboard with the cash grab.

    This is exactly what I thought, word for word. I knew mounts were going to be monetized, and I was pretty much fine with it at the time because I figured they'd offer them the same way they do gliders. However, once I read the whole description of this Black Lion Stables thing and the method being used with adoption tickets, any sort of excitement about mount skins completely turned to disappointment. :/ I can't think of a worse way to offer new mount skins to players than yet another loot box style RNG form of nonsense. And trying to get people to panic-purchase the bundle by offering it for the "low low price" of $120 for only one week? No thanks.

    Let's not forget, though, that there is a mount that you can buy individually: the Reforged Warhound. The catch for being able to buy this one direct? Two... THOUSAND... gems. :# Ouch, I don't think we've ever even had a stand alone glider priced that high.

    I'm not gonna get into debating whether or not the adoption tickets are considered gambling because I think that's beside the point. The questions we should be asking is: Is this acceptable practice? Have they gone too far? Where do we draw the line in all this? And perhaps most importantly, what can be done to fix this and avoid future widespread backlash of this degree?

  • It would be nice to actually see something like this as a drop in game. It gives the people that have finished the game & expansions something fun to do. It would be really nice if Anet could divide (future?) contracts into a raptor, springer, gryphon etc. contract, so people would have more chance of a skin drop that they like, instead of it being so random.

  • It's sad to see all of these people wishing for Anet and GW2 to fall. Why is there so much hatred in people's hearts nowadays? I personally wouldn't mind getting any of the mount skins, especially because of no duplicates and equal chance of getting them. It takes a lot of work to make sure these skins work/aren't buggy/are textured correctly and 400 gems for what would probably cost at least 1000 with some of them is a great deal. I don't care if it's random. I'm just happy to get a skin in general since I can probably find a dye combo that looks great on it.

  • Not really no. Its one of the biggest and longest running complaints on here I've noticed. They've gotten "better" at putting things in the game that feel rewarding when getting them. For instance, I rather enjoyed getting the griffon as I liked revisiting maps and having to creatively explore them to find and get the things I needed. Perhaps it felt more rewarding doing it all solo, so the fights and such were a bit more meaningful, and being a gw1 player the lore was also a bit of a reward, but they are still lacking overall on in game rewards. Map completion still feels lackluster and some of the weapon collection stuff either feels under tuned or over tuned at times. Also, pretty sure the loot chances for the needed exotics in the unidentified gear is still broken so I'm sitting on tons of unidentified bags until that gets fixed.

    I dunno...it seems like they are trying, but still missing the mark somewhat. Can't suggest a way forward on this but I do know they need to make more things available as rewards for doing more on the maps to encourage replayability.

    Greck Howlbane - Firebrand
    Sorrow's Furnace For Life

  • I'm okay with the current price, but RNG is too severe for a B2P title even though it's not a true RNG because of no dupes etc. The possibility to choose mount type looks like a nice compromise decision for both the community and ANet. Also it would be awesome to get a bunch of cool racial (or not) mount skins with some kind of adventure, like the one we get when we go for Mawdrey. When you really adopt a little cub, raise, feed and train it etc. And yes, I know it cannot be done today and needs a lot of work, but it could fill the new maps with content and give us the adventure we need to go back there again and again. Please, do it guys <3

  • Rashagar.8349Rashagar.8349 Member ✭✭✭

    @Hephaustus.8547 said:
    I cannot believe how tonedeaf this action is. PoF in full swing, new players and old returning ones coming in droves, distaste and anger towards lootbox MT systems in games at an all time high... And you all choose NOW to attempt something like this? What planet does Anet live on? Is the whole show run by lizard people? Or maybe politicians?

    Well, go on then. Do your damage control, appease the masses. Then go ahead and do the thing; try it again in a more insidious and predatory way. I'm sure we won't notice. I am sure we won't get pissed. It'll all work out. You'll get your money and we'll all be too stupid to realize you are duping us. There's is no way it'll backfire AGAIN. Test the waters until the whole thing drowns. All will be well.

    Here is some feedback: Don't do it.

    See the thing is, tonedeaf is exactly how I feel the community's reaction to it is too.

    Like, you can think it's too expensive. That's fair enough. Everyone has different ideas about what "too expensive" is for them and there's no wrong answer.
    You can say you'd prefer to only buy the thing you want (most likely for a higher price) instead of it being randomised. That's fair enough. It's a preference, and it's a preference that probably should be catered for (though from the sounds of it when it is being catered for there are a lot of people here who won't be happy with how it'll be implemented, those expecting to spend 400 gems on the shiniest of shinies for example).

    But things like trying to justify that preference by calling the alternative predatory behaviour and all that just seems to show a fundamental lack of understanding of what makes the other instances of predatory game behaviour actually deserve the label. And I just wish people would be smarter about throwing those words around, because when it's applied in the wrong instances (like this one) it detracts from the severity of the actual instances of predatory behaviour. And then I start wondering why people are deliberately misusing the label and what they're trying to gain by manipulating current gamer trends to their own ends, and it's not a happy line of thinking.

  • I've been playing GW2 since launch and I've happily spent a lot of money on the gem store in all those years. Being able to buy shiny things for (IMO) reasonable amounts of currency and thereby supporting the game that I love playing always felt good.

    For the first time I have a bad feeling about this. The RNG mount adoption gamble and the 2000 gem single mount skin both feel really bad.

    I never liked the black lion chest system and it worries me that not only are there more and more account bound exclusive items in those chests that can only be acquire by gambling, but now it seems that the RNG shenanigans are about to take over the rest of the gem store as well.

    I sincerely hope this will be remedied in some way, because if this is the future of the game, then I don't know if I want to be part of it anymore. And even just typing that makes me one incredibly sad quaggan :(

    PS.: I would happily pay 400 for a single mount skin of my choice. But the random system is unacceptable for me. Also 2000 for one single skin is insane.

  • GreyWolf.8670GreyWolf.8670 Member ✭✭✭

    @pah.4931 said:

    @GreyWolf.8670 said:

    @pah.4931 said:

    @GreyWolf.8670 said:

    @Dinks.2478 said:
    And those of us who actually like to play the game as just sitting here wondering when we'll get good in game rewards.

    Judging by this move? When you pay cash for them. :/

    200 gems to get Teq to drop the purple chest... any takers?

    OR pretend that gems are sold by Argos the Gem Trader and he takes your in-game gotten gold for gems. And then you can trade your Gems with Cashopia the Wicked for a magical orb that unpredictably (magic isn't an exact science) gives your a mount a new look.

    BOOM. You can actually play the game and get good in game rewards...

    Can't you see how it's all an illusion?????

    Yeah, except for that pesky "currency exchange" where you can bypass all the hard work by buying gems from someone else that paid real money for them.

    So? The skins don't make you better or awesomer. Who cares if someone else bypasses the fun? Does that stop you from having fun?

    I think you're intentionally evading the point, so I'm done discussing this with you. :/

  • I don't want to be critical but I likely will not buy a mount skin. Right now it feels like the game is moving towards being a little more engaging VLT(video lottery terminal). I worry about recovering gamblers or those that may have susceptibility to gambling.

    I hope that the end note that those who work at Anet get is "We Love your games" please let those of us who buy things have a little more choice when you do offer things for sale.

    Thank you for taking the time to listen to players, regardless of the outcomes that are likely driven by the need for a business to produce profit.

  • Yeah, seriously, why not have a new raptor skin be a dye channel upgrade that is earnable from winning a small raptor race tournament in the game? I'd be down for something like that. Or a bunny hop event race of who can reach the top of a spire fastest have the reward of a new skin with additional dye channels. Not talking big changes, just literally more channels. Or a chance at getting a gold, silver or bronze version of the mounts with respective adornments around their necks. This way its something that people can try to win in game doing an event and it gets people on the maps. I dunno, its an idea I was just kicking around but its something that both rewards players in game with something and makes them more likely to not cut and run.

    Quests for cooler skins could be more drawn out, and even collection based if you really want that. Maybe quests that take you back to areas in core maps that are empty. Timed races across Tyria. SOMETHING. Just jeex Anet...why am I doing your job for you here. You mean to tell me no one thought of any of this?

    Greck Howlbane - Firebrand
    Sorrow's Furnace For Life

  • Binnsey.1690Binnsey.1690 Member
    edited November 9, 2017

    I don't appreciate loot box gambling in guild wars 2 (random chance of the mount including the random chance of a skin you want) I feel like the trading post has taken a rather dark turn on the release of the mount adoption Black Lion Stables Mount Skins.

    I feel like the video made by Jim Sterling strongly puts forward how myself and many of my friends are feeling at the moment.

    It's gambling don't try to sugar coat it. It's disgusting that you've brought this into our family-friendly adventure world and it's quite sickening to be completely honest.
    Somehow you've managed to turn a cosmetics shop into a slot machine which players are then praying to get the skins they want for the mount they want a skin for.

  • STIHL.2489STIHL.2489 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    Some games are built from the ground up to be ideally suited for players that enjoy grinding out more power and in fact enjoy hunting down every minuscule incremental bit of power creep they can find, and don't care if they look like exactly like everyone else, because a lot of times in those games BiS gear all looks the same, and its graphic is a sign of its status. However, people that enjoy that kind grind will not find a game like GW2 fun, as GW2 was built from the ground up to be a game that offered little in the way of raw character power hidden behind a grind or skill gate,. And while 2 expansions later and not raise in level cap should have been indicative that this was not going to be "that" kind of game , instead of raw power and bigger numbers to keep players occupied, Anet built their whole 'grind system' around graphics & aesthetics, that is why there are pointless skins and cosmetics in the store and not +1 Damage tokens and some such.

    So if you came here for an endless power grind, you're gonna have a bad time.

    There are two kinds of Gamers, Salty, and Extra Salty.
    Ego is the Anesthesia that dullens the pain of Stupidity.

  • Honestly, not really, and it’s made me look at other games. It feels like I now have to play the game on ANET’s time rather than mine with how many things have daily rewards limits, or are tied to a timer. And if they aren’t, I need to pray to the RNG gods I get it via drop, otherwise, save gold and buy it on the TP for a price that’ll probably leave me broke and having to save up for again.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    Wait. Hold on.

    Isn't this slightly better than the black lion chest? I mean yes, you can gamble for a skin you want and -not- get it, but it then removes that option from the pool. Eventually you will have larger and larger chances to get what you want. If you liked black lion chests for super rare/rare weapon skins, this is actually slightly better than that.

    I'm not saying it still doesnt -reek- of lootbox, but the lootboxes that contained rare skins didnt progressively have better rates the more gems you spent.

    Lets say they put these in the black lion chest as rare drops, as was mentioned before. I don't think there would be even a fraction of the backlash that I'm seeing here if they did. There was some backlash when the hydra skin was introduced, because it was tied to account, but that only really hurts the people who dont buy the keys in the first place.

    Iiiiiii think I'm on the fence about this. It would be one thing if we could get dupes, but I'm going to have to weigh the "you will always get something you dont have" side of it. Because that way you are guaranteed what you want at some point, instead of potentially spending and spending and never getting what you want.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • Fallesafe.5932Fallesafe.5932 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tsakhi.8124 said:

    @Fallesafe.5932 said:

    @feroxeu.7416 said:
    this is a carebear game. Anyone who says they don't feel rewarded are just numb due to the amount of rewards they recieve. Facts: You get rewarded for losing. You get rewarded for winning. You get rewarded for logging in.

    And it's all garbage. I wish I had a giant snow-shovel to throw it all into the delete-incinerator at the same time. This game absolutely showers you with trash while offering you nothing of any real value. If came up to you every day, and gave you a milk-crate full of ribbons, and colored drinking straws, and chewing gum, and number 2 pencils how long would it take before you started getting annoyed?

    laughs In my case, I'd start making things from those items MacGyver style. Then again, you're looking at someone that is delighted to get leaves as presents. Heh.

    lol, that's an interesting answer. Teach me your ways. ;)

  • Myhr.9108Myhr.9108 Member ✭✭✭

    @Luna.6807 said:
    I'm very disappointed with the RNG lootbox system for the mount skins. I spent my last 400 gems on one of the boxes only to get a bland bunny skin - a mount that I rarely use. I mainly play wvw so gold is already low given that WvW is not profitable at all against those who farm day in and day out. Thus, when I go farm for something, it's something that I really want. You might ask why I don't just spend real money to get gems? Because GW2 seems to forget that different countries have different currencies. Yes, GW2, when I have to pay dollars or euros for gems I have to pay 10-15 times my currency value because I do not get paid in the super currency. Yes, that's not your problem, but I'd really like you to take that into consideration. Moreover, even if I was to farm for gold to buy all 30 skins - I would have to get around 2.7k gold - that's almost the price of a legendary on the trade post!!! That's a crazy price. I will not gamble the little gold I have on random skins. I don't find gambling thrilling or rewarding in any way! And I think you should also consider adding a gambling addition warning and helpline to your profit endeavors of this nature.

    Ok, I don't care if I get some hate for this but...If you don't like something in the gem store, DON'T BUY IT. Before anyone jump toward the sky, no, I don't think RNG lootboxes for mount skins is reasonable, it makes the price for a single skin very unclear, and it indeed predates on some psychological weaknesses...like many frequent commercial practices, if I may add. There is only one real answer : DO NOT BUY IT.

    I've lost the count of people saying "ho, yeah, it's atrocious, I had 400-800 gems laying there so I bought one-two licenses to test, didn't get what I wanted, and now I'm unhappy." Uuuuuuuuurgh, what? I'm sorry, but if I put a random green on the TP for 10.000 gold and someone buys it, it's not my fault. Of course, in the mount adoption licences case, it's a little more complex, because it does predate on curiosity, impatience, lack of self-control, and straight lack of reflection...

    I'm sorry, but if you bought one-two licenses to "test", all you can complain about is being manipulated (which many people do, to be fair), but I'm afraid it's a weak weak complain, as NOTHING about those lootboxes was convoluted. People just feel entitled to have more than the default skins and are pissed off when they're too weak to resist some really obvious attempt at manipulating them. Shared responsability at its worse, it's a loose-loose situation.

    Again, I'm not saying those lootboxes are ok, but I really wish people had more control over themselves, it would make the whole argument against random lootboxes much much stronger than it is now.

  • There is a disturbing lack of qualifiers regarding the word "rewarding".

    I would say, for example, there is a ton to "pursue" in this game, but maybe to someone who is achievement hunting, those little rewards and AP are very small increments towards feeling "rewarded".

    Maybe you want to say, "Do you feel as though there are enough loot rewards in the game as it exists today?" or something to that effect concerning actual drops.

    Gotta be specific, yo.

    Potential requires action in order to be realized.

  • @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:
    Wait. Hold on.

    Isn't this slightly better than the black lion chest? I mean yes, you can gamble for a skin you want and -not- get it, but it then removes that option from the pool. Eventually you will have larger and larger chances to get what you want. If you liked black lion chests for super rare/rare weapon skins, this is actually slightly better than that.

    I'm not saying it still doesnt -reek- of lootbox, but the lootboxes that contained rare skins didnt progressively have better rates the more gems you spent.

    Lets say they put these in the black lion chest as rare drops, as was mentioned before. I don't think there would be even a fraction of the backlash that I'm seeing here if they did. There was some backlash when the hydra skin was introduced, because it was tied to account, but that only really hurts the people who dont buy the keys in the first place.

    Iiiiiii think I'm on the fence about this. It would be one thing if we could get dupes, but I'm going to have to weigh the "you will always get something you dont have" side of it. Because that way you are guaranteed what you want at some point, instead of potentially spending and spending and never getting what you want.

    I'm already against the RNG aspect of black lion chests, so it won't change anything or make the idea of 'getting something' better. In the end it's still the aspect of value. If you get something you value as worthless, you basically got nothing. The idea of me spending money, but risking to get nothing in return makes it a gamble I do not want to play. I've never spend a single coin on black lion chests either and this will be just the same :/

  • Drew.1865Drew.1865 Member ✭✭✭

    When getting leather to craft requires traveling to a specific living world zone and spamming a key for an hour and you have to click containers two to three times to see loot that most of the time is trash how could the player feel rewarded for playing?

  • Okay so my two cents. As a long time mmo player RNG for novelty things isn't a big deal to me. Done right, it is rewarding even if you get frustrated along the way and the setup is nice because unlike some instances in other games - at least here I'm guaranteed something i don't have and I'm not going to get doubles. So thats a win in my book.

    However I really feel like this was poorly done. So much should have been thought about in the system like whether or not you have all the mounts unlocked and player mount preference. I for one hadn't bothered with the Griffin (250 gold ouch) but now i have four skins for it meaning i spent 20$ and got nothing I could use. Thats a big problem.

    So please please please, implement being able to pick the mount you're rolling the skin for. I.E. a simple ‘drop box’ menu to select one of the mounts and then RNG from that pool of skins. This improves the odds that the player will get something they like and can actually use while still ensuring they may still have to buy multiple chances. You get the money and the player is moderately happy.

    The other issue is account bound. Of those 4 griffin skins, only one or two I really like enough to want to use. I also got several jackal skins that my friends and guildmates wanted more than i did. Were these not account bound I could have given them the ones they really liked and then have been all the more driven to buy even more since any i got that i didn't like could be given or traded off. Increasing the value of my purchase as a customer and allowing for there to be a 'second market' in the Trading post, just like with the dyes and minis. Though i understand that this option does lose you some sales as i wouldn't feel ‘forced’ to buy every single one but to be fair, forcing everyone to try buying them all seems to be why everyone is so upset here and it is an awful business practice anyway.

    Alternatively! Adding a second type of adoption where at a higher cost I could select the exact skin I wanted. Say, instead of 400 gems, I pay at least three times the sum so 1200 to 1600 gems. To me that seems fair and even 2000 would be acceptable as 15$+ for a novelty mount in other mmos is pretty normal and thats not including the cost of paying a sub like in WoW.

    All in all though, I really like the skins - even those considered ‘recolors’ and 5$ each is pretty cheap in my opinion but not getting to choose even what mount it is for is pretty upsetting.

  • Vincent Xavier Snow.5869Vincent Xavier Snow.5869 Member ✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    First of all, I'm a veteran player and I've been around since beta, and despite my previous gemstore purchases I refuse to support gambling with real money.

    I was excited for mount skins and ready to drop gems on them, but I will not spend money on gem store items I don't want (i.e. all the skins I would get before getting the ones I do want).

    For those of you justifying this RNG lootbox practice in GW2 by saying that BLCs were already in place since launch, I see two major problems with your argument:

    1. Most of the skins obtained from BLCs are selectable and tradeable. Furthermore I can obtain claim tickets (albeit slowly) without the need to buy keys. The exclusive account-bound skins offered by BLCs are few and far between, and are skins for armor, weapons, gliders... But unlike mount skins, if I want to put anything other than the default armor or weapons skins on something there are hundreds of non-gemstore options to choose from. If I want a glider skin I can just buy one I want on the gemstore for ~400 gems. If I want something other than the default mount skins, I'll have to gamble for them, as we don't have any of the same options compared to weapons, armor, and gliders.
    2. BLCs have always been a bit scummy, so saying that their existence justifies something worse is a pretty terrible argument. By that logic, irl nuclear bombs aren't a big deal because fireworks can also hurt people by exploding and we already use those all the time. Obvious exaggeration is obvious, but the point stands.

    I've supported GW2 from the beginning, in no small part because of the principles it was founded on - breaking the MMO mold, providing a more player/consumer-friendly option in the market... but if cash shop gambling is the sort of thing we can expect from Anet going forwards, then players like myself will leave.

    Maybe you'll be fine financially by relying only on the whales, but your average playerbase is going to take a serious hit and I won't feel even a little sorry for you.

  • mount adoption license 250-300 gems, with purchase in bulk
    individual mounts on sale 400 gems.

    new mount skins get added to the same adoption license pool.

    Appeal to collectors through discounted prices, appeal to other players getting the one mount skin they want. everyone wins.

  • Jordan.5930Jordan.5930 Member ✭✭✭

    @feroxeu.7416 said:
    this is a carebear game. Anyone who says they don't feel rewarded are just numb due to the amount of rewards they recieve. Facts: You get rewarded for losing. You get rewarded for winning. You get rewarded for logging in.

    @FrigginPaco.4178 said:
    There is a disturbing lack of qualifiers regarding the word "rewarding".

    I would say, for example, there is a ton to "pursue" in this game, but maybe to someone who is achievement hunting, those little rewards and AP are very small increments towards feeling "rewarded".

    Maybe you want to say, "Do you feel as though there are enough loot rewards in the game as it exists today?" or something to that effect concerning actual drops.

    Gotta be specific, yo.

    Yes for some people it's in-game loot rewards. But for others maybe titles make the game rewarding, maybe it's the satisfaction of 100% map completion, maybe it's winning a PvP match or just having enough fun mechanics to play with your friends. I intentionally left it opened ended so people could more freely express their thoughts.

  • @Senecxys.9437 said:
    Okay so my two cents. As a long time mmo player RNG for novelty things isn't a big deal to me. Done right, it is rewarding even if you get frustrated along the way and the setup is nice because unlike some instances in other games - at least here I'm guaranteed something i don't have and I'm not going to get doubles. So thats a win in my book.

    However I really feel like this was poorly done. So much should have been thought about in the system like whether or not you have all the mounts unlocked and player mount preference. I for one hadn't bothered with the Griffin (250 gold ouch) but now i have four skins for it meaning i spent 20$ and got nothing I could use. Thats a big problem.

    So please please please, implement being able to pick the mount you're rolling the skin for. I.E. a simple ‘drop box’ menu to select one of the mounts and then RNG from that pool of skins. This improves the odds that the player will get something they like and can actually use while still ensuring they may still have to buy multiple chances. You get the money and the player is moderately happy.

    The other issue is account bound. Of those 4 griffin skins, only one or two I really like enough to want to use. I also got several jackal skins that my friends and guildmates wanted more than i did. Were these not account bound I could have given them the ones they really liked and then have been all the more driven to buy even more since any i got that i didn't like could be given or traded off. Increasing the value of my purchase as a customer and allowing for there to be a 'second market' in the Trading post, just like with the dyes and minis. Though i understand that this option does lose you some sales as i wouldn't feel ‘forced’ to buy every single one but to be fair, forcing everyone to try buying them all seems to be why everyone is so upset here and it is an awful business practice anyway.

    Alternatively! Adding a second type of adoption where at a higher cost I could select the exact skin I wanted. Say, instead of 400 gems, I pay at least three times the sum so 1200 to 1600 gems. To me that seems fair and even 2000 would be acceptable as 15$+ for a novelty mount in other mmos is pretty normal and thats not including the cost of paying a sub like in WoW.

    All in all though, I really like the skins - even those considered ‘recolors’ and 5$ each is pretty cheap in my opinion but not getting to choose even what mount it is for is pretty upsetting.

    It should be 600-800 for specific skins. The RNG should be left for those who want something new or for a gift, not a gamble for the one you want at a lower price.

  • notebene.3190notebene.3190 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I can't answer this, because my idea of rewarding is most likely not your idea of rewarding. If it's about getting D3-style loot drops, then I can't answer that, as that is not what is rewarding to me. To me, it's about 'am i enjoying my time with the game'. If it's that, then I would pick 'most of the time'. If it's the loot thing, I don't even know how to vote on that in D3 itself, much less a game that is not D3, as I don't understand how others see that as objectively rewarding.

    I had a friend or two I was hoping would come play GW2 with me, maybe 3-4 months after release, and one of them wouldn't play it because there weren't enough shiny things dropping, like in D3. Needless to say, no one wanted to play this with me, which has been quite a bummer for me, but oh well. It resonated with me. :)

    In the event I don't get a chance, thank you all for the company and help when I needed it from time to time.

  • takatsu.9416takatsu.9416 Member ✭✭✭

    Mount skins like outfits, backpacks and gliders, beautiful fashion items should be kept the same, where we can buy what we like. There was no reason to make this a randomized lootbox scenario. BLC and other small things is a different story. These skins are pretty major visible effects on our character. This is definitely an unfair exploit. 700 gems for basic, 1000 gems sounds about right for most nice mounts skins, and maybe a 2000 for the starbound griffon, or the reforged warhound is an okay stretch. But randomizing it is so appalling and placing the value of starbound griffon equal to some other basic skins just doesn't make sense either. It also seems there are skins that are just some recoloring simply made for this lootbox concept, as common drops, when they really aren't that unique or necessary. Please never do these kind of things. I know it might work as players are forced to buy many many adoption licenses to get which skins they want but it's really an exploitative business practice and doesn't fit in your overall history so far, culture and community.

  • Grim West.3194Grim West.3194 Member ✭✭✭

    GW2 has a ton of things to do. Even though they screwed up WvW, they've got so many other things to distract me that I still play this game a lot.

    I generally don't spend that much in the gem shop. And not a sucker for loot boxes, so that stuff doesn't bother me much.

    So I find the game rewarding and fun. It's the best MMO out there atm imo.

  • Jordan.5930Jordan.5930 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 9, 2017

    @notebene.3190 said:
    I can't answer this, because my idea of rewarding is most likely not your idea of rewarding. If it's about getting D3-style loot drops, then I can't answer that, as that is not what is rewarding to me. To me, it's about 'am i enjoying my time with the game'. If it's that, then I would pick 'most of the time'. If it's the loot thing, I don't even know how to vote on that in D3 itself, much less a game that is not D3, as I don't understand how others see that as objectively rewarding.

    I had a friend or two I was hoping would come play GW2 with me, maybe 3-4 months after release, and one of them wouldn't play it because there weren't enough shiny things dropping, like in D3. Needless to say, no one wanted to play this with me, which has been quite a bummer for me, but oh well. It resonated with me. :)

    @Jordan.5930 said:

    @feroxeu.7416 said:
    this is a carebear game. Anyone who says they don't feel rewarded are just numb due to the amount of rewards they recieve. Facts: You get rewarded for losing. You get rewarded for winning. You get rewarded for logging in.

    @FrigginPaco.4178 said:
    There is a disturbing lack of qualifiers regarding the word "rewarding".

    I would say, for example, there is a ton to "pursue" in this game, but maybe to someone who is achievement hunting, those little rewards and AP are very small increments towards feeling "rewarded".

    Maybe you want to say, "Do you feel as though there are enough loot rewards in the game as it exists today?" or something to that effect concerning actual drops.

    Gotta be specific, yo.

    Yes for some people it's in-game loot rewards. But for others maybe titles make the game rewarding, maybe it's the satisfaction of 100% map completion, maybe it's winning a PvP match or just having enough fun mechanics to play with your friends. I intentionally left it opened ended so people could more freely express their thoughts.

    Read this. Just to make everything clear, there is no correct answer to this question people. It's your own personal opinion and if your opinion differs from what counts as rewarding than my own, that's fine :)

  • It's highly predatory. Stop with RNG RMT rewards. One it the other, not both.

    The black lion chests are bad enough. Do you not make enough off of direct sales?

  • kitten this kitten i'm out, I had hopes you were different than the like like of EA or Warnerbros. but no, kiss you community goodbye.

  • @AnodicShadow.3647 said:

    It's sad to see all of these people wishing for Anet and GW2 to fall. Why is there so much hatred in people's hearts nowadays? I personally wouldn't mind getting any of the mount skins, especially because of no duplicates and equal chance of getting them. It takes a lot of work to make sure these skins work/aren't buggy/are textured correctly and 400 gems for what would probably cost at least 1000 with some of them is a great deal. I don't care if it's random. I'm just happy to get a skin in general since I can probably find a dye combo that looks great on it.

    Liking the game doesn't mean you have to like everything they do. Liking the game means you want it to develop into a good direction. This is business strategy is exploitative and people don't want it to continue like this. And not only is it irrelevant to argue about how much work was put into each skin, I seriously doubt those ticket mount skins even require more work than an entirely new glider, which are like 400-500 gems each.
    There are three types, retextures, skins with slightly modified models and skins with the same models but with particle effects.
    For the first one they only need to modify the color texture and draw four masks for each dye channel because everything else stays the same.
    For the modified models, they need to remodel and retexturize some parts of it but it's definitely not much more work than making a new glider from scratch
    And for the ones with particle effects, they need to make new textures or add some fancy shaders, and make and add some particle effects. The models are still the same.

    Just because it's sparkly and shiny doesn't necessarily mean it takes a lot of time to make them and you aren't getting a special deal because they're in lootboxes.
    The main reason for them to put the skins into lootboxes is to sell more bulk. If they sold them like gliders people would just buy the ones they want, but with RNG they can convince people to buy more skins than they would have in the upfront method. Most people aren't like you and just want any, they want a specific one or a specific few. It's just plain manipulative psychology.

  • Aside of merging complain threads into 1 so their main forum looks "clean", do they plan to do anything about it, or just wait that it dies down and leave it as it is currently?

  • @Rashagar.8349 said:

    See the thing is, tonedeaf is exactly how I feel the community's reaction to it is too.

    Pardon? Unable to appreciate or understand the concerns or difficulties of others, in what way is the community – or those who are complaining – not understanding the role of ANet/those in charge? The way in which these loot boxes were implemented is absolutely awful. If they wanted to bring in loot boxes, there's a plethora of ways in which they could have done it that wasn't so consumer unfriendly.

    1. Mount separate contracts: still gross, but it lowers the % in which you'll get a mount that you don't care about if you're after specific mounts.
    2. A flat price based on quality of skin and then cheaper gamble contracts: still psychologically beneficial for what they want to achieve and doesn't bother those who want to catch em' all.
    3. Release mounts by smaller proportion: gives chase rare mounts per 'grouping', in this instance at least the percentage in which you'll get what you want is better than the initial 3.33%. This also again, doesn't hurt those who want to catch em' all and benefits those who want to roll the more friendly dice for the skin.

    Overall what they chose to do was bundle it all together (30) – give no mounts to any form of achievement, raid ect – and laugh to the bank.

    Like, you can think it's too expensive. That's fair enough. Everyone has different ideas about what "too expensive" is for them and there's no wrong answer.

    In its current form, they are too expensive. Some skins could easily be valued at 800-1k gems, if not more. The issue arises when you get a skin for a mount that you don't use, in which it's not only useless to you, but you'll need to spend another 400 gems to reroll til you get something of personal value or just a low overall quality skin.

    You can say you'd prefer to only buy the thing you want (most likely for a higher price) instead of it being randomised. That's fair enough. It's a preference, and it's a preference that probably should be catered for (though from the sounds of it when it is being catered for there are a lot of people here who won't be happy with how it'll be implemented, those expecting to spend 400 gems on the shiniest of shinies for example).

    ... Yeah, that's the problem, in its current iteration, gambling is one of the only thing beings catered for. Those who decide to gamble and hopefully come out RNG king and those who want all the mounts anyway. If you cannot see how this is a problem, i don't know what to tell you, you're anti-consumer.

    But things like trying to justify that preference by calling the alternative predatory behaviour and all that just seems to show a fundamental lack of understanding of what makes the other instances of predatory game behaviour actually deserve the label. And I just wish people would be smarter about throwing those words around, because when it's applied in the wrong instances (like this one) it detracts from the severity of the actual instances of predatory behaviour. And then I start wondering why people are deliberately misusing the label and what they're trying to gain by manipulating current gamer trends to their own ends, and it's not a happy line of thinking.

    I can agree with this, however, that doesn't mean the method they chose was good especially seeing how not one mount was included in actual game play that didn't involve Gold Wars 2.

  • There are 30 skins.. way more than I was originally thinking they would add... however, some of them are just bland, retextures, or add more dye slots. Why not add at least one/two skins per mounts via in game rewards?

    Give us the basic skins as in game rewards, give us something to work towards... allow people to be able to use more than one dye. THEN have the RNG loot box for all of the "special" skins.

  • This is a very disappointing practice that I hoped to never see in Guild Wars 2. I like what someone said on reddit at some point and I think you should follow that:
    Account bound, expensive, RNG - choose 2 out of 3

    RNG and expensive. At least Black Lion Trading Post would stabilise the prices.
    Random and account bound. We won't mind that much we are not getting what we want, if it's cheap (and no, 400 gems is far away from cheap in RNG game).
    Expensive and account-bound. People choose the skin they want - no complaints.

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