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(Relative) Newbie Question - need advice


UnbentMars.9126

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Hi all,

I'm nowhere near new to the game but have spent very little time in WvW. I am trying to get into it, but when I try to join zergs I often find myself unable to join any squads as they are locked but no one will invite me so I can't get in. If I try following them, eventually the commander (probably) links some waypoint in squad chat and they all disappear so I can't find them. There have been some open squads with commanders who have been good about giving instructions so I know where to help/what to do, but I run into way too many of the other kind.Then when I go off and try to help out by taking camps/towers with small groups or alone I get full squads who are upset because I'm "disrupting their capture chain" and/or some kind of plan of action they never divulge.

I want to be useful, but I'm not really familiar with what is going on. Would anyone be willing to give me some advice?

Thank you!Unbent

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Welcome to WvW Unbent, it sucks you are having such a poor experience so far. Let me address some of the items you talked about. It may not necessarily be an answer, but might give you some insight.

There could be multiple reasons you cannot get into a squad: 1) It could be full. A squad can only have 50 people. 2) It's locked because it's a closed raid, meaning it's likely a guild group that has a team composition that they don't want randoms to be part of, since the purpose of squads is boon share prioritization (mostly). 3) It's locked because the commander wants you to be on TeamSpeak/ Ventrilo / Discord or some kind of voice comm program, which is used to better coordinate movement and attacks, and the commander only invites you once you say who you are on TeamSpeak, etc.

Another note on Squads, is there is a general rule of what type of zerg/raid the commander is leading based on the color of the tag. Though many people don't really follow that strictly... it's more of a gentleman's agreement. Blue/Purple/White/Green/Red is open raid, anyone can join. Yellow/Orange usually indicates a guild's closed raid. But that's more of a guideline than a rule.

I'm surprised that you would get hate for capping a tower or camp 'out of order', which sounds more like Edge of the Mists attitude versus the normal Borderland and Eternal Battlegrounds maps. However maybe the server you are on has that mentality or culture (which sucks). Do what you want to do, and you can play as you want, so don't listen to people when they tell you not to take a tower or camp. Although there is the rare occasion that your zerg's commander is trying to sneak a capture or surprise an enemy group without telling them where they are, and capturing a tower/camp/sentry/objective might give that away. But that's rare. If people are upset about other people not doing what the zerg is instructing than that's bad on them.

Advice? If you are having trouble joining a squad, see if they are posting links to TeamSpeak (most common voice program) and see if that helps. At the very least you can hear where they have gone. Otherwise, just follow them. You don't need to be in the squad to be useful or be part of the zerg.

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@UnbentMars.9126 said:Then when I go off and try to help out by taking camps/towers with small groups or alone I get full squads who are upset because I'm "disrupting their capture chain" and/or some kind of plan of action they never divulge.

Capture chain? What in the hell...?! Man, you don't want to be in that sort of squad. If that's all your server has going for squads, I'd suggest transferring to a much more agreeable server because it sounds like you're the sort of person who's a real asset. And if you can already take towers on your own, you've got the potential to be a solid roamer too.

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i never heard of a capture chain what sever are you on xD? if someone has that much of ego to say such a thing just block them no one got time for that.

the way i got in to WvW was i just friendlist everyone i roam with until the point i just go in to WvW instantly make a group of friends an do stuff :).

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Various possible reasons for squad being closed:

  • Requires being on TS or discord (organised)
  • Guild run only (sustain of guild in combat without the help of PUGs, splitting blob to encourage PUGs to follow main tag, havoc unit, GvG etc)
  • Small ops unit (don't want too many PUGs else it will draw enemy attention)
  • You are trying to join a squad with a class that does not bring sufficient support/sustain nor benefits party composition (mostly Ranger, Thief, Engi)
  • Squad is full (max 50 players)

I find your 2nd paragraph hard to believe, with all due respect. I've personally never witnessed or come across anyone who's been upset about team mates capturing enemy objectives. Perhaps before you entered the map they established a form of k-train squad and you, unknowingly, disrupted it? Either way, that's just silly on their behalf and you should continue to help your server out no matter what.

I would suggest playing a class such as Guardian, Revenant, Necro, Ele etc if you expect yourself to have a chance of being accepted into a squad. Those listed bring proper party composition, especially Guard due to stability being a necessity within a squad.

Hope that helps.

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@Zephyra.4709 said:Various possible reasons for squad being closed:

  • Requires being on TS or discord (organised)
  • Guild run only (sustain of guild in combat without the help of PUGs, splitting blob to encourage PUGs to follow main tag, havoc unit, GvG etc)
  • Small ops unit (don't want too many PUGs else it will draw enemy attention)
  • You are trying to join a squad with a class that does not bring sufficient support/sustain nor benefits party composition (mostly Ranger, Thief, Engi)
  • Squad is full (max 50 players)

I find your 2nd paragraph hard to believe, with all due respect. I've personally never witnessed or come across anyone who's been upset about team mates capturing enemy objectives. Perhaps before you entered the map they established a form of k-train squad and you, unknowingly, disrupted it? Either way, that's just silly on their behalf and you should continue to help your server out no matter what.

I would suggest playing a class such as Guardian, Revenant, Necro, Ele etc if you expect yourself to have a chance of being accepted into a squad. Those listed bring proper party composition, especially Guard due to stability being a necessity within a squad.

Hope that helps.

Regarding your points:I have gotten into squads using Discord, but sometimes I won;t get a response if I ask for info. If it's a closed squad I don't push anything since its the way I want to play, but sometimes it's hard to tell (as I said I don't have a lot of experience with it and am not caught up on a lot of the jargon and habits people have so if I'm missing something it's on me. Squads do tell you if they are full, and that's not an issue.

I play on Sanctum of Rall, but I don;t know if the people who comment are from my server or whichever one we are paired with. I haven't gotten a whole lot of it (3-4 times total so far), but I would prefer not to be eliciting that behavior at all.

I started playing thief for mobility but quickly found that I'm not good at it, so I switched to sword/shield guardian off of a roaming build I found on Metabattle (for both damage and survivability). I was planning on sticking with that until I got more comfortable then maybe doing a support guardian if that is helpful

It does, thank you.

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@Esprit Dumort.3109 said:Welcome to WvW Unbent, it kitten you are having such a poor experience so far. Let me address some of the items you talked about. It may not necessarily be an answer, but might give you some insight.

There could be multiple reasons you cannot get into a squad: 1) It could be full. A squad can only have 50 people. 2) It's locked because it's a closed raid, meaning it's likely a guild group that has a team composition that they don't want randoms to be part of, since the purpose of squads is boon share prioritization (mostly). 3) It's locked because the commander wants you to be on TeamSpeak/ Ventrilo / Discord or some kind of voice comm program, which is used to better coordinate movement and attacks, and the commander only invites you once you say who you are on TeamSpeak, etc.

Another note on Squads, is there is a general rule of what type of zerg/raid the commander is leading based on the color of the tag. Though many people don't really follow that strictly... it's more of a gentleman's agreement. Blue/Purple/White/Green/Red is open raid, anyone can join. Yellow/Orange usually indicates a guild's closed raid. But that's more of a guideline than a rule.

I'm surprised that you would get hate for capping a tower or camp 'out of order', which sounds more like Edge of the Mists attitude versus the normal Borderland and Eternal Battlegrounds maps. However maybe the server you are on has that mentality or culture (which kitten). Do what you want to do, and you can play as you want, so don't listen to people when they tell you not to take a tower or camp. Although there is the rare occasion that your zerg's commander is trying to sneak a capture or surprise an enemy group without telling them where they are, and capturing a tower/camp/sentry/objective might give that away. But that's rare. If people are upset about other people not doing what the zerg is instructing than that's bad on them.

Advice? If you are having trouble joining a squad, see if they are posting links to TeamSpeak (most common voice program) and see if that helps. At the very least you can hear where they have gone. Otherwise, just follow them. You don't need to be in the squad to be useful or be part of the zerg.

It's not been a super poor experience, it feels good to be able to take on other players with a hope of winning (I suck at spvp but I'm finding I'm successful at small fights in wvw which is nice), I just want to get the jump on knowing what I should be doing and what is helpful for people, until i do I'm a liability to groups and I want to do it right.

I've joined a few discords, but my playing hours can be erratic so I run into lots of different commanders rather than anything consistent, which I'm sure is part of the problem lol. For the squad colors, that's good to know because I had no idea!

It's only happend 3-4 times, most often I've capped a camp right before a big zerg shows up that I didn't realize was coming and then people /say whoever capped that is an idiot and should have waited. I've been assuming theyre salty for missing out on participation or something, but I've never received an answer on why they are upset so I wanted to make sure I'm not screwing anything up I'm unaware of.

Thank you for the insight, I'm just hoping I can git gud!

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@Choppy.4183 said:

@UnbentMars.9126 said:Then when I go off and try to help out by taking camps/towers with small groups or alone I get full squads who are upset because I'm "disrupting their capture chain" and/or some kind of plan of action they never divulge.

Capture chain? What in the kitten...?! Man, you don't want to be in that sort of squad. If that's all your server has going for squads, I'd suggest transferring to a much more agreeable server because it sounds like you're the sort of person who's a real asset. And if you can already take towers on your own, you've got the potential to be a solid roamer too.

Sadly I have yet to solo a tower, so I can't claim to be that good lol. I'm sorry I didn't specify, I meant I'll start trying to take down a wall if I think people will come and help or, more likely, I'll try and help a small group who is already doing that. Camps alone are easy, I'm playing a sword/shield trap guardian but I don't want to mislead anyone into thinking I'm some kind of WvW god lol

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