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Mesmer Changes


Azukas.1426

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Post patch Mesmer needs to be nerfed. I was afraid that this was going to happen. 41k DPS in PvE & Condi Mirage in PvP is just insane right now...

Let's talk about what we can come up with to get Mirage back in line with the rest of the game w/out having Anet gut us.

Thanks,

Az

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@LordOtto.2650 said:That's one of the reasons I don't play PvP this season! Who is responsible for this mess?!

Wait until the Mesmer Forum Brigade descend on this thread yelling at me that it's perfectly balanced or under powered lol.

Overall damage needs immediate -30% then re-evaluate for further nerfs if needed. (You shave the damage however you want)

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@FaboBabo.3581 said:The 42k is about a known bug which is responsible for ~5-7k dmg increase, through axe ambush hitting twice. Will be ok after a fix for this i think.

42k - 30% would be 30k, which is not viable as a pure DPS build in PVE. Further nerfing it then would destroy the DPS - Spec.

Mostly talking about PvP here sorry wasn't as clear since most of my balance stances refer to PvP.

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I would start by scrapping all of the current Mirage design because I'd also scrap major parts of the Mesmer design, chief among which are Shatters as a mechanic.

As the latter change more or less invalidates the entire Mirage design, I'd start over once the base-class is re-imagined. If this requires a GW3, then frankly given the current mount loot boxes and all... roll out work on GW3 already, I say! :grin:

@Azukas.1426 said:Mostly talking about PvP here sorry wasn't as clear since most of my balance stances refer to PvP.

As always, why balance for a minority game mode? I mean I understand it's important to mostly-PvP-players, but logically speaking why not balance first and foremost for PvE if that's where most of the playtime is spent?

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@Carighan.6758 said:I would start by scrapping all of the current Mirage design because I'd also scrap major parts of the Mesmer design, chief among which are Shatters as a mechanic.

As the latter change more or less invalidates the entire Mirage design, I'd start over once the base-class is re-imagined. If this requires a GW3, then frankly given the current mount loot boxes and all... roll out work on GW3 already, I say! :grin:

@Azukas.1426 said:Mostly talking about PvP here sorry wasn't as clear since most of my balance stances refer to PvP.

As always, why balance for a minority game mode? I mean I understand it's important to mostly-PvP-players, but logically speaking why not balance first and foremost for PvE if that's where most of the playtime is spent?

I take it you didn't see the riveting gameplay & skill required in the 42k DPS video?

You can balance NPC's, but you can't balance players

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@Refia Montes.3205 said:

@Azukas.1426 said:

@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Nope it's over performing by a LARGE margin atm.

Please tell me why. Seems that you're such an Mirage expert. /s

Survivability + Damage + Mobility

/discussion

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@Azukas.1426 said:

@Azukas.1426 said:

@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Nope it's over performing by a LARGE margin atm.

Please tell me why. Seems that you're such an Mirage expert. /s

Survivability + Damage + Mobility

/discussion

Why did I even expect a decent answer from you? sigh

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@Refia Montes.3205 said:

@Azukas.1426 said:

@Azukas.1426 said:

@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Nope it's over performing by a LARGE margin atm.

Please tell me why. Seems that you're such an Mirage expert. /s

Survivability + Damage + Mobility

/discussion

Why did I even expect a decent answer from you?
sigh

That's the perfect answer. You can't be that good at everything and expect it to be balanced. I suggested nerfing damage since most here would rather keep survivability/sustain & mobility.

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@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Sorry but the OP and pros are correct. Whether we see changes soon, who knows but mirage is the #1 dueling spec, still has insane mobility and is doing outrageous single target damage in PVE. Hey I have 2 mesmars too, but it shouldn't be this above the rest for another 1/4. It's dodge trait mechanic need a little revision too, I mean how UC got nerfed and some of the mirage traits didn't. The sustain you lose over not playing chrono is nothing, I switched to mirage recently and now I see what all the fuss is about.

I too hate over-reactions and over-nerfs, but mirage in it's current state is in a separate tier. The question is can we adjust something so it doesn't fall off a cliff like SB.

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@Despond.2174 said:

@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Sorry but the OP and pros are correct. Whether we see changes soon, who knows but mirage is the #1 dueling spec, still has insane mobility and is doing outrageous single target damage in PVE. Hey I have 2 mesmars too, but it shouldn't be this above the rest for another 1/4. It's dodge trait mechanic need a little revision too, I mean how UC got nerfed and some of the mirage traits didn't.

I too hate over-reactions and over-nerfs, but mirage in it's current state is in a separate tier. The question is can we adjust something so it doesn't fall off a cliff like SB.

Dilly Dilly!

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@Despond.2174 said:

@Refia Montes.3205 said:Uhhhh.... okay? There were no changes to Condi Mirage for PvP, and it's not OP. Most changes were towards Axe, which in the end is still a bad PvP weapon.

Sorry but the OP and pros are correct. Whether we see changes soon, who knows but mirage is the #1 dueling spec, still has insane mobility and is doing outrageous single target damage in PVE. Hey I have 2 mesmars too, but it shouldn't be this above the rest for another 1/4. It's dodge trait mechanic need a little revision too, I mean how UC got nerfed and some of the mirage traits didn't. The sustain you lose over not playing chrono is nothing, I switched to mirage recently and now I see what all the fuss is about.

I too hate over-reactions and over-nerfs, but mirage in it's current state is in a separate tier. The question is can we adjust something so it doesn't fall off a cliff like SB.

Hey, I agree with the PvE nerfs, not much on the PvP, since I haven't played much yet this ranked season. I was just asking for a decent answer, and as always Azukas never fails to sound like a troll with no knowledge on the class.

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Mesmer/Mirage not really getting toned down in terms of mobility and condition cleanse yet alone offensive dps came as a complete surprise to myself and many other's in our circle of friends. I do not really follow anets logic for post-poning the obvious balances that need to be made regarding mirage/mesmer. Hopefully it doesn't end up happening all super late like with Unhindered combatant on thief.

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@Azukas.1426 said:

@FaboBabo.3581 said:The 42k is about a known bug which is responsible for ~5-7k dmg increase, through axe ambush hitting twice. Will be ok after a fix for this i think.

42k - 30% would be 30k, which is not viable as a pure DPS build in PVE. Further nerfing it then would destroy the DPS - Spec.

Mostly talking about PvP here sorry wasn't as clear since most of my balance stances refer to PvP.

Contradict yourself much? You say in your first post 41k dps and that is certainly the core of your complaint which refers exclusively to PvE then make the statement above that this is all in relation to PvP?

Quite frankly I’m surprised ANet haven’t banned you for trolling yet. As mentioned it’s a bug which makes axe hit twice, you fix bugs first so you can see how it’s really performing then balance.

Before you start with the “I said in PvP” you need to actually prove that it does 41k dps in PvP. Discuss.

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@Azukas.1426 said:Post patch Mesmer needs to be nerfed. I was afraid that this was going to happen. 41k DPS & Condi Mirage in PvP is just insane right now...

Let's talk about what we can come up with to get Mirage back in line with the rest of the game w/out having Anet gut us.

Thanks,

Az

Mind showing me this?All i see is the golem test, where did this come from?Did you do it on a non-responsive player?

/edit grammar/

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@Unknown.3976 said:Using DPS golem to justify a nerf for PvP is just mind-boggling. Mirage, on its' own, is not capable of self-buffing, golem tests are unrealistic outside of professional raid groups.

Well, this is what you get when you make huge claims without providing any actual arguments.

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@Azukas.1426 said:

@LordOtto.2650 said:That's one of the reasons I don't play PvP this season! Who is responsible for this mess?!

Wait until the Mesmer Forum Brigade descend on this thread yelling at me that it's perfectly balanced or under powered lol.

Overall damage needs immediate -30% then re-evaluate for further nerfs if needed. (You shave the damage however you want)

No good mesmer is calling this balanced or underpowered, if you actually read the mesmer forums you would know that. We acknowledge that this is caused by a bug with skills hitting twice in hitboxes of various sizes, and that our DPS was not intended to be this high. We want it fixed. I don't know who you're trying to fool though, because you literally made this thread to the people who acknowledge that its overperforming until this bug gets fixed.

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