No more fractals, it's time for the dungeons

Well, every time I see that they continue to add more difficulty to fractals, apart from creating new ones with greater difficulty based on the difficulty of the raids.

From my experience in WoW, which has a similar system of Mistlock instability, when you play high-level dungeons (+10 and up), the "cancer" dungeons appear, which basically means you suffer a lot to complete it ...

Well, today I played a fractal T4 and it was amazing how the new vindicator was loading everyone in a few seconds ... and so it became an averagely difficult fractal in a cancer ...And the worst is that they are thinking of adding more Mistlock instability in the future and doing a rotation of it ... something similar in the wow, what happened? It made some weeks very fun to play high level dungeons and others that practically nobody played because of the ridiculous difficulty he had.

Why do not they leave fractals alone and focus on new content like dungeons? Really, they'll end up ruining the fractals if they start to screw you up. Think that the fractals is already very mature and it keeps getting steroids ... it will end up breaking.

Instead of continuing to stuff the turkey, why do not they start going back to the beginning with the dungeons? It would be good to see old content returned.

PD: I regret not having added more options, what happens when I press a key badly and only the post was released.

This has already been addressed by Anet.

@Mourningcry.9428 said:This has already been addressed by Anet.Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

Have you done twilight oasis? Its literally a dungeon tied directly to the lore of the new patch. In fact, it is more directly tied to the ongoing narrative then any dungeon was to the original personal story, with the exception of Arah. Nothing is stopping them from making fractals that tie directly to the new story, or even that are part of the new story.

All your other complaints are nonsense. T4 is supposed to be hard. If you don't want to deal with it, don't deal with it. T2 and T3 are easier with ok rewards.

No, fractals is what they'll focus on and that's fine, game evolved past dungeons. I'd like it if a legendary trinket was tied to the Dungeoneer collection though, would make sense that a legendary accessory is tied to collecting all dungeon accesories.

Well, everyone is saying the dungeons need better loot. Which is of course true, but adding loot just makes it a farmfest. The dungeons are emptied out because the enemy AI is really crappy. All parties have to do is stack up in a spot and spam dps at incoming mobs that enter into the kill zone. This makes the entire exercise mindless follow the leader with no skill involved.

1. Monsters need to get out of range if players are too close to each other and stacking dps into a single zone.
2. Bypassing monsters by using memorized glitch paths needs to end. While sneaking is a cool strategy, doing a one man glitch path stealth run for all the rewards is bogus. It's basically being a bot.
3. Increase not just the basic mob AI so it isnt so stupid, but boost their power as well. Which just means that there should be an additional difficulty choice on the npc for people who want to go for ascended or legendary gear.

First I need to be sure what's the difference between fractal and dungeon? Aside agony.

yes. actually need more for arah and the rest of the dungeons.spoilers: xd just re run a few paths or arah recently to realize their boss "bloodstone shard" has something to do with living world. pretty neat to learn they're not abandon dungeons. but i wish they rework them like they do with fractals. that way, it'll give players more options to play. dungeons, then a higher difficulty aka fractals, and a higher level as in raids.

right now dungeons eat all the dust as this old buggy contents and we skipped a lot or utilize the bugs to our advantage. lol.if they actually fix dungeons again, it'll become interesting. and i bet a lot of fractal folks can't even clear some dungeons.

@Eramonster.2718 said:First I need to be sure what's the difference between fractal and dungeon? Aside agony.

Thank you, exactly my thought

I don't mind if something new is adding value into the game but I get confused at times. When the content is too hard, nerf is requested. When the content is too easy, a call is made to be challenging? On the scale of difficulty 1 to infinity, what is just right...?

Not going to speak on behalf of others. But in my case it's not about the quality, I've already unlock every possible skin from the current dungeons (been playing for more than a year). I will play it once for experience if its overhauled, but it's going to take more to make me going back to the old dungeons. Doubt there will be, but 2 possible outcome if its possible to get Asc from dungeons :

1 - All the previous exotic drop table will be scrapped, and the price for ectos & exotics in TP will crash rock bottom. Will the non-expansion players be able to play as well?

2 - Effects other contents loot table such as Raid, WvW, Fractals....

Which brings back to,

First I need to be sure what's the difference between fractal and dungeon? Aside agony.How is it different from adding a new fractal?

Honestly, I like both and certainly would like to see further work on both types of instanced PvE content.The major difference between dungeons and fractals is their designs or more like the ideas behind them. Dungeons provide us with a wide range of content through story modes and multiple branching paths while keeping all of that at a decent difficulty. Fractals on the other hand are more focused on delivering an adequate difficulty scale for everybody ranging from very easy to pretty hard.Comparing these two directly is a little unfair. Like comparing release content with content created in 2017/18. Fractals were changed times and times again until they found the sweet spot they were looking for. ArenaNet had years to add new levels also. All of that while constantly updating them to keep up with an ever changing game. The work on creating raids and the new designs and content ideas they created in the process have deeply influenced fractals and even PvE as a whole. Dungeons preceed all of that. They do seem outdated indeed.

Having said that, we should try to think about what dungeons could be like if they were reworked and new dungeons were added to HoT or PoF maps rather than how outdated they seem to be in places.Dungeons would be further content to explore in many of the individual areas. They would remain at a decent difficulty without adding shinanigans such as instabilities or vindicators. There should be a focus on mechanics rather than a specific scaling difficulty which forces people to run raid builds. The reward system would be updated to fit the GW2 of 2018. Achievements and masteries could be added to please the frequenters.Dungeons still hold a lot of potential. There is something more pleasing about having to go to an area on the world map to enter a dungeons rather than entering yet another lobby which allows you to cycle the instances at your leasure for quick dailies.

@Eramonster.2718 said:First I need to be sure what's the difference between fractal and dungeon? Aside agony.

You forgot the armor.

@Kapax.3801 said:

@Mourningcry.9428 said:This has already been addressed by Anet.Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

They are already doing that. The last fractal was closely related to expansion content and lore (Joko and the Sunspears).

I do not really see any difference between fractals and dungeons besides the lore part. And assuming that next fractals will follow TO ideas the lore part is being addressed.

You are more complaining about the difficultly of the fractal than the dungeons themselves. Fractals are no different than dungeon with multiple difficulties. By your description dungeons or not the experience will be the same for you. T2 fractals are supposed to serve the typical dungeon difficulty. You already have what you want. Instabilities just create unknowns that keep the encounter fresh. If the dungeons are made without the intricate mechanics of the fractal they will grow old, get boring and abandoned by the players as the old ones. The only way to keep them fresh is to keep updating them and changing their mechanics. Which is the exact same process as the fractals. Fractals are just dungeons that are easily expandable and you can make quick changes even in older ones to keep fresh. That is it.

Pls no breakbars in dungeon ore mechanics we want dungeons before hot before bb :D

@"Mourningcry.9428" said:This has already been addressed by Anet.They keep saying that it's not their intention to raise the difficulty bar in fractals, while consistently raising the difficulty bar in fractals. That "addresses" the issue only in the way of mentioning it (and insisting it doesn't exist). It certainly doesn't "address" the issue in the way of actually doing anything about it.

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"Mourningcry.9428" said:This has already been addressed by Anet.They keep saying that it's not their intention to raise the difficulty bar in fractals, while consistently raising the difficulty bar in fractals. That "addresses" the issue only in the way of mentioning it (and insisting it doesn't exist). It certainly doesn't "address" the issue in the way of actually doing anything about it.

@"Mourningcry.9428" said:This has already been addressed by Anet.They keep saying that it's not their intention to raise the difficulty bar in fractals, while consistently raising the difficulty bar in fractals. That "addresses" the issue only in the way of mentioning it (and insisting it doesn't exist). It certainly doesn't "address" the issue in the way of actually doing anything about it.

That is why tier 1 exists.

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"Mourningcry.9428" said:This has already been addressed by Anet.They keep saying that it's not their intention to raise the difficulty bar in fractals, while consistently raising the difficulty bar in fractals. That "addresses" the issue only in the way of mentioning it (and insisting it doesn't exist). It certainly doesn't "address" the issue in the way of actually doing anything about it.

The difficulty bar in fractals was dropped lower than ever when they went to the current 100level system. And they then proceeded to somehow lower it even further through the ongoing nerfs and modifications to these fractals... The level of difficulty for the current T4 islands is so much lower than the previous lvl 50s, they're almost not even the same fractals - here's looking to you, Mai.

While this could be taken as subjective, just have a look at the LFG - seen anyone selling daily T4s lately? No? Me neither. They can't sell something that there's no market for, as no one's willing to pay for something they just as easily do themselves.

Also, the institution of CM modes does not equate to a raising of the bar, these exist inherently as a challenge.

Regardless, my original quote was in mainly with respect toward's ANet's stance relating to the ceasing of any further new dungeon development. Which had nothing to do with Fractals.... Also, regardless of the necro of this thread.

@Kapax.3801 said:

@Mourningcry.9428 said:This has already been addressed by Anet.Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

The devs already clarified that making dungeons requires more effort. Fractals are easier to produce. Also, the dungeon team has been disbanded and reassigned, so no more dungeon content.

Fast forward to 4:15

i used to do fractals t4s+99cm daily but when the new 100 come out i stoped playing fractals because i noticed the difficulty was like the raids,too much of everything and pugs are not used nor do they want to so i knew that from that day doing daily fractals would be frustating. I tried 100cm in the first day and i beat the first 2 bosses and i stoped there,never touched fractals since and i didn't do even the most recent one twilight oasis. I don't want to know what kind of players are in t4 anymore probably searching for a full team to start daily is a chore nowdays with all those stupid requirements they ask and i am pointing at normal t4 fractals not cm.

Dungeons dungeons dungeons dungeons

Aside from the fact that agony is a mess of a system, I struggled to think about what the heck the difference between dungeons and fractals is. I think one of thing is that dungeons are group content that is easily accessible by even brand new players. Newbies need to be able to play alongside vets without vets "slummin' it" by helping out with a level 1 fractal or something.

I remember several years ago Nike posted a video about how lack of dungeons was bringing down the player skill level, not knowing basic things like might stacking or using the full compliment of a professions skills for unique encounters or skipping.

Just recalled and wanted to share a story about Dungeons and difficulty...

Waaaaaaaaaay back when, when dungeons were supported content, ANet revamped Ascalon Catacombs (explorable)... a level 35 dungeon.

After the revamp there was an outcry about how it was made too difficult for at level players, and was revamped to cater to level 80 dungeon runners... Complaints also centered around discrimination against under level toons, as well as the usual AP and gear requirements popular at the time (and not so different from now)...

Well, someone challenged that it could indeed be done at level and asked for volunteers to PUG it. I joined up along with the main dude, and 3 others, no one knew one another... We all started new toons, that were not our main class, and geared up to level 35- one person who was the ele was still unlocking weapon skills (remember that) minutes before we were set to start. Needless to say we completed it, along with Kholer... not a record run by any means, but still completed.

This is not to toot my own horn, or any of the others in the group... but simply to relate how the same arguments plagued dungeon development in the past... and were, pretty much the same as now, unfounded.

The point being, I've seen nothing from the detractors in this community that would indicate that the same arguments being applied to all new instanced content, as well as the current environment, would not be applied to the new dungeons as well. From Meta comps, to kill proofs, to difficulty to whatever... There will always be a section of the player community that cannot be satisfied. I can't see how Dungeons would be silver bullet that would accomplish changing this.

The historical days of GuildWarriors2? Definately, it was at that time my warrior(2nd alt) was born. My poor necro was discriminated and shunned, ele have it better since they can provide icebows. Zerker stat dominance & Level 80 requirement for a lv30+ dungeon or kicked. Some of the dungeon path was never touched because it was long and "difficult"?

@Verthurnax.2784 said:i used to do fractals t4s+99cm daily but when the new 100 come out i stoped playing fractals because i noticed the difficulty was like the raids,too much of everything and pugs are not used nor do they want to so i knew that from that day doing daily fractals would be frustating. I tried 100cm in the first day and i beat the first 2 bosses and i stoped there,never touched fractals since and i didn't do even the most recent one twilight oasis. I don't want to know what kind of players are in t4 anymore probably searching for a full team to start daily is a chore nowdays with all those stupid requirements they ask and i am pointing at normal t4 fractals not cm.

Yea its so hard to put up a t4 daily lfg in the fractal 76-100 and see it fill in minutes.

Sure it will take you longer then the meta comp of chrono, druid, banner sister and 2 dps with food and pots but your playing a game and wasting your time is the point aint it?

About the first part of your post nothing is keeping you from still doing 99cm and the t4 dailys you feel like doing you dont have to do all 3 if twilight oasis or shatterd observatory is in the rotation.

Dubble post please delete.