Moderator message saying I'm not penalised - But I've been penalised?

I've had comments removed because the post I was quoting was removed before, but this is the first time I've received a warning for no reason (or the reason was not stated to me). According to my profile I'm now on warning level 1, and I have received no message as to why.

Would love some sort of explanation if it's intended, and if it's a bug I hope we can get it fixed.

@Gaile Gray.6029

I actually emailed gaile (well the forum team) about this.

They were pretty straight-forward in explaining it not sure if its safe to repost so instead i'll paraphrase.

The points are intended for tracking and are inseparable from the action, but carry no weight.They may look into cleaning up the message to let people know this going forward.

@TexZero.7910 said:I actually emailed gaile (well the forum team) about this.

They were pretty straight-forward in explaining it not sure if its safe to repost so instead i'll paraphrase.

The points are intended for tracking and are inseparable from the action, but carry no weight.They may look into cleaning up the message to let people know this going forward.

Thanks for that. It's pretty misleading to get a message saying that I've received no infraction, but then see that I have indeed received an infraction that hasn't been explained.

I hope that they can change the system to have some other way to track rather than giving infractions.

Where do you see your warning level?

In the OP's image, it shows "1 point" of moderation.

how do you see infractions?all i see is a moderater send you a notice why your post was removed it quoted someone that got its post removed, if they dident remove urs aswell ppl could still read the other guys post in your quote

@Vayne.8563 said:Where do you see your warning level?

If you have one it will be on your profile page.

@Linken.6345 said:how do you see infractions?all i see is a moderater send you a notice why your post was removed it quoted someone that got its post removed, if they dident remove urs aswell ppl could still read the other guys post in your quote

On your profile page -> Left side tab "Moderation"Though this is only if you've actually been moderated (not sure if best phrase for it).

EDIT:

So my moderations say I should only have one point (for "tracking"), but if that's the case then only one point is needed for level 1. Why have I been put on the warning levels when I haven't committed any forum felony that I know of? If it's just for tracking this should seriously be altered.

@"Miss Lana.5276" said:EDIT:

So my moderations say I should only have one point (for "tracking"), but if that's the case then only one point is needed for level 1. Why have I been put on the warning levels when I haven't committed any forum felony that I know of? If it's just for tracking this should seriously be altered.

If the actions happen quick enough i.e more than one post you responded to removed the points still keep a rolling total and trigger the levels. However there's different levels and actions from what i understand. Notices don't impact your ability to post in any fashion.

Hopefully that answers your question. If not i do suggest sending an email to forums@arena.netAlso read through this. https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/12118/how-to-communicate-with-the-forums-team-appeals-pms-e-mails & https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/342/forum-moderation-and-infraction-system

@TexZero.7910 thanks for posting the paraphrasing of what you've seen. It's very helpful.

I figured that was the case when it happened to me. Bit of an odd quirk of the system, but as you say a harmless one

Thanks for clarifying, Gaile. The new phrasing is much better (although I hate that you can't dish out "zero points" for something benign, as in your example).

On a related note: should we be receiving notifications when a thread in which we've posted is locked & hidden? Or do we just have to live with mysterious disappearances of comments?

I had posted some time ago (I think in the Forum Feedback thread) about the lack of notifications about moved or removed threads. Although, in the old forums, it seemed we received, perhaps, too many notifications, now they are missed. Now, if you follow a notification that someone quoted you, and the thread has been removed, you get the 'Permission Denied' message.

Also, it is unfortunate that there has to be a notice in large font that we are at 'WARNING LEVEL 1' on our forum account page (or whatever it is called), when we get these benign points. You get the same exact notice if you get a point that isn't benign.

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:Hi.

This thread was removed for a bit, because the moderator believed that the subject might best be discussed in a private setting, such as through e-mail. However, I've moved it back to the live forum, and have removed the Notice that was sent to the OP, so that I can discuss this situation.

When we remove a post, we send a Notice. We do so in cases where the person posting was just fine, but they quoted or referred to objectionable content. In other words, Member A posts something unacceptable. Member B then might write, with all intentions of being truly helpful, "Hey, Member A, you should remove your post because it's [rude / unconstructive / unacceptable in some way]." When Member B does that, they actually quote the unacceptable content.

One of our moderators comes along or reads a member report, notes the original content, and removes it. They then need to also remove the post that contains the quote... because why remove objectionable content and let quotes of it remain in place, right? When they remove the post with the quote, the system requires that they send a Notice, and there are no zero-point Notices within the forum system. But this is important: A single point expires in 24 hours, and a single point has no impact on someone's ability to do anything at all on the forums.

I wish we could change the ominous "You have been warned!" message to something more benign. We can't. :( But what I have done is put through some messaging that forum moderators can use that lets members know "Hey, you see a point but no worries, you're not being penalized and the point will float into nothingness in a single day."

So where the OP in this thread was told they received "no points or penalty" the mods will now make it clearer, saying something like this: "Your post was removed because it quoted or directly referred to a post by another forum member that we were required to remove because it wasn’t acceptable on our forums. You were not given any penalty related to your own comments, and the single Notice point will expire in 24 hours. You are welcome to re-post your comments if you do not quote or refer to the removed comment(s)."

I hope that all explains what we do, why we do it, and how a Notice is, in most cases, either a "Hey, please reconsider posting as you did" or, in the uncommon situations where we have to remove quoted objectionable content, "Hey, you're fine, you did nothing wrong, but we need to remove this post (we provide the quote) and the Notice point you receive is harmless."

Does that all make sense to you?

Hey Gaile, I don't know if you have the answer, or maybe you do but aren't allowed to share it. But is this limitation a limitation with Vanilla's software itself? Or is it more of a limitation in the sense that its not important enough to spend time and money negotiating with Vanilla to change it?

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:Happy to provide some info and context for this issue. It's minor, but I don't want anyone to be overly concerned about it.

About lock/removal notifications: We do not have a notification system for removals or locks. We've added a lot of custom features, but I cannot justify the cost, time, and focus required for adding such a feature; nor do I know if Vanilla would be willing to accept such a request on their backlog. I'll look into whether Vanilla has existing add-ons that would allow us to give that sort of notification, but because the list of notifications is standard, and because type that is not included, I do not believe that sort of functionality if available. Therefore, I suggest that if something "disappears" it's safe to assume it was objectionable, it quoted objectionable content, or, in rare cases, that the OP themselves asked for the thread's removal and the moderators reviewed and concurred that we could fulfill that request.

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:Thanks for clarifying, Gaile. The new phrasing is much better (although I hate that you can't dish out "zero points" for something benign, as in your example).

---

On a related note: should we be receiving notifications when a thread in which we've posted is locked & hidden? Or do we just have to live with mysterious disappearances of comments?

Thanks for the answer. It was just a feature of the old forums, so I had gotten used to it. I apologize if that came across as "overly concerned;" I don't think it's worth your time to check with Vanilla.

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:Hi.

This thread was removed for a bit, because the moderator believed that the subject might best be discussed in a private setting, such as through e-mail. However, I've moved it back to the live forum, and have removed the Notice that was sent to the OP, so that I can discuss this situation.

When we remove a post, we send a Notice. We do so in cases where the person posting was just fine, but they quoted or referred to objectionable content. In other words, Member A posts something unacceptable. Member B then might write, with all intentions of being truly helpful, "Hey, Member A, you should remove your post because it's [rude / unconstructive / unacceptable in some way]." When Member B does that, they actually quote the unacceptable content.

One of our moderators comes along or reads a member report, notes the original content, and removes it. They then need to also remove the post that contains the quote... because why remove objectionable content and let quotes of it remain in place, right? When they remove the post with the quote, the system requires that they send a Notice, and there are no zero-point Notices within the forum system. But this is important: A single point expires in 24 hours, and a single point has no impact on someone's ability to do anything at all on the forums.

I wish we could change the ominous "You have been warned!" message to something more benign. We can't. :( But what I have done is put through some messaging that forum moderators can use that lets members know "Hey, you see a point but no worries, you're not being penalized and the point will float into nothingness in a single day."

So where the OP in this thread was told they received "no points or penalty" the mods will now make it clearer, saying something like this: "Your post was removed because it quoted or directly referred to a post by another forum member that we were required to remove because it wasn’t acceptable on our forums. You were not given any penalty related to your own comments, and the single Notice point will expire in 24 hours. You are welcome to re-post your comments if you do not quote or refer to the removed comment(s)."

I hope that all explains what we do, why we do it, and how a Notice is, in most cases, either a "Hey, please reconsider posting as you did" or, in the uncommon situations where we have to remove quoted objectionable content, "Hey, you're fine, you did nothing wrong, but we need to remove this post (we provide the quote) and the Notice point you receive is harmless."

Does that all make sense to you?

OP here, thanks so much for clearing that up Gaile. I'm hoping that the wording of the messages that the moderators send will make it more apparent what is happening in the future.

Funny how people always hide behind the software. If you use software that does something stupid it does something stupid. As a customer/end user I do not care if it is the software that "cannot be changed" that does something stupid. Software doesn't do anything on it's own. A developer made it. It is a management decision to accept the stupidity or not. You don't have to use crappy forum software, that is a choice. Clearly ArenaNet made the choice to use less than perfect forum software. Clearly ArenaNet made the choice to not do anything about the stupidity. Don't hide behind software, be honest and say you don't want to pay for it.

At least Gaile tried to make the message better that is send because of the stupid software. Hopefully that will help innocent players "attacked" by the stupid software.