12- 12 Necromancer Changes

Optimistic! Was expecting a nerf catastrophe because pvp players do not like playing against scourge, but instead it looks like slight buffs.

Feast of Corruption: Torment has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 4 seconds to 1 stack for 8 seconds.Chillblains: Poison has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 5 seconds to 2 stacks for 8 seconds.Deathly Chill: Bleeding has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 5 seconds to 2 stacks for 8 seconds in PvE.Dark Water: Poison has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 6 seconds to 1 stack for 12 seconds.Harrowing Wave: Burning has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 3 seconds to 1 stack for 8 seconds. Torment has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 3 seconds to 2 stacks for 6 seconds.Oppressive Collapse: Torment has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 6 seconds to 2 stacks for 9 seconds.Serpent Siphon: Poison has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds.Plaguelands: Burning has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds.Necrotic Traversal: Poison has been adjusted from 3 stacks for 6 seconds to 2 stacks for 9 seconds.Punishment Skills: Adjusted torment from 2 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds.Desert Shroud: Torment stacks per hit have been adjusted from 2 stacks for 4 seconds to 1 stack for 10 seconds in PvE. The PvP and WvW version has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 2 seconds to 1 stack for 5 seconds.Speed of Shadows: Fixed a bug in which this trait failed to remove all instances of the listed conditions.Rending Claws: Increased damage by 13%.Ghastly Claws: Increased damage by 11%.Unholy Feast: Increased damage by 10%.Dhuumfire: Fixed a bug that prevented this trait from inflicting burning when multiple scourge profession skills were activated at the same time.Death's Embrace: Increased vulnerability stacks from 1 to 5 and increased duration from 5 seconds to 8 seconds. Increased enemy health threshold from 33% to 50%. Vulnerability can now only be applied to the same foe once every 10 seconds.Unholy Fervor: This trait has been reworked and renamed Dread. It now causes fear you apply to also inflict 10 stacks of vulnerability for 5 seconds. It also causes attacks against foes inflicted with fear to deal 20% more damage.Spiteful Talisman: This trait now reduces the recharge time of axe skills in addition to focus skills.>

Most of the changes are condition burst related. Scourge relied on condition burst for kills in pvp, and is probably nerfed, the Dhummfire change notwithstanding, but I think that the global changes will work to the Necromancer's favor, making Consume Conditions a bigger and more reliable heal.

But raid necromancers will now have their fears count as a +20 % vulnerability. A unique buff for necromancers in raids! Real utility! This could be big, but needs to be tested. It's a worthless trait if it doesn't apply to your allies too. The fears, if used as a damage buff, can't be used as a CC and are really short. Also Necromancer has a lot less access to fear than most people think.

Then, a comical 10% damage boost to axe. I thought we only got axe buffs when necromancer gets nerfs. One of these days, it will be a real weapon. (Anet, please fix focus).

Dhuumfire change looks like a buff. Did the big nerf in the previous patch get revered?

Dhuumfire change looks like a buff. Did the big nerf in the previous patch get revered?

It was never nerfed. It was always bugged but now its been fixed hence the tag "fixed a bug". People were just over-reacting and readying the pitchforks because they figured out something people knew from all the way back to the beta weekends with scourge.

I like the Axe changes as well as the changes in Spite. I can now safely take Awaken the Pain with my axe on my Power Reaper without having to worry about damage reduction. The damage from Unholy Fervor has been made base and the recharge boost has been given to Spiteful Talisman, a necessary trait in most power builds. This is good. Not a fan of the lack of bust on condi, but I do understand the reasoning.

Unholy fervor was the axe trait and it's gone. So the new axe changes basically give you the damage buff of the trait for free and moved the recharge part of the trait to spiteful talisman.

The new fear vulnerability trait now competes against the might/power trait. I imagine that Condition Duration geared necromancers will chiefly benefit from this new trait, while power users take the might trait.

@nekretaal.6485 said:Then, a comical 10% damage boost to axe. I thought we only got axe buffs when necromancer gets nerfs. One of these days, it will be a real weapon. (Anet, please fix focus).Axe Spite Mastertrait damage is baseline now and the cooldown reduction went to Spiteful Talisman (which every PvE Power Reaper uses), so that Power Reapers now can pick Awaken the Pain without sacrificing Axe damage.

This is a well thought out buff to PvE Power Reapers and Axe/Focus PvP users (like me), too. I have now a fully buffed ranged weaponset on top of Chill of Death. Nice!

The axe buffs, as some1 said in another post, was to counteract the loss of 10% axe damage from the changes to unholy fervor, we basically went -1 +1 on axe. The fear change is meh, there is no reliable application of fear in a raid scenario to make that bonus damage work in any useful or meaningful way. At best this trait makes terrify+shivers of dread+bitter chill stack alot of vulnerability.

What really gets to me this patch the change they gave to warrior: "Stick and Move: This trait has been renamed Pinnacle of Strength, and its functionality has been changed. Might now grants you an additional 10 power per stack at level 80." That is EXACTLY what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus condi damage you get from might. But hey necro right, gotta loose something for that mediocrity.

@KrHome.1920 said:

@nekretaal.6485 said:Then, a comical 10% damage boost to axe. I thought we only got axe buffs when necromancer gets nerfs. One of these days, it will be a real weapon. (Anet, please fix focus).Axe Spite Mastertrait damage is baseline now and the cooldown reduction went to Spiteful Talisman (which every PvE Power Reaper uses), so that Power Reapers now can pick Awaken the Pain without sacrificing Axe damage.

Yeah. I love the changes. Not being able to take Awaken the Pain as an axe reaper was a bummer. This is good.

But how bout the barrier buffs? Do we like that?

The problem with the might & extra power changes was that necromancer weapons (even great sword) scale awfully with extra power. This is not true for warrior.

@"Sigmoid.7082" said:

Dhuumfire change looks like a buff. Did the big nerf in the previous patch get revered?

Finaly they fix it! Now they "only" need to fix the obstructed for shades

Barrier buffs are nice, makes it much more reliable

@"Sephylon.4938" said:The axe buffs, as some1 said in another post, was to counteract the loss of 10% axe damage from the changes to unholy fervor, we basically went -1 +1 on axe. The fear change is meh, there is no reliable application of fear in a raid scenario to make that bonus damage work in any useful or meaningful way. At best this trait makes terrify+shivers of dread+bitter chill stack alot of vulnerability.

What really gets to me this patch the change they gave to warrior: "Stick and Move: This trait has been renamed Pinnacle of Strength, and its functionality has been changed. Might now grants you an additional 10 power per stack at level 80." That is EXACTLY what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus condi damage you get from might. But hey necro right, gotta loose something for that mediocrity.

THAT

i mean... give power warrior the extra 10 power. but handle it like necro and reduce the damage on dodge by 20%-50% <.< (i crits for 3k-5k in wvw roaming. wtf)."you have to make a deal" sometimes feels like making a deal with the devil - since necro is the only one in contact with "the devil" hence good buffs come at a price ahaha. (another roleplay attempt. sorry guys)

but... besides that i feel like the changes where not too bad. the condi side looks still fine. in pve ... not much changed.and power got some sweets. axe and focus skills reduced in one skill and dmg increase on axe since the axe-trait got replaced. (thats a big plus for pvp. although defense is still nuts)something is still bothering me. i went to the golem and can not pull off my 27k dps anymore (power reaper) instead i sit at 23k. and i basically changed nothing :-/

@"Sephylon.4938" said:What really gets to me this patch the change they gave to warrior: "Stick and Move: This trait has been renamed Pinnacle of Strength, and its functionality has been changed. Might now grants you an additional 10 power per stack at level 80." That is EXACTLY what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus condi damage you get from might. But hey necro right, gotta loose something for that mediocrity.But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

@Sephylon.4938 said:

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

But it isn't a +10% damage anymore if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.

Dark Water: Poison has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 6 seconds to 1 stack for 12 seconds.

Anyone else smiled at the underwater skill change?

@Vitali.5039 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

I'm sorry, but I'm not quite understanding what you're saying. Can you please clarify what you mean by "+10% damage anymore if <100% endurance anymore:".

@Dadnir.5038 said:

Dark Water: Poison has been adjusted from 2 stacks for 6 seconds to 1 stack for 12 seconds.

I did

How do the changes play out in PvP? Trading stack application for duration will make condi clears more powerful.

@Anchoku.8142 said:How do the changes play out in PvP? Trading stack application for duration will make condi clears more powerful.

That's exactly the intent. No more melting people.

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Vitali.5039 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

But it isn't a +10% damage if <100% endurance anymore: better for PvE and Worse vs players.No tradeoff is good, counting that its a minor trait: our is a major and we'll pick it only if we want.Stick and move has been changed, you don't get 10% damage while endurance isn't full anymore. It now does what awaken the pain does, except it doesn't reduce the bonus to condi damage you get with might. The fact that warriors now get virtually the same functionality without the trade off is what irks me.

Thay had a damage increase trait that got changed into another damage increase trait, both of them (the old and the new version) into a minor trait spot.Their damage will be better at high might stack but VS players the increased damage will be lower thanks to boon corruption and boon rip.

We got a choice when running Spite: picking Awaken the Pain or not. This could not be possible for Strenght Warriors.Strenght is a line that also have condition traits: what about condition Hammer builds running Strenght? Could it be fair for them to have reduced condition damage gain from Might? We got a good power buff with Awaken the Pain (that we can pick or not) changing a useless trait, their minor were a good trait and making it lower condition damage only for choosing Strenght could have been pretty stupid.

I'm not saying that lowering our condition damage was right but that making "pay a toll" to warriors was wrong.

I have a major issue with the mirage changes this round honestly it seems like they gave them the opposite of what the patch was intended to do.Warriors get a minor trait that does what one of our choosable spite traits does without having the negative cost bleh....

That saidThe condi changes i could care less for it just makes necro condi even less viable imo for how slow necros are with casting i dont think they needed as many condi changes as other professions.

On the power side.

• Free axe damage again for the 15th time in a row or so slowly axe might get to daggers level after another 10 patches
• The fear trait is interesting IF WE HAD MORE FEAR UPTIME to actually make use of it. Fear trait will be useful for at most 1 to 2 hits if you are lucky Baseline fears are weak and traited fears are still underwhelming.Expertise is pointless on a power build as thats made for condition users so here we are again with a conflicting trait that make very little sense on the necros kit. Prob will test it once or twice but it likely wont be as good enough to compete with the might trait or lesser spinal shivers trait.
• Death’s Embrace was a great change moving it from 33% proc to 50% proc

Although im still hoping for more changes that are not so conflicting in the future anet keeps doing this to necromancers but not to other professions. well maybe rev gets it too... lol

That is a valid point vitali, and you bring up points I haven't considered. Though, I must clarify, I'm not asking for Pinnacle of Strength to work like awaken the pain in that it should reduce the bonus to condi damage we get from might, no. Rather I a masking for the opposite; for awaken the pain to work like pinnacle of strength so as to allow chill bleed hybrid reapers to work better. Currently, the way awaken the pain is right now, reaper's condi output is hampered by the trait and as for the other two trits, the changes to unholy fervor have yet to be tested so I can't speak for it, while chill of death is too situational in my opinion to be of much use. As I see it right now, the only option for hybrid reapers is to opt out of spite in favour of curses or blood magic along with soul reaping.

p.s. I mainly speak from a pve stand point, more specifically t4 fractals and raids, I have some experience with pvp/wvw but I am not as learned as others when it comes to them as I am not excited by them. Additionally, the recent changes to on interrupt traits and defiance bars, along with this conversation, has given me something I want to try out on my warrior: hybrid sword/torch+hammer. I know it'll probably be horrible, but at best, it'll be like a train wreck: you just have to see it.

@Sephylon.4938 said:That is a valid point vitali, and you bring up points I haven't considered. Though, I must clarify, I'm not asking for Pinnacle of Strength to work like awaken the pain in that it should reduce the bonus to condi damage we get from might, no. Rather I a masking for the opposite; for awaken the pain to work like pinnacle of strength so as to allow chill bleed hybrid reapers to work better. Currently, the way awaken the pain is right now, reaper's condi output is hampered by the trait and as for the other two trits, the changes to unholy fervor have yet to be tested so I can't speak for it, while chill of death is too situational in my opinion to be of much use. As I see it right now, the only option for hybrid reapers is to opt out of spite in favour of curses or blood magic along with soul reaping.

p.s. I mainly speak from a pve stand point, more specifically t4 fractals and raids, I have some experience with pvp/wvw but I am not as learned as others when it comes to them as I am not excited by them. Additionally, the recent changes to on interrupt traits and defiance bars, along with this conversation, has given me something I want to try out on my warrior: hybrid sword/torch+hammer. I know it'll probably be horrible, but at best, it'll be like a train wreck: you just have to see it.

Considering they dont want reaper to be condition i doubt you will see this change. To be hoenst reaper should not even have the bleed on chill trait anymore.Scourge has no real power trait options within its kit why should a power spec like reaper have a condition trait on its grand master. Every other trait the only conditions that come up are movement impairing conditions.

@ZDragon.3046 said:

@"Sephylon.4938" said:That is a valid point vitali, and you bring up points I haven't considered. Though, I must clarify, I'm not asking for Pinnacle of Strength to work like awaken the pain in that it should reduce the bonus to condi damage we get from might, no. Rather I a masking for the opposite; for awaken the pain to work like pinnacle of strength so as to allow chill bleed hybrid reapers to work better. Currently, the way awaken the pain is right now, reaper's condi output is hampered by the trait and as for the other two trits, the changes to unholy fervor have yet to be tested so I can't speak for it, while chill of death is too situational in my opinion to be of much use. As I see it right now, the only option for hybrid reapers is to opt out of spite in favour of curses or blood magic along with soul reaping.

p.s. I mainly speak from a pve stand point, more specifically t4 fractals and raids, I have some experience with pvp/wvw but I am not as learned as others when it comes to them as I am not excited by them. Additionally, the recent changes to on interrupt traits and defiance bars, along with this conversation, has given me something I want to try out on my warrior: hybrid sword/torch+hammer. I know it'll probably be horrible, but at best, it'll be like a train wreck: you just have to see it.

The said trait is in core necromancer, it can effectively affect all e-spec (or not) of the necromancer. E-specs should not be restricted to a single kind of damage, unlike what you seem to think. Honnestly, what you say about the reaper is somewhat concerning. The reaper, right now, have reduced survivability so it's not tanky and it doesn't have "support", this litterally leave him just one choice which DPS in which he is not even on par with the DPS top dogs. And you would want to restricted this dps to power damage? Even weaver can do more than just power DPS.