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How many WvW guilds must leave the game?


MadBomber.3719

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Ever hear that song "Blowing in the Wind" by Bob Dylan? here are some lyrics I have severely butchered

Yes, and how many years can a gamemode sustainBefore it sustain no more?Yes, and how many years can some guilds existBefore they all leave the game?Yes, and how many times can anet turn it's headAnd pretend that everything is fine?

The answer, my friend, is blowin' in the windThe answer is blowin' in the wind.

the point is... 3 major NA WvW guilds have left the game in the last 2 months a 4th is about to go on haitus from the game in the coming week. if anet doesnt act quickly more and more guilds will leave. fights are becoming stale to non-existent. linkings and current matchups are not working. everyone is tanking to avoid T1, other servers are blacking out to open up. things are mess right now. No one knows the direction of where anet is taking WvW. can we get a statement, AMA, anything at this point from anet?? nothing was answered at the last AMA. PVP seems to be having some fruitful discussions lately, i hope the wvw team consider doing something similar. please send help.

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@coglin.1496 said:You appear to have no actual understanding of anyone's motivations.

T1 for example communities are not tanking to avoid T1. They organized as a community, to minimize playtime as a server, in order to get their closed servers to open up and unlock.

Thats only JQ afaik. but please tell me more. Mag and BG are the only other closed servers (unless API is totally wrong) and mag doesnt want to open. please get an understanding yourself before you tell others to

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@MadBomber.3719 said:

@coglin.1496 said:You appear to have no actual understanding of anyone's motivations.

T1 for example communities are not tanking to avoid T1. They organized as a community, to minimize playtime as a server, in order to get their closed servers to open up and unlock.

Thats only JQ afaik. but please tell me more. Mag and BG are the only other closed servers and mag doesnt want to open. please get an understanding yourself before you tell others to

As far as BG goes, I do not claim to speak for them. Play time has been down, but I see it as a combination of boredom and serveral active WvW guilds have transferred. There are some core guilds on BG and the Militia population as far as numbers is pretty unmatched.

No blackout on BG to my limited knowledge has been called for.

Mag is their own animal. I wouldn't begin to comment on them.

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The game is five years old. It would be amazing if there weren't dozens of guilds leaving the game, burnt-out players, or anything other than a gradual decrease in participation in the game mode that has changed the least. People simply can't sustain interest for that long. Interests change, real life intervenes, and newer, shinier things distract us. It takes a lot of work to counteract the social entropy: for guilds to remain, they have to work hard to invigorate veterans with challenges and attract fresh blood.

So it's almost meaningless to say that participation is declining or that guilds are leaving WvW. It's annoying, frustrating, and potentially depressing, but it's also a fact of gaming that people move on.

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@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:The game is five years old. It would be amazing if there weren't dozens of guilds leaving the game, burnt-out players, or anything other than a gradual decrease in participation in the game mode that has changed the least. People simply can't sustain interest for that long. Interests change, real life intervenes, and newer, shinier things distract us. It takes a lot of work to counteract the social entropy: for guilds to remain, they have to work hard to invigorate veterans with challenges and attract fresh blood.

So it's almost meaningless to say that participation is declining or that guilds are leaving WvW. It's annoying, frustrating, and potentially depressing, but it's also a fact of gaming that people move on.

all true. guilds/ players will leave the game naturally as the game gets older in age but you cant deny the fact that the current state of WvW isnt having an affect on the recent exodus of guilds.

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@MadBomber.3719 said:

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:The game is five years old. It would be amazing if there weren't dozens of guilds leaving the game, burnt-out players, or anything other than a gradual decrease in participation in the game mode that has changed the least. People simply can't sustain interest for that long. Interests change, real life intervenes, and newer, shinier things distract us. It takes a lot of work to counteract the social entropy: for guilds to remain, they have to work hard to invigorate veterans with challenges and attract fresh blood.

So it's almost meaningless to say that participation is declining or that guilds are leaving WvW. It's annoying, frustrating, and potentially depressing, but it's also a fact of gaming that people move on.

all true. guilds/ players will leave the game naturally as the game gets older in age but you cant deny the fact that the current state of WvW isnt having an affect on the recent exodus of guilds.

I don't see evidence that the "current state" is anything different from previous "current states" in which people declared that the end was nigh. As long as there are people who like ZvZ or roaming, there will be competitive WvW. And no matter how good it gets, people will keep leaving, too.

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@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

I don't see evidence that the "current state" is anything different from previous "current states" in which people declared that the end was nigh. As long as there are people who like ZvZ or roaming, there will be competitive WvW. And no matter how good it gets, people will keep leaving, too.

although you arent wrong, that mindset is probably why anet continues to neglect wvw. "people still playing everything is fine!"so at what point do you draw the line and say things arent ok? my point is how many guilds/ players will have to stop playing before it really is too late?

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@coglin.1496 said:You appear to have no actual understanding of anyone's motivations.

T1 for example communities are not tanking to avoid T1. They organized as a community, to minimize playtime as a server, in order to get their closed servers to open up and unlock.

Well that's a bunch of garbage.

An understanding of the hundreds who have left the game - over 250 of my own friends - gone - aren't playing any longer, would be great if you were to acknowledge, if you have played the whole five plus years the game has been out.

I think it's you who have no idea what is going on in WvW and that we've lost people because of ridiculous past changes cough links, no competition (tourneys) and atotal lack of interest by the company we are hoping will not completely destroy one of the best gaming modes ever to allow hundreds of playersto play at any one time.

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@MadBomber.3719 said:

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

I don't see evidence that the "current state" is anything different from previous "current states" in which people declared that the end was nigh. As long as there are people who like ZvZ or roaming, there will be competitive WvW. And no matter how good it gets, people will keep leaving, too.

although you arent wrong, that mindset is probably why anet continues to neglect wvw. "people still playing everything is fine!"so at what point do you draw the line and say things arent ok? my point is how many guilds/ players will have to stop playing before it really is too late?

I am not saying "everything is fine". I just don't think that today|this week|this month is any different from last week or last year.

In other threads, I've acknowledged that changing WvW is horribly challenging; there are so many moving parts, it's easy to work hard and have no impact or make a small change that screws up everything. So I can accept the developers' word that things happen slowly.

On the other hand, I wish they would adopt some sort of new engagement philosophy: chat with the community regularly about the big picture, find little things to try out, and experiment. If, for example, we knew that every four weeks the devs would introduce some sort of ...something, there would be interest in showing up just to see what's up. People might hate or love the change and ANet could decide to bring it back permanently or not.

They've done something like that in very short bursts, but never committed to it long term. Add new siege or change siege cooldowns or damage. Make NPCs weaker or stronger, more durable or more cheeze. Change the Bloodlust bonuses (add MF or skirmish points or ...). Mix it up.

Or put another way, all of us reach a point where we think the end is nigh, if for no other reason than we don't see anything changing in the game mode except that a lot our friends and familiar roaming partners stop playing. The only way for ANet to combat that is to distract us with little things while they work on epic changes (assuming that they are working on epic changes; it's hard to tell from what they've said, let alone what we've seen).

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Though the game is 5 years old and I would expect population to decline, I've always felt that wvwers were never really part of the gw2 community. Like we were always on this island having no advocate.

Honestly, I think they are fine with the competitive guilds moving on. WvW is dynamic and ever changing with little the devs can do to control it. I believe that is why they have a hands off approach most of the time. 90% of the time when they change something, it's for the worst in our eyes so kinda don't blame them. On the other hand, most of their changes are very questionable.

So they probably ask themselves why do we even bother with those fussy kids in wvw.

Fortunately, some guild at launch corrupted me and I've been in wvw since the start so I'm part of the fussy club :)

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@Odokuro.5049 said:All the Guilds that believe WvW is their GvG playground and they don't need to work with the other Guilds that are trying to capture points and defend objectives.

According to everyone else on this forum, GvG is dead, so based on that assumption, you're trying to make something out of nothing. We at least take our GvGs to OS or guild halls...it's the only way to eliminate the pug and siege factors.

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@Sylvyn.4750 said:

@"Odokuro.5049" said:All the Guilds that believe WvW is their GvG playground and they don't need to work with the other Guilds that are trying to capture points and defend objectives.

According to everyone else on this forum, GvG is dead, so based on that assumption, you're trying to make something out of nothing. We at least take our GvGs to OS or guild halls...it's the only way to eliminate the pug and siege factors.

Well on Yaks Bend, there are a lot of Guilds that bunch up together to GvG at locations such as behind the South Camp on Alpine maps, and other locations on the maps, I don't care if you're fighting in OSanctum, since that doesn't effect the Queue for the maps, but saying it's "Dead", is far from the truth.

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You just need to evolve or play something else. WvW will never be as great as it once was. A lot of PvE type people are now playing WvW as some of the more popular classes are super easy to play and require very minimal skill to play. That is the way it is in most PvE content, and that is what Anet makes the most money off of. So figure a way out to outsmart these new players and their easy mode classes. Were there is a will, there is a way.

But coming on the forums and complaining about it helps nobody.

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@Malerian.8435 said:You just need to evolve or play something else. WvW will never be as great as it once was. A lot of PvE type people are now playing WvW as some of the more popular classes are super easy to play and require very minimal skill to play. That is the way it is in most PvE content, and that is what Anet makes the most money off of. So figure a way out to outsmart these new players and their easy mode classes. Were there is a will, there is a way.

But coming on the forums and complaining about it helps nobody.

your post helps no one either but ok. no one here was talking about skill ceiling/ playstyle being the issue.

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@atheria.2837 said:

@coglin.1496 said:You appear to have no actual understanding of anyone's motivations.

T1 for example communities are not tanking to avoid T1. They organized as a community, to minimize playtime as a server, in order to get their closed servers to open up and unlock.

Well that's a bunch of garbage.

An understanding of the hundreds who have left the game - over 250 of my own friends - gone - aren't playing any longer, would be great if you were to acknowledge, if you have played the whole five plus years the game has been out.

I think it's you who have no idea what is going on in WvW and that we've lost people because of ridiculous past changes
cough
links, no competition (tourneys) and atotal lack of interest by the company we are hoping will not completely destroy one of the best gaming modes ever to allow hundreds of playersto play at any one time.

You believe tournaments are healthy for this game mode? Tournaments almost destroyed WvW...Sit down.

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Well actually you were. But that's ok you seem a little upset and unable to understand what you actually wrote. Maybe rte-read your statement regarding being a major guild... Like you think your guild is better than others. So there you are talking about skill. It's ok to be mad sometimes. Maybe instead of complaining about stuff you evolve and become better than you were before. But no let's complain to Anet cause I do not like the way things are...

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@Malerian.8435 said:

@Malerian.8435 said:You just need to evolve or play something else. WvW will never be as great as it once was. A lot of PvE type people are now playing WvW as some of the more popular classes are super easy to play and require very minimal skill to play. That is the way it is in most PvE content, and that is what Anet makes the most money off of. So figure a way out to outsmart these new players and their easy mode classes. Were there is a will, there is a way.

But coming on the forums and complaining about it helps nobody.

your post helps no one either but ok. no one here was talking about skill ceiling/ playstyle being the issue.

Well actually you were. But that's ok you seem a little upset and unable to understand what you actually wrote. Maybe rte-read your statement regarding being a major guild... Like you think your guild is better than others. So there you are talking about skill. It's ok to be mad sometimes. Maybe instead of complaining about stuff you evolve and become better than you were before. But no let's complain to Anet cause I do not like the way things are...

im super hurt right now. please quote where i mentioned it was an issue. this thread was meant to be a call to action to Anet. im genuinely curious where you took it to be complaining about skill and trashtalking other guilds

where did i say my guild is better?? i havent even mentioned what guild im in?? what you are you talking about??

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@MadBomber.3719 said:

@Malerian.8435 said:You just need to evolve or play something else. WvW will never be as great as it once was. A lot of PvE type people are now playing WvW as some of the more popular classes are super easy to play and require very minimal skill to play. That is the way it is in most PvE content, and that is what Anet makes the most money off of. So figure a way out to outsmart these new players and their easy mode classes. Were there is a will, there is a way.

But coming on the forums and complaining about it helps nobody.

your post helps no one either but ok. no one here was talking about skill ceiling/ playstyle being the issue.

Ya you were lol. But w/e I am not going to argue with you as you are obviously a very sensitive person. Hate to hurt your feelings...

im super hurt right now. please quote where i mentioned it was an issue.

The whole post is a complaint. You are obviously hurt/upset things do not go the way you feel they aught to. Either play the game and evolve or do something else. Do not bring your negativity in here. It hurts everyone's chances of actually getting valuable responses from Anet.

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Guilds require a big investment in time and energy, its not always possible for people to do that on a consistent basis over a prolonged period of time. I have experience as an officer and leader in large guilds, talking hundreds of people (300-400). I like to say to people, that I would not wish this crap on anyone. It is natural that guilds/players will stop playing over time, because leadership cannot continue keeping commitments, and this will affect members' activity and morale.

Combine that with dissatisfaction with a game, real life stuff, or just plain boredom, and you will constantly see guilds die off. When it comes to competitive activity, it is very rare to see a guild that lasts for a long time. For every one guild I can think of that has been around for a long time, I can think of 10 that are no longer active.

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@MadBomber.3719 said:wait you thought major guild meant skill? i meant major in terms of numbers (running 20-30+ nightly). sorry if that offended you so easily. i'll make sure to clarify that next time. ill also be sure to write about rainbows and unicorns and how perfect wvw is.

Leave my rainbow unicorn finisher out of this. TASTE THE RAINBOW!

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