OP Updated: The reason 'Enemy of My Enemy' in the PoF Storyline is terrible — Guild Wars 2 Forums

OP Updated: The reason 'Enemy of My Enemy' in the PoF Storyline is terrible

Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
edited December 27, 2017 in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

The conclusions I came to throughout this thread // what was pointed out along the way (and what a war with words it was!):

Update: Okay, so yes, Lady Kasmeer is a Mesmer and Lady Kasmeer does make illusions, mind you, a terrible one at that (nothing I did not already know), and with that being said in mind, that has been my point throughout this entire discussion, yet nobody throughout this thread figured that out.

I believe the developers could have done a much better job at creating a more better, 'clearer' illusion of Archon Iberu, either as a 'overlay' over your character's entire body (fill it out more) OR as I have argued, a complete illusory, purple form of Archon Iberu that replaces your character's model, that which would still indicate it is in fact an 'illusion' used as a disguise.

Furthermore, throughout this discussion, somebody did prove that, yes, a depiction of Archon Iberu's illusion does exist on our character's model beyond a 'purple blob' efffect: https://i.imgur.com/gRdGOrz.jpg yet while the illusion shows up a little better on other races, the 'overlay' illusion of Archon Iberu is so underwhelmingly developed so as to not be very 'clear', notably at a distance, even on other races.

And in some cases, Archon Iberu's model does not show at all depending on a character's size/height, as shown in this screenshot I took: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa My screenshot proves the illusion of Archon Iberu's illusion is not scaled properly for all character sizes/heights.

The reason why I initially argued the illusion of Archon Iberu 'did not exist at all' is because I did not see Archon Iberu's illusion whatsoever on MY character during the Storyline (as seen in the screenshot I provided). Issues like that should not be a thing in any first playthrough in any Storyline.

The Achievement BUG nobody acknowledged throughout this thread: (an issue I tagged on my OP because it is relevant to the PoF Storyline)

Please fix the bug that keeps occurring in the 'The Departed' part of the Storyline for the achievement 'The Whole Story' that fails to get achieved, even after watching all memory events. I have done that part of the Storyline 4 times and still no achievement. I then looked up some forums, and apparently, the bug in 'The Whole Story' achievement has been going on for a while now. Why is the bug not getting fixed?

Feedback from other players would have been nice, yet pride got in the way to admit I was 100% right about this bug being an issue in the PoF Storyline.

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

My initial feedback:

In other parts of the game, even outside of instanced Storylines (where you get to disguise yourself as a certain group or an individual), we look like part of that group or look like that individual, yet when my character is supposed to be disguised as Archon Iberu, I look nothing like him, and in going through this part of the Storyline, the whole experience was ruined.

Why is our character model not changed to look like Archon Iberu? Lady Kasmeer Meade and Rytlock Brimstone are disguised, yet not us when playing through this part of the Storyline. And playing through Storylines is not just a one-time thing; I like to repeat the Storylines, so yes, something like this in the game is a big deal to me.

Player class should not matter during this part of the story. Anyone going through this part of the story should be disguised as Archon Iberu, and at his exact size/height. Instead, we have a small purple effect around our head. While that may not make sense if you are playing as an Asura (technically), it makes less sense with no disguise at all. The whole point of the 'Enemy of My Enemy' part of the Storyline is to fool everyone, and the Storyline does a very poor job at conveying deceit on our character's part, because we still look like we normally do, not like Archon Iberu.

As for the rest of PoF's Storyline, smooth sailing thus far!

Comments

  • I will assume our model don't change is the same excuse on why we can't use tonics and mount.
    Also, I just thought about it... at what point did we lose the disguise during the final mission?

    As you said, our model never changes and it's just a stupid aura so I never thought about it until now, but I don't recall having that aura during the end battle and if I did, how would Balthazar know it was me?

  • I recall that the "trick" was that we weren't using a disguise. At all. Canach and Rytlock are complaining quite heavily during this story section because the illusionary disguises they wore were uncomfortable. I remember that
    the Commander was asked by someone why they didn't have to wear the illusion as well, to which the response was something to the effect of "The Archon's bodyguards were all Awakened, but the Archon was not, so I didnt need a[n Awakened] disguise."

    It feels like I must have missed something, because there is no possible way that plan was put forth by either me or my friend's Commander as they went through the story; we are a Charr and Asura, respectively, of which there are almost none in the whole desert.

  • The reason is that more people probably prefer to see their character than those that want to be replaced by a different model.
    I thought it was great, we're being masked by an illusion. You can see the illusion depicted above your head, but you don't have to deal with a completely different model for no reason. It's an artistic choice, and it makes sense thematically.

    Tarnished Coast - Ranger (80), LB/S-D, Eagle/Wolf, Signet, M/S/NM |Daredevil|Ranger|Guardian
    |Scrapper|Necromancer|Berserker|Dragonhunter|Mesmer|Elementalist|Deadeye|Warrior|Herald
    |Daredevil|Reaper|Spellbreaker|Weaver|Chronomancer|Soulbeast|Holosmith|Revenant|Mirage

  • I can't tell if there is a game-wide direction, or if it's just one dev team vs. another. Back in Lake Doric we put on whole-body disguises during a heart quest, and in Bitterfrost Frontier we put on whole-body disguises after collecting armor pieces. These were open world disguises, not related to the story.

    Do the dev teams do their own thing, or is there a singular design to which they all work. Seems like a mixed bag to me.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Sevifor.1925 said:
    I recall that the "trick" was that we weren't using a disguise. At all. Canach and Rytlock are complaining quite heavily during this story section because the illusory disguises they wore were uncomfortable. I remember that

    Except the 'trick' is that we WERE using a disguise, just an illusory disguise cast on us by Lady Kasmeer (who is a Mesmer). It did just as good had everyone been using a non-illusory disguise. Furthermore, our character, as well Lady Kasmeer and Rytlock Brimstone, complained about the illusory outfits, except our character is always in our own outfit the entire Storyline (basically complaining about our original outfits we put on our character) when we should be looking like Archon Iberu no matter what class we are playing.

    @Sevifor.1925 said:
    the Commander was asked by someone why they didn't have to wear the illusion as well, to which the response was something to the effect of "The Archon's bodyguards were all Awakened, but the Archon was not, so I didnt need a[n Awakened] disguise."

    Nowhere in 'Enemy of My Enemy' is the Commander (our character) asked why he or she does not have to wear the illusory outfit. Furthermore, the entire Awakened Army knows Archon Iberu very well, despite being human, for reason being Palawa Joko is the one who converted Archon Iberu to serve him.

    You are missing a big part of Archon Iberu's role, and if you read the Wiki, it says, "Archon Iberu is a high-ranking officer in the Mordant Crescent. In the past, he had opposed Palawa Joko, but was eventually converted to serve him. Iberu rose to the high rank of Archon while still human and has taken to converting Elonians, who have fled north to locations such as Amnoon, into following Joko."

    @Sevifor.1925 said:
    It feels like I must have missed something, because there is no possible way that plan was put forth by either me or my friend's Commander as they went through the story; we are a Charr and Asura, respectively, of which there are almost none in the whole desert.

    Player class should not matter during this part of the story. Anyone going through this part of the story should be disguised as Archon Iberu, and at his exact size/height. Instead, we have a small purple effect around our head. While that may not make sense if you are playing as an Asura (technically), it makes less sense with no disguise at all. The whole point of the 'Enemy of My Enemy' part of the Storyline is to fool everyone, and the Storyline does a very poor job at conveying deceit on our character's part, because we still look like we normally do, not like Archon Iberu.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Klipso.8653 said:
    It's because we needed to be able to mount during those missions.
    Adding a buff icon and some purple fog is easier than creating an Archon Iberu character model with mount animations.

    That is no excuse because even in less-important parts of the game we can still disguise ourselves, either during a Storyline or outside a Storyline, and mind you, the new Mount animations work with those older parts of the game just fine.

    From what I have seen in game development videos IS if there are already-made models of either weapons, back attachments, armor (like we wear that 'attaches' to our character's body), OR whole character models, then all the developers do from there is 'replace' and/or 'attach' that model to our character's model (in the game code), because only the bare bones of a character itself is already coded to animate with all-existing animations. From there, anything can be put on your character.

    How do you think it works with Gem Store outfits? Do you really think the developers go through every single piece of armor to look right with every single animation in the game? Heck no. That would be a behemoth of work, and Gem Store outfits would be more than just 700 Gems.

    Hypothetically speaking, even if I WAS wrong in the above stated, then if Anet really DID go through every character outfit to ensure they look good during any animation, including but not limited to, the new Mount animations, then how much more work is it, really, to do the same with an Archon Iberu character model?

    The bottom line is Anet rushed this part of the Storyline, and because of that rush, playing through 'Enemy of My Enemy' makes no sense running around in our original character models instead of Archon Iberu in this part of the Storyline. Every other part in the game that calls for a disguise let's us go completely in disguise.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Kal Spiro.9745 said:
    The reason is that more people probably prefer to see their character than those that want to be replaced by a different model.
    I thought it was great, we're being masked by an illusion. You can see the illusion depicted above your head, but you don't have to deal with a completely different model for no reason. It's an artistic choice, and it makes sense thematically.

    Yet going in complete disguise in other parts of the game is fine? It only makes sense if you are to be disguised that you look like the disguise. Not doing so only ruins the 'concept' of going in disguise and in turn ruins the 'direction' of this part of the game.

    The issue is 'lack of consistency' with this part of PoF's Storyline vs. other parts of the game that calls for a complete disguise. That is not very hard to understand. It is a Storyline, after all, so yes, it will make better sense if our original character models are replace with Archon Iberu's model. This part of the Storyline should therefore not be any different from any other part of the game where we go in complete disguise.

  • The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Permanently Embiggened

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:
    The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Citation of any developer saying that or it is therefore not a valid excuse. And please explain why in older parts of the game when you go in disguise, and then Mount, that everything is just fine animation-wise?

    I do not understand in these forums where when valid issues are brought up, people like you find any way to discourage Anet to fix their blunders that stick out like a plank in one's eye. No wonder Anet is doing a poorer job than in earlier parts of the game; people simply do not care, and will accept anything in the game how you can get it, no matter if it's broken, looks bad, etc.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Ayumi Spender.1082 said:
    I will assume our model don't change is the same excuse on why we can't use tonics and mount.
    Also, I just thought about it... at what point did we lose the disguise during the final mission?

    As you said, our model never changes and it's just a stupid aura so I never thought about it until now, but I don't recall having that aura during the end battle and if I did, how would Balthazar know it was me?

    Tonics are one thing because they come in all shapes and sizes and would in turn not look visually appealing when Mounted. Therefore, it is not a matter of Anet's team not being able to code it, but a matter of most tonics not looking good on Mounts, and Anet knows that (big difference). However, not allowing us to Mount with an Archon Iberu model during a Storyline makes no sense whatsoever.

  • @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Ayumi Spender.1082 said:
    I will assume our model don't change is the same excuse on why we can't use tonics and mount.
    Also, I just thought about it... at what point did we lose the disguise during the final mission?

    As you said, our model never changes and it's just a stupid aura so I never thought about it until now, but I don't recall having that aura during the end battle and if I did, how would Balthazar know it was me?

    Tonics are one thing because they come in all shapes and sizes and would in turn not look visually appealing when Mounted. Therefore, it is not a matter of Anet's team not being able to code it, but a matter of most tonics not looking good on Mounts, and Anet knows that (big difference). However, not allowing us to Mount with an Archon Iberu model during a Storyline makes no sense whatsoever.

    Not if his shape and design does not work on it.
    There's a lot of humanoid tonics that we can use during battle, gliding, emotes, but can't on mounts.
    We've never seen Archon on a mount.

  • Cuon Alpinus.7645Cuon Alpinus.7645 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 19, 2017

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:
    The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Citation of any developer saying that or it is therefore not a valid excuse. And please explain why in older parts of the game when you go in disguise, and then Mount, that everything is just fine animation-wise?

    I do not understand in these forums where when valid issues are brought up, people like you find any way to discourage Anet to fix their blunders that stick out like a plank in one's eye. No wonder Anet is doing a poorer job than in earlier parts of the game; people simply do not care, and will accept anything in the game how you can get it, no matter if it's broken, looks bad, etc.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/74re46/pof_developer_ama_summary/

    "Currently you can’t use mounts while being transformed – This will likely stay. We currently don’t really really have different classifications of transforms(they are used in all sorts of ways across the game) and a lot of them that would be cause issues or balance concerns if we let you mount and remove the transform."

    In other words, in order to get mount TFs to work without breaking a whole lot of stuff, they'd have to retool the part of the engine/game that handles transformations- something that is going to be extremely difficult after 5 years of continuously building on the same antiquated engine. It'd be nice for there to be some more QoL stuff related to TF-mount interactions, like being automatically de-transformed, or hacking together a solution JUST for that story instance. I'm not saying they handled it as well as they possibly could, but there are definitely significant issues outside of their control for certain aspects.

    To say I don't care is ignorant and horribly assumptive. I do care about the quality of the game, but I understand that the dev team are human beings with limitations that are trying to put resources toward areas of the game which need a lot more attention.

    Permanently Embiggened

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I had this exact issue raised in another topic, sadly some people disagreed and claimed looking like Iberu would have been less fun.
    I prefer true immersion, but this was apparently a two camp issue where pleasing both sides would've been impossible

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • @Ayakaru.6583 said:
    I had this exact issue raised in another topic, sadly some people disagreed and claimed looking like Iberu would have been less fun.
    I prefer true immersion, but this was apparently a two camp issue where pleasing both sides would've been impossible

    No clue how it would be less fun as I still see my character in every other thing that's in the game/story.

    I guess being a Nuhoch during that one event in Tangled Depth was less fun because I wasn't playing as my actual character and roping the beetles with my tongue and making my arms somehow fling 3 or more of the beetles at a time in the pen.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayumi Spender.1082 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:
    I had this exact issue raised in another topic, sadly some people disagreed and claimed looking like Iberu would have been less fun.
    I prefer true immersion, but this was apparently a two camp issue where pleasing both sides would've been impossible

    No clue how it would be less fun as I still see my character in every other thing that's in the game/story.

    I guess being a Nuhoch during that one event in Tangled Depth was less fun because I wasn't playing as my actual character and roping the beetles with my tongue and making my arms somehow fling 3 or more of the beetles at a time in the pen.

    Its not my argument, just one raised a lot..
    I preferred real models over "everyone pretending I'm transformed"

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I would like to have an illusory disguise present in situations such as this. It would make that aspect of the story more impactful for me.

    That said, I can handwave it off as my character being able to see through an illusory disguise placed on himself if I have to.

    I am somewhat forgiving when a developer is trying to do something that is limited by their tech, but wonder why, if the tech limits their ability to do X well, they dont do Y instead. Everything has strenghts and weaknesses. Play to your strenghts. If you cant do X because of the limitations of your code, then find something within the scope of your code/engine/whatever's strenghts instead?

  • Felipe.1807Felipe.1807 Member ✭✭✭

    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

  • Zaklex.6308Zaklex.6308 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Personally, I wouldn't see the illusion of me being Iberu, everyone else would see me as Iberu but I would still see myself as me...that explains why we didn't see our characters transformed, at least that's a good enough reason for me.

    Yes...no...maybe...what do you want, can't you see I'm busy saving the world...AGAIN!

  • @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    I say it's because of Caithe then and not because you played as her.

    Also, it would've been even cheaper for Arenanet as they would've just had one voice actor to pay for us to be in a disguise until that one part in the middle of the story, the parts before transformation, and the final battle.

  • Ben K.6238Ben K.6238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's an illusion, not a disguise. Doesn't seem that unreasonable for the affected individual to experience it slightly differently than an outside observer.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

  • @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Kal Spiro.9745 said:
    The reason is that more people probably prefer to see their character than those that want to be replaced by a different model.
    I thought it was great, we're being masked by an illusion. You can see the illusion depicted above your head, but you don't have to deal with a completely different model for no reason. It's an artistic choice, and it makes sense thematically.

    Yet going in complete disguise in other parts of the game is fine? It only makes sense if you are to be disguised that you look like the disguise. Not doing so only ruins the 'concept' of going in disguise and in turn ruins the 'direction' of this part of the game.

    The issue is 'lack of consistency' with this part of PoF's Storyline vs. other parts of the game that calls for a complete disguise. That is not very hard to understand. It is a Storyline, after all, so yes, it will make better sense if our original character models are replace with Archon Iberu's model. This part of the Storyline should therefore not be any different from any other part of the game where we go in complete disguise.

    Sorry, but this sounds like QQing to me for the sake of QQing. They're allowed to go in a different direction. The concept was maintained, the execution was changed. It didn't affect anything, though. It enhanced my enjoyment of the event, it detracted from yours. Get over it, because if you're only argument is that they did it one way before so they must never do it any other way, that's a terrible argument. How about this. There is only one other instance I know of in which the player is shrouded in an illusion and that occurs in the beginning of the human story, which also makes it very old. But we've also never been shrouded by Kasmeer before, so lorewise, we can say that Kasmeer uses her spells differently. The result is that you can perceive yourself despite the illusion.

    Tarnished Coast - Ranger (80), LB/S-D, Eagle/Wolf, Signet, M/S/NM |Daredevil|Ranger|Guardian
    |Scrapper|Necromancer|Berserker|Dragonhunter|Mesmer|Elementalist|Deadeye|Warrior|Herald
    |Daredevil|Reaper|Spellbreaker|Weaver|Chronomancer|Soulbeast|Holosmith|Revenant|Mirage

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Kal Spiro.9745 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Kal Spiro.9745 said:
    The reason is that more people probably prefer to see their character than those that want to be replaced by a different model.
    I thought it was great, we're being masked by an illusion. You can see the illusion depicted above your head, but you don't have to deal with a completely different model for no reason. It's an artistic choice, and it makes sense thematically.

    Yet going in complete disguise in other parts of the game is fine? It only makes sense if you are to be disguised that you look like the disguise. Not doing so only ruins the 'concept' of going in disguise and in turn ruins the 'direction' of this part of the game.

    The issue is 'lack of consistency' with this part of PoF's Storyline vs. other parts of the game that calls for a complete disguise. That is not very hard to understand. It is a Storyline, after all, so yes, it will make better sense if our original character models are replace with Archon Iberu's model. This part of the Storyline should therefore not be any different from any other part of the game where we go in complete disguise.

    Sorry, but this sounds like QQing to me for the sake of QQing. They're allowed to go in a different direction. The concept was maintained, the execution was changed. It didn't affect anything, though. It enhanced my enjoyment of the event, it detracted from yours. Get over it, because if you're only argument is that they did it one way before so they must never do it any other way, that's a terrible argument. How about this. There is only one other instance I know of in which the player is shrouded in an illusion and that occurs in the beginning of the human story, which also makes it very old. But we've also never been shrouded by Kasmeer before, so lorewise, we can say that Kasmeer uses her spells differently. The result is that you can perceive yourself despite the illusion.

    Look, that's you guys' opinion, yet no matter what anyone says here, I stick by my words that how we are disguised (in the 'Enemy of My Enemy' part of PoF's Storyline) makes no sense whatsoever.

    How about we place our focus on the other elephant in the room in the OP for a moment, instead of reading a half and not a whole. What about 'The Whole Story' achievement BUG that's not been fixed for a while? You guys ridicule only one part of the OP, yet the second part in the OP is also relevant to the PoF Storyline.

  • Felipe.1807Felipe.1807 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

  • Cuddy.6247Cuddy.6247 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Klipso.8653 said:
    It's because we needed to be able to mount during those missions.
    Adding a buff icon and some purple fog is easier than creating an Archon Iberu character model with mount animations.

    That is no excuse because even in less-important parts of the game we can still disguise ourselves, either during a Storyline or outside a Storyline, and mind you, the new Mount animations work with those older parts of the game just fine.

    But you can't mount while disguised...

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Cuddy.6247 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Klipso.8653 said:
    It's because we needed to be able to mount during those missions.
    Adding a buff icon and some purple fog is easier than creating an Archon Iberu character model with mount animations.

    That is no excuse because even in less-important parts of the game we can still disguise ourselves, either during a Storyline or outside a Storyline, and mind you, the new Mount animations work with those older parts of the game just fine.

    But you can't mount while disguised...

    Then Anet should not code it like Tonics are coded. How hard is that? Just have the character model replaced immediately during 'The Departed' and 'My Enemy of My Enemy' parts of PoF's Storyline (and other parts) until the disguise no longer necessary.

    What is the difference between our original character model being able to Mount, mind you, each character wearing different outfits VS. a temporary model used for disguise during a Storyline?

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Zephire.8049Zephire.8049 Member ✭✭✭

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:
    Then Anet should not code it like Tonics are coded. How hard is that? Just have the character model replaced immediately during 'The Departed' and 'My Enemy of My Enemy' parts of PoF's Storyline (and other parts) until the disguise no longer necessary.

    What is the difference between our original character model being able to Mount, mind you, each character wearing different outfits VS. a temporary model used for disguise during a Storyline?

    Guild War 2's engine is approximately 15 years old. It's build off GW1's engine, which was NOT built with mounts in mind, and at this point is a giant pile of spaghetti code. The engine cannot even handle water anywhere above the Z-axis, to give you an idea of how old it is. GW2's engine was not modified with mounts in mind up until fairly recently, all things considered. If it takes the better part of a year for them to figure out how to add a keyring without breaking things, hacking together a fix to let you mount while transformed isn't going to be as easy as you seem to think it would be. It could be done, most likely, but with a ton of resources that would be better off spent on content or QoL issues that will benefit the majority.

    Even the size potions don't work with mounting because, as a dev stated (I believe in an AMA), it would require a heck of a lot of work to get transformations to work with mounts, plus having to go through and whitelisting some transformations (likely only the battle ones) and blacklisting the rest. Then there's also the consideration for the animations. Even with copy-pasting them from what they have now, there would still need to be tweaks to fit the model. The latter doesn't matter so much if only one transformation is allowed to mount, I'll grant you that, but all the other work still needs to be done.

    People have given you lore reasons why your character model doesn't change. People have given you tech reasons why your model doesn't change. People have given you resource reasons why your model doesn't change. Yet you continue to reject every single one of them.

    BTW: This is the aura everyone is talking about.

  • @Zephire.8049 said:
    The engine cannot even handle water anywhere above the Z-axis, to give you an idea of how old it is.

    I.... did not know that.
    So any maps that have water... they're all at the same exact level... Stupid me thought some were higher or lower than others depending on where you were on the map...

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Zephire.8049 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:
    Then Anet should not code it like Tonics are coded. How hard is that? Just have the character model replaced immediately during 'The Departed' and 'My Enemy of My Enemy' parts of PoF's Storyline (and other parts) until the disguise no longer necessary.

    What is the difference between our original character model being able to Mount, mind you, each character wearing different outfits VS. a temporary model used for disguise during a Storyline?

    Guild War 2's engine is approximately 15 years old. It's build off GW1's engine, which was NOT built with mounts in mind, and at this point is a giant pile of spaghetti code. The engine cannot even handle water anywhere above the Z-axis, to give you an idea of how old it is. GW2's engine was not modified with mounts in mind up until fairly recently, all things considered. If it takes the better part of a year for them to figure out how to add a keyring without breaking things, hacking together a fix to let you mount while transformed isn't going to be as easy as you seem to think it would be. It could be done, most likely, but with a ton of resources that would be better off spent on content or QoL issues that will benefit the majority.

    Even the size potions don't work with mounting because, as a dev stated (I believe in an AMA), it would require a heck of a lot of work to get transformations to work with mounts, plus having to go through and whitelisting some transformations (likely only the battle ones) and blacklisting the rest. Then there's also the consideration for the animations. Even with copy-pasting them from what they have now, there would still need to be tweaks to fit the model. The latter doesn't matter so much if only one transformation is allowed to mount, I'll grant you that, but all the other work still needs to be done.

    People have given you lore reasons why your character model doesn't change. People have given you tech reasons why your model doesn't change. People have given you resource reasons why your model doesn't change. Yet you continue to reject every single one of them.

    BTW: This is the aura everyone is talking about.

    Correction: You are the only one here in these comments who has given technical reasons that actually make sense, and while I understand how old GW2's engine is, I still question some of your claims and whether or not half of them still hold true to this day, given the fact the developers have done a few things to enhance the engine to perform and handle certain things it could not handle or perform before. The money being poured into this game is not just going toward Gem Store items and things of that nature alone.

    Furthermore, the link you provided with Archon's face above the Charr does not at all show up on my Charr, or my female human, for that matter. All I see (as I have said numerous times already) is a big purple blob effect that looks nothing like Archon Iberu. Here is my screenshot of my Charr vs. the Charr you linked: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa. Therefore, the illusory disguise of Archon Iberu is clearly not scaled properly for every race.

    Are you telling me there is no way for Anet's developers to either HIDE or REMOVE our character's model temporarily to show only the illusion of Archon Iberu throughout those parts of PoF's Storyline? I find that very hard to believe since the model of Archon Iberu is already there, just not in complete 3D form.

    On two of my character's, no depiction can be seen whatsoever of Archon Iberu. It shows up for that Charr in that screenshot, yet not my Char in my screenshot, and I have zoomed in, zoomed out, tried to /dance just so I can see a fraction of Archon Iberu's illusion, and nothing can be seen of him. The effect looks like garbage, to be honest with you, and it is not as 'obvious' as you and everyone else here makes it seem. Even in the screenshot you provided, the illusion is still a rough depiction of him.

    And when you said, "The latter doesn't matter so much if only one transformation is allowed to mount, I'll grant you that, but all the other work still needs to be done."

    What, sir, or ma'am, do you think my whole argument has been about? My argument is ONLY temporary models used for the sake of disguise are what should work with the Mounts, notably during Storylines. Nothing more or less. Throughout this entire thread, I never say I wanted Tonic disguises to work with the Mounts.

    As for the rest of the comments throughout this thread, many of those who commented gave no good responses worth taking serious whatsoever. One guy here even wrote:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Which makes me question if he or she even played the PoF Storyline or not, because clearly none of our characters sound like Archon Iberu, much less, look like him. And clearly the illusion of Archon Iberu is not so 'obvious' as proven in the screenshot I provided, and as proven even in the screenshot you provided. You have to actually zoom in and TRY to see the depiction of Archon iberu. I repeat, the illusion does not in any way, shape, or form stick out like a sore thumb like everyone has said here.

    And did I mention nobody thus far (yourself included) has mentioned anything regarding the second half of my OP that points out a glaringly obvious achievement bug? All people are focused on is the first half of the OP. I believe people in the comments here are too full of pride to admit I am 100% right about at least one thing, because a bug is a bug, and the bug has been around longer than it should have been.

  • Felipe.1807Felipe.1807 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 20, 2017

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    Come on man, you guys are smarter then this...is not even funny anymore lol...you guys are overthinking this way, WAY to much, to everyone around you, all the awakaned and your fellow dragons watch companions, you looks like and sounds like Iberu, and this is it...you have the mesmer effects around your character and if I remenber, theres even some effects added to your voice, the same way that was added to voice of the rest of Dragons Watch, basically telling us, the players, that we at that moment we sound like Iberu.
    And no, people really desliked playing with other characters apperence and complete different move set...not saying this was the main reason why was done this way, some people are talking about mounts...not sure, they could have just disable mounts during Iberu events and make a single Mounted Iberu model for the part that you have capture that branded thing.

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

    Okay, the image of big ugly fat chaar that you gave really dosent help at all...i would play the whole PoF with my chaar just to prove it too you, but thankfully someone else allready done it...here it goes

    Now please, my 6K gold. Even without any special effects aroud your character, you have "Ilusion buff" on you bar...that should be enough to any person realize that they look and sound like Iberu at that time.

  • I thought it made sense. I mean, I know that I'm me, of course I'm not fooled by a mesmer illusion to think I'm not me.
    I was quite pleased they went that route, even if just for mount convenience.

  • Ardid.7203Ardid.7203 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It made total sense to me. I'm not seeing myself as Iberu, only the others are. Is not something important, anyway, not to me at least.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    Come on man, you guys are smarter then this...is not even funny anymore lol...you guys are overthinking this way, WAY to much, to everyone around you, all the awakaned and your fellow dragons watch companions, you looks like and sounds like Iberu, and this is it...you have the mesmer effects around your character and if I remenber, theres even some effects added to your voice, the same way that was added to voice of the rest of Dragons Watch, basically telling us, the players, that we at that moment we sound like Iberu.
    And no, people really desliked playing with other characters apperence and complete different move set...not saying this was the main reason why was done this way, some people are talking about mounts...not sure, they could have just disable mounts during Iberu events and make a single Mounted Iberu model for the part that you have capture that branded thing.

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

    Okay, the image of big ugly fat chaar that you gave really dosent help at all...i would play the whole PoF with my chaar just to prove it too you, but thankfully someone else allready done it...here it goes

    Now please, my 6K gold. Even without any special effects aroud your character, you have "Ilusion buff" on you bar...that should be enough to any person realize that they look and sound like Iberu at that time.

    That really doesnt hold water.
    To me its a Charr with a faint purple glow. Not an Iberu illusion.
    Even the 'face' in purple cloud looks nothing like Iberu

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Ashen.2907Ashen.2907 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    The Caithe portion, if you are referring to the part of season2 I think you are, does not involve a disguise. We actually become her. We have an entirely new skill set. In many cases involving the use of a weapon that our profession could not otherwise use. We are responsible for the actions taken in that bit of story as we were in control of the character at the time. I disliked that bit, not because I disliked Caithe at the time, but because it required that I play someone else's build, and that my character perform despicable acts. Caithe was exonerated of all responsibility for those actions once it was established that the commander was controlling her body at the time.

  • zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭

    You have the mesmery aura around you and if you zoom in you can see archon's face be reflected above you.

    To others u look like him while you ur self look nomal but with a mesmer veil. Its the same for the rest that are changing looks but you dont see it since they are well disguised.

  • Felipe.1807Felipe.1807 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    Come on man, you guys are smarter then this...is not even funny anymore lol...you guys are overthinking this way, WAY to much, to everyone around you, all the awakaned and your fellow dragons watch companions, you looks like and sounds like Iberu, and this is it...you have the mesmer effects around your character and if I remenber, theres even some effects added to your voice, the same way that was added to voice of the rest of Dragons Watch, basically telling us, the players, that we at that moment we sound like Iberu.
    And no, people really desliked playing with other characters apperence and complete different move set...not saying this was the main reason why was done this way, some people are talking about mounts...not sure, they could have just disable mounts during Iberu events and make a single Mounted Iberu model for the part that you have capture that branded thing.

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

    Okay, the image of big ugly fat chaar that you gave really dosent help at all...i would play the whole PoF with my chaar just to prove it too you, but thankfully someone else allready done it...here it goes

    Now please, my 6K gold. Even without any special effects aroud your character, you have "Ilusion buff" on you bar...that should be enough to any person realize that they look and sound like Iberu at that time.

    That really doesnt hold water.
    To me its a Charr with a faint purple glow. Not an Iberu illusion.
    Even the 'face' in purple cloud looks nothing like Iberu

    okay, now i am 100% sure that you are just trolling...but anyway, Eidolonemesis.5640 i am still waiting for my 6K gold.

    "you don't conform to my way of thinking, therefore you must be trolling"

    Wrong, you just keep ignoring all facts. Kasmer is a mesmer, she is not a cosmic all powerfull entity that can manipulate matter and transform your character in Iberu, what she does is make a illusion...you can see this in game by the little buff that appear on your character and you have the visual effects, like the purple glowying and the Iberu "silhoutte" above your character...what else do you want, a message saying "Hey kitten, now you are kitten IBERU"....really dude this kitten is going longer then it should, its time to close this thread.

  • @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    Come on man, you guys are smarter then this...is not even funny anymore lol...you guys are overthinking this way, WAY to much, to everyone around you, all the awakaned and your fellow dragons watch companions, you looks like and sounds like Iberu, and this is it...you have the mesmer effects around your character and if I remenber, theres even some effects added to your voice, the same way that was added to voice of the rest of Dragons Watch, basically telling us, the players, that we at that moment we sound like Iberu.
    And no, people really desliked playing with other characters apperence and complete different move set...not saying this was the main reason why was done this way, some people are talking about mounts...not sure, they could have just disable mounts during Iberu events and make a single Mounted Iberu model for the part that you have capture that branded thing.

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

    Okay, the image of big ugly fat chaar that you gave really dosent help at all...i would play the whole PoF with my chaar just to prove it too you, but thankfully someone else allready done it...here it goes

    Now please, my 6K gold. Even without any special effects aroud your character, you have "Ilusion buff" on you bar...that should be enough to any person realize that they look and sound like Iberu at that time.

    That really doesnt hold water.
    To me its a Charr with a faint purple glow. Not an Iberu illusion.
    Even the 'face' in purple cloud looks nothing like Iberu

    okay, now i am 100% sure that you are just trolling...but anyway, Eidolonemesis.5640 i am still waiting for my 6K gold.

    "you don't conform to my way of thinking, therefore you must be trolling"

    Wrong, you just keep ignoring all facts. Kasmer is a mesmer, she is not a cosmic all powerfull entity that can manipulate matter and transform your character in Iberu, what she does is make a illusion...you can see this in game by the little buff that appear on your character and you have the visual effects, like the purple glowying and the Iberu "silhoutte" above your character...what else do you want, a message saying "Hey kitten, now you are kitten IBERU"....really dude this kitten is going longer then it should, its time to close this thread.

    She's fighting naked.
    To not take a fatal blow from getting hit with imaginary clothes on, I have to say she's manipulating matter.

  • @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    You can’t on low end PCs, all we got was a faint purple glow around the chest.
    And have you ever heard Iberu talk? Trust me, it sounds nothing like a any player character does.
    People who disliked the caithe portion, disliked caithe. There was nothing wrong with ‘assuming a role’

    Come on man, you guys are smarter then this...is not even funny anymore lol...you guys are overthinking this way, WAY to much, to everyone around you, all the awakaned and your fellow dragons watch companions, you looks like and sounds like Iberu, and this is it...you have the mesmer effects around your character and if I remenber, theres even some effects added to your voice, the same way that was added to voice of the rest of Dragons Watch, basically telling us, the players, that we at that moment we sound like Iberu.
    And no, people really desliked playing with other characters apperence and complete different move set...not saying this was the main reason why was done this way, some people are talking about mounts...not sure, they could have just disable mounts during Iberu events and make a single Mounted Iberu model for the part that you have capture that branded thing.

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    Jesus, is this for real? lol come on dude everyone is transformed on those story steps, you can clearly see the purple aura and Iberu silhoutte around your character, clearly indicating that you looks and sounds just like him...Anet probably done like this cause a lot of people didnt like to play as Caithe on some story episodes before HoT.

    Pardon my late reply.

    I played 'Enemy of My Enemy' on my Charr, and all I see is a purple blob effect that shows no such illusory silhouette, disguise, call it what you want. Even more the reason we should just be given an Archon Iberu model, notably a transparent purple one that replaces our character's model (to give off the idea of an illusion).

    I played both times with max size norn with heavy armor and spikes and all good stuff, and was pretty clear the purple effects and Iberu silhoutte around our character...maybe you aint paying attention to the details, or maybe you are playing with low setting, but still, the effects are there...again reason why we dont have our model replaced with Iberu like the rest of the NPCs was because before people didnt liked have to play with the apperence of other character(playing as Caithe during episodes pre-HoT), so they went with this way, we have to keep our apparence, but is clear that we should look like Iberu for those around us.

    Bro, I will give you 6K Gold if you can prove I look like Archon Iberu during 'Enemy of My Enemy', even a little bit: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa Go on. I'm waiting eats popcorn There is only the purple effect, and nothing more that shows. My argument is the visual of Archon Iberu AND the purple effect should be present, that which will still indicate it is an illusion. Why not both things at the same time?

    Okay, the image of big ugly fat chaar that you gave really dosent help at all...i would play the whole PoF with my chaar just to prove it too you, but thankfully someone else allready done it...here it goes

    Now please, my 6K gold. Even without any special effects aroud your character, you have "Ilusion buff" on you bar...that should be enough to any person realize that they look and sound like Iberu at that time.

    That really doesnt hold water.
    To me its a Charr with a faint purple glow. Not an Iberu illusion.
    Even the 'face' in purple cloud looks nothing like Iberu

    okay, now i am 100% sure that you are just trolling...but anyway, Eidolonemesis.5640 i am still waiting for my 6K gold.

    "you don't conform to my way of thinking, therefore you must be trolling"

    I think it was more, "You just said that the obvious picture of Iberu is not Iberu, you must be trolling."

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  • @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:
    The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Citation of any developer saying that or it is therefore not a valid excuse. And please explain why in older parts of the game when you go in disguise, and then Mount, that everything is just fine animation-wise?

    I do not understand in these forums where when valid issues are brought up, people like you find any way to discourage Anet to fix their blunders that stick out like a plank in one's eye. No wonder Anet is doing a poorer job than in earlier parts of the game; people simply do not care, and will accept anything in the game how you can get it, no matter if it's broken, looks bad, etc.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/74re46/pof_developer_ama_summary/

    "Currently you can’t use mounts while being transformed – This will likely stay. We currently don’t really really have different classifications of transforms(they are used in all sorts of ways across the game) and a lot of them that would be cause issues or balance concerns if we let you mount and remove the transform."

    In other words, in order to get mount TFs to work without breaking a whole lot of stuff, they'd have to retool the part of the engine/game that handles transformations- something that is going to be extremely difficult after 5 years of continuously building on the same antiquated engine. It'd be nice for there to be some more QoL stuff related to TF-mount interactions, like being automatically de-transformed, or hacking together a solution JUST for that story instance. I'm not saying they handled it as well as they possibly could, but there are definitely significant issues outside of their control for certain aspects.

    To say I don't care is ignorant and horribly assumptive. I do care about the quality of the game, but I understand that the dev team are human beings with limitations that are trying to put resources toward areas of the game which need a lot more attention.

    lol rekt.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Chickenooble.5014 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:
    The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Citation of any developer saying that or it is therefore not a valid excuse. And please explain why in older parts of the game when you go in disguise, and then Mount, that everything is just fine animation-wise?

    I do not understand in these forums where when valid issues are brought up, people like you find any way to discourage Anet to fix their blunders that stick out like a plank in one's eye. No wonder Anet is doing a poorer job than in earlier parts of the game; people simply do not care, and will accept anything in the game how you can get it, no matter if it's broken, looks bad, etc.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/74re46/pof_developer_ama_summary/

    "Currently you can’t use mounts while being transformed – This will likely stay. We currently don’t really really have different classifications of transforms(they are used in all sorts of ways across the game) and a lot of them that would be cause issues or balance concerns if we let you mount and remove the transform."

    In other words, in order to get mount TFs to work without breaking a whole lot of stuff, they'd have to retool the part of the engine/game that handles transformations- something that is going to be extremely difficult after 5 years of continuously building on the same antiquated engine. It'd be nice for there to be some more QoL stuff related to TF-mount interactions, like being automatically de-transformed, or hacking together a solution JUST for that story instance. I'm not saying they handled it as well as they possibly could, but there are definitely significant issues outside of their control for certain aspects.

    To say I don't care is ignorant and horribly assumptive. I do care about the quality of the game, but I understand that the dev team are human beings with limitations that are trying to put resources toward areas of the game which need a lot more attention.

    lol rekt.

    I did not get rekt. You guys are just ignorant. With all the money flowing into Anet's pockets, despite the age of GW2's engine (by the way, has been updated since the release of the game), Anet IS capable of making at least ONE 'illusory' character model that can Mount just like our original character model that has no problem doing so.

    Furthermore, even if Anet chose NOT to replace our character's model with a complete 'illusory' form of Archon Iberu (that which would still give off the impression of an illusion), the least Anet can do and IS capable of doing is to make the 'overlay' of Archon Iberu's model better looking over our already-existing character model.

    Do you know why I know Anet can at least do that? Because there already exists a very poor 'overlay' of Archon Iberu's illusion on our character. The reason why I initially argued the illusion of Archon Iberu did not exist at all is because I did not see him whatsoever on MY character (on two, actually) during the Storyline. I even posted a screenshot to prove it: https://imgur.com/a/0mMTa

    There is no excuse why the aforementioned solution cannot by done by the developers. Anet's devs are capable of so much, and yet this is what they gave us for an 'overlay' Archon Iberu illusion on our character's model. You can barely see it is him.

    The sad thing is you guys are perfectly fine with this lack of quality. Not giving a kitten = Anet does nothing = a continuous cycle of more lackluster quality (feature-wise or aesthetic).

    Telling me, "Anet has other things to work on" is also not a valid excuse because PoF IS what Anet is still working on, polishing, etc. That is why I made this thread so that they can improve upon 'Enemy of My Enemy' while PoF is still being tweaked BEFORE they forget about it when they begin working on another huge Map. What part of any of that do you people in this discussion not understand?

    And I am still waiting to hear from those regarding the fact none of our characters sound like Archon Iberu (not that I expect that, neither did my OP talk about that, yet I just want to make the point clear to those who say otherwise). Those players in the comments clearly did not play through the PoF Story and instead jumped into a discussion they had no business jumping into.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Felipe.1807 said:
    lol you gonna tell that you dont see the big aura around the asura, that her voice is kitten distorted...whatever if you acknowledge that or not, that is the clear sign that your character looks and sounds like Iberu...again, give me the 6k gold that you owe me.

    Argue the 'visual' of Archon Iberu's 'overlay' illusion all you want (and yes, I see it, yet it is still quite vague, even on such a small character model), yet trying to convince me that a female Asura voice is the voice of Archon Iberu's in any way, shape, or form is the most idiotic thing to claim. My grandmother can hear the difference better than you can.

    The 'distortion' proves absolutely nothing. All that does is tell the player their character is temporarily faking the role of Archon Iberu, yet that does not mean the voice sounds just like him like you initially claimed.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2017

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Chickenooble.5014 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Cuon Alpinus.7645 said:
    The reason they left us unchanged character-model wise is because their transformation system directly interferes with mounts and is not something capable of being fixed without doing some deep-code diving. That's why they were present in other story instances earlier in the game or in other parts of the story where you're incapable of using mounts anyway.

    Citation of any developer saying that or it is therefore not a valid excuse. And please explain why in older parts of the game when you go in disguise, and then Mount, that everything is just fine animation-wise?

    I do not understand in these forums where when valid issues are brought up, people like you find any way to discourage Anet to fix their blunders that stick out like a plank in one's eye. No wonder Anet is doing a poorer job than in earlier parts of the game; people simply do not care, and will accept anything in the game how you can get it, no matter if it's broken, looks bad, etc.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/74re46/pof_developer_ama_summary/

    "Currently you can’t use mounts while being transformed – This will likely stay. We currently don’t really really have different classifications of transforms(they are used in all sorts of ways across the game) and a lot of them that would be cause issues or balance concerns if we let you mount and remove the transform."

    In other words, in order to get mount TFs to work without breaking a whole lot of stuff, they'd have to retool the part of the engine/game that handles transformations- something that is going to be extremely difficult after 5 years of continuously building on the same antiquated engine. It'd be nice for there to be some more QoL stuff related to TF-mount interactions, like being automatically de-transformed, or hacking together a solution JUST for that story instance. I'm not saying they handled it as well as they possibly could, but there are definitely significant issues outside of their control for certain aspects.

    To say I don't care is ignorant and horribly assumptive. I do care about the quality of the game, but I understand that the dev team are human beings with limitations that are trying to put resources toward areas of the game which need a lot more attention.

    lol rekt.

    I did not get rekt. You guys are just ignorant. With all the money flowing into Anet's pockets, despite the age of GW2's engine (by the way, has been updated since the release of the game), Anet IS capable of making at least ONE 'illusory' character model that can Mount just like our original character model that has no problem doing so.

    Actually, I think you did get rekt because you initially dismissed the idea as an invalid excuse because he didn't have a dev's citation ... so he got you one. So are you going to entertain the 'valid excuse' that the game has limitations on it's engine that would make fixing this issue difficult? No, instead, you claiming people are ignorant because money fixes everything and Anet has money ... except anyone that isn't ignorant knows that just because they have money, doesn't mean they should fix what is actual a completely insignificant issue. I don't think it's a stretch of the imagination that it's a stupid idea for Anet blow their coffers to fix such a nothing problem; they have more important things to deal with. NO, it's not NO problem as you claim ... the citation provided is pretty clear what the problem actually is and if you knew enough, you could probably get a sense of what's involved in addressing it; whatever it is, it's not as trivial as you would like to make it sound.

    In the end, your assumptions about how the game works are simply wrong and shows your lack of understanding to what is involved to address these issue you are describing. Perhaps instead of being pigheaded, you should listen and understand what people are telling you instead of thinking you know better than everyone else, including Anet, about their own game and what's involved with changing it.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Obtena has it right, OP. You wanted proof. Someone gave proof and you moved the goal posts like, "Nuh uh, that's not good enough." Face it man. ArenaNet did enough to create the 'effect' that we were Archon Iberu; they mentioned it in story, they added an effect, and other things.

    If that's not good enough for you just uninstall the game and walk away. There's no pleasing you. My guess is you're still playing the game despite your cries about validating ArenaNet's mediocrity.

    So, yea, #rekt. And have a Happy New Year. :)

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 27, 2017

    @Chickenooble.5014 said:
    Obtena has it right, OP. You wanted proof. Someone gave proof and you moved the goal posts like, "Nuh uh, that's not good enough." Face it man. ArenaNet did enough to create the 'effect' that we were Archon Iberu; they mentioned it in story, they added an effect, and other things.

    If that's not good enough for you just uninstall the game and walk away. There's no pleasing you. My guess is you're still playing the game despite your cries about validating ArenaNet's mediocrity.

    So, yea, #rekt. And have a Happy New Year. :)

    Correction. I never said the 'effect' itself did not exist at all, just that the 'effect' did not give the impression it was Archon Iberu, especially not right away. I knew the 'effect' was there, yet it looked like a purple blob. The fact you have to take a closer look to figure it out is a problem in and of itself. Sure, on an Asura, not so much; it is a little more visible (and did I mention it still looks terrible?) On bigger race models? Not so much, obviously, and the screenshot I provided in the OP proves that.

    So you are right; proof was given that the 'look' of Archon Iberu exists, and yes, the 'not good enough' factor at this point boils down to how 'rushed' the effect of Archon Iberu looks so as to barely be noticeable, regardless of race, that and it is scaled poorly, which is exactly the reason why during my first playthrough Archon Iberu's effect barely showed up on my Charr as a result of poor scaling, hence, the existence of this thread in the first place.

    Just because Archon Iberu's effect serves its purpose to most of you (in the lackluster way it is presented) does not make it aesthetically pleasing, and does not mean the 'effect' cannot be improved upon. A Level 80 Berserker's Iron Sword in the game can serve its purpose, too, yet would that be what you really want for a Sword? No. You would want a better looking Sword, even though two swords with different looks has the same power as the other. So am I really wrong for wanting Anet to improve the 'look' of Archon Iberu's effect, if not a temporary, complete replacement of our character model for Archon Iberu's model? No!

    Anet has already proven to us they are capable of temporarily removing our character model completely and temporarily replacing it with another model, for example, during the Heart 'Disrupt White Mantle forces occupying Fort Evennia' in the Lake Doric map (among other instances of disguise).

    Therefore, it is foolish for anybody in the comments to sit here and argue Anet is not also capable of improving the 'look' of the Archon Iberu effect to stand out more and to be scaled more properly, an effect that is nothing more than an 'overlay' model/effect over our existing character model without replacing our character model with another model, that which is more work than creating an 'overlay' model/effect.

    Furthermore, you guys call Archon Iberu's disguise an 'effect', when really, it is no different than a regular disguise: a traditional disguise replaces your character model completely with a new one; an effect is merely an 'overlay' disguise, the former you cannot Mount with for said reasons by others, and the latter you can Mount with (in the event Anet improves Archon Iberu's 'disguise effect'. Let's call it that since 'disguise effect' sounds more accurate, anyway).

    Given the irrefutable example I have given to support my end of the discussion in the above stated (and in other examples in comments I have posted throughout this thread) regarding what Anet can actually do, I am through arguing, because only 2 other people in these comments really understands.

    Better to voice my concerns now about PoF's Storyline before they move on to create new ones riddled with more gaffes. That was my mindset when I posted this thread, and the thread served its purpose. I am sure somebody on Anet's team received the message, and whether or not they agree or disagree with my gripe is their business.

    Happy New Year to you as well.

  • I interpreted it as this: to everyone else you appear as Archon Iberu but to us, the player, we look like ourselves. Didn't bother me at all especially since it's such a small part of the game.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 27, 2017

    @Llethander.3972 said:
    I interpreted it as this: to everyone else you appear as Archon Iberu but to us, the player, we look like ourselves. Didn't bother me at all especially since it's such a small part of the game.

    While the 'concept' may make sense, the way it is 'presented' is another thing entirely. Personally, I am a stickler for such things whereas players like you are not (fine). Furthermore, I do not consider anything Storyline-related 'a small part of the game' since each part in every Storyline tells of other things throughout the game. Not only that, Storylines are repeatable, and I am someone who likes to repeat Storylines, notably for achievements, rewards, and once in a blue moon a refresher on the lore.

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