The fix for NPC crowding when Mounted to get 'Interact [F]' back (using 'Stealth' mechanics) — Guild Wars 2 Forums

The fix for NPC crowding when Mounted to get 'Interact [F]' back (using 'Stealth' mechanics)

Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
edited December 21, 2017 in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Instead of completely disabling 'Interacting [F]' while on Mounts, how about having NPCs automatically 'Stealth' nearby Mounted players, and only Mounted players, within a radius (being completely invisible instead of otherwise transparent) in the event too many players get too close to any NPC? whereupon an 'Effect' icon pops up just above your Skill Bar that says, "Other Mounted players nearby NPCs are hidden except you to prevent crowding." and then call this Effect something along the lines of 'Hiding the crowd'.

The radius around each NPC (or only important NPCs, however Anet goes about it) would be this big: https://imgur.com/a/T4P3f and any other players within that circle other than you are seen as hidden, yet with player names intact.

I also want to make very clear that other Mounted players you see who are hidden (as a result of coming within the vicinity of NPCs who are under the 'Hiding the crowd' Effect) will still receive damage from enemies near NPCs. Therefore, just because the player (you) cannot see hidden Mounted players does not mean enemies cannot see those Mounted players. You can't see them, yet enemies can see them.

Player names, however, will still show as they do when in Stealth, yet player names can be turned off in the Options Window.

Does anybody have a better idea? If so, let's hear it.

Comments

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    Wait? What?
    There are mounts disabled next to NPCs? Since when? i never noticed.
    I could always just run, while mounted, to an NPC and talk tomthem, even with lots of,other people crowded around.
    Ill just automatically dismount when interacting

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Ayakaru.6583 said:
    Wait? What?
    There are mounts disabled next to NPCs? Since when? i never noticed

    No, bro, when you use the 'Interact [F]' command on any NPC or on any object, it automatically dismounts your character. Anet disabled Interacting [F] entirely when players try to interact with any NPC or any object while on their Mounts.

    Therefore, to fix the issue (so we can have our Interact [F] command back on our Mounts without being dismounted every time), I came up with the idea of using Stealth mechanics as detailed in my OP.

  • I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact [F] is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all, given that the issue has been brought up in other threads.

    Furthermore, I changed the the title of my thread to better reflect the original idea in mind. While this idea does not fix 'Interact [F]' breaking things in the game, as Anet has said, the idea I bring to the table is the other half of the equation required to fix the issue, that way if Anet ever did find a way to make 'Interact [F]' not break anything, at least NPC crowding will not be an issue.

    The purpose of this thread is to give Anet a reason to want to work on a fix for 'Interact [F]' while Mounted, granted the idea I came up with will actually work to prevent NPC crowding.

    Therefore, without at least an idea for fixing NPC crowding when Mounted, it is much less likely Anet will even so much get the incentive to work on fixing 'Interact [F]' on Mounts.

  • @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all.

    I didn't say it was "not an annoyance at all." I asked if it was that big a deal. I find mounts with dismount-on-interact so much incredibly faster than no-mounts that I don't care that much that interact dismounts.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all.

    I didn't say it was "not an annoyance at all." I asked if it was that big a deal. I find mounts with dismount-on-interact so much incredibly faster than no-mounts that I don't care that much that interact dismounts.

    Except it is clearly not faster. Prove it is faster. Post a video. If we were able to Interact [F] while Mounted without being Dismounted, clearly, Interact [F] would be much faster than having to wait for the Dismount animation to pass every time you Interact [F] with NPCs or objects.

    For example, if you were to go to the Stampede Uplands (where you originally receive your Springer Mount) and tried to pick up Carrots in succession, one after another, are you telling me Interact [F] + Dismount is going to be quicker than Interact [F] and no Dismount? You cannot be serious.

    I am not arguing whether or not it is quicker for a player with no Mount to Interact [F] vs. a player who owns a Mount and uses Interact [F] (big difference). This is about Mounting and using Interact [F] with no Dismount vs. Mounting and using Interact [F] whereupon Dismount happens every time.

  • Cronos.6532Cronos.6532 Member ✭✭✭

    Why are you saying Stealth instead of just programatically culling them? Nonetheless, this is a non-issue and your post does not make it clear what the problem is. As such, no solution is possible.

    signature

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Cronos.6532 said:
    Why are you saying Stealth instead of just programatically culling them? Nonetheless, this is a non-issue and your post does not make it clear what the problem is. As such, no solution is possible.

    Dismount upon every Interact [F] is an issue, equally as much, so is the issue of NPC crowding (the second reason Anet decided to get rid of Interact [F] on Mounts, even IF Interact [F] did not break the game). Both issues have been brought up in multiple threads.

    And the reason I used 'Stealth' as an example in my idea is because the mechanics of 'Stealth' already exist in the game, SO if Anet can use an already-existing mechanic they are already familiar with and work with something they already have, it would therefore lessen the time it would take to fix the NPC crowding issue.

    As for fixing Interact [F] itself, Anet can do it if they really put their mind to it, as with anything. However, saying, "They can't! They can't! They can't!" does not even have a chance at helping anything get fixed.

  • Illconceived Was Na.9781Illconceived Was Na.9781 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all.

    I didn't say it was "not an annoyance at all." I asked if it was that big a deal. I find mounts with dismount-on-interact so much incredibly faster than no-mounts that I don't care that much that interact dismounts.

    Except it is clearly not faster. Prove it is faster. Post a video. If we were able to Interact [F] while Mounted without being Dismounted, clearly, Interact [F] would be much faster than having to wait for the Dismount animation to pass every time you Interact [F] with NPCs or objects.

    For example, if you were to go to the Stampede Uplands (where you originally receive your Springer Mount) and tried to pick up Carrots in succession, one after another, are you telling me Interact [F] + Dismount is going to be quicker than Interact [F] and no Dismount? You cannot be serious.

    I am not arguing whether or not it is quicker for a player with no Mount to Interact [F] vs. a player who owns a Mount and uses Interact [F] (big difference). This is about Mounting and using Interact [F] with no Dismount vs. Mounting and using Interact [F] whereupon Dismount happens every time.

    Calm down. I'm not trying to "prove" anything. I explained how I saw things. For me, mounts are faster; the momentary slow down for dismounting is (for me) no worse than the slow down from having to wait for 3 animations to mine metal nodes compared to one animation for gathering from veggie nodes. Sure, it's not as fast as one can imagine, but (again, for me) it's really really fast to travel on mounts.

    A classic example for me is Bitterfrost. Before mounts, getting a flame, running to & fro, waiting for chests to unfreeze, and then opening them again, well, it took too long for me to bother with. Since PoF, I actually have fun doing a circuit of chests. You get dismounted for interacting whether the chest is frozen or not, but (again, speaking for me), the overall process is so fast that I don't care that it could be another 10% faster if I didn't dismount.

    So yes, it is, for me, faster in every way important to me. I'm sorry that it's so much of an annoyance to you that you can't see how wonderful it is for others.

    tl;dr it's faster for me compared to what I'm used to (and that's good enough for me); your mileage apparently varies.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all.

    I didn't say it was "not an annoyance at all." I asked if it was that big a deal. I find mounts with dismount-on-interact so much incredibly faster than no-mounts that I don't care that much that interact dismounts.

    Except it is clearly not faster. Prove it is faster. Post a video. If we were able to Interact [F] while Mounted without being Dismounted, clearly, Interact [F] would be much faster than having to wait for the Dismount animation to pass every time you Interact [F] with NPCs or objects.

    For example, if you were to go to the Stampede Uplands (where you originally receive your Springer Mount) and tried to pick up Carrots in succession, one after another, are you telling me Interact [F] + Dismount is going to be quicker than Interact [F] and no Dismount? You cannot be serious.

    I am not arguing whether or not it is quicker for a player with no Mount to Interact [F] vs. a player who owns a Mount and uses Interact [F] (big difference). This is about Mounting and using Interact [F] with no Dismount vs. Mounting and using Interact [F] whereupon Dismount happens every time.

    Calm down. I'm not trying to "prove" anything. I explained how I saw things. For me, mounts are faster; the momentary slow down for dismounting is (for me) no worse than the slow down from having to wait for 3 animations to mine metal nodes compared to one animation for gathering from veggie nodes. Sure, it's not as fast as one can imagine, but (again, for me) it's really really fast to travel on mounts.

    A classic example for me is Bitterfrost. Before mounts, getting a flame, running to & fro, waiting for chests to unfreeze, and then opening them again, well, it took too long for me to bother with. Since PoF, I actually have fun doing a circuit of chests. You get dismounted for interacting whether the chest is frozen or not, but (again, speaking for me), the overall process is so fast that I don't care that it could be another 10% faster if I didn't dismount.

    So yes, it is, for me, faster in every way important to me. I'm sorry that it's so much of an annoyance to you that you can't see how wonderful it is for others.

    tl;dr it's faster for me compared to what I'm used to (and that's good enough for me); your mileage apparently varies.

    Instead of saying, "It is faster" (since it is clearly not faster), what you meant to say was, "It is fast enough for me." (big difference).

    Perhaps it is 'fast enough' for you, but people like me (and I am not the only one, as you make it sound), like mechanics in a game that feel 'fluid-like' without clunky hiccups when I am Mounted and Interact [F] with NPCs or objects.

    And it is not so much I am 'mad'; I just don't understand your logic. Nothing more, nothing less. Had we gone by your logic, to improve nothing, to change nothing, gaming these days would not have graphically and mechanically advanced the way they have. (Now, on the subject of what defines 'fun' in gaming, and how the 'fun' in gaming has changed over the years, that is different).

  • Sigh. All you really had to do was answer, "yeah, it's a big deal to me" and we wouldn't be digressing this thread on the definition of "faster."
    How many times do you need me to repeat "for me" before you accept that I'm speaking for myself and not anyone else? I don't doubt other people see it as you do; why do you doubt that others are happy with the status quo?

    Anyhow, I really am sorry that I've done a poor job of explaining my stance. Because, (again, speaking for myself), the status quo is faster than what we had before — that's all I was saying from the beginning. It's plenty fast and, (again, speaking for myself) I don't see this as "broken;" it's simply less efficient than I could imagine.

  • @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    Sigh. All you really had to do was answer, "yeah, it's a big deal to me" and we wouldn't be digressing this thread on the definition of "faster."
    How many times do you need me to repeat "for me" before you accept that I'm speaking for myself and not anyone else? I don't doubt other people see it as you do; why do you doubt that others are happy with the status quo?

    Anyhow, I really am sorry that I've done a poor job of explaining my stance. Because, (again, speaking for myself), the status quo is faster than what we had before — that's all I was saying from the beginning. It's plenty fast and, (again, speaking for myself) I don't see this as "broken;" it's simply less efficient than I could imagine.

    Except I did say it is a big deal, just not in the brevity you expected. I like to 'elaborate' on why it is a big deal, since oftentimes, just saying, "It is a big deal." is not good enough for the majority of people.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    Sigh. All you really had to do was answer, "yeah, it's a big deal to me" and we wouldn't be digressing this thread on the definition of "faster."
    How many times do you need me to repeat "for me" before you accept that I'm speaking for myself and not anyone else? I don't doubt other people see it as you do; why do you doubt that others are happy with the status quo?

    Anyhow, I really am sorry that I've done a poor job of explaining my stance. Because, (again, speaking for myself), the status quo is faster than what we had before — that's all I was saying from the beginning. It's plenty fast and, (again, speaking for myself) I don't see this as "broken;" it's simply less efficient than I could imagine.

    Saying something is 'less efficient' is an opinion of yours I disagree with, and it also happens to be an opinion that can easily be disproved, whether your intent was to prove anything on your end or not. You simply cannot prove otherwise, even if you wanted to prove the Interact [F] Mount system we have now is 'more efficient' than what I propose (to bring back Interact [F] on Mounts so we do not have Dismount happening upon every Interact [F]). That is my point.

  • I think you are entirely missing IWN's point. I agree that post-Mount overall game interactions are faster than pre-Mount overall game interactions (such as doing a gathering run, traveling to-and-interacting with an NPC, etc.).

    Regardless, when did the Devs ever state that the Interact issue had anything to do with NPC crowding? I watched the video and the only thing I heard the Dev in question state was that interacting while mounted caused broken-game bugs. I think you might have taken forum rumor for fact, as is often the case.

  • Eidolonemesis.5640Eidolonemesis.5640 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:
    I think you are entirely missing IWN's point. I agree that post-Mount overall game interactions are faster than pre-Mount overall game interactions (such as doing a gathering run, traveling to-and-interacting with an NPC, etc.).

    Regardless, when did the Devs ever state that the Interact issue had anything to do with NPC crowding? I watched the video and the only thing I heard the Dev in question state was that interacting while mounted caused broken-game bugs. I think you might have taken forum rumor for fact, as is often the case.

    It is only common sense had Interact [F] not broke things in the game to begin with (as has been stated by the Devs) that players crowding NPCs would be an issue. That is what you call 'griefing', in the case of crowding NPCs, preventing players from seeing who they should be talking to, or seeing certain NPCs in general.

    The same applies for why our character models 'pass through' other players so there are no purposely-made obstructions in doorways and paths. Back in Guild Wars 1, the developers a long time ago had it where character models never moved 'through' each other, and players who were 'griefers' purposely obstructed crucial doorways and paths. All an example of 'griefing' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer. Therefore, my idea in the OP seeks to rid half of the problem with Mounts gathering around NPCs, whether players use Interact [F] or not.

    Furthermore, I never said specifically that any Dev stated NPC crowding was an issue; what I did say is NPC crowding has been brought up as a potential issue in other threads had Interact [F] not broke things in the game to begin with.

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    I think it's more accurate to say that interact dismounts you; it's not disabled when mounted.

    Is it really that much of an issue? As it stands now we travel much, much faster in the world than we did before mounts.

    Being Dismounted upon every Interact is a very annoying issue. I don't get where you get the idea it is not an annoyance at all.

    I didn't say it was "not an annoyance at all." I asked if it was that big a deal. I find mounts with dismount-on-interact so much incredibly faster than no-mounts that I don't care that much that interact dismounts.

    Except it is clearly not faster. Prove it is faster. Post a video. If we were able to Interact [F] while Mounted without being Dismounted, clearly, Interact [F] would be much faster than having to wait for the Dismount animation to pass every time you Interact [F] with NPCs or objects.

    For example, if you were to go to the Stampede Uplands (where you originally receive your Springer Mount) and tried to pick up Carrots in succession, one after another, are you telling me Interact [F] + Dismount is going to be quicker than Interact [F] and no Dismount? You cannot be serious.

    I am not arguing whether or not it is quicker for a player with no Mount to Interact [F] vs. a player who owns a Mount and uses Interact [F] (big difference). This is about Mounting and using Interact [F] with no Dismount vs. Mounting and using Interact [F] whereupon Dismount happens every time.

    He means you travel to the target in 5 seconds instead of 30 seconds. Then dismount at the npc. Mount up again after and travel to your next target at high speed.
    The time spend at NPCs is the same. The time spend between NPCs and targets is reduced.

    Besides, i don't want this issue fixed because then story NPCs and interactable objects would be swarming with mounts at every chapter release

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • Ayakaru.6583Ayakaru.6583 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    Delete delete

    To defeat the dragons, see the good in them.
    Zhaitan reunites lost ones, primordus creates fertile land, mordremoth spreads the green, and jormag..
    ..jormag? Who's that?

  • MarshallLaw.9260MarshallLaw.9260 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:
    Instead of completely disabling 'Interacting [F]' while on Mounts, how about having NPCs automatically 'Stealth' nearby Mounted players, and only Mounted players, within a radius (being completely invisible instead of otherwise transparent) in the event too many players get too close to any NPC? whereupon an 'Effect' icon pops up just above your Skill Bar that says, "Other Mounted players nearby NPCs are hidden except you to prevent crowding." and then call this Effect something along the lines of 'Hiding the crowd'.

    The radius around each NPC (or only important NPCs, however Anet goes about it) would be this big: https://imgur.com/a/T4P3f and any other players within that circle other than you are seen as hidden, yet with player names intact.

    I also want to make very clear that other Mounted players you see who are hidden (as a result of coming within the vicinity of NPCs who are under the 'Hiding the crowd' Effect) will still receive damage from enemies near NPCs. Therefore, just because the player (you) cannot see hidden Mounted players does not mean enemies cannot see those Mounted players. You can't see them, yet enemies can see them.

    Player names, however, will still show as they do when in Stealth, yet player names can be turned off in the Options Window.

    Does anybody have a better idea? If so, let's hear it.

    Addressing your original point, it is certainly a creative idea.
    My thoughts are that dismount to interact is a minor inconvenience which has only appeared with introduction of mounts. We can now travel significantly faster but have to wait about 0.7 seconds to dismount. Overall this is a small % of time delay and not worth creating a whole new effect for. The stealthing of players is a complicated interaction and to implement on all NPCs? - it's a lot of effort and with all due respect I would rather devs worked on more important aspects of the game, rather than a tiny but hard to execute perk.

    We have gone 100 steps forward and 1 step back - I am not worried about the 1 step.

  • Asur.9178Asur.9178 Member ✭✭✭

    The correct way to annoy other players is to mount up on your fancy $120 mount skin right on top of npcs AFTER interacting with them. :)

  • FrizzFreston.5290FrizzFreston.5290 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I prefer it the way it is. Bringing our characters down to NPC level makes interacting that tiny bit more immerssive or meaningful or whatever the word is, rather than just interacting while on a mount.

    Sure, it might be a minor annoyance if you quickly want to talk and dash off, that you first need to press a button before you are mounted again. (seriously, set your keybinds right and its no problem.)

    But really, I dont see any change to this as a fix and rather as a change of style. I think anything that enables mounting to be more permanent, destroys a bit of the flow you have while moving through the world. Interacting while on a mount is not needed.

  • Offair.2563Offair.2563 Member ✭✭✭

    I think anet done it right with the dismounting. Used to play a game where you could interact with npcs on mounts and ooooo boy i don't want to see that clusterkitten of mounts again.

    Don't argue with idiots, they drag you down to their level and own you with experience.
    Big Babou, Ranger for life.

  • Ardid.7203Ardid.7203 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 21, 2017

    @Eidolonemesis.5640 said:

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:
    Sigh. All you really had to do was answer, "yeah, it's a big deal to me" and we wouldn't be digressing this thread on the definition of "faster."
    How many times do you need me to repeat "for me" before you accept that I'm speaking for myself and not anyone else? I don't doubt other people see it as you do; why do you doubt that others are happy with the status quo?

    Anyhow, I really am sorry that I've done a poor job of explaining my stance. Because, (again, speaking for myself), the status quo is faster than what we had before — that's all I was saying from the beginning. It's plenty fast and, (again, speaking for myself) I don't see this as "broken;" it's simply less efficient than I could imagine.

    Except I did say it is a big deal for me, just not in the brevity you expected. I like to 'elaborate' on why it is a big deal for me, since oftentimes, just saying, "It is a big deal for me." is not good enough for the majority of people.

    There, clearer now.

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