GS shatter-burst a little too strong?

I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.I tried it out myself and I found that I was able to do the same to the heavy armored target golem in the Heart of the mists, which, by the way, has 22,084 health and 2,597 armor. This is just barely short of a typical warrior build, the profession with the most base health and armor in the game.

I honestly think this needs to be nerfed a bit. The entire burst comes out too quickly and executes in an amount of time that's a bit too short to react.Perhaps spacing out the damage a bit would be better, just so much that it doesn't take a literal second to defeat someone.

imo the only unfair parts are the stealth removing the tell combined with the ability to be invulnerable while executing the burst thanks to mirage cloak. plus it being on a 10s cooldown

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

..So basically what thief has been able to do since 2012

@reikken.4961 said:imo the only unfair parts are the stealth removing the tell combined with the ability to be invulnerable while executing the burst thanks to mirage cloak. plus it being on a 10s cooldown

Agreed. There is very little counterplay to it. It also doesn't help that there are only 9 skills in the entire game that reveal stealthed players, and some of those abilities require you to target the player and use the skill before they go into stealth. Not to mention that of those 9 skills, 5 of them are locked behind a particular elite spec so you would never see them used anyway (when was the last time you saw a Scrapper in sPvP?)

Hey The Mirage confusion condi burst is to Strong.. NERF it!Hey the GS shatter burst is to Stong.. Nerf it..Hey the Chrono is to Strong..Nerf it!Hey mesmer core is to Strong..nerf it!Nerf mesmer..nerf it!

ITT: People that have never actually played mesmer in PvP.

Well the gs burst itself isn't really to strong, I think the main things that make it annoying are the stun on daze trait and stealth.

IMO full stealth is pretty much bad design for any game especially one as bursty as gw2.

I also think instant cast hard cc is bad design from the mantra and trait synergy. Tbh the trait was added with the specialization patch way back when and power Mesmer existed to some capacity before then. However the game has powercreeped wayyyyy to far for a similar playstyle to ever be relavent. Plus the gs combo was only created after gs 2 got powercreeped with Unblockables.

In all honesty though power Mesmer is a pretty weak build and has only recently peaked its way into semi-viable play with mirage cloak and elusive mind. The burst itself is pretty predictable and some form of evade and invuln can be used to negate it.

Plus pretty much every spec has stability for days , but then again with all the hard cc around it's pretty much needed.

Really I just want Mesmer to play like an actual illusionist/lockdown spec with debuffing elements.It used to be the case that "power shatter" referred to either lockdown builds, power shatter which speced for illusionary persona (a trait that made shatters apply from the player before it was made baseline), and phantasm Mesmer.

Tl;dr: there's way more design flaws in the game more pressing than power Mesmer which is pretty weak relative to other specs. Mainly ones that can sustain similarly high damage with far more utility, such as thief and holosmith.

@Vieux P.1238 said:

@"tartarus.1082" said:Well the gs burst itself isn't really to strong, I think the main things that make it annoying are the stun on daze trait and stealth.

IMO full stealth is pretty much bad design for any game especially one as bursty as gw2.

I also think instant cast hard cc is bad design from the mantra and trait synergy. Tbh the trait was added with the specialization patch way back when and power Mesmer existed to some capacity before then. However the game has powercreeped wayyyyy to far for a similar playstyle to ever be relavent. Plus the gs combo was only created after gs 2 got powercreeped with Unblockables.

In all honesty though power Mesmer is a pretty weak build and has only recently peaked its way into semi-viable play with mirage cloak and elusive mind. The burst itself is pretty predictable and some form of evade and invuln can be used to negate it.

Plus pretty much every spec has stability for days , but then again with all the hard cc around it's pretty much needed.

Really I just want Mesmer to play like an actual illusionist/lockdown spec with debuffing elements.It used to be the case that "power shatter" referred to either lockdown builds, power shatter which speced for illusionary persona (a trait that made shatters apply from the player before it was made baseline), and phantasm Mesmer.

Tl;dr: there's way more design flaws in the game more pressing than power Mesmer which is pretty weak relative to other specs. Mainly ones that can sustain similarly high damage with far more utility, such as thief and holosmith.

True I just miss all the fun builds we had before power creep made them essentially obsolete, making Mesmer a class of condi bombs and gimmicks ;-;

And yet, when you say this can kill a warrior in a second... I still see immortal spellbreakers tank 3 players on point while themselves doing so much damage they get people down.

Shatter mesmer got good burst, yes. Its a good dps. But it cannot hold points at that amount of glass cannon. Which means it cannot win a Conquest match on its dps alone. Thats called balance.

@Dawdler.8521 said:And yet, when you say this can kill a warrior in a second... I still see immortal spellbreakers tank 3 players on point while themselves doing so much damage they get people down.

Shatter mesmer got good burst, yes. Its a good dps. But it cannot hold points at that amount of glass cannon. Which means it cannot win a Conquest match on its dps alone. Thats called balance.

Yes but you are still missing the point. Warriors & other none mesmer classes played by casual snufles cant kill mesmers as good & as fast as before. So this is grounds & for good reason to nerf mirage & any build set on mesmers. Cuz they dont die as well when we sneeze.

Mesmer GS burst is ridiculously high (~26k damage is the highest I have seen when I was chilling with my Magis Rev in the FFA arena) but there are so many things that can mess it up and it is basically an all-in build so in most cases the risk is not worth the trouble. Condi Mirage on the other hand ...

@salogel.1869 said:Mesmer GS burst is ridiculously high (~26k damage is the highest I have seen when I was chilling with my Magis Rev in the FFA arena) but there are so many things that can mess it up and it is basically an all-in build so in most cases the risk is not worth the trouble. Condi Mirage on the other hand ...

You yet fail to mention that it's 26k damage with your super glassy build & have no sustains & the mesmer crits & that you on it's best day take on full damage. Unlike some other class i aint going to mention. Cough..scourge..cough cough..Firbrand...cough..cough...cough..warrior....COUGH!!!

BasicallyMesmer has a burst spec like other classes that also run full glass for max damage ( cough thief cough cough warrior cough cough)And it's too much because its a mesmer?

K

If you die to a single burst or shatter combo from a mes (or any pure power based class) as a warrior....You need to sit and have a long self review

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

thief does not have 2 backstabs every 10 seconds at a 900 distance. where as a Mesmer can throw its sword 2 times, both from an invis state, and go strait into invulnerable, two times. There is no comparison. Thief has one backstab every 22-30 seconds depending on the setting, with no invuln and just about the same amount of mobility/invis, right now the Mesmer is definitely the stronger small group fighter/roamer...

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

No, thief can backstab slightly faster than that, what's yours point?

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

huh!...really? ...

@Vieux P.1238 said:

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

Sure the only thing standing between thief and backstab is reveal. Granted no good player will let a thief execute two well positioned backstab in such a short time.

Disregarding the obvious similarities (and technical inferiorities) to back stab; It is not OP, but is simply anticipatory.If you are aware and fighting a power mes you can play around it, and he will play around you, playing around it, which is fair.btw I don't get the complaints about stealth? Compared to thief, power shatter has fairly limited stealth meaning it can't sit and delay forever in stealth to waste your cooldowns.

I know people don't like being insta gibed but there are a ton of builds with passives that will not allow you to down in a one hit from an unaware stealth burst, and if you know you are fighting it, you can fight it, just need to pay attention.There is a ton of counter play here just look at the numbers in the kit and figure it out instead of jumping to "IT'S OP!".

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

I am just saying that the Mesmer is stronger when meeting a thief. But thief has other uses than tracking every Mesmer for a duel, they both are great. The best players shine on both classes. It is good the way it is...

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

Well that's how much you know.... ;/

When I get blown up (and hell it happens) by a Shatter, I tell myself:“Crap, I didn’t account for that mesmer stealthing and switching on me.” Or “Crap, I didn’t read that guy swapping on me and going full blown tunnel vision.”When Casual Joe gets blown up:“GoddamnMesmerNubOPIgotmadskillzIdienubzbrokenspecbbqwentonfire.” Or simply “I got killed! Nerf Plox!”

As you can see it’s all about perception and how different people see the same problem.

I'd trade some of the burst damage for better sustained direct damage.

It's not like we can do ridiculous auto attack crits like thief or ridiculous damage without speccing full zerker/marauder like warrior...

@ToPNoP.2493 said:

@Solori.6025 said:

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities, on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.not to mention it can be done in a second.

. . . as Pyro said...Thief can do it faster than that...and yes they can Backstab you from 900 range.You would know this if you tried to do it.

where as a Mesmer can throw its sword 2 times, both from an invis state, and go strait into invulnerable, two times.

? Are you mixing up evasion for invuln?Or are you mixing two different specializations?

Thief has one backstab every 22-30 seconds depending on the setting, with no invuln and just about the same amount of mobility/invis, right now the Mesmer is definitely the stronger small group fighter/roamer...

If you are only able to backstab every 30 seconds you need to play a different class. . .A DD only now with PoF has to really worry about a power mes, and that is only if they let themselves be baited.With the ability to stalk in stealth much longer than a mes, and go in and out of stealth, much more often that a mes If you make one misstep as a power mes v a thief its game.They have more tools to specifically wait out CD's than any other class that comes to mind right now

For solo roaming, thief still has the crown.

@NaXorb.9732 said:I find this burst combo a bit unfair and too strong. It can one shot most players that aren't using automatic invulnerabilities,It can't. Unless you are talking about a player waiting inactive for a full burst of 3 clones + GS or about WvW in which case it's pointless to talk about because of the various environmental effects and gear differences. Even with full zerker setup in pvp, literally all offensive traits, it is almost impossible to burst down someone from 100% to 0% in spvp. Not to mention it's unplayable with full zerk.on top of witch, it can be used from stealth or from a distance, and, used in tandem with the stun from Mantra of distraction, is

Stealth is rather predictable in pvp, as it's short duration. Distance burst is less damage and easier to predict (projectiles, huh?).very hard to dodge requiring a stun-break and a dodge.Wow, you need a stunbreak and a dodge to negate a huge burst! Never seen this before (let's see: most warrior builds, most thief builds, holo and scrapper engi, some revenant builds, most ranger builds, power necro, some guardian builds like hammer, etc etc etc.)not to mention it can be done in a second.Well, I can not challenge this.I tried it out myself and I found that I was able to do the same to the heavy armored target golem in the Heart of the mists, which, by the way, has 22,084 health and 2,597 armor. This is just barely short of a typical warrior build, the profession with the most base health and armor in the game.You tried it out on a golem. And based on that you call it overpowered. Right. Try it out in spvp.I honestly think this needs to be nerfed a bit. The entire burst comes out too quickly and executes in an amount of time that's a bit too short to react....Perhaps spacing out the damage a bit would be better, just so much that it doesn't take a literal second to defeat someone.Then remove all other power burst focused builds as well. That should be around 15-20 currently, out of 5-10 are viable for higher tier pvp.

Not trying to offend you but only because you got burst down by a power mes in whatever scenario it does not mean it's overpowered. Now let's talk about condi mirage again.

@reikken.4961 said:imo the only unfair parts are the stealth removing the tell combined with the ability to be invulnerable while executing the burst thanks to mirage cloak. plus it being on a 10s cooldownWhat is on a 10s cooldown?

@reikken.4961 said:imo the only unfair parts are the stealth removing the tell combined with the ability to be invulnerable while executing the burst thanks to mirage cloak. plus it being on a 10s cooldownWhat is on a 10s cooldown?

I’m just assuming here, but it’s likely the 10.25 sec CD on traited Mind Wrack.