Valkyrie vs Berserker Power DH

That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

But im curious about going full Valkyrie armor on my DH to get 4k HP as 11k hp is too low. Although i can play fine with 11k i wonder if i could do even better with a bit more HP. What do you guys thinks? (Using Retaliation uptime to maintain 60% + crit chance)

@"KeoLegend.5132" said:That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

"Impressive, every single thing you said in that sentence was wrong" - Luke Skywalker

@Darknicrofia.2604 said:

@"KeoLegend.5132" said:That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

you're free to try prove me wrong, altough thats not the objective of this topic

@KeoLegend.5132 said:That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

But im curious about going full Valkyrie armor on my DH to get 4k HP as 11k hp is too low. Although i can play fine with 11k i wonder if i could do even better with a bit more HP. What do you guys thinks? (Using Retaliation uptime to maintain 60% + crit chance)

What scenario? Pve? sPvP? WvW? For Pve stuffs where the damage is the only thing requested for dh, berserker is just the best.For sPvP and WvW marauder seems to be the meta.Valkyrie is only present in the core sPvP called Radiant Hammer which uses the retaliation traits.For dh roam marauder is superior to valkyrie because you won't crit much otherwise having zero precision, only using core guardian you can make it work.

@KeoLegend.5132 said:That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

But im curious about going full Valkyrie armor on my DH to get 4k HP as 11k hp is too low. Although i can play fine with 11k i wonder if i could do even better with a bit more HP. What do you guys thinks? (Using Retaliation uptime to maintain 60% + crit chance)

First of all, you can get the whole 100% crit chance with 0 precision, so it's true that under optimal conditions, Valkyrie is strictly better than Berserker. You get 50% from Righteous Instincts, 10% from Radiant Power, 20% from fury and 5% base. The last 15% can either come from Right-Hand Strength, or if you are using a 2-hander, a Berserker weapon with Sigil of Accuracy (so ok, in that case you have some precision). In group content, you can get the last 15% from Spotter and Banner of Discipline.

Of course, the problem is having fury and retaliation. In pvp and open world where burst is more important than dps, a few seconds of these boons are easy enough to get without any sacrifices. Especially if you use the Virtues/Radiance build, opening your fight with F1 and sword 2 (which is usually what I do with my DH regardless of gear) already gives you both boons. Then drop Procession of Blades, swap to GS, and do GS 2 + GS 4 and watch everything melt.

Now, in group content, fury should be already covered, so that leaves only retaliation. DH already relies on retaliation uptime for the bonuses of Retribution, so bad uptime hurts regardless. You already provide retaliation with your GS symbol, so goood stacking and a good chrono can be enough, otherwise you can use an utility slot for Stand your Ground (more reliable) or Hallowed Ground (more retaliation uptime). Test of Faith is a minor dps contributor anyway, which is why SC guides already suggest swapping it out.

Personally, while I believe Valkyrie can absolutely work in pve, I also don't feel like 4k HP is worth all the fuzz. I also don't feel like making another ascended set.

Is this for PvE, PvP, or WvW? My comments are only for PvE. Please disregard if this is not your preferred game mode.

I assume you are talking about the standard retaliation DH GS/Sc+Torch build, correct? Then it depends on what PvE content you are trying to do and how well you can keep the retaliation buff.

If it is grouped instanced content, as long as you can keep up your retaliation and your group doesn't mind, then why not? In a group is is much easier to keep good up time on retaliation, and you can easily over cap Crit Chance, making too much precision a wasted stat. Pugs and some elite groups may not want you to run anything but full berserker in T4 fractals or raids, however.

If this is mainly solo PvE, then you really have to pay attention to to how well you can keep up retaliation on you own. If you can't keep up retaliation enough, then I wouldn't use Valkyries. Going from 100% Crit chance with retaliation up to 20% Crit Chance when retaliation is down is a huge difference and noticeably effects your damage/performance.

In case you never tried it, Power FB (basically the retaliation DH GS build, but with FB swapped in) has a very impressive burst (similar to Power DH), is much easier to self provide near 100% retaliation up time, lots of quickness, more aegis refreshes, better AOE damage through the Tomes, and optimally includes some Valkyries stats for about 4000K more HP. For running solo PvE content, I find this to be a better choice than Power DH.

Hi OP, speaking of Fractal, if 11k hp is too low for you, by all mean please do increase it.When I'm with my usual group, I'll just swap my stats to full Berserker. But most of the time when I'm with a pug group, I need that extra hp to cushion spike damage cause' we can't avoid pug using derp stats which resulted in a pro-long boss fight, and that is bad for low hp setting.

Why not use marauder stats for some extra hp? It's not exactly a given to have 100% retaliation uptime outside of raids/fractals (if you have a good chrono).

@Raguel.9402 said:Why not use marauder stats for some extra hp? It's not exactly a given to have 100% retaliation uptime outside of raids/fractals (if you have a good chrono).

But you don't need 100% retaliation uptime outside of raids and fractals. The example I gave above (Virtue/Rad DH doing F1, Sw 2, Procession, GS 2, GS 5) gives a total of 17s of fury and 10s of retaliation. Most anything you will fight in pve won't last that long, except open world bosses, where everyone else will be spamming 1 in Nomad's gear anyway.

Speaking about WvW mainly. Using Virtues, Radiance and DH traits

@RabbitUp.8294 said:

@Raguel.9402 said:Why not use marauder stats for some extra hp? It's not exactly a given to have 100% retaliation uptime outside of raids/fractals (if you have a good chrono).

well OP didn't exactly specify the content he meant it for up until now. In open world a short burst from the healing skill is enough usually.

@RabbitUp.8294 said:

@KeoLegend.5132 said:That DH is the best Elite ever we already know that. That DH has one of the best bursts of the game we also already know that.

But im curious about going full Valkyrie armor on my DH to get 4k HP as 11k hp is too low. Although i can play fine with 11k i wonder if i could do even better with a bit more HP. What do you guys thinks? (Using Retaliation uptime to maintain 60% + crit chance)

Okay, I've been playing hammer guard even before HoT, during HoT and after PoF, this is the style I played for the longest time and you are right about the precision might.However, I find valkyrie stats good only when you fight inferior opponents, when you initiate the fight, or there isn't a lot of boon strip/corrupt flying around.The thing is that with valk you have a high risk high reward so much, that the burst that hammer guard can make is once in a while. You have to stack boons and be at the right time in the right place for it to pull off the best of this build, which happens rarely considering how more capable are other builds, for example Holo. Holo doesn't need that much of a wind up and every single burst skill of theirs is just as punishing as one well placed mighty blow with all effects stacked.

However, two ago I changed to berserker. Yes, it's silly, the precision gives 46,85% crit chance and with fury + retal its 116.8% which sounds like a waste. But believe me, it is not. I've had more problems running valk, it was just some more HP that gave me just 2 or 3 seconds longer to live. During a fight it is hard to keep constant burn as a power guard. Fury and retal gives about 70% crit chance which is oddly underwhelming. With zerker I have my 100% crit chance very easily with fury and retal all the time. The trick is that hammer's auto attack is strong as nails and nobody really dodges auto attacks. Most combatants, even experienced ones, expect you to hit mighty blow at the right time so they can dodge. What I tend to do is just whittle down the opponent with 2k/2,5k strong auto attack hits, and the third auto attack is a mini-mighty blow. Every single hit is no less than 2k and some. Now I win more fights due to this 100% unending crit burst. It's not about surviving yourself, but forcing your enemy to play defensively, so that they have a harder time to get to you. Thus offense is the best defense.Besides, litanny of wrath heals much better with zerk stats. If I place my blinds from F1 and sword/focus well, I can even soak the damage and heal it in within a second with the burst.So yeah, with valk it is reliable but you have to build up a lot to make sure that you hit that burst. Too many times it happened to me that I was sure to land a crit mighty blow just to see a whismy, white 2k hit even with fury and retal + burn, it's RNG. With zerk I am sure that every single mighty blow that I land will be at least 4.5/5k if not more. What's even better is that when I manage to close an enemy in ring of warding and pop zealot's defense with quickness, I can pull off even 10k burst.

valk in wvw is good unless you fight scourge

It's funny to watch people being confused wether this is PvP or PvE related. I'd say that for PvP it is an Ay and for PvE/WvW it is a Nay.

Valkyrie in PvP will provide you with a total of extra 9k HP, which is a substantial amount, as it is practically a 100% boost. I wouldn't run it with DH though. I would never give up Valor line on DH in order to get Radiance to make up for the crit loss from valkyrie just for the extra HP. Valor is going to provide heals and utilities that are essencial for DH's survival in PvP. So if you want my opinion as a PvP main Guardian, Valkyrie on DH is a nono. But if it is a core guardian that you are playing, then it is a whole different scenario. Core Guardian does not have the tools to mitigate as much burst as DH has, so it relies on going in and out of the fight in order to stay alive and deal big chunks of burst damage. Then you can afford to drop the DH line and pick up Radiance and go for Valkyrie for the extra HP.

Valkyrie in PvE will provide you with about 4k HP, which is NOT a very substantial amount. Sure, if all the cards are played right, you will have close to 100% crit chance with it, but that isn't something you can rely on. Relatiation buff will not always be there and if you're caught with your pants down, you can very well die because you lack damage to kill your foes before they kill you. Specially on prolongued fights. That is my opinion for both open world and fractals. As for raids, it really depends on your group. If you have a solid group with a Chrono you can rely on to provide you with proper relatiation uptime, then sure, you can go Valkyrie, but I wouldn't. As I said, Valkyrie is slightly better in an ideal situation. If your chrono dies, though, or you need to split from him, your damage will take a very significant loss. I'd always say it is much better to be self-reliant. The 4k HP boost is just not worth it in any scenarios, imho.

TL;DR ? Valkyrie DH is a nono in any scenario. In PvP, Core Guardian Valkyrie can work.

precision is for losers who don't know what retaliation is. Go full valkyrie and have 20k health and all the dps of zerker