WvW and ascended gear - Update

Hello all. I posted a thread about power creep and ascended gear around two months ago, if memory serves correctly.

At the time, I was full exotics except rings, back, amulets, and ear rings. I was noticing that I was just not performing at all in WvW , and my suspicion was ascended gear plus the power creep from the two expansions had made ascended gear more of a necessity for WvW than the current population was lead to believe.

Now I have full ascended armor on my warrior except for my boots, which I will craft soon, and the difference is INSANE. I am by no means a good player, my main games are wow arena and overwatch (blizz fanboy i know, but i still support anet a lot through black lion tp purchases). However; with the full ascended gear, i now find myself regularly winning 1v2, 1v3, and ocasionally 1v2 + multiple + one fights while roaming solo.

The "damage" and survivability increase is definitely noticeable for me. My build and gearing stats are the same. It is not a "got good" situation either. It just seems to be fully, 100%, the gear that helps me rip apart enemies and be more tanky than I was in full exotics.

Just my observation. Please discuss, and offer any thoughts or objections that you may have. I am genuinely interested in this topic.

My main point of observation is that I am able to do things that I was previously unable to do before, now that I have full ascended gear.

I also note that I went from full vital toughness power exotics to power vital ferocity, and I think one or two prices of power precision vital ferocity. Sorry I still don't know fully the names. Soldiers to gobrech/svaards? So I lost all my toughness. Even swapped dolyak runes to hoelbrak. And a lot of the fights were vs power builds, like quickness ranger or dd or holo, power mes etc.

So you shifted your stats more towards damage, plus you got the maybe 5-10% bump in stats, plus got the +10% (to power damage) from the higher base damage on your weapons. It's not a surprise that you're seeing results.

That said, just shifting your weapons to ascended, and possibly your trinkets, leaving your armour exotic, would have net you almost the same results if you still shifted to the more aggressive stat array. So, to the point (that I assume you made in your earlier post, but maybe not) that you need full ascended to compete, it's just not so. But there is an advantage, especially if you change specific items and for specific builds (i.e. power).

Besides the stat changes, there is something you seem to be missing. And that is the fact that you've had two months of practice to improve your gameplay. Player skill matters more to winning a fight than the 10% stat difference between exotic and ascended.

There is power creep, but it's more from the new elites than anything else.

I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

Another reason for this is how unsustainable it is. If you are a WvW main player, you better get out your credit card or spend copious amounts of time on the game because WvW wont give you the gold you need to make ascended armor.

But I digress. The two months of playing, I didn't spam WvW or the game or my one character only; the amount played was pretty insignificant if you believe me. All I feel like is that for some reason, I just... do better, and for me, there isn't really an explanation except getting full ascended. For me personally, I will aim to have full ascended on all characters before I try to WvW seriously. That is how much of a difference I notice!

Ascended isn't even that hard to get, there is no tredmill. The only people who whine about it are new players who feel entitled to log in on a level 1 with the best gear

@LaFurion.3167 said:

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

I've been pretty much exclusively roaming in wvw for four years or more, and have never done any farming/grinding regardless, and I've never had to pay actual money to acquire ascended stuff. And I've got multiple sets as well, plus a crap tonne of rings I'll never use.

As for the difference, as mentioned, you gained +10% damage from your weapons' base damage, then another 5-10% from the extra stats, then (probably) considerably more by adding ferocity and precision into your build at the expense of toughness.

I play full ascended on my main acc with the exact same builds and stats on my alt account, except my alt is mostly exotic. I hardly notice a difference.You have switched stats to more offensive sets AND you are now two months more experienced. Don't underestimate the difference that is making.

10% is 10%That said, confidence is also a factor

@LaFurion.3167 said:My main point of observation is that I am able to do things that I was previously unable to do before, now that I have full ascended gear.

I also note that I went from full vital toughness power exotics to power vital ferocity, and I think one or two prices of power precision vital ferocity. Sorry I still don't know fully the names. Soldiers to gobrech/svaards? So I lost all my toughness. Even swapped dolyak runes to hoelbrak. And a lot of the fights were vs power builds, like quickness ranger or dd or holo, power mes etc.

You're not really comparing pinks with oranges here.

You've change two variables (armour stats & armour level) and you're attributing the result to one variable (armour level).

If you went from Soldier (exotic) to Soldier (ascended) then your observations on the difference would have more validity.

However you've gone from Soldier exotic (low damage, high defence) to Maurauder ascended (very high damage, low defence).

Most of the change you are noticing is due to you adopting Maurauder amour instead of Soldier armour, it's not due to you adopting pinks over oranges.

Ascended gear was introduced between 2012-2013 (2015 if we count breathers). Meaning you could have finished your set of gear back in 2013 and remained competive until now. It is also rather likely that ascended gear will remain the best gear in the future. It is an obvious upgrade to exotics but pretty easy to acquire nowadays and hardly anythign talking about if you know other games.

@LaFurion.3167 said:

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

Those who grind it get it fast. Its not hard to get anymore. :)

And sure some can use irl cash and sone do not. Thats just.how it is in any mmo.

Edit -wrong topic

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

I have full ascended zerk/marauder with power wvw infusions on my Warrior, I perform fairly well with him. This weekend I was at a friend's house, who is very inexperienced with fighting players. I emulated my Warrior's gear stats with exotics for him and entered WvW on his computer to showcase how I played. I fought multiple of the same enemies I fought and defeated on my own ascended warrior earlier that day. I barely saw a difference; the only thing really noticeable being a few hundred less damage on some attacks against opponents I assumed were playing glass - and even that wasn't super noticeable, since you never know who has toughness in their gear anyway.

If a 5% difference in stats and a 5% increase in base-weapon damage makes or breaks your fight, then you have bigger problems to worry about than the rarity of your gear.

Hammer Rev is absolute garbage for roaming, but after playing it for a year I can win some 1v2 and 1v3...

It's amazing what, getting to know your buttons, can do.

ascended gear is highly overated if we talk about the need of a full set. Important are just the weapons that give power based dmg a +5% dmg inscrease AND +5% stat increase. 5% more or less dmg is relatively significant to my experience. but aside of that the rest of the stat increase is so little, it will never ever decide a fight. now that ascended trinkets are very easy to obtain u even compensate a portion of your lower stat pool by not getting/crafting every piece of Armor. even the food + right food choice is so much of a bigger factor then beeing full ascended vs full exotic (with ascended weapons).

my other account has exotics zerkers and the difference is almost unnoticeable when youre with a zerg. unless youre into roaming and 1v1.

@LaFurion.3167 said:

@"Bish.8627" said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

If you are serious about WvW you should be using full ascended. The stuff is practically free at this point in the games life. But you really arnt convincing anyone with the "ascended made me good at the game" bs.

Thanks for the thoughts everyone! I guess the swap from soldiers gear to marauders explains a bit of what I might be experiencing. Although in the 1v2 and 1v3 situations vs all the power roamers my survivability has taken a huge hit, I guess the damage that I do now with the new stats is significant enough to explain how I can coming out of these fights winning.

@Turk.5460 said:

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

Nice opinion bud. My issue is not skill but the fact a gear treadmill exists and does have a noticeable impact in WvW. A mode that should be based on Skill>build>stats not play time or gold level.

Ascended armor is no big deal, it's a very marginal armor and dps increase. Having the correct stats and runes/sigils is a big deal. Ascended weapons and trinks are a big deal and extremely easy to get via a very small gold outlay and LW3 farming.

I use non-ascended armor all the time because I have so many stat variations, for example I am never going to spend gold to craft ascended valk armor so I keep an exotic set. I have many exotic armor sets all with correct stat allocation and runes, there is no point making them all ascended. Skill is still number #1, your spec #2, correct stats #3, then the rest.

Can we stop calling gear that was added 4 years ago a tredmil, it's not.

I sometime play on an alt account on na. I have no ascended , only exotic and usually i play pu condi mesmer ( mix DIRE/rabid ) . I am not a champion but i win often 1 vs1. Ascended impact is not that hight and the player level is much more important. When i find player worse than me usually i win even if they have all ascendend, when i find players stronger than me i lose and the difference usually is made by the player. Obviously in a perfect world a player on the same skill level with ascended would win but there are also many other things to consider . It is much more common to lose a fight for a wrong dodge , a skill wasted or a burst unavoided rather then the stats different .

@Bish.8627 said:

@Turk.5460 said:

@Bish.8627 said:I tried to say as much in another thread. Someone said if 5% difference feels a lot to me thats not my only problem. I then had a message deleted by the 1984 thought police moderators, a leading question asking my critic if he plays a meta cheese roaming build like mirage or thief. Anyway what I would of then asked is if he believes a meta roamer of similar skill or even more skill, in full exotic, could best a full ascended player. He would no doubt say yes. But honestly, only in the last 2 months have I gone ascended, not even full but 3 of 6 armour and all accessories with a legendary weapon, and the difference was incredible.

WvW should never have had ascended. I don't think any game mode should ever have had ascended. WoW had the same problem with raiders getting the best stuff and then being OP in PvP so they made PvP armour. WvW needs stats capped at exotic level imo.

Gear treadmill? Haven’t seen one since a new stat level tier hasn’t been introduced in years, and it’s been proven that Ascended vs Exotics isn’t as large as people tend to make it out to be, unproven anecdotes are still unproven anecdotes and sound like the lamentations of the highly saturated sodium filled players that like to blame anything other than themselves.