Why not make WvW a megaserver like the rest of the game? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Why not make WvW a megaserver like the rest of the game?

2

Comments

  • Kirnale.5914Kirnale.5914 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    Megaserver would result in:
    1. People not caring about defending stuff. Why should they? I would let everything drop because I don't care. You lose all reasoning to defend stuff.
    2. Old school players will quit. Say bye to the good fights. Say hello to trash-tier "fights". At least you get your baggies.
    3. Bore the kitten out of people that like WvW's "strategy" point of view. It will become a battle arena where people meet up in the middle of the map and fight endlessly with no goal. More people will quit.
    4. As a result, karma train will constantly run on the side. PvE people can farm it as much as they like. People who likes to defend stuff will receive some flaming. More people will quit.
    5. Shattered communities. Especially hard on national servers. National servers will likely to lose more than half of their people. Community is one of the most important aspect in this game mode. Without that, the game will quickly die out. Like really, really fast.
    6. kitten distribution of people. People will always join the winner's side. If the distribution is set in stone every week, then they will use 2nd accounts in order to get all colors. And thanks to that, one side will always have too much people. How are you going to distribute the people when there is like 1k+ more on the green side? Create 10 more maps with no blue and red team present? Or make it a 1000s queue?
    7. Community guilds will lose their purpose. Play for the server is completely gone. More people will quit. Colors with random people each week isn't representing enough for them to care.
    8. People will be forced to join a guild to get the bonus. There you go, multiple megaserver guild with 500 people. Still a guild, right? Or just be at some pve random guilds like always.
    9. Ts/discord communication will be completely gone, well besides GvG. Karma trains doesn't need one. Mindless fights in the middle of the map doesn't need one either.
    10. Sieging will lose it's purpose. It's a battle arena after all. Some people like sieging. More people will quit.
    11. GvG will exist, but they will die out much faster than now. Because besides GvG, there is nothing really "WvW-like" stuff to do. People will get bored, they will quit.
    12. People that don't get along with might end up in the same color.
    13. Now you have a whole network of trolls. Time to turn off chat completely. Or right-click block every day, if that is fun to you.

    Sounds like fun? Go into Eotm and play it. Anet have made it just for you. I ask again, why are you still playing normal WvW when your prefered WvW already exist? And yes, Eotm is a megaserver WvW with a set color each week. Doesn't mean player distribution will be fair.

    Oh and one more. Expect to have a whole zerg AFKing spawn to get rewards. Because there is no need to leave for other players to get in to help out your group.

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @SkyShroud.2865 said:

    @Justine.6351 said:
    The game isn't setup with the notion of 3 main faction's like ESO is with the Ebonheart Pact, Daggerfall Covenant and Aldermeri Dominion. Identity is important or nobody cares and win trading type things can happen.

    If we ever saw cantha maybe we could get 3 faction's like,

    Kurzick
    Luxon
    Imperial

    But that would likely come with AB maps not WvW.

    Part of the issue imo is that they never added an NPC faction, which made wvw strictly players only. Without the dynamic of an always aggressive and present balancing force on the map, ktraining ensues. Without an NPC faction there is "no story" and wvw becomes as boring as the players who are present at any given time.

    WvW is 100% player driven, which is why it can be amazing or a complete bore.

    People may think I'm stupid for wanting more pve in wvw but it's even more stupid to ask for content in a mode that has none by design and by extension, a system to pit no-identity teams against each other forever, expecting players to be permanently hooked.

    It is setup as fractions, called servers. Though the identity is not as strong as the one you have on pvp mmorpgs with all the supporting mechanism to make it more involving and interesting. Nevertheless, it is still a fraction.

    Since I mentioned pvp mmorpg, I think everybody should understand gw2 isn't a pvp mmorpg, don't get your hope too high.

    It's not really setup as factions in the way I mean as it does not have any meaningful splitting beyond what the players have ascribed to them, like yb the defensive siege server, BG the blob server, and so on. I guess more on the pve side I'm talking which can translate to pvp like AD in ESO was called the ganker alliance because 2 of the 3 races, wood elf and kajit, have stealth racial bonuses. For better or worse, that doesn't exist at all in gw2. There really isn't a draw to any specific server in gw2 other than black gate cause "they big server and always win".

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Rampage.7145Rampage.7145 Member ✭✭✭

    @Kirnale.5914 said:
    Megaserver would result in:
    1. People not caring about defending stuff. Why should they? I would let everything drop because I don't care. You lose all reasoning to defend stuff.
    2. Old school players will quit. Say bye to the good fights. Say hello to trash-tier "fights". At least you get your baggies.
    3. Bore the kitten out of people that like WvW's "strategy" point of view. It will become a battle arena where people meet up in the middle of the map and fight endlessly with no goal. More people will quit.
    4. As a result, karma train will constantly run on the side. PvE people can farm it as much as they like. People who likes to defend stuff will receive some flaming. More people will quit.
    5. Shattered communities. Especially hard on national servers. National servers will likely to lose more than half of their people. Community is one of the most important aspect in this game mode. Without that, the game will quickly die out. Like really, really fast.
    6. kitten distribution of people. People will always join the winner's side. If the distribution is set in stone every week, then they will use 2nd accounts in order to get all colors. And thanks to that, one side will always have too much people. How are you going to distribute the people when there is like 1k+ more on the green side? Create 10 more maps with no blue and red team present? Or make it a 1000s queue?
    7. Community guilds will lose their purpose. Play for the server is completely gone. More people will quit. Colors with random people each week isn't representing enough for them to care.
    8. People will be forced to join a guild to get the bonus. There you go, multiple megaserver guild with 500 people. Still a guild, right? Or just be at some pve random guilds like always.
    9. Ts/discord communication will be completely gone, well besides GvG. Karma trains doesn't need one. Mindless fights in the middle of the map doesn't need one either.
    10. Sieging will lose it's purpose. It's a battle arena after all. Some people like sieging. More people will quit.
    11. GvG will exist, but they will die out much faster than now. Because besides GvG, there is nothing really "WvW-like" stuff to do. People will get bored, they will quit.
    12. People that don't get along with might end up in the same color.
    13. Now you have a whole network of trolls. Time to turn off chat completely. Or right-click block every day, if that is fun to you.

    Sounds like fun? Go into Eotm and play it. Anet have made it just for you. I ask again, why are you still playing normal WvW when your prefered WvW already exist? And yes, Eotm is a megaserver WvW with a set color each week. Doesn't mean player distribution will be fair.

    Oh and one more. Expect to have a whole zerg AFKing spawn to get rewards. Because there is no need to leave for other players to get in to help out your group.

    Completely disagree, defenders would have to work just as hard to wiin the matchups, many many oldoschooll players that left the game due, lack of fights/competition (now on a single raid you can potentially fight against any existing guild in WvW not only the ones on your matchup and that is huge for fight focused people), server imbalance, being outnumbered all the time, etc, will probably return, comunities will be stronger than ever many since you will no longer only interact with people from your server/country but people from WvW as a whole just like PVE comunities work, so if anything WvW comunities will be stronger than ever; you can now play with people you enjoy playing/have common playstile with no matter what server they are from.

    VR Driver
    Salty beavers top guild 2 years in a row back to back, the double champs
    https://saltybeavers.com/

  • X T D.6458X T D.6458 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If you think its a good idea, you can always go to EoTM. If this was a good idea, EoTM would be full of people. If you actually believe that throwing in a bunch of random people into wvw matches that use an instance creation system would somehow create any type of balance, or competition, or even any incentive to do anything other then ktrain...then you are either being dishonest or just really hoping for the impossible.

    BG

  • Rampage.7145Rampage.7145 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    Nothing better for fighters than killing huger 80 man ktrains brother just saying, i would kill ktrains all day long if you ask me, just because it is fun, untill you run against a team on the enemy team trying to do the same, and wait, oh yeah then u got a good fight, what if there is another group wanting to do the same in the 3rd faction, kitten a 3 way fight, what if u have multiples grous on the same faction trying to do the same, oh multiple fighting groups, oh wait what happened to the ktrain???? oh yeah they got kitten up quit and it is all fighting groups now!!!! i don't know whay people think ktrains are bad, nothing better than killing a juicy ktran to start a WvW raid brother

    This can't be put in praactice in EoTm cuz EoTm is dead, nobody goes there anymore not even ktrainers.... i guarantee u tho if they close WvW completelly for 1 week, activate pips in EoTM, and fights guilds just go to EoTM raids only it would be more fun than anything those guilds have done in the past 2 years. WvW is designed arround 3 servers full packed fighting each other 24/7, once u stop having that (and we stopped having that many years ago) WvW fails completelly and just becomes slow and boring for everybody, megaservers solves this issue for good and forever, dosnt matter how many people stop playing dosnt matter how many people come back, dosnt matter how many new players, the system balances itself for a 24/7 3 way battle.

    VR Driver
    Salty beavers top guild 2 years in a row back to back, the double champs
    https://saltybeavers.com/

  • X T D.6458X T D.6458 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Rampage.7145 said:
    Nothing better for fighters than killing huger 80 man ktrains brother just saying, i would kill ktrains all day long if you ask me, just because it is fun.

    I agree.

    However some people still like having something to play for.

    BG

  • Namer.9750Namer.9750 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    @Kirnale.5914 said:
    Megaserver would result in:
    1. People not caring about defending stuff. Why should they? I would let everything drop because I don't care. You lose all reasoning to defend stuff.
    2. Old school players will quit. Say bye to the good fights. Say hello to trash-tier "fights". At least you get your baggies.
    3. Bore the kitten out of people that like WvW's "strategy" point of view. It will become a battle arena where people meet up in the middle of the map and fight endlessly with no goal. More people will quit.
    4. As a result, karma train will constantly run on the side. PvE people can farm it as much as they like. People who likes to defend stuff will receive some flaming. More people will quit.
    5. Shattered communities. Especially hard on national servers. National servers will likely to lose more than half of their people. Community is one of the most important aspect in this game mode. Without that, the game will quickly die out. Like really, really fast.
    6. kitten distribution of people. People will always join the winner's side. If the distribution is set in stone every week, then they will use 2nd accounts in order to get all colors. And thanks to that, one side will always have too much people. How are you going to distribute the people when there is like 1k+ more on the green side? Create 10 more maps with no blue and red team present? Or make it a 1000s queue?
    7. Community guilds will lose their purpose. Play for the server is completely gone. More people will quit. Colors with random people each week isn't representing enough for them to care.
    8. People will be forced to join a guild to get the bonus. There you go, multiple megaserver guild with 500 people. Still a guild, right? Or just be at some pve random guilds like always.
    9. Ts/discord communication will be completely gone, well besides GvG. Karma trains doesn't need one. Mindless fights in the middle of the map doesn't need one either.
    10. Sieging will lose it's purpose. It's a battle arena after all. Some people like sieging. More people will quit.
    11. GvG will exist, but they will die out much faster than now. Because besides GvG, there is nothing really "WvW-like" stuff to do. People will get bored, they will quit.
    12. People that don't get along with might end up in the same color.
    13. Now you have a whole network of trolls. Time to turn off chat completely. Or right-click block every day, if that is fun to you.

    Sounds like fun? Go into Eotm and play it. Anet have made it just for you. I ask again, why are you still playing normal WvW when your prefered WvW already exist? And yes, Eotm is a megaserver WvW with a set color each week. Doesn't mean player distribution will be fair.

    Oh and one more. Expect to have a whole zerg AFKing spawn to get rewards. Because there is no need to leave for other players to get in to help out your group.

    Incorrect.

    1. In WvW people T3 keeps on reset night anyway then siege it up so massively that it's literally impossible to take in primetime. Defending is already overblown as it is, considering the power of T3 keeps, disablers and siege traps, and all the defensive siege you can put down all over the place.
    2. Wut. Old School players, especially the ones who prefer fighting, would be the ones to come back. It's the acoustic level of sieging and defending, plus a lack of good guilds to fight and blobby servers that drives those players away. The ones who will quit at the ones who get creamed on 1v5 despite their Diamond/Mithril whatever ranks and can't fight worth kitten.
    3. WvW doesn't have any "strategy" anymore lmfao, other than try to run 60 guildies and have enough people to make coffee and sandwiches while you line up 10 trebs and 5 shield gens outside a T3 keep.
    4. PvEers have far better methods of farming karma now, and all it takes is one WvW guild on a map deciding to spend a night 'farming pve'ers' to drive away those ktrainers.
    5. Perhaps the only legitimate point you have, but frankly if it worked out in PvE's Megaservering, it should work out anyway in WvW as well.
    6. Distribution should change weekly. The current system of (1+4+7+10) vs (2+5+8+11) vs (3+6+9+12) is a little reet, but better distributions can be made, taking the top 2-3 and bottom 2-3 servers, then the next top 2-3 and bottom 2-3, in the same way they did the initial linkings, to make 3 sides that should be roughly even. The current servers will still exist and 1-2 will swap colours weekly depending on the position of their megaserver in that matchup.
    7. Community guilds can still exist because your server will still stay it's own cohesive unit inside a megaserver and while the other servers you're allied with and the colour changes, the people and guilds you're playing with will remain constant throughout. They would just add " Community Guild!" to their advertisements or whatever.
    8. Why would you have to join a guild? I'm not talking about the Battlegroups concept that gets bandied around. Do you have to join a guild to participate in the current EotM?
    9. TS/Discord communication will exist perfectly fine. I mean, there are guilds who do nothing but ktrain dead timezones in actual WvW now, and they still use comms. There are plenty of guilds who want to fight each other and they'll use comms.
    10. I thought, according to you people will just ktrain forever. Won't they need to siege and stuff for that? Think about your earlier points before you type lol. As things currently stand, sieging needs a huge overhaul anyway because nobody bothers breaking Tier 3 structures during active times nowadays.
    11. Can people who've never been part of the scene not talk about it please? If you were/are in any GvG guild, you should know you're completely wrong. Guilds who GvG have been asking for an instanced OS since forever and having Megaservers accomplishes pretty much the same things. Current EotM is kitten for GvGing and Guild Hall is a cesspit where whoever stacks more Spellbreakers wins.
    12. People who don't get along already get linked anyway. This isn't even a point since it happens now anyway.
    13. I apologize since I'm not afflicted with Junctional Herlitz Epidermolysis Bullosa and thus can't understand your pain (google that I guess if you're not a Med Student or sth). I occasionally block people and that's been enough for me.

    I've been to EotM and played it. I've GvGed in EotM, and frankly it was kinda messy since current EotM map has several huge issues that make it unfit for wvw play. It has too many slopes and narrow chokes that make fighting a mess of 'blocked by terrain' and "I onepush so I'm going to camp this choke until they log off I guess." The current EotM's issue is the map itself, not the system. The map itself prevents serious guilds from spending too long in it, which means only pvx and ktrainers are left to spend time on it (until they nerfed the rewards kek).

    tl;dr: I absolute completely adisadisagree with you. If you're confused reading this, there is no freaking tl;dr go up and read the post or if you don't have time go back to working/studying/more important things in life.

    Also I think some people haven't quite grasped what megaserver'ing WvW entails. It would entail the same thing we have now, only instead of each linking having 2-3 servers, each linking would have 8-9 servers.

    I envision that at the end of each week (or longer I guess), instead of a server moving up or down, some of the servers inside the megaserver would be swapped around: the first place would lose one of the servers that make it up (and replace it with an even smaller server from the second or third place) while the third place would gain a bigger server or so. There's a lot more flexibility that can be achieved with such a system: for instance, every map shuts down 6 hours after it opens (whereas current EotM is 4 hours). When a map shuts down, whoever had the highest points (ppt and ppk together) on that map wins Victory points (like current skirmishes). Additional maps will continuously be created if one map is completely filled and people are still coming into WvW.

    What about servers that log off early?

    Well, if one server becomes outnumbered on a map for more than, say, 20 minutes, and then finishes the skirmish 3rd, the victory points awarded change to 0, 1, and 2 for 3rd, 2nd, 1st place. If two servers become outnumbered on a map for more than 20 minutes, the map is closed after a short period of time and the remaining server only gains 1 point if they come 1st (otherwise normal scoring occurs since the other two servers managed to build up enough of a lead).

    Frankly, the main reason behind EotM is to consolidate populations in a dying game mode rather than have small community pockets here and there still pretending winning in ppt or rivalries mean anything anymore.

    Zzzzz anyway enough said on the topic not that it will lead anywhere since these are official forums.

  • Rampage.7145Rampage.7145 Member ✭✭✭

    @X T D.6458 said:

    @Rampage.7145 said:
    Nothing better for fighters than killing huger 80 man ktrains brother just saying, i would kill ktrains all day long if you ask me, just because it is fun.

    I agree.

    However some people still like having something to play for.

    Brother having FUN is what 99% of the people play a videogame for, people who think playing for a virtual server means anything are just living on a dream, are disociated from reality, and they are the vest minority of players/gamers playing not only GW2 but any videogame.

    VR Driver
    Salty beavers top guild 2 years in a row back to back, the double champs
    https://saltybeavers.com/

  • X T D.6458X T D.6458 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Rampage.7145 said:

    @X T D.6458 said:

    @Rampage.7145 said:
    Nothing better for fighters than killing huger 80 man ktrains brother just saying, i would kill ktrains all day long if you ask me, just because it is fun.

    I agree.

    However some people still like having something to play for.

    Brother having FUN is what 99% of the people play a videogame for, people who think playing for a virtual server means anything are just living on a dream, are disociated from reality, and they are the vest minority of players/gamers playing not only GW2 but any videogame.

    Its not about virtual servers, its about giving yourself a goals and a reason to play so you don't get bored or burned out. The ones who leave are the people who constantly server hop and never become part of a server community while proclaiming how they are all about the fights. Both you and I know that its true, I've seen it over and over the last 5 years, and I am sure you have as well. Some were my friends, some were yours, and a lot of guilds we all knew.

    My favorite part of WvW is big zerg fights, that's what I like. But I also want to be part of a community, make friends with people, coordinate with them, be part of a team, help each other. Although I like zerg fights, I do what I can to help my server, including scouting, roaming, small team stuff, etc. This is the best part about WvW for me, we can do whatever we want here.

    BG

  • Baldrick.8967Baldrick.8967 Member ✭✭✭

    I like the variety of current wvw. Some days it's huge fights, some days scouting, some days smaller group action- all with people I know.

    My favourite is taking on those t3 keeps, despite wiping several times, draining their supply, pushing again and again until eventually you take it. It might have taken 2 hours, my entire night's gaming, or whatever, but it was enormous fun, involved some tactics, some perserverance and some great close fights but in the end we feel like we've achieved something.

    Taking t3 keeps isn't to be avoided in prime, unless you are all about the loot bags and k- training. It's one of the best challenges there is in wvw.

    Of course, 3 way fights are great fun too, but only if they are against groups that are well organised. Megaservers where people are randomly shoved into a map with three different languages and no real organisation will just end up like EOTM. If you organise megaservers by combining existing servers then you will have the same population problem as now, where people will flock to the winning side- that's just human nature.

  • Kirnale.5914Kirnale.5914 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    @Namer.9750 said:

    @Kirnale.5914 said:
    Megaserver would result in:
    1. People not caring about defending stuff. Why should they? I would let everything drop because I don't care. You lose all reasoning to defend stuff.
    2. Old school players will quit. Say bye to the good fights. Say hello to trash-tier "fights". At least you get your baggies.
    3. Bore the kitten out of people that like WvW's "strategy" point of view. It will become a battle arena where people meet up in the middle of the map and fight endlessly with no goal. More people will quit.
    4. As a result, karma train will constantly run on the side. PvE people can farm it as much as they like. People who likes to defend stuff will receive some flaming. More people will quit.
    5. Shattered communities. Especially hard on national servers. National servers will likely to lose more than half of their people. Community is one of the most important aspect in this game mode. Without that, the game will quickly die out. Like really, really fast.
    6. kitten distribution of people. People will always join the winner's side. If the distribution is set in stone every week, then they will use 2nd accounts in order to get all colors. And thanks to that, one side will always have too much people. How are you going to distribute the people when there is like 1k+ more on the green side? Create 10 more maps with no blue and red team present? Or make it a 1000s queue?
    7. Community guilds will lose their purpose. Play for the server is completely gone. More people will quit. Colors with random people each week isn't representing enough for them to care.
    8. People will be forced to join a guild to get the bonus. There you go, multiple megaserver guild with 500 people. Still a guild, right? Or just be at some pve random guilds like always.
    9. Ts/discord communication will be completely gone, well besides GvG. Karma trains doesn't need one. Mindless fights in the middle of the map doesn't need one either.
    10. Sieging will lose it's purpose. It's a battle arena after all. Some people like sieging. More people will quit.
    11. GvG will exist, but they will die out much faster than now. Because besides GvG, there is nothing really "WvW-like" stuff to do. People will get bored, they will quit.
    12. People that don't get along with might end up in the same color.
    13. Now you have a whole network of trolls. Time to turn off chat completely. Or right-click block every day, if that is fun to you.

    Sounds like fun? Go into Eotm and play it. Anet have made it just for you. I ask again, why are you still playing normal WvW when your prefered WvW already exist? And yes, Eotm is a megaserver WvW with a set color each week. Doesn't mean player distribution will be fair.

    Oh and one more. Expect to have a whole zerg AFKing spawn to get rewards. Because there is no need to leave for other players to get in to help out your group.

    Incorrect.

    1. In WvW people T3 keeps on reset night anyway then siege it up so massively that it's literally impossible to take in primetime. Defending is already overblown as it is, considering the power of T3 keeps, disablers and siege traps, and all the defensive siege you can put down all over the place.
    2. Wut. Old School players, especially the ones who prefer fighting, would be the ones to come back. It's the acoustic level of sieging and defending, plus a lack of good guilds to fight and blobby servers that drives those players away. The ones who will quit at the ones who get creamed on 1v5 despite their Diamond/Mithril whatever ranks and can't fight worth kitten.
    3. WvW doesn't have any "strategy" anymore lmfao, other than try to run 60 guildies and have enough people to make coffee and sandwiches while you line up 10 trebs and 5 shield gens outside a T3 keep.
    4. PvEers have far better methods of farming karma now, and all it takes is one WvW guild on a map deciding to spend a night 'farming pve'ers' to drive away those ktrainers.
    5. Perhaps the only legitimate point you have, but frankly if it worked out in PvE's Megaservering, it should work out anyway in WvW as well.
    6. Distribution should change weekly. The current system of (1+4+7+10) vs (2+5+8+11) vs (3+6+9+12) is a little reet, but better distributions can be made, taking the top 2-3 and bottom 2-3 servers, then the next top 2-3 and bottom 2-3, in the same way they did the initial linkings, to make 3 sides that should be roughly even. The current servers will still exist and 1-2 will swap colours weekly depending on the position of their megaserver in that matchup.
    7. Community guilds can still exist because your server will still stay it's own cohesive unit inside a megaserver and while the other servers you're allied with and the colour changes, the people and guilds you're playing with will remain constant throughout. They would just add " Community Guild!" to their advertisements or whatever.
    8. Why would you have to join a guild? I'm not talking about the Battlegroups concept that gets bandied around. Do you have to join a guild to participate in the current EotM?
    9. TS/Discord communication will exist perfectly fine. I mean, there are guilds who do nothing but ktrain dead timezones in actual WvW now, and they still use comms. There are plenty of guilds who want to fight each other and they'll use comms.
    10. I thought, according to you people will just ktrain forever. Won't they need to siege and stuff for that? Think about your earlier points before you type lol. As things currently stand, sieging needs a huge overhaul anyway because nobody bothers breaking Tier 3 structures during active times nowadays.
    11. Can people who've never been part of the scene not talk about it please? If you were/are in any GvG guild, you should know you're completely wrong. Guilds who GvG have been asking for an instanced OS since forever and having Megaservers accomplishes pretty much the same things. Current EotM is kitten for GvGing and Guild Hall is a cesspit where whoever stacks more Spellbreakers wins.
    12. People who don't get along already get linked anyway. This isn't even a point since it happens now anyway.
    13. I apologize since I'm not afflicted with Junctional Herlitz Epidermolysis Bullosa and thus can't understand your pain (google that I guess if you're not a Med Student or sth). I occasionally block people and that's been enough for me.

    I've been to EotM and played it. I've GvGed in EotM, and frankly it was kinda messy since current EotM map has several huge issues that make it unfit for wvw play. It has too many slopes and narrow chokes that make fighting a mess of 'blocked by terrain' and "I onepush so I'm going to camp this choke until they log off I guess." The current EotM's issue is the map itself, not the system. The map itself prevents serious guilds from spending too long in it, which means only pvx and ktrainers are left to spend time on it (until they nerfed the rewards kek).

    tl;dr: I absolute completely adisadisagree with you. If you're confused reading this, there is no freaking tl;dr go up and read the post or if you don't have time go back to working/studying/more important things in life.

    Also I think some people haven't quite grasped what megaserver'ing WvW entails. It would entail the same thing we have now, only instead of each linking having 2-3 servers, each linking would have 8-9 servers.

    I envision that at the end of each week (or longer I guess), instead of a server moving up or down, some of the servers inside the megaserver would be swapped around: the first place would lose one of the servers that make it up (and replace it with an even smaller server from the second or third place) while the third place would gain a bigger server or so. There's a lot more flexibility that can be achieved with such a system: for instance, every map shuts down 6 hours after it opens (whereas current EotM is 4 hours). When a map shuts down, whoever had the highest points (ppt and ppk together) on that map wins Victory points (like current skirmishes). Additional maps will continuously be created if one map is completely filled and people are still coming into WvW.

    What about servers that log off early?

    Well, if one server becomes outnumbered on a map for more than, say, 20 minutes, and then finishes the skirmish 3rd, the victory points awarded change to 0, 1, and 2 for 3rd, 2nd, 1st place. If two servers become outnumbered on a map for more than 20 minutes, the map is closed after a short period of time and the remaining server only gains 1 point if they come 1st (otherwise normal scoring occurs since the other two servers managed to build up enough of a lead).

    Frankly, the main reason behind EotM is to consolidate populations in a dying game mode rather than have small community pockets here and there still pretending winning in ppt or rivalries mean anything anymore.

    Zzzzz anyway enough said on the topic not that it will lead anywhere since these are official forums.

    1. So? What is your point? Defending is OP, you don't like, you prefer people jump outside and fight you when you outnumber them or have a stronger zerg?
    2. Who are the old school players? You? The one you knows? There are a bunch of old school players. They are not only fight-centric as you think they are. There are a bunch of them who plays PPT, a bunch that likes both PPT and PPK and a bunch that only prefers PPK. In my server, the ones that stays the longest isn't the ones that prefers fighting only. And yes, they are old school players. And to be honest, old school players come bacK? Players that quit a game won't come back so fast. It is usually RL inc or they have found a better game in the meantime. They have moved on.
    3. I don't even want to explain anything here lol.
    4. They will just simply port away. And depending on how the megaserver is working, they will just go to another map.
    5. Comparing PvE with WvW? lol. PvE never had any sort of things that hold them together. That's why it works. Why should a PvE player cares if he farmed with whatever server his shinies? WvW is different. It have a community that works together for YEARS. It's the core the of the servers that have been keeping WvW alive.
    6. That isn't megaserver. That is pretty much linking.
    7. The post I made was referred to the one that made this thread.
    8. Same as 7. Read the first post.
    9. You don't get my point. There is no need for community TS/discord, which is something I like. Guilds will always use TS/discord, no matter what they do. But other than the guilds, there is no need to use that.
    10. Sieging isn't the same as Ktrain. Ktrain you cap T0 and T1 stuff without resistance. That's why is it usually fridays, because the MU is usually set which server wins or not. Real sieging is when you try to take something that actually is being cared for. You don't say attacking an abandoned castle is sieging. You just simply take it over.
    11. Who are you to think you decide whether I'm part of this scene or not? And why is Eotm bad for GvG? Open field is all you need.
    12. Yes, but not in this mass. Linking Server A and B doesn't create as much as linking all into a megaserver pool.
    13. Cool bro. But I don't want to deal with that. And many in my server would agree.

    And yes, my first post was a reply to the maker of this thread. Who said I talked about your idea?

    And you are still confused about a megaserver. What you are doing is linking, nothing more nothing less. Megaserver is something that throws complete stranger randomly together. Don't use the word megaserver for linking. It is not the same.

    And Eotm is empty because most people don't even consider that as WvW. While the maps sucks, it is certainly the concept that keeps the WvW players away. There is no goal, no teamwork, just a bunch of randoms aimlessly doing something together.

  • SkyShroud.2865SkyShroud.2865 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Justine.6351 said:

    @SkyShroud.2865 said:

    @Justine.6351 said:
    The game isn't setup with the notion of 3 main faction's like ESO is with the Ebonheart Pact, Daggerfall Covenant and Aldermeri Dominion. Identity is important or nobody cares and win trading type things can happen.

    If we ever saw cantha maybe we could get 3 faction's like,

    Kurzick
    Luxon
    Imperial

    But that would likely come with AB maps not WvW.

    Part of the issue imo is that they never added an NPC faction, which made wvw strictly players only. Without the dynamic of an always aggressive and present balancing force on the map, ktraining ensues. Without an NPC faction there is "no story" and wvw becomes as boring as the players who are present at any given time.

    WvW is 100% player driven, which is why it can be amazing or a complete bore.

    People may think I'm stupid for wanting more pve in wvw but it's even more stupid to ask for content in a mode that has none by design and by extension, a system to pit no-identity teams against each other forever, expecting players to be permanently hooked.

    It is setup as fractions, called servers. Though the identity is not as strong as the one you have on pvp mmorpgs with all the supporting mechanism to make it more involving and interesting. Nevertheless, it is still a fraction.

    Since I mentioned pvp mmorpg, I think everybody should understand gw2 isn't a pvp mmorpg, don't get your hope too high.

    It's not really setup as factions in the way I mean as it does not have any meaningful splitting beyond what the players have ascribed to them, like yb the defensive siege server, BG the blob server, and so on. I guess more on the pve side I'm talking which can translate to pvp like AD in ESO was called the ganker alliance because 2 of the 3 races, wood elf and kajit, have stealth racial bonuses. For better or worse, that doesn't exist at all in gw2. There really isn't a draw to any specific server in gw2 other than black gate cause "they big server and always win".

    Yes, it isn't as involving and interesting. Unfortunately, gw2 isn't a pvp mmorpg despite the potential for greatness.

    Founder & Leader of Equinox Solstice [TIME], a Singapore-Based International PvX Guild
    Henge of Denravi Server
    www.gw2time.com

    --

    Explanations of WvW Structures & Populations Issues

  • ArchonWing.9480ArchonWing.9480 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    Why not just fix EOTM and make it a map conductive to fights?

    If it's clearly the superior method, people will naturally move.

  • Hyper Cutter.9376Hyper Cutter.9376 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @X T D.6458 said:
    If this was a good idea, EoTM would be full of people

    It was full of people, until Anet gutted the rewards to drive them out (including specifically not allowing you to earn pips there).

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭

    WvW didn't have rewards for most of it's existence. EoTM living and dying on it's bling factor kinda shows people weren't there for the PvP

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • Between population drops and megaservers killing anything that resembled server pride which both in turn killed WvW in many ways, I can't see a single plus to making WvW itself megaservered. That will put the final nail in that coffin. Horrible idea.

    Greck Howlbane - Firebrand
    Sorrow's Furnace For Life

  • hunkamania.7561hunkamania.7561 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hyper Cutter.9376 said:

    @X T D.6458 said:
    If this was a good idea, EoTM would be full of people

    It was full of people, until Anet gutted the rewards to drive them out (including specifically not allowing you to earn pips there).

    Yup, most the time there was no fights in wvw and our group would go eotm and there was something going on now there's no fights in wvw we just log. The server system is trash and most the people for that type of system are stuck in their ways afraid of change for the better.

    Ferguson's Crossing Server Leader

    WVW LEADER

    VR

  • Israel.7056Israel.7056 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2018

    This would basically turn WvW into something like the old pvp hotjoin games. They were fun but there's something to be said for the more permanent server identities and the sense of belonging that individual, distinct and persistent servers offer as well. Having different servers with different vibes and 'personalities' allows for players to self select and self organize based on their own individual priorities and values. So for me the best server is Maguuma but for others it might be Henge of Denravi. Having three different teams would just make everything feel homogeneous and that's boring. Fights are fun but fights when you feel like you're fighting for something that you actually care about are better in my experience.

  • Aenaos.8160Aenaos.8160 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 28, 2018

    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

  • X T D.6458X T D.6458 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 28, 2018

    @Hyper Cutter.9376 said:

    @X T D.6458 said:
    If this was a good idea, EoTM would be full of people

    It was full of people, until Anet gutted the rewards to drive them out (including specifically not allowing you to earn pips there).

    Letoll basically answered it.

    @LetoII.3782 said:
    WvW didn't have rewards for most of it's existence. EoTM living and dying on it's bling factor kinda shows people weren't there for the PvP

    BG

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Anet can always test this idea to see if it will work. And if people don't like it. Lessen the servers. ^O^ And in the least return to status quo

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • As long as 2 things happen

    1) no player limit on maps
    2) remove player cap for abilities so I can hit 50 people with Meteor Shower

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sovereign.1093 said:
    Anet can always test this idea to see if it will work. And if people don't like it. Lessen the servers. ^O^ And in the least return to status quo

    They have tested it.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2018

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

  • Kirnale.5914Kirnale.5914 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2018

    WvW is community-centric and guilds are part of that community. While guilds carry the server (by leads and fighting power), they can't do everything alone. Without the randoms, you won't be able to hold your ground for long. And sometimes, the randoms can be really good. Our server consists roughly about 50/50 of guilds/randoms. Ofc you can suddenly decide on one server like Vabbi does and all transfer there. But it usually isn't the case. Also, some guilds exists for the community alone.

    Also joining the team their guild is on is flawed as it can be. Image 500 people guilds can all go into one team. Now multiply that by the amounts of these guilds.

  • i don't see how anet can save/fix/whatever wvw when community don't know what it wants :/

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    Again, this is currently in EOTM. People don't go there now, and guilds don't go there.

    Pugs and ransoms aren't anti social. Lmao.. a better case could be against the guilds who only run closed being anti social and this would only incentivize it more.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    Again, this is currently in EOTM. People don't go there now, and guilds don't go there.

    Pugs and ransoms aren't anti social. Lmao.. a better case could be against the guilds who only run closed being anti social and this would only incentivize it more.

    LOL... So a social group is anti-social, but people that run alone with minimal interaction are the social ones. Fun.
    And no that's not EoTM.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    Again, this is currently in EOTM. People don't go there now, and guilds don't go there.

    Pugs and ransoms aren't anti social. Lmao.. a better case could be against the guilds who only run closed being anti social and this would only incentivize it more.

    LOL... So a social group is anti-social, but people that run alone with minimal interaction are the social ones. Fun.
    And no that's not EoTM.

    So, I guess you've never gone into WvW without your guild, because that makes you a PUG. And I take it your guild has never run closed.

    You are calling the roamers/pugs/ransoms anti social. Not I. And I am calling guilds who (by all rights it is their choice) that run closed anti social.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @Sovereign.1093 said:
    Anet can always test this idea to see if it will work. And if people don't like it. Lessen the servers. ^O^ And in the least return to status quo

    They have tested it.

    they must test it again with us like pre hot

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • zinkz.7045zinkz.7045 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2018

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    LOL... So a social group is anti-social, but people that run alone with minimal interaction are the social ones. Fun.

    Rather depends, within the context of a video game, some of the most anti-social people are those who for example play with the same four friends in their own little guild, and barely interact with anyone else, where as some people not in guilds can be some of them chattiest people in map chat, actually meet and interact with other people because they pug fractals, etc, rather than play with the same 4 people, so really it depends on the person, being in a guild or not doesn't really mean anything.

    And then in a broader context, someone who sits in a room, alone, playing a video game for thousands of hours with their guild "friends" would frankly be mocked by most of society if they claimed they were sociable, where as one of the reasons some people don't do the guild thing, is they actually have this thing called a life, with actual friends, work, other interests, etc so they only play the game a limited amount of time, which on the whole is not conducive to being part of most sorts of guild, but is conducive to having an actual social life.

  • ArchonWing.9480ArchonWing.9480 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2018

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    Again, this is currently in EOTM. People don't go there now, and guilds don't go there.

    Pugs and ransoms aren't anti social. Lmao.. a better case could be against the guilds who only run closed being anti social and this would only incentivize it more.

    LOL... So a social group is anti-social, but people that run alone with minimal interaction are the social ones. Fun.
    And no that's not EoTM.

    So, I guess you've never gone into WvW without your guild, because that makes you a PUG. And I take it your guild has never run closed.

    You are calling the roamers/pugs/ransoms anti social. Not I. And I am calling guilds who (by all rights it is their choice) that run closed anti social.

    And not to mention common anti-social behaviors like some groups demanding the map be their personal playground especially when there's a queue.

    Regardless of which end people come from it boils down to "I'm more important than other people"

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    there is skill in teamwork because it is not easy. those who dont understand that needs to wake up =)

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • Norbe.7630Norbe.7630 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2018

    Why would there will be someone that insists megaserver if theres already one (EoTM), the linking is already on its way to be like one.
    Why not make guild halls a battle ground instead of requesting OS as an instance like PvP.
    Your guild hall can be attacked and your guild can also attack other guild halls, setting like a PvP season would be good and guild ratings a record.
    Tournament burnout would be obsolete........

    As a guild in PvE you go adventures together
    As a guild in GvG you fight and defend together
    As a guild in WvW you die alot together

    Why So Serious?

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Norbe.7630 said:
    Why would there will be someone that insists megaserver if theres already one (EoTM), the linking is already on its way to be like one.
    Why not make guild halls a battle ground instead of requesting OS as an instance like PvP.
    Your guild hall can be attacked and your guild can also attack other guild halls, setting like a PvP season would be good and guild ratings a record.
    Tournament burnout would be obsolete........

    As a guild in PvE you go adventures together
    As a guild in GvG you fight and defend together
    As a guild in WvW you die alot together

    Actually that would be awesome GvG! The best games i've played GvG in had pretty much the same style of play (GW1, Perfect World, Runes of Magic), your Guild Hall would be your battleground and you'd attack the enemies and defend yours.

    Well, MegaServers with only 3 teams in WvW would arguably be a fix for WvW, i've never mentioned GvG in any post, because as far as i'm concerned GW2 has no such thing. I mentioned guilds simply because when shuffling players into random teams for that sort of rework, there should be a grace period where people can reshuffle themselves to get on the same server as their WvW guild. And then be locked in afterwards with the same system for changing servers/teams as we have today.

    What would megaservers fix:

    • Map capacity could be reduced, lowering latency, and FPS losses.
    • Lowering map capacity might lead to less reliance in numbers, and allow for better more strategic play.
    • A reset and reshufle of everyone would solve current overpopulated servers.
    • A "loyalty" bonus could be added to WvW rewards to keep people from moving to the strongest team.
    • Lower map caps and only 3 teams would lead to more people queueing, which although fixed by adding more instances of the map, would also punish overpopulated maps, because in order to keep balance there would have to be a quorum in every team, which without a well dispersed population would punish the team with too many people.
    • Possibility of bringing back the WvW bonuses, but this time geared towards the team you're representing.
    • Nightcapping wouldn't be such a big issue.
    • Outnumbered would also be less of an issue, especially if there's enforced balance.

    The downside to this would be that objectives would have to be reworked because of the impermanence of the servers.

  • Ill never understand people wanting to make WvW into EoTM, when they already have EoTM.

    If this was the optimal choice, why not just play it instead of trying to force on those who don’t care for it?

  • @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    I’m going to assume you’re relatively new to WvW to make the above statements. Otherwise you’d recognize that some like to blob, others don’t, and both contribute to the map. Lose one group or another and you’ll see even emptier maps. WvW is a microcosm that relies on cooperative gameplay. That includes multiple styles of play. To indicate otherwise lacks foresight.

  • DeadlySynz.3471DeadlySynz.3471 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    I’m going to assume you’re relatively new to WvW to make the above statements. Otherwise you’d recognize that some like to blob, others don’t, and both contribute to the map. Lose one group or another and you’ll see even emptier maps. WvW is a microcosm that relies on cooperative gameplay. That includes multiple styles of play. To indicate otherwise lacks foresight.

    There is no cooperative game play when there is no semblance of population balance. You can easily have one larger uncoordinated group running over a smaller coordinated group with ease. Population balance needs to be had above anything else first and foremost and that is exactly what the mega server fixes. So unless the populace as a whole can agree to disperse themselves evenly among all the servers (which we know is never going to happen), balance should simply be imposed on WvW before people get bored and walk out of the game either from having no competition or being rolled continuously.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2018

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Thustlewhumber.7416 said:
    EOTM's Megaserver resulted in 1) green server constantly rolling blue and red, or 2) just rotating keeps over and over. Turning all of WvW into EOTM isn't the answer, and you would LOSE players... not gain them.

    That's a problem with the map, not the teams.

    @Aenaos.8160 said:
    Yeah... that's exactly what WvW needs,taking away what little is left of servers ,and turning it into EotM 2.0 with pips.
    Make bandvagoning from a thing that it is now,to the only thing.
    I'd rather if they allowed people to gain pips in EotM,so you can farm your pips,and we can at least enjoy WvW proper.
    Even in it's current state WvW is 100 times better than EotM or ESO's bs of a campaign.

    You're assuming that bandwagoning would even be possible?
    This kind of change would actually make it possible to reset all WvW populations and create proper measures to avoid bandwagoning.

    There is some possible truth to that.

    My problem with most of the proposals that have been floated by players is that it would be guild centric. Not player centric. No priority should be given to guilds if we go to this system.

    Guilds that want it, have yet to truly note why. Fights can currently be accomplished in EOTM.

    Well, in case you didn't notice WvW is already guild-centric. Only guilds can claim stuff, and having a claimed keep increases it's power by a lot.
    So it will always be somewhat guild-centric.
    Now the option to have teams based on the guild would have to be binding to the guild, but not entirely to the player. But a choice has to be given to the player to join the Team their main guild is on.

    I don't think this system would replace GvG in any way. But WvW always has been very guild-centric, but not guild exclusive, and the Mega-server solution isn't either.

    However, what many people have advocated for is guilds choosing where they want to go and pugs being the 'full ins' on the other servers/groups. That would be the deathknell.

    And no, the choice DOESNT have to be given to the player to go where their guild is. That would just lead to more stacking.

    Actually, since it's group content, it shouldn't cater to the anti-social. And yes they should allow people to go to where their guild is, of course.
    BUT, only in the period after the switch.

    Plus bandwagoning would actually be detrimental to players with this mode...
    With mega-servers and only 3 teams, a lot more people would be queuing per team. But how WvW works, there would have to be a minimum of players on each team queued for the system to create a new instance.
    So imagine a new map would be created when each team has 50+ ppl queued. If too many people bandwagon to a single team, what would end up happening is that team having 100++ people queued when the others don't have enough to start a new instance. So the system itself would punish bandwagoning, and people would naturally disperse to be able to queue.

    I’m going to assume you’re relatively new to WvW to make the above statements. Otherwise you’d recognize that some like to blob, others don’t, and both contribute to the map. Lose one group or another and you’ll see even emptier maps. WvW is a microcosm that relies on cooperative gameplay. That includes multiple styles of play. To indicate otherwise lacks foresight.

    Blobs are mostly people just blindly following one person, it's not cooperation it's delegation of responsibility.
    I've been playing WvW since there is a GW2. And i had the opportunity to play it before zergs/blobs became a staple of the game. When people would divide into smaller groups to capture individual points simultaneously.
    Emptier maps compared to what? Have you ever played WvW on a map where a com just jumped maps? That's a freaking desert.

    Also, funny enough you actually quoted a post where i never mentioned blobs or zergs... Or maybe you don't understand the concept of bandwagoning, as in moving to the winning server to reap easy rewards, which leads to huge population imbalances?

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:
    Ill never understand people wanting to make WvW into EoTM, when they already have EoTM.

    If this was the optimal choice, why not just play it instead of trying to force on those who don’t care for it?

    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM. It doesn't mean that 3 global factions isn't better than individual servers, because the only actual difference between EoTM and a mega-server type system with 3 teams, is that there would be some less persistence of objectives (to be fair, there's people advocating that they reset with each skirmish) if a Mega-server goes too low and is closed.
    All else is improved, you'd have less queue times if all servers are balanced, which would incentivize people to spread out more evenly instead of all jumping to the winning server, would remove the issue with night capping, and would allow map capacity to be more flexible, since they wouldn't have to worry about queues.

  • Norbe.7630Norbe.7630 Member ✭✭✭

    PvE is Fashion Wars 2
    pls dun make WvW a Faction Wars too :/

    Why So Serious?

  • @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

    And of course winning doesn't matter nor does rewards so... It should fix things for them.

  • ReaverKane.7598ReaverKane.7598 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Norbe.7630 said:
    PvE is Fashion Wars 2
    pls dun make WvW a Faction Wars too :/

    It already is?

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

    Did i say that? Actually never have i mentioned EoTM before others did. EoTM doesn't work because it's an isolated mechanic that doesn't bring anything to the rest. Having 3 factions with instantiated maps, would. It's not the same thing as Edge of the Mists. And the fact that Edge of the Mists didn't work has no bearing on this suggestion since the similarities start and end with there being factions in it.

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

    And of course winning doesn't matter nor does rewards so... It should fix things for them.

    1) Again, didn't say that.
    2) In the Height of WvW people actually had to play pve to fund WvW the rewards were pretty much non-existant, and people still played it. Now that they added rewards, it's arguably much, much worse.

  • Hoon.1524Hoon.1524 Member ✭✭✭

    #serverpride2018

  • @ReaverKane.7598 said:

    @Norbe.7630 said:
    PvE is Fashion Wars 2
    pls dun make WvW a Faction Wars too :/

    It already is?

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

    Did i say that? Actually never have i mentioned EoTM before others did. EoTM doesn't work because it's an isolated mechanic that doesn't bring anything to the rest. Having 3 factions with instantiated maps, would. It's not the same thing as Edge of the Mists. And the fact that Edge of the Mists didn't work has no bearing on this suggestion since the similarities start and end with there being factions in it.

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:

    @SugarCayne.3098 said:

    @ReaverKane.7598 said:
    EoTM doesn't work because it's estranged from the rest of the game mode, its not integral to it, and the map itself sux. That's the problem with EoTM.

    So if Anet took devs away from working on WvW and created a new EoTM map you'd be happy and not want to make WvW into another EoTM?

    Ok that clears things up.

    And of course winning doesn't matter nor does rewards so... It should fix things for them.

    1) Again, didn't say that.
    2) In the Height of WvW people actually had to play pve to fund WvW the rewards were pretty much non-existant, and people still played it. Now that they added rewards, it's arguably much, much worse.

    People bring up EoTM because you’re describing EoTM.

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