With professions more in need of a rework...you opt to reevaluate an already strong class

It's hard...it's not possible anymore to hide the level of favouritism that goes behind the curtains when it comes to balance. Some professions get all the attention, evaluation and testing meticulously designed to cover any possible scenario, nothing is left to chance; some professions always receive buffs aimed at creating powerful new meta build or increase the efficiency of the ones they already possess . On other hand we have professions with changes that look more like random attempts with no background knowledge about the profession, these so called changes are aimed to, a level of change that any random nobody could create after reading the GW2 wiki for half hour.

To those new to GW2, this is the second time that mesmers receive a full 360 change, the first happened soon after GW2 launch, meanwhile other professions have been sitting on the same gameplay since launch, the same gameplay that has seen nothing but overbearing nerfs and insignificant buffs

Are people ok with this? Was mesmer really the class more in need of a rework at this time?

Yeah mesmer needed a rework. Hopefully they are reworking the way they stack conditions and hopefully they are reworking how elusive mind works cause right now it's insane. Rework doesn't always mean favorite. In this case (hopefully) it could mean they see there's problems with it that simple number changes won't fix and are trying to address the issue so the rest of us can play against mesmer without instant 25 confusion stacks.

Whatever. If it turns out mesmers perform even better after this rework than prior, it's par for the course.I don't expect steps even remotely in the right direction at this point.

Both thief and mesmer need a complete redesign. Here is the kicker; only mesmer getting a rework but it doesn't end here: once again, Mesmer will return being toxic and broken due to the fact that thief design not being reworked.

By the way, both thief and mesmer are favorable by the same dev.

GL

As someone who mained Mesmer at the first year of my play experience, this is a much needed change. It is surely a change In the right direction for Mesmer.

But I also do question the timing. Considering that Mesmer performs well in every game mode, and fulfill different roles, there are issues with much significant priority, primarily boon corruption and class performance disparity.

If these were also addressed in this patch, then it will be okay. If not, then this Mesmer indever is complete waste of dev resources.

The reworked Phantasms don't seem to be the only change on Mesmers, lots of traits are undouptly hit too. Don't assume anything until full patch notes are out.

Why is this in the pvp forums? it's clear the "redesign" didn't take pvp into consideration and the whole redesign likely just stem from some anet mesmer main not liking how they are afking in raids. All the while you get engis/eles that are also not playing the way they were originally meant to do (swapping kits/attunements constantly) and warriors just dropping some banners and using longbow instead of meleeing or tanking, but apparently anet is ok with that.

I just can't wrap my mind around how can they look at the state of the PvP/WvW meta and say "hey, let's leave it as is for half a year, and instead improve the gameplay of something that's already top tier in every area of the game"Anet has serious problems when it comes to priorities.

I don't think it needed a rework. Also, this is mainly a PvE rework as Phantasm builds in PvP is just not, or ever will be a thing. However since they said they're making sweeping changes, it could drastically buff or nerf current shatter builds. Honestly, it sounds like it makes Mesmer more of a fun class to play in theory, so I'm all for it. I just hope it's as viable as it was before.

Also, the balance patch hasn't dropped yet so I think it's a little too early to say Anet is neglecting the other classes.

At this point im waiting for them to announce that more GW1 servers are being added and they are going back to developing that game, because build diversity or balance wise, GW1 was much greater in every sense. However, what improved GW1 pvp experience, with its own balance crisis, was that they split pvp and pve skills. The same needs to happen here, and immediately, because incremental changes and waiting 3 more years to see the fruit of those changes is killing parts of the game for ppl that not only care about PVE... which is not good overall. PvP/WvW are endgame choices... but if theyre dead or not getting new attention.. then what? Pve with more lackluster rewards & boxes? No thanks.

Mesmer was functionally broken since launch and needed a rework wayyy before necro ever got looked at. It was rushed out and was being burdened by it's own mechanic.Chrono slightly fixed the generation and prevalence problem.Mirage solved the kill confirm and mobility problem.

But baseline it was still poor and elite specs were just a band-aid.

Mes across the board is losing it's consistent damage, and you'll be thankful when a mesmer has to stop and take 3 quarters of a second to cast a delayed attack, every 15 seconds (probably). I know any decent Thieves/Guard/Engies will. For all we know it could be a game wide nerf but feels better to play.

What mesmer needed was a nerf, this class dominates all game modes. Mirage is god in PvP and all end game content groups basically revolve around the chrono. This is clearly their favorite class though so idk why anyone is surprised.

Sorry but a class that can spam 25 stacks of confusion on a enemy have them clear and do it again in 5 seconds should not have unlimited damage evades. You sould either be able to evade forever and be a distraction or be able to sneak and spam. not both. Scourge needs to be toned down but we have barrier compared to the 100 ways to evade damage with mesmer.

Dodge evade, spam spam spam, evade, dodge, mirror cloak, invulnerability, spam spam spam spam, dogde evade, dodge, evade, mirror cloak, Spam spam spam, Dodge, dodge, invulnerability, Spike.

Being able to dance around damage and not be hit while spamming conditions without issue or being hurt is bull crap. That's why condi spam got out of control when confusion went from just doing damage you when you cast a skill to doing damage every second and on skill use.

This is why I laughed when people said ele is anet's favorite class.

Ele is like the top employee anet wants to get rid of. It's famous and successful, but that doesn't mean anet sees it with good eyes, they're just a necessary evil.

Warrior and mesmer = anet clearly favorite classes. Bias is obvious.

@Razor.6392 said:This is why I laughed when people said ele is anet's favorite class.

Ele is like the top employee anet wants to get rid of. It's famous and successful, but that doesn't mean anet sees it with good eyes, they're just a necessary evil.

Warrior and mesmer = anet clearly favorite classes. Bias is obvious.

Flavor of the month doesn't necessarily mean favorite. I mean, look at guardian. It's never been irrelevant in any game mode ever, and there are several viable builds for core, DH, and firebrand in every game mode.

@Razor.6392 said:This is why I laughed when people said ele is anet's favorite class.

Ele is like the top employee anet wants to get rid of. It's famous and successful, but that doesn't mean anet sees it with good eyes, they're just a necessary evil.

Warrior and mesmer = anet clearly favorite classes. Bias is obvious.

Anet's favorite class is never the main of the one making the claim lol

I mean it is doubtful that Ele would be it, and Mesmer is a strong candidate, but I think the most polished class or should I say complete (even if OPAS), is probably guardian.

Revenant is/was fun, but what happened? Did they can the guy/girl who dreamed it up?

Thief is a love-hate class, people love to play it, but hate playing against it. If thief can beat your main, it's time for a nerf....seems to be the case. Obviously thief had some really strong abilities. It is strong, but not insurmountable in team skirmishes or 1 v 1.

It is very unlikely that these changes will weaken the mes. The devs have the dream but the players find the truth...about a class.

Perhaps they can beat svanir with the new mes, and if so....welp reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Ideally? I think all professions need a whole redesign of the core mechanic, and then an upgrade for the elite specialization mechanic as well, to retrofit them properly.

I made threads for each profession, with redesign ideas. You can read them here:

• Elementalist
• Mesmer
• Necromancer
• Engineer
• Ranger
• Thief
• Guardian
• Revenant
• Warrior

Since release, they've been applying band-aids, and the real problem is that most professions are broken at the core, at the gameplay mechanics. You can fix the numbers all you want, but if the mechanic is broken, new problems will keep appearing. And of course, elite specializations really suffer from this.

If I were to be as objective as possible I honestly believe the devs care about all the classes and the game as a whole.

Having said that, I find it very short sighted to jump on the bandwagon of "mesmer OP and they get a rework/buff!!!?!?!11". It must be realised that this is a crucial rework of the foundation mechanics of gw2 mesmer certainly one of the biggest changes across any class since launch and more importantly it lays a new foundation for appropriate balance changes to me made - ie you'll all get your mesmer nerfs that you want, while the class maintains a more robustly designed core framework that isn't contradictory/anti-synergistic.

Yes Revenant Legends need to be addressed, Ranger pets could be addressed, and so on - but please stop this "hashtag me too" rally call which serves no purpose. I'm sure this is only the start of what could be a deeper look at all the classes' primary mechanics.

@Daishi.6027 said:Mesmer was functionally broken since launch and needed a rework wayyy before necro ever got looked at. It was rushed out and was being burdened by it's own mechanic.Chrono slightly fixed the generation and prevalence problem.Mirage solved the kill confirm and mobility problem.

But baseline it was still poor and elite specs were just a band-aid.

Mes across the board is losing it's consistent damage, and you'll be thankful when a mesmer has to stop and take 3 quarters of a second to cast a delayed attack, every 15 seconds (probably). I know any decent Thieves/Guard/Engies will. For all we know it could be a game wide nerf but feels better to play.

I agree, well said.

Favoritism isn't 100% correct for describing it, now that I think about it.

There are simply professions Anet understands and those they do not, which is scary enough on its own. The ones they know in and out like mesmer get more attention, while others like revenant (where the guy who made the entire thing was moved to work on mounts a year after HoT) are left in the dirt.

I'm still waiting for the Med Kit for Engineer to be useful in PvE or PvP that's not going to happen at all though.

@Arheundel.6451 said:It's hard...it's not possible anymore to hide the level of favouritism that goes behind the curtains when it comes to balance. Some professions get all the attention, evaluation and testing meticulously designed to cover any possible scenario, nothing is left to chance; some professions always receive buffs aimed at creating powerful new meta build or increase the efficiency of the ones they already possess . On other hand we have professions with changes that look more like random attempts with no background knowledge about the profession, these so called changes are aimed to, a level of change that any random nobody could create after reading the GW2 wiki for half hour.

To those new to GW2, this is the second time that mesmers receive a full 360 change, the first happened soon after GW2 launch, meanwhile other professions have been sitting on the same gameplay since launch, the same gameplay that has seen nothing but overbearing nerfs and insignificant buffs

Are people ok with this? Was mesmer really the class more in need of a rework at this time?

Its funny that you say this when Mirage was clearly the least tested PoF elite spec, and we were flat out told by devs that it was partially designed around artwork instead of an actual theme. But yea, mesmer is totally the class that always gets all of the attention.

The class' core design was fundamentally at odds with itself, no other class had to struggle with that. Mesmer needed this redesign. If you can't understand that then its only because you never put any significant amount of time and effort into playing mesmer.

The people that make the final decisions on balance for the most part are not spvp players and that's a gigantic problem. There is no reason why spvp balance cant be a total split from pve balance and have its only balance guys except they dont really give a damn and want to use the resources to make it so. What is good in spvp is not always good in pve and vice versa. That's the disconnect and its a impossible line to straddle the way they do things currently.

if anet would split everything and nerf it down to a normal level agian that would be lovely

Realistically though the rework isn’t a blanket buff, plus it literally removes the base that chronophantasma shatter was built around.

That being said mesmer needed a rework, a rework is not the same as a buff. I think this is well on the way to making Mesmer a more cohesive class, and not one reliant on op gimmicks and synergy.

Mesmer needed neutered