So what are necros supposed to be good at?

If we can't be:

Good at damageGood at healingGood at support.

WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO? it seems like we can't have nice stuff because people will cry about it.

Good at a bit of everything I suppose. I honestly don't see much of a difference in performance (in WvW) anyway, mainly because I never ran the standard scourge build. People are still going to whine about our damage anyway because they can't seem to differentiate between being hit by 1 scourge vs multiple scourges at once.

You can still stand around afk with a MM bunker build farming some mobs.

Good at boon stripping? Currently, that's still the case.

Maybe dying? Seems the only thing left for necros do to these days...

@Drarnor Kunoram.5180 said:Good at boon stripping? Currently, that's still the case.

Even that was nerfed in this patch lol.

@HardRider.2980 said:

@Drarnor Kunoram.5180 said:Good at boon stripping? Currently, that's still the case.

It was, but we are still good at it.

Necro is good at downed state. Nothing has changed in 5+ years.

They need to delete necro already before new players waste their time and level one to 80 like we all did.

@Axl.8924 said:If we can't be:

Good at damageGood at healingGood at support.

WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO? it seems like we can't have nice stuff because people will cry about it.

We are good at afk farming with minions. Guess thats the only thing anet allows us to do.

Oh wait... afk farming is forbidden as well...

@Drarnor Kunoram.5180 said:

@HardRider.2980 said:

@Drarnor Kunoram.5180 said:Good at boon stripping? Currently, that's still the case.

But other classes can do the same.

Complaining

@DeadlySynz.3471 said:Good at a bit of everything I suppose. I honestly don't see much of a difference in performance (in WvW) anyway, mainly because I never ran the standard scourge build. People are still going to whine about our damage anyway because they can't seem to differentiate between being hit by 1 scourge vs multiple scourges at once.Guess you havent played wvw out of being zergling. The 0.5 sec cast time just utterly destroy your build.

@Kam.4092 said:Complaining

WhatchootalkinboutWillis

Even with the nerf, necromancers and especially scourges are hand down the best at ripping boons, Drarnor is right about that.The necromancer is also still crazy good at applying a huge variety of conditions in a short amount of time even if variety does not mean quality.The necromancer is also still a profession which have a good inate survivability in low risk environment making it a profession easier to pick for new players.

That's what they are good at.

So in short the necromancer is supposed to be good at bringing it's foes down to it's level (through condition/boon corruption) and then outlast them. That's the design of the necromancer in a nutshell (even if it's not even close to this result)

@Kam.4092 said:Complaining

And that's that. Anything a necro player says from here on out about any future balance patch is invalidated. Pack it up guys.

I hear deadeye's gotten some buffs? Great time to try thief no? Could even get some warrior in your life.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Even with the nerf, necromancers and especially scourges are hand down the best at ripping boons, Drarnor is right about that.The necromancer is also still crazy good at applying a huge variety of conditions in a short amount of time even if variety does not mean quality.The necromancer is also still a profession which have a good inate survivability in low risk environment making it a profession easier to pick for new players.

That's what they are good at.

So in short the necromancer is supposed to be good at bringing it's foes down to it's level (through condition/boon corruption) and then outlast them. That's the design of the necromancer in a nutshell (even if it's not even close to this result)

And they badly failed at reaching the goal of this design.

Necro is good class for bad players.

I personally don't agree.While yes you can survive in unranked its not 100% braindead as you think.

Surviving is a pain pre pof, and reapers were super easy to kill.Even now with these new changes, reaper is still a joke.I mean what about thieves? a S/P thief with poison can teleport around but thats fine? sounds biased to me.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Even with the nerf, necromancers and especially scourges are hand down the best at ripping boons, Drarnor is right about that.This is trueThe necromancer is also still crazy good at applying a huge variety of conditions in a short amount of time even if variety does not mean quality.Not so much naturally. Necros are limited by boons that foes have and the ability to convert those boons allows for the variety of conditions. Naturally necromancer is mostly bleeds with minimal torment and tons of vuln.Or it usually requires the necromancer to be hit with conditions before hand to send them back to foes. This is not the same as simply applying heavy conditions.

The necromancer is also still a profession which have a good inate survivability in low risk environment making it a profession easier to pick for new players.Only with core and even so the survivability pales in comparison to any profession with evades/stealth, invuln skills, or hard blocks. There is no inate survivability by simply having slightly more hp in this day and age of the game. This is especially true when it comes to pvp / wvw.

So in short the necromancer is supposed to be good at bringing it's foes down to it's level (through condition/boon corruption) and then outlast them. That's the design of the necromancer in a nutshell (even if it's not even close to this result)

This part is also true but as you said its design is flawed and its not close to doing this as a result. Any profession with moderate sustain via healing, stealth, evades, or invuln and hight damage output will out last the necromancer several times over due to the long cooldowns and outdated tools the necromancer has at its base. While good players can make it work its design is certainly flawed. I would say more so bringing other foes down to its level part.

Necormancer often struggles on that line of risk vs reward and usually most tools fall on the scale of 75% risk 25% reward vs a 50/50 split.

@AceGonzalez.9380 said:They need to delete necro already before new players waste their time and level one to 80 like we all did.

@obcan.1470 said:Necro is good class for bad players.

As an Engineer main, taunting shouldn't be your purity of purpose.

@"Axl.8924" said:I personally don't agree.While yes you can survive in unranked its not 100% braindead as you think.

Surviving is a pain pre pof, and reapers were super easy to kill.Even now with these new changes, reaper is still a joke.I mean what about thieves? a S/P thief with poison can teleport around but thats fine? sounds biased to me.

Obcan think highly of engineers and elementalists and poorly about any other profession. He got the misconception that these two professions are harder to play and thus more valuable than profession that he deem "easy". The reality is that as long as you play long enough with each and every professions, none of them are harder to play nor do they earn the right to be above other professions. The necromancer is just the easiest for him to hate because it's designed to be hated by other professions since it forcibly bring those professions down a notch with all it's boon hate and all it's outgoing conditions. Nobody like to see it's abilities crippled in PvP and sadly it's the only thing that the necromancer can do.

The only thing necro is good at: AFK FARMING

Warrior: Multiweapon class with decent dps, strong and unique support (boons and banners, hp and heavy armor.Berserker: Condi variant of warrior, with great condi dps and bursty feel.Spellbreaker: PvP focused "disabler" that really feels good.

Elementalist: Best DPS class with tons of skills and strong and unique support (boons and auras)Tempest: Support/dps/healer with even better acces to auras.Weaver: Fun to play mage class with ability to combine element. Greatest dps in game.

Revenant: Recently fixed multi-role warrior. Support/Healer and both condi and power DPSHerald: Unique boon support mechanic, great as power dps too. Accest to tons of boons.Renegade: Support/Condi DPS. Can be anything with really good efficency.

Guardian: Supportive paladin. Good DPS, Aegis mechanic, can carry newbs.Dragonhunter: Amazing DPS/Trapper with great power. Very good in endgame pve and pvp.Firebrand: Similar to renegade, it can be both support and dps. OP in PvP.

Ranger: Fun pet user class with great versatility. Unique boons(spirits), good power and condi dps.Druid: Best healer+support class in game, now probably similar to healing renegade/venatari. Acces to spirits makes him auto-included in endgame pve.Soulbeast: Very strong condi dps with some supportive abilities as well.

Mesmer: Illusionist mage with mobility skills. Mass invisibility and portals anyone? Class mechanic great in pvp.Chronomancer: So far best tank in game with very needed aclarity+quickness+aegis combo, makes him auto-included in endgame pve.Mirage: Strong DPS and great "feel" of class.

Engineer: Versatile gadget user. Can be realy anythingScraper: Now reworked, a tank with access to great party supportive/healing skills. Great in PvP.Holosmith: Amazing dps, fun to play, feels a bit easier than core engi.

Thief: Hit and Run dps with a lot of invisibility skills and amazing mobilityDaredevil: Meele dps with enhanced evasion. Great as condiDeadeye: Ranged focused power dps with some supportive abilities. Now boosted to be really good.

Necromancer: Outperformed in every way by other classes: Low dps, almost zero support. Necromancer-themed minions are just bad.Reaper: This class was never explained how should actually work. Promised as power dps, was a condi solo dps for years. Now its just a bad and slow power dps.Scourge: Target for all nerfs. Supposed to be support but its so bad that i lack words to describe it. Doesn't deal dmg too.

Bandaid fixes:Core necro: Enhance all corruption skills to be twice as effective. Other classes have access to stronger condi utilites and our corruptions deals dmg to ourself and are worse in most cases. They should be enchanced by 200% minimum.Rework Minions. Make F2-F5 skills that will enhance their skills/heal them using our life force.Add a minion, pernament or summonable with Life Force.

Reaper: If its meant to be power dps it should get higher numbers than Deadeye now. Ranged weapons always meant to deal less dmg than meele, because its harder to get to the enemy sometimes. Plus necro is really immobile, thus all reaper skills should be greatly enchanced. If Deadeye with suboptimal rotation can deal 31dps then reaper should do 34 minimum. Whats more, reaper should deal even more than meele thief because thief has superior mobility, allowing to close gaps,teleport to and from enemies and such. Reaper is a sitting duck so if he somehow gets to enemy, he should smash.

Scourge: Here. We have support/condi dps elites in form of Renegade and Firebrand. We have pure condi in form of Soulbeast and Mirage. We have full support in form of Cronomancer and Druid. Few exaplmes how to fix scourge:

• If it should be support/condi then dps should be equal to firebrand and mirage at their best. Supportive skills should generate full stacks of at least 4 different boons. On top of it, there should be 1-2 unique boons, synergised with Scourge. Boosting Vampiric Presence and scaling it with power does not help at all.
• If it meant to be pure support, then barrier generation should get some necro-unique enchancements. Make barrier convert to HP after decay (or 50% of it, 75% when traited?). Make insta-kill raidboss skills deal 100% HP dmg, thus making barrier the way to survive them. Killing gorseval is easy with dps, surviving world eater with necro barrier could be funnier than button-mashing. Remove dps-increase traits. Give unique boons instead. Make Shade skills a god-tier in condi management. Rework F5, give us ability to channel our Life Force for permanent barrier party-wide. On top of that, scourge should generate might, fury, quickness, protection, renegeration and vigor. Replace elite skill with non-dmg support skill. Bring back condi removal in PvE.
• If devs could remember what they once said... (necro cant get dps because shroud give too much survivability...) scrap all that support kittens out of this class and make it pure condi dps. Scourge doesn't have shroud anymore so it should be able to deal dps equal to that of other condi dps (or even more, because it feels like necro should be condi-god).

FOR THE KITTEN SAKE, MAKE US GOOD IN AT LEAST ONE THING, MAKE THIS CLASS UNIQUE IN SOME WAY, I CAN SACRIFICE SHROUD SURVIVABILITY, HP POOL AND EPIDEMIC SKILL IN FAVOR OF BEING COMPARABLE TO OTHER CLASSES IN ENDGAME PVE. OR LOWER ALL DPS CHECKS ON RAIDBOSSES, FRACTAL BOSSES, WORLD BOSSES AND STORY BOSSES. INSTEAD REQUIRING 30KDPS FROM MOST OF THE PARTY, MAKE IT 10K. REMOVE FIGHT TIMERS. CHANGE THE GAME SO EVERYONE CAN HAVE FUN, NOT ONLY CHRONO+DRUID+DPS COMBO. AND SPLIT SKILLS BETWEEN PVP AND PVE.

I main necro for more than 5 years now. I dropped the game soon after i realised that my class is unwanted and instakicked from dungeons back in core game. I came back because reaper was promising. Dropped game again because it was nerfed hard in PvE (because of pvp/wvw players complains) useless in team pve content. A class witn no identity, power dps being better as condi and only when alone. Came back again to see that promised support-condi dps scourge only to be hit by nerfs soon after release (because of PvP/wvw players complains). And again and again. And once more. Scourge barely alive? Let's nerf MORE! It still moves? NERF!!! Old forgotten Scraper was reworked, necro dropped from trash tier to kitten tier. Time to leave the game, waiting for another elite class promise. To see how fun it will be in exp3 beta and how hard it will be nerfed soon after in PvE (because of PvP and WvW players complains).

Am I the only one happy about necro's nerf?

Seriously, scourge needed that nerf. And it's still strong and cancer...I did a lot of ranked these 2 days and if necro plays well he can still deal a lot of damage. Now it's just less retarded and a little more skilled. It's not just about rollfacing anymore :p. Sure it's more difficult than before, because of his nerf, and because of buff of some supports classes (scrapper for example)...but necro and especially scourge are not dead.