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Will 3rd Expansion happen at all?

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  • Dante.1508Dante.1508 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 14, 2019

    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 14, 2019

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    I can see people having problems with the Fraenir, since particle density is so unnecessarily high.
    Also, doing the prisoner camp events alone downed me a lot on my Ele.

  • Dante.1508Dante.1508 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    Honestly no idea i stopped doing content pretty much after Living Story 4.

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    Honestly no idea i stopped doing content pretty much after Living Story 4.

    So maybe dont spread miss information if you havent played the latest stories then?

  • Dante.1508Dante.1508 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    Honestly no idea i stopped doing content pretty much after Living Story 4.

    So maybe dont spread miss information if you havent played the latest stories then?

    No misinformation said living story 3 and 4 were hard as nails to complete solo and some of my classes would never even been able too.. Just because i haven't done the latest content doesn't change that fact.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2019

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    Honestly no idea i stopped doing content pretty much after Living Story 4.

    So maybe dont spread miss information if you havent played the latest stories then?

    No misinformation said living story 3 and 4 were hard as nails to complete solo and some of my classes would never even been able too.. Just because i haven't done the latest content doesn't change that fact.

    Aside from Bloodstone Caudecus, I don't remember any boss problem with the LS3 story.
    Some other bosses, like the Golem boss in LS4 Episode, felt quite tedious and boring, but not hard.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:

    @Linken.6345 said:

    @Dante.1508 said:
    I'd love to see Cantha added but the way its been so silent i'm thinking no more expacs.. I hope i'm wrong but this game isn't very transparent or updated often.. And when it is updated it seems less and less lately.

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    What story content in the last 2 releases have been insanely hard?

    Honestly no idea i stopped doing content pretty much after Living Story 4.

    So maybe dont spread miss information if you havent played the latest stories then?

    No misinformation said living story 3 and 4 were hard as nails to complete solo and some of my classes would never even been able too.. Just because i haven't done the latest content doesn't change that fact.

    What fact? You said

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    Season 3 and Season 4 are old by this time and the Icebrood Saga has been a joke so far.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I don't need any expnsion nearest 3-5 years. How I undesrtand thats can only break current new players come, and trigger action to someplayers leave.
    So will hope no any exp3.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:
    I don't need any expnsion nearest 3-5 years. How I undesrtand thats can only break current new players come, and trigger action to someplayers leave.
    So will hope no any exp3.

    Expansions bring new and old players back to a game. There is a reason why with every expansion release there is a increase in player activity/involvement (and obviously revenue). Meanwhile the Living World is in a downwards spiral in both activity and revenue, the question for the developers is how low they want their activity and revenue to drop before they take action and release an expansion to address both. The game won't last 3, let alone 5, years without an expansion.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    Expansions bring new and old players back to a game.

    very big part old will left if it come, this is very simple view.

    There is a reason why with every expansion release there is a increase in player activity/involvement (and obviously revenue).

    and obviously revenue? no, revenue will be fail. Make big product long time and invest money, and have risk that it not will be accepted or get some fail. Fail all 100%, but not 5% fail if make some fail with story line.
    There is something like put all money in single place and sink it oiled paper.

    player activity

    also we will get some players count who will close that content per 1 month, and again never power on gw2 few years .. Don't see any reason attract that players scope, thay a useless.

    The game won't last 3, let alone 5, years without an expansion.

    It can be perfect 20 years without an expansion till some virtual reality life standard will come in out world.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2019

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Why keep a tight lid on something the fourth team is working on if it's not LW5 stuff? Think about it people. They said one team is working on LW5 stuff, which is no real secret. Yet this mysterious forth team is making something that Anet wants to keep a secret but worth TELLING US THAT IT'S A SECRET....

    Creating hope out of nothing is nothing mind-blowing or spectacular.
    That statement might have just been made so people wishing for an expansion get their hopes up too high.
    The content that team creates might be minor questline additions for the seasonal events, a new fractal or even just the annual raid release.
    That statement also might be a straight lie and that team is working on LS5 after all.

    Realistically why would they do that? Think about it. Why would they state they have a fourth team working on something they not ready to reveal yet for GW2 that isn't LW5 related.

    Because they had a team working on something they were not ready to reveal yet that wasn;t LS5 related. My guess, that team worked on capes.

    Also we saw future Living World 5 photos in which the developers are even hinting at new weapons for classes (, Shield for Necro, Greatsword for Revenant, off hand Mace for Guardian)

    We saw art and animations for HoT showing land spears. And then much later we heard that it was never even considered, much less worked on.

    Why tease this along side hinting at a fourth team making something that's secret?

    So people like you can blow this secret out of propotions, without Anet actually promising anything they don't want to fulfill.

    Remember, they never said that the fourth team worked on something big. That is an assumption you are making, with absolutely no basis for it in any info we've seen or heard. My take on it, on th other hand, is that, whatever they are working on, is simply not big enough to be properly hyped. As such, my guess is that it's that team that is going to do all the little stuff, like capes, or color channels for back items, that they will ultimately try to sell to us as "expansion-like features". My expectations are also that it will still come way short of actual expansion features (and probably end up being monetized like kitten).

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • hugo.4705hugo.4705 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2019

    Well those stats really illustrate the point, I'm now curious about the recents one of Grothmar and Bjora maps. But hell, only 29.6% finished s4e6? Ouch.....
    After checking earning, well I bet 6 years big max before the end if nothing is made.
    12.9% lost of episode completion in s3, vs 17.5% in s4. Surely s5 will be worse.

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  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    Old data (from almost 5 months ago) because I can't be bothered to get new ones, but they illustrate the point perfectly:

    91.5% started Heart of Thorns, 66.2% killed Mordremoth
    67.2% started S3E1, 59.7% finished it
    ...
    52.7% started S3E6, 46.8% finished it
    79.9% started Path of Fire, 62% killed Balthazar
    57% started S4E1, 47.1% finished it
    ...
    32.8% started S4E6, 29.6% finished it

    This is perfectly illustrate the point that I say - 91.5% started Heart of Thorns and 79.9% started Path of Fire. You see 20% drop ?
    First - Next drop will be till 40-55%.
    Second, and main - we have a lot of starters, and they dissapear after short time. So there is no any point to do content to them.
    You see drop from 79.9% - 32.8% ? So where the point to exp3 and get after 5 month again THE SAME 30% ?

    Notice the sizable activity bump when Path of Fire was released

    this bump is only "sound blink" - short and non monetized. I am sure that "bump players" ayway don't buy slot for bags, templates, skins, mounts, and etc. They only buy patch, make "bump", and leave. Who care about them ??

    Now, notice how getting fully unlocked build templates on ONE character costs as much as an expansion. If we'd gotten build templates as part of Expansion 3 then it would've been much cheaper for everyone.

    Not, it cheaper only for you.

    that happens at the expense of those paying customers that are now overcharged

    Want buy - do, don't want - not do. Don't see any problem in this. Who is "overcharged "?

    Expansions on the other hand are meant to be paid by everyone.

    how you say this is very small sum, same as all tepmlates on ONE character.

    And what we get if do it? We have chance to fail all.

    We can trigger leave some not big, but active players group, who play each day 6h+, do some challenges, raid, and etc. But not have plan pay fro exp3.
    Now on non prime time make cms party is 20-60 min fro me. After that triggered leave some raid/cms content in non prime time can be dead at all. And this is will trigger second wave of leave palyers like me, who don't see problem to pay, but cam't play in prime time cm content and etc.
    So we can have some "domino effect". So on one hand get "domino" , on other "short bump of one month playes". And keep attention, this bump coast additional money, work, and pressure.

    I don't see any reason spend additional money to get chance additional fail.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:
    This is perfectly illustrate the point that I say - 91.5% started Heart of Thorns and 79.9% started Path of Fire. You see 20% drop ?

    Your point is flawed. More players started Path of Fire (79.9%) than played S3E6 (52.7%) meaning if there was no expansion there, S4E1 totals would be lower than 52.7%, the expansion revitalized the game, pushing S4E1 to 57% and stopping the downward trend even temporarily. That's what expansions do, they invigorate games and soften their fall, or they are excellent enough skyrocket games back towards the sky, as many other games have done.

    You see drop from 79.9% - 32.8% ? So where the point to exp3 and get after 5 month again THE SAME 30% ?

    That drop exists because we don't have a third expansion, if, instead of the Icebrood Saga, we had an expansion now, then those numbers would climb, as they did with Path of Fire. Now which is better, getting an increase and then drop back to 30% after 5 months (as you say), or continue with the Living World til we reach 0%?

    I don't see any reason spend additional money to get chance additional fail.

    So you'd rather see the game die in a year, rather than something that stops the fall and has the chance to lead it again to greatness. Because although you are saying that expansions have the chance of failure, they also have the chance to make something good. The Living World is simple life support without -any- chance of making the game better.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    More players started Path of Fire (79.9%) than played S3E6 (52.7%) meaning if there was no expansion there, S4E1 totals would be lower than 52.7%, the expansion revitalized the game, pushing S4E1 to 57% and stopping the downward trend even temporarily.

    About grow down % each season part - they do right choose - now instance story line is shorter and more adaptive for current mmo gameplay. % was decreced because sigle story in mmo is bored sometimes if you do it SOLO. Also currently you can't complete sroty line by join and do any part, you should do it step by step. If they will fix this the % will be up again.

    That drop exists because we don't have a third expansion

    I can't say that exp3 not will come .. The some side of exp3 currenty exist. It is already - Grot, Bjora, .. wiht new mastery and some new things.

    increase and then drop back to 30% after 5 months (as you say), or continue with the Living World til we reach 0%?

    "bumps players" a leave. So now we will get so idel grow up wiht 30% constanta.

    Because although you are saying that expansions have the chance of failure, they also have the chance to make something good.

    exp3 as big monetized pack not have chance do any good things.

    The Living World is simple life support without -any- chance of making the game better.

    The Living World is a part of exp 3. They have choose wait and make it as ony big exp patch after 2 years, or spit and feed players each 2-3 month.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Hot Boy.7138Hot Boy.7138 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'd quit if they decided no more expansions. I think a lot of players would, so I think they are working on a new expansion. They know we are expecting one.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2019

    @lare.5129 said:
    I can't say that exp3 not will come .. The some side of exp3 currenty exist. It is already - Grot, Bjora, .. wiht new mastery and some new things.

    That's not exp3 currency, that's Season 5 currency. Same with the new mastery. It's highly unlikely to use these in the next expansion

    exp3 as big monetized pack not have chance do any good things.

    So far expansions have been bumping the game's revenue and activity high up. It's the Living World that hasn't done any good things so far for the game. The Living World is to keep some of the current players busy, in a steady decline, but it's expansions that push it all up. Also, many games out there shine with expansions, ESO, FF14 to name a few mmorpgs that were revitalized with their expansions. Yes expansions are risky, but they are the only thing that can bring good things to a game, the Living World so far has done nothing good to increase the popularity, activity or revenue of the game.

    Yes let's compare how monetized an expansion is compared to what we get in this "Free" version of the game, like what I mentioned earlier Build Templates costing more than a complete expansion or 2 mount skins costing more than an expansion. Fully monetized pieces of nothing, while with an expansion you know what you get, substantial amounts of content, new mechanics, new everything. Let's not compare the costs of an expansion with the scraps we get in the Living World.

    What is a big monetized pack is the Living World and all the overpriced expensive "expansion level content" they give us. Content and features we should've had for the price of an expansion, combined with all the other things we get in expansions. But hey I guess many people love free things and let the losers pay for the continued development of the game.

    They have choose wait and make it as ony big exp patch after 2 years, or spit and feed players each 2-3 month.

    That's not what's happening though. What we are getting in the Living World is NOT expansion content spread over multiple months. It's filler.

    You can check what happened with the revenue of the game in early 2015 when they announced Heart of Thorns: it was going UP. You don't even have to release an expansion to make money, just announce that you are making one.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 16, 2019

    @Dante.1508 said:
    [...]

    Plus the fact they seem to make the content so insanely hard these days.

    :lol: You mean the "tough" story missions from the Icebrood Saga that even a 5-year old can do without trouble? Yeah, "insanely hard these days". :sweat_smile:

  • Svarty.8019Svarty.8019 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I just played the prelude Story and it seems like a lot of work went into it. I don't know if that's BECAUSE it's the prelude, but it certainly had a LOT of stuff stuffed into it. I can't imagine they have resources to be making an Expac at the same time!

    (As a WvW player it made me sad to see all that effort go on content that will be superseded after a couple of months, when WvW has the same old content for 7 years, but I suppose it's the reason I don't pay a subscription fee).

    This post contains my opinion.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    That's not exp3 currency, that's Season 5 currency. Same with the new mastery. It's highly unlikely to use these in the next expansion

    so that the difference between Season 5 and exp3 for you? New map ? no, because it have s5 also ..new currency ? again no.
    Requirement to do some story to go inside? ou, ot is so small in S5 that some palyer don't see it at all.

    New elites spec? So as for me I am SURE that IF exp3 will come no any elites will be .. May be we will get some merge of existing two, but one more looks impossible and to much ..
    New mastery? We have new mastery in S5 ..
    there is NO any valuable difference between LS an exp.

    Yes expansions are risky, but they are the only thing that can bring good things to a game, the Living World so far has done nothing good to increase the popularity, activity or revenue of the game.

    :))) how can you say about real revenue if you a not top anet manager? How you calculate it ?? All that you can see is total income, without outcome.
    So if a get total revenue 1M, and spend for exp 1M, in real I get aprox 0. If I get 0.5M, and spend 0.1M, I get 0.4M. We n ot have any real outcome numbers to make investigation it is profitable, or not. Ofc if u a not Anet to manager??

    Yes let's compare how monetized an expansion is compared to what we get in this "Free" version of the game, like what I mentioned earlier Build Templates costing more than a complete expansion or 2 mount skins costing more than an expansion. Fully monetized pieces of nothing, while with an expansion you know what you get, substantial amounts of content, new mechanics, new everything. Let's not compare the costs of an expansion with the scraps we get in the Living World.

    So, you accept my words ??? Because I see - yes. Value of exp can't havesome big vaue. So the attract more easu and cheaper whit other ways ..

    What is a big monetized pack is the Living World and all the overpriced expensive "expansion level content" they give us.

    if you have a job - you can pay, if can't - yo not pay. Someone can't buy chocolate, someone buy new BMW .. This is part of life.

    That's not what's happening though. What we are getting in the Living World is NOT expansion content spread over multiple months. It's filler.

    and people like it.

    You can check what happened with the revenue of the game in early 2015 when they announced Heart of Thorns: it was going UP. You don't even have to release an expansion to make money, just announce that you are making one.

    only top business analytic can know that. Anyway I have mind that exp is very bad and destroy game.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Svarty.8019 said:
    (As a WvW player it made me sad to see all that effort go on content that will be superseded after a couple of months

    you absolutely right, the bump players will eat it per few months and we will get same picture.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:

    @Svarty.8019 said:
    (As a WvW player it made me sad to see all that effort go on content that will be superseded after a couple of months

    you absolutely right, the bump players will eat it per few months and we will get same picture.

    At least we'd get the same picture and be a few months later. Otherwise in those few months the picture might become even worse.

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • shippage.1983shippage.1983 Member ✭✭✭

    I wouldn't mind if they kept releasing Sagas. All I want is more Elite specs!

  • otto.5684otto.5684 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Highly unlikely. Expansions are a risk. They require much investment in development and marketing. And considering the game age and recent progress, seems highly unlikely. From how things been going in 2019, it does not seem like NCSOFT is willing to make this happen. Just keep this one episode every three month. Try to monetize as much as possible. You will continue to lose players and employees, but it is a safe bet to keep monetizing the game for years to come.

  • Gemstore is your third expansion man!

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @shippage.1983 said:
    I wouldn't mind if they kept releasing Sagas. All I want is more Elite specs!

    Honestly same. Elite specs, new weapons, new Meta events and Housing. New WvW maps and features as well. I would be good on that for a few years of gameplay.

  • Mouse.7382Mouse.7382 Member ✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @lare.5129 said:
    So, you accept my words ???

    I'll write it a bit more simple: I'd rather get all the content of an expansion instead of the similarly priced "expansion level content" that we get with the Living World. You want -some- players to pay for overpriced "expansion level content" so free loaders can continue playing the game. That's the free to play model, only this game ain't exactly free. We already see where it leads: to an exodus of players and reduction in both population and revenue, as clearly deduced by the data. If players liked the Living World content then we would see a surge in both players and revenue, but we don't. Facts and actual data suggest that expansions are better for the game and for its players.

    I fully agree. In general, MMOs are a dying breed. The ones (including myself) that still play them, are used to subscription based games, with an expansion every 1-2 years & no ingame store. I'll take a sub based MMO anyday--in fact, there are a few games coming out, going back to that model.

  • Pifil.5193Pifil.5193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    No there won't be a third expansion. They've told us as much.

    I don't think the game is shutting down but given the way things have gone since PoF launched I wouldn't be all that surprised if they don't make it to LS6.

  • SoulGuardian.6203SoulGuardian.6203 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 17, 2019

    Maybe.
    Some people state that there aren't anymore expantions being developed, with such conviction, that you'd think they were part of ANet is administration staff.

    Only they know... and certainly aren't going to reveal it way before hand.

  • XYLO.7031XYLO.7031 Member ✭✭✭

    Thanks for the contribution, Mad Doctor. Expansions are head and shoulders above this living world seasonal thing they're doing.

    Eponymously known as 'Tanya' despite many alts
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  • Acheron.4731Acheron.4731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I honestly can't fathom why they have chosen to go this route. I want something to look forward to and living story is not it.
    Wish I could get motivated to play again but there is just nothing interesting right now.

    Don't Worry, My Dutch is OK

  • Sovari.7246Sovari.7246 Member ✭✭✭

    I think that PoF was hurt by IGN or Gamespot not reviewing it. So the massive amounts of casual gamers were not even aware of PoF. I'm sure if the expansion got more buzz with new influx of players I think we could have had a 3rd one already.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @shippage.1983 said:
    I wouldn't mind if they kept releasing Sagas. All I want is more Elite specs!

    All DO NOT want more Elite specs. Some people at all want change current 2 elite to one merged. OR just make one "tree".
    Anyway I am not see any tie between elite spec and exp. If you want "more Elite specs" you should as "more Elite specs" but not exp. This is not same.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • battledrone.8315battledrone.8315 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sovari.7246 said:
    I think that PoF was hurt by IGN or Gamespot not reviewing it. So the massive amounts of casual gamers were not even aware of PoF. I'm sure if the expansion got more buzz with new influx of players I think we could have had a 3rd one already.

    it is end game content, so new players cant even play it. and most casuals wont pay for hardcore content.
    even the best ads cant compete with word of mouth

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @battledrone.8315 said:

    @Sovari.7246 said:
    I think that PoF was hurt by IGN or Gamespot not reviewing it. So the massive amounts of casual gamers were not even aware of PoF. I'm sure if the expansion got more buzz with new influx of players I think we could have had a 3rd one already.

    it is end game content, so new players cant even play it. and most casuals wont pay for hardcore content.
    even the best ads cant compete with word of mouth

    You are saying the core game isn't good enough to keep new player attention until they get to level 80? Because that's the only requirement to access Path of Fire and it's not hardcore content at all

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    I'll write it a bit more simple: I'd rather get all the content of an expansion instead of the similarly priced "expansion level content" that we get with the Living World.

    I am sure they calculate how to make it more profitable, also they calculate players who make environment world more active and who have chance do not accept way to additional pay, and who have good job and not see problem to buy templates to each 9 slots.

    You want -some- players to pay for overpriced "expansion level content" so free loaders can continue playing the game.

    This is not my "want". This is vision of businesses managers. As I think, this is for some people not overpriced, and how I see "free loaders" ir a part of game-play, like npc.
    What the reason pay but don't have in party for group content and stand in Lion Arch ??
    I am sure that at less half in my dayli non-prime time cms group how you say "free loaders", but if they absent this content is dead.
    The game nowadays need that "free loaders" more that any current or new elite spec, any expansion, or any another current or future feature.

    Facts and actual data suggest that expansions are better for the game and for its players.

    no facts. We a not Anet busssnes managers to say about facts.
    What I see that new people come, I see that useless "one month bump payers" leave. As for me better have 1 continuous player, than 12+ "bumps". I am can't be sure, but think managers think same.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:
    no facts. We a not Anet busssnes managers to say about facts.

    I posted the facts in charts which you ignored. But let's go the other around, where is your proof that expansions hurt the game?

  • @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @lare.5129 said:
    I can't say that exp3 not will come .. The some side of exp3 currenty exist. It is already - Grot, Bjora, .. wiht new mastery and some new things.

    That's not exp3 currency, that's Season 5 currency. Same with the new mastery. It's highly unlikely to use these in the next expansion

    exp3 as big monetized pack not have chance do any good things.

    So far expansions have been bumping the game's revenue and activity high up. It's the Living World that hasn't done any good things so far for the game. The Living World is to keep some of the current players busy, in a steady decline, but it's expansions that push it all up. Also, many games out there shine with expansions, ESO, FF14 to name a few mmorpgs that were revitalized with their expansions. Yes expansions are risky, but they are the only thing that can bring good things to a game, the Living World so far has done nothing good to increase the popularity, activity or revenue of the game.

    Yes let's compare how monetized an expansion is compared to what we get in this "Free" version of the game, like what I mentioned earlier Build Templates costing more than a complete expansion or 2 mount skins costing more than an expansion. Fully monetized pieces of nothing, while with an expansion you know what you get, substantial amounts of content, new mechanics, new everything. Let's not compare the costs of an expansion with the scraps we get in the Living World.

    What is a big monetized pack is the Living World and all the overpriced expensive "expansion level content" they give us. Content and features we should've had for the price of an expansion, combined with all the other things we get in expansions. But hey I guess many people love free things and let the losers pay for the continued development of the game.

    They have choose wait and make it as ony big exp patch after 2 years, or spit and feed players each 2-3 month.

    That's not what's happening though. What we are getting in the Living World is NOT expansion content spread over multiple months. It's filler.

    You can check what happened with the revenue of the game in early 2015 when they announced Heart of Thorns: it was going UP. You don't even have to release an expansion to make money, just announce that you are making one.

    The gw2 hype is dead. I dont think an expansion will change that. Unless it is a real expansion with new systems, races, dungeons and raids.

    Think people just realise that anet cannot keep this product going.

  • battledrone.8315battledrone.8315 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @battledrone.8315 said:

    @Sovari.7246 said:
    I think that PoF was hurt by IGN or Gamespot not reviewing it. So the massive amounts of casual gamers were not even aware of PoF. I'm sure if the expansion got more buzz with new influx of players I think we could have had a 3rd one already.

    it is end game content, so new players cant even play it. and most casuals wont pay for hardcore content.
    even the best ads cant compete with word of mouth

    You are saying the core game isn't good enough to keep new player attention until they get to level 80? Because that's the only requirement to access Path of Fire and it's not hardcore content at all

    the core game is free, so they wont make much money on that . and the last maps in core are very disappointing, compared to the rest (IMO)
    the people, who like core are generally not fans of the expansions, and vise versa
    that is why most expansions give the casuals something too..new race or class

  • Astralporing.1957Astralporing.1957 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    I'll write it a bit more simple: I'd rather get all the content of an expansion instead of the similarly priced "expansion level content" that we get with the Living World.

    I am sure they calculate how to make it more profitable, also they calculate players who make environment world more active and who have chance do not accept way to additional pay, and who have good job and not see problem to buy templates to each 9 slots.

    Oh, i am sure of it as well. Problem is, after all that we've still arrived at the current situation, which is really bad. That doesn't fill me with a lot of confidence about their decision making.

    You want -some- players to pay for overpriced "expansion level content" so free loaders can continue playing the game.

    This is not my "want". This is vision of businesses managers.

    See above. This being their business decision doesn't automatically make it a good decision. Or the game wouldn't be in the current state.

    What the reason pay but don't have in party for group content and stand in Lion Arch ??
    I am sure that at less half in my dayli non-prime time cms group how you say "free loaders", but if they absent this content is dead.
    The game nowadays need that "free loaders" more that any current or new elite spec, any expansion, or any another current or future feature.

    Those "free-loaders" are leaving as well, if you haven't noticed. The current model doesn't seem to be enough to keep them in game.

    Facts and actual data suggest that expansions are better for the game and for its players.

    no facts. We a not Anet busssnes managers to say about facts.

    You might have missed the big January layoffs. Or maybe you consider them a sign that Anet's doing perfectly wel on the business side of things.

    What I see that new people come, I see that useless "one month bump payers" leave. As for me better have 1 continuous player, than 12+ "bumps". I am can't be sure, but think managers think same.

    And i see those "continuous players" of yours leaving as well. Funny how that works. In the end, you're not choosing between "12+ bumps" and "1 continuous player". You are choosing between " 12+ bumps and 1 continuous player, that will eventually leave" and "no bumps and 1 continuous player that will leave even sooner".

    The whole point of a social game is to play with the people you want to play with, not be forced to play with the people you don't.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @battledrone.8315 said:
    the core game is free, so they wont make much money on that . and the last maps in core are very disappointing, compared to the rest (IMO)
    the people, who like core are generally not fans of the expansions, and vise versa
    that is why most expansions give the casuals something too..new race or class

    The core game might be free but the gem store isn't, that's like saying free to play games make no money. Expansions are things to chase further down the line, but if the game is suffering from retention issues it's not because expansions are hard, it's because the core game wasn't good enough to keep the player attention until they got to the expansion in the first place. The majority of players that quit the game were because of the core game and Arenanet has been trying to play catch up and stop the exodus since November 2012 (one of the reasons they gave for the introduction of Ascended gear). I'm not sure those who like the core are enough to sustain the game alone.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:
    I posted the facts in charts which you ignored.

    We not have facts. We not Anet businesses analytic center. All that you can see is revenue without additional pays, and real product coast.

    But let's go the other around, where is your proof that expansions hurt the game?

    so you suggest do some big work 1-2 years, get some, how your % say decreaced player count who buy it, play one mumped monht and leave? What a point to do taht ??
    Do you put all you money and property to risk ? For that? Get same picture after few month ??
    pof get -20% than hot. Mounts not help? Cuurenlty now is perfect time, we get new players, no bumped useless palyers, some changes, it is very good.

    currently now is a lot of free-to-play games so some part of continues players can left

    and they do that. And some of them back. Some not. Don't see any problem.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DutchRiders.2871 said:
    Think people just realise that anet cannot keep this product going.

    Keep that? I havenew LS5, templates and still have fractals, wvw and nice spvp.
    People not instersted in new systems, races. Aslo mostly of them not intersted in new dungeons and raids.
    I still see so small people count who create mostly all legendary weapons and have 40k achiv. So thiere is no any point to do new content if current still not complete.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 17, 2019

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    You might have missed the big January layoffs. Or maybe you consider them a sign that Anet's doing perfectly wel on the business side of things.

    I was see that and sure that this is very good business idea and accept it. Hold the Door !
    Who want will find, who don't need - don't get. This is current slogan.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:

    @Astralporing.1957 said:
    You might have missed the big January layoffs. Or maybe you consider them a sign that Anet's doing perfectly wel on the business side of things.

    I was see that and sure that this is very good business idea and accept it. Hold the Door !
    Who want will find, who don't need - don't get. This is current slogan.

    Didn't the layoff reduce the workforce to about what it was before? Weren't most of those laid off working on other projects outside of GW2?

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:
    We not have facts.

    The charts are actually facts you don't have to be a business analyst to interpret them. They show both revenue and activity. That you can't see them it's your own fault and can't do much to help there.
    As for the rest of your comments about players not wanting content because there is lots of it in the game, you should be aware that players quit the game -because- there is no content. At least no content that they find enjoyable.
    I suggest to have both an expansion and the living world, expansions to bring old players back and new players in, living world to keep them busy until the next expansion. It's as simple as that and how it worked in between the two expansions we got and kept the game going. Now we are on a downwards spiral with no end in sight (until we reach the actual bottom)

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    Didn't the layoff reduce the workforce to about what it was before? Weren't most of those laid off working on other projects outside of GW2?

    Arenanet still (after the layoffs) has more employees than they had during the release of the game in 2012 and during most of Heart of Thorns development.