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Player-created Cantha expansion ideas


Nash.3974

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So I randomly found this page on wiki.. Can anyone explain where this comes from? Not to mention that I love what it says (while I was hoping that Ritualist becomes a class on its own)edit: this is the final version of the draft of @Lonami.2987 . Well done ! :)https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/30399/guild-wars-2-the-celestial-tournament-canthan-expansion-idea

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@"Nash.3974" said:So I randomly found this page on wiki.. Can anyone explain where this comes from? Not to mention that I love what it says (while I was hoping that Ritualist becomes a class on its own)https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/User:Lon-ami/Cantha

That's a user page, not part of the documentation of the game. Everything on it is the opinion/idea/suggestion of the user, not vetted by anyone else.Lonami is pretty well known as someone who proposes long & involved suggestions for content that appeals to a particular sort of player. I believe they have several other suggestions linked from their main personal page.

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really neat fan made stuffbut on a serious note:I hope cantha isn't the next part - i hope it's Eotn bc cantha will be their biggest seller and if they push that out first - then noone will care about Eotn to kill Jormag, personally I want to kill that ice dragon and explore more norn related things hopefully open the branch into spirit animals more like badger and owl where there still might be shrines - and maybe just maybe spirit animals for norn will actually mean something and not just like "pick your favorite color.. okay well that doesnt matter bc its not lore based" type crap. cantha is great and all but pushing it out too soon could be idk... hopefully tengu as a playable race will come with it. and it also means braham's conquest will be put on the far back burner and basically forgotten about and then players will be left with... oh wait what? ohhh yea i remember sorta... hopefully theyll avoid that.

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@"Nash.3974" said:So I randomly found this page on wiki.. Can anyone explain where this comes from? Not to mention that I love what it says (while I was hoping that Ritualist becomes a class on its own)https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/User:Lon-ami/Cantha

Too good to be true but look at the user page, looks like this is theorycrafting (although pretty good theorycrafting).

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@Sombra.3246 said:Wow, I have to give Lon-ami props. Loved his idea's and his well thought suggestion for the upcoming GW2 expansion. You can see he put a lot of detail and attention and thought writing and setting up that page. I wish the developers will take notice and use some of his idea's :)

They've seen Lon-ami's ideas. (Lon-ami isn't shy about sharing ;) )

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I really quite liked that except again like so many others this person cant get his/her character armor weight class right...

Dervish is a MEDIUM armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. NOT a light class. So Engie, Ranger or Thief. The best choice for Dervish is Ranger and use the Pets as avatars (better than what was used for Soulbeast (Soulbeast could almost have been called Dervish but would have needed some better more Dervish like utility skills).).

Ritualist is a LIGHT armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. Not a heavy class. So Necro, Ele or Mesmer. Probably best set as a Ele. Maybe even better might be a Necro

I really wish people would go back to Guild Wars 1 and look at a profession before mismatching the armor weights.

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@Ubi.4136 said:

@SnowHawk.3615 said:really neat fan made stuffbut on a serious note:I hope cantha isn't the next part - i hope it's Eotn bc cantha will be their biggest seller and if they push that out first - then noone will care about Eotn to kill Jormag,

I already don't care about killing Jormag. Braham on the other hand...

Kill Jormag by firing Braham out of a cannon at him? His incredibly thick skull should make an effective cannon ball.

@"Firebird Gomer.9563" said:I really quite liked that except again like so many others this person cant get his/her character armor weight class right...

Dervish is a MEDIUM armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. NOT a light class. So Engie, Ranger or Thief. The best choice for Dervish is Ranger and use the Pets as avatars (better than what was used for Soulbeast (Soulbeast could almost have been called Dervish but would have needed some better more Dervish like utility skills).).

Ritualist is a LIGHT armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. Not a heavy class. So Necro, Ele or Mesmer. Probably best set as a Ele. Maybe even better might be a Necro

I really wish people would go back to Guild Wars 1 and look at a profession before mismatching the armor weights.

Guardian blatantly uses many of the skill names that were on Monk in GW1, both on actual utility skills and on the trait lines... Magic behaves differently than how it did in GW1, and there is no reason to believe that any classes would actually return as elite specs, but even if they did there is absolutely zero reason for them to share the same armor weights that they did in the first games. also from the Ritualist page: "Before magic, the Ritualists focused on channeling spirits from the Mists. They relied upon the strength and wisdom granted to them by their powerful ancestors whom maintained a connection to their descendants." Sound familiar? That's right, thematically the Ritualist is most closely related to the Revenant... not to mention the fact that with the Rev's Warband spirits some of them function VERY similarly to old Ritualist spirits... more so than any similarities they share with Ranger spirits or anything else for that matter. Meanwhile, the Mirage mechanics have some of their names stolen directly from Dervish. Chances are we will never get a Paragon, or Ritualist, or Dervish elite... mostly because a lot of their mechanics, or at least their skill names, have been folded in to other classes. (Guardian has a bunch of Paragon skills also.)

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@Ubi.4136 said:

@SnowHawk.3615 said:really neat fan made stuffbut on a serious note:I hope cantha isn't the next part - i hope it's Eotn bc cantha will be their biggest seller and if they push that out first - then noone will care about Eotn to kill Jormag,

I already don't care about killing Jormag. Braham on the other hand...

Seriously. Can we just convince him to try to solo joko so he can be turned and then we can roflstomp him already? I'm sure they were hoping for a redemption type story with him, but he's insufferable and needs to die. Horribly. Preferably by our hands.

I can't believe I'm about to say this but....

I prefer.... deep breath I prefer...

...

Trahearne

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@"Nash.3974" said:So I randomly found this page on wiki.. Can anyone explain where this comes from? Not to mention that I love what it says (while I was hoping that Ritualist becomes a class on its own)https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/User:Lon-ami/Cantha

How did you find that? No one was supposed to see it until it was finished :I.

If an user hadn't whispered me about how cool the idea was, I wouldn't have noticed this thread lol. Oh well, we're here anyway, so if you have any feedback on what you see so far, go for it. My current plan for the story is that various Canthan envoys arrive across Tyria, with an invitation. This is the pitch for said invitation:


To all heroes of Tyria,

The glorious Dragon Empire of Cantha will soon be turning 2,000 years old. To celebrate this occasion, Emperor Kaineng the Eternal will be hosting the legendary Tournament of Legends. Every brave guild is invited to participate, no matter their race, arts, or nation of origin.

The contestants will be welcomed as honored guests in the Imperial Palace itself, where they will be granted shelter, food, and training grounds, all for free, as long as the tournament rages on. During the trials, they will journey across the empire, facing multiple challenges, testing their mettle, strength, and wisdom. Clashes against other guilds will be inevitable, and in the end, only one will emerge victorious.

The winners will claim the final prize, the legendary Bell of Harvest, an ancient artifact gifted to the people of Cantha by the Six Gods themselves. The champions who prove themselves worthy of the relic will be able to use its powers to defy death, and bring back their lost loved ones.

The Emperor wishes for this celebration to mark the beginning of a new era, reopening trade between Cantha and the rest of world once again. Those willing to participate in the tournament will be ferried to Cantha by sea, as soon as they are ready and willing.

We will be waiting for you.


So the expansion has no "great evil" kind of plot. It's a huge tournament, with multiple guilds from all across the world, including villains as well. Lot of known faces are to be expected. Of course, something has to go wrong eventually. That's why the invitation sounds kind of shady. Might be the emperor being evil and wanting to suck your soul out, naga invading, tengu wanting revenge, demon portals, or whatever. We might even get to fight against our own friends in the tournament (Maybe we can't convince Braham to join our guild). There's a lot of room for some down to Earth exciting stories here, and barely any MMO out there has tried doing a story without a big evil villain at the middle of it, so it would be very innovative too.

Some extra information:

  • The focus of the expansion is player-driven content, with lot of minigames and activities. It's pretty much the "party expansion", and it's all open world, like Queen's Gauntlet (queue problems will be fixed by spectators interacting with the games, and getting cool stuff for it as well).
  • Assassination is open world PvP (still don't know if using unique skills representing various assassin roles, or just the profession skills).
  • The Imperial Palace is thrice as big now, eating the northern part of Kaineng City. The zone you see in the map is covered by the palace in its entirety. It has multiple tournament installations, kinda like a big olympic stadium.
  • Something that surprised me when planning the expansion, is that I can cover most of the original landscape with PoF-sized zones. I expected needing to leave a lot of places out, but the 4 big zones, which have the size of the Desolation (I compared GW1's Cantha map to a merged map of GW1 and GW2's Elona map to get sizes right) cover everything pretty well.
  • Playable tengu are sold separately, and tentatively, released before the expansion. The idea is that the expansion pack is 30€, and the race pack is 20€. Buying them both gives you a normal priced game, 50€, but you don't need to buy both. Buying both deluxes could give you a 10€ discount or something like that. I hate the current lootbox environment, and I want ArenaNet to explore new product models. They can get people to pay more with the right products, and then depend less on gem store shenanigans.
  • One of the key points of the expansion, is that masteries are group-friendly. This means that you don't need to level them yourself, you can party with someone else, and he can carry you. So, you can focus on music, and your friend on drilling, and then you can adventure together and support each other. You don't need to grind the masteries to play everything, you can team with someone else who has them and work together. I think the individual factor of masteries was a big mistake, that made them really annoying during HoT, and this would fix that altogether.
  • Celestial Blessings have adventures tied to them, where you must gather celestial energy. You need someone with the mastery to ring the bell and spawn the energy. The celestial blessings against hazards are bubble-like, so you can stay near someone who has the blessing, you aren't forced to grind for it yourself. The other 4 masteries are tied to other activities: Fishing, drilling, assassination, and music. These are all available for every players back in Tyria, but the masteries are for those who own the expansion only.
  • I hate Southsun Cove's current location, for lore reasons (it ruined the original novel maps), so I always move it a bit south, in case you noticed there was something amiss with the tengu map.

@"SnowHawk.3615" said:really neat fan made stuffbut on a serious note:I hope cantha isn't the next part - i hope it's Eotn bc cantha will be their biggest seller and if they push that out first - then noone will care about Eotn to kill Jormag, personally I want to kill that ice dragon and explore more norn related things hopefully open the branch into spirit animals more like badger and owl where there still might be shrines - and maybe just maybe spirit animals for norn will actually mean something and not just like "pick your favorite color.. okay well that doesnt matter bc its not lore based" type crap. cantha is great and all but pushing it out too soon could be idk... hopefully tengu as a playable race will come with it. and it also means braham's conquest will be put on the far back burner and basically forgotten about and then players will be left with... oh wait what? ohhh yea i remember sorta... hopefully theyll avoid that.

I've thought for a long time that Cantha wasn't the right idea, but when I started writing this, I realized that it could be a very good decision to go to Cantha next. Tengu should be the first playable race, and introducing them at the same time would make the bond stronger. And GW2 really needs a new playable race by the next expansion, badly. The tournament excuse is great for the new weapons, since we can meet all kind of weird exotic warriors from across the world there. And we need new weapon types desperately, too.

Anyway, my bet for the 3rd expansion was Charr Homelands, with the Blood Legion imperator, Bangar Ruinbringer, being the villain, wanting to be the Khan-Ur and rule all High Legions, with the help of a now subdued Flame Legion. He's against the treaty of peace with humans too, and would give us a mortal villain. Only downside is that it's a lot of new places, and similar enemy themes to the Forged.

Another problem I have with non-Cantha, is that we don't really have anything else that is established enough. Wherever we go, it's pretty much new stuff, since the North was destroyed and has nothing to do with EotN anymore. This is a big problem GW2 has, it's completely barren outside the current events. We need time to establish more villains and more plots, and then have them ready to flow for new expansions. See how Balthazar was introduced, it was very rushed and had no proper buildup. If we go to a new location (and the North is pretty much new) we will have another HoT, where the cameos and references weren't enough to make it feels like it was part of GW2's world and story so far.

You say burning Cantha now is too soon, but I also feel like we need to get more players NOW, before going with the new stuff. We need to get strong, before exploring new locations, that wouldn't be very attractive anyway. PoF should have been enough for this, but it was a very weak expansion, with barely any replayability, and it hasn't made people stay and be excited for what's next. That's why my Cantha idea focuses so much on player-driven content, it's fun and very replayable, and gives people something to do until they get caught by the story and decide to stay.

@"Fenom.9457" said:How does this guy make such good edits

I love theorycrafting game design. It's my "fan art". Been doing it for many years, and I waste time on it when I have nothing better to do (which is too often lol).

If you're curious, I made another expansion idea before, back in 2013:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/User:Lon-ami/First_expansion_theorycrafting:_Jormag,_Tengu_and_Far_Shiverpeaks

Note that this was month's before Scarlet's death, long before Mordremoth and HoT, and I was much more conservative with not stepping out of line.

@Sombra.3246 said:Wow, I have to give Lon-ami props. Loved his idea's and his well thought suggestion for the upcoming GW2 expansion. You can see he put a lot of detail and attention and thought writing and setting up that page. I wish the developers will take notice and use some of his idea's :)

They're free to, and I'm sure they can spin them to something better anyway. Them, or other players. It's sad we don't have a community of people doing content ideas, I'm pretty much the only one lol :(.

@"Firebird Gomer.9563" said:I really quite liked that except again like so many others this person cant get his/her character armor weight class right...

Dervish is a MEDIUM armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. NOT a light class. So Engie, Ranger or Thief. The best choice for Dervish is Ranger and use the Pets as avatars (better than what was used for Soulbeast (Soulbeast could almost have been called Dervish but would have needed some better more Dervish like utility skills).).

Ritualist is a LIGHT armor weight class in Guild Wars 1. Not a heavy class. So Necro, Ele or Mesmer. Probably best set as a Ele. Maybe even better might be a Necro

I really wish people would go back to Guild Wars 1 and look at a profession before mismatching the armor weights.

I would have preferred if those two had been new professions, but their themes and roles are already taken by others. Dervishes use light armor in GW2, and medium armor we have here doesn't fit them at all. Ritualists were partially absorbed by guardians, and then revenants took what remained, including the blindfold.

If you're picky, we could try something else: Make elite specializations enable new armor weights. Or just remove armor weights altogether, outfits made them pointless anyway. I don't think we'll ever get new professions, elite specializations are way too good of a solution, and each expansions needs 9 of them, so we can't spare themes on new professions.

In retrospective, I wish we had gotten secondary professions (new sub-professions usable by multiple professions) instead of elite specializations, but too late for that. In that scenario, I could have seen a final number of 12 professions, which would have been awesome, buuut, no way it's happening now. Core themes like time and druidism were already spent (poorly, they could have been stretched more) on ranger-druid and mesmer-chronomancer. Those themes could have feed whole professions on their own.

So yeah, elite specializations are here to stay, and we aren't getting new professions. I still hope for a huge profession redesign some day, though. You can find links to some of those ideas here: Elementalist - Mesmer - Necromancer - Engineer - Ranger - Thief - Guardian - Revenant - Warrior (this doesn't have many chances of happening either, but I believe the game really needs something like it)

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@Lonami.2987Hey I really admire your drafts on the next expansion and I basically agree with everything you‘ve said but one thing. I disagree that we do not need new professionsImo we desperately need new professions and I don’t think we should get rid of elite specs but just add new classes. And ritualist would still have very unique and own mechanics and a viable role in the game. While they have ashes and weapon spells which could be newly implemented to the game also their ability to summon spirits in a unique way isn’t really replaced by Rev’s new elite spec/Ranger’s spirits or Mesmer’s illusions.

@Deathok.2914 said:I agree, the ritualist was definetely the most unique class in this game and by far my most favorite one.I feel like there is plenty of room to bring the ritualist back as an own profession.Maybe when we go to Cantha at some point we could get the ritualist as an own class and maybe assassin as thief’s elite spec with sword off hand or so.However the ritualist would perfectly fit in this game.A perfect mix between support and dps.Summoning spirits are mostly the utility skills and maybe some staff skills, as well as the signet of spirits as elite which summons 3 spirits.F1 skills are for example teleporting your spirits to you or consume ur spirits to heal nearby allies or damage nearby foes.Staff as offensive weapon with channeled strike, essence strike etc.Spirit weapons would easily work as a buff, like more damage, siphoning life, aoe damage or whatever just like they were in Gw1 and maybe even a spirit weapon skill which works like endure pain which allows u to take 0 dmg for 2-3 secs.There is so much room for the ritualist, so many weapon choices…Obviously the usual magician weapons like scepter focus staff etc.But also weapons like torches and swords fit the ritualist perfectly.Furthermore they should also get corruptions since they also had sacrifices in Gw1.It fits perfectly in Gw2 in many ways and it really needs to be an own profession.There is no class like the ritualist in Gw2.

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@Lonami.2987 said:

@"Nash.3974" said:So I randomly found this page on wiki.. Can anyone explain where this comes from? Not to mention that I love what it says (while I was hoping that Ritualist becomes a class on its own)

How did you find that? No one was supposed to see it until it was finished :I.

If an user hadn't whispered me about how cool the idea was, I wouldn't have noticed this thread lol.

A simple search for "cantha" and filter "everything" shows it as one of the results.

Nothing stays hidden with the wiki search engine.

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