So today in my 100frac

First, let me tell you about my main. I have played pretty much since launch with around 3k hours. It's a full zero medi virtue base guard. (I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with. ( not the best player ever, but my skill level is at its peak on this toon). I rarely die or even go down while putting out bomb spike dps. Wielding GS Sw/T and Sc/f ( when I need a little more sustain) . All zerk armor, weapons, rings amulet everything. Running zeal, radiance and virtues.

Now for my experience. Today I joined a pug lfg that said (something like) t4s exp.

I'm pretty good at t4s, I don't do them everyday but most days. I don't die and I know the mechanics.

As soon as I joined and loaded into the mistloc observatory another player (I didn't even get the chance to see which profession he was playing, that's how soon this happened) said "core guard is not a dps build" and left the party.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

After the player left. I asked the other party members if they minded me playing my build. I gave them a quick 101 of my build and all one member said was (honestly idgaf let's just go) .

Let me tell you.....i carried that entire freaking run!

Booyah! Oh and I've very recently started playing PvP consistently and also my build has been killing it there too!

Well... being picky on build in the chill run is poo poo.

I recently got hooked on power chorono build and planning to do 100 tonight. Hopefully I don't run into those " Y u no support" kinda guy.

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

I would argue that this:

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build.

is what no adaptability looks like.

I can tell you I'm in a similar situation, even worse I suspect. I love playing my Power Daredevil in fractals, and I'm pretty good at it, but I get insta-kicked quite regularly, or players leave, or don't join in the first place. It's the same with necro players. Just two days ago I joined a group that only needed a chrono to fill up, for 99cm and T4s. When a dps joined, the healer left. The dps switched to chrono right away though. I said to the group that she probably left because she thought we have no chrono. The guardian added that it might also be because there's a thief in the group. We set up a new LFG to get a healer, and the same healer joined...

We asked, and yeah, she thought we would run without chrono, and she was also "sceptical about the thief". We then had a very smooth run, simple as that.

I'll be honest, if I see a thief or necro, or even two necros, in a T4 LFG, I am sceptical too. They usually suck, but you can say the same about most weavers. I think it's in the hand of players to prove that their non-meta classes can perform well. They need to get a chance to do so from the warriors, chronos and druids. My deal would be "if I suck, go ahead and kick me, I deserve it." You take risks pugging anyway. There's a good chance the weaver will do mediocre damage, that the healer doesn't heal at all, or the chrono doesn't pull and doesn't give the boons you expected. Sometimes you are lucky with a random pug, and sometimes you require titles and kill proofs and have a bad time.

Anyway, I also suggest adapting to the current situation. I updated my warrior's gear yesterday and can fill the banner dude role now. My dps sucks but I was able to do 99cm. With more practice, my dps will be better than my thief's, and I can say good bye to insta-kicks and people leaving because of me playing thief. I also practice my holosmith. You'll be surprised how much better DH and Firebrand are if you give them a try, and more dps and usefulness is always fun.

To tell you the truth, I get this playing Spellbreaker. Even though I bring what is expected from a 'banner slave', I'm not a condition dps, which is what they actually reference when using 'bs' in the LFG, they just don't realise that.
Although the newest term I've seen crop up is 'Banner babe' which I love, cuz my bannerbabe is a norn female warrior.I don’t end up carrying the run, but I at least prove myself to naysayers. I don’t like carrying people, I shouldn’t have to, Fractals are for teams of 5 players. Each person plays their part, or should.As long as you get the opportunity to prove your worth, any build is fine as long as it works for the role you are filling in the group and isn't a selfish build.

As long as you output is decent and you follow mechanics it's fine. 1 healer for 100 normal makes a massive difference though. I had a semi meta group today fail bombs, and orbs even after it was nicely explained. After 4 wipes funnily the ones who kept wiping the group left, then 3 new people came, reaper, scourge, power warrior, druid healer and we one shot it. T4 is always sink or swim, you either get a one shot group or a 5+/disband shot group. Nothing in between. But overall the quality is good, T4 is a lot easier to pug than T3, that's for sure.

Some people just learn how to play one way and do not want to deviate from the "plan" because it may take some effort to deal with things differently. Even if there's a chance that the run will be easier or faster if done differently/ with a good player on non meta build, they would rather stick to what they know instead of trying something different. If you like changing things up and/or are good with the process you may find this ridiculous but some people just want to auto pilot or play it safe.

@"Faaris.8013" said:The guardian added that it might also be because there's a thief in the group. We set up a new LFG to get a healer, and the same healer joined...

We asked, and yeah, she thought we would run without chrono, and she was also "sceptical about the thief". We then had a very smooth run, simple as that.

I'll be honest, if I see a thief or necro, or even two necros, in a T4 LFG, I am sceptical too. They usually suck, but you can say the same about most weavers. I think it's in the hand of players to prove that their non-meta classes can perform well. They need to get a chance to do so from the warriors, chronos and druids. My deal would be "if I suck, go ahead and kick me, I deserve it." You take risks pugging anyway. There's a good chance the weaver will do mediocre damage, that the healer doesn't heal at all, or the chrono doesn't pull and doesn't give the boons you expected. Sometimes you are lucky with a random pug, and sometimes you require titles and kill proofs and have a bad time.

Speaking from experience: I rather take any half-decent power Daredevil than basically any condi dps that is not Berserker or Mirage. Condi ramp up time is too long for most fractal encounters making DoT effects impractical with bosses phasing so quickly. Thief doesn't have the easiest time but compared to the other power DPS specs (I did not have the pleasure to play with a Spellbreaker yet) It does the job just fine for virtually any fractal while also having an easier "rotation" than the others. shrug

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:(I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

people who look up what is the most efficeint way to clear X content through the web is not being adapted or optimizing? While meta changes from time to time that means they need to adjust to the current new meta. Hence adapting to the changes. While you say this which is the opposite

This sounds familiar... One person who refuses to adjust their build to be more efficient and instead prefers to bring up the times when they partied with players who were way worse than them to justify their own stubborness. Good players carry people, good players on good builds carry people even harder.

@Henry.5713 said:This sounds familiar... One person who refuses to adjust their build to be more efficient and instead prefers to bring up the times when they partied with players who were way worse than them to justify their own stubborness. Good players carry people, good players on good builds carry people even harder.

And teamed up good players on good builds don't need to be carried but instead are having fun together. ;)

@thrag.9740 said:

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build.

Allow me to add: I do have all other professions (and specs) lol 80 and geared. I try each after a major update. I just don't care for their themes and mechanics. I do minor adjustments to my setup here and their to fit the game mode or situation. What I mean by ~"I don't change my build ever" is I always run full zero and always prioritize dps over bunker/tank etc.

@Ryze.2891 said:

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:(I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:(I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

I have no issues with others wanting to optimize. I know some players just rush their t4s for a "daily task". I'm only saying that others shouldn't be banished or unplayable just because it's not the META ( as stated by other people). Just because something isn't meta, doesn't mean it's not good enough.

I think this "leaver" did a reasonable decision: Avoiding that there are people with different expectations together in a group that has to play as a team for a distinct time. It could have been worse for example flaming or blaming while playing and wiping during the run.It seems like even this behaviour is seen as toxic although he did nothing wrong and instead made it right. You should have been happy that his decision made up a "good" (in your eyes) experience for you and most certainly for him as well because he didn't have to carry the other 3 players with you.

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:Let me tell you.....i carried that entire freaking run!

Why am I always sceptical when someone says this in these contexts? I wished every time this is said on the forums, a member of that party would reply and tell his side of the story. If you had played Firebrand support, I might believe that you were in a position to carry a team.

Unfortunately many people in fractals expect Class X to play build XYZ. A ranger is not druid or no ranger at all in group and you'll find many people that quit upon joining, I find it rather silly as even without a druid, fractals are still easily doable. On another occasion my friend was playing support necro, many people kept quitting because it was Mai Trin and without druid they considered it suicide, we kept searching for pugs until someone stuck around and we cleared the level without issues.

This game has one of the best team systems, you can finish almost any content with any kind of class combination and yet people don't seem to realize it yet.

If your build works in spvp it's not good in pve group play, especially fracs.The leaving player did the right thing to be honest. Leaving to protect his sanity. Medi core guard is a super selfish build which sacrifices damage for self buffs and sustain. Thats great for spvp but in pve buffs are usually applied much easier and with less dmg loss by teammates because the meta builds buff the whole party.

"I carried the run". I'm pretty sure a dps druid could have outdamaged you with that special snowflake build. What is bomb spike dps in your opinion?You are even saying that you switch to sc/t for sustain while its the best dps set besides gs.You can complete T4 with every possivle build and pretty sure also naked if there isn't an agony barrier. But that doesn't mean everyone enjoys doing them with bad builds and special snowflake players."Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?" Sounds like you just press random buttons off cooldown to do damage. And do you switch utilities between encounters? Because thats what 99,9% of the special snowflake players usually don't do.

@Haleydawn.3764 said:To tell you the truth, I get this playing Spellbreaker. Even though I bring what is expected from a 'banner slave', I'm not a condition dps, which is what they actually reference when using 'bs' in the LFG, they just don't realise that.

Although the newest term I've seen crop up is 'Banner babe' which I love, cuz my bannerbabe is a norn female warrior.I don’t end up carrying the run, but I at least prove myself to naysayers. I don’t like carrying people, I shouldn’t have to, Fractals are for teams of 5 players. Each person plays their part, or should.As long as you get the opportunity to prove your worth, any build is fine as long as it works for the role you are filling in the group and isn't a selfish build.

Thats just dumb because spellbreaker is actually meta and better than berserker almost everywhere in fractals. Even before the balance update.

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:

@Ryze.2891 said:

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:(I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

@Dwaynethe.7914 said:(I have both expansions and all specs unlocked) this is my main, the only toon I play. In all game modes with pretty much the same build. It's the toon I am the best with.

I admit that core guard is not the meta atm. But isn't a veteran player, playing the class I'm best at better than a player who just plays the meta all cookie cutter like. Memorizing the rotation off of a website and having no adaptability?

Sometimes it does mean. If I'm LF chrono, you join on a something else and refuse to change, I'll kick you. Nothing personal, I just want a perfect comp. I don't care if you think "we can do just fine". Yes, we probably can. But I don't want to. I want a perfect run, or something close to it. My time, my fun, my decision.

If you join on an off-meta dps when I'm LF dps, that's fine. If you do trash dps, that is also fine, as long as you don't make us fail. If you do, I'll kick you. Again, nothing personal, see above.

@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Haleydawn.3764 said:To tell you the truth, I get this playing Spellbreaker. Even though I bring what is expected from a 'banner slave', I'm not a condition dps, which is what they actually reference when using 'bs' in the LFG, they just don't realise that.

Although the newest term I've seen crop up is 'Banner babe' which I love, cuz my bannerbabe is a norn female warrior.I don’t end up carrying the run, but I at least prove myself to naysayers. I don’t like carrying people, I shouldn’t have to, Fractals are for

teams

of 5 players. Each person plays their part, or should.As long as you get the opportunity to prove your worth, any build is fine as long as it works for the role you are filling in the group and isn't a selfish build.

Yeah, people see what they want to see on Metabattle it seems. /shrug.

@Haleydawn.3764 said:

@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Haleydawn.3764 said:To tell you the truth, I get this playing Spellbreaker. Even though I bring what is expected from a 'banner slave', I'm not a condition dps, which is what they actually reference when using 'bs' in the LFG, they just don't realise that.

Although the newest term I've seen crop up is 'Banner babe' which I love, cuz my bannerbabe is a norn female warrior.I don’t end up carrying the run, but I at least prove myself to naysayers. I don’t like carrying people, I shouldn’t have to, Fractals are for

teams

of 5 players. Each person plays their part, or should.As long as you get the opportunity to prove your worth, any build is fine as long as it works for the role you are filling in the group and isn't a selfish build.

Citation needed. Even with spellbreaker being power, berserker has so much QoL over spellbreaker there are many reasons you would run it. Also spellbreaker is on meta battle, so this statement was just ignorant. Anytime someone uses "what they see on metabattle" in order to dismiss others, chances are they haven't actually read metabattle.

Before the patch Spellbreaker was great if your group was also great. As soon as one or multiple components did not meet peak performance Berserker outperformed it. Post patch Spellbreaker is in a much better position and groups are slowly adapting. In pugs I am fine with either now whereas before Berserker had a clear edge.

I've encountered a similar guard build (might even be OP).At first we were like "ok, we're carrying this guy, no biggy". But he actually held his own. Not the best DPS, but was above 10k, which is pretty much the fractal sweet spot for decent players.I'm as elitist as they come when people start dragging the group down, but i always give people a chance. Because, the game has a lot of diversity, and while a Core guard doesn't have traps and Big game Hunter to get towards DH levels, it still has the GS, and they can use both of the "optional" trait lines that DH uses (Zeal or Virtues), which ends up actually compensating some of the losses.Its ridiculous to judge someone based on their class. I've been pleasantly surprised most of times i've given someone else a chance to show me wrong. And i've been unpleasantly surprised by a lot of "top tier DPS" weavers.

@FrostDraco.8306 said:

@Haleydawn.3764 said:

@Nephalem.8921 said:

@Haleydawn.3764 said:To tell you the truth, I get this playing Spellbreaker. Even though I bring what is expected from a 'banner slave', I'm not a condition dps, which is what they actually reference when using 'bs' in the LFG, they just don't realise that.

Although the newest term I've seen crop up is 'Banner babe' which I love, cuz my bannerbabe is a norn female warrior.I don’t end up carrying the run, but I at least prove myself to naysayers. I don’t like carrying people, I shouldn’t have to, Fractals are for

teams

of 5 players. Each person plays their part, or should.As long as you get the opportunity to prove your worth, any build is fine as long as it works for the role you are filling in the group and isn't a selfish build.

What I meant by what I said was that people are blind-sided by the top few builds, they don't see the other builds anywhere elsewhich are rated just as highly (even under the same heading) and are just as effective. So your comment was just ignorant. Maybe you should look up the phrase 'people see what they want to see' and get back to me.Fact is, both Spellbreaker and Berserker bring the same offensive buffs to the group, and give out a similar amount of damage. Both builds suffer if other buffs aren't up to good standard, as do near enough all other builds. My original point being, even playing a build that’s highly rated, I get players asking ‘wtf is that you’re playing, why? Not as good as condizerk, blah blah blah’

@"ReaverKane.7598" said:Its ridiculous to judge someone based on their class. I've been pleasantly surprised most of times i've given someone else a chance to show me wrong. And i've been unpleasantly surprised by a lot of "top tier DPS" weavers.

Agreed, and me too.

Yeah, but let's be realistic. Players with "non-optimal" builds aren't most often the ones with 2-5k lower dps than the meta builds because you really don't recognize them within the dps noise of the whole group while focusing on the encounter.It's rather the players that are bringing really horrible dps numbers - often combined with poor mechanic gameplay (a.k.a. constantly putting flux bombs into the team or inside of bosses or constantly stacking social awkwardness due to running around like crazy). So I understand every player leaving a group before the run starts because he doesn't want to experience trouble if he can cash out his daily rewards much safer than with this sort of gambling.